52 replies to this topic

[jvr]

Hello,

My name is John Van Roekel. I’m a 62 year-old white guy who in 1994 read a biography of Teddy Roosevelt that described his experiences with the African-American 9th and 10th Cavalry Regiments during the Spanish-American War. I was so impressed with the story of these men that I naively decided to write a novel about a young black man serving in the 9th Cavalry. After years of research, writing classes, and trips to Fort Robinson, Nebraska, the Wounded Knee site in South Dakota, and to the San Juan Hill battle site in Cuba, Braver Deeds is the result.

So, what do African-American readers think about a well-meaning white man writing a novel mainly about African-American characters?

More information about Braver Deeds is available at http://braverdeeds.com, including the first chapter and information on purchasing both print and Kindle version. By the way, I make no profit on the sale of Braver Deeds.

John

[Linda Chavis]

I think its fine because a good book, is a good book no matter the author. I look forward to reading. Sounds very interesting.

[Cynique]

I'd actually have to read the book for an in-depth response, but I think it would be safe to say that if you portray the black protagonist sympathetically, depicting him to be an individual with emotions that transcend color, black readers will give you a pass.

Your acceptance will be even more if you expose Teddy Roosevelt as a racist aristocrat. It also counts for something when you acknowledge that a white guy writing about a black one is presumptuous. Most resentments about such endeavors stem from the idea of white people telling black peoples' stories, as was the case with "The Help". It smacks of paternalism when the implication is that benevolent white writers have to step forward to do what poor ol mistreated black folks can't do for themselves.

Bottom line, truth and honesty, like justice, are color-blind. In a perfect world.

[Troy]

Here is a link to a chapter from John's book. http://www-personal....edsChapter1.pdf (from his website).

I'll print it out and let you know what I think. John, thanks for sharing information about your book here.

Peace

[richardmorrisauthor]

I can't answer your question as an African American, but I can share my experiences with you as a white author with an African American protagonist. Here's a blogpost I wrote on this topic http://richardmorris.../into-the-mind/.

Richard

[Troy]

Hey Richard thanks for your comments. I read your Blog post. You, like John, seem to be interested in creating authentic characters. If you do this well, where is the justification to complain?

Much of the controversy surrounding books like <strong>The Help</strong> have to do with characters whom some feel were not authentic (read related article), propagating stereo types for monetary gain when continue to marginalize a group of people in the mass media.

Further, when these insensitive stories are published while overlooking work from Black writers, with more accurate portrayal of characters, then people get really bent out of shape.

But it is a new day. Anyone can publish a book or make a film.

[ChickenBones]

It is not about the color of skin. I'd place Harold Courlander's "The African" in the Top 10 of fiction books. The recent book by Foster, a black female gospel novelist, I'd review it as reactionary and a book to avoid, maybe 20,000 on my fiction list. This fellow may indeed have done well. But I suspect he has not by how he has already identified himself. Never say goodbye to Truth. Loving you madly, Rudy

[JeniseR]

GE, and this has been done numerous times already: Uncle Tom's Cabin (Stowe); Nigger Heaven (Van Vechten); The Help (out now in book AND movie form!); and of course in various movies and TV shows from the last century to now. If book is handled humanly as opposed to stereotypically, shouldn't be an issue. Would of course have to read for myself to judge, and sure everyone here has come to the same conclusion:-)

[gwenrichardson]

I agree that a good book is a good book, no matter the ethnicity of the author. If a white author can write a book with mainly black characters, making them multi-dimensional rather than stereotypical, then I don't see it as a problem. However, it would be wonderful to see the day when black authors can write books dominated by white characters and have their books accepted in the mainstream. Then we'll know we've made progress.

Black authors are usually forced to write only about black characters, with a few rare exceptions; otherwise, their books won't get picked up by major publishers. I'm sure there are exceptions to this rule, but none readily come to mind. Perhaps Troy can think of a few. When I think of the fiction writers who have had major breakthroughs -- Terry McMillan, Walter Mosley, Carl Weber, Toni Morrison, Alice Walker, Stephen Carter (who may be the exception) -- their protagonist is almost always black.

Now, I don't want to take away from the joy found in writing about African American culture. And, as a reader, I appreciate having a large number of books from which to choose that reflect my culture. But writers -- all writers -- should have choices and options. That's what freedom is all about.

[jvr]

Thanks for all the great comments. Some responses:

Cynique hopes that I expose Teddy Roosevelt as a racist aristocrat. I think that just like we want our fictional characters to be complicated and multi-dimensional, we need to view historical figures the same way. It's a truism that we should judge people in the context of the times in which they live. Of course, that can be used to rationalize all kinds of bad actions, but I think it's appropriate for TR. For his time, and especially during the period of Braver Deeds, he seemed to be a positive influence on the condition of African-Americans. His very popular memoir of the Spanish-American war, The Rough Riders, informed many white Americans about the bravery and competence of the black regiments. And as president, he shocked many by inviting Booker T. Washington to the White House, who ended up staying for dinner. There are other examples. However, by any measure he failed African-Americans during the "Brownsville Incident" when he gave dishonorable discharges to 167 men in the 25th Infantry Regiment for a racial incident with townspeople. He knew at the time that most, if not all of these professional soldiers, where innocent.

Cynique says that I've acknowledged that "a white guy writing about a black one is presumptuous." Not surprisingly, I don't quite see it that way. I am uncomfortable with the fact that some people may feel that this book is presumptuous, but I also believe that at the end of the day, an author can write about anything he or she wants to. That doesn't mean that we don't have a responsibility to our readers. For example, it's morally wrong to reenforce stereotypes, especially hateful ones, and I know in my heart that I have not done this. But as others have pointed out here, there's nothing inherently presumptuous about an author of one race writing about characters of another.

Cynique and Troy both mention The Help. I have not read the book or seen the movie. Thank you to Troy for referring us to the "An Open Statement to the Fans of The Help" by the Association of Black Women Historians. One of the points made there concerned the use of "child-like, over-exaggerated 'black' dialect." I must tell you that as a white man with no great exposure to African-American speech, I worry that my efforts here were inadequate. I read several books on African-American dialects and some great literature (I found James Baldwin's Got Tell It on the Mountain to be particularly helpful). But I fear that to many African-American readers, my character's dialect may seem inaccurate and exaggerated. If that's true, I'm sorry. I did the best I could.

Finally, thank you to ChickenBones. I just ordered The African from Amazon.

Oh, and by the way. Has anybody decided to read Braver Deeds? Any feedback yet?

John

[Troy]

John, I read the excerpt. The story sounds interesting and I'd be curious to see how it pans out. Regarding the Black dialect of the period; you would be a better judge of it that I.

What I read sounds reasonable, but I have now way of judging. Obvously I'm not from the period and have not I studied it. What you have written works for me, however The Association of Black Women Historians may diagree

As with The Help most people really don't care must about that, they really want a compeling story. As long as the dialect is good enough and does not get in the way, readers will be fine -- which is why the vast majority of people enjoyed the book and film. Beside It is fiction, not a documentary expectations.

Thanks again for introducing yourself here.

[Cynique]

Well, John, since you singled me out in your response, I'll make my previous remarks a little clearer.

It seemed to me that because you felt the need to seek out the reaction of black readers to your book about black characters, implicit in this gesture is the idea that you, yourself, feared writing such a book was "presumptuous". Hence my comment.

Where Teddy Roosevelt is concerned, may I remind you that racism is not always aggressive and inflammatory. It can be benign. White people can be so steeped in their sense of entitlement and superiority that they can condescend to be civil to Blacks in spite of the fact that they don't consider them equal. That's why racism still exists today. Teddy appreciated educator Booker T. Washington because where the races were concerned, Washington favored racial separation, while encouraging Blacks to excel in the fields of agriculture and mechanics. This was why he was such an anathema to W.E.B. Dubois. Abe Lincoln freed the slaves not because he thought they were equal, but because he hated slavery. To expose Teddy as an "aristocratic racist" would not necessarily make him a villain. It would, indeed, make him a man of his times.

I read the excerpt from your book and had no problem with its use of dialect.

Cynique

[careycarey]

John writes: "So, what do African-American readers think about a well-meaning white man writing a novel mainly about African-American characters?'

Okay John, since you asked the question I have to say I smelled game. Well to be honest, as a black man who has felt the sting of the white man with a fork tongue, that's my first natural reaction/response. I have to question you because my history tells me that the overwhelming majority of whites could care less about the ways and means of POC, so I'd be a fool to open my arms to you, even though YOU said you're a well-meaning white man. In fact, since that was in you're opening sentence, I am more prone to question your motive and agenda. I mean, what if you would have said "I am a racist, and I'm writing a book about a black man who served in the African-American 9th and 10th Cavalry Regiments during the Spanish-American War"? I mean, what's the purpose of telling us that? We've heard the "talk". Why didn't you tell us you have a few black friends?

Okay, I am not going to go on about this b/c from the jump your post didn't set well with me. For instance, they were not called the "African- American 9th Cavalry.

Then, after telling us you were a "good" white man, you decided to share this: "I make no profit on the sale of Braver Deeds". Why did you think you needed to tell us those fine details?

Well John, in short, I think the home team took it easy on you. They treated you like a guest, you know, with respect, but I'm gonna tell you right now, all closed eyes were not sleep.

[breathebooks]

Hello,

My name is John Van Roekel. I’m a 62 year-old white guy who in 1994 read a biography of Teddy Roosevelt that described his experiences with the African-American 9th and 10th Cavalry Regiments during the Spanish-American War. I was so impressed with the story of these men that I naively decided to write a novel about a young black man serving in the 9th Cavalry. After years of research, writing classes, and trips to Fort Robinson, Nebraska, the Wounded Knee site in South Dakota, and to the San Juan Hill battle site in Cuba, Braver Deeds is the result.

So, what do African-American readers think about a well-meaning white man writing a novel mainly about African-American characters?

More information about Braver Deeds is available at http://braverdeeds.com, including the first chapter and information on purchasing both print and Kindle version. By the way, I make no profit on the sale of Braver Deeds.

John

The underlined portion of the quote above came across similar to the phrase "She is not like other blacks" or "He is so articulate". As if "impressive" behaviour is or was rare among blacks.

That said, the quality of the novel is of greater importance. Would a black reader enjoy reading the novel without previously knowing the race or motivation of the author?

[jvr]

John writes: "So, what do African-American readers think about a well-meaning white man writing a novel mainly about African-American characters?'

Okay John, since you asked the question I have to say I smelled game. Well to be honest, as a black man who has felt the sting of the white man with a fork tongue, that's my first natural reaction/response. I have to question you because my history tells me that the overwhelming majority of whites could care less about the ways and means of POC, so I'd be a fool to open my arms to you, even though YOU said you're a well-meaning white man. In fact, since that was in you're opening sentence, I am more prone to question your motive and agenda. I mean, what if you would have said "I am a racist, and I'm writing a book about a black man who served in the African-American 9th and 10th Cavalry Regiments during the Spanish-American War"? I mean, what's the purpose of telling us that? We've heard the "talk". Why didn't you tell us you have a few black friends?

Okay, I am not going to go on about this b/c from the jump your post didn't set well with me. For instance, they were not called the "African- American 9th Cavalry.

Then, after telling us you were a "good" white man, you decided to share this: "I make no profit on the sale of Braver Deeds". Why did you think you needed to tell us those fine details?

Well John, in short, I think the home team took it easy on you. They treated you like a guest, you know, with respect, but I'm gonna tell you right now, all closed eyes were not sleep.

Hi careycarey,

I'll let some of your more acid comments pass.

Just for the record, you're right about the name of the 9th Cavalry. In my post, I meant the 9th Cavalry, which was also African-American. The formal name was 9th Cavalry Regiment (Colored).

I mentioned that I don't make a profit on sales of Braver Deeds because I didn't want people to think I wrote the book and am participating in this forum because I want to make money.

John

[jvr]

The underlined portion of the quote above came across similar to the phrase "She is not like other blacks" or "He is so articulate". As if "impressive" behaviour is or was rare among blacks.

That said, the quality of the novel is of greater importance. Would a black reader enjoy reading the novel without previously knowing the race or motivation of the author?

Hi breathebooks,

I'm sorry to hear you interpreted my words as you did. The fact is that the accomplishments of the 9th and 10th Cavalry as well as the 24th and 25 Infantry Regiments during the Spanish-American War are impressive. Right? Don't you feel that way? I was impressed. And inspired.

John

[Xeon]

I'm sorry to hear you interpreted my words as you did. The fact is that the accomplishments of the 9th and 10th Cavalry as well as the 24th and 25 Infantry Regiments during the Spanish-American War are impressive. Right? Don't you feel that way? I was impressed. And inspired.

Well, good luck with your book. I think you have seen a cross section of views and opinions of what you are trying to do. Personally myself, I welcome any literature that illuminates the often overlooked involvement and contributions of blacks in the American military. I think your effort should be encouraged since there is no overwhelming public interest in literature that documents the history of blacks in the military. If you peruse the major popular non-fiction top sellers listings, I don't think you will find historical books about blacks in the military cracking the top ten week after week. Obviously, hoping for fame and fortune could not be a major factor for writing about such a topic. So, your interest seems genuine and sincere to me. And yes, the accomplishments and dedication to duty of these black soldiers warrants exposure. These men existed and performed admirably in one of the most discriminatory and racist periods in American history. Again, good luck with your book……

[Cynique]

I find it puzzling that Carey, who was such a staunch defender of "The Help", would be so derisive where this white author is concerned.

[careycarey]

Cynique, it was just the way the man came through the door. He came in with a setup question. He didn't have to tell me the color of his skin. To that point alone, that's the same way I felt about The Help. The author of The Help didn't ask... "hey y'all, what do you guys think about a wellmeaning white woman writng a book about some dark women?"

[Jackie]

John, I will check out your book. My great grandfather was a veteran of the Spanish-American War, a member of the 1st US Volunteer Cavalry known as The Rough Riders (recruited by Lieutenant Colonel Theodore Roosevelt and commanded by Leonard Wood. He fought at El Cana, near the famous battle of San Juan Hill, his unit was a part of Roosevelt’s 71st New York Regiment. He served under General MacArthur, the father of General Douglas MacArthur, He was a member of the Chinese Expeditionary force that mapped trails and navigation channels through out Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos. He re-entered the service as a National Guardsmen during World War I. There was a profile written on his 90th birthday by the Fresno Bee in Fresno, CA.