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Cynique

Take this job and stuff it?

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Poor movie mogul, Harvey Weinstein, the serial molester  who has supplanted Bill Cosby as the poster boy for horny ol lechers. Why am i not outraged by his being outed by all of the mostly white damsels in distress coming out of the wood work, making accusations   My entrenched cynicism no doubt.  Or maybe, i feel rejected because I could not add my name to the swelling ranks of the "me, too" sisterhood of sexually harassed females. :o

 

More likely because the "casting couch" has been a long standing joke in the movie business, wherein ambitious young starlets anxious to advance their careers, submitted to the sexual overtures of powerful Hollywood tycoons.  Now all of a sudden, ambitious women who remained silent because  they didn't want to derail their careers are coming forth,  playing the victims.  I've always considered any woman who was surprised at a man wanting to get in her pants as being naive. But perhaps "vulnerable' is a better description.  

 

In looking back, i couldn't think of any incidents that qualified me for membership in the "me, too" sisterhood of sexual harassment.  Many men flirted with me on my job, but i  took it in my stride and if i didn't respond, they moved on.  Only once did a guy make a lewd suggestion to me and after i laid a few choice words on him, he grinned sheepishly and never bothered me again.  i suspect because black women usually cuss out or blow off men who bug them and because most of these men aren't powerful enough to  impede their progress, this latest feminist outcry doesn't resonate with them as much. Of course, rappers like Dr. Dre are the exception.   Dating back to slavery days, black women have had to deal with sexual aggression and they've learned how to be just as manipulative as their predators.  Of course,  rape and domestic abuse put all women in jeopardy. 

 

I'm sure many would dub me as "old school" and would disagree with my view point.  So be it.  I'm so sick of everything that's going on in the world that  i've become desensitized.      <_<                                                                   

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Cynique

Were most of the men "coming on" to you Black?

If so.....that may explain in part why they didn't harass you or get more aggressive after letting them know you weren't interested.

Black men are usually BOLDER than White men when it comes to approaching women but we USUALLY (but not always) draw the line with rejection.

Rather than sit there and harass the same woman over and over again who's made it plain that she doesn't want us, most of the time we'll just move on to messing with the next woman and will probably even go through DOZENS of women until we nail one.....lol.

Some people don't like that approach, but it's one that has worked for ME and many other Black men who aren't considered the most attractive men in this society.

There are exceptions to the rules and you have all types of Black and White men, but generally speaking most Black men like to play games and charm women into sleeping with them.
We also tend to sleep with A LOT MORE women to increase the odds of "getting lucky" and staying that way.

Where as most White men like to demand or coherce women through their money and power or sense of obligation and often times tend to focus on ONE woman at a time and maybe a second "mistress".

Because of their status in society, many White men feel ENTITLED to women and find it very frustrating and almost intolerable that a woman would not want to sleep with them.
Most women don't understand this mentality and are often surprised when they encounter it.

On the other hand, most Black men in this nation are so used to being dissed and rejected that it really doesn't bother them as much.
It becomes a NUMBERS GAME to them and they will shrugg off a rejection to move on to another target.....lol.

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Again, I feel you Pioneer.  Cynique, men use the lewd approach, because they are crude, and don't know any no better, but it works from time to time.  So the tactic persists.

 

I have never used the approach; It is just not my style, but again I know it works for many guys.

 

 

 

 

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I'm well aware that  men use the lewd approach because they are crude.  i don't think i am personally acquainted with any women with whom this approach as worked, however.   

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I'm not going to say I've NEVER used the lewd approach...lol.
But I wasn't my usual style.
I didn't care too much for making dirty sexual remarks to women I didn't or barely knew.

For me, it was (and still is) boldness and a numbers game more then finesse and charm; but I always have a certain amount of respect and courtesy.


However some men DID get success from being lewd and I've seen women go for men who were down right thuggish and threatening.


But first, what is considered "lewd"?

If a man says,

"Hey baby what's up?
What's your name....can I get to know you?"


That's not lewd.

Even if he told a woman how nice her body was or how nice her butt or breast are.....that STILL isn't lewd.....in my opinion

We did that all day long with NO shame with a lot of success.

But if he starts asking her to perform something on him or gets graphic about what he wants to do to her.....then THAT crosses the line and becomes rude and lewd.

And again, I've known DOZENS of women who both bold AND "lewd" talk actually worked on.


But I guess it depends on a person's definition of "worked" or what "success" is.

Meaning, what is a man's AIM or GOAL when he approaches a woman with lewd remarks and lines?

If is goal is to meet a woman to marry or is looking for a compatible partner to have a life long relationship with....theres a slim chance that he'll find that type of relationship from women he's using those remarks on.

However if is goal is to must find somebody to "hit it and quit" or have a few night stands with where it's just sex and not much else......those lewd remarks will work remarkably well and I've known several instances where they have!

 

 

But we have to be careful in what we're calling crude and lewd.
There's a "street harassment" push going on among racist young White women where they are going around taking videos of men of color who flirt with them and using this as an excuse to make flirting with women on the street ILLEGAL.
They want to get it termed STREET HARASSMENT and get these young men punished simply for being normal men.

These are middle class mostly racist young White women who aren't used to men boldy displaying their sexuality so they want to demonize it.

This is the type of attitude that SPAWNS the "Harvey Weinsteins" because men are forced to suppress their nature and turn to perverted methods to satisfy themselves.

 

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Cynique, you obviously surround yourself with good people.

 

Pioneer I guess lewdness is in the eye of the beholder.  I never comment on a woman's physique to a woman, at least I don't recall ever doing it.  There are a myriad of ways for that conversation to go south.  That is why the "does my butt look big?" question is such a good opener to so many jokes :lol:

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????

I rarely talk about a woman's looks to another woman either.
There's little purpose in doing so.

However I HAVE approached dozens of women with compliments on their looks and body parts.

Did ALL of my encounters go as well as planned?
Not necessarily.

But some were EXTREMELY successful.

Right off the top I can think of atleast 2 women I "got with" simply by stopping them on the street, telling them how nice their butt was, and asking them how many accidents did they cause from men staring at it.....lol.

Much of life is about doing what you HAVE to do to be successful despite what society tells you is "right" or "wrong".

In this society much of the rules for social engagement are laid out by middle class White people who don't suffer from the same problems poor and working class urban Black people suffer from.

Most Black men, especially ones who are poor and aren't very attractive physically don't have the luxury of kicking back and WAITING for women line up and invite them to engage in sexual encounters....lol.

Nor do most Black men have the money and ability to "mail order" brides and prostitutes from all over the globe like White men do.

We do what we HAVE to do...and we do what works for US.


This is why I'm very adamant about Black people and especially Black men deciding OUR OWN morals.

When Tupac said, "Only God can judge me".....that resonated with a lot of Black males because it captured the frustation of being criticized by people who've never experienced what you have but expect you to behave as they do.

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You compliment women's butts, 45 grabs vaginas. Lewdness is in the eye of the beholder.

 

Again I know both tactics work. It depends on the people and situation.  I'm sure some, perhaps most, of the women Harvey Weinstein got sleezy with took him up on his offer.  Weinstein's lewdness worked for him until it didn't.  

 

 

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On 10/21/2017 at 4:49 PM, Cynique said:

i don't think i am personally acquainted with any women with whom this approach as worked, however.   

 

AMEN!  I can't even imagine someone saying "oh, yes...I want to spend the rest of my life or even a minute with you, Mr. Potty Mouth"

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I wouldn't call what I did "harassment".

I'd make a play for them a few times and if they reject, I move on....no stalking or harassing.

Another thing is the fact that I wasn't in a position of power over most of these women which would constitute as traditional "harassment".
Most of them were women I met outside of the work place and those who I met IN the workplace were either at my level or in a higher position of authority.
I didn't and still don't date women who are subordinates at work because I know many if not most will be expecting favors in exchange for sexuality.

 

Having said that..............

I actually don't have a problem with people using sex to get ahead whether they be male or female.
As long as it's CONSENTUAL.

Just like a prostitute uses sex to make money, other people can use use sex to get ahead in life also.

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Power is not always in the form of job title.  Men might have power over women because  of age; one and can exploit younger less experienced women.  Men can exert power over women with lower self esteems.  Of course men are physically more powerful than most women, etc.

 

So you flirt with women in a higher position @Pioneer1? That is insubordination as well as harassment. In a corporate environment you might have been fired

 

I was sexually harassed by a woman but she was low class--not poor, just common, and did not know any better.  I ignored her the best I could for she was a contract employee and would not be around very long.  Today, almost today 30 years later, I would have just shut her down--she was not attractive enough for me to sleep with.

 

Sleeping with someone is a bad way to decide to promote someone. I prefer to make the decision based upon qualifications and merit.  Beside you open yourself of for being used when you do that. It you don't get the promotion or the raise you have no recourse.

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No these weren't corporate jobs.
Mostly sales, industrial, or retail.

I hear exactly what you're saying about the problems that arise from promoting people based on the sexual favors they offer you and I personally don't engage in that behavior.

Infact, about 10 or 12 years ago I made a rule for myself not to even sleep with anyone at work regardless of their position.

 

I'm getting older.....lol.
Pioneer is not what he was at 25 or 30.....lol.
If something "goes wrong" in bed.......lol.....I don't want that shit getting around the workplace!!!

Ofcourse it's usually UNETHICAL......meaning it's bad business practice.
But is it IMMORAL???
And should it be CRIMINAL???

EXCEPT when it comes to government positions, I say no to both.

Whether we're talking about government or a business I'm of the personal belief that the fewer the rules and regulations....usually the better.
Rules and laws should only be to maintain safety and honesty.

But when it comes to business (again not government and civic institutions) ofcourse a person should be promoted based on their ability to do the job BUT some people have a gift for charm or sex appeal that makes whoever is promoting them enjoy their presence and gives them peace of mind.
Things that aren't measured in hard numbers and performance.

Come on man......
You know about "work wives" and "work husbands"!

Men or women who work around eachother so long that they know eachother better than their own spouses and know how to "comfort" eachother when they need it.

Or "morale boosters"!
People who aren't good at the actual job but their personalities are very harmonious and great for the morale of the job so everyone likes them and they keep the environment enjoyable.

Now too many rules and regulations would demand that these people not be promoted since they aren't qualified to occupy the positions they are seeking.....BUT....their presence in that position would bring far more happiness than if another more qualified but less appealing person occupied it.

Do you know what I'm saying?

So yes you're right that a person shouldn't make decisions based on who they're sleeping with I believe when it comes to BUSINESSES (not government institutions) these decisions should be left up to the individuals because there are so many variables involved.

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On 21/10/2017 at 12:00 PM, Pioneer1 said:



Rather than sit there and harass the same woman over and over again who's made it plain that she doesn't want us, most of the time we'll just move on to messing with the next woman and will probably even go through DOZENS of women until we nail one.....lol.

 

Pioneer here is your quote. 

Nailing women is your capstone statement. 

Pioneer let's say your Boss is a bisexual male. Who only promotes his lovers. And it took you a year to get this job. Due to a sexuall harrasment claim against you. Would you still not care that people are using sex to get a head.

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Delano

Pioneer here is your quote.

Nailing women is your capstone statement.


OK?
And where in that statement does it say I harass women as you accused me of?

If you have a problem COMPREHENDING my statement then let me re-phrase it.

Rather than standing there trying different or the same approach over and over again on a woman who has made it clear that she's not interested in us.......something that WOULD be considered harassment......after the first or second rejection most of the time we would just move on to the next woman until we nail (have sex with) one.

Does that make things clearer?




Pioneer let's say your Boss is a bisexual male. Who only promotes his lovers. And it took you a year to get this job. Due to a sexuall harrasment claim against you. Would you still not care that people are using sex to get a head.


I didn't say I "didn't care" that people are using sex to get ahead (or get some "head"....lol).
I said I didn't have a problem with it.

And unless "Mr Half-n-Half" is the owner of the firm, I'll just go over his head to get promoted....lol.
I've actually encountered similar situations before.
Not with bisexual men, but with women who were in higher positions that I didn't find attractive.

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