BEGIN:VCALENDAR VERSION:2.0 PRODID:-//InvisionCommunity Events 4.7.23//EN METHOD:PUBLISH CALSCALE:GREGORIAN REFRESH-INTERVAL:PT15M X-PUBLISHED-TTL:PT15M X-WR-CALNAME:RMCommunityCalendar NAME:RMCommunityCalendar BEGIN:VTIMEZONE TZID:Europe/London TZURL:http://tzurl.org/zoneinfo/Europe/London X-LIC-LOCATION:Europe/London BEGIN:DAYLIGHT TZOFFSETFROM:+0000 TZOFFSETTO:+0100 TZNAME:BST DTSTART:20250330T020000Z RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;BYMONTH=3;BYDAY=-1SU END:DAYLIGHT BEGIN:STANDARD TZOFFSETFROM:+0100 TZOFFSETTO:+0000 TZNAME:GMT DTSTART:20251026T020000Z RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;BYMONTH=10;BYDAY=-1SU END:STANDARD END:VTIMEZONE BEGIN:VEVENT SUMMARY:Economic Corner 28 11/23/2025 DTSTAMP:20251123T184117Z SEQUENCE:0 UID:600-7-c3fe8195a3dde498d013e477e2142422@aalbc.com ORGANIZER;CN="richardmurray":troy@aalbc.com DESCRIPTION:\n The 2\,000\n\n\n\n I don't know if Schrumpfts 2\,000 doll ar check will come in BUT I do think this is a  perfect chance to talk ab out what happens if it does happen.\n\n\n\n For example\n\n\n\n New York C ity has a possible three million black folks. Let us say\, a third are chi ldren. so\, two million adults. \n\n\n\n If each adult gives one dollar o f their $2\,000 that is two million dollars. Now what does the black popul ace in NYC need?\n\n\n\n Maybe they could vote on it?\n\n\n\n Now before y ou get excited lets be honest\, few have the clout to get that many Black adults in NYC behind an initiative. the tribal issues exist and it is simp ly not easy. \n\n\n\n But\, the idea has wings in a lesser way. \n\n\n\n Any black person in any black group \, for example\n\n\n\n the black memb ers of one mosque\n\n\n\n the black members of one church\n\n\n\n the blac k members of the party of abraham lincoln in one city\n\n\n\n the black me mbers of the party of andrew jackson in one city\n\n\n\n the black alumni for any college in one city\n\n\n\n can all pool a single dollar together and do something with the collected funds. \n\n\n\n To what end\, you wil l need a voting system\, where people who placed a dollar get the chance t o place their desired collective action. \n\n\n\n And then have a boring\ , long but very even process for each pooler's collective action through a simple yeah or neah on the action from the entire poolers body\, so each idea gets to be voted on by every member\, yes or no. \n\n\n\n The idea t hat won the most yeahs gets done. If a draw a the top. Another round of vo ting where each idea gets voted on \, yes or no\, by each pooler. \n\n\n\ n If two rounds go with the same draw result\, then the poolers who made t he idea\, get to amend their idea. \n\n\n\n And vote again\, the added de tails should lead to an imbalance and if still a tie\, amend again. \n\n\ n\n  \n\n\n\n Yes in a better scenario \, someone black with enough conne ctions calls for a million man march and millions of black men go to this place and each leave a dollar and then vote in a truly even way to use the money. But the conditions don't favor that. But\, i think every black chu rch or mosque can do it. And even if the results are small the real goal i s for black collectives to do something...\n\n\n\n KWanzaa is coming up an d a tenet is collective work and responsibility. \n\n\n\n The timing coul dn't be better.\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n PArtially Inspired by this dialog\n\n\n \n https://aalbc.com/tc/topic/12056-african-christians-african-american-ch ristians/#findComment-77851\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n POST URL\n\n\n\n https://aa lbc.com/tc/topic/12059-2000-million-people-marches/\n\n\n\n PRIOR EDITION\ n\n\n\n https://aalbc.com/tc/events/event/586-economic-corner-27-11122025/ \n\n\n\n NEXT EDITION\n\n\n\n https://aalbc.com/tc/events/event/605-econom ic-corner-29-11302025/\n\n\n\n COMMENTARIES\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n COMMENT\n\n \n\n  @ProfD\n\n\n\n \n On 11/23/2025 at 2:20 PM\, ProfD said:\n \n\n \n \n 1) Needs have to be identified before a dime is spent.\n \n \n\n\n \n Well concerning my suggestion in the original post\, the needs can't be identified first cause the money is reliant on an unknown. The organizati on can come first and then if the money comes then\, the gathering of fund s\, ala trust\, and then those who have placed funds in the trust can vote \, ala what I stated in the larger post\, I don't know if you read it.\n\n \n\n  \n\n\n\n \n On 11/23/2025 at 2:20 PM\, ProfD said:\n \n\n \n \n Otherwise\, handing out $2\,000 per person especially those who don't hav e it already will lead to more consumerism.\n \n\n \n  \n \n\n \n Look no further back than those pandemic stimulus checks. \n \n \n\n\n\ n but that is the point of Universal BAsic Income\, it is just welfare\, j ust expanded. Consumerism isn't evil\, it is what the usa has always been\ , starting wiith the white murdering colonist. Remember\, the british colo nies had become a huge buyer\, consumer\, not a producer\, but a consumer. the best producing colonies were in the caribbean with over 90% black pop ulations which led to them all having a different phenotypical history to the english colonies n north america\, having a white european populace \, ever growing\, became big consumers. I recall france did stimulus checks and it was all used\, the french were wiser in that they gave guidelines f or where to spend. but the usa from a financial philosophy perspective his torically likes to allow a freer market\, that is how financial cheating a nd other things can thrive\, it is up to the individual in the usa\, again st france's communalist\, government guided economy through the fiscal cap italist free market.\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n @Pioneer1\n\n\n\n \n On 11/23/202 5 at 5:01 PM\, Pioneer1 said:\n \n\n \n \n I haven't followed this $2\, 000 story much because I don't think Trump is serious about it.\n \n \n\n \n\n nyc 80s white businessmen's fiscal culture isnt about planning\, it i s about shark hunting\, short term gains. \n\n\n\n shark hunting is buyin g things\, breaking them up and selling them into the market\, crows work. that is what the socialist financial models never have. This is why too b ig to fail was huge\, cause the usa did a piss poor variant of socialism i n saving the banks. they saved the banks like in a socialist model but unl ike a socialist model didn't demand they plan\, so the banks haven't impro ved. \n\n\n\n And short terms gains isn't about seriousness\, in schrumpf ts case they are wild gambits. they shake things up which was his original premise and I don't he has ever left that position.\n\n\n\n \n On 11/23/ 2025 at 5:01 PM\, Pioneer1 said:\n \n\n \n \n richarmurray talks about Universal Basic Income....so is he talking about giving it to people MONTH LY or is this just another one time deal kind of like the stimulus checks for Covid?\n \n \n\n\n\n I apologize for confusing you. This is a one tim e thing\, but I think as this is the economic corner. that if he succeeds this is a huge step to universal basic income becoming in some form or fas hion. Cause if he can do it once\, he can do it again and the next preside nt can as well and with the executive order culture reaching new heights\, all the precedence is present for it to become something that happens at a greater frequency.\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n well... gimmick\, the usa is over three hundred and fifty million people. half of that is one hundred and se venty five million so if that is the count of adults\n\n\n\n two thousand multiplied by one hundred and seventy five million is three hundred and fi fty billion dollars. I don't see 350\,000\,000\,000 as a gimmick. \n\n\n\ n I think you and Profd have a very low view of others financially\, that I don't have. \n\n\n\n I never forget one winter past\, real cold\, and a homeless person asked for money and I gave it cause i had it to give. And a black person of you and profd's philosophical race said I shouldn't hav e did that cause that person will spend it on liquor. And I replied to the m that i didn't give the money as a test or because I judged or critiqued them in any way\, I gave the money because I could and I wanted to\, the w ay in which they use it is up to them\, and considering it is cold\, I thi nk it wise to warm your belly with liquor if you live in the cold. \n\n\n \n  \n\n\n\n I have always found the voice of black people like you and p rofd who chime in that helping others\, especially black folk\, shouldn't be done\, to be very ugly. If you don't want to help other black people. D on't. I have no problem with that. But chiming in that people shouldn't be helped because you feel they are unwarranted based on your critique of th em or your evaluation of what they will do... well ok. You two plus the ma ny other blacks I have heard do it are free to do it\, I have no problem w ith none of you doing it\, but it is an ugly act. That kind of talk in the village needs to be stated for what it is\, ugly. \n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n \n On 11/24/2025 at 7:46 AM\, Pioneer1 said:\n \n\n \n \n And the REAL k icker is they're probably going to put up all kinds of limitations and exe mptions on it to where half if not most people wouldn't even qualify for t hat money anyway.\n \n \n\n\n\n I don't think so\, like the stimulus chec ks this is meant to go wide. I will say this\, SCrumpft wants this to go w ide\, I Think the problem is the congress... the congress in the usa is a mess in terms of what is produces legislatively.  IT rarely is well const ructed and all to often has alot of dysfunctional complexity to maintain a gendas against the purposes of the laws.\n\n\n\n I think many of the limit s and exemptions may happen but largely because of two things\n\n\n\n 1. t he multipheonotypical naysayers to UBI. For some reason many in government fear UBI. I have listened to their arguments and none hold water. The non black naysayers talk about the merit of work but the usa wasn't built on the merit of work it was built on murdering others for land and enslaving other human beings. the northern colonies were extremely poor compared to the southern. the northern colonies were the most eager to cede from the e nglish empire as they were poorest in north america+caribbean in terms of wealth making and could use to not pay taxes to england\, but virginia to the carolinas were only interested for the opportunity to avoid taxation a nd gain more money. Hard work had nothing to do with it.  The black naysa yers talk about their pseudo prescient view that people will spend the mon ey negatively which has no basis in truth. All the people in the usa who h ad home bills to pay or children to feed spent some or all of each stimulu s on bills and care. homeless and other very fiscally poor people don't ha ve homes or others to care for usually\, so they spent as they wanted. but commerce is not bad\, usa business retained all that money so it wasn't w asted it was fueled right back into the economy of the usa. which is the p oint of welfare\, the impoverished get to feed themselves \, the market ge ts fuel. \n\n\n\n 2. the donkeys\, the part of andrew jackson were the on es who stopped the stimulus checks from continually coming. They felt it w asn't feasible which is interesting cause the donkeys love government spen ding. The problem with stimulus checks is the donkeys can't use stimulus c hecks for favors of big firms. the thousands to millions of homeless peopl e getting stimulus checks going to the liquor store\, buying a sandwich \, maybe a new pair of shoes isn't influencing big business through governme nt spending. But spending money on the affordable care act\, which then go es to insurance companies\, is an example of how to influence the big firm s. So I can see the donkeys trying to stop it though with the shutdown res ult I imagine a  number of donkeys may disregard schumer and others which will make it easy to happen. \n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n COMMENT\n\n\n\n  \n\n\ n\n  @ProfD\n\n\n\n \n On 11/24/2025 at 8:27 PM\, ProfD said:\n \n\n \n \n I read it.\n \n\n \n  \n \n\n \n From reading your posts\, I don't get the impression you have started businesses and/or managed a lo t of money.\n \n\n \n  \n \n\n \n As a result\,  our perspective s are vastly different when it comes to financial management.\n \n \n\n\ n\n Even point\, our experiences are different\, we are two strangers\, yo u don't know me and i don't know\, we both have levels of assumption \,but our experiences have clearly  led to varying perspectives.\n\n\n\n \n O n 11/24/2025 at 8:27 PM\, ProfD said:\n \n\n \n \n Clearly\, you have m isread or misinterpreted what I've written around here. However\, your mis interpretation is consistent with our differing perspectives especially as it relates to money and investing. \n \n \n\n\n\n par the course\, I do nt' think so. when a person says that giving money to another person will be wasted in their opinion and they are opposed to it\, even when the mone y will not be there own\, I see my position as in even response to your wo rds which are said similar.\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n @Troy\n\n\n\n \n On 11/24/ 2025 at 8:38 PM\, Troy said:\n \n\n \n \n don't worry about those broth ers just are projecting what they would do with the money 🙂\n \n \n\n\ n\n well the post wasn't about what individuals would do but what will a g roup do \, each a portion of their funds. Now if either had said they woul dn't put their dollar in the pot   to the stated concept then fine. I ha ve no problem with that. But that wasn't an element of their discourse. It was  \n\n\n\n from Profd  The net benefit is zero especially if folks are going to spend it on BS instead of investing it in something that act ually makes more money\n\n\n\n from Pioneer Low intelligence people are e asily \"bought off\" with cheap gifts and trinkets\, while more intelligen t people look at the LONG TERM aspect and what offers the most benefit in the long run.\n\n\n\n I think my response was even to both. What does eith er of those projections serve a group action as I suggested? \n\n\n\n And I will be blunt\, I have been blessed to be around many types of Black pe ople\, various generations\, various religious associations\, various lang uage types... being a black kid in NYC depending on where in the Black woo ds you live can be very open to how varying black people can be. And so I have always heard black people talk like profd + pioneer when it comes to the qualities of other black people or when it comes to how other black pe ople behave from their view\, when it comes to how other black people who m they view lesser than or negatively in some fashion should be treated. a nd... I have never cared for it.  I have also always heard black people n ot talk like profd + pioneer when it comes to said similar values or persp ectives or judgements. \n\n\n\n Many black people are not going to act or behave the way any one black person thinks\, but when a group action is c alled\, that isn't just about a black individuals views\, or when one sees another black person helping another black person\, that isn't about what said one would do\, it is about two others. \n\n\n\n And I have witnesse d black individuals in a group offline\, chime in just like those two\, wh en all in a group were asked to help and the projections of the philosophi cal peers to profd or pioneer offline were... didn't help.  \n\n\n\n  \ n\n\n\n \n On 11/24/2025 at 8:38 PM\, Troy said:\n \n\n \n \n They are motivated by the acquisition of wealth not distributing it.  They are ab out exploitation period.\n \n \n\n\n\n You think UBI will be a distributi on of wealth? I don't think so. It is welfare\, expanded but welfare. Like the stimulus checks that money will mostly go into paying bills. \n\n\n\ n  \n\n\n\n \n On 11/24/2025 at 8:38 PM\, Troy said:\n \n\n \n \n If the US somehow decided to pay a UBI you can forget about reparations forev er.\n \n \n\n\n\n well\, as the discourse in my post in this forum have p roven\, even a small set of black people can't even come to a collective a ccepted position on what reparations is defined as for Black DOSers let al one how it shall be implemented. Are Black DOSers owed reparations? 100% h istorical fact\, financially. Are reparations that Black DOSers owed beyon d money? 100% true too.  But\, absent collective acceptance \, the Black DOS populace in the usa  can's decide what reparations is\, and it has to be decided on first before it can be implemented. It can't be what Profd wants or pioneer wants or Rich wants or Troy wants. It has to be what the group wants. \n\n\n\n And thank you Troy \, cause this economic corner\, outside my intentions has reinforced the truth of Reparations problems in the Black populace in the USA. \n\n\n\n If four black men :  me you Prof d Pioneer have this much collective unacceptance on financial matters\, ho w can the tens of millions of black people in the usa find a collective ac ceptance with reparations? \n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n @Pioneer1\n\n\n\n \n On 1 1/24/2025 at 9:20 PM\, Pioneer1 said:\n \n\n \n \n Are you prone to hal lucination or delusion?\n \n \n\n\n\n whichever answer is the worst in yo ur mind\, pick it. \n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n COMMENT\n\n\n\n  @Troy\n\n\n\n bu t in the testing program out west for the UBI \, i forget the name of the town and i think it even has a black representative\, years back at least\ , the UBI doesn't work by distributing funds\, the government prints the m oney and gives it.  The US Military allows the USA to print money and not worry about collection.\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n @Pioneer1\n\n\n\n \n On 11/25 /2025 at 6:19 PM\, Pioneer1 said:\n \n\n \n \n Was I wrong?\n \n \n\n\ n\n not based on your own definitions but if another doesn't share your de finitions then yes.\n\n\n\n \n On 11/25/2025 at 6:19 PM\, Pioneer1 said:\ n \n\n \n \n Again\, maybe people like us HAVE A POINT that you should pay attention to instead of thinking YOU have all the answers.\n \n \n\n\ n\n I have never said or felt i have all the answers\, if i did why commun icate in this very forum. But\, based on how black people like me and othe rs define things\, black people like you or profd are wrong in this case. I have publicly admitted you or profd have spoken truth or generated erudi tion before.\n\n\n\n  \n\n\n\n \n On 11/25/2025 at 6:19 PM\, Pioneer1 sa id:\n \n\n \n \n You know how I feel about Mamdani.\n\n So now if som ebody goes around the neighborhood demanding that all of the Black people take \"group action\" to run out and vote for him\, I'm going to have an i ssue with this because I don't feel this will properly or effectively help our community.\n \n \n\n\n\n I didn't refer to mamdani. I confused you a nd I apologize. when I spoke of group action I wasn't speaking in referenc e to him and I am not a mamdani supporter.\n\n DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:20251123 RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;INTERVAL=1 END:VEVENT END:VCALENDAR