Black Males And Jealousy

Pioneer1 · April 1, 2023

I touched on this in another thread recently and I went a little more in depth with Mel some years back when I said I don't like and in many cases do not tolerate White men or men of other races "getting their goodies" with the best of our women.

I don't believe Black men are jealous ENOUGH.
Especially when it comes with seeing our women interact with men of other races.
We can get jealous with EACHOTHER and often engage in all types of playa hatin' tactics to throw salt in eachother's game when it comes to the opposite sex. But when it comes to that White boy hanging around trying to start conversations and sneak a giggle or two from our sistaz....most Black men act like they don't even see him.
They act like he poses no threat what so ever.

You can't mess around with an Arab, Asian, or Latino (even a Black one) woman in the presence of men of that same ethnicity without them staring over trying to see what's going on and some of them even giving the women dirty looks.
Check it out and see if I'm lying.

That's one of the reasons you see so many Black men with Black women or White women but not too many others.
Those men are HIGHLY jealous and HIGHLY protective of their women, and many of their women seem to either enjoy it or not care.

When I find a sista who's attractive, intelligent, and knows how to act like a lady....that's a PRIZE.
Not trying to see them prance off arm-n-arm with some greasy haired White or "almost" White dude, talking about how "in love" they are with eachother.

And if you're a Black man and you don't mind seeing this, YOU are part of the problem.
That's right!

You don't care enough about your own women to want to keep them, hold on to them, and protect them from being snatched up by other communities.

Why?
Because you don't prize them or hold them above other women.....so them leaving or being snatched away doesn't matter to you.

Now I'm a fair man and I believe in Justice.
I'm not going to physically stop a Black woman from being with whatever man she chooses.
However I have and I WILL make it crystal clear that I DO NOT like the best of our women even having CASUAL conversations with White men let alone getting into relationships with them and having sex and children with them.
Let them find a crack ho or some hood rat if they have a Black fetish, but leave our good sistas ALONE.

ProfD · April 1, 2023

@Pioneer1, according to NF Jr., Black men aren't qualified to be husbands or fathers.

The reality is Black men cannot afford to be jealous if our sistas decide to date someone else.

Unfortunately, the ratio is not even when it comes to Black men and women being of equal status.

There are many intelligent and successful sistas who will have a hard time finding a brotha of equal or higher status.

Dont get it twisted...while a sista will take a brotha below her pay grade, there will be issues. Men are not designed to be the tail.

While there are always exceptions, in every other culture, the roles of men and women are clearly defined based on their traditions. They have a code.

Until Black men are better prepared to take care of Black women, it makes no sense for them got jealous and start huffin' and puffin' and yellin' and cussin' because they can't afford them.

If the Black man fails to get his weight up and stay on code, Black women will find themselves in someone else's arms.

There's little or nothing a Black man can do about it especially if he's broke, er, underfunded and/or dumb, er, unintelligent.

frankster · April 2, 2023

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I touched on this in another thread recently and I went a little more in depth with Mel some years back when I said I don't like and in many cases do not tolerate White men or men of other races "getting their goodies" with the best of our women.

I don't believe Black men are jealous ENOUGH.

I would not call it Jealousy but .....Territorialism.

In that sense maybe you are seeing Black Women as the exclusive property of Black Men....and not Sovereign Individuals in and of themselves.

Which I would say is a behaviour exhibited by white men for years over white women.

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Especially when it comes with seeing our women interact with men of other races.
We can get jealous with EACHOTHER and often engage in all types of playa hatin' tactics to throw salt in eachother's game when it comes to the opposite sex. But when it comes to that White boy hanging around trying to start conversations and sneak a giggle or two from our sistaz....most Black men act like they don't even see him.

They act like he poses no threat what so ever.

Where is the threat....if two human beings decide to hook up?

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

You can't mess around with an Arab, Asian, or Latino (even a Black one) woman in the presence of men of that same ethnicity without them staring over trying to see what's going on and some of them even giving the women dirty looks.
Check it out and see if I'm lying.

You may not being lying.....but is that a behaviour to be model after?

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

That's one of the reasons you see so many Black men with Black women or White women but not too many others.
Those men are HIGHLY jealous and HIGHLY protective of their women, and many of their women seem to either enjoy it or not care.

Asian women cross ethnic lines more than any other ethnic women

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

When I find a sista who's attractive, intelligent, and knows how to act like a lady....that's a PRIZE.

I agree

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Not trying to see them prance off arm-n-arm with some greasy haired White or "almost" White dude, talking about how "in love" they are with eachother.

Which would you rather see them with... any kind of Blackman or a good man regardless of his ethnicity/race?

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

And if you're a Black man and you don't mind seeing this, YOU are part of the problem.
That's right!

Maybe I am wrong but I sometimes like seeing so called interracial couples

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

You don't care enough about your own women to want to keep them, hold on to them, and protect them from being snatched up by other communities.

Why?
Because you don't prize them or hold them above other women.....so them leaving or being snatched away doesn't matter to you.

Now I'm a fair man and I believe in Justice.

I think Justice in this case would mean allowing people the freedom to choose who they want.....

Being there to protect that freedom of choice is the best way to show you care.

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I'm not going to physically stop a Black woman from being with whatever man she chooses.

I agree.

9 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

However I have and I WILL make it crystal clear that I DO NOT like the best of our women even having CASUAL conversations with White men let alone getting into relationships with them and having sex and children with them.
Let them find a crack ho or some hood rat if they have a Black fetish, but leave our good sistas ALONE.

So now you are segregating black women into classes....classism

The crack ho and or hood rat are black women who are usually most vulnerable...aren't these the individuals most in need of help guidance and protection.

Pioneer1 · April 2, 2023

ProfD

according to NF Jr., Black men aren't qualified to be husbands or fathers.

But whether we're qualified or not, Neely Fuller Jr. has BOTH....lol.
And I doubt even at 93 he'd let any man come up and mess with his wife either...lol.

This is why I listen to Neely Fuller Jr. but have to take some of what he says with a grain of salt.

The reality is Black men cannot afford to be jealous if our sistas decide to date someone else.

It's a natural emotion that SHOULD rise up in us whether we can afford to or not.
It shouldn't be something we have to "reason" about.

It's like some strange man cussing at your mother.
You don't stop and reason what SHE might have done to anger this man, you just automatically get angry and offended because it's your mother.

You SHOULD be offended when someone you love is threatened.

Unfortunately, the ratio is not even when it comes to Black men and women being of equal status.
There are many intelligent and successful sistas who will have a hard time finding a brotha of equal or higher status.

A lot of them are out there, even if they are not FBA.
However the point is, they should be kept with us whether we're "good enough" for them or not.

If a sista is smart and wealthy, all the more reason to keep her in our community and not "let" her get with men of another.

While there are always exceptions, in every other culture, the roles of men and women are clearly defined based on their traditions. They have a code.

True.

Until Black men are better prepared to take care of Black women, it makes no sense for them got jealous and start huffin' and puffin' and yellin' and cussin' because they can't afford them.

You're correct.
And being "better prepared to take care of them" starts with a DESIRE to take care of them in the first place.
A lot of our brothers don't have that desire, which is why they could care less about other men running off with them.

If the Black man fails to get his weight up and stay on code, Black women will find themselves in someone else's arms.

If as men we continue to let them.

Most men of other communities don't give their women that "choice" whether to stay or go.

There's little or nothing a Black man can do about it especially if he's broke, er, underfunded and/or dumb, er, unintelligent.

I agree.
Especially if he's stupid....there is little he can or will do.
He doesn't have sense enough.

Pioneer1 · April 2, 2023

frankster

I would not call it Jealousy but .....Territorialism.

True.
But at the root of it, it's jealousy and covetousness.

Men who desire power and control over their environment.....instead of succumbing to a victim mentality.

In that sense maybe you are seeing Black Women as the exclusive property of Black Men....and not Sovereign Individuals in and of themselves.

Correct.
As most men who aren't oppressed and haven't learned to be comfortable being helpless see the women in their community.

Which I would say is a behaviour exhibited by white men for years over white women.

My point exactly.
.....because they haven't been oppressed lately, so they think like conquerors, not slaves.

A slave has come to acknowledge he has no control over the women in his community so he stops caring.

Where is the threat....if two human beings decide to hook up?

If you had a wife and she decide to "hook up" with another man, you wouldn't see a threat?

You may not being lying.....but is that a behaviour to be model after?

It's not the most ideal, but it's certainly more honorable than the behavior I see exhibited by most AfroAmerican men which is simply and truly not caring one way or the other.
You aren't going to walk up into an Asian establishment and sit with a table full of Asian women and not have the Asian men sit their wondering WTF???

Infact, the women probably wouldn't even do it WITH YOU....because they have too much respect for Asian men to do that infront of them.

Asian women cross ethnic lines more than any other ethnic women

Yes....with White men.
And most Asian men I've talked to don't like it, but say there's little they can do about it.

Which would you rather see them with... any kind of Blackman or a good man regardless of his ethnicity/race?

If those are the only 2 choices.....neither.

Maybe I am wrong but I sometimes like seeing so called interracial couples

When it comes to Black people dating interracially.....

I'd rather see a Black man with a Black woman, however I will tolerate our men being the ones to dip outside than our women do it because they are more vulnerable and when women dip outside of the community it is more dangerous and harmful

Again, this may not sound fair....but it history proves that it works.

A community can remain strong while the men are screwing women outside of it, but when the WOMEN start doing so....it will collapse quickly.

I think Justice in this case would mean allowing people the freedom to choose who they want.....

Being there to protect that freedom of choice is the best way to show you care

As the Bible says...
There are ways that SEEM right unto man, but the end results are DEATH.

There are many things that may SEEM fair and just, but the results of them are death and disaster.
On the other hand, there are things that SEEM unfair and unjust....but the results are progress, prosperity, and stability.

Men in charge and having control over who their women associate with outside of the community SEEMS sexist, barbaric, and unfair.....but it appears to work much better for other communities than the laissez-faire mentality of letting the women do and screw whoever she wants and not worrying about it, so many Black American men have.
This CLEARLY hasn't worked for our community.

So now you are segregating black women into classes....classism

I didn't segregate them....they are ALREADY segregated into different classes, lol.
Infact, this can be said about the men too as well as the men and women of other communities.

That's human nature in general.

The crack ho and or hood rat are black women who are usually most vulnerable...aren't these the individuals most in need of help guidance and protection.

I don't know if they need the "most" help, guidance, and protection....but most of them certainly need a lot.
Some of them need to be kept the hell away from our healthy community as well.

We should focus are resources on those in the community who are actually TRYING to improve themselves and their community, not those who've given up on life and humanity and just exist to manipulate people, harm others, and have fun for themselves.

ProfD · April 2, 2023

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

And being "better prepared to take care of them" starts with a DESIRE to take care of them in the first place.

Most men of other communities don't give their women that "choice" whether to stay or go.

I don't think NF Jr. ever had a wife or kids. He even tells us his teachings are a guide. Use what is most beneficial.

Jealousy is a negative emotion like greed, envy and hate. It's destructive at best. Nothing good comes out of it.

Anger is a natural emotion too. One must be prepared to pay the mental and physical price if it leads to a destructive outcome.

Desire is no different than a dream if there is no action. A man has do the work that puts him in a position to call shots.

Men in other cultures aren't holding the women as hostages. Thr women have been indoctrinated by their culture. The women are on code too.

Pioneer1 · April 2, 2023

ProfD

I don't think NF Jr. ever had a wife or kids. He even tells us his teachings are a guide. Use what is most beneficial.

Yep, he's has (had?) both.
If you can dig it up, he often talks about living in YOUR city....Washington D.C. back in 1968 during the MLK assassination riots and how when they were burning down one end of his block, he had a firehose trying to put out the fires and save his end.

When a caller asked why, he said because his wife and kids were in there.

Ofcourse he calls them his "care unit" and "progeny" instead of wife and kids, but I believe he did use those terms a couple times to describe them.

Jealousy is a negative emotion like greed, envy and hate. It's destructive at best. Nothing good comes out of it.

There is no such thing as an inherently negative emotion.
GOD gave us these emotions for a reason.

There are negative USES of it....but jealousy isn't negative in and of itself.

Sure jealousy can be destructive and get you in trouble.
But if manipulated correctly...can be a great motivator and provide with with tremendous energy to accomplish goals, set boundaries, and protect the assets and people you love.

Show me a man who never gets jealous...
And I'll show you a man who probably never had anything to be jealous ABOUT, lol.

If you never had shit, you never had to worry about anyone trying to take it from you.

Anger is a natural emotion too. One must be prepared to pay the mental and physical price if it leads to a destructive outcome.

Facts
And just like Jealousy, Anger...if manipulated properly...can be a powerful motivator and energizer.

Desire is no different than a dream if there is no action. A man has do the work that puts him in a position to call shots.

Facts

Men in other cultures aren't holding the women as hostages. Thr women have been indoctrinated by their culture. The women are on code too

And MORE FACTS
Although the men aren't holding the women hostage, many are doing so much for the women in terms of providing jobs for them, building housing, providing a home, supporting the children, etc....that it wouldn't make a lot of sense for them to walk away from them seeking men from another community.

It's easy for the average AfroAmerican woman to walk away from the average AfroAmerican man because he's not providing anything for her.
He doesn't pay her rent.
He doesn't employ her
He can't keep her out of jail
He doesn't provide her or his offspring with healthcare.

What does the average nigga have to offer besides sex and MAYBE some protection if another nigga tries to break in the house?
Maybe....hell, he might beat HER running to the bathroom to hide until the cops come.

Cynique · April 2, 2023

@ProfD and @frankster thank you for putting pioneer in check. It's not surprising how myopic somebody who has such a magnified vision of himself can be when it comes to expressing the opinions that he tries to pass off as facts. i didn't bother reading what I knew would be a crock of hogwash, but had I done so, my response would've certainly been in line with the replies you 2 posted.

If pioneer was half as omniscient as he thinks he is, he'd still be nothing more than a motormouth who needs his oil changed. He possesses no credentials but still thinks he's an authority on everything and that he has a hotline to god.

Pioneer1 · April 2, 2023

12 minutes ago, Cynique said:

hotline to god.

I noticed how you spelled "god" with a small "g".

That tells me a lot.

frankster · April 2, 2023

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

I would not call it Jealousy but .....Territorialism.

True.
But at the root of it, it's jealousy and covetousness.

Men who desire power and control over their environment.....instead of succumbing to a victim mentality.

Jealousy and covetousness is rooted in fear

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

in that sense maybe you are seeing Black Women as the exclusive property of Black Men....and not Sovereign Individuals in and of themselves.

Correct.
As most men who aren't oppressed and haven't learned to be comfortable being helpless see the women in their community.

So black women have no Agency over themselves?

Black women are in this scenario are.....Property?

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Which I would say is a behaviour exhibited by white men for years over white women.

My point exactly.
.....because they haven't been oppressed lately, so they think like conquerors, not slaves.

A slave has come to acknowledge he has no control over the women in his community so he stops caring.

Being a Conqueror over others is cruelty breeds resentment....being a conqueror over self is true Power.

Try as they did by making Laws and statutes....white women still found their way into the hands and bed of Black men.

It was wrong and it failed.....worst of all its is oppressive

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Where is the threat....if two human beings decide to hook up?

If you had a wife and she decide to "hook up" with another man, you wouldn't see a threat?

Every Black woman is not my wife

If my wife hooked up with another...yes I would feel betrayed and deceived - because we entered into a Marriage Contract and swore oaths of mutual fidelity.

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

You may not being lying.....but is that a behaviour to be model after?

It's not the most ideal, but it's certainly more honorable than the behavior I see exhibited by most AfroAmerican men which is simply and truly not caring one way or the other.

I do not think that's the way to show care.....to me that appears more like control through intimidation.

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

You aren't going to walk up into an Asian establishment and sit with a table full of Asian women and not have the Asian men sit their wondering WTF???

Infact, the women probably wouldn't even do it WITH YOU....because they have too much respect for Asian men to do that infront of them.

I am always conscious of the space I am in....so a lot depends on where you are

Some Asians do as you say....some do not care...and some encourage it

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Asian women cross ethnic lines more than any other ethnic women

Yes....with White men.
And most Asian men I've talked to don't like it, but say there's little they can do about it.

Yes Asian women are married mostly to white Men outside of their Race/Ethnicity.

As a corollary to show that intimidation and out lawing harmless human behaviour does not work ....The Forbidden Fruit Effect

In other your ideas may have the opposite effect than that which you desire.

White Females are married mostly to Black Men outside of their Race/ethnicity....all those laws and statutes failed miserably

The most common interracial marriage in the United States is an Asian American female married to a White American male, this is followed by a White American female married to a Black American male....... In contrast, 20.1% of white women married a black man,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interracial_marriage_in_the_United_States#:~:text=17.5% of married Asian American,to a Black American male.

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Which would you rather see them with... any kind of Blackman or a good man regardless of his ethnicity/race?

If those are the only 2 choices.....neither.

You are entitled to your opinion...

My Opinion is I would rather see them with a good man regardless of ethnicity

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Maybe I am wrong but I sometimes like seeing so called interracial couples

When it comes to Black people dating interracially.....

I'd rather see a Black man with a Black woman, however I will tolerate our men being the ones to dip outside than our women do it because they are more vulnerable and when women dip outside of the community it is more dangerous and harmful

Why so?

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Again, this may not sound fair....but it history proves that it works.

A community can remain strong while the men are screwing women outside of it, but when the WOMEN start doing so....it will collapse quickly.

No....it only proves that you want to preserve your freedoms and liberties

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

I think Justice in this case would mean allowing people the freedom to choose who they want.....

Being there to protect that freedom of choice is the best way to show you care

As the Bible says...
There are ways that SEEM right unto man, but the end results are DEATH.

Never knew you esteemed the bible...

What about...."What about do unto others as you would have them do unto you"

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

There are many things that may SEEM fair and just, but the results of them are death and disaster.
On the other hand, there are things that SEEM unfair and unjust....but the results are progress, prosperity, and stability.

I become suspicious when what you want for yourself you deny others.....especially free agency

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Men in charge and having control over who their women associate with outside of the community SEEMS sexist, barbaric, and unfair.....but it appears to work much better for other communities than the laissez-faire mentality of letting the women do and screw whoever she wants and not worrying about it, so many Black American men have.
This CLEARLY hasn't worked for our community.

What is destroying the black communities is no secret......Racism

To now internalize racism against our women...is to aid Racism by being Sexist

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

So now you are segregating black women into classes....classism

I didn't segregate them....they are ALREADY segregated into different classes, lol.
Infact, this can be said about the men too as well as the men and women of other communities.

That's human nature in general.

Yes....that is true

Racism already exist should we then be promoting it or denouncing it it?

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

The crack ho and or hood rat are black women who are usually most vulnerable...aren't these the individuals most in need of help guidance and protection.

I don't know if they need the "most" help, guidance, and protection....but most of them certainly need a lot.
Some of them need to be kept the hell away from our healthy community as well.

Their behaviour and situation has demonstrated that need for guidance and help...the form the help takes should be on an individual level.

45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

We should focus are resources on those in the community who are actually TRYING to improve themselves and their community, not those who've given up on life and humanity and just exist to manipulate people, harm others, and have fun for themselves.

We should focus on helping all....if we must triage then we do what we can for all to the limits of the best use of available resources.

ProfD · April 2, 2023

@frankster, as usual, you're killing it in this thread too. Bravo bro.

Pioneer1 · April 2, 2023

frankster

You put a lot on my plate....lol.
I gotta run down and grab some fish right quick, I'll get you back later on.

Pioneer1 · April 2, 2023

frankster

Jealousy and covetousness is rooted in fear

Perhaps.
And just like jealousy...fear is a natural emotion and a motivator when channeled correctly.
God gave human beings both the emotions of fear and jealousy for reasons.

So black women have no Agency over themselves?

Absolutely.
Infact, at this point...many if not most of them have no choice BUT to have Agency over themselves since they can't rely on having men who care enough about them to protect them.

Black women are in this scenario are.....Property?

Well, not in the sense of a car or chair.....lol...but they DO belong to our community the same way Black men and Black children do.

Being a Conqueror over others is cruelty breeds resentment....being a conqueror over self is true Power.

That SOUNDS good.

Try as they did by making Laws and statutes....white women still found their way into the hands and bed of Black men.

Or was it vice versa, White women ALLOWED and PULLED the Black men of their choice into THEIR beds?

Perhaps you have the power dynamic mixed up.

Next to the slave master himself....the slave masters WIFE is the one who primarily owns the bed and decides which Black man....if any..she wants to allow in it.

It was wrong and it failed.....worst of all its is oppressive

If it failed, why are White folks still the ones running the country?

Slavery didn't fail, it was just TRANSFORMED...to the modern Prison Industry.

I do not think that's the way to show care.....to me that appears more like control through intimidation.

Perhaps it's both.
You can care about someone, love someone, and be controling and protective at the same time.

You love your children, therefor you set a curfew for them to come in on time.
You love your children, therefor you control who they interact with and who their friends are so they don't get hurt.

Yes Asian women are married mostly to white Men outside of their Race/Ethnicity.

As a corollary to show that intimidation and out lawing harmless human behaviour does not work ....The Forbidden Fruit Effect

In other your ideas may have the opposite effect than that which you desire.

White Females are married mostly to Black Men outside of their Race/ethnicity....all those laws and statutes failed miserably

The most common interracial marriage in the United States is an Asian American female married to a White American male, this is followed by a White American female married to a Black American male....... In contrast, 20.1% of white women married a black man,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interracial_marriage_in_the_United_States#:~:text=17.5% of married Asian American,to a Black American male.

Lol... man, you posted a lot of information just to show you ultimately agree with me that the most prevalent form of interracial marriage is Asian women with White men.

You are entitled to your opinion...
My Opinion is I would rather see them with a good man regardless of ethnicity

Hmmm, interesting opinion.

So according to that logic....
During Chattel Slavery you would have rather see the Black women be married off to wealthy White men who treated them right, than stick with the Black men who were still slaves.
Am I correct?

Never knew you esteemed the bible...

What about...."What about do unto others as you would have them do unto you"

Came from the same source that said:

"A woman's desire would be for her husband and he would RULE over her"

and

"Wives obey your husbands"

Same source....lol...and we can go further if you like.

What is destroying the black communities is no secret......Racism

That's ONE of the factors destroying the Black community, but not the only one.

To now internalize racism against our women...is to aid Racism by being Sexist

Racism has ALREADY been internalize against our women, through not protecting or providing for them as we should.

Racism already exist should we then be promoting it or denouncing it it?

I believe Anti-Black racism should be denounced and challenged at every level.

Their behaviour and situation has demonstrated that need for guidance and help...the form the help takes should be on an individual level.

They indeed need guidance and help, and they should get it.
However as a community we need to focus most of our energy and attention on building our community up and helping the decent righteous among our people FIRST and if we have any energy left....we can use it to help those who chose to destroy their bodies and minds through foolish decision making like smoking dope and gang banging.

Last time I checked, both crack-smoking and gang banging were CHOICES people made. No one was forced into it for the most part.
If you want to spend most of your time and energy trying to reform them, go right ahead...I won't stop you. But that's NOT how I choose to use mine.

We should focus on helping all...

I disagree.

I WILL NOT waste my time, energy, or resources trying to "help" my racist open enemies, pedophiles, serial killers, and other detriments to our society.

And when you say "all"...you're INCLUDING the above mentioned whether you intended to or not.

frankster · April 4, 2023

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Jealousy and covetousness is rooted in fear

Perhaps.
And just like jealousy...fear is a natural emotion and a motivator when channeled correctly.
God gave human beings both the emotions of fear and jealousy for reasons.

Fear is a necessary emotion when in danger.....but a dangerous and destructive emotion when the danger is imaginary.

Jealousy is worst than fear, in that you want to deny others what you want for yourself.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

So black women have no Agency over themselves?

Absolutely.
Infact, at this point...many if not most of them have no choice BUT to have Agency over themselves since they can't rely on having men who care enough about them to protect them.

Denial of Choice in this sense is denial of Agency

In that case what makes you any different from an individual who would enslave another purely on the basis of Sex ?

Your use of the word "protection" is similar to the Enslavers use of the word to "civilize and or christianize" ..... a euphemism for them to Control and Use(abuse).

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Black women are in this scenario are.....Property?

Well, not in the sense of a car or chair.....lol...but they DO belong to our community the same way Black men and Black children do.

If women have no Agency over Themselves....they are Property

They are members or part of a community...Women are not Possessions of the Community

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Being a Conqueror over others is cruelty breeds resentment....being a conqueror over self is true Power.

That SOUNDS good.

It is also True

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Try as they did by making Laws and statutes....white women still found their way into the hands and bed of Black men.

Or was it vice versa, White women ALLOWED and PULLED the Black men of their choice into THEIR beds?

Perhaps you have the power dynamic mixed up.

Whichever way the point is ...Miscegenation Laws rules and statues failed

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Next to the slave master himself....the slave masters WIFE is the one who primarily owns the bed and decides which Black man....if any..she wants to allow in it.

The primary purpose of Miscegenation Laws was to keep (especially) Black men and white women from Marrying and cohabiting.....it failed.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

it was wrong and it failed.....worst of all its is oppressive

If it failed, why are White folks still the ones running the country?

Slavery didn't fail, it was just TRANSFORMED...to the modern Prison Industry.

You are conflating the issues....who runs the country is mainly a function of Economics and Politics.

We are talking about a Social Issue....Whether or not two individuals of different race/ethnicity have the Right to marry date or have sex .

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I do not think that's the way to show care.....to me that appears more like control through intimidation.

Perhaps it's both.
You can care about someone, love someone, and be controling and protective at the same time.

You love your children, therefor you set a curfew for them to come in on time.
You love your children, therefor you control who they interact with and who their friends are so they don't get hurt.

No....You Guide and advise you in no way Control or restrict people you love....their lives are their own.

Children are a different matter...as they are a part of a household some rights are ceded in exchange for their welfare (support).

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Yes Asian women are married mostly to white Men outside of their Race/Ethnicity.

As a corollary to show that intimidation and out lawing harmless human behaviour does not work ....The Forbidden Fruit Effect

In other your ideas may have the opposite effect than that which you desire.

White Females are married mostly to Black Men outside of their Race/ethnicity....all those laws and statutes failed miserably

The most common interracial marriage in the United States is an Asian American female married to a White American male, this is followed by a White American female married to a Black American male....... In contrast, 20.1% of white women married a black man,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interracial_marriage_in_the_United_States#:~:text=17.5% of married Asian American,to a Black American male.

Lol... man, you posted a lot of information just to show you ultimately agree with me that the most prevalent form of interracial marriage is Asian women with White men.

No I post that to show that all the laws against miscegenation between blacks and whites ....had the opposite effect.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

you are entitled to your opinion...
My Opinion is I would rather see them with a good man regardless of ethnicity

Hmmm, interesting opinion.

So according to that logic....
During Chattel Slavery you would have rather see the Black women be married off to wealthy White men who treated them right, than stick with the Black men who were still slaves.
Am I correct?

Yes...

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Never knew you esteemed the bible...

What about...."What about do unto others as you would have them do unto you"

Came from the same source that said:

"A woman's desire would be for her husband and he would RULE over her"

and

"Wives obey your husbands"

Same source....lol...and we can go further if you like.

Again you are confounding issues....Are you married to every black woman?

Marriage is a contract and the very word husband dictates the terms of which you speak...

It all comes back to the Golden Rule of...... do unto others as you would have then do unto you

Ephesians 5:28

So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

11 Corinthians 7:4

The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

What is destroying the black communities is no secret......Racism

That's ONE of the factors destroying the Black community, but not the only one.

That is the main one.....all else is maladaptation and dysfunction in response to Racism.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

To now internalize racism against our women...is to aid Racism by being Sexist

Racism has ALREADY been internalize against our women, through not protecting or providing for them as we should.

Yes by people who believe as you do....who believe it is ok to deny individuals their humanity according to their sex.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Racism already exist should we then be promoting it or denouncing it it?

I believe Anti-Black racism should be denounced and challenged at every level.

Good....Then realize that Sexism and Racism is the Same in its effects - Oppressive.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

their behaviour and situation has demonstrated that need for guidance and help...the form the help takes should be on an individual level.

They indeed need guidance and help, and they should get it.
However as a community we need to focus most of our energy and attention on building our community up and helping the decent righteous among our people FIRST and if we have any energy left....we can use it to help those who chose to destroy their bodies and minds through foolish decision making like smoking dope and gang banging.

Again I think we start by trying to help all, according to the availability of resources - triage.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Last time I checked, both crack-smoking and gang banging were CHOICES people made. No one was forced into it for the most part.
If you want to spend most of your time and energy trying to reform them, go right ahead...I won't stop you. But that's NOT how I choose to use mine.

Environment often acts as a Force and Pressure on many who see limited Options....

Readily available mind numbing drugs and or alcohol is one avenue of escape...as it is easily accessible.

Lack of proper coping skills or training lead many to do that which is easiest given tools available and or accessible.

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

We should focus on helping all...

I disagree.

I WILL NOT waste my time, energy, or resources trying to "help" my racist open enemies, pedophiles, serial killers, and other detriments to our society.

And when you say "all"...you're INCLUDING the above mentioned whether you intended to or not.

Yes those are most in need and pose the greatest threat to our community.....Malcolm X was once one of them

The Shepherd leaves the flock and goes in search of the lost sheep....The Prodigal son returns.

Pioneer1 · April 4, 2023

frankster

Fear is a necessary emotion when in danger....

And our community IS in danger, would you not agree?

The AfroAmerican community is being attacked physically, psychologically, economically, and academically.

Protecting our women and children should be among the top priorities.

Jealousy is worst than fear, in that you want to deny others what you want for yourself.

It's worse if it prevents you from thinking logically and straight forwardly.

Sometimes jealously is warranted.
For example, when others DON'T DESERVE to have what they do and YOU DO but are denied it.

Black males have been denied power in this nation for so long by White men, in my opinion they DESERVE to be jealous and resentful of their authority.

Are you telling me Black men don't have the right to even HURT and feel PAIN at the injustice they've received?

Denial of Choice in this sense is denial of Agency

In that case what makes you any different from an individual who would enslave another purely on the basis of Sex ?

And exactly WHO has denied Black women a choice in who they want to sleep with?

I've expressed my OPINION...and that's what it is...an OPINION.

I do have a right to express it.

Would you dare compare a man who merely expressed his opinion with men who took ACTION and even KILLED people to have their way?

Your use of the word "protection" is similar to the Enslavers use of the word to "civilize and or christianize" ..... a euphemism for them to Control and Use(abuse).

I suppose you could use the same analogy for parenting and accuse a good parent of being "controlling" and "abusive".
You probably could even liken them to the slave master for wanting the best for the child and keeping them out of danger.

Such is the thought pattern of a people who haven't really held power in their life and weren't responsibly for anyone besides themselves.

If women have no Agency over Themselves....they are Property

1. Who has denied or even promoted denying women "agency" over themselves?

2. Are children and the extremely disabled who are under the care and protection of others "property" as well?

And for the record, Black women should have the same and just as many rights as Black men. Equality and Justice for both.
However certain behaviors should be ENCOURAGED and others DISCOURAGED.

Whichever way the point is ...Miscegenation Laws rules and statues failed

Not sure about THAT point you just made, but the ORIGINAL point you made...about White women finding their way into the beds of Black men back during the times of the anti-Miscegenation laws...was wrong.
If any interracial CONSENTUAL sex was going on...it was White women in control and bringing Black men of their choice into THEIR beds.

The primary purpose of Miscegenation Laws was to keep (especially) Black men and white women from Marrying and cohabiting.....it failed.

No sir, it did not.
A FEW exceptions to the rule does not equate to failure.

You are conflating the issues....who runs the country is mainly a function of Economics and Politics.

LOL......And which race controls most of the economics and politics of this nation?

Asians?
Native Americans?

We are talking about a Social Issue....Whether or not two individuals of different race/ethnicity have the Right to marry date or have sex .

But we were also talking about race and sex in a HISTORICAL context as well.

Further, I mentioned nothing about "rights".

Again, I feel the Black woman should have the same rights as the Black man and should be free to date and marry or have sex with whomever she wants.

However I don't have to like it or approve of it and I should be able to express how I feel about it.

No....You Guide and advise you in no way Control or restrict people you love....their lives are their own.

Going by your logic, the United States and other national governments HATE their own citizens because they set up rules, limits, and boundaries that RESTRICT them from going into dangerous areas, consuming dangerous products, engaging in dangerous activities like riding motorcycles without helmets.

If the government "really" cared about people they should let them smoke all the crack they want, not lock up serial killers, and let everyone do as they will as a show of love?

Children are a different matter...as they are a part of a household some rights are ceded in exchange for their welfare (support).

But it's not a VOLUNARY exchange...the children generally have no say so in the matter.
Adults are in charge simply because they are the most qualified to be.

No I post that to show that all the laws against miscegenation between blacks and whites ....had the opposite effect.

But again, it did NOT.
For the MOST part...those laws kept Black men and White women apart even on a platonic level.

Don't point to a hand full of clandestine romances mentioned an a few memoires and slave stories and hang your hat on that as being evidence that every Black male slave had a White "side dish" he was banging in the big house.

Makes for good entertainment....far from reality.

Yes...

And the fact that you would rather see the Black slave woman with her White open enemy than with the Black slave man who is a victim just like her, explains a lot about how you arrive at your conclusions.

Again you are confounding issues....Are you married to every black woman?

No.

Marriage is a contract and the very word husband dictates the terms of which you speak...

First of all, what's your point?

Are you suggesting that Black women who are married should NOT have free agency and that the husbands should be in control?
Freedom of choices should only be allowed to single Black women?

It all comes back to the Golden Rule of...... do unto others as you would have then do unto you

That's not a "golden rule" because some people are SUICIDAL and are willing to kill themselves....which is why they have no problem killing others.

Plus, as a man...I screw women.
I wouldn't want anyone screwing me....lol.
So you shouldn't always treat people how YOU want to be treated, but you treat them like they SHOULD be treated.

These religions platitudes SOUND nice, but much of it isn't rooted in reality and won't solve many real-world problems.

Yes by people who believe as you do....who believe it is ok to deny individuals their humanity according to their sex.

Show me an example of where I've denied or even promoted denying people their very humanity because of their sex?

That's not even POSSIBLE, let alone something I'd seek to do.

Again I think we start by trying to help all, according to the availability of resources - triage.

No sense in beating a dead horse.
I've already told you that I DO NOT support helping "all" people.
I don't believe "all" people deserve help from me, some don't.
My enemies CERTAINLY don't deserve my help.

Environment often acts as a Force and Pressure on many who see limited Options....

Readily available mind numbing drugs and or alcohol is one avenue of escape...as it is easily accessible.

Ok....?
Does that now mean that most of those who choose to smoke Crack did NOT have a choice in doing so?

Trying to see where you're going with this...lol.

Sorry, but if you chose to smoke Crack YOU made that choice, not "pressure from society".

Lack of proper coping skills or training lead many to do that which is easiest given tools available and or accessible.

True.
Does that mean we should take the money and resources meant for housing, education, food, and raising our children....and divert it to helping Crack heads and give them better coping skills in life?

Or rather HOW MUCH of the money and resources should go to them?

Yes those are most in need and pose the greatest threat to our community.....Malcolm X was once one of them

Correct, Malcolm X was ONE of them....one in a MILLION.
There are MILLIONS of them who end up UN-REFORMED and dying in the miserable degraded condition they lived their lives in.

Again, using one or two exceptions DO NOT justify or make a point.

Do MOST Crack heads and other drug addicts turn into a Malcolm X?
No
Which is why he was such a notable exception.

I hope you aren't trying to make a case for us wasting time and energy that SHOULD be going to building and progressing our community on reforming and helping those who CHOSE to destroy their lives and could care less whether they live or die....or YOU live or die if you have some money in your pocket.

The Shepherd leaves the flock and goes in search of the lost sheep....The Prodigal son returns.

And in my opinion, that father was UNJUST.

I thought that the first time I heard it....lol.

The father was wrong for giving the son who DISOBEYED him a higher position and more honor after coming back than the son who was loyal and stick with him and obeyed him all this time.

The son should have been forgiven...yes...but not elevated higher than the son who remained steadfast and did the right thing through and through.

One more reason I'm not religious....lol.
It "warps" you sense of morality....in my opinion.

ProfD · April 5, 2023

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

The AfroAmerican community is being attacked physically, psychologically, economically, and academically.

Protecting our women and children should be among the top priorities.

As I mentioned in another thread, the AfroAmerican community seems to be content with the status quo.

The best we can do as Black men is to protect and provide for the women, children and elderly within our immediate community.

We have to build and connect with other strong Black men who are doing the same thing.

Exponential growth with like-minded folks is the best path to building a community that could be self-sufficient and on code.

frankster · April 6, 2023

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Fear is a necessary emotion when in danger....

And our community IS in danger, would you not agree?

The AfroAmerican community is being attacked physically, psychologically, economically, and academically.

Protecting our women and children should be among the top priorities.

Yes our community is in danger.....Men and women crossing the color line poses little danger.

Controls and Restrictions is not protection the need.

Proper Nutrition, Education, Exercise and Play, Defensive, and Employable Skills development is the best way to protect our women and children

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Jealousy is worst than fear, in that you want to deny others what you want for yourself.

It's worse if it prevents you from thinking logically and straight forwardly.

Sometimes jealously is warranted.
For example, when others DON'T DESERVE to have what they do and YOU DO but are denied it.

Black males have been denied power in this nation for so long by White men, in my opinion they DESERVE to be jealous and resentful of their authority.

Are you telling me Black men don't have the right to even HURT and feel PAIN at the injustice they've received?

No one deserves to be jealous and are resentful....those are emotion stemming from fear and inadequacies.

Continuously striving toward your desired future....Indignation

Hurt and Pain are real that cannot be denied....Jealousy and Resentment are Emotions to be Overcome.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Denial of Choice in this sense is denial of Agency

In that case what makes you any different from an individual who would enslave another purely on the basis of Sex ?

And exactly WHO has denied Black women a choice in who they want to sleep with?

I've expressed my OPINION...and that's what it is...an OPINION.

I do have a right to express it.

Would you dare compare a man who merely expressed his opinion with men who took ACTION and even KILLED people to have their way?

You did in a roundabout way:

I'm not going to physically stop a Black woman from being with whatever man she chooses.
However I have and I WILL make it crystal clear that I DO NOT like the best of our women even having CASUAL conversations with White men let alone getting into relationships with them and having sex and children with them.

I understand it is your opinion, but it is also an idea and ideas are often times more dangerous than we would want to accept.

Such ideas lack only Support Means and Opportunity.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Your use of the word "protection" is similar to the Enslavers use of the word to "civilize and or christianize" ..... a euphemism for them to Control and Use(abuse).

I suppose you could use the same analogy for parenting and accuse a good parent of being "controlling" and "abusive".
You probably could even liken them to the slave master for wanting the best for the child and keeping them out of danger.

Such is the thought pattern of a people who haven't really held power in their life and weren't responsibly for anyone besides themselves.

We are not talking about children are we....

Any way there is a difference between Instilling Discipline and Abuse.....as well as between Control and Setting Boundaries.

Control is manipulation and Abuse is about instilling fear and not about Educating or teaching.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

If women have no Agency over Themselves....they are Property

1. Who has denied or even promoted denying women "agency" over themselves?

Your Ideas and Arguments or way of Reasoning lends itself readily to an oppressive attitude toward women of color who choose to cross the Ethnic divide.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

2. Are children and the extremely disabled who are under the care and protection of others "property" as well?

Again it is really Care and Safety....but it sounds better when one says Care and Protect...as in protect and serve - we know how that goes down in our communities.

When under Protection some Freedoms are given up....while under Safety Freedoms are preserve and threats and dangers mitigated.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

And for the record, Black women should have the same and just as many rights as Black men. Equality and Justice for both.
However certain behaviors should be ENCOURAGED and others DISCOURAGED.

Your Reasonings does not bear that out:

I'd rather see a Black man with a Black woman, however I will tolerate our men being the ones to dip outside than our women do it because they are more vulnerable and when women dip outside of the community it is more dangerous and harmful

You are right when it comes to Behaviours...But Remember is Always best to Encourage Good Behaviour than to Discourage Bad Behaviour.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Whichever way the point is ...Miscegenation Laws rules and statues failed

Not sure about THAT point you just made, but the ORIGINAL point you made...about White women finding their way into the beds of Black men back during the times of the anti-Miscegenation laws...was wrong.
If any interracial CONSENTUAL sex was going on...it was White women in control and bringing Black men of their choice into THEIR beds.

I am looking at the failure of Miscegenation Laws of the past based on current trends in Marriage.

Meaning that if you denouncing interracial relationships it has failed in the past and will probable failed today

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

The primary purpose of Miscegenation Laws was to keep (especially) Black men and white women from Marrying and cohabiting.....it failed.

No sir, it did not.
A FEW exceptions to the rule does not equate to failure.

Again I am talking today....20% of Married White are Married to black men....that's not a few exception.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

You are conflating the issues....who runs the country is mainly a function of Economics and Politics.

LOL......And which race controls most of the economics and politics of this nation?

Asians?
Native Americans?

The issue we are discussing is Social......Not Political or Economical

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

We are talking about a Social Issue....Whether or not two individuals of different race/ethnicity have the Right to marry date or have sex .

But we were also talking about race and sex in a HISTORICAL context as well.

Further, I mentioned nothing about "rights".

Yes we are.....Black women crossing the color line...and your disappoint with that and the reaction of Black men to it.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Again, I feel the Black woman should have the same rights as the Black man and should be free to date and marry or have sex with whomever she wants.

However I don't have to like it or approve of it and I should be able to express how I feel about it.

You are entitled to your opinion....No one is stopping you from expressing yourself .

That freedom to express yourself is what i am trying to preserve by saying to you allow black women to date whom they please without your intimidation. and condemnation.

Once your opinion is express in this forum, then you invite critique.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

No....You Guide and advise you in no way Control or restrict people you love....their lives are their own.

Going by your logic, the United States and other national governments HATE their own citizens because they set up rules, limits, and boundaries that RESTRICT them from going into dangerous areas, consuming dangerous products, engaging in dangerous activities like riding motorcycles without helmets.

If the government "really" cared about people they should let them smoke all the crack they want, not lock up serial killers, and let everyone do as they will as a show of love?

Your Freedom ends when it impinges on anyone's Freedoms.....Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Children are a different matter...as they are a part of a household some rights are ceded in exchange for their welfare (support).

But it's not a VOLUNARY exchange...the children generally have no say so in the matter.
Adults are in charge simply because they are the most qualified to be.

A child has no concept of individuality until around 7-9....pure Impulse and Urges....Reasoning and Rational Thought is in most cases absent.

Without Rational thought Communication through Verbal Language is difficult....Kinetics(kinesics/bodily) communications is the only viable option.

Yes the Child's Lack of Volition denies them the ability to give Consent or Dissent....In exchange for their welfare all or most decision are made on their behalf.

These decision are neither voluntary or involuntary

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

No I post that to show that all the laws against miscegenation between blacks and whites ....had the opposite effect.

But again, it did NOT.
For the MOST part...those laws kept Black men and White women apart even on a platonic level.

Don't point to a hand full of clandestine romances mentioned an a few memoires and slave stories and hang your hat on that as being evidence that every Black male slave had a White "side dish" he was banging in the big house.

Makes for good entertainment....far from reality.

That's not the point I was addressing....

One would be surprise at the reality of how common it was for the both slave Master and the slave Mistress to find themselves with an African lover...Hence the Mandingo.

There is nothing more attractive to a rich white woman than a young hard working sweaty muscle bound oppressed black Man....Of course both white men and white women would exclude that from the history books and studies.....but its betrayed by the numbers of white women marrying black men today.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Yes...

And the fact that you would rather see the Black slave woman with her White open enemy than with the Black slave man who is a victim just like her, explains a lot about how you arrive at your conclusions.

The Truth is I would like to see her with whomever she chooses.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Again you are confounding issues....Are you married to every black woman?

No.

Marriage is a contract and the very word husband dictates the terms of which you speak...

First of all, what's your point?

Are you suggesting that Black women who are married should NOT have free agency and that the husbands should be in control?
Freedom of choices should only be allowed to single Black women?

When you are Married you are bound by the Marriage contract and vows taken....implicit and explicit.

The word Husband implies Caretaker and HousHolder....The Word wife implies HelpMate

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

It all comes back to the Golden Rule of...... do unto others as you would have then do unto you

That's not a "golden rule" because some people are SUICIDAL and are willing to kill themselves....which is why they have no problem killing others.

Maybe You are confusing the Golden Rule with the Royal Law.....Love thy Neighbor as thyself

It is the Golden Rule:

Do Unto Others - not do unto self.

As you would have them do unto you - how can the commit suicide of you???

If I want to kill myself that does not mean that I want someone else to kill me or i am now justified in killing anyone else.

On the other hand...If I was a murderer or soldier then I would find it justifiable for someone else to kill me.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Plus, as a man...I screw women.
I wouldn't want anyone screwing me....lol.
So you shouldn't always treat people how YOU want to be treated, but you treat them like they SHOULD be treated.

Sexual Intercouse is mutual.....be it man and woman, woman and woman or man and man.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

These religions platitudes SOUND nice, but much of it isn't rooted in reality and won't solve many real-world problems.

They have stood the test of Time Place and Culture...are there exceptions - certainly if look at in part but not in whole.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Yes by people who believe as you do....who believe it is ok to deny individuals their humanity according to their sex.

Show me an example of where I've denied or even promoted denying people their very humanity because of their sex?

That's not even POSSIBLE, let alone something I'd seek to do.

I quote:

Not trying to see them prance off arm-n-arm with some greasy haired White or "almost" White dude, talking about how "in love" they are with eachother.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Again I think we start by trying to help all, according to the availability of resources - triage.

No sense in beating a dead horse.
I've already told you that I DO NOT support helping "all" people.
I don't believe "all" people deserve help from me, some don't.
My enemies CERTAINLY don't deserve my help.

Then we agree to disagree.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Environment often acts as a Force and Pressure on many who see limited Options....

Readily available mind numbing drugs and or alcohol is one avenue of escape...as it is easily accessible.

Ok....?
Does that now mean that most of those who choose to smoke Crack did NOT have a choice in doing so?

Trying to see where you're going with this...lol.

Sorry, but if you chose to smoke Crack YOU made that choice, not "pressure from society".

Of course they had a Choice.

Every Choice is impacted by the Influences in your Environment

Usually the easiest Choice to take is One that has the least amount of Barriers to Fulfillment

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Lack of proper coping skills or training lead many to do that which is easiest given tools available and or accessible.

True.
Does that mean we should take the money and resources meant for housing, education, food, and raising our children....and divert it to helping Crack heads and give them better coping skills in life?

Or rather HOW MUCH of the money and resources should go to them?

Those decisions are to be made by bodies in the know....

I think it should be part of a Health Program.

How much money....Whatever is available or affordable.

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

yes those are most in need and pose the greatest threat to our community.....Malcolm X was once one of them

Correct, Malcolm X was ONE of them....one in a MILLION.
There are MILLIONS of them who end up UN-REFORMED and dying in the miserable degraded condition they lived their lives in.

Again, using one or two exceptions DO NOT justify or make a point.

Do MOST Crack heads and other drug addicts turn into a Malcolm X?
No
Which is why he was such a notable exception.

I hope you aren't trying to make a case for us wasting time and energy that SHOULD be going to building and progressing our community on reforming and helping those who CHOSE to destroy their lives and could care less whether they live or die....or YOU live or die if you have some money in your pocket.

Many have become fine upstanding contributing members of their communities...

It is how you treat the Poor Sick and Neglected among us that is the true measure of a community.

"A Nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members"

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

The Shepherd leaves the flock and goes in search of the lost sheep....The Prodigal son returns.

And in my opinion, that father was UNJUST.

I thought that the first time I heard it....lol.

You are entitled to your opinion

On 4/4/2023 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

The father was wrong for giving the son who DISOBEYED him a higher position and more honor after coming back than the son who was loyal and stick with him and obeyed him all this time.

The son should have been forgiven...yes...but not elevated higher than the son who remained steadfast and did the right thing through and through.

One more reason I'm not religious....lol.
It "warps" you sense of morality....in my opinion.

I do not recall Him getting a higher position or being elevated....Celebrated yes.

The Older and faithful son inherited all that the father has..

Pioneer1 · April 7, 2023

frankster

Controls and Restrictions is not protection the need.

Proper Nutrition, Education, Exercise and

?????

What is "proper" nutrition, education, and exercise if not a matter of CONTROLS and RESTRICTIONS?

Controlling and restricting one's diet = nutrition
Controlling and restricting one's information = education
Controlling and restricting one's physical exertion = exercise

No one deserves to be jealous and are resentful....those are emotion stemming from fear and inadequacies.

Your book says:

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments” (Exod. 20:4-6).

“For you shall worship no other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God” (Exod. 34:14).

Are you suggesting the Lord's jealousy stems from "fear" or "inadequacy" as you claim?

Hurt and Pain are real that cannot be denied....Jealousy and Resentment are Emotions to be Overcome.

If the Lord is perfect, then why would His jealousy need to be "overcome"?

I understand it is your opinion, but it is also an idea and ideas are often times more dangerous than we would want to accept.

The idea of keeping Black women with Black men is ONLY "dangerous" to those who wish to keep us separated.

Such ideas lack only Support Means and Opportunity.

Ideas with enough support become CONSENSUS.
The means and opportunity usually justified.

Your Ideas and Arguments or way of Reasoning lends itself readily to an oppressive attitude toward women of color who choose to cross the Ethnic divide.

I'd hardly call the desire to love, protect, and keep the Black woman next to my side is "oppressive".

The oppressive conditions exist when she has to put up with a community full of men who ignore her, forcing her to work and bear and raise children alone. That's the TRUE oppression a lot of our sisters are tired off. The type that often pushes them to seek love from outside the community.

You are right when it comes to Behaviours...But Remember is Always best to Encourage Good Behaviour than to Discourage Bad Behaviour

It depends on the behavior.
Encouraging a person to eat less meat should take a back seat from trying to talk them out of consuming rat poison after a bad break-up.

It's a judgement call.

BTW...what nation are you posting from?

I am looking at the failure of Miscegenation Laws of the past based on current trends in Marriage.

Well that's the problem right there.
You can't judge effectiveness of policies of the PAST, by CURRENT social trends!

That's like saying the Sodomy Laws of the past didn't work back in the 1800s...because there's plenty of gay marriage TODAY.

Or saying Slavery was ineffective and couldn't keep people in bondage....look how free we are TODAY.

You can't look at the situation as it CURRENTLY is to judge how effective or ineffective a social/legal rule was in the past.

For intents and purposes, Black men and White women were kept AWAY from eachother in the U.S.
Any type of secret rendezvous or affair going on was certainly an exception and not the rule.

It would be intellectually dishonest to make it anything else besides such.

Again I am talking today...

But we WEREN'T just talking today.
We were talking about the PAST as well as the present.

You're just FOCUSING on today in an attempt to carry your point.

The issue we are discussing is Social......Not Political or Economical

We're talking about race, sex, and marriage.
Those subjects INVOLVE politics and economics as well as societal.

Yes we are.....Black women crossing the color line...and your disappoint with that and the reaction of Black men to it.

How does my objecting to Black women hopping in bed with White men...and my disappointment in Black men who DON'T object to it as well...infringe upon ANYBODY'S rights...much less the Black womans?

Your Freedom ends when it impinges on anyone's Freedoms.....Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

For one thing, nobody is free.
We have various levels of liberty.

One would be surprise at the reality of how common it was for the both slave Master and the slave Mistress to find themselves with an African lover...Hence the Mandingo.

There is nothing more attractive to a rich white woman than a young hard working sweaty muscle bound oppressed black Man....Of course both white men and white women would exclude that from the history books and studies.....but its betrayed by the numbers of white women marrying black men today.

Lol...I think you've been reading too many steamy romance novels.
Too many Terry McMillan and Danielle Steel books.

The Truth is I would like to see her with whomever she chooses.

Which means building and maintaining a strong healthy Black community with a strong and healthy Black family as a basic building block is very LOW on your priority list.

Maybe You are confusing the Golden Rule with the Royal Law.....Love thy Neighbor as thyself

It is the Golden Rule:

Do Unto Others - not do unto self.

As you would have them do unto you - how can the commit suicide of you???

If I want to kill myself that does not mean that I want someone else to kill me or i am now justified in killing anyone else.

On the other hand...If I was a murderer or soldier then I would find it justifiable for someone else to kill me.

The so-called "golden rule" of the Bible is not only IMPRACTICAL for most human beings to truly practice but it's often down right DANGEROUS if taken literally.

According to that logic, no one should be locked up in prison...since no one would want that done to themselves.

So killers who don't care about rules or the law get to roam around town for free without fear of being locked up for their crimes.

They have stood the test of Time Place and Culture...are there exceptions - certainly if look at in part but not in whole.

Christianity stood the test of time simply because people could just CALL themselves a "Christian" despite not really believing.
Getting drunk, violent, raising hell all day and night and STILL can come in the church and pray and run around with a cross on their neck "calling" themselves a Christian or even a pastor.

It is how you treat the Poor Sick and Neglected among us that is the true measure of a community.

Another rather baseless platitude.

We're not talking about poor and sick people in general who absolutely should get our help, but SPECIFIC TYPES of poor and sick people....drug addicts.

How did they become poor?
By CHOOSING to engage in the behavior that lead to that.

How did they become sick?
By CHOOSING to engage in the behavior that lead to that.

Troy · April 8, 2023

On 4/1/2023 at 12:11 PM, Pioneer1 said:

They act like he poses no threat what so ever.

The reason is because he doesn't In 1823 yeah, but in 2023 not so much...

On 4/1/2023 at 12:11 PM, Pioneer1 said:

I have and I WILL make it crystal clear that I DO NOT like the best of our women even having CASUAL conversations with White men l

No need for me to add anything here @ProfD and @frankster said it all

@Pioneer1 when I review the data shared by Frankster and using your "logic," it would appear it is Black women who should be displaying more jealously.

Black men marry white women at twice the rate the Black women marry white men. In fact Black men marrying white women is the second highest rate of "interracial" marriage, only exceeded by white men and Asian women.

Pioneer1 · April 8, 2023

Troy

it would appear it is Black women who should be displaying more jealously.

Actually YES, they should!
And they DO.

I hear Black women speak out against interracial relationships FAR MORE than I hear Black men doing it.
Another example of role reversals in our community.

Troy · April 8, 2023

Well @Pioneer1 complaining about the situation has obviously not done anything to change things. Why do you think men bitching about it would have a different effect?

Still, the fundamental issue is why do you care so much about who other people choose to love or spend their lives with. Why do you believe they should conform to you standard?

Pioneer1 · April 9, 2023

Troy

Well @Pioneer1 complaining about the situation has obviously not done anything to change things. Why do you think men bitching about it would have a different effect?

Lol, well hell....you can ask that question about ANY subject people are discussing.

Poverty has been in the world for thousands of years, what the purpose of bitching and complaining about it if it obviously hasn't gone anywhere?
War.....disease....famine.......why waste time complaining about or even discussing ANY of these issues?
Throw relationships in the mix as well.
Women are women.....men are men....why are there entire websites and television shows focused on sex and male/female relationships alone????

Still, the fundamental issue is why do you care so much about who other people choose to love or spend their lives with. Why do you believe they should conform to you standard?

For the same reason White and Latino and Black men WITH GOOD SENSE care......because we're intelligent enough to know that if we don't carefully watch who is snuggling up to and breaking to the ear of the women of our community.....pretty soon we won't HAVE a community.

Just like a man who is a good father and good husband wants to know about every grown man who comes into his house, especially when he's not home.
Who his wife and daughters are talking to and why.

It really boils down to not just common sense....but GOOD SENSE period.
The fact is, a lot of our people (both male and female) simply don't have good sense.

"Hell naw....I ain't even WURRRED about who the bitches in my 'hood
fuckin'. Na'm sayin'.....cuz I gets so much pussy myself, I'm busy tryna
do ME!
If dem White boys want some Black coochie, sheeyit....I'll even
sell 'em some.....ha ha haaa.....na'm sayin'.
Ain't NO shame in my game!"

The same mentality that allows them NOT to care who the women in their community are associating and sleeping with is the SAME mentality that allows them not to care when people from other countries are brought to their community to take jobs, buy up property, and siphon wealth out of their community while they sit around smoking dope and getting high wondering why they can't find a job when they want one.

They simply aren't intelligent enough to know and understand how certain behaviors effect their community and ultimately them.
Which is why White folks, Arab, and other groups constantly take advantage of and exploit them.

Most AfroAmerican men simply DON'T CARE.....until it's too late.
They only men they are watching are EACHOTHER.

@frankster

Sorry my man......
But as THIS point, I can't even say racism is the biggest problem our community faces.
I would have to say STUPIDITY is.

Most other men CARE and want to CONTROL everything of value and worth in their communities, it's almost common sense to them.

Troy · April 10, 2023

On 4/9/2023 at 8:02 AM, Pioneer1 said:

Poverty has been in the world for thousands of years, what the purpose of bitching and complaining about it if it obviously hasn't gone anywhere?
War.....disease....famine.......why waste time complaining about or even discussing ANY of these issues?

Actually all of these ills have been greatly reduced especially in America. Compare America of 1823 or even 1923 with 2023. The same improvement is true for the rest of the world.

Interracial marriage was once described as the mongrel mixing of the races. It was a against the law in many states. A Black man could be lynched for looking sideways at a white woman. Did white men stop "protecting" their women, or they just grow up.

Today black and white people top the list of interracial marriages. This freedom makes the world a better place.

Pioneer1 · April 11, 2023

Troy

When you factor in mass incarceration, the very high homicide and very high suicide rate in the United States compared to 1923 and especially 1823.....you have to wonder HOW MUCH progress has really been made in terms of poverty, famine, and disease.

They claim the poverty rate was higher 100 and 200 years ago, huh?
Well how about the HOMELESS rate?
How many HOMELESS people are around today....even when the increase in population is factored in....as compared to 100 and 200 years ago?
Infact, how many homeless people even EXISTED in America in 1823???

Certainly less people are DYING of diseases today than in 1823....but how many people are GETTING diseases today compared to that time?
A far higher percentage of people have gotten cancer in the 1990s than in 1823.
A far higher percentage of people have gotten AIDS and other stds than in 1823.
Far more people are depressed, bi-polar, and schizophrenic than in 1823.

So really.....has THAT much progress been made?

Troy · April 12, 2023

Yes. Despite all the misleading statements you made. We can make it simple and just boil it down to life expectancy. The life expectancy of a Black person in America had almost doubled in the last 100 years.

Of course, the quality of life, the amount of leisure time, and the variety of diversions we have access to has increased dramatically as well. It is like we have been blessed with an additional higher quality life compared to Black people from just 100 years ago.

That is not to say that this trajectory will continue with climate change. On the heels of Covid, Opioids, and mass shootings a year or two has been knocked off the life expectancy of Americans, but we are still FAR better off today than 100 years ago.

ProfD · April 13, 2023

22 hours ago, Troy said:

The life expectancy of a Black person in America had almost doubled in the last 100 years.

You're right. But, it all applies to all human beings in the most developed countries.

As you mentioned, a better quality of life has given us an extension that are harder working ancestors did not benefit.

The craziest part is that while many folks are living longer they aren't necessarily more productive.

I'd like to see the universe snatch the most useless people sooner than later.

Troy · April 14, 2023

On 4/13/2023 at 9:57 AM, ProfD said:

I'd like to see the universe snatch the most useless people sooner than later.

Oh you won't need to worry the universe will snatch this himan racve up soon enough. We see the damage we are doing to the planet, but none of us, including myself are doing a damn thing about it.

Maybe in a 1,000 millennia after the human race has been wiped rendering the planet inhospitable to homo sapiens and new life form will do a better job. They will dig up our remains and ponder why we were so self destructive.

frankster · April 15, 2023

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Controls and Restrictions is not protection the need.

Proper Nutrition, Education, Exercise and

?????

What is "proper" nutrition, education, and exercise if not a matter of CONTROLS and RESTRICTIONS?

Controlling and restricting one's diet = nutrition
Controlling and restricting one's information = education
Controlling and restricting one's physical exertion = exercise

Control and Restrict "one's (own) deit".....Not anothers

Having access to Education and Exercise etc...is the basis of liberty

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

No one deserves to be jealous and are resentful....those are emotion stemming from fear and inadequacies.

Your book says:

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments” (Exod. 20:4-6).

“For you shall worship no other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God” (Exod. 34:14).

Are you suggesting the Lord's jealousy stems from "fear" or "inadequacy" as you claim?

The Israelites are in a Contractual relationship with God....It is a warning that if broken there will be dire consequences

The word Translated as Jealous here could and has been interpreted as Zealous in other scriptures....The KJV Translators prefered to use Jealous.

It is the First Commandment...No other God - Monotheism Moses said it that way and Jesus said this way

Matt 22:37-38

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

This is the first and great commandment.

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Hurt and Pain are real that cannot be denied....Jealousy and Resentment are Emotions to be Overcome.

If the Lord is perfect, then why would His jealousy need to be "overcome"?

It is a threat or warning of intent should One break the agreement.....of No other God

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

I understand it is your opinion, but it is also an idea and ideas are often times more dangerous than we would want to accept.

The idea of keeping Black women with Black men is ONLY "dangerous" to those who wish to keep us separated.

No

The idea of controlling and Restricting people against their Will....that is dangerous

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Such ideas lack only Support Means and Opportunity.

Ideas with enough support become CONSENSUS.
The means and opportunity usually justified.

Consensus is Good.

Controlling and restricting people who pose no danger is.

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Your Ideas and Arguments or way of Reasoning lends itself readily to an oppressive attitude toward women of color who choose to cross the Ethnic divide.

I'd hardly call the desire to love, protect, and keep the Black woman next to my side is "oppressive".

The oppressive conditions exist when she has to put up with a community full of men who ignore her, forcing her to work and bear and raise children alone. That's the TRUE oppression a lot of our sisters are tired off. The type that often pushes them to seek love from outside the community.

If it is against her will....then it is oppressive.

Those Oppressive Social conditions are often a result of Racism

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

You are right when it comes to Behaviours...But Remember is Always best to Encourage Good Behaviour than to Discourage Bad Behaviour

It depends on the behavior.
Encouraging a person to eat less meat should take a back seat from trying to talk them out of consuming rat poison after a bad break-up.

It's a judgement call.

If some desires to kill themselves and there is no sign of mental illness.....Euthanasia(assisted suicide) is not unheard of.

It is not you place to force or control them.

Yes....it is a judgement call

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

BTW...what nation are you posting from?

NYC

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

I am looking at the failure of Miscegenation Laws of the past based on current trends in Marriage.

Well that's the problem right there.
You can't judge effectiveness of policies of the PAST, by CURRENT social trends!

Those Laws were passed to keep people apart......It Failed and they have been struck down - no longer the Law of the Land.

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

That's like saying the Sodomy Laws of the past didn't work back in the 1800s...because there's plenty of gay marriage TODAY.

True...they did not work.

Laws are there to benefit Society as a whole.

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Or saying Slavery was ineffective and couldn't keep people in bondage....look how free we are TODAY.

Exactly.

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

You can't look at the situation as it CURRENTLY is to judge how effective or ineffective a social/legal rule was in the past.

I have and I can.

They Past is the best predictor of the Future and we learn most from our past failures

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

For intents and purposes, Black men and White women were kept AWAY from eachother in the U.S.
Any type of secret rendezvous or affair going on was certainly an exception and not the rule.

It would be intellectually dishonest to make it anything else besides such.

Why do you think we have terms like Mulatto, Octoroons and Quadroons.....it is also believe by some historians that as many five of our Presidents before Obama had African Blood...It was not an exception - hence the miscegenation laws

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Again I am talking today...

But we WEREN'T just talking today.
We were talking about the PAST as well as the present.

You're just FOCUSING on today in an attempt to carry your point.

Ok...I am saying laws were made to prevent socalled race mixing in the past and it failed then....we had plenty of mixed race people.

The way white women are marrying black men today is a real life demonstration of why it failed.

We learn from the past....that's why history is taught.

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

The issue we are discussing is Social......Not Political or Economical

We're talking about race, sex, and marriage.
Those subjects INVOLVE politics and economics as well as societal.

Do not use the obvious overlap to confound..

Race, Sex, and Marriage are Primarily Social Issues....It only becomes Political when we try to Legislate around the issues

As such nearly all social and economic issues can be politicize

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Yes we are.....Black women crossing the color line...and your disappoint with that and the reaction of Black men to it.

How does my objecting to Black women hopping in bed with White men...and my disappointment in Black men who DON'T object to it as well...infringe upon ANYBODY'S rights...much less the Black womans?

Please you said a lot more than that....

I quote:

I'm not going to physically stop a Black woman from being with whatever man she chooses.
However I have and I WILL make it crystal clear that I DO NOT like the best of our women even having CASUAL conversations with White men let alone getting into relationships with them and having sex and children with them.

That's Intimidation

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Your Freedom ends when it impinges on anyone's Freedoms.....Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

For one thing, nobody is free.
We have various levels of liberty.

I concur

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

One would be surprise at the reality of how common it was for the both slave Master and the slave Mistress to find themselves with an African lover...Hence the Mandingo.

There is nothing more attractive to a rich white woman than a young hard working sweaty muscle bound oppressed black Man....Of course both white men and white women would exclude that from the history books and studies.....but its betrayed by the numbers of white women marrying black men today.

Lol...I think you've been reading too many steamy romance novels.
Too many Terry McMillan and Danielle Steel books.

No....Just one Movie - Mandingo starring Ken Norton

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

The Truth is I would like to see her with whomever she chooses.

Which means building and maintaining a strong healthy Black community with a strong and healthy Black family as a basic building block is very LOW on your priority list.

How is it going to be healthy and strong if you are recommending it being controlling and restrictive.

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Maybe You are confusing the Golden Rule with the Royal Law.....Love thy Neighbor as thyself

It is the Golden Rule:

Do Unto Others - not do unto self.

As you would have them do unto you - how can the commit suicide of you???

If I want to kill myself that does not mean that I want someone else to kill me or i am now justified in killing anyone else.

On the other hand...If I was a murderer or soldier then I would find it justifiable for someone else to kill me.

The so-called "golden rule" of the Bible is not only IMPRACTICAL for most human beings to truly practice but it's often down right DANGEROUS if taken literally.

It is the Law of God and it is the Nature of the Universe

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

According to that logic, no one should be locked up in prison...since no one would want that done to themselves.

Prisons does not address the causes of crime....It Punishes Criminals.

Unjust Laws Creates Criminals

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

So killers who don't care about rules or the law get to roam around town for free without fear of being locked up for their crimes.

By far most human beings are not Murderers....Murderers need Care

Why would a human being want to kill?

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

They have stood the test of Time Place and Culture...are there exceptions - certainly if look at in part but not in whole.

Christianity stood the test of time simply because people could just CALL themselves a "Christian" despite not really believing.
Getting drunk, violent, raising hell all day and night and STILL can come in the church and pray and run around with a cross on their neck "calling" themselves a Christian or even a pastor.

Calling oneself a Christian or Going to Church may not make you a Christian....Obeying God's Commandment is a First step - to being a child Of God or part of His Flock

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

It is how you treat the Poor Sick and Neglected among us that is the true measure of a community.

Another rather baseless platitude.

We're not talking about poor and sick people in general who absolutely should get our help, but SPECIFIC TYPES of poor and sick people....drug addicts.

Drug Addicts are not sick?

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

How did they become poor?
By CHOOSING to engage in the behavior that lead to that.

Lack of coping skills or dysfunctional reasoning and or Maladaptive behaviour.

On 4/6/2023 at 9:32 PM, Pioneer1 said:

How did they become sick?
By CHOOSING to engage in the behavior that lead to that.

Yes.....

We have all fell short and it is human to err.....Forgiveness is for all

Pioneer 1 said:

Sorry my man......
But as THIS point, I can't even say racism is the biggest problem our community faces.
I would have to say STUPIDITY is

Most other men CARE and want to CONTROL everything of value and worth in their communities, it's almost common sense to them.

I care and value all women in my community....I do not treat my women according to the values of other men.

Black Women are not 'things' to be control

Delano · April 15, 2023

1 hour ago, frankster said:

I care and value all women in my community....I do not treat my women according to the values of other men.

Black Women are not 'things' to be control

I am not into acquisition except for knowledge.

Pioneer1 · April 15, 2023

Troy

Maybe in a 1,000 millennia after the human race has been wiped rendering the planet inhospitable to homo sapiens and new life form will do a better job. They will dig up our remains and ponder why we were so self destructive.

Lol....that sounds like something out of a Utopian Science Fiction novel.

Some futuristic world where they sell little cages with human dolls in them to children.

frankster

Control and Restrict "one's (own) deit".....Not anothers

Ok.
But they still need to control and restrict to protect oneself from the ill effects of letting their bodies deteriorate.
You said they were not needed.

Having access to Education and Exercise etc...is the basis of liberty

And you might want to throw in a powerful military to protect your liberties and sovereignty also.

The Israelites are in a Contractual relationship with God....

Are you sure about this?
If it's part of the Bible why haven't I read it?

It is a warning that if broken there will be dire consequences

The word Translated as Jealous here could and has been interpreted as Zealous in other scriptures....The KJV Translators prefered to use Jealous.

Well if that's true, then you might as well question the ENTIRE Bible.
Once you start opening up the can of worms of claiming THIS word was misplaced and it really should have been translated as THAT word, what you're saying is any part of the Bible that you don't like or doesn't make sense can just be replaced at will.

The facts as we see them, is that The Lord clearly stated that He was a Jealous god. An emotion you said was faulty.

It is the First Commandment...No other God - Monotheism Moses said it that way and Jesus said this way

Matt 22:37-38

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

This is the first and great commandment.

- Monotheism Moses said it that way and Jesus said this way

Matt 22:37-38

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

This is the first and great commandment.

Sounds to me that the Jesus of the Bible ADDED to Moses' Commandments.

Was something wrong with the original 10?.....or how they were presented...?

I would think God makes everything...including those Commandments...perfect.
Don't need Jesus adding to what Moses claimed he got from God.
It should suffice as it stands.

No

The idea of controlling and Restricting people against their Will....that is dangerous

So would I be correct in presuming that you don't support jails, prisons, or the military?

If it is against her will....then it is oppressive.

Again, what about prisons and jails who force people to live a certain way against their will?
Do you think those institutions are oppressive and need to be removed?

If some desires to kill themselves and there is no sign of mental illness.....Euthanasia(assisted suicide) is not unheard of.

It is not you place to force or control them.

I agree, if there is no sign of mental illness, it's not my place to force or control them.
However a lot of our people are showing CLEAR signs of mental illness and pyschological damage from centuries of living under an arch deceiver and barbarian. So force and discipline is needed to balance out the IMBALANCES they inherited.

NYC

Well I ask because most people from New York...or America itelf----don't spell "behavior" as "behavioUr" with a "U".
People from England and Australia do....we don't.

Those Laws were passed to keep people apart......It Failed and they have been struck down - no longer the Law of the Land.

Just because not everyone adhered to them, doesn't mean they failed.

Not everyone obeys the speed sign on the road either....but enough people DO obey it for things to remain relatively stable.

They Past is the best predictor of the Future and we learn most from our past failures

Take a look at my signature at the bottom of each post.

Why do you think we have terms like Mulatto, Octoroons and Quadroons.....

Because White MEN were running around ignoring the racial separation laws and doing whatever the hell they want to do.

As I said before, those laws weren't designed to prevent "miscegenation" or race-mixing in general, they were designed in SPECIFIC....to keep Black men away from White woman while the White MEN had fun with whoever they wanted.

That's Intimidation

It may be intimidating....but not intimidation.

I'm speaking my mind, letting my values be clearly known, and not using any type of weapon while doing so. Most people in thier CORRECT frame of mind wouldn't find that intimidating at all.

However if you're the type of woman who bashes Black men and sees them as worthless or a threat...I can see how ANY Black man's very presence or his words can seem intimidating.

No....Just one Movie - Mandingo starring Ken Norton

Yea, I remember that movie.
Had quite a few naked Black women in it if I remember correctly....lol.

How is it going to be healthy and strong if you are recommending it being controlling and restrictive.

Because much like a body builder or world class athlete, that's how it IMPROVES it's health and GAINS it's strength...through plenty of restrictions and discipline.

It is the Law of God and it is the Nature of the Universe

Sorry, but I would have to respectfully disagree with both assertions.

I've been out in nature before and I don't recall the hawk NOT snatching up and eating the rabbit simply because the hawk wouldn't want that done to him.
Much of nature doesn't care.

Lions chase down and kill gazelles all day long and probably don't think once about whether the gazelle would do that too him.

Prisons does not address the causes of crime....It Punishes Criminals.

True.
However it often removes extremely dangerous people off the street who shouldn't be on them.

Unjust Laws Creates Criminals

I agree that they do, however they aren't the ONLY thing that makes criminals.
Sometimes people are just born rebellious and criminal minded.

By far most human beings are not Murderers....Murderers need Care
Why would a human being want to kill?

Not sure, but they need a place to be held until and kept away from the community so that they are protected from murderers UNTIL they get the help they need in life.

Drug Addicts are not sick?

Sure they are, and most of them made themselves sick and didn't care as long as they got the dope they wanted.

My question is how much of my limited resource should go to their near useless treatment.

Yes.....

We have all fell short and it is human to err.....Forgiveness is for all

We can forgive....just don't be a sucka.

Don't let people treat you like a human ATM.

I care and value all women in my community..

Well all women don't care about and value YOU.
There are a lot of racist selfish White women who would rather see you 6 feet under or homeless than to treat you with respect, love, and kindness.

..I do not treat my women according to the values of other men.

Oh they're YOUR women now....lol.

So much for not wanting to be possessive or controlling, now you're taking ownership of them with the excuse that you'll treat them more fairly than the next man....lol.

frankster · April 16, 2023

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Troy

Maybe in a 1,000 millennia after the human race has been wiped rendering the planet inhospitable to homo sapiens and new life form will do a better job. They will dig up our remains and ponder why we were so self destructive.

Lol....that sounds like something out of a Utopian Science Fiction novel.

Some futuristic world where they sell little cages with human dolls in them to children.

frankster

Control and Restrict "one's (own) deit".....Not anothers

Ok.
But they still need to control and restrict to protect oneself from the ill effects of letting their bodies deteriorate.
You said they were not needed.

What "they" need is accessibility to necessities of Life

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Having access to Education and Exercise etc...is the basis of liberty

And you might want to throw in a powerful military to protect your liberties and sovereignty also.

I put my trust in more and better Education and Necessary Coping Skills

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

The Israelites are in a Contractual relationship with God....

Are you sure about this?
If it's part of the Bible why haven't I read it?

Here is the Marriage Contract - Vows

Genesis 17:10 - 14.

9God also said to Abraham, “You must keep My covenant—you and your descendants in the generations after you. 10This is My covenant with you and your descendants after you, which you are to keep: Every male among you must be circumcised. 11You are to circumcise the flesh of your foreskin, and this will be a sign of the covenant between Me and you.…

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

It is a warning that if broken there will be dire consequences

The word Translated as Jealous here could and has been interpreted as Zealous in other scriptures....The KJV Translators prefered to use Jealous.

Well if that's true, then you might as well question the ENTIRE Bible.

You should...

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Once you start opening up the can of worms of claiming THIS word was misplaced and it really should have been translated as THAT word, what you're saying is any part of the Bible that you don't like or doesn't make sense can just be replaced at will.

Where did I say " misplaced...really should have been"????......

I clearly said it "could and has"

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

The facts as we see them, is that The Lord clearly stated that He was a Jealous god. An emotion you said was faulty.

In the KJv the word Jealous used

Literal Standard Version

Exodus 34:14
for you do not bow yourselves to another god—for YHWH, whose Name [is] Zealous, is a zealous God.

https://biblehub.com/exodus/34-14.htm

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

it is the First Commandment...No other God - Monotheism Moses said it that way and Jesus said this way

Matt 22:37-38

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

This is the first and great commandment.

- Monotheism Moses said it that way and Jesus said this way

Matt 22:37-38

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

This is the first and great commandment.

Sounds to me that the Jesus of the Bible ADDED to Moses' Commandments.

Was something wrong with the original 10?.....or how they were presented...?

I would think God makes everything...including those Commandments...perfect.
Don't need Jesus adding to what Moses claimed he got from God.
It should suffice as it stands.

Moses appeals to the Emotion of Fear

Jesus appeals to the Emotion of Love

Same Goal different routes....focus on God

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

No

The idea of controlling and Restricting people against their Will....that is dangerous

So would I be correct in presuming that you don't support jails, prisons, or the military?

Jails and prison are being misused

Military overused

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

if it is against her will....then it is oppressive.

Again, what about prisons and jails who force people to live a certain way against their will?
Do you think those institutions are oppressive and need to be removed?

There is no doubt they are Oppressive

Remove no .....Repurpose yes - Restorative Justice.

Right now it's a money making scheme....Retributive Penal Colonies - PIC

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

If some desires to kill themselves and there is no sign of mental illness.....Euthanasia(assisted suicide) is not unheard of.

It is not you place to force or control them.

I agree, if there is no sign of mental illness, it's not my place to force or control them.
However a lot of our people are showing CLEAR signs of mental illness and pyschological damage from centuries of living under an arch deceiver and barbarian. So force and discipline is needed to balance out the IMBALANCES they inherited.

Discipline Yes

Force and or Control ......best avoided at most cost

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

NYC

Well I ask because most people from New York...or America itelf----don't spell "behavior" as "behavioUr" with a "U".
People from England and Australia do....we don't.

Lol You caught that, when I was typing it I did mused to myself will that spelling be notice....but i did not know it prompted the what nation query......Yaadman.

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Those Laws were passed to keep people apart......It Failed and they have been struck down - no longer the Law of the Land.

Just because not everyone adhered to them, doesn't mean they failed.

Not everyone obeys the speed sign on the road either....but enough people DO obey it for things to remain relatively stable.

You cannot legislate against Human Nature....Nature is the Neteru

Do Unto others as you would that they should do to you.....Then you do not need signs.

Mad crossroad No rulles in traffic India live streaming

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

They Past is the best predictor of the Future and we learn most from our past failures

Take a look at my signature at the bottom of each post.

Then we concur

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Why do you think we have terms like Mulatto, Octoroons and Quadroons.....

Because White MEN were running around ignoring the racial separation laws and doing whatever the hell they want to do.

As I said before, those laws weren't designed to prevent "miscegenation" or race-mixing in general, they were designed in SPECIFIC....to keep Black men away from White woman while the White MEN had fun with whoever they wanted.

Yes...that is true..

That means it failed on both counts....both white men and women visited the enslaved quarters.

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

That's Intimidation

It may be intimidating....but not intimidation.

I'm speaking my mind, letting my values be clearly known, and not using any type of weapon while doing so. Most people in thier CORRECT frame of mind wouldn't find that intimidating at all.

However if you're the type of woman who bashes Black men and sees them as worthless or a threat...I can see how ANY Black man's very presence or his words can seem intimidating.

You are entitled to speak your mind

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

No....Just one Movie - Mandingo starring Ken Norton

Yea, I remember that movie.
Had quite a few naked Black women in it if I remember correctly....lol.

Good Movie

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

How is it going to be healthy and strong if you are recommending it being controlling and restrictive.

Because much like a body builder or world class athlete, that's how it IMPROVES it's health and GAINS it's strength...through plenty of restrictions and discipline.

Proper Nutrition is all about Discipline

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

It is the Law of God and it is the Nature of the Universe

Sorry, but I would have to respectfully disagree with both assertions.

I've been out in nature before and I don't recall the hawk NOT snatching up and eating the rabbit simply because the hawk wouldn't want that done to him.
Much of nature doesn't care.

You haven't seen it so it does not exist.

Lion saves a baby calf from another lion attack

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Lions chase down and kill gazelles all day long and probably don't think once about whether the gazelle would do that too him.

A Lioness Adopts a baby antelope. A short documentary that will open your eyes.

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Prisons does not address the causes of crime....It Punishes Criminals.

True.
However it often removes extremely dangerous people off the street who shouldn't be on them.

True but what is the opportunity cost..

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Unjust Laws Creates Criminals

I agree that they do, however they aren't the ONLY thing that makes criminals.
Sometimes people are just born rebellious and criminal minded.

Natures plays a role....but in most cases I suspect it is Nurture that corrupts.....In other words Rehabilitation is possible

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

By far most human beings are not Murderers....Murderers need Care
Why would a human being want to kill?

Not sure, but they need a place to be held until and kept away from the community so that they are protected from murderers UNTIL they get the help they need in life.

Finding the Cause/s may lead to the Eradication of Murder....or at least drastically reduction - Restorative Justice

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Drug Addicts are not sick?

Sure they are, and most of them made themselves sick and didn't care as long as they got the dope they wanted.

My question is how much of my limited resource should go to their near useless treatment.

That is a Judgement Call for those in the know of the relevant deciding factors.

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Yes.....

We have all fell short and it is human to err.....Forgiveness is for all

We can forgive....just don't be a sucka.

Don't let people treat you like a human ATM.

You get to decide...how best to be forgiving.

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

I care and value all women in my community..

Well all women don't care about and value YOU.
There are a lot of racist selfish White women who would rather see you 6 feet under or homeless than to treat you with respect, love, and kindness.

Sadly.

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

...I do not treat my women according to the values of other men.

Oh they're YOUR women now....lol.

So much for not wanting to be possessive or controlling, now you're taking ownership of them with the excuse that you'll treat them more fairly than the next man....lol.

Mainly my beloved Daughters

Delano · April 16, 2023

11 hours ago, frankster said:

Mad crossroad No rulles in traffic India live streaming

I was in India for about four months outside of the cities I don't recall seeing that many traffic lights. I get in into one of the Tuk Tuk. The driver went the wrong way through traffic and then cross the divider. I also saw a bull trying to mount a cow noone was concerned.

frankster · April 16, 2023

2 hours ago, Delano said:

I was in India for about four months outside of the cities I don't recall seeing that many traffic lights. I get in into one of the Tuk Tuk. The driver went the wrong way through traffic and then cross the divider. I also saw a bull trying to mount a cow noone was concerned.

Yeah i first learned of this phenomenon from my nephew, who went on a business trip to Vietnam and India...

He explained it this way to me based on his assumptions ...right or wrong I do not know.

It comes down to attitude

In the US traffic lights and signs give drivers the permission to be "dead right" and other drivers to be "dead wrong" I have the "Right of Way" mentality...your vehicle becomes a shield and or a weapon.

In India and Vietnam the Vehicle is a part of you and like walking you do not want to bounce into any one as a result you pay more attention... Altruistic Sharing of the space - hypervigilance.

Delano · April 17, 2023

15 hours ago, frankster said:

He explained it this way to me based on his assumptions ...right or wrong I do not know.

A friend when to Japan and saw something similar. It like there is common culture or perspective.

frankster · April 17, 2023

23 hours ago, Delano said:

I also saw a bull trying to mount a cow noone was concerned.

If you are a cow you want to be born in India, this world is full of what to us western minds is strange cultures

Troy · April 17, 2023

22 hours ago, frankster said:

In India and Vietnam the Vehicle is a part of you and like walking you do not want to bounce into any one as a result you pay more attention... Altruistic Sharing of the space - hypervigilance.

Deep.

Also, the speeds are much lower. No one is doing 70 (on a 55) down the roads the way they do here -- traffic lights make these speeds possible.

Look at old videos of NYC is was worse with horses and cars and people...

Delano · April 17, 2023

5 hours ago, frankster said:

If you are a cow you want to be born in India,

I saw a cow enter a temple no one was concerned. However once in aa Tuk Tuk my driver whacked this cow with a stick. I asked, "I thought cow were sacred?" His reply, "Not all cows." So there is a caste system even for cows.

Pioneer1 · April 19, 2023

frankster

What "they" need is accessibility to necessities of Life

Some would say they already have them and CHOOSE a less healthy diet.
Most supermarkets sell fresh fruits and vegetables....not just pop, candy, and chips.
All supermarkets sell bottled water....not just pop and liquor.

At some point, a person's CHOICES come into play.

Here is the Marriage Contract - Vows

Genesis 17:10 - 14.

9God also said to Abraham, “You must keep My covenant—you and your descendants in the generations after you. 10This is My covenant with you and your descendants after you, which you are to keep: Every male among you must be circumcised. 11You are to circumcise the flesh of your foreskin, and this will be a sign of the covenant between Me and you.…

I don't see the word "marriage" anywhere in this scripture.

Covenant...yes.

I'd even give you "contract" since a covenant can be compared to a contract.
But "marriage".....that's a stretch.

You should...

....and I did.

But I no longer do.
I now accept it as man-made...no question...lol.

Where did I say " misplaced...really should have been"????......

I clearly said it "could and has"

So I take it you don't believe the Bible is the word of God either?

or you do not bow yourselves to another god—for YHWH, whose Name [is] Zealous, is a zealous God.

This is a CLEAR contradiction.

First of all.... to my knowledge YHWH does NOT mean "Jealous" or "zealous".

Secondly, there is no way to confuse translating the word "jealous" with "zealous" except for deceptive purposes.

I'm sure the Hebrew word for zealous and jealous are two different words....no way to confuse them.

Moses appeals to the Emotion of Fear

Jesus appeals to the Emotion of Love

Same Goal different routes....focus on God

Moses brought the LAW and according to the Bible Jesus came to fullfill it.
......not absolve people of it and tell them they no longer have to adhere to it.

Jails and prison are being misused

Military overused

But do you support the EXISTENCE of these institutions, or do you think both should be done away with?

Remove no .....Repurpose yes - Restorative Justice.

Right now it's a money making scheme....Retributive Penal Colonies - PIC

Ok, so you DON'T think prisons should be removed.
They control people and hold them against their will....including women, yet you SUPPORT THAT type of control over women as long as it's "restorarative"

You cannot legislate against Human Nature....Nature is the Neteru

Laws against human nature are made and enforced all day long....lol.

Laws against urinating in public.
Laws against walking around naked.
Laws against sex in public.
And the list goes on......

That means it failed on both counts....both white men and women visited the enslaved quarters.

Come on man, be real....how often were White women running down to the slave quarters to get served up by these bruthaz????
If massa himself didn't jack those White women up for running after the Black penis....surely the other White men working on the plantation would catch her and jack her up over her lusty desires...lol.

You haven't seen it so it does not exist.

I'm not saying that.
I'm saying how did YOU get into a hawk's mind to figure out what he was thinking when he chose not to swoop down and devour a chicken or rabbit?

You're saying "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" is a universal law found in nature. I'm saying it's absolutely NOT and I'm asking for proof if I'm wrong.

Natures plays a role....but in most cases I suspect it is Nurture that corrupts.....In other words Rehabilitation is possible

Sure it's possible.
And I support it.

I just don't want to waste too much time and resources on THAT as opposed to focusing on building up a brand new society with those who are clean, healthy, and ready to start building RIGHT NOW.

Why reward and re-enforce NEGATIVE behavior in people????

Finding the Cause/s may lead to the Eradication of Murder....or at least drastically reduction - Restorative Justice

True!
But until then........keep them away.

That is a Judgement Call for those in the know of the relevant deciding factors.

One of whom I plan on being!

Mainly my beloved Daughters

All Black women are SOMEBODY'S daughters.
Which ones are beyond being controlled and disciplined?

frankster · April 21, 2023

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

What "they" need is accessibility to necessities of Life

Some would say they already have them and CHOOSE a less healthy diet.
Most supermarkets sell fresh fruits and vegetables....not just pop, candy, and chips.
All supermarkets sell bottled water....not just pop and liquor.

At some point, a person's CHOICES come into play.

Usually people choose a "less Healthy diet" because Affordability and lack Knowledge of Nutrition and skill of Food Preparation.

Constant Exposure to Systemic Racism often leads to dysfunction

Are you implying that all Bottled water is Good?

Information and Influences also plays a part in an individuals choice

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Here is the Marriage Contract - Vows

Genesis 17:10 - 14.

9God also said to Abraham, “You must keep My covenant—you and your descendants in the generations after you. 10This is My covenant with you and your descendants after you, which you are to keep: Every male among you must be circumcised. 11You are to circumcise the flesh of your foreskin, and this will be a sign of the covenant between Me and you.…

I don't see the word "marriage" anywhere in this scripture.

Covenant...yes.

I'd even give you "contract" since a covenant can be compared to a contract.
But "marriage".....that's a stretch.

Then I have proved my point.... God and his People called Israel have a contractual Relationship.

A Marriage is Considered a Contract

Jeremiah 31:31-32

Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

You should...

....and I did.

But I no longer do.
I now accept it as man-made...no question...lol.

Yes ....It is

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Where did I say " misplaced...really should have been"????......

I clearly said it "could and has"

So I take it you don't believe the Bible is the word of God either?

It is Man's Understanding Of God.

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

or you do not bow yourselves to another god—for YHWH, whose Name [is] Zealous, is a zealous God.

This is a CLEAR contradiction.

First of all.... to my knowledge YHWH does NOT mean "Jealous" or "zealous".

Secondly, there is no way to confuse translating the word "jealous" with "zealous" except for deceptive purposes.

I'm sure the Hebrew word for zealous and jealous are two different words....no way to confuse them.

No it's Not a contradiction

Jealous....also means to Guard and Defend One's Rights vigorously....as in a contract

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Moses appeals to the Emotion of Fear

Jesus appeals to the Emotion of Love

Same Goal different routes....focus on God

Moses brought the LAW and according to the Bible Jesus came to fullfill it.
......not absolve people of it and tell them they no longer have to adhere to it.

Moses Laws were written On tablets of Stone...fear

Jesus Laws are written in you heart....love

Jesus fulfilled the Law.

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Jails and prison are being misused

Military overused

But do you support the EXISTENCE of these institutions, or do you think both should be done away with?

Repurpose

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Remove no .....Repurpose yes - Restorative Justice.

Right now it's a money making scheme....Retributive Penal Colonies - PIC

Ok, so you DON'T think prisons should be removed.
They control people and hold them against their will....including women, yet you SUPPORT THAT type of control over women as long as it's "restorarative"

Repurpose Them into Treatment and Training facilities....I hold specific meanings for the terms treatment and training.

Our Freedoms end where or when it proves to be imminent harm to another's freedoms....Golden Rule.

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

You cannot legislate against Human Nature....Nature is the Neteru

Laws against human nature are made and enforced all day long....lol.

Laws against urinating in public.
Laws against walking around naked.
Laws against sex in public.
And the list goes on......

They are exercising their Free Will....where is the harm?

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

That means it failed on both counts....both white men and women visited the enslaved quarters.

Come on man, be real....how often were White women running down to the slave quarters to get served up by these bruthaz????
If massa himself didn't jack those White women up for running after the Black penis....surely the other White men working on the plantation would catch her and jack her up over her lusty desires...lol.

I based my assumption on the rate at which white women are marrying black men today.

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

You haven't seen it so it does not exist.

I'm not saying that.
I'm saying how did YOU get into a hawk's mind to figure out what he was thinking when he chose not to swoop down and devour a chicken or rabbit?

You're saying "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" is a universal law found in nature. I'm saying it's absolutely NOT and I'm asking for proof if I'm wrong.

I show you the exception, to what you thought was the rule as proof.

The Universal law does not abrogate Free Will.....It Compensate and Rebalance

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Natures plays a role....but in most cases I suspect it is Nurture that corrupts.....In other words Rehabilitation is possible

Sure it's possible.
And I support it.

I just don't want to waste too much time and resources on THAT as opposed to focusing on building up a brand new society with those who are clean, healthy, and ready to start building RIGHT NOW.

Why reward and re-enforce NEGATIVE behavior in people????

It is the sick that needs a doctor.....We are only as strong as our weakest link.

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Finding the Cause/s may lead to the Eradication of Murder....or at least drastically reduction - Restorative Justice

True!
But until then........keep them away.

So be it unto you.

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

That is a Judgement Call for those in the know of the relevant deciding factors.

One of whom I plan on being!

Such an Organization would lack Mercy and Love of those who need it most.

On 4/18/2023 at 8:45 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Mainly my beloved Daughters

All Black women are SOMEBODY'S daughters.
Which ones are beyond being controlled and disciplined?

All Black women are not my Daughters.

Discipline is for everyone.

Control is best self directed.

Pioneer1 · April 22, 2023

frankster

Usually people choose a "less Healthy diet" because Affordability and lack Knowledge of Nutrition and skill of Food Preparation.

Constant Exposure to Systemic Racism often leads to dysfunction

Are you implying that all Bottled water is Good?

Information and Influences also plays a part in an individuals choice

"Usually"???
I'm talking about communities in the UNITED STATES, not the planet in general. In most places in the United States even poor communities have markets with fresh fruits and vegetables and water available to those who actually want them. They may be SLIGHTLY higher than the food you get at the dollar menu at McDonalds or Taco Bell, but they are there for people who really do want them and want to feed them to their children.

Most of it boils down to education and choice.
Most of the time a lot of poor people....because of lack of proper education and cultural habit...CHOOSE to eat foods that aren't very healthy for them simply because these foods are rich in fat and salt and spices and often taste good and can prepared quickly.

And no, I'm not implying all bottled water is good.....but generally speaking it's better than soda pop and liquor.
And although it's bottled, it's still usually cheaper than soda and liquor; but most people still choose the later because it's an EMOTIONAL decision and not an intellectual one.

Then I have proved my point.... God and his People called Israel have a contractual Relationship.

A Marriage is Considered a Contract

Lol...you mean you proved your point WRONG.

You said they had a MARRIAGE with God, I asked you to show me and you couldn't. You just showed me a covenant/contract made between God and Israel according to the Bible. Again, it says nothing about marriage.

Yes, marriage is a contract....but not all contracts are marriages.

I have a cousin who's a CONTRACTOR for construction. He writes contracts for his customers. But that doesn't mean he's MARRIED to everyone he does business with....lol.

Further, what do you mean "God's people"?????

Aren't all human beings God's people?

It is Man's Understanding Of God.

I'd consider it more of an INTERPRETATION by CERTAIN men, more so than an understanding by man in general.

But at any rate, if we understand and agree that the Bible is NOT from God....then we can agree that it also contains mistakes and errors, no?

No it's Not a contradiction

Jealous....also means to Guard and Defend One's Rights vigorously....as in a contract

If what you say about the meaning of jealousy is true, then:

1. It's STILL a contradiction because YHWH does NOT mean "guard" or "defender of one's rights". It's a personal Name of the God of the Israelites.

2. If to be jealous means to guard and defend one's rights, then keeping up with the origin and theme of this thread Black men SHOULD be more jealous, right?

Moses Laws were written On tablets of Stone...fear
Jesus Laws are written in you heart....love

That's a metaphor as you know
His laws weren't written on a physical heart, but even when taken figuratively....it's not true.
The teachings attributed to Jesus are not found among most human beings and some of them (like turn the other cheek) goes against human nature.
Clearly his "laws" are not written on the hearts of most humans.

And what you're calling "fear" from Moses law...I would call DISCIPLINE and ORDER.
Moses was brining a savage and wayward people into civilization and civility and they NEEDED strict law and disciple to keep them moral and righteous.

You also need love to balance it out and provide mercy.

So you need BOTH....not too much of one or the other.

They are exercising their Free Will....where is the harm?

Urinating in public poses a health hazzard, especially from people with communicable diseases squiring toxic urine all over the place infecting other people.

Walking around naked in public poses a safety hazzard because it significantly increases the risk of people being sexually assaulted.
Especially by those with mental problems who lack discipline and other perverted groups like rapists and pedophiles.

Sex in public also poses a health risk because of the spread of STDS from bodily fluids.

Many laws are in place for a reason, even if we didn't take time to stop and think about it.

I based my assumption on the rate at which white women are marrying black men today.

But White women aren't being killed and threatened with death for the very mention of sleeping with a Black men today, as they were during the days of chattel slavery...so how can you make that type of leap in logic?

Men like women and women like men, so ofcourse there was attraction between the Black men and White women in those days, but the actual SEX itself wasn't happening nearly as much as you're implying because of the strong punishments measured out for it.

It is the sick that needs a doctor.

Yes the sick needs a doctor, but not the DEAD.
A lot of the people you're talking about saving aren't merely sick but actually DEAD.
Zombies....walking around.

.We are only as strong as our weakest link.

I don't believe that.

So be it unto you.

Not to me, because I'm not a murderer or rapist.

We shouldn't put decent human beings into the same category of the most evil, vile, and wicked of humanity.
That wouldn't be fair nor just.

This is the problem with religion and religious people running a society....they tend to have their OWN interpretation of justice and fairness that doesn't always line up with common sense.

Such an Organization would lack Mercy and Love of those who need it most.

Absolutely not.
To the contrary, it would provide JUSTICE to all.

The mercy and love would be balanced out with punishment and discipline.

Tell a mother who's daughter has been raped by a crack head under the influence that what the rapist REALLY needs is some "mercy and love".
You better be in a fast moving car when you say it.

A lot of this "feel good" talk doesn't pan out in the REAL world.
It just sounds good on paper or on the screen, but in real life human nature takes over.

Hell, you wouldn't even convince the average woman to show "mercy and love" to a husband who's been cheating on her...lol.

She'll agree with you about loving and showing mercy to crack heads and murderers all day long, but just let her find out HER husband has been cheating on her and she'll ignore everything you wrote and be ready to kill the man....lol.

We need PRACTICAL and VIABLE solutions to solve the problems of society, not Dr. Feel Good nuggets of wisdom.

frankster · April 23, 2023

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Usually people choose a "less Healthy diet" because Affordability and lack Knowledge of Nutrition and skill of Food Preparation.

Constant Exposure to Systemic Racism often leads to dysfunction

Are you implying that all Bottled water is Good?

Information and Influences also plays a part in an individuals choice

"Usually"???
I'm talking about communities in the UNITED STATES, not the planet in general. In most places in the United States even poor communities have markets with fresh fruits and vegetables and water available to those who actually want them. They may be SLIGHTLY higher than the food you get at the dollar menu at McDonalds or Taco Bell, but they are there for people who really do want them and want to feed them to their children.

One of the manifestation of Structural Racism in the US is the Lack of Readily Affordable, Accessible, and Available Nutritious Food in Black (Inner city) Communities.

There is approximately 2 million African Americans enduring One or All of the Food Justice Issues in the US...like Food Desert, Food Swamp, Food insecurity, and Food Apartheid.

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Most of it boils down to education and choice.
Most of the time a lot of poor people....because of lack of proper education and cultural habit...CHOOSE to eat foods that aren't very healthy for them simply because these foods are rich in fat and salt and spices and often taste good and can prepared quickly.

True we concur....On the lack of proper Food Education - Nutrition and Food Preparation Skill.

Cultural Habit in the Black Community is Not a Coping Skill but a Survival Mechanism as a result of Structural Racism.

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

And no, I'm not implying all bottled water is good.....but generally speaking it's better than soda pop and liquor.
And although it's bottled, it's still usually cheaper than soda and liquor; but most people still choose the later because it's an EMOTIONAL decision and not an intellectual one.

True

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

And although it's bottled, it's still usually cheaper than soda and liquor; but most people still choose the later because it's an EMOTIONAL decision and not an intellectual one.

True in most cases.

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Then I have proved my point.... God and his People called Israel have a contractual Relationship.

A Marriage is Considered a Contract

Lol...you mean you proved your point WRONG.

You said they had a MARRIAGE with God, I asked you to show me and you couldn't. You just showed me a covenant/contract made between God and Israel according to the Bible. Again, it says nothing about marriage.

Yes, marriage is a contract....but not all contracts are marriages.

I have a cousin who's a CONTRACTOR for construction. He writes contracts for his customers. But that doesn't mean he's MARRIED to everyone he does business with....lol.

Further, what do you mean "God's people"?????

Your initial question was......

I quote:

The Israelites are in a Contractual relationship with God....

Are you sure about this?
If it's part of the Bible why haven't I read it?

I have shown that Contractual Relationship..

And Yes it was A Marriage....God Considered Himself the "Husband"

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Aren't all human beings God's people?

Yes..

but not all of us are under contract.....

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

It is Man's Understanding Of God.

I'd consider it more of an INTERPRETATION by CERTAIN men, more so than an understanding by man in general.

But at any rate, if we understand and agree that the Bible is NOT from God....then we can agree that it also contains mistakes and errors, no?

Who said it was not from God??....That's your interpretation of my words.

The Bible is Man's Understanding of God.....Your Interpretation of Man's Understanding depends Depends on your Cognition.

Often Errors seen in the Bible is our lack Comprehension.

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

No it's Not a contradiction

Jealous....also means to Guard and Defend One's Rights vigorously....as in a contract

If what you say about the meaning of jealousy is true, then:

1. It's STILL a contradiction because YHWH does NOT mean "guard" or "defender of one's rights". It's a personal Name of the God of the Israelites.

2. If to be jealous means to guard and defend one's rights, then keeping up with the origin and theme of this thread Black men SHOULD be more jealous, right?

Do you have a "contractual Relationship" with the individuals you want to "guard or defend" as in Jealous?

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Moses Laws were written On tablets of Stone...fear
Jesus Laws are written in you heart....love

That's a metaphor as you know
His laws weren't written on a physical heart, but even when taken figuratively....it's not true.
The teachings attributed to Jesus are not found among most human beings and some of them (like turn the other cheek) goes against human nature.
Clearly his "laws" are not written on the hearts of most humans.

Yes it is a metaphor and should be taken figuratively and literally....We all have a Conscience

Jeremiah 31:33

But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

And what you're calling "fear" from Moses law...I would call DISCIPLINE and ORDER.
Moses was brining a savage and wayward people into civilization and civility and they NEEDED strict law and disciple to keep them moral and righteous.

You also need love to balance it out and provide mercy.

So you need BOTH....not too much of one or the other.

True

Hence Jesus fulfilled....Both are in application

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

They are exercising their Free Will....where is the harm?

Urinating in public poses a health hazzard, especially from people with communicable diseases squiring toxic urine all over the place infecting other people.

Walking around naked in public poses a safety hazzard because it significantly increases the risk of people being sexually assaulted.
Especially by those with mental problems who lack discipline and other perverted groups like rapists and pedophiles.

Sex in public also poses a health risk because of the spread of STDS from bodily fluids.

Many laws are in place for a reason, even if we didn't take time to stop and think about it.

Maybe urinating in public could in some cases pose a health hazard......but the others are practically for all intents and purposes "du jure" in many countries in the world.

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I based my assumption on the rate at which white women are marrying black men today.

But White women aren't being killed and threatened with death for the very mention of sleeping with a Black men today, as they were during the days of chattel slavery...so how can you make that type of leap in logic?

True....

Based on your own quote.....

Today was built on Yesterday, and Tomorrow will be built on Today!

What in yesterday's white women led to today's white women marrying black men at such a high rate?

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Men like women and women like men, so ofcourse there was attraction between the Black men and White women in those days, but the actual SEX itself wasn't happening nearly as much as you're implying because of the strong punishments measured out for it.

Yes I am only "implying" that it must have happen frequently....If I was "stating" I would have given you more than the past is the best predictor of the future already

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

It is the sick that needs a doctor.

Yes the sick needs a doctor, but not the DEAD.
A lot of the people you're talking about saving aren't merely sick but actually DEAD.
Zombies....walking around.

I will let a Doctor pronounce them dead before I do....Doctors have the require info or knowledge

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

We are only as strong as our weakest link.

I don't believe that.

It is a Truism.....Show me where it does not apply?

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

So be it unto you.

Not to me, because I'm not a murderer or rapist.

We shouldn't put decent human beings into the same category of the most evil, vile, and wicked of humanity.
That wouldn't be fair nor just.

Human beings are human beings.....We are all One Race One Class one Caste

Do you prefer a Caste or Class system to the Racialized hierarchical one we now live in???

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

This is the problem with religion and religious people running a society....they tend to have their OWN interpretation of justice and fairness that doesn't always line up with common sense.

Common sense is subject to Culture Time and Place.....In Hitler's Germany it was the law and common sense to persecute Jews.

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Such an Organization would lack Mercy and Love of those who need it most.

Absolutely not.
To the contrary, it would provide JUSTICE to all.

The mercy and love would be balanced out with punishment and discipline.

Punishment is retributive and not necessarily Restorative or rehabilitative..

Justice is supposed to be Reparative.

Discipline is educative.

Is there overlap ...yes - where or what is emphasized is important.

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Tell a mother who's daughter has been raped by a crack head under the influence that what the rapist REALLY needs is some "mercy and love".
You better be in a fast moving car when you say it.

A message like that is not for the mother of someone who has been victimize

11 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

A lot of this "feel good" talk doesn't pan out in the REAL world.
It just sounds good on paper or on the screen, but in real life human nature takes over.

Hell, you wouldn't even convince the average woman to show "mercy and love" to a husband who's been cheating on her...lol.

She'll agree with you about loving and showing mercy to crack heads and murderers all day long, but just let her find out HER husband has been cheating on her and she'll ignore everything you wrote and be ready to kill the man....lol.

We need PRACTICAL and VIABLE solutions to solve the problems of society, not Dr. Feel Good nuggets of wisdom.

The Current punitive and retributive forms of Justice is becoming more and more apparent that its not working as a deterrent to crime...Tough on Crime is a Racist Agenda and money making scheme.

Pioneer1 · April 25, 2023

frankster

One of the manifestation of Structural Racism in the US is the Lack of Readily Affordable, Accessible, and Available Nutritious Food in Black (Inner city) Communities.

I disagree.
The lack of readily affordable, accessible, and available nutritious foods in the Black communities is PARTIALLY the fault of racism.....but MOSTLY the fault of AfroAmericans who are either too lazy or too indifferent to build enough supermarkets and grocery stores to feed themselves.

Back in the 50s, 60s, and 70s the Nation of Islam had grocery stores and resturants in nearly every Black community in this nation serving healthy and nutritious food.
This was during a time when MORE open racism, segregation, and poverty existed as obstacles for the AfroAmerican community.

True we concur....On the lack of proper Food Education - Nutrition and Food Preparation Skill.

Absolutely.
However I believe most of the lack of proper food education in the AfroAmerican community TODAY is not the result of racism, but the result of negro laziness and indifference.
Simply not caring enough to educate one's self on the proper growing and preparing of foods.....since they can rely on other demographic groups to do it for them.

Cultural Habit in the Black Community is Not a Coping Skill but a Survival Mechanism as a result of Structural Racism.

Perhaps.

And Yes it was A Marriage....God Considered Himself the "Husband"

I don't think you have a very clear understanding of the word "God" in the Bible.

Yes..

but not all of us are under contract.....

Well, outside of Biblical reference....we don't know that Israel is either.

Often Errors seen in the Bible is our lack Comprehension.

Well if it's an "error" and is recognized AS such....then that shows pretty ACCURATE comprehension!

It's the person who can read the entire Bible and not notice any glaring differences and contradictions who should have their comprehension skills questioned.

Do you have a "contractual Relationship" with the individuals you want to "guard or defend" as in Jealous?

Not sure I understand your question.
You might want to RE-word it.

Yes it is a metaphor and should be taken figuratively and literally....We all have a Conscience

Again, that's simply not the case.
Many people are born WITHOUT a conscience or moral compass for right and wrong. They are known as PSYCHOPATHS.

And again, this is one of the reasons I don't do religion.
They tend to ignore the realities of nature that don't fit neatly within their boundaries of doctrine.
It's ASS-umed that everyone knows right from wrong or has access to the scriptures so that they can accept Jesus and do good deeds when that's far from the truth for a LARGE percentage of the Earth's population

.

True

Hence Jesus fulfilled....Both are in application

How can Jesus "fulfill" something that is an ongoing process commanded of multiple generations??

The commandments and laws of Moses put down for the Israelites in scripture were meant to be perpetual, not ended when Jesus came.

What in yesterday's white women led to today's white women marrying black men at such a high rate?

The attraction and desire for Black men's bodies.
That didn't change.
But the ACCESS to them did.

It is a Truism.....Show me where it does not apply?

Any institution could serve as an example to disprove that saying.
The military, hospitals, universities, etc...

The U.S. has the most powerful military of any nation in this world, yet they have plenty of weak people in it who can't fight and must rely on the strength of the group to maintain.

Plenty of hospitals with lazy and weak nurses and even doctors but still remain strong because of the strong nurses and doctors who carry the load.

We are all One Race One Class one Caste

Come on bro, now you KNOW that's not true....lol.

Do you prefer a Caste or Class system to the Racialized hierarchical one we now live in???

Yes.

Common sense is subject to Culture Time and Place.....

True.
Yet the fact remains, most religions ask you to put common sense to the side and simply have faith in THEIR doctrine as a means of salvation.

Punishment is retributive and not necessarily Restorative or rehabilitative..

Punishment is actually therapeutic and keeps a community from devolving into chaos and savagery.

If a person believes that the law will actually PUNISH a person who has done harm to them or their loved one, they are less likely to take matters into their own hands.

However if you take away punishment, most people will seek justice by their own hands, which will likely lead to more INJUSTICE and innocent people being hurt.

A message like that is not for the mother of someone who has been victimize

Agreed, it's absolutely not.

She wants to know what will happen to those who violated her baby.

The Current punitive and retributive forms of Justice is becoming more and more apparent that its not working as a deterrent to crime.

..

Correct.
Because it wasn't meant to deter crime in the first place.

It's doing exactly what was designed to do....PROMOTE crime and the criminal mindset among certain populations.

frankster · April 25, 2023

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

One of the manifestation of Structural Racism in the US is the Lack of Readily Affordable, Accessible, and Available Nutritious Food in Black (Inner city) Communities.

I disagree.
The lack of readily affordable, accessible, and available nutritious foods in the Black communities is PARTIALLY the fault of racism.....but MOSTLY the fault of AfroAmericans who are either too lazy or too indifferent to build enough supermarkets and grocery stores to feed themselves.

Not True

Black Businesses could not avail themselves of Credit from Lending Institutions - The real cause is Discriminatory Lending - in Housing it was called RedLining.

FHA, ECOA and CRA are Fair Lending Laws/Acts passed to remedy the onslaught of Discriminatory Lending - It survive as Predatory Lending and Odious Debt

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Back in the 50s, 60s, and 70s the Nation of Islam had grocery stores and resturants in nearly every Black community in this nation serving healthy and nutritious food.
This was during a time when MORE open racism, segregation, and poverty existed as obstacles for the AfroAmerican community.

Yes there was more black owned stores during the time of Segregation....it was a necessity.

Integration allow Blacks to shop where they pleased....Lacking access to Credit many black businesses could not compete.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

True we concur....On the lack of proper Food Education - Nutrition and Food Preparation Skill.

Absolutely.
However I believe most of the lack of proper food education in the AfroAmerican community TODAY is not the result of racism, but the result of negro laziness and indifference.
Simply not caring enough to educate one's self on the proper growing and preparing of foods.....since they can rely on other demographic groups to do it for them.

Careful Pioneer1 less you reveal your Heart..... your words seemed borrowed from the Racists Playbook.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Cultural Habit in the Black Community is Not a Coping Skill but a Survival Mechanism as a result of Structural Racism.

Perhaps.

Racism is Lethal Violence.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

And Yes it was A Marriage....God Considered Himself the "Husband"

I don't think you have a very clear understanding of the word "God" in the Bible.

Then share with me your interpretation of what the word "God" means in the Bible?

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Yes..

but not all of us are under contract.....

Well, outside of Biblical reference....we don't know that Israel is either.

Just To be clear in the bible Israel is under Contract....under Law

Outside the Bible we are Under Grace.....God's Love

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Often Errors seen in the Bible is our lack Comprehension.

Well if it's an "error" and is recognized AS such....then that shows pretty ACCURATE comprehension!

It's the person who can read the entire Bible and not notice any glaring differences and contradictions who should have their comprehension skills questioned.

The Error is in your ability to Comprehend what is being communicated.

I have nothing against questioning all and everything....even the bible is to be question

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Do you have a "contractual Relationship" with the individuals you want to "guard or defend" as in Jealous?

Not sure I understand your question.
You might want to RE-word it.

If you are being "jealous" in the way the verses you quoted are using the word "jealous" then your Contractual Rights are being attacked or denied....

So the people you intend to defend or guard must be in a Contractual Relationship with you. If so then you are oblige even obligated to guard and defend your Rights.

I was responding to your statement:

2. If to be jealous means to guard and defend one's rights, then keeping up with the origin and theme of this thread Black men SHOULD be more jealous, right?

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Yes it is a metaphor and should be taken figuratively and literally....We all have a Conscience

Again, that's simply not the case.
Many people are born WITHOUT a conscience or moral compass for right and wrong. They are known as PSYCHOPATHS.

On this science may support you to a point......I stand with scripture - We Human Beings are Social creatures and are Born with Conscience.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

And again, this is one of the reasons I don't do religion.

I do not do Religion.....Spirituality is my quest

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

They tend to ignore the realities of nature that don't fit neatly within their boundaries of doctrine.
It's ASS-umed that everyone knows right from wrong or has access to the scriptures so that they can accept Jesus and do good deeds when that's far from the truth for a LARGE percentage of the Earth's population

All Social Creatures have a Conscience.....whether they obey it or not is Free Will.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

True

Hence Jesus fulfilled....Both are in application

How can Jesus "fulfill" something that is an ongoing process commanded of multiple generations??

The commandments and laws of Moses put down for the Israelites in scripture were meant to be perpetual, not ended when Jesus came.

Where did I say "ended"......I said BOTH are IN application.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

What in yesterday's white women led to today's white women marrying black men at such a high rate?

The attraction and desire for Black men's bodies.
That didn't change.
But the ACCESS to them did.

I think they had access ..... what change - is that they no longer have to hide.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

It is a Truism.....Show me where it does not apply?

Any institution could serve as an example to disprove that saying.
The military, hospitals, universities, etc...

The U.S. has the most powerful military of any nation in this world, yet they have plenty of weak people in it who can't fight and must rely on the strength of the group to maintain.

Plenty of hospitals with lazy and weak nurses and even doctors but still remain strong because of the strong nurses and doctors who carry the load.

Yet Our military did not do so well in Vietnam....they are looking at the weak link.

Many will tell you that our healthcare system is failing if not broken.....they are looking at the weak link.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

We are all One Race One Class one Caste

Come on bro, now you KNOW that's not true....lol.

Social Constructs are only real in a existing Social Order......Race Class and Caste are Social Constructs.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Do you prefer a Caste or Class system to the Racialized hierarchical one we now live in???

Yes.

To each His Own.....Which is your preference?

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Common sense is subject to Culture Time and Place.....

True.
Yet the fact remains, most religions ask you to put common sense to the side and simply have faith in THEIR doctrine as a means of salvation.

True....Common sense is often Temporal.

Religion is an Organization of socio-culture beliefs and practices.......Faith is Spiritual.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Punishment is retributive and not necessarily Restorative or rehabilitative..

Punishment is actually therapeutic and keeps a community from devolving into chaos and savagery.

If a person believes that the law will actually PUNISH a person who has done harm to them or their loved one, they are less likely to take matters into their own hands.

However if you take away punishment, most people will seek justice by their own hands, which will likely lead to more INJUSTICE and innocent people being hurt.

Yet Criminal activity continues....Prisons and Retributive Justice as a deterrent has failed.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

A message like that is not for the mother of someone who has been victimize

Agreed, it's absolutely not.

She wants to know what will happen to those who violated her baby.

They will be apprehended and given the care they need.

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

The Current punitive and retributive forms of Justice is becoming more and more apparent that its not working as a deterrent to crime.

..

Correct.
Because it wasn't meant to deter crime in the first place.

It's doing exactly what was designed to do....PROMOTE crime and the criminal mindset among certain populations.

So we agree.

Pioneer1 · April 27, 2023

Stay tuned for an in-depth response..........

Troy · April 28, 2023

Every point in this conversation could be a completely separate conversation.

I would like to explore the issue of spirituality versus religion, at some point.

Pioneer1 · April 29, 2023

frankster

Not True

Black Businesses could not avail themselves of Credit from Lending Institutions - The real cause is Discriminatory Lending - in Housing it was called RedLining.

FHA, ECOA and CRA are Fair Lending Laws/Acts passed to remedy the onslaught of Discriminatory Lending - It survive as Predatory Lending and Odious Debt

1. You're speaking in the PAST TENSE while I'm talking about RIGHT NOW.

2. Again, I acknowledge the role racism played and is still playing in the acquisition of Black businesses in general and Black supermarkets and food distrubition centers in specific...however the disagreement is over HOW BIG of a role racism actually plays.

And again....
I'm telling you the Honorable Marcus Garvey and the Honorable Elijah Muhammad were building businesses including restaurants and grocery stores serving good nutritious food in AfroAmerican communities all over the United States back during the height of legal Segregation where the laws OPENLY limited Black movement and economic success.
You mean to tell me in 1990 and 2000 and 2010 and 2023 Black folks in America today are so oppressed and curtailed by red-lining that they can ONLY establish weed shops, McDonalds franchises, barbershops, hair braiding stores, and soul food joints.....not fresh markets grocery stores to feed the community?

Come on bro, get real.

It's not a matter of ability as much as it's a matter of DESIRE and FOCUS.

1. Most Black business owners don't WANT to build these institutions and

2.A large percentage of our people don't WANT to eat the healthiest of foods because they don't taste like the fast food they're used to and take longer to prepare.

Societal laziness and societal immaturity

That's the truth.

Yes there was more black owned stores during the time of Segregation....it was a necessity.

Integration allow Blacks to shop where they pleased....Lacking access to Credit many black businesses could not compete.

Exactly, that's part of my point.
AfroAmericans CHOSE to abandon their own businesses and go whoring after racist White institutions whom they "believe" have more to offer.

That's not the fault of racism so much as it's the fault of disloyalty and indifference to the overall success of the Black community in America that a lot of our people harbor.

It's not so much about lack of access to credit, as much as it is being RESPONSIBLE with the credit you DO have access too as well as SAVING up enough money to buy your business property and supplies outright.

Careful Pioneer1 less you reveal your Heart..... your words seemed borrowed from the Racists Playbook.

Lol...oh really?

So was brother Malcolm X borrowing HIS lines out of the Racists Playbook when he correctly noted that a lot of our people run THEIR OWN communities down and blame White folks for it and also said that a lot our people don't have sense enough to establish businesses in our own community to keep our dollars with us?

Then share with me your interpretation of what the word "God" means in the Bible?

The first thing to understand is that "God" is an English/Germanic word that wasn't used in the actual scriptures.
It's a TRANSLATED word.

So what was the original word(s) used before the translation?

The two major words were "Elohim" and "Eloah".

One is the plural form of the other.

Just To be clear in the bible Israel is under Contract....under Law

Ok, you proved your point about the Bible stating that Israel was in a contract/covenant with God.
Not that I actually believe it; but my question was was it actually in the Bible......and you showed me.

Outside the Bible we are Under Grace.....God's Love

We're under God's love both inside AND outside the Bible.

The Error is in your ability to Comprehend what is being communicated.

I admit I clearly don't know all and can't comprehend all, but I do have a reasonably good understanding and comprehension of the Bible.

It's the SPIN a lot of Christians and preachers put on it that causes problems. They'll take a scripture that is as plain as day to understand and put a spin on it claiming it doesn't mean what it clearly says.
Or they'll try to iron out a blaring contradiction.

I stand with scripture - We Human Beings are Social creatures and are Born with Conscience.

You can stand with scripture if you want.
Just understand that it's not Divine, but the script of human beings...who's knowledge was very limited at that time.

Those who wrote those scriptures had a very limited and rudimentary understanding of psychology and psychiatry at that time so they would say "human beings are born with a conscience" not understanding that some people are born psychopaths.

I do not do Religion.....Spirituality is my quest

You can be Spiritual as much as your heart desires, however if you believe Jesus Christ is your lord and savior then you DO have a religion, called Christianity.

All Social Creatures have a Conscience.....whether they obey it or not is Free Will.

We'll have to agree to disagree.
We know that some people are born without a "conscience" and they're called PSYCHOPATHS.
Others...for one reason or another....lose their conscience and are known as SOCIOPATHS

I think they had access ..... what change - is that they no longer have to hide.

Access at the risk of execution is NOT what I call "access"....lol.

It's like a civilian having "access" to a military base or the Pentagon.
I guess as long as they have legs they can physically attempt to walk onto and "access" it but the consequences of such....like the consequences of a White woman at that time trying to "access" a Black man...would one they'll regret.

Yet Our military did not do so well in Vietnam....they are looking at the weak link.

The U.S. military did was well as it WANTED to do in Vietnam.

It was a PROJECT designed to clear the streets of America of a lot of "unwanted" Black and poor White young men whom some in the government believed weren't enough jobs and resources to supply them with.

Most wars are forms of population control

Social Constructs are only real in a existing Social Order......Race Class and Caste are Social Constructs.

1. CASTE and CLASS....just like rank and nobility...are social constructs.

2. Racial CLASSIFICATION...is a social construct.

But RACE ITSELF is NOT a "social construct" but a biological reality.

In other words, the differences between these two men are not just on paper but are ACTUAL and BIOLOGICAL.

However how they are CLASSIFIED is a matter of social interpretation.

To each His Own.....Which is your preference?

I'd personally prefer a CLASS system.
Castes tend to be inborn and from my studies of history, people tend to be stuck in their particular castes from birth to death and rarely move from them.

Where as in a CLASS system, through one's abilities and ofcourse Divine Assistance as is the case with most successes in life....a person has more of a chance to improve their class and move up.

Yet Criminal activity continues....Prisons and Retributive Justice as a deterrent has failed.

Just because crime exists, doesn't mean the Prison system has failed.
That's like saying just because sickness and accidents still occur....HOSPITALS must have failed, lol.

1. If it serves as a deterrent and REDUCES crime to any measurable extent...then it has not failed.
It may not be working at optimal or ideal levels, but reducing crime to ANY measurable extent is better than not reducing crime at all.
If ONE LIFE can be saved out of the fear of going to prison.....it would be worth it, wouldn't you say?

2. As I said before, the system as actually working the way they designed it to. It wasn't designed to stop or solve crime....it was designed to CONTAIN it and keep it in certain areas as well as profit off of it.

They will be apprehended and given the care they need.

See, and that mentality is part of the problem.

You said apprehended and given the CARE they need....yet you said nothing about giving them the PUNISHMENT they deserve.

That type of mentality actually leads to a lot of vigilantes where a lot of victims and victims' loved ones feel they have to take the law in their own hands.

So we agree.

Lol...we tend to agree on MOST things.
But we usually only discuss and debate that which we DISAGREE on though because it tend to be more interesting and mind sharpening.

Sorry for the late response, but I wanted to give your post the respect it deserves so I wait until I have the time to respond properly!

Troy

I would like to explore the issue of spirituality versus religion, at some point.

Hey,
Bang out a thread and I'm down....lol.

frankster · April 29, 2023

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Not True

Black Businesses could not avail themselves of Credit from Lending Institutions - The real cause is Discriminatory Lending - in Housing it was called RedLining.

FHA, ECOA and CRA are Fair Lending Laws/Acts passed to remedy the onslaught of Discriminatory Lending - It survive as Predatory Lending and Odious Debt

1. You're speaking in the PAST TENSE while I'm talking about RIGHT NOW.

I am showing why we are still having from Food Justice Issues

Come Pioneer 1 We are both speaking about the recent past as you yourself stated:

I quote:-

Back in the 50s, 60s, and 70s the Nation of Islam had grocery stores and resturants in nearly every Black community in this nation serving healthy and nutritious food.
This was during a time when MORE open racism, segregation, and poverty existed as obstacles for the AfroAmerican community.

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

2. Again, I acknowledge the role racism played and is still playing in the acquisition of Black businesses in general and Black supermarkets and food distrubition centers in specific...however the disagreement is over HOW BIG of a role racism actually plays.

What you think White Racist in America stop Destroying in Black business and Organizational successes?

Take the Organization Known as Acorn (not the App) with over 400,000 ( Dues paying ) membership it was targeted and destroyed when it started to implement an Employee Deduction Program. Racists realize that if instituted the organization would net billions in under 5yrs...

Acorn was one of the most effective and progressive black led Organization destroyed by Racism that never made it into the News

Until the 2008 election campaign threw it into the national spotlight, ACORN (Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) was well known among its 400,000 member families and other grassroots organizations as a leader in community organizing around social and economic justice issues. But it had little presence on the national political scene......I have to tell you about the attacks on us from the Right.

https://www.hofstra.edu/pdf/academics/colleges/hclas/cld/cld_rlr_sp09_acorn_duffy.pdf

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

And again....
I'm telling you the Honorable Marcus Garvey and the Honorable Elijah Muhammad were building businesses including restaurants and grocery stores serving good nutritious food in AfroAmerican communities all over the United States back during the height of legal Segregation where the laws OPENLY limited Black movement and economic success.
You mean to tell me in 1990 and 2000 and 2010 and 2023 Black folks in America today are so oppressed and curtailed by red-lining that they can ONLY establish weed shops, McDonalds franchises, barbershops, hair braiding stores, and soul food joints.....not fresh markets grocery stores to feed the community?

Come on bro, get real.

Yes....Why you think all those Right Wing Think Tanks are being paid Billions to do?....To ensure we stay in the ghettos by finding ways to criminalize black success or organizations -Edu/Info/Media, Movement, Fresh Air, Water and Food.

Food Control is a Major way to control People.....Food is Mood

The following was written in the early 19 century for the British Nobility.

More sensational than tests of intelligence is the possibility of controlling the emotional life through the secretions of the ductless glands. It will be possible to make people choleric or timid, strongly or weakly sexed, and so on, as may be desired. Differences of emotional disposition seem to be chiefly due to secretions of the ductless glands, and therefore controllable by injections or by increasing or diminishing the secretions. Assuming an oligarchic organization of society, the State could give to the children of holders of power the disposition required for command, and to the children of the proletariat the disposition required for obedience. Against the injections of the State physicians the most eloquent Socialist oratory would be powerless. The only difficulty would be to combine this submissiveness with the necessary ferocity against external enemies; but I do not doubt that official science would be equal to the task.

It is not necessary, when we are considering political consequences, to pin our faith to the particular theories of the ductless glands, which may blow over, like other theories. All that is essential in our hypothesis is the belief that physiology will in time find ways of controlling emotion, which it is scarcely possible to doubt. When that day comes we shall have the emotions desired by our rulers, and the chief business of elementary education will be to produce the desired disposition, no longer by punishment or moral precept, but by the far surer method of injection or diet. The men who will administer this system will have a power beyond the dreams of the Jesuits, but there is no reason to suppose that they will have more sense than the men who control education to-day. Technical scientific knowledge does not make men sensible in their aims, and administrators in the future, will be presumably no less stupid and no less prejudiced than they are at present.

https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/philosophy/works/en/russell2.htm

Diet, injections, and injunctions will combine, from a very early age, to produce the sort of character and the sort of beliefs that the authorities consider desirable, and any serious criticism of the powers that be will become psychologically impossible ..

https://www.ukcolumn.org/article/bertrand-russell-impact-science-society

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

It's not a matter of ability as much as it's a matter of DESIRE and FOCUS.

1. Most Black business owners don't WANT to build these institutions and

2.A large percentage of our people don't WANT to eat the healthiest of foods because they don't taste like the fast food they're used to and take longer to prepare.

Societal laziness and societal immaturity

That's the truth.

True..

Most of what we Desire and Focus on is Learnt.....Education again is the Answer

It will not be profitable as the Community you want to serve Lack the Proper Food Education of Nutrition its Necessity Benefits and Preparation.

Sugar and Salt is are very Addictive substance...especially when start on early in life or in utero.

Food Coloring and most Food additives are Neurotoxins

Using Words like Societal Laziness, Societal immaturity and Longer to prepare is true of the entire society both black white and other... but are often use as "code" for Black stereotyping.

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Yes there was more black owned stores during the time of Segregation....it was a necessity.

Integration allow Blacks to shop where they pleased....Lacking access to Credit many black businesses could not compete.

Exactly, that's part of my point.
AfroAmericans CHOSE to abandon their own businesses and go whoring after racist White institutions whom they "believe" have more to offer.

That's not the fault of racism so much as it's the fault of disloyalty and indifference to the overall success of the Black community in America that a lot of our people harbor.

It's not so much about lack of access to credit, as much as it is being RESPONSIBLE with the credit you DO have access too as well as SAVING up enough money to buy your business property and supplies outright.

It is Racism..... who taught them to hate themselves(Malcolm X)

It's called Consumerism and Marketing/Advertising Campaign.....people fall prey regardless of so called race

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Careful Pioneer1 less you reveal your Heart..... your words seemed borrowed from the Racists Playbook.

Lol...oh really?

So was brother Malcolm X borrowing HIS lines out of the Racists Playbook when he correctly noted that a lot of our people run THEIR OWN communities down and blame White folks for it and also said that a lot our people don't have sense enough to establish businesses in our own community to keep our dollars with us?

I do not hearing him referring to black people as "lazy"

Please watch again his explanation of the cause.

White Business have access to credit and Racism is guarantee of white success.

Spending Power is Good but is often mostly Consumed by Mandatory Spending on Immediate and Urgent cost of living expenses on life necessities......

Discretionary Income is far more important....Racism Denies Black Discretionary Income

Time Stamp 1:27 - 2:40 tells you the cause Lack of the Knowledge of Self - self hate ....who taught them to hate themselves?

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Then share with me your interpretation of what the word "God" means in the Bible?

The first thing to understand is that "God" is an English/Germanic word that wasn't used in the actual scriptures.
It's a TRANSLATED word.

So what was the original word(s) used before the translation?

The two major words were "Elohim" and "Eloah".

One is the plural form of the other.

I Am ..... I Am

Elohim Yahweh Jehovah etc are all titles ad honorifics

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Just To be clear in the bible Israel is under Contract....under Law

Ok, you proved your point about the Bible stating that Israel was in a contract/covenant with God.
Not that I actually believe it; but my question was was it actually in the Bible......and you showed me.

Cool

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Outside the Bible we are Under Grace.....God's Love

We're under God's love both inside AND outside the Bible.

Yes....Jesus is the FulfillMent of God's Love

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

The Error is in your ability to Comprehend what is being communicated.

I admit I clearly don't know all and can't comprehend all, but I do have a reasonably good understanding and comprehension of the Bible.

It's the SPIN a lot of Christians and preachers put on it that causes problems. They'll take a scripture that is as plain as day to understand and put a spin on it claiming it doesn't mean what it clearly says.
Or they'll try to iron out a blaring contradiction.

No one human knows All.

Some Know more than others.

The Truth lies in your Heart

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I stand with scripture - We Human Beings are Social creatures and are Born with Conscience.

You can stand with scripture if you want.
Just understand that it's not Divine, but the script of human beings...who's knowledge was very limited at that time.

Those who wrote those scriptures had a very limited and rudimentary understanding of psychology and psychiatry at that time so they would say "human beings are born with a conscience" not understanding that some people are born psychopaths.

It is Divine

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I do not do Religion.....Spirituality is my quest

You can be Spiritual as much as your heart desires, however if you believe Jesus Christ is your lord and savior then you DO have a religion, called Christianity.

Christ is Our Saviour....Jesus was not a Christian

Christianity is a Religion and I do not do religion.......I study the Scriptures and live by many of its Tenets - Old and New Testaments

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

All Social Creatures have a Conscience.....whether they obey it or not is Free Will.

We'll have to agree to disagree.
We know that some people are born without a "conscience" and they're called PSYCHOPATHS.
Others...for one reason or another....lose their conscience and are known as SOCIOPATHS

No I do not believe or know that sociopaths or psychopaths are without conscience....but i will accept that some scientist believe so.

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I think they had access ..... what change - is that they no longer have to hide.

Access at the risk of execution is NOT what I call "access"....lol.

It's like a civilian having "access" to a military base or the Pentagon.
I guess as long as they have legs they can physically attempt to walk onto and "access" it but the consequences of such....like the consequences of a White woman at that time trying to "access" a Black man...would one they'll regret.

For years now the Punishment for Murder is Death......Yet we still have countless murders every year

Soldiers go to War on the say so of others....People commit suicide for their beliefs.

People risk death for an adrenaline rush or a dare.....Death is not a deterrent .

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Yet Our military did not do so well in Vietnam....they are looking at the weak link.

The U.S. military did was well as it WANTED to do in Vietnam.

It was a PROJECT designed to clear the streets of America of a lot of "unwanted" Black and poor White young men whom some in the government believed weren't enough jobs and resources to supply them with.

Most wars are forms of population control

Yes

Wars are a "racket" to gain Access to Resource or Market share for the Corporatocracy

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Social Constructs are only real in a existing Social Order......Race Class and Caste are Social Constructs.

1. CASTE and CLASS....just like rank and nobility...are social constructs.

2. Racial CLASSIFICATION...is a social construct.

But RACE ITSELF is NOT a "social construct" but a biological reality.

In other words, the differences between these two men are not just on paper but are ACTUAL and BIOLOGICAL.

However how they are CLASSIFIED is a matter of social interpretation.

Race is not biological...some individuals express more or less Melanin than that others....we have had this discussion already if you wish to revisit it then it behooves one of us to find the thread.

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

To each His Own.....Which is your preference?

I'd personally prefer a CLASS system.
Castes tend to be inborn and from my studies of history, people tend to be stuck in their particular castes from birth to death and rarely move from them.

Where as in a CLASS system, through one's abilities and ofcourse Divine Assistance as is the case with most successes in life....a person has more of a chance to improve their class and move up.

You are defining a Meritocracy.....Class has to do with Aristocracy

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Yet Criminal activity continues....Prisons and Retributive Justice as a deterrent has failed.

Just because crime exists, doesn't mean the Prison system has failed.
That's like saying just because sickness and accidents still occur....HOSPITALS must have failed, lol.

Is crime increasing proportionally respective to the growing population at large or shrinking?

We had had prisons for hundreds of years and yet crime outstrips population growth

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

1. If it serves as a deterrent and REDUCES crime to any measurable extent...then it has not failed.

Does it deters some people from crime....yes

Yet More and More people are committing more and more heinous crimes.....as we see by prison population growth.

Its not working it needs to be replace by something that works more effectively.

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

It may not be working at optimal or ideal levels, but reducing crime to ANY measurable extent is better than not reducing crime at all.
If ONE LIFE can be saved out of the fear of going to prison.....it would be worth it, wouldn't you say?

No....what if another method can save two lives instead of one?

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

2. As I said before, the system as actually working the way they designed it to. It wasn't designed to stop or solve crime....it was designed to CONTAIN it and keep it in certain areas as well as profit off of it.

Hence the reason I said it should be repurpose...."Tough on Crime is a Racist Agenda and money making scheme."

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

They will be apprehended and given the care they need.

See, and that mentality is part of the problem.

You said apprehended and given the CARE they need....yet you said nothing about giving them the PUNISHMENT they deserve.

That type of mentality actually leads to a lot of vigilantes where a lot of victims and victims' loved ones feel they have to take the law in their own hands.

I see criminality as a Maladaptive dysfunction......Not an Innate Compulsion.

8 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

So we agree.

Lol...we tend to agree on MOST things.
But we usually only discuss and debate that which we DISAGREE on though because it tend to be more interesting and mind sharpening.

Sorry for the late response, but I wanted to give your post the respect it deserves so I wait until I have the time to respond properly!

Hey I love it

I will wait for good arguments and points.....it is fun

frankster · April 30, 2023

On 4/27/2023 at 9:14 PM, Troy said:

Every point in this conversation could be a completely separate conversation.

True

On 4/27/2023 at 9:14 PM, Troy said:

I would like to explore the issue of spirituality versus religion, at some point.

Spirituality is about direct connect to God....Man Know thyself.

Religion is an organization use to control Man and his Spirituality for few to have Power

4BIDDEN KNOWLEDGE With Billy Carson | Spirituality Vs. Religion Pt. 2

Pioneer1 · April 30, 2023

frankster

I am showing why we are still having from Food Justice Issues

Well...lol...you're SPLAININ' why our people are still having food and justice issues, not really giving us legitimate reasons.

You're saying it's because of racism, and I agree that's a PART of it. However the BULK of it comes from our community being too lazy and too indifferent to focus on growing, distributing, and purchasing proper foods needed for a healthy community.

That's not to say all or even most of our people are lazy or indifferent, but enough of them are to make a noticeable impact on the health and wholesomeness of AfroAmerica.

What you think White Racist in America stop Destroying in Black business and Organizational successes?

Have White racists in America destroyed the McDonalds and other fast food joints owned by Black Americans?

Have White racist in America destroyed the hair braiding and barber shops owned by Black Americans?

Take a look at this article of the Black owned Marijuana stores in Michigan:

20 Black-owned Michigan cannabis companies you should support | Detroit | Detroit Metro Times

Are White racists destroying the businesses of THESE bruthas and sistas who are focusing on growing and distributing DOPE to people instead of healthy foods????

Take the Organization Known as Acorn (not the App) with over 400,000 ( Dues paying ) membership it was targeted and destroyed when it started to implement an Employee Deduction Program. Racists realize that if instituted the organization would net billions in under 5yrs...

Acorn was one of the most effective and progressive black led Organization destroyed by Racism that never made it into the News

Until the 2008 election campaign threw it into the national spotlight, ACORN (Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) was well known among its 400,000 member families and other grassroots organizations as a leader in community organizing around social and economic justice issues. But it had little presence on the national political scene......I have to tell you about the attacks on us from the Right.

I remember this organization.
Fox News did a few hit-jobs on it.
I don't know too much about it but if the racists hated it and targeted it....it must have been doing some good.

Yes....Why you think all those Right Wing Think Tanks are being paid Billions to do?....To ensure we stay in the ghettos by finding ways to criminalize black success or organizations -Edu/Info/Media, Movement, Fresh Air, Water and Food.

Ofcourse....devils are being devils.
They've BEEN that way for not just hundreds but THOUSANDS of years....but our people have been dealing with them for HUNDREDS of years; so why is it such a surprise or shock that we aren't preparde for their wicked behavior????

Are you suggesting that AfroAmericans are totally helpless then?
Are you suggesting the right wing has our community's food and health on lock and there's nothing THEY can do to help themselves?

Food Control is a Major way to control People.....Food is Mood

Absolutely!
All the more reason we need to grow, distribute, and prepare OUR OWN foods!
The question is, why aren't we doing so when we have the opportunity?

I think you know the reason for that.

Nobody is forcing Black folks to pile up in McDonalds, KFC, and these other fast-food merchants of death to intoxicate themselves with pink slime. They are CHOOSING to do it out of indifference.

True..

Most of what we Desire and Focus on is Learnt.....Education again is the Answer

Education is ONE of the answers, but at this point I believe SEPARATION is the initial solution before even the Education.
We must SEPARATE ourselves from the AfroAmericans who have no desire or will to improve themselves and do nothing to progress our communities but would rather hinder it with their negative behavior.

We must do this FIRST if we expect to have lasting progress.

If not, we'll just be going in circles constantly RE-building what the negative among us destroy and focusing most of our energy on trying to help and uplift THEM and keep THEM out of trouble.
No....cut off the dead weight first.

It will not be profitable as the Community you want to serve Lack the Proper Food Education of Nutrition its Necessity Benefits and Preparation.

Sugar and Salt is are very Addictive substance...especially when start on early in life or in utero.

Facts!
Infact, they are actually DRUGS.
The white substances like sugar, salt, flour, cocaine, heroin, are EXTRACTIONS from the larger more wholesome herb or plant or mineral they were taken from.

Food Coloring and most Food additives are Neurotoxins

More facts.

Using Words like Societal Laziness, Societal immaturity and Longer to prepare is true of the entire society both black white and other... but are often use as "code" for Black stereotyping.

Well to be honest, Whites no longer call our people lazy in public....lol....although many of them still acknowledge that a lot of our people ARE lazy and have been for centuries which is how that stereotype developed.

It must be pointed out that laziness doesn't start in the body, it starts in the mind.
Black folks were called lazy even as slaves; not because our people didn't work hard...but because many of them didn't have a desire to think for themselves. And you STILL see that trait among lot of our people.

We can't ignore the truth and facts simply because they are uncomfortable or because White racists pointed them out. Our focus should be on correcting problems, not making excuses for them or keeping them in the closet so that racists can't use them as ammunition.

White Business have access to credit and Racism is guarantee of white success.

Black people in this nation have HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS of dollars flowing through our hands each year!
Why do we need "credit" from White institutions when we can capture some of that money and establish lines of credit among ourselves????

Are you telling me that racism is the reason we don't have more AfroAmerican banks and lending institutions?

Oprah, Byron Allen, and LeBron James each have enough money to establish their own banks and credit unions in cities across the U.S.....who's going to stop them in 2023?

Elohim Yahweh Jehovah etc are all titles ad honorifics

This is what I mean about a wrong understanding about "God" in the Bible.

Elohim is a word of plurality meaning "Eloahs" (more than one "Eloah").
An "Eloah" is the name for a Deity in Israelite/Canaanite religion.

The word Eloah is often translated as "God" in the Bible.

The Biblical translators KNOW that "Elohim" is a plural term yet they purposely translate it as singular for deceptive purposes.

Jehovah is NOT a "title"...it's a mis-translation.
I also believe (though I don't know for sure) "Yahweh" is a mis-translation also.
The correct pronunciation of YHWH is "Yahoowah", the Head God of the Israelites the Israelites.

Yes....Jesus is the FulfillMent of God's Love

No human being or one man is the "fulfillment" of God's Love....which is eternal and larger than imagination.

It is Divine

Does the Divine contradict itself?
Does the Divine order people to kill innocent children?

Christ is Our Saviour....Jesus was not a Christian

I agree, Jesus was NOT a Christian.
Paul started Christianity.....not Jesus; but if you believe he is your Saviour....then YOU are a Christian.

Christianity is a Religion and I do not do religion.......I study the Scriptures and live by many of its Tenets - Old and New Testaments

Lol...MANY of it's tenets huh....?

So you pick and choose which ones to live by?

No I do not believe or know that sociopaths or psychopaths are without conscience....but i will accept that some scientist believe so.

Ok, we're making progress....lol.

For years now the Punishment for Murder is Death......Yet we still have countless murders every year

Soldiers go to War on the say so of others....People commit suicide for their beliefs.

People risk death for an adrenaline rush or a dare.....Death is not a deterrent .

Know why it's not now????

Because in many societies, it wasn't JUST death that was the punishment but there was TORTURE along with the death and HOW a person was killed that dettered the public from murder.

Today a person is just lain on a cot and lethally injected, or put in a chair and electrocuted.

In the past, a person was often stripped naked and whipped to death or placed in a pit and had stones bust him upside the head until he brains were knocked out.....a gruesome way to die.
THAT was the deterrent.

I guarantee you that if they made "Death by Whipping" the standard punishment for 1st degree murder in America....homicides would PLUMMET by 95%.

Race is not biological...some individuals express more or less Melanin than that others....

Because melanin content isn't the ONLY factor that determines race.
Heredity, hair texture, facial shape, and other genetic factors determine a person's race.

You are defining a Meritocracy.....Class has to do with Aristocracy

One doesn't necessarily cancel out or abrogate the other.
You can have Aristocracy who arrived at that position THROUGH Meritocracy

In many organizations, you have well admired high ranks and degrees that people were able to achieve through hard work, great deeds, and proper focus.

Is crime increasing proportionally respective to the growing population at large or shrinking?

To be honest, it's hard for me to say because I don't trust the statistics being put out for crime rates.
Many many crimes are not documented.

From personal observation, I would say that people in general are a little more violent than they were 30 years ago because of more access to powerful weapons, plus the girls tend to fight more today than they did in the past.

We had had prisons for hundreds of years and yet crime outstrips population growth

If this is true, it's because crime in this nation (like disease) is being CONTROLED....not prevented.
Prison is an INDUSTRY in the U.S. and wasn't currently designed as crime prevention measure SO MUCH as it's designed to be FILLED for PROFIT and CHEAP LABOR.

In order for prisons to be filled you NEED CRIME.
So it behooves the powers that be that for the more prisons we have the more crime is needed to justify their existence.

Its not working it needs to be replace by something that works more effectively.

Again, it's working the way it was DESIGNED to work.
But I wholeheartedly agree that we need something that works far more effectively on reducing and preventing crime.

No....what if another method can save two lives instead of one?

It depends on that "second life" you're talking about saving.
If it's the life of a pedophile or serial killer....should it be spared?

I see criminality as a Maladaptive dysfunction......Not an Innate Compulsion.

Perhaps we need to back up a bit.....
If we go to the raw definition, what is "crime"?
Simply breaking a law.

1. Laws were made by man, human beings.
2. Between the Federal, State, and Local jurisdictions -there are MILLIONS of laws in the United States....some are good, some are bad.

Everyone has and is breaking a law at some point because there are so many....many of which contradict eachother....we don't even know them all and unintentionally break them day to day.

So simply breaking a few laws or breaking UNJUST laws that don't cause harm to others....is not who I'm speaking of when I say "criminal".

I'm talking about those who routinely harm and steal from people...especially as a way of life.
I believe SOME of those people if not a majority of them, are compelled to do this at a certain point and need some sort of correction to curtail their behavior.

BTW....I see you are knowledgeable about brother Billy Carson.
I listen to him from time to time.

Lol...however what do you know about brother 19 Keys???

Troy

This exchange between frankster and myself is a TASTE of those old school "multiple page" discussions I used to watch and engage in back in the day when message boards were more popular with brothers from the Nation of Islam and Hebrew Israelites and others deep into various forms of knowledge.

In one thread we could argue about ONE WORD for an entire week before moving on in the SAME conversation which would be on-going for weeks it not months.....40 and 50 pages in one thread, lol.

Troy · April 30, 2023

4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

This exchange between frankster and myself is a TASTE of those old school "multiple page" discussions

You know that can come back... I approving a lot more accounts now -- but I can see it being a little intimidating to jump in. So people just read, but we will see

@frankster I'd never heard of Billy Carson until you posted that video. He is "out there" with stories of aliens modifying ancient hominids to work as slaves mining Africa for minerals. He says these stories are "written in stone."

Clearly, ancient Africans had advanced technology. People like John Anthony West, theorize that the Sphinx was built 7 thousand years before many Egyptologists previously believed.

Obviously, what we are taught about human history does not make sense if the pyramids were built 10,000 years ago -- before Europeans emerged from caves! When you couple this with the celestial knowledge of the Dogon who were aware of Sirius B. It is not just history that does not make sense -- nothing does

This draws me back to the topic of religion versus spirituality.

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Mad crossroad No rulles in traffic India live streaming

Lion saves a baby calf from another lion attack

A Lioness Adopts a baby antelope. A short documentary that will open your eyes.

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