BEGIN:VCALENDAR VERSION:2.0 PRODID:-//InvisionCommunity Events 5.0.18//EN METHOD:PUBLISH CALSCALE:GREGORIAN REFRESH-INTERVAL:PT15M X-PUBLISHED-TTL:PT15M X-WR-CALNAME:RMWorkCalendar NAME:RMWorkCalendar BEGIN:VTIMEZONE TZID:Europe/London TZURL:https://tzurl.org/zoneinfo/Europe/London X-LIC-LOCATION:Europe/London BEGIN:DAYLIGHT TZOFFSETFROM:+0000 TZOFFSETTO:+0100 TZNAME:BST DTSTART:20250330T020000Z RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;BYMONTH=3;BYDAY=-1SU END:DAYLIGHT BEGIN:STANDARD TZOFFSETFROM:+0100 TZOFFSETTO:+0000 TZNAME:GMT DTSTART:20251026T020000Z RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;BYMONTH=10;BYDAY=-1SU END:STANDARD END:VTIMEZONE BEGIN:VEVENT SUMMARY:Poem of the Aeolian Heart Harp 02/26/2025 DTSTAMP:20250226T093057Z SEQUENCE:0 UID:207-5-c3fe8195a3dde498d013e477e2142422@aalbc.com ORGANIZER;CN="richardmurray":noreply@aalbc.com DESCRIPTION:\n Poem of the Aeolian Heart Harp \n\n\n\n poem \n\n\n\n h ttps://www.deviantart.com/hddeviant/art/1164090235\n\n\n\n illustration \ n\n\n\n https://www.deviantart.com/hddeviant/art/1164089424\n\n \n\n\n\n I N AMENDMENT\n\n\n\n The Brothers Grimm &\; Dark Fairytales\n\n\n\n VIDE O\n\n\n\n \n\n\n\n TRANSCRIPT\n\n\n\n 0:00\nthis video has been sponsored by Squarespace I seriously doubt that any of us have managed to reach adul thood\n0:06\nwithout hearing at least a few fairy tales maybe it was the s tory of Little\n0:11\nRed Riding Hood or Cinderella or Jack in the bean st ock or maybe it was one of the many adaptations spoofs and edgy\n0:18\n201 0 retellings that were inspired by those Original Stories and not stereoty pe you guys but if you're\n0:25\nwatching this video I bet you know that a lot of those modern fairy tales originated from the collection of the\n0: 32\nbrothers Grim today I want to take a deeper look at The Life and Times of the Grim Brothers investigate some of their\n0:39\nmore obscure and pe rhaps disturbing stories to try and pin down why they\n0:45\nmade it their life's work to study and preserve something as silly and\n0:51\ninconsequ ential as fairy tales yakob ludvig Carl Grim was born on January 4th\n0:58 \n1785 in Hano a city in what we now know as Germany just about a year lat er on\n1:05\nFebruary 24th 1786 his brother vilhelm Carl Grim was\n1:10\nb orn and due to their closeness in age the brothers were Incredibly Close g rowing up they were basically twins\n1:18\nexcept that they shared the mid dle name Carl instead of the womb while their family had never been partic ularly poor\n1:25\ntheir stations improved considerably in 1791 when the f ather of the family was\n1:31\nelected amtman which is basically a magistr ate of the city of styo this gave\n1:37\nthem land to live on a quite beau tiful house and a rather stable income the\n1:43\nbrothers flourished in s tyo with private tutors to teach them reading and writing\n1:49\na nursaid to tell them stories and the entirety of the German Countryside at their fingertips okay and I have been\n1:56\nsaying the German Countryside but t echnically where they were living was not Germany yet this was before the\ n2:03\nunification of Germany when the country was still split up into muc h smaller kingdoms each with their own leader\n2:09\nstill under the large r umbrella of the Holy Roman Empire as they had been for\n2:14\nover a tho usand years I will be continuing to refer to the regions that\n2:19\nwould eventually become Germany as Germany just for the sake of Simplicity\n2:2 5\nbut you should probably be aware that technically it was not Germany un til 8 185 however it is interesting to note\n2:33\nthat the abundance of r andom small Kings and Kingdoms in the time of the Holy\n2:38\nRoman Empire may have contributed to the environment of the fairy tales that the\n2:44 \nbrothers Grim would collect and retell where there's always a king and a \n2:49\nprincess and a castle but their peaceful Countryside upbringing co uld not remain\n2:54\npeaceful there was a lot of Chaos in Europe at this time the French Revolution was was going on and things\n3:01\nwere only ab out to get more chaotic in the personal lives of yakob and vilhelm Grim in 1796 their father died of\n3:09\npneumonia leaving 11-year-old yakob as t he man of the house because their\n3:14\nfather the amtman was gone they l ost possession of the house they had lived in and they got a very small st ipend\n3:21\nfrom the government in his memory but it was not enough to su pport them their mother dorota was unemployed at the time\n3:28\nbut they were able to just barely scrape by with a lot of monetary support from\n3: 33\nfamily members their greatest support would come from their aunt who w as wealthy enough to provide for yakob and\n3:40\nvilhelm to attend a spec ial school in the city of Castle this was the\n3:45\nopportunity of a life time but it did present its own unique challenges\n3:51\ndespite their pri vate tutoring educationally speaking the Grim brothers were far behind the ir peers and compared\n3:59\nto the other Rich Noble boys that attended th is school they were country bumpkins they stuck out like a sore\n4:05\nthu mb and constantly pressing on them was this feeling that even though they were children themselves between vilhelm\n4:13\nand yakob was the responsi bility of being the man of the house through hard\n4:19\nwork and a lot of focus they managed to claw their way through school becoming\n4:24\njust as educated as their classmates and in 1802 yak was accepted into Universi ty\n4:32\nwhile this was a great step forward for him it also meant that f or the very first time the Grim brothers would have\n4:39\nto be separated this was a heartbreaking blow for them they had basically been\n4:45\ncon nected at the hip since they had been born and now suddenly they were enti rely\n4:51\nalone we still have a lot of their letters that they exchanged from this time were they're expressing to each\n4:56\nother the pure hear tbreak that they feel being completely alone without each\n5:02\nother yak ob was doing quite well in University but vilhelm who had suffered from sc arlet fever when he was much\n5:09\nyounger was constantly plagued by poor health he was bedridden for a full 6\n5:15\nmonths not allowed to read or write only able to draw and to dream to pass the\n5:22\ntime and while th is was obviously quite difficult vilhelm would later explain\n5:27\nhow mu ch this time of intense boredom would spark his creativity and his\n5:33\n curiosity fortunately the brothers were soon reunited as vilhelm went up t o University and it was there that the two\n5:40\nof them fell under the t utelage of Professor Friedrich Von svy svy nurtured\n5:46\nthe spark he sa w in the brothers urging them to be mindful and thorough in their scholars hip and pointing them in the\n5:52\ndirection of specifically German art c ulture and knowledge this was at odds\n5:59\nwith the more classical Unive rsity curriculum which emphasized the study of\n6:04\nthe art and history of Rome and Greece and svi was likely inspired by the\n6:10\ngrowing wave of Romanticism in Europe the movement known as Romanticism was\n6:16\njust starting to pick up steam in the early 1800s and it sought to do away wit h all pretension and get to the heart\n6:25\nof what it meant to be human the art and literature of romantic ISM attempted to\n6:31\nisue the subjec t of the Rich and Famous and focus on Simplicity on the ordinary\n6:37\npe rson and their very ordinary lives they thought that in this Simplicity in \n6:43\ngoing back to Our Roots we might find some answers some kind of un iversal\n6:50\ntruth that might guide us through rapidly Changing Times th is meant setting aside the tales of Homer and the\n6:57\nwisdom of Aristot le and instead diving into folk wisdom into local history svy\n7:05\nwould eventually request ycob to be his research assistant in Paris and yakob\n 7:10\ndropped everything to take this opportunity derailing his University career and although this was a very\n7:18\nrisky move everyone in his lif e including his mother approved of the decision somehow they knew that thi s was\n7:25\nsomething that he needed to do but as important as this stint imp Paris would end up being to his later scholarly\n7:32\nefforts it als o meant that the brothers had to be separated once more and again\n7:37\ny ou can see in their letters the pain and frustration that being divided by \n7:44\nspace gave them but by 1805 the brothers were together again movin g in with their\n7:50\nmother and sister in Castle where they had first at tended school as joyful as this reunion was their living situation\n7:58\n was still as dire as ever despite their education yakob and vilhelm strugg led to\n8:04\nfind work and tragically in 1808 their mother dorota Grim di ed to make things\n8:11\nall the worse it was right around then that the F rench arrived in Castle the\n8:17\nnew French Emperor Napoleon bonapart ha d been sweeping his way across Europe throughout the 1800s and his armies\ n8:24\nreached Castle in 1806 Napoleon positioned his youngest\n8:29\nbrot her Jerome bonapart as the new king of West philia and Castle was the\n8:3 4\ncapital of the new realm and it was actually in the castle of this new French King that yakob finally found\n8:42\nwork perhaps it was because he was the best one for the job or perhaps it was\n8:47\njust because he was the only academic in town desperate enough to take a position under their new French overlords yakob\n8:55\nwas given the job of being the Royal li brarian caring for over 12\,000 books\n9:02\nin their collection his only real job was to look after the books and to make\n9:09\nsure that nobody b ut the approved people the king the queen and of course himself the Royal librarian was allowed to ever\n9:16\nlook at the books and fortunately for him the royal couple was not very much\n9:23\ninto reading so he kind of just had the library to himself and he had a lot of\n9:28\ndowntime meanwh ile vilhelms already fragile Health was just getting worse and worse so he was sent away to an\n9:35\nexperimental doctor for treatment and when I s ay experimental I really do mean\n9:42\nexperimental he was fed pills that made him vomit every morning his neck would\n9:47\nbe rubbed with Mercury which yes is incredibly toxic which is what we now\n9:53\nknow and they e ven played with the new technology of electricity using A\n9:59\nPrimitive car battery basically to run electricity through his body in the hopes of settling his heart vilhelm\n10:07\nunderstandably didn't really enjoy the se treatments but he found refuge in this time in learning about the local \n10:13\nfolklore and folk music and you know what something that they did to him must\n10:19\nhave worked because eventually the treatments started to make him feel better and he was able to return to\n10:26\nCastle and t o his family still trapped under under the thumb of the French but with pl enty of free time because of\n10:32\nyacob's employment and vilhelms conti nued unemployment the brothers found solace in diving deeper into\n10:39\n German culture inspired by Romanticism they believed that fairy tales the fairy\n10:45\ntales of the German people contained some kind of quintessen tial germanness\n10:51\nand they thought that preserving the Integrity of that germanness would be key to preserving the spark in the\n10:58\nhearts of the German people vilhelm would later describe it when a storm or some other catastrophe sent from the\n11:05\nheavens levels an entire crop we are relieved to find that a small patch protected by tiny Hedges or bushes has\n11:13\nbeen spared and that some solitary stocks remain standing whe n the sun shines once again and favors them they\n11:20\nwill continue to grow alone and unnoticed no sickle will cut them down\n11:25\ntoo early so they can be stashed in a large silo but late in the summer when\n11:30\nt hey are ripe and fully grown some poor and Pious hands will come searching for them ear on ear will be carefully Bound\n11:38\nin bundles inspected and attended to as whole sheaths then they will be brought\n11:44\nhome an d serve as the staple food for the entire winter perhaps they will be\n11: 50\nthe only seed for the future this is how it seemed to us when we began examining the richness of German literature in\n11:58\nearlier times and saw that nothing much had been preserved from that richness\n12:03\ndeterm ined to preserve what was left of the storytelling tradition of bygone day s the brothers began to collect fairy\n12:12\ntales now the Contemporary i mpression seems to be that the brothers Grim\n12:18\ngathered these storie s themselves that they canvased across Germany going door Todo hearing the se stories\n12:25\nfirsthand but that's not entirely accurate in certain s pecial cases they\n12:30\nwere able to do so such as in the case of their neighbors the Wilds who were literally their nextd door neighbors\n12:37\n they had four daughters who really enjoyed telling stories and some of the tales that we get in the very first\n12:43\nvolume of grim Fairy Tales co me from those sisters and in some cases the\n12:48\nbrothers had to get a bit creative about how they collected their stories because\n12:53\nnot ev eryone was willing to give them up to some random academic according to On e account they tra an old man his stories\n13:01\nin exchange for a couple of pairs of their old trousers and they actually stayed in communication with that old\n13:07\nman and he would frequently send them letters asking if they had any other used trousers that he could take which I\n13:14\nth ink is nice and then in other cases they would have to send in children to little old ladies to get them telling\n13:21\ntheir stories because the l ittle old ladies didn't want to tell their stories to grown men but for th e most part the\n13:27\nbrothers Grim asked other people for help they sen t out to their colleagues and fellow Scholars requesting that they\n13:35\ nrecord any Snippets of folktales that they might hear everything from the old\n13:40\nwasher woman talking around the well to the thief in a prison cell and just\n13:45\nabout everyone in between in 1811 they sent out an open letter requesting that anybody who has fairy tales send them in\n13:5 3\nit didn't matter yakob said if the stories taught a lesson or were just fun to listen to whether they were happy or\n14:00\nsad what was importan t was that the person writing down the story should capture every word the teller said even\n14:08\nif the story didn't make sense the way that it w as told the brothers Grim certainly were not the first Scholars to\n14:16\ never think of recording folklore but you could argue that for their time they\n14:23\nwere the best a lot of other recorders of the time would only take very vague\n14:29\nnotes on the original orally told story and then it was accepted practice for\n14:35\nthem to embellish change and sometime s entirely make up the rest of the story\n14:42\nfrom that Bas line they c ould make the stories do whatever they needed them to do in order to confi rm their scholarly\n14:50\nintent the brothers Grim however were comparati vely far more mindful although\n14:57\nthat's not to say that they didn't change anything anything for example in the original Snow White the orally told\n15:03\nversion of the story the evil stepmother was actually Snow W hite's mother but\n15:09\nthat didn't quite fit in with what the brothers Grim were trying to do and they\n15:15\nfirmly believed in the goodness an d purity of the role of a mother so they changed it from being a wicked mo ther to\n15:22\na wicked stepmother and while that is a significant change it doesn't really\n15:27\nchange the message of the story all too much pl us the convention of the wicked stepmother was something that they saw\n15 :34\nin other Tales so it wasn't a particularly difficult or a seriously t ransformative change to make so they\n15:41\ncertainly did change things b ut they really worked hard to preserve what they saw as a story's essentia l truth vilhelm\n15:50\nGrim once compared it to cracking open an egg when you crack open an egg\n15:56\nthere's always going to be a little bit of white that gets left behind in the Shell it's inevitable and you could try \n16:03\nand scrape it out but you're just going to lose some of it but wh at's important is that the Yoke stays intact and\n16:10\nespecially compar ed to other Scholars of their day the brothers Grim were really mindful of keeping the truth that yolk\n16:18\nof the story intact and discernible e ven in their Rewritten stories by modern\n16:24\nstandards they editoriali zed a bit and it's hardly a spot-on firsthand account but especially\n16:3 2\nin the context in which they were operating the scholarly work that the brothers Grim did was groundbreaking one\n16:40\nscholar who wasn't quite so concerned with maintaining integrity was an old\n16:45\nfriend of the Grim Brothers Clemens brentano brentano had also been working\n16:51\non a fairy tale compilation at the same time as the brothers Grim but his work \n16:56\nwas far less precise and mindful in fact some of the storytellers that the Grims\n17:02\napproached had had previous encounters with brenta no and whatever he did they\n17:07\nwere so scarred by the experience that these storytellers refused to share their tales with any other Scholars\n 17:15\nincluding the Grims still the brothers wanted to hold on to that fr iendship and\n17:21\nso when brentano requested a copy of their manuscript for him to examine of\n17:26\ncourse they gave it to him fortunately they did make a separate copy of the\n17:31\nmanuscript before they handed it over which was good because brentano took that manuscript and never gave i t back\n17:38\nin fact it went missing for decades and was only fairly rec ently found despite\n17:44\ntrials and disagreements and a whole lot of wo rk in 1812 the brothers Grim\n17:50\npublished Kinder un house the title t ranslates to the children's and\n17:55\nhousehold tales and it contained 8 6 of of their collected stories and although\n18:01\nthis was called child ren's tales it was not originally intended to be a book for\n18:08\nchildr en rather than having illustrations or etchings you know the stuff kids ki nd of like to see in their\n18:14\nbooks this book contained footnotes and assiduous notes on all of the stories\n18:21\nand where they came from ya kob explained that although the book very well could be enjoyed by childre n it was origin\n18:28\nAlly intended as a serious scholarly Pursuit inten ded for adult consumption\n18:35\nthis was a misconception that would cont inue to reoccur throughout the fairy tale work of the brothers Grim while\ n18:42\nchildren really enjoyed the book and they devoured the stories a l ot of the\n18:47\nEducators and adults in their lives were a bit more skep tical Not only was the\n18:53\nbook dull and illustration it was also thro ughout most\n18:58\nof it incredibly dark there are some seriously bloody and brutal moments in\n19:06\nthose stories that you could argue are not a cceptable for children in fact\n19:11\nthere's one of the stories that I'm going to share later on that was deemed so brutal and horrifying that it was cut\n19:18\nby the brothers Grim from later publications of their book s yakob would\n19:24\nremain steadfast in the idea that this book was not intended for children and that it should not not be adjusted to\n19:29\nPa nder to them it was written to be a scholarly preservation of German cultu re\n19:36\nvilhelm however did begin to change his mind over time vilhelm had always been a\n19:43\nbit more of the Romantic between the two of them yakob was very much dedicated to\n19:48\nthe facts and vilhelm was more i nterested in larger spiritual truths\n19:54\nand he was willing to Pivot t heir work to cat more towards a younger audience\n20:01\nthis is something that would be a bit of a point of friction between the two of them when t hey were working together but\n20:07\non the second collection of fairy ta les vilhelm would have the chance to Pivot\n20:13\ntheir intent however he liked 1812 was a really rough year to be Napoleon\n20:20\nbonapart the Fr ench were facing defeat in Russia and higher-ups like King Jerome were beg inning to see the writing\n20:27\non the wall he began to to pull out of C LE and while they were trying to work on the second book he kept yakob ver y\n20:34\nbusy collecting up German books and art to smuggle with him as h e fled for\n20:39\nFrance and once Napoleon's defeat was finalized yakob w as kept even more busy\n20:45\nwith politics he was sent to Paris from 181 4 to 1815 to recover German art and\n20:52\nliterature that had been taken by the French it was during this lengthy\n20:57\nseparation that a lot of the work was done to compile the second edition of Grim's fairy tales mea ning that most of\n21:04\nit was done under vilhelms hand and as always wh en the brothers are physically separated we get a lot of very angsty\n21:1 1\nletters where they're getting upset about miscommunications due to just how long it takes to get a letter from\n21:18\nFrance to Germany the seco nd volume when it was published wasn't quite the smash\n21:23\nhit that th e first one was but it did a lot to establish the brothers grim as\n21:29\ nthe voice in German folklore the brothers would be reunited in 1816 and\n 21:35\nfortunately they would never be seriously parted again they would c ontinue much of their work together\n21:42\nediting and recompiling fairy tales exploring German folklore and history\n21:48\nand doing some groundb reaking work on the study of the German language in 1825\n21:54\nvilhelm w ould marry dor wild one of their former Nextdoor neighbors who had\n22:00\ ncontributed stories to the first volume of grim fairy tales yakob would n ever\n22:05\nmarry but he did live out the rest of his life in the same ho use as vilhelm dorota and their four children over\n22:13\ntheir years the y spent time as Librarians professors and members of The Academy of Scienc es and in 1838 they\n22:21\nbegan work on the dees V the most comprehensiv e German dictionary ever\n22:27\ncreated vilhelm passed away in 1859 and y akob would carry on after him\n22:33\njust 4 years later but they left beh ind a remarkable Legacy be it their\n22:39\nlinguistic studies their schol arly practice and of course their preservation of German culture at an\n22 :47\nincredibly volatile point in history adaptations like the Disney Prin cess\n22:53\nmovies loving satires on the original fairy tale stories and yes even the edgy\n23:01\ngritty 2010 dark fairy tale remakes none of thes e would have been able to exist\n23:07\nwithout the groundwork laid by the brothers grim and yet there are a lot of stories from these collections t hat\n23:13\naren't quite as well known but they can tell us a lot about th e values that these Tales wanted to promote the\n23:21\nquestions and cont roversies around them and how these stories were crafted and\n23:29\nchang ed throughout time and space let's begin with my new favorite ever fairy\n 23:34\ntale the mouse the bird and the sausage this Story begins as so man y do with a\n23:41\nmouse a bird and a sausage getting together and buying a house and at first\n23:47\nthey are experiencing domestic Bliss they ea ch have their own special jobs the bird goes out into the forest to\n23:54 \ngather wood the mouse stays home and takes in water from the well starts the\n23:59\nfire and sets the table and the sausage of course does all of the cooking and as\n24:04\na final step to all of the cooking he takes hi s little body and slithers through the food to season it so that\n24:10\ni t's perfectly salted every time it's just the perfect setup and they've go t an excellent thing going however one day\n24:17\nthe bird gets talking w ith another bird and that other bird is like hey to me it\n24:22\nlooks li ke you're doing most of the work in the house because after they finished cooking the mouse and the sausage get to\n24:30\nrelax they don't have to do anything but it's the bird who has to wake up early in the morning and spend all day\n24:38\nGathering wood the bird insists that they try and ch ange jobs for a day and\n24:43\nso they draw lots to decide who's doing wh at and their fate is sealed the\n24:48\nsausage goes out into the wild to gather firewood and the results are disastrous\n24:55\nnot far from their home the sausage had encountered a dog now this dog had\n25:00\nconsidered the sausage free game and had grabbed him and swallowed him down the litt le bird arrived and accused the dog\n25:07\nof highway robbery but it was of no use for the dog maintained that he had found\n25:12\nforged letters on the sausage and therefore the sausage had had to pay for\n25:17\nthis w ith his life with the sausage dead for his socalled crimes the bird flies\ n25:24\nhome to find even more chaos the mouse had been making dinner and since he had\n25:30\nseen the sausage cooking he knew that the final step was to slide your body\n25:35\nthrough the vegetables but the mouse isn't greasy enough and he gets stuck halfway through and he burns to death\n25: 43\nbetween the potatoes when the bird returns he can't find the Mouse any where so he throws the firewood all across the\n25:50\nfloor so that he ca n search for the mouse but the firewood then catches on fire and the whole house is consumed in\n25:58\nFlames the bird rushes to the well to try an d get a bucket out but the bucket Falls in and pulls the bird in behind it \n26:05\nand the bird drowns truly you can learn just so many lessons from this story you\n26:12\ndon't carry forged papers um cops might eat you if you're\n26:18\nan anthropomorphic sausage and you really shouldn't try an d slip inside through a pan of hot vegetables if you\n26:24\naren't greasy enough and perhaps most importantly you shouldn't change up a good thing although it may look like it\n26:31\nthe grass is not always greener on th e other side and even if it looks like your friend has the easier side of\ n26:38\nthings it might not go so well trying to walk a mile in their shoe s I will be\n26:44\nhonest that I first read this story because it had a m ouse in the title and you guys know how I feel um about\n26:50\nrodents bu t I've been thinking about this story for days and I need as many people a s humanly possible to hear it\n26:58\nand maybe a great way for me to get the word out about the mouse the bird and the sausage would be to build it its own\n27:05\nplatform using this video sponsor Squarespace Squarespace is the allinone\n27:11\nwebsite building platform that's going to allow y ou to stand out and succeed online using their Cutting Edge design\n27:17\ nintelligence technology you can build yourself a beautiful 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get\n28:17\n10% off your first purchase of a website or domain th anks so much to Squarespace\n28:23\nfor sponsoring this video and thanks t o all of you for checking out my sponsors so the mouse the bird and the sa usage is\n28:32\nI can admit ridiculous but this next one is not and it is very gruesome and\n28:38\nbloody so if you want to skip it go ahead to th is Tim stamp in the story titled how some children play at\n28:45\nslaught ering we meet a couple of five and six-year-old kids who are playing\n28:5 2\nbutcher together one of them is the butcher the other is the assistant who's holding a bowl to to catch the blood in\n28:59\nand then one of the children is cast as the pig in this game imitating The\n29:05\nButchers th at they've watched they pin down the pig cut its throat and collect\n29:10 \nthe blood one of the town's people sees what has happened and they panic and\n29:16\nthey grab the kid who has done the murdering and take him bef ore the local Court there they just have no idea what\n29:23\nto do until a wise man suggests that the judge present the boy with an apple and\n29:3 0\na gold coin if the boy took the apple he was to be set free if he took the coin\n29:36\nhe was to be killed the judge took the wise man's advice and the boy grabbed\n29:42\nthe apple with a laugh thus he was set free wi thout any punishment in the first\n29:48\nedition this was followed up by a part two which is somehow even more brutal so\n29:53\nI'm not going to s hare it here but that story was deemed so gruesome that it was\n29:58\ntak en out of later editions of the brothers Grim stories it only appeared in the very first publication and this\n30:06\nwas actually something that ya kob himself protested heavily apparently this was one of the stories that had\n30:12\ncome from the mouth of their own mother and yakob remembers th at after hearing the story he certainly played a lot more\n30:19\ncarefull y there definitely was value to the story and while I get why you\n30:25\n probably wouldn't want kids reading that one I I think that in the origina l intended context of it being a\n30:31\ncollection of folk stories for ad ults it makes a lot of sense to have that story\n30:37\nin there while it is a warning to children to play carefully it's also a\n30:42\nreally inte resting exploration into the culpability of children at what age does\n30: 48\na child become fully responsible for their actions at what age should their\n30:54\nconscience prevent things like that from happening no one li kes to consider the\n31:00\nfact that children can do really terrible thin gs but sometimes they do\n31:05\nand this story presents something very in teresting the child is allowed to choose between an apple the instant\n31: 12\ngratification and sweet treat of an apple versus a gold coin which is something that an adult would certainly\n31:19\nchoose over an apple and t he child chooses the Apple meaning that in all\n31:24\nlikelihood he just didn't understand the serious ious nness and the adultness of\n31:31\nthe act that he was performing it asks questions about who is accountable when a child does something wrong is it the\n31:39\nbutcher who allowed the ch ildren to watch as he slaughtered pigs was it the\n31:44\nchild himself wh o had no comprehension of his action or was it maybe even the\n31:49\npare nts who probably should have been watching their kids a bit closer this is n't a fun story and it's probably not\n31:56\none I'd um you know bring to story time at the local library but it does what\n32:01\nthe best stories do it asks questions that provoke us to think further our\n32:07\nthird s tory is way less brutal and that is the tale of the old woman in the\n32:1 3\nforest it tells of a servant girl left all alone in the forest after he r\n32:19\nemployers are killed by robbers she cries and cries thinking tha t she's going to die out there but then she's\n32:26\nsaved by a dove hold ing a key the golden key unlocks a nearby tree where she\n32:32\nfinds an entire Cas of delicious food she eats and when she grows tired the\n32:38\ ndove brings her another key she unlocks another tree to find a beautiful bed for\n32:43\nher to sleep in and another tree where she finds a whole W ardrobe full of\n32:49\nbeautiful clothing after many days of living in lu xury in the forest the dove asks her for something in return I'm\n32:56\ng oing to lead you to a small cottage said the dove you are to go inside whe re you'll find an old woman seated right\n33:03\nnext to the Hearth she'll say good day to you but you are not to answer her no matter what she does go past her to the\n33:10\nright where you'll come upon a door open it an d you'll find a room where there will be lots of different kinds of rings\ n33:17\nlying on a table you'll see magnificent ones with glistening stone s but you're\n33:22\nto leave them alone pick out a simple one that will b e lying among them and\n33:27\nbring it to me as fast as you can the girl hastens to obey enters the home and\n33:33\nignores the old woman even as she screams at the girl to stop and finally\n33:38\nshe makes her way into the room that the dove described while she was looking for the ring she n oticed the old woman\n33:45\nslinking by with a bird cage in her hand the woman was about to make off with it but the maiden went up to her and took \n33:51\nthe cage out of her hand when she lifted it up and looked inside she saw a bird\n33:57\nwith a Le ring in its beak she snatches the ring an d runs but returns to find\n34:02\nher Dove nowhere to be seen while she's waiting she leans against a tree but\n34:08\nsuddenly that tree begins to move its branches wrap around her and when the\n34:14\ngirl turns around she finds that the tree has become a handsome young man and\n34:19\nthe tw o Embrace he explains that he is actually a prince and that him and his\n3 4:26\nservants and his entire house have been turned into trees by the wic ked witch he\n34:31\nwas able to become a dove for a few hours every day b ut so long as the old woman had the ring he was trapped by\n34:39\nstealin g the ring the girl has freed him and they ride off into the sunset\n34:44 \ntogether that story is really interesting to me because although it is c ertainly unique it contains so many\n34:52\nvery familiar fairy tale eleme nts helpful birds can be seen in in many\n34:58\ndifferent fairy tales the image of a child lost in the dangerous Woods is pervasive that child brea king and\n35:05\nentering a witch's cabin is practically a staple and of c ourse the girls saving\n35:11\nthe prince and turning him human can be fou nd in many tales but to me it rang\n35:16\nmost similarly to the classic t ale of Beauty and the Beast now what's\n35:22\ninteresting is that Beauty and the Beast is not German it is a very specifically\n35:29\nFrench story with some Italian influences but it's definitely not\n35:34\nGerman which is really interesting that either it has influenced this story or\n35:39\ nthis story has probably influenced it either way there is some kind of cr osscultural bleed there now I'm not\n35:47\ntrying to say that the old wom an in the forest is like fanfiction of Beauty and the Beast or something b ut it is some\n35:54\nkind of proof that although they didn't necessarily know it or acknowledge it in their time the stories collected by the\n36:0 1\nbrothers Grim are not solely German in origin and I do think it's worth \n36:07\nexamining if that's important and because a lot of people think i t is why that is so important in their\n36:14\nexploration on the brothers Grim Alfred and Mary David explain all the labors of\n36:19\nthe Grims wh ether in philology or in folklore stem from a basic premise that\n36:24\nt hey share with most of the major figures of the Romantic Movement there is a spiritual force in nature that\n36:30\nfinds expression in literature n ature means not only external nature mountains\n36:37\nforests Lakes but h uman nature which responds to these things the ancient\n36:43\npoets the G rims and their fellow Romantics felt had lived closer to Nature and their Works were therefore\n36:50\nimbued with fundamental truths and values the se truths and values had been\n36:56\ngiven their noblest embod in the anc ient epic poetry much of it lost but they still survived in the\n37:03\nhu mbler form of the folk tale there was a belief that only intensified over time\n37:10\nthat coming from a more ancient like primitive more connected to Nature time\n37:16\nthese stories contain some kind of German quintess ence that by studying and\n37:22\npopularizing these stories they would fi nd some kind of over seing national\n37:28\nidentity to which they could c ling now that's not entirely inaccurate these\n37:33\nstories told by a pa rticular people and region are significant and of course they were in stud y but consigning\n37:41\nanything to belong specifically to any one nation ality can be a bit of a\n37:47\nslippery slope for example very classicall y German things like vogner's ring cycle and the stories of the\n37:55\nbr others Grim were adopted and upheld by\n38:00\nparticular movements of the 1930s and 40s that I can't name or else YouTube\n38:05\nwill block this v ideo suffice it to say trying to claim that anything is\n38:11\nquintessen tially German and defining what values make someone quintessentially Germa n or\n38:17\nquintessentially any nationality you risk alienating people t hat don't\n38:22\nspecifically fit into that mold it also means that stori es like the ring cycle\n38:28\nor like the stories of the brothers Grim ma y be written off by people who for\n38:33\nwhatever reason don't want to e ngage with things that are German specifically\n38:38\nin the case of the Allies in World War II they specifically avoided things that were consider ed very German and that\n38:46\nincluded the tales of the brothers Grim de spite the fact that the tales of the brothers Grim had nothing to do with the\n38:54\ncertain political movements that had taken over Germany and wh at's really crazy is that these stories aren't even\n39:01\ntechnically Ge rman in a lot of cases first off Germany didn't exist when a\n39:07\nlot o f them were being told and collected and stories don't really\n39:13\nresp ect arbitrary borders that's like expecting um rivers or Wildlife to\n39:1 9\nrespect the arbitrary lines that we draw on maps in fact a lot of the\n 39:24\nstorytellers that contributed things especially for the first volum e of fairy tales they were actually French people\n39:31\nwho just a coupl e of years before had migrated over to Germany so they weren't\n39:36\neve n technically German whatever that means because it's a human term that we \n39:42\nhave applied to stories but the stories themselves do not obey th ose labels you\n39:47\ncan find crossover and influence from stories from all across Europe in the\n39:53\ntales of the brothers grim and you could probably make Fair arguments that there are international stories sprinkle d in\n40:00\nthere some things are a bit Universal while the idea of a sau sage um sliding\n40:06\nhis body through the vegetables to season them may be admittedly um quintessentially German the concept of a\n40:13\nlittle girl lost in the forest is universal and can be found in the\n40:18\nstori es of almost all if not all cultures on his essay exploring the idea\n40:2 4\nof ownership and the Grim fairy tales Donald hos explores this idea ver y thoroughly that essay is linked in the\n40:31\ndescription along with a lot of other very interesting discussions uh revolving around the brothers Grim but\n40:38\nhe dispels the idea of a story being able to be owned by a single nationality because first off that's a dangerous and\n40:45\nlim iting way to look at stories and second off stories rarely actually\n40:50 \nrespect International borders but even then the alternative to that some times\n40:56\npeople swing a little bit too far in the direction of univer sality okay so if stories don't\n41:02\nbelong to a single nationality if they don't belong to America or to England or to Germany who do they belon g to you\n41:10\ncould say they belong to all of us that the folk in folk tale is all of humanity\n41:16\nand that stories like fairy tales contain some kind of universal human value but the problem\n41:24\nwith that is wh at are those Universal human values I think that\n41:29\ninternationally w e can all kind of agree that children with knives isn't a good call but be yond that you get into\n41:37\ngeneralizing and stereotyping that just doe sn't really Encompass the full\n41:43\nbreadth and variety and diversity o f The Human Experience so we're left in a\n41:48\nplace where the national istic definition doesn't satisfy nor does the concept of\n41:54\nuniversal ownership in both cases fairy tales are supposed to depict or\n42:00\npre scribe for us what is true as well as what forms of behavior are typical\n 42:05\nnormal and acceptable whether we view them as yours and mine or as ours fairy\n42:11\ntales read from these perspectives confine and limit us narrowing our views\n42:16\nof reality while allegedly giving us greater insight into the other into ourselves or into Humanity from these\n42:24\n perspectives fairy tales own us we don't own them I do find it kind of\n42 :31\nunfortunate that this is a conversation that has to happen at all but the idea that a story can be owned by one\n42:38\nspecific person has bec ome so prevalent over the last few centuries the idea of\n42:45\ncopyright has had a huge impact on The Art of Storytelling in that we feel the\n42: 50\ncompulsive need to assign ownership and to consider the ownership of e verything\n42:57\nit can't just be a collection of fairy stories it is the brothers Grim collection of fairy stories it is\n43:04\nDisney's Cinderel la it is this actor's show it is this author's book it is this\n43:10\npro ducer's movie ownership is important obviously it matters who originally t old\n43:16\na story and what their intent was but that can't be where our consideration of\n43:21\na story ends because the moment that a story leav es one person's mouth and enters another person's mind it is\n43:29\nchang ed it is the egg being cracked open even if all of the pieces are still\n4 3:34\nthere it will never quite be the same it is totally fair to attribut e that\n43:40\nspecific collection of fairy tales to the brothers grim and even to the larger country of Germany but that cannot be\n43:48\nwhere a consideration of these stories ends Donald hos explains so who owns\n43:54 \nfairy tales to be blunt I do and you do we can each claim fairy tales\n4 4:00\nfor ourselves not as members of a national or ethnic folk group as F rench\n44:05\nGerman or American not as nameless faces in a sea of humanit y and not in the\n44:11\nDisney model as legal copyright holders we claim fairy tales in every individual\n44:18\nAct of telling and reading it is b y this process of continual transformation that\n44:25\nstories stay alive without Shrek I bet a whole generation would never have heard of The Muff in Man\n44:33\nWithout Disney's Snow White The Tale of Snow White may be j ust as obscure as the\n44:38\nmouse the bird and the sausage and without t he brother's Grim collecting\n44:44\npreserving and retelling these storie s we wouldn't have this entire plethora of\n44:50\nbeautiful educational a nd imaginative fairy tales that we have today I\n44:57\nhonestly think I m ight uh perish if I try and get through a video without talking about tolk en a little bit so I\n45:03\nwanted to bring up one of his storytelling co ncept and that is the idea of The Cauldron of story speaking\n45:11\nof th e histories of stories and especially of fairy Stories We may say that the pot of soup The Cauldron of\n45:18\nstory has always been boiling and to it have continually been added new bits\n45:25\ndainty and UND dainty a st ory is not an individual incident it is an ongoing\n45:32\nprocess once it has been put out into the world a story drops down into The\n45:38\nCauld ron where it simmers away breaking into its component parts exchanging\n45 :44\nflavors with the tails that lay around it until a new teller wants to spin\n45:49\ntheir tail and they dip into the pot take out these older el ements reform\n45:55\nreshape them repurpose them and put them back into t he pot once the new story is\n46:01\ntold the same as it ever was but irre vocably Changed by time and by the\n46:08\ncomplexities of the human mind tolken mentions many stories that have found\n46:13\ntheir way into the ca uldron the tale of King Arthur of fafnir and of sigur and\n46:20\nof cours e the classic fairy tale I wish to point to something else that these Trad itions contain a a singularly\n46:27\nsuggestive example of the relation o f the fairy tale element to gods and Kings\n46:34\nand nameless men illust rating I believe the view that this element does not rise\n46:40\nor fall but is there in The Cauldron of story waiting for the great figures of\n46 :46\nmyth and history and for the yet nameless he or she waiting for the\n 46:51\nmoment when they are cast into the simmering Stew one by one or all together without consideration of rank\n46:59\nor precedence the importan t part of tolk's cauldron of story is not necessarily what's put in or who put it\n47:06\nin or what their reasoning was what's important is what we take out of it and\n47:12\nthat means that it's really impressive when we find something like the tales of the brothers Grim something that has bee n in this cauldron for so long but\n47:20\nsomething that continues to pro ve itself to be flexible Timeless and significant\n47:25\nbecause it is Ta les like that that will continue to flavor the stew of our\n47:31\nimagina tions for generations to come you guys know that I absolutely love\n47:37\ nresearching highly specific and kind of random topics and putting togethe r this\n47:42\nvideo was an absolute blast I pretty much didn't know anyth ing about the actual Brothers Grim going into this and\n47:50\nthey had in credibly interesting lives and there's a lot of stuff that I wasn't able t o get into in this video so if if\n47:56\nyou want to learn a little bit m ore and do a bit of research yourself I highly recommend checking out anyt hing by Jack\n48:02\nzipes he's written a lot of stuff that was hugely hel pful for putting this video together and his translation of\n48:09\nthe gr im tales is topnotch so go ahead and check that out I will link a couple\n 48:15\nof things in the description and then of course my sources are also in the description in the comments let me know\n48:21\nwhat your favorite Brothers Grim fairy tale is especially if it's one of the more obscure on es on but I mean who\n48:28\ndoesn't love the classics I think my favorite other than the mouse the sausage and the bird is probably Little\n48:35\n Red Riding Hood because I've always been a big fan of cloaks and also beca use we had that really creepy 3D animated movie\n48:43\nHoodwinked on DVD as a kid and that kind of imprinted on my mind like I'm a baby\n48:50\nduc k and I still think about that movie a lot today I am planning on hopping on\n48:56\nthe patreon this weekend to do a little cozy read through of so me more of the\n49:02\nbrothers Grim fairy tales we'll pick a couple I mig ht do it with the rats so\n49:07\nthat I have somebody to read too other t han the Silence of my own mind but if you're interested in that my patreon is\n49:14\nlinked right below thank you so much for joining me this week I really love making videos about Tolen but I really\n49:20\nlike making v ideos about other stuff too and it means the world that you guys are here supporting me even when when I'm\n49:27\ndoing slightly more out there top ics and I hope that you have a very happy hoby\n49:33\nday [Music]\n49:42\ n[Music]\n\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n MY COMMENT\n\n\n\n What are your thoughts on Giovanni Francesco Straparola or Giovanni Boccaccio ? I think those two p redecessors inspired the grimms initial style of a full range of tales\, t o the merger of christianity with folk tales from the countryside of europ e.\n\n\n\n That gentleman mouse on the wall will never switch places with the bird + sausage.\n\n\n\n Thanks for sharing the stories. Great point\, on culture attributation. Funny that most whites in the usa are german ame ricans. Good point on how human cultures influence each other with their f olklores. you may enjoy : the roach family and the mouse\; the mouse and t he potato chips\; the park mouse and the apartment mouse https://www.kobo. com/us/en/ebook/sunset-children-stories\n\n\n\n Yes\, copyright has taken over creativity with stories. I wonder is this the problem with all arts. When whites have issue with the presence of black ballerinas? When blacks have issues with the presence of white rappers?\n\n\n\n I concur to Tolkie n in that the stew builds over time. Any writer who interprets work over o ne hundred years old knows this to be true.\n\n\n\n hmm my favorite grimm is the bremen town players:) It makes me giggle thinking about it\, and i like the version when they scare the robbers and lie in that house on the road\, not reaching bremen. it is an excellent story about what inspires m igration\, a destination thought well like bremen\, but what inspires immi gration is finding a home along the way\, like a house on the road\n\n DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:20250226 RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;INTERVAL=1 END:VEVENT END:VCALENDAR