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FOOD FOR THOUGHT


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CYNIQUE SAYS:

This recent exchange that follows may have gotten lost on the thread invaded by the relentless postings of the serial poster, sara. I thought it was an interesting conversation that deserved its own thread.

 

PIONEER SAID:

"Nearly all diseases afflicting humanity are man-made either directly or indirectly from not living by attempting to defy and go against nature.

Infact, what we called "Western Civilization" has been a major contributor to the suffering of mankind as people no longer live in harmony with nature.

-Glasses are good for correcting your sight...but they also make the eyes weaker.
-Cars are good for for fast transportation....but it makes the legs weaker and is responsible for thousands of people being killed and disabled every year.
-Clothes and shoes are good for protecting us from the environment but they also make the feet weaker and the skin more delicate and vulnerable.

Every holiday the most religious of people can be found stuffing themselves with all types of meats, breads, and alcoholic beverages.....and afterwards farting and talking nostalgically about the time when people ran around naked in a garden with only food that grew on trees as being the ideal way to live.

Were human's made to eat meat?
Where are the fangs and why must it be cooked first?

Where humans made to eat bread?
Who even thought up the relatively complicated process by which bread is made?

Many people believe that the only food human beings were designed to eat are fruits and water, not even vegetables that must be cut and boiled to be edible."

____________________________________________________________________________

TROY RESPONDED:

"Pioneer, you know all the examples  and symptoms you described, eyeglasses, clothing, and cars, none of those things are diseases.   I seriously doubt anyone who needs eye-glasses would agree with or care about your assertion that they cause weakness , nor would any one who needs clothing to protect them from the weather or a car to transport them.

Man, lets keep things in perspective.  So-called western civilization despite all of its ills has improved the quality of life, certainly if you measure it by life expectancy and infant mortality in particular.

There are scientists who argue that modem man evolved because we cook food, not the other way around.  Cooking food actually reduces greatly the amount of energy we need to exert in order to consume it.  

Man can consume meat just fine, we are adapted to do it.  The whole notion that homo sapiens evolved to eat only vegetables flies in the face off all the available science, despite what some vegetarians might have you believe.  Those vegans have the luxury of being vegetarians because they can go down to the Whole Foods and buy this stuff with relatively little effort.  If these "nuts" were in the wild they would die from starvation or malnutrition come the first winter.

Whenever someone starts a sentence with, "I believe God...." I stop listening, because what man knows the mind of God?  Who would presume to know what God knows.  That is like an amoeba presuming to know what Einstein knows.

Of course man was meant to eat meat. We are omnivorous."

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Troy

 

Whenever someone starts a sentence with, "I believe God...." I stop listening, because what man knows the mind of God? Who would presume to know what God knows. That is like an amoeba presuming to know what Einstein knows.

Oh??? Is me admitting it's only a belief too humble for you?
Would you be more receptive if people started off boldly declaring,
"And Gaaawwdd told ME to tell YOU......." LOL

I didn't say I KNEW I said I BELIEVED, for the reasons you just gave.
Your counter response would be better aimed at one silly enough to come through boldly claiming absolute knowledge of God and His intentions.






Pioneer, you know all the examples and symptoms you described, eyeglasses, clothing, and cars, none of those things are diseases. I seriously doubt anyone who needs eye-glasses would agree with or care about your assertion that they cause weakness , nor would any one who needs clothing to protect them from the weather or a car to transport them.

I for one can speak from experience that wearing glasses can make your eyes weaker because I was diagnosed with having to wear prescription glasses years ago.
I wore them until they got stolen and found out that they were making my eye muscles weaker so decided to try not wearing them for a while....10 years later I don't need them.

I've heard similar stories from others.
SOME people need glasses...but certainly not everyone being prescribed them by the optomotrist.

As far as clothes and cars not causing diseases, I beg to differ....
We know that gasoline contains carcinogens, carbon monoxide is poisonous, a lot of the chemicals used to make and maintain clothes are toxic and quite a few people have allergies to wool and silk. The chemicals used in detergents and dry cleaning have been known to give people skin problems as well.

I won't get into the amount of deaths and permanent disabilities automobiles are responsible for.


I'm not anti-Civilization.
I'm more specific about WESTERN Civilization because of all the civilizations I've studied Western civilization seem to be more inimical to nature than any.
Much of what is considered normal in this society goes against the very nature of humanity.


When you talk about life expectancy......WHO'S life?

My father was born and raised in the rural South and he as well as many others who grew up during his time said that Black folks used to live MUCH longer and healthier when he was a kid. They said it was nothing to see a 90 or 100 year old man or woman walking up and down an old dirt road unassisted with maybe an old stick.
Many of them still had most of their teeth....and some men were still making babies in their 70s and 80s!

I don't know if it's true or not but I've heard there were people in many parts of continental Africa who live well over 150 years of age living a traditional lifestyle.

They used to say cancer and diabetes were "White folks" diseases because Black people rarely got them.
Now after following a European diet packed with meats and starch and following a Westernized culture many are dying of all types of previously unknown diseases...and at an increasingly younger age.
Again, this civilization and diet isn't necessarily the best for US.


 

 


There are scientists who argue that modem man evolved because we cook food, not the other way around. Cooking food actually reduces greatly the amount of energy we need to exert in order to consume it.
Man can consume meat just fine, we are adapted to do it. The whole notion that homo sapiens evolved to eat only vegetables flies in the face off all the available science, despite what some vegetarians might have you believe. Those vegans have the luxury of being vegetarians because they can go down to the Whole Foods and buy this stuff with relatively little effort. If these "nuts" were in the wild they would die from starvation or malnutrition come the first winter.

Of course man was meant to eat meat. We are omnivorous


Perhaps the reason it took so much energy to consume meats and vegetables was because we didn't have any business eating it in the FIRST place.
It ain't hard to pick a plumb off the tree.
It ain't hard to peel a banana or scoop up a cup full of fresh crystal clear water from a river.
And these fruits are easily digestable.
Along with some nuts (also considered fruit scientifically) this would provide all the vitamins, carbohydrates, and proteins one would need for a healthy and happy life.

.....as long as you didn't have to wear yourself out working at a factory, or on a farm, or in a coal mine.

Which is completely unnatural, as most "jobs" are....which is why so many people HATE their jobs.

Again, this so-called "civilization" and the stressful demands both physical and psychological it makes on the human being just to survive in it REQUIRES a lot of excess energy.
The very luxuries and conveniences that we praise so much are often the biggest culprit in causing disease and stress.

It's like a soldier who happily joins the military and marches off to war so that he can get full medical insurance coverage and guaranteed trips to the VA hospital.
Uh.....if you didn't go in the first place you wouldn't NEED those benefits!

One of humanity's biggest assets over the animal kingdom...high intelligence...has also been one of it's biggest liablities by constantly inventing better ways to poison itself.

I would argue that perhaps human beings were designed to digest cooked meat and cooked vegetables for only TEMPORARY emergencies like impending famines and other lack of resources.....giving us enough energy to survive and make other arrangements or find greener forests to forage so that we could quickly get back to the more simple diet we were intended.

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There has to be an explanation as to why all of the plants we cultivate and animals we slaughter are so pleasing to our palates. Why did we acquire and come to savor a taste for them? Is it some kind of trick of nature that everything that tastes good to us is frequently considered  bad for us?  

Even an infant naturally likes things that taste good and so do our pets. Processed foods full of preservatives and additives still taste good.  We eat what appeals to our taste buds and salivary glands and olefactory  organs of smell. Man's brain seems to be wired to enjoy what we call delicious food..  

And of course everybody's metabolism doesn't react to food the same way and longevity has a lot to do with genes. Some people eat everything and never experience debilitating effects.  Others watch their diets but are not necessarily that healthy.  

Of course, exercise or lack thereof, is a great factor in maintaining a healthy body.

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I'm sure most people found bloody RAW meat distasteful and stinking, especially as compared to the sweet fruits they were eating.
Even if you could tolerate the taste of organs mixed with feces and blood by cooking it.......to
chase a zebra down and viciously kill it and cook it took considerable more energy than picking bananas off trees all day.

I'm convinced that humans started eating meat out of some sort of necessity that continued to develop and like many things...we adapt and eventually often times develop a craving.

I know the first time I tried alcohol, cigarettes, and coffee....I found them VERY distasteful and bitter.
It was nature's way of telling you it's not the best thing in the world for you.
But because of peer pressure I kept
on consuming and eventually acquired a bit of a taste for coffee and certain alcoholic beverages.

But I know very few people who started off loving the bitter taste of alcohol or nicotine.

The need for exercise is almost as imporant as the need for nutrition.
Once again, WESTERN civilization seems to take much of that away from us by increasingly coming up with better modes of transporation the prevent man from using his legs....and now even his mind and sense of direction, with self driving and self parking cars.

We almost instinctually know that this type of civilization isn't necessarily good for us which is why so many people feel much better wh
en they live the city and spend time in nature.

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Yea, but there is a vast menu of delicious food that you don't have to acquire a taste for.  After eating it once, you keep eating it because it tastes good to you. A dog will do tricks for dog treats.  Babies will nibble and smile when you give them a cookie. 

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LOL!  @Pioneer1, if you started off with "God Told me..." I'm leaving the room.  

It would be sufficient to say "I believe...." that would be more accurate.  Often people try to bolster an argument by relating the mind of God.  Misinterpreting the mind of God gets people killed every day.

Pioneer, where are all these plums and bananas growing where you can just walk up a pick it off a tree?  What world are you envisioning the Garden of Eden? In the real worl, before industrialization and certainly agriculture, the vast majority of our time was spent looking for food. 

In order to produce those Bananas, you take for granted they have, to be cultivated.  To cultivate them in the volume and price that most people will consume them, takes a lot of fossil fuels for framing, transportation, storage, etc, and slave like labor to work the fields.  The production of meat is even worse.  

As far as infant mortality and the related life expectancy.  I don't need to argue about that the data is readily available.  Your personal experiences while interesting are certainly not extendable to entire populations.  Also, I'm not aware of any documented evidence of anyone living to be 150 years old. I'm certain you can not produce any, so that is not worth arguing about either.

@Cynique, modern processed food is developed to appeal to us. Seriously, there are scientists working in laboratories, every day, trying to concoct something that will taste so good that it will hook us.  Of course nowadays there is a bit more pressure to produce something that will not also kill us--but not nearly enough if you ask me.

The food tastes good, it is artificially cheap (though still remarkably profitable), readily available, so we over consume.  Of course we get all the associated weight related diseases as a result. I can go into mcdonalds today buy two hamburgers, and a large Coke for $3.00. That is far cheaper that it would cost me to go to the supermarket buy the ingredients and prepare that meal myself.  Plus I'd save a lot of time.

If you are under educated, overweight, poor, and over 50 you are almost certainly diabetic.  But no one cares cause treating diabetes is profitable and Black people get it disproportionately--though we are no more susceptible than anyone else.

But the real kicker is that as we get fatter and fatter, rather the dealing with the problem in our food supply celebrate our new found obesity. Thick is the new fat. Skinny girls are evil.  

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Why do we have to go through life avoiding what tastes good and provides pleasure just so the food Nazis can dictate our lifestyles?  I still think moderation is the key.   Avoiding gluttony is a simple solution.  

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Cynique was that said in your Nancy Reagan, "Just say no" voice?

You, and for the most part I, grew up at a time when people cooked at home.  We NEVER ate out.  After I got into college my family started to go out to restaurants, but this was typically for special occasions.  Today many people in places like NYC never cook and eat dinner out every night.  Overindulging in processed foods just did not happen.  An overweight kid in my day was unusual, not the norm.  A child with adult onset diabetes are unheard of.

Today it is much harder to avoid these foods.  I know you'be heard of food desserts, but actually exist.  Even if fresh produce is available, it costs too damn much, and will not satiate you as easily has some good 'ole American fast food. 

Marketers target kids and get them hooked at an early age--using the same tactics cigarette company's use.  

At the end of the day, I agree with you Cynique, but I also know for many people making the right choice is often very hard, if not altogether impossible. Avoiding gluttony sounds simple on paper, but in practice it is completely different story.  People don't want to be fat any more than they want to be hooked on drugs.

Also the food is manufactured in such a way that you don't have to necessarily be a glutton, the same number of calories compared to unprocessed food will result in additional weight gain--for some more than others.

But again Coke is cheaper than water and tastes better.  They sell it schools directly to children.  You can go to a movie theater or 7-eleven and buy a cup of coke the size of a bucket--with free refills.

We are programed to consume, not to be concerned with our health.  And a lack of education makes it much easier to become a victim of this corporate programming.

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Well, we are all individuals and, for lack of a better solution, just have to get our priorities straight, keeping in mind that we also have individual metabolisms and that one person's meat is another one' s poison. IMO, Life is too short and relishing delicious food remains one of its enduring pleasures.   :P

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2 hours ago, Sara said:

Here, I disagree. 100%. Humans are omnivores. We are made to eat everything that moves! Unlike herbivores who eat only plants, we have the eyeteeth of the carnivorous wolf. Not as pronounced, perhaps, but our eyeteeth are meant to tear, not to "chew" or chomp on, as does a cow's molars chewing grass.

 

23 hours ago, Cynique said:

 

CYNIQUE's complete message that preceded this Food for Thought thread that contained an exchange between Pioneer and Troy; 

This recent exchange that follows may have gotten lost on the thread invaded by the relentless postings of the serial poster, sara. I thought it was an interesting conversation that deserved its own thread.

Sara's incomplete quote was:

Cynique said: This recent exchange that follows may have gotten lost on the thread invaded by the relentless postings of the serial poster, sara...

Sara's response was:

Your bitter, lying, dog hair wig-wearing, about-nothing, envious bitch azz just can't get enough of my stomping it, can ya? All I have to do is to say "hi" to anyone on this board and here you come, fingers tapping, leathery old titties flying with every gasp under that nasty raggedy slip and swinging away with that big spoon, hoping to make contact as you derail the thread.

GTFOH!

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Cynique says to sara:

Maybe you and your devious self will get your fill of cutting and pasting incomplete quotes in order to make yourself look blameless.  

 

 

_____________________________________________________________-____

2 hours ago, Sara said:

Here, I disagree. 100%. Humans are omnivores. We are made to eat everything that moves! Unlike herbivores who eat only plants, we have the eyeteeth of the carnivorous wolf. Not as pronounced, perhaps, but our eyeteeth are meant to tear, not to "chew" or chomp on, as does a cow's molars chewing grass.

Cynique responded:

"We", hell. What does a sub species aberration like you know about  herbivores?  It's obvious all you eat is your own feces which you lick  off of your underage girlfriend.     LMAO. 

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The only thing gettin unravelled around here, strapped up sara the homo ho,  are the lies you try to pass off as true, while looking for sympathy and feeling sorry for yourself because you "can't say hi to someone". Poor ol thing, Why don't you coax sarafan out of her hole and bring her on board so you can feel better about yourself. something that's hard to do, I know. But stay away from mirrors. That might help. ^_^  

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Cynique

Yea, but there is a vast menu of delicious food that you don't have to acquire a taste for. After eating it once, you keep eating it because it tastes good to you. A dog will do tricks for dog treats. Babies will nibble and smile when you give them a cookie.

Absolutely, like fruits, honey, nectar, and sugar cane......
There isn't one animal that can be snatched up or hunted down and eating raw that one immediately finds delicious as soon as they bite in.

All meat from animals must be PREPARED first before they become edible....which means it probably wasn't intended for you to eat on a regular basis in the first place.




Troy

Pioneer, where are all these plums and bananas growing where you can just walk up a pick it off a tree? What world are you envisioning the Garden of Eden? In the real worl, before industrialization and certainly agriculture, the vast majority of our time was spent looking for food.

These things grew wild and they grew in ABUNDANCE in the warm climates that most human beings dwelt in BEFORE Western Civilization came through DISplacing and MISplacing entire populations to colder harsher climates and chopping down the forests as well as other destructive acts against the natural environment.

So ofcourse it's going to be hard to find a banana tree in the ghetto today.
Because the city itself is an artificial man made construct that erased nature's original one.

Sure the infant mortality rate may have been higher in certain groups, but like homosexuality and people naturally born born infertile....perhaps it was natures way of population control to make sure those who DID survive had enough food and other resources.
As opposed to today where people are saved from birth to live a long healthy life which in some cases leads to over population, war, begging and homelessness, and other social ills before they eventually succumb to some unnatural disease they acquired from eating too much of the wrong foods (cancer, diabetes, asthma, ect....)

To make it clear, I don't believe in the "over population" crap they're putting out.
I believe many of our problems with food and housing in this socity comes from a lack of proper urban planning.
However if I were FORCED to and had to decide how my society's population was to be controled and balanced I'd rather it be done from the front end by a high infant mortality rate  than to be done on the other end by war, homicide, and disease.

 

But again Coke is cheaper than water and tastes better. They sell it schools directly to children. You can go to a movie theater or 7-eleven and buy a cup of coke the size of a bucket--with free refills.

Yet another example of this so-called "civlization" marketing death and destruction to our children.
Artificial products like pop and kool-aid loaded with sugars and artificial sweeteners that not only jack up the teeth and make the dentists rich, but also produce diabetese, cancers, and cause psychological problems that aren't found among so-called "primitive" populations who practice a simpler diet.

These modern conveniences aren't making life "better" for a lot of people, it's producing more DEATH and disease.

 

 

 

 

 

Sara
 

All I have to do is to say "hi" to anyone on this board and here you come, fingers tapping, leathery old titties flying with every gasp under that nasty raggedy slip and swinging away with that big spoon

Come on Sara..........

Now why would you sit up there and talk about that woman's titties like that?
You KNOW there is no such thing as titties turning "leathery".....lol.




Same thing with my grandparents who lived well into their 80's when the actuarial table for life expectancy for U.S. citizens in the years they were born was less than 50. Oh, and they weren't remarkable. One aunt lived to be 102 - and she wasn't remarkable, either. Down south, black people lived long lives.... eating pig. BUT! They were eating freshly slaughtered pig, not pre-packaged meats. I've heard of many blacks, fresh from the farm, who refused to eat ANY type of meat bought in a store. They said it's wasn't REAL meat!

Our people can live a looooong loooong time when they are practicing their own culture in thier own environment.

I don't know about the accuracy of the reports, but just recently I came across a story about a 191 year old Nigerian woman:

http://www.trendingnewsportal.com/2016/03/191-years-old-woman-who-lives-in-Nigeria-said-to-be-the-oldest.html

http://thegedsection.com/blogs/191-year-old-woman-discovered-in-nigeria-oldest-living-woman-alive


Although rural villages aren't known for the most accurate of record keeping, I've heard similar stories about Black people living well past 150 in various parts of Africa.
I'm not sure why we should be suprised at how long so many of our people can live under a more natural setting fitting for THEIR chemistry and biology.


Not only isn't the meat fresh, most meat you buy in the stores is a little rotten to "soften" it up and make it more palatable.....which leads to weaker teeth.

Another problem with the meat in America is the way it's killed.
Muslims and Jews know to kill thier animals in as peaceful setting as possible and then drain all the blood out of it so that the "fear" of the animal doesn't get ingested into the human.
When I first heard this it didn't make a lot of sense until I thought....perhaps the "adrenaline" in improperly slaughtered meat may be what's driving a lot of societies criminal and psychological issues.

 

 


I used to think we were omnivores as well.
But guess what?


SWINE are omnivores
BEAR are omnivores

They have the natural equipment and strength to kill animals without weapons and rip the hide off of them and eat them and digest them unassisted.
If human beings were naturally meant to eat meat as a regular part of our diet we would have the fangs and claws to catch and kill animals and eat them raw.
We'd also have the digestive system with enough acid....like bears...to digest raw meats.

Now, we are just smart enough to find ways to properly prepare normally inedible foods for TEMPORARY consumption until we can get back to our normal diet.

We can't confuse having the INTELLIGENCE to prepare foods that aren't naturally edible for us and make them palitable for a short period of time....with being omnivorous.
Remember, just because you can eat it and it doesn't have adverse effects on you immediately....perhaps in the long run it will.

Not only aren't we designed to eat meat on a regular basis, I don't think we're even designed to eat most VEGETABLES and ROOTS that we tend to eat.
The more I study it the more I'm convinced that humans are for the most part FRUTARIANS.

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