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@Chevdove
 

The conflict in Sudan is not a proxy war between the U.S. and Russia. It is violent battle between two men who were once friends. However, both men fear the prospect of free elections in Sudan.


Abdel Fattah Abdelrahman al-Burhan is the Sudanese army general who has ruled Sudan since Omar al-Bashir was overthrown in a series of revolutionary protests in 2019. In August of that year, Burhan became head of the Sovereign Council and de facto ruler of Sudan. The Council was comprised of civilian and military leaders that were supposed to oversee a transition towards elections, according to a news report from Al Jazeera.

But Burhan, who dissolved Council just two years later, is now opposed by his deputy, General Mohamed Hamdan Dagalo, who heads the paramilitary Rapid Support Forces. Neither man wants free elections in Sudan. Dagalo, also known as Hemedti, was once an enforcer for Bashir, an Islamist
 and was considered a warlord.

 

Burhan elicited help from Arab Gulf States to oust him and enjoyed good relations those nations. He even hosted Egypt’s president in Khartoum.


The RDF are successors to the Janjaweed, the vicious bastards who massacred men and raped scores of women in Darfur. To help him take over Sudan, Dagalo also gets help from Gulf States and has turned to Russia’s Wagner Group who have been busily slaughtering Ukrainian civilians.

But Warner Group also protects the ruler of the Central African Republic which supplies Russia with mined gold to pay for its invasion of Ukraine. Dagalo claims Wagner Group has departed Sudan.

Sudan seems complicated. But it is not. It is simply a case of a vile Black man (Dagalo) who is perfectly willing to kill his own people for power, prestige and probably an expensive car or two. If you notice, a whole lot of White people have fled Sudan. Proof that Abdel Fattah Abdelrahman al-Burhan at least ran a stable state so well that foreigners had little problem working and living there.

What’s going to happen? Who knows? But the U.S. will not become ostensibly involved in this civil war owing to lingering memories of what happened in Libya when Obama was President. And there is little the average Black man in the U.S. can do, despite all the fulminating by some loudmouths who never knew about Wagner Group until I mentioned them.

The situation is a damn shame: https://www.bbc.com/news/topics/cq23pdgvgm8t/sudan

To get a good handle on Sudan, one will have to check several news Websites, policy groups and think tanks.

Here's one:

https://www.crisisgroup.org/

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3 hours ago, Stefan said:

@Chevdove
 

The conflict in Sudan is not a proxy war between the U.S. and Russia.

I think it is a Proxy war between the US and Russia.

 

3 hours ago, Stefan said:

 

 

It is violent battle between two men who were once friends. However, both men fear the prospect of free elections in Sudan.

No they were never friends....one was used to contain or off set the other

Dagalo was used to contain al-Burhan

 

3 hours ago, Stefan said:

 

  • Abdel Fattah Abdelrahman al-Burhan is the Sudanese army general who has ruled Sudan since Omar al-Bashir was overthrown in a series of revolutionary protests in 2019. In August of that year, Burhan became head of the Sovereign Council and de facto ruler of Sudan. The Council was comprised of civilian and military leaders that were supposed to oversee a transition towards elections, according to a news report from Al Jazeera.

It was al-Burhan job to secure a peaceful transition to civilian rule.....instead he plotted with Dagalo to retain power.

Now Dagalo had in the past shown himself to be willing to betray his Superiors.....Why did al-Burhan think history would not repeat is beyond me?

 

3 hours ago, Stefan said:

But Burhan, who dissolved Council just two years later, is now opposed by his deputy, General Mohamed Hamdan Dagalo, who heads the paramilitary Rapid Support Forces. Neither man wants free elections in Sudan. Dagalo, also known as Hemedti, was once an enforcer for Bashir, an Islamist and was considered a warlord.

True

 

3 hours ago, Stefan said:

Burhan elicited help from Arab Gulf States to oust him and enjoyed good relations those nations. He even hosted Egypt’s president in Khartoum.


The RDF are successors to the Janjaweed, the vicious bastards who massacred men and raped scores of women in Darfur. To help him take over Sudan, Dagalo also gets help from Gulf States and has turned to Russia’s Wagner Group who have been busily slaughtering Ukrainian civilians.

 

Yes the RSF are being support by Russia......Wagner Group

The SAF are being supported by Egypt a vassal states of  the........US

As the Gulf States hedges with a Straddle approach..

Depending on which general wins this so called civil war will give their backer access to minerals and possible a base.....hence war by proxy

The SAF will win if one or both Arabia and Egypt send in troops....if not RSF will win as their forces are already battle hardened.

 

 

3 hours ago, Stefan said:

But Warner Group also protects the ruler of the Central African Republic which supplies Russia with mined gold to pay for its invasion of Ukraine. Dagalo claims Wagner Group has departed Sudan.

We know the first victim in all wars is usually the ....Truth

 

 

3 hours ago, Stefan said:

Sudan seems complicated. But it is not. It is simply a case of a vile Black man (Dagalo) who is perfectly willing to kill his own people for power, prestige and probably an expensive car or two. If you notice, a whole lot of White people have fled Sudan. Proof that Abdel Fattah Abdelrahman al-Burhan at least ran a stable state so well that foreigners had little problem working and living there.

They are both despicable human beings.....When Dagalo was killing and raping it was with the knowledge and most likely approval of  al-Burhan.

As the people he was killing was not Muslim or Arabized Africans....but mostly Christians and Traditional and Cultural Indigenous Animist.

 

3 hours ago, Stefan said:

What’s going to happen? Who knows? But the U.S. will not become ostensibly involved in this civil war owing to lingering memories of what happened in Libya when Obama was President. And there is little the average Black man in the U.S. can do, despite all the fulminating by some loudmouths who never knew about Wagner Group until I mentioned them.

The war will continue until.....Black Africans step in - AU

None of the foreign powers want peace....They want Victory which means - Gold or other minerals.

 

3 hours ago, Stefan said:

The situation is a damn shame: https://www.bbc.com/news/topics/cq23pdgvgm8t/sudan

To get a good handle on Sudan, one will have to check several news Websites, policy groups and think tanks.

Here's one:

https://www.crisisgroup.org/

Great Links will check out later

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@frankster

Post links proving your points. All news forum posters elsewhere post links to prove their contentions. Neither are you in Sudan, nor do you have any inside information as part of the warring factions. So when you claim the two men were not friends, you need to prove it. Or you're just talking nonsense, which so many on this discussion group always do. 

Black Africans will not step in during the conflict in Sudan. They simply are unable to. Do you even understand the geography? Sudan and South Sudan are NORTH of the Sahara Desert. And no Black African nation possesses reliable airborne divisions to make the hop over that hot sand. That's the reason Black African nations sat on their haunches and never made any move to rescue Blacks being held as slaves in Libya soon after Moammar Gaddafi was overthrown in 2011.

I remember all the nonsense about Nigeria and South Africa supposedly coming to the rescue of those enslaved Blacks at that time. It would have been a huge undertaking and a military coalition would have been needed. Naval ships would have had to have been docked offshore Libya to assist with the evacuation of slaves. Because no Black African nation can force march a mechanized military force through the Sahara. Look at a map!

Black African nations did not do anything then and they will not do anything now. You are dreaming if you think otherwise. The reason why frontline African states endeavored to aid the African National Congress in its war of liberation against the Afrikaaners is because they did not have a huge natural obstacle to overcome. The Sahara Desert is not frigging joke. 

And friendship between the two generals does not mean they were sharing cocktails or going to clubs together. Black Americans are ignorant because they see everything through their eyes and only their experiences. Which is why we pay an inordinate amount of attention to celebrities and NBA playoff games. How quickly did many Blacks eat up the garbage about getting rich through Cryptocurrency?

Burhan and Hemedti cooperated as they planned to divvy up the riches of Sudan, with each other and that was the extent of their friendship. https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2023/5/16/sudan-to-break-the-cycle-of-violence-end-the-kleptocracy

Depending upon where one derives their news, they were friends/rivals who were always suspicious of each other. But Hemedti was much worse than Burhan. You have no information and no one else on this discussion group has any either. They just make chit up and hope it flies. But they've been wrong so many times it's comical. 

But you notice they NEVER post any links? I do, which is proof that I have no fear of clowns.

Here's proof the viciousness of Hemedti. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/apr/20/sudan-outsider-hemedti-mohamed-hamdan-dagalo-leader-militia-army-war-conflict

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7 hours ago, Stefan said:

Or you're just talking nonsense, which so many on this discussion group always do. 

Black Americans are ignorant because they see everything through their eyes and only their experiences. Which is why we pay an inordinate amount of attention to celebrities and NBA playoff games. How quickly did many Blacks eat up the garbage about getting rich through Cryptocurrency?

You have no information and no one else on this discussion group has any either. They just make chit up and hope it flies. But they've been wrong so many times it's comical. 

But you notice they NEVER post any links? I do, which is proof that I have no fear of clowns.

@Stefan, clearly, the posters here are not meeting your standards of journalism.   So, I'm slightly curious to know what brings you back to this particular discussion forum.😎

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46 minutes ago, Troy said:

What bring you back to these forums?  I enjoy reading all of y'alls posts.

Same here.  I enjoy reading the lively discussions with my folks. 

 

It doesn't matter whether or not we agree or disagree, the dialog is most important. 

 

Of course, I can find a certain amount of humor in everything.😎

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10 hours ago, Stefan said:

@frankster

Post links proving your points. All news forum posters elsewhere post links to prove their contentions. Neither are you in Sudan, nor do you have any inside information as part of the warring factions. So when you claim the two men were not friends, you need to prove it. Or you're just talking nonsense, which so many on this discussion group always do. 

 

True....I am not in Sudan nor do I have inside Info on the particular situation in Sudan

What I do Have is insight based on experience of past similar events.....Now it could be totally of base - but I think not.

 

"With their once uneasy alliance in tatters,"

https://www.reuters.com/world/africa/sudans-army-chief-warlord-feud-that-risks-civil-war-2023-04-19/

 

 

Omar al-Bashir, came to rely on Hemedti and the RSF as a counterweight to the regular armed forces, .......

Sudanese politics has always been dominated by an elite largely drawn from the ethnic groups based around Khartoum and the River Nile.

Hemedti comes from Darfur, and the Sudanese elite often talk about him and his soldiers in pejorative terms, as "country bumpkins" unfit to rule the state.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-65297714

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

Black Africans will not step in during the conflict in Sudan. They simply are unable to.

They did it in the recent past....

The international community is failing in its responsibility to protect the inhabitants of Darfur, many of whom are still dying or face indefinite displacement from their homes. New thinking and bold action are urgently needed. The consensus to support a rough doubling of the African Union (AU) force to 7,731 troops by the end of September 2005 under the existing mandate is an inadequate response to the crisis. The mandate must be strengthened to prioritise civilian protection, and a force level of at least 12,000 to 15,000 is needed urgently now, not in nearly a year as currently envisaged.

https://www.crisisgroup.org/africa/horn-africa/sudan/aus-mission-darfur-bridging-gaps

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

Do you even understand the geography? Sudan and South Sudan are NORTH of the Sahara Desert. And no Black African nation possesses reliable airborne divisions to make the hop over that hot sand.

I do not need to....technology and people since before the dawn of human civilizations has traverse the Sahara for trade and war.

I think you gravely underestimate the abilities of Black Africans.

 

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

That's the reason Black African nations sat on their haunches and never made any move to rescue Blacks being held as slaves in Libya soon after Moammar Gaddafi was overthrown in 2011.

Africans leaders could not help Gaddafi under threat from the US....The same is true today as it regards Africans Immigrants in Libya

 

The crux of the disagreement between the AU and NATO occurred when the Ad Hoc Committee met in Noakchoutt on 19 March, hosted by President Aziz. Mauritania provided a plane to fly to Tripoli the following day, but that was the day on which the no fly zone came into effect. The Panel members received a curt message from the U.S. and the UN saying that, should they proceed with their visit, their security could not be guaranteed. The communiqué published at the end of the meeting reflected the disappointment and anger of the participants for not having been allowed to travel to an African country for a peace mission.

https://sites.tufts.edu/reinventingpeace/2012/12/19/the-african-union-and-the-libya-conflict-of-2011/

 

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:


I remember all the nonsense about Nigeria and South Africa supposedly coming to the rescue of those enslaved Blacks at that time. It would have been a huge undertaking and a military coalition would have been needed. Naval ships would have had to have been docked offshore Libya to assist with the evacuation of slaves. Because no Black African nation can force march a mechanized military force through the Sahara. Look at a map!

 

Provide the Links to this Nigeria and South Africa rescue  effort of black Africans  from Libya.....

Yes  I know of Black Africans being sold there openly....

Europeans and Americans are being sold into Slavery today.....Human or Sex Trafficking

Slavery is still a global phenomenon

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

Black African nations did not do anything then and they will not do anything now. You are dreaming if you think otherwise. The reason why frontline African states endeavored to aid the African National Congress in its war of liberation against the Afrikaaners is because they did not have a huge natural obstacle to overcome. The Sahara Desert is not frigging joke.

Natural Obstacles are not barriers to cooperation.....Interventions by outside forces and fear and disunity among the faithful.

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

And friendship between the two generals does not mean they were sharing cocktails or going to clubs together.

There is no friendship among general and or criminals.....only shared Interests.

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

Black Americans are ignorant because they see everything through their eyes and only their experiences. Which is why we pay an inordinate amount of attention to celebrities and NBA playoff games. How quickly did many Blacks eat up the garbage about getting rich through Cryptocurrency?

Our Heros prove that to be a lie....From Ali to Martin To Malcolm

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

Burhan and Hemedti cooperated as they planned to divvy up the riches of Sudan, with each other and that was the extent of their friendship. https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2023/5/16/sudan-to-break-the-cycle-of-violence-end-the-kleptocracy

 

That's like saying Communist Russia and Capitalist American were friends during world war II.....

No they were not friends but  allies because they shared a common interest - Defeat  Fascist Nazi Germany.

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

Depending upon where one derives their news, they were friends/rivals who were always suspicious of each other. But Hemedti was much worse than Burhan. You have no information and no one else on this discussion group has any either. They just make chit up and hope it flies. But they've been wrong so many times it's comical. 

Maybe my definition of friendship is different from yours.....Rivals they were and are.

They are only allies when their interests align....they then form an Accord and act in Concert - Mutually Beneficial

 

10 hours ago, Stefan said:

But you notice they NEVER post any links? I do, which is proof that I have no fear of clowns.

Here's proof the viciousness of Hemedti. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/apr/20/sudan-outsider-hemedti-mohamed-hamdan-dagalo-leader-militia-army-war-conflict

I saw no need to post links at the time....since you demanded it I have.

They both committed Genocide in Darfur which is one of the reasons they fear a Civilian Government - Both are guilty of War Crimes

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On 5/23/2023 at 2:12 PM, Stefan said:

Burhan elicited help from Arab Gulf States to oust him and enjoyed good relations those nations. He even hosted Egypt’s president in Khartoum.

 

Ah! @Stefan Thank you. 

 

On 5/23/2023 at 2:12 PM, Stefan said:

To help him take over Sudan, Dagalo also gets help from Gulf States and has turned to Russia’s Wagner Group who have been busily slaughtering Ukrainian civilians.

 

So it seems that both of them turned to the Arab gulf states for help! 

 

On 5/23/2023 at 2:12 PM, Stefan said:

But the U.S. will not become ostensibly involved in this civil war owing to lingering memories of what happened in Libya when Obama was President.

 

Maybe not, but at any rate, they may be even if they don't want to be. 

 

 

On 5/24/2023 at 2:23 AM, Stefan said:

Black Africans will not step in during the conflict in Sudan. They simply are unable to. Do you even understand the geography? Sudan and South Sudan are NORTH of the Sahara Desert. And no Black African nation possesses reliable airborne divisions to make the hop over that hot sand. That's the reason Black African nations sat on their haunches and never made any move to rescue Blacks being held as slaves in Libya soon after Moammar Gaddafi was overthrown in 2011.

 

 

Well, after doing more research and trying to understand better, I can definitely understand what you say about the geographical aspect. I recently came to understand that during one of the World Wars, one faction attempted to march their forces through the desert from the region near Alexandria in hopes of reaching the nile and failed. 

 

On 5/24/2023 at 2:23 AM, Stefan said:

Black African nations did not do anything then and they will not do anything now. You are dreaming if you think otherwise.

 

I believe that the AU has been involved. I think that they are being pressed. However, I don't think the intentions are good to involve them though. 

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On 5/24/2023 at 2:23 AM, Stefan said:

Which is why we pay an inordinate amount of attention to celebrities and NBA playoff games. How quickly did many Blacks eat up the garbage about getting rich through Cryptocurrency?

 

LOL! @Stefan Wait-a-minute. Can you read between the lines? I don't believe that any other people have been so watched as the slaves during American slavery times when they had to shout in Church to show the Master that they were preaching and conforming to the 'obey you master' hype to avoid being killed. Whether some of us jump off too deeply in our obssession with celebrities and the NBA or not, there is a reason why they both become a vital aspect of being invited to the White House! This is part of our culture. 

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I am not a Slave. NBA Playoffs are not an example of Black culture. It’s a part of Black Entertainment or Black Escapism. Just like action movies are.

If you want to believe this? Go right ahead. There was a dude who called himself Nels on here who swore committing crimes is part of Black Culture, too. And he even provided spurious FBI crime stats to prove it. I do not believe that Black people, men or women, are criminally minded. Nels and another guy named Greg do.

I would rather stand with this man who writes OpEds for The Grio:
 

https://thegrio.com/2023/05/26/jordan-neelys-death-reminds-us-of-the-lynching-atmosphere-that-still-exists-for-black-people/

I don't necessarily agree with everything he wrote. But there is little doubt White Supremacy has never gone away even though some on here claimed it no longer exists.
 

I post opinions based on facts. When I was a News Reporter, I could never write stories without proving my contentions. So, I eventually created a huge source list. I just do not make chit up. I became so adept at my profession, I became a Senior News Editor. And then a Writing Teacher.

But I still never made up stuff and if called upon to prove my position, I always had multiple sources to back me up. And that seems to piss off a lot people who cannot do the same. 



 

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1 hour ago, Stefan said:

I am not a Slave. NBA Playoffs are not an example of Black culture. It’s a part of Black Entertainment or Black Escapism. Just like action movies are.

 

That's your opinion @Stefan

I say it is.

Black entertainment in the form of singing the blues may not have become part of Blak culture by choice but that form of entertainment became associated with Black culture just as certain sports.

 

 

 

 

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