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Strip Club Queens Atlanta - Reality TV - What Do You Think?


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Troy

Lol.....man what's wrong with you.

Posting all that - what Archie Bunker would call "pornagrafitti"

 


But personally, I don't have a problem with programs that promote and celebrate Black sexuality as long as it's NORMAL HEALTHY sexuality (not homosexuality, pedophilia, incest, rape, ect....)

In a culture where White women have long been considered the epitome of feminine beauty, I can't stress enough the need for Black women to promote their sexuality in a POSITIVE way.
 


I'm sure SOME people will consider this exploitation.
It really all depends on who the producers of the show are.

What I mean is............
If the producers are BLACK MEN, they will be called exploiters who are disrespecting Black women.
But if the producers are WHITE GUYS in t-shirts and glasses then they'll probably get praise and applause for promoting the "untapped treasures" of Black female sensuality.

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Pioneer something tells me this new reality TV program is not, using your words, a positive, celebration of normal or healthy expression of Black sexuality.

 

I don't think the producers (Black or white) are disrespecting or exploiting these women.  I'm sure the women are doing it VERY willingly, are being paid to do it and are even enjoying the experience and fame (notoriety).

 

NYC Public Schools ban Youtube.  I originally thought it was a dumb practice.  But now I understand...

 

I dislike so called "reality TV", so I have a strong bias against this show from jump street.  The nature of the subject does not help. 

 

I also don't think everything needs to be in TV... 

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You hit the nail on the head when you called it "so called reality" tv.

When people bring that up I ask them WHO'S reality are they portraying on these shows?

The cast on most of these shows are attractive young people who seem to never work but have plenty of money to jack-off at malls and parties every night and they constantly get drunk and fight eachother but rarely do time in jail or prison.

How many of the characters are unemployed?
How many have cancer or AIDS?
How many are victims of incest?
How many are hardcore racist and belong to the Ku Klux Klan?

These things are also part of reality but they don't make it to nework television.

Rather than truly portraying a reality the public can relate to, it seems like the objective is social engineering by using ART to SHAPE REALITY.

I'm meeting more and more normal well adjusted people who tell me straight up that they don't even HAVE a television set anymore and don't want one because of the garbage constantly flooding the airwaves.

They say their computer allows them more control over the information and entertainment that flows into their home and it certainly makes sense.

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These women are professional strippers, plying their trade, capitalizing off their voluptuous bodies, finding their niche in the reality TV format. Good for them. (A girl's gotta do, what a girl's gotta do.)
 
The problem arises when there are no alternative programs featuring black women as more  positive role models. And I don't mean Kerry Washington giving POTUS a hard-on  in "Scandal".
 
Black anchor newswomen are the only sistas I'm familiar with who represent positive images. But that's because I mostly watch true crime documentaries where any episodes about black women deal with them either kiliing or being killed by their mates. 
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Cynique THAT is the crux of the problem as programing for show like Strip Club Queen Atlanta, other often more positive programing is crowded out. 

 

And given the name you know there will be Strip Club Queens New York and others if the Atlanta version is successful.

 

Limited resources go toward what is easiest and makes the most money.  This is what is killing journalism, music and books. 

 

Pioneer, I'm not about to ditch my TV but I definitely would not be paying for cable.  I pay for it now 'cause the rest of the family would revolt if I did not.  I too watch more youtube that cable programming.

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These women are professional strippers, plying their trade, capitalizing off their voluptuous bodies, finding their niche in the reality TV format. Good for them. (A girl's gotta do, what a girl's gotta do.)

Believe it or not (and I'm sure you can) I actually agree with this statement.

 

 

And the fact that you both say we need other programs that are MORE positive...as opposed to saying we need positive programs which would have insinuated that women displaying their abilities for sexual tititlation weren't positive....actually neutralized the argument I was prepared to make. 

So I leave you in peace.....one piece...lol.

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I can't moralize about stripping. Partly because I am uncomfortable judging others. I have spoken to two strippers in a strip club. Neither conversation was initiated by me. I used to live with a stripper. I think of is human drama played out in a strip club. I remember when Superfly the movie came out there was a similar debate. It's exploitation your glorifying hustling. As you know Curtis Mayfield did the soundtrack. Which is a brilliant piece of music but it also has a message and tells a story. He said it is a story about redemption.

I would watch it. The trailer I saw was about six minutes long and had 30 seconds of stripping. I remember this performance artist Penny Arcade (we are friends). Saying that prostitution and stripping is they only way outside of marriage to raise some real capital. I don't think that statement is totally true. Yet it is basically TRUE. I women's worth is a function of her attractiveness.

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Del I want to see positive programming.  I'm not alone either.

 

This is not to say I'm against strip clubs or even pornography (involving consenting adults).  I just don't think either should be marketed to children or involve children the way it is today.

 

The other problem is that given the emphasis on this type of programing fewer resources go to the positive TV programs. 

 

After Superfly came out there was a great deal of criticism about the film.  When people say a film like Superfly was a story about redemption they are trying to delude themselves or you.

 

The film gloried the antisocial lifestyle, in much the same why this TV show glorifies stripping, making it more acceptable to young women - indeed even a desirable alternative, the way drug dealing and pimping was depicted to young men generation prior.  We know the end of that story.

 

You don't have to "judge" others Del, but you can critique their behavior.  Our biggest problem is that we don't do this very much anymore.... and garbage like this TV program proliferates.

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You could say that Sweetback started Blaxpoitation, or it is a slave narrative. I would almost agree with you about the delusional part. Except the quote is coming from Curtis Mayfield. Who is one if the most Conscious Musicians at a time when there ead a message in the music. And musician and performers weren't just singing it they were standing up. Maybe I am romanticizing Curtis and the power of the music.

The kids issue no argument whatsoever.

I think definition wise judging and critiquing are differences of degree not kind.

Actually Troy you and I may have seen different films. I recall him being in jail. And dealing with crooked cops paying lawyers to get out of the game.

There are two other points, who seels more Eric Jerome Dickey or Cornel West. Which categories of books sell a lot and which don't sell. I have never run a bookstore bit I think we all know the answer to that question. Sex sells even in books.

I think the show is actually fascinating from several points of view. I guess I see them as Human. The clip I saw the white chick has a drinking problem. It's a reverse situation where the white chick is in the minority. And if memory is correct, the strippers are majority dark skin. No you could argue this the other way around.

I have only seen the preview, bit what I noticed is that out of six minutes there was maybe 30 seconds of stripping. Does that ratio hold true for the series.

Here's. A news flash tv has always been mostly crap, lowest common denominator. I used to love the Twilight Zone. I would consider this quality tv. Rod Serling said something very interesting. He said that there was always pressure from the sponsors not to tell really gripping stories because this got in the way of the bunny selling toilet paper. I reckon you can't name five shows that were quality tv on Commercial tv. One more restriction the show has to last more than one season. You can even pick which 5 years.

Sarurday morning cartoons pretty much a writeoff. Let's see there was Good Times, Archie Bunker, Sanford and Son, The Love Boat. Probably you'll have to pick variety shows or Music shows: Ed Sullivan, Soul Train, Hee Haw. Positively Black yep was on in the dead zone of Sunday Afternoon. Playhouse 90 not certain if it was a series.

You can't count the Richard Pryor show it was even a full series it was like 6 episodes.

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Del I actually could not watch the entire 6 minute clip.  I stopped after it was revealed one of the strippers had a pet pig.  So I'm in less of a position than you to judge or critic the series than you are.  That said I know shit when I smell it -- immediately.  I don't need to see it or touch it.

 

Curtis may have been speaking about his music, which I agree was excellent.  Hayfield is one of my favorite artists.  In any event the star of film

 Ryan Oneil I think (too lazy to look it up right now), expressed his sorrow for participating in the film -- acknowledging that it was a harmful film.  Personally I remember very little of the film's details, but don't recall anything redeeming coming from it.

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That's interesting because there's no commentary from Rysn O'Neil. O think Superfly is about someone who decides to change his only way of life.

Yeah I just don't have that strong a filter to judge someone. A pig is apparently clean,highly intelligent and it has an hour long orgasm. The characters struck me as human. In a way that most reality shows I have seen or not. I also think they are not self conscious. I feel as though they see honest. I don't get that they ate trying to massage their image. Which is I dunno, a bit ironic because they see strippers.

I may watch it and tell you what I think

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What I meant to post was that there was no commentary from Ryan O'Neil on the DVD extras.

Troy - I have noticed in my last fw post that you attribute comments to me that are not mine. And then don't respond to direct questions. Are you tired or busy?

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Regarding Ryan O'Neil, OK.  But I'm not sure why you mentioned that.  I would image they would exclude much if not all of the controversy surrounding the film on the DVD.  Besides I never suggested it was on the DVD.  I heard a radio conversation just this past Sunday when Bob Law (a popular Black radio personality and activist) said the actor who played Superfly regretted the role he played.

 

Regarding not answering a direct question; that is very possible I missed it.  If there is a specific question you like me to answer ask it again here and I'll answer it.

 

As far as attributing comments to you that you did not make.  I find that unlikely.  While anything is possible I'm pretty sure I did not do that.  If you can find a single example I'd appreciate it.

 

Thanks 

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I can't speak on this particular show and it's content but....

I too want more positive programming and I think stripping and other sex shows CAN be positive depending on how they are produced and presented.

Black girls seeing other Black females with faces that look like theirs and bodies shaped like theirs being adored by men can be a VERY good thing for thier self esteem as opposed to being constantly called ugly, unwanted and abandoned.

Explicit sexual program being seen as negative is part of what I consider the "old world" system of things.
If I ran a public education system not only would I teach sex education but I would include videos that many would probably be considered x-rated
I'd teach young people how to actually have sex (lol....I'm still learning things myself) and how to do things safely instead of the trial-n-error method most go through by the time they reach adulthood.

But this is teaching for a NEW WORLD.

As surely as the old world was built on lies and violence.
The new world coming in will be built on truth and love (sex being but one expression of it.....)


 

 


And now for a word on those Blaxploitation flicks, lol.

Whether it's......

BLACK CEASAR
SUPER FLY
or one of my personal favorites...THREE THE HARD WAY

The thing I liked about these movies was that Black men were always the PROTAGONIST.
They were almost always the good guys who kicked ass and got money and got the women in the end.

Unlike most of the movies in Hollywood today where Black men have gone back to playing the role of fools, petty street hustlers, thieves, rapists, illiterate sidekicks who get smacked around and almost never get any coochie.

That's one of the reasons I enjoyed Django (the "D" is silent) Unchained so much.
The violence was so extreme it was comical but atleast you had a Black man kicking ass and getting his woman at the end, when was the last time Hollywood featured that?


 

The Black men were MEN in those movies back then.

 

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Troy I reckon that you can't name 5 shows on commercial tv that had more than one season. In any 5 year period. TV has always been crap.

Pioneer - I'll. Hive it a shot. Tap; Colour Purple(girl gets girl, hadn't seen it though), White Nights; Uptown Saturday Night, Piece of the Action, let's do ir again, Claudine; Heavy Metal, Brother from another Planet; Mo Better Blues.

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Jeeze!  Do you guys wear mittens when you type, or are you in a hurry or posting from your iPhones???

 

The name of the actor who played Superfly was RON O'Neal, not Ryan.  The character he played in the movie was a cocaine dealer who made a final big score that he hoped would make him rich and liberate him from "the life". 

 

Richard Roundtree was the consummate cool black dude in his role as a private eye in the original "Shaft".  Ex-football players Jim Brown and Fred Williamson also starred in these type of roles. "Cotton Comes to Harlem" was a comedic treatment of blaxploitation directed by Ozzie Davis and  starring Raymond St. Jaques and Godfrey Cambridge. 

 

The adventures of feisty, gun-toting female cops  were also the subject of  blaxpoitation flicks.  Pam Grier was the queen of the genre. 

 

Sidney Poitier's role in "Raisin in The Sun"  showcased a new type of black hero, leadind to the "large-and-in-charge" type he played in "In the Heat of the Night". Paul Winfield in "Sounder" and James Earl Jones in "The Great White Hope" also played strong black men.

 

TV series like "Good Times, "Sanford and Son", "The Jeffersons", and of course, "The Cosby Show" had pretty long runs.  5 years is a long time for any TV show to last. 

 

I wouldn't consider these reality show strippers as women the average young black girl could identiify with.  These scantily-clad, curvaceous, buxom,  golden beauties, skillfully made-up  and well-coiffed in long silky hair extensions  are female caricatures whose sole function is to entertain men. 

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Okay Cynique I can't type, bit at least my grammar is bad and I don't use spell check. Okay you have four shows and you want to use George Jefferson, Lsmont Sanford, and JJ as black role models.

Ned Kelly was interviewed after he fid Roots. He said there are no positive black male role models. He also said there aren't any positive white male role models. You may have assumed I was talking about Black shows I meant all shows. It's pretty hard to come up with 5 commercial tv shows that were quality. In any 5 consecutive years.

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Delano, I have 2 words for you. "proof read". 

 

You didn't say anything about "role models", during the course of a discussion about Blacks on TV. But, as a matter, of fact,  George Jefferson was a successful black businessman who had "moved on up to a deluxe apartment in the sky." He even had a maid.   The father, James, played by John Amos in "Good Times" was specifically written into this series to show a strong black father figure.  Lemont Sanford  was a honest, hard-working guy who was a good, patient son to his irascible father, Fred, played brilliantly by comedic genius Redd Foxx.

 

TV shows and movies could be considered examples of "art imitating life" and maybe that's why there are so few good role models.  ;)

 

 

BTW, here is my post that Delano is responding  to.

 

"The name of the actor who played Superfly was RON O'Neal, not Ryan. The character he played in the movie was a cocaine dealer who made a final big score that he hoped would make him rich and liberate him from "the life".

 

Richard Roundtree was the consummate cool black dude in his role as a private eye in the original "Shaft". Ex-football players Jim Brown and Fred Williamson also starred in these type of roles. "Cotton Comes to Harlem" was a comedic treatment of blaxploitation directed by Ozzie Davis and starring Raymond St. Jaques and Godfrey Cambridge.

 

The adventures of feisty, gun-toting female cops were also the subject of blaxpoitation flicks. Pam Grier was the queen of the genre.

 

Sidney Poitier's role in "Raisin in The Sun" showcased a new type of black hero, leadind to the "large-and-in-charge" type he played in "In the Heat of the Night". Paul Winfield in "Sounder" and James Earl Jones in "The Great White Hope" also played strong black men.

 

TV series like "Good Times, "Sanford and Son", "The Jeffersons", and of course, "The Cosby Show" had pretty long runs. 5 years is a long time for any TV show to last.

 

I wouldn't consider these reality show strippers as women the average young black girl could identiify with. These scantily-clad, curvaceous, buxom, golden beauties, skillfully made-up and well-coiffed in long silky hair extensions are female caricatures whose sole function is to entertain men."

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Okay if your going to complain about proof reading and spell check, you should nr error free. Also we started talking about images I mentioned role models. I feel the two are somewhat related.

I see your point be a financial successful opinionated bigot is good.

I agree that the father in good times is strong. I remember Dick Gregory saying that the secondary leader of the family in the father's absence is a fool.

Dick Gregory also felt that Lamont was a pretty disrespectful in the series. I hadn't really thought of either of those things. You could argue that the tv shows that you mentioned showed black family trying to do their best.

If you object to role models than I am fine to keep the conversation limited to images. Also I probably have less free time than you and I don't really proof, what I write. I can see your point.

Perhaps I wasn't clear. Can you name 5 tv shows, that had at least two seasons. The tv shows don't have to be on tv for five years. The five just have to be on within the same 5 years. I think I was pretty clear excluding movies since they probably would not be two seasons long.

I would have to disagree with you. I think the way women are portrayed in the media is as an object. I think this has been covered before. Look at newscasters. Older women have fewer roles than older men. The red carpet of award shows is predominantly about the sexual desirability of women. Whereas for men it is about power as sex.

So can you mentioned three can you think of two more series on commercial TV.

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???Where did I say that women were not portrayed as "objects"  in the media?  That's what I meant when I implied that the strippers were "caricatures" whose function is  primarily to represent the eye candy that would appeal to men.

 

I disagree with Dick Gregory's "opinion".  There was a very special, affectionate, father and son bond between Lamonte and Fred Sanford. Yes, "Cotton Comes To Harlem" was based on a book.  "Sanford and Son" was patterned after an English TV series

 

???Where did I say that I objected to role models? Or images?  Why would I???

 

The references I made about movies were in conjunction with the topic of black exploitation films that were being discussed.

 

Can you be more specific when you ask can I think of more commercial TV series???  If you're talking about white ones that ran at least 5 years, there are plenty of them.  I don't know where to start.  "MASH",  "NYPD BLUE",  "CHEERS",  "DYNASTY", "DALLAS",   'MARY TYLER MOORE SHOW', 'FAMILY TIES", "MIAMI VICE",  "BEVERLY HILLS 90210",  'LITTLE HOUSE ON THE PRAIRIE" "IN LIVING COLOR",  "GRAY'S ANATOMY",  "LOST", "CSI" - just to mention a few.  I could come up with more if I continued to wrack my memory. 

 

In regard to proof-reading,  it's hard to figure out what you're trying to say because of  typos and run-on sentences and omitted words. It's just commmon courtesy to make your statements coherent. The "edit" feature at the bottom of the page allows you to go back in and correct your comments after you've posted them and read them over.      

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You may want to check again. I actually wasn't sure about how to spell Ron's name. However I knew who Troy was talking about in his post. If you are going to be a stickler make sure you get it right. Or not. The correct spelling is Lamont.

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I am a stickler for CLARITY.  The reason I was quick to correct the name of the actor who played SuperFly was because Ryan O'Neal is a white actor, - Farrah Fawcett's boyfriend - and star of the lengendary tear-jerker movie - "Love Story".  Ron and Ryan are 2 entirely different names and spelling is not a factor.   

 

I don't expect educated people to just write any ol way and blow off their not being detail-oriented by saying "you knew what I meant".  This is an exact quote of a sentence you wrote yesterday, Delano: "Okay Cynique I can't type bit at least my grammar is bad and I don't use spell check".  This is typical and it's not about anything but carelessness and the assumption that readers will figure out what you mean.  You know better.  I stand corrected on the misspelling of Lamont's name, even if my spelling wouldn't lead to confusion with another actor. 

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 In answer to your question, as to whether I can name  5 TV series that ran for at least 2 seasons at the same time, I would say "No".  Can you name any?  If I did list some, would you know whether or not my responses were accurate?  Finding the answer would require extensive research into the archives of TV programming, - a project you can take on yourself if you're that curious. 

 

As I said before, I mentioned movie titles in response to the open discussion you, me, Troy and Pioneer were having about black exploitation films and strong black male roles.  I didn't list any TV  "specials".   

 

I spelled Lamont's name  wrong twice  because that's how I obviously thought it was spelled. 

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I thought when we got off subject.....the subject of this new strip show....the road we traveled down was featured with Blaxploitation flix.

Now Good Times, Sounder, Claudine and Sanford and Son were good Black movies and television programs but they weren't the stereotypical Black movies of the 70s.

When I think of Blaxploitation I think of:

DOLEMITE!
((waaaay down in the jungle deep))

.....now that's Blaxploitation for your ass.

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JD'S REVENGE!!!!

.....aaaaahhh don't get me started, lol.


I said it before but unfortunately it got no response...............
I don't usually like to be the only one who thinks a particular way or notice a particular thing but I often find myself in that position.

Again, say what you want to but the thing I loved about those flix was that they not only showed real Black LOVE (Black people making love to eachother unapologetically on the big screen), but it showed Black men in the masculine dominant role of good guy who gets the woman.

That's lost on a lot of people and I can't figure out why.

Look at most of the movies spawned from Hollywood these past 30 years and the fool role most of the Black men play in them.
Going to jail
Getting slapped around and arrested.


And often times men who I didn't think had it even IN THEM to sell out.

Like Mos Def playing that retarded ass criminal in that Bruce Willis movie (yeah we're on the internet and I could have looked it up but that would take away from some of the "real feel" of conversing in this setting)

Or Denzel Washington playing a crooked cope in Training Day and dope dealing crime boss in American Gangsta.
I was so disgusted at certain scenes in that movie.....but not at just the scenes themselves but at my boy Denzel Washington's willingness to even put his stamp of approval on them by starring in these movies.

 


I happened to catch one episode of Law and Order on tv the other day and saw even Blair Underwood being slapped against the wall and handcuffed!!!
WTF??????
How is BLAIR UNDERWOOD of all people allowing himself to be chumped on tv?


 

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  • 6 years later...
Guest Shy money

Its actually help are black sisters survive and feed home and fullfill there needs to avoid struggleing without strippering some black women wouldn't be able to feed there children and pay fir college they strip cos there piss poir

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Man, looks like Shy dug deeeeep for this one.....lol.


I personally have NO PROBLEM with prostitution (male or female) or people stripping (male or female) for a living or just for fun.....AS LONG AS THEY ARE ADULTS AND AREN'T BEING FORCED.

My  morality isn't tied to sexuality or sexual behavior EXCEPT when it come to rape or pedophilia because it's against people's will...therefore is an act of violence.



You know.......
Maybe it's just the "black conservative" in me....lol.
But now a days with so many shows that seem to be promoting Black men in "drag"; I'm just glad to see a show with REAL BLACK WOMEN getting naked.

T be honest when I first saw the title of this thread I thought if may have been about men dressing up as women and then stripping.

HBO
TLC
VH1
.....and other networks have began an all out campaign of parading as many men of color in "drag" as they can. Every week there's a new show coming out featuring Ru Paul or Billy Porter snapping and switching and I though this was just another one.
Until I looked at the date when the thread was started, lol.

Not that I think dressing in drag is immoral, as I said my morals aren't tied to sexuality except for a couple categories.
But I DO see an agenda to cause sexual confusion among AfroAmericans.

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@Pioneer1, it continues to escape me why do you think this is a conspiracy against African Americans.  Perhaps it is because I have never watched one and probably never will.  But it seems to me that a white program, staring mostly white people would impact white people...  How can this programming cause "...cause sexual confusion among AfroAmericans," when we don't even watch this stuff?

 

PLUS one's sexual orientation is not determined by a TV program.  Let me put it this way: how many more times would you, @Pioneer1 have to watch men in drag, on TV, for you to let another dude climax in your mouth?

 

 

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Troy

Man...what in the world.

Your point was made BEFORE that rather graphic hypothetical. ((shakes head))


For one thing, it doesn't matter if Black people WEREN'T watching drag-queen shows before. Once Ru Paul and other AfroAmericans begin to star on the show MORE AfroAmericans will begin to watch it because it's human nature for people to want to see themselves on television and in the movies.

Secondly, just like drug, cigarettes, and junk food....it doesn't matter how many Caucasians engage in these vices, they don't affect them like they effect us because our natures are different.

Caucasians drink more alcohol than Native Americans yet their communities aren't NEARLY as devastated by alcoholism and it's by-products like Native American communities are.
Why?
Beause out nature is different than theirs.

A rattle snake can bite a pig and not only will it NOT kill the pig but the pig can actually turn around and eat the snake whole!
YOU can't do that....because your nature is different.

You can't look at Caucasians doing something and assume YOU can do the same thing and it will affect you the same because what may be good for THEM to engage in may be harmful for US.

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The graphic point was made to emphasize the fact  mthe watching Rupaul does not turn heterosexual Black men into homosexuals. 

 

But you still don't agree. 

 

So now you say that white people natures are different and therefore less susceptible to being converted into a homosexual than a Black person who watches drag queens on TV. Do i understand you correctly.

 

I don't know if whites drink more than native Americans or not, but acholism is often a function of other factors like poverty. I'm sure the consequences of genocide is a factor too.

 

 

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Troy

 

So now you say that white people natures are different and therefore less susceptible to being converted into a homosexual than a Black person who watches drag queens on TV. Do i understand you correctly.


Yes.
Generally speaking, they tend to have stronger intellects.

Most of the time when a Caucasian does something they know EXACTLY what they're doing and why they're doing it. They have a purpose.
Too often when a Black person does something they do it because they see Caucasians doing it and that's the only reason.

Getting tattoos is a good example.

Caucasians know exactly why THEY get tattoos, most Black folks don't...except it being "in style".



Watching Ru Paul may not turn heterosexual Black MEN into homosexuals but what about the young impressionable AfroAmerican BOYS who are watching him on television switching and snapping and acting flamboyantly feminine (more feminine than even women act) ?

Children learn how to act in society by watching the adults....especially adults who look like them.
If little Black boys turn on the television and HALF of the Black men they see are wearing dresses, switching and snapping; and the women on the show.....instead of finding a man who behaves like that disgusting....are shown hugging them and praising them and delighting in their company  -many of these boys will grow up wanting to be like that!

They may not be homosexual, but they will ACT feminine and flamboyant for attention and fame.

Television shows aren't called PROGRAMMING for nothing, there's an agenda going on!

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