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No Substitute For Struggle


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It's not easy to challenge racism or work for positive social change. Most of us are just trying to live and work regular lives. Being an activist or running for elected office is an impossible task for most people. Maybe black people are no different from anyone else in this regard. At the same time when you look at the black community blaming all the problems solely on racism or economic injustice doesn't make sense. Black people mess up like anyone else. We succeed or fail based on individualism as much as fighting against racism. There are things we must do as people beyond struggle. These things are moral and spiritual. Other issues can be addressed by black community groups and businesses. However this country has been and remains systemically racist. Furthermore working people live and labor in an unjust economy that mainly benefits wealthy elites and corporations. These things undermine black people regardless of other problems. Self help is no substitute for protest or politics.  

 

Drugs, gun violence, fatherlessness, academic underachievement, and the decline of marriage undermine black life and community. All of these things are tied together, and they make it harder for us to access opportunity when it is available. Black people have always been deprived of rights and material benefits relative to whites in this society, but we didn't live like this. Crime despite racial stereotypes racist law enforcement didn't plague our neighborhoods. Two parent and strong extended family relationships provided love, discipline, and shelter amid poverty and crippling discrimination. We had each other if we had nothing else. Doing well in school and advancing to college was something everyone took pride in. Our schools were inadequate, but we made the most of things. The irony is not lost on black people that when so many things seemed to get better because of the Civil Rights Movement and a decline in blatant racism black community life declined. We lost the family. We started killing each other over drugs and turf. Oftentimes the violence doesn't have a reason. Too many of us don't succeed in school and it's not the education system - it's us. Contrary to widespread belief among whites blacks spend a lot of time talking about these problems rather than racism. There's nothing wrong with self criticism. Furthermore, we need to all be better people as parents, husbands, wives, lovers, students, and neighbors. Everything is not about racism or capitalist oppression. At the same time community self help and entrepreneurship are important too. 

 

Black people have always done things to help themselves and start businesses. We have banded together despite have meager resources to solve problems and meet needs. While our efforts in this regard may not be covered by the mainstream press, black groups and civil society are doing everything possible to tackle problems faced by urban communities. The same thing is happening with black business. There are more black owned companies than ever. Black athletes and entertainers are not just playing sports, singing, or rapping. They are starting all kinds of companies and engaging in lots of business ventures. While most black businesses are small and have few full time employees others are large million and even billion dollar enterprises. We need to keep doing more self help and entrepreneurship on a bigger and more sophisticated level. No matter how bad things are they would be worse if black people themselves had not assumed individual and collective responsibility. Black people past or present have never waited on the government to help us. We need call out white people and certain blacks who say otherwise.  

 

Self help and economic development are no substitute for protest or political engagement. We need to be in the streets and on social media fighting racism and economic injustice. We must demand changes that advance freedom and equality. From the nineteenth century abolitionist movement, to Civil Rights protests, the Black Power Revolution, and now the Black Lives Matter struggle against racist policing nothing has never changed for our good or this country's unless black people fought. Racism and discrimination never went away. They became more subtle and are persistent. Black people are not impoverished, underemployed, less wealthy, and underpaid compared to similar whites because of choices we make. Systemic racism is the problem. This impacts black politics. We must hold elected officials including blacks accountable for getting results. Also Black policy wonks and experts who research solutions to problems are more important than ever. Black activists and elected officials need to make sure these people are included at the highest levels of policy making. We need to stop listening to right leaning white people and blacks who say we have no right to demand anything from society or the democratic process. These blacks say "begging the white man" is undignified and useless. For them the solutions are self made. They emphasize cultural pride and awareness especially Black Nationalists focused on the African past. Others talk about restoring the two parent patriarchal family and starting businesses. Black conservatives claim government programs and protest politics have ruined black families, community life, and moral fiber. The call for moral rehabilitation and making our way in society built on less government. Whether it's Black Nationalist or Conservative both approaches discourage activist struggle and political engagement. If we follow their lead we will lose the gains we've made. 

 

Our progress and wellbeing depend on self help along with protest and political engagement. We're not perfect people and neither is this country. When it comes to solving problems the choice is not either or. It is both. Right now there are people who want blacks to stop pushing. They are determined to hold on to what they have. Some are racist others are driven by greed and a lust for power. Black people have experienced so many political defeats and policy failures. For many self help works. It is something black people can control without whites. For other blacks making the best of things means being a better person and playing by existing rules. To them changing society is not possible or desirable. However history has shown no matter how good or accommodating black people are racism and economic inequality will deprive us of life, liberty, and happiness until we take a stand. No matter what happens blacks are better off because of politics and activist struggle rather than doing nothing at all.

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Do you think blacks should get the covid vaccine or do you believe it's part if a government conspiracy to thin our ranks and control us? I'm just curious about your sentiments is regard to this issue. Anyway,  I applaud your good intentions but I don't think systemic racism will ever be abolished. Nobody gives up or even shares power and America is not our country. It was not created for us nor does it return our "love". We just live here. And why should a black individual have to make a lifetime commitment to "the struggle"? How much do I owe the race that gives me so little peace of mind? Why can't I live what's left of my life on my own terms? Why am I expected to do what Jesus has neglected to do for his most loyal and devoted followers? Liberate them!

 

At this point, the only idea I can muster up any enthusiasm for is the appearance of a miracle that would take the form of dismantling Trump and the vile right-wing conservative Republicans who support him. 

 

 

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12 hours ago, Cynique said:

Do you think blacks should get the covid vaccine or do you believe it's part if a government conspiracy to thin our ranks and control us?

 

Of course Black should get the vaccine. "They" could have used the MMR vaccine which far more people, including kids, take if they wanted to kill us off.  Social media has been far more effective in controlling us; indeed one could argue THAT is the tool confusing so many people NOT to take the vaccine and is THE reason some many more of are dying than necessary.

 

12 hours ago, Cynique said:

Why can't I live what's left of my life on my own terms?

 

You should live you life on your terms.  The "fight" is for young people anyway... Elders should be sought for advise and counsel; to provide motivation and lessons learned.  Young Black people are rarely interested in learning from older people, so we reinvent the wheel and make the same mistakes. Often elders refuse to relishing the reins and hold on to power far too long... 

 

12 hours ago, Cynique said:

...the only idea I can muster up any enthusiasm for is the appearance of a miracle that would take the form of dismantling Trump and the vile right-wing conservative Republicans who support him. 

 

Some people think that is what the aliens are here to do 🙂

 

Seriously, it will not take a miracle. Mortality will be the solution.  In 20 years Trump, Mitch McConnell and the old school racist will be out of office and almost certainly be dead.  

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Kenneth

 

I'm gonna give you the solution to solve over 90% of the problems you're listing.

Intelligent and decent Black folks MUST separate themselves from the fools, thugs, and ratchets and build our own separate communities around this nation.

That way we can march towards progress and do a grand RESET for our people.  It's the stupid and immoral in our community who are the biggest threat at this point.

 

 

 

 


Cynique

 


and America is not our country. It was not created for us nor does it return our "love". We just live here.

 

After 400 years of deeply rooted history in this land, I would say America is MORE our country than anyone elses besides the Native Americans.

Certainly AfroAmericans have more of a claim to America than Trump and his German grand parents.

 

Just because we have less power in this nation, doesn't mean it's not ours.  Even a young CHILD has a home whether she has power in it or not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Troy

 

 

 "They" could have used the MMR vaccine which far more people, including kids

 

According to some they're already using it to increase the rates of Autism in Black boys.

And that's not conspiracy THEORY....according to Dr.Wesly Muhammad that is conspiracy FACT.
 

 

 


In 20 years Trump, Mitch McConnell and the old school racist will be out of office and almost certainly be dead.  

 

And a new generation of racists while rise up to take their place...just like the Reagan generation before them and the Nixon generation before them.

Although I seriously doubt that they'll have anywhere near as much power then as they do now on this planet.
 

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10 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

After 400 years of deeply rooted history in this land, I would say America is MORE our country than anyone elses besides the Native Americans.

Certainly AfroAmericans have more of a claim to America than Trump and his German grand parents.

 

Just because we have less power in this nation, doesn't mean it's not ours.  Even a young CHILD has a home whether she has power in it or not.

What "you would say", doesn't make it so. And the fact that blacks have "less power in this nation" can mean that it's not ours. You can't erase reality with platitudes and replace it with illusions. The author of this post implores blacks to continue the 400-year struggle, and that struggle involves acquiring the kind of power that Donald Trump's immigrant father earned in one generation. And Trump, in spite of his repulsiveness, commands more power than Oprah Winfrey and Robert Johnson - and Barack Obama, 3 of America's black step children.  I comply with your inadvertent confirmation that having a home doesn't empower a child, inasmuch as having a "home' is not synonymous with having a country.

 

10 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

According to some they're already using it (MMR ) to increase the rates of Autism in Black boys.

And that's not conspiracy THEORY....according to Dr.Wesly Muhammad that is conspiracy FACT.
 

It may be a fact that Dr. Wesley Muhammad claimed this, but "according to some" is a phrase that introduces hearsay not "fact". All my life, starting with the assassination of JFK, conspiracy theories have saturated America, and not one has ever been proven to be conclusively true. What purpose would a preponderance of autistic black boys serve?  

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Cynique


What "you would say", doesn't make it so. And the fact that blacks have "less power in this nation" can mean that it's not ours. You can't erase reality with platitudes and replace it with illusions. The author of this post implores blacks to continue the 400-year struggle, and that struggle involves acquiring the kind of power that Donald Trump's immigrant father earned in one generation. And Trump, in spite of his repulsiveness, commands more power than Oprah Winfrey and Robert Johnson - and Barack Obama, 3 of America's black step children.  I comply with your inadvertent confirmation that having a home doesn't empower a child, inasmuch as having a "home' is not synonymous with having a country.


Power and citizenship are two separate things.

Many FOREIGN DIPLOMATS have more power to break the law than the average citizen.  It's called Diplomat Immunity.  That power doesn't mean this is THEIR country.

However you're right, we can't erase reality with platitudes OR sour grapes. We can go back and forth sharing our OPINIONS but let's go the LEGAL and OFFICIAL route on this one........

 

According to the 14th Amendment:


"All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States"

 

If you were BORN IN the United States (as most AfroAmericans are) then this is officially YOUR COUNTRY.  You're a citizen here whether you THINK you are or not or whether you're feel you're TREATED like one or not.

 

Everyone has their own opinions, but all of this sitting in a corner with your arms folded and lips poked out mumbling is irrelevant.  

This is official law.

 

 

 

 All my life, starting with the assassination of JFK, conspiracy theories have saturated America, and not one has ever been proven to be conclusively true.

 

How do you KNOW this?

 

One group comes with information they claim are facts to prove it's true....another group comes with information they claim are facts to debunk it.

It's a matter of choosing which side you believe.
Simply REFUSING to accept the evidence and proof offered doesn't mean it wasn't proven.
 

 

 

What purpose would a preponderance of autistic black boys serve?

 

A means to reduce competition with White men for jobs, power, wealth, and sexual access in this society.

 

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@Pioneer1The straw man argument is alive and well, revitalized by one of its chief proponents.  You are debunking something i never said, wallowing in the subterfuge of superfluous drivel.  Being a citizen of this country by way of being born here is not a certification that the country belongs to you, which is what i meant when i said America is not our country, - the reason for that being the stifling disenfranchisement of institutionalized racism. It is why Blacks are still engaged in the struggle to obtain even first class citizenship. Being born in this country certainly didn't endow slaves with any rights...In regard to your thoughts on conspiracy theories, cherry-picked facts make theories inconclusive and selective data is the gist of conspiracy theories which is why all these theories do nothing but provide choices for habitually suspicious people. Can you cite a theory that has ever been officially declared to be true?...As for resorting to autism, grasping at straws as a possible way of incapacitating black men, how far fetched can you get? Under existing circumstances, black men are perfectly capable of self-destructing on their own. 😜 Seriously,  autism is not necessarily disabling, especially high-end autism and Asperger's Syndrome.

 

I'm done. But you're welcome to further demonstrate your proclivity for specious arguments. 

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Cynique


Being a citizen of this country by way of being born here is not a certification that the country belongs to you, which is what i meant when i said America is not our country, - the reason for that being the stifling disenfranchisement of institutionalized racism. It is why Blacks are still engaged in the struggle to obtain even first class citizenship. Being born in this country certainly didn't endow slaves with any rights.

Most Black folks in this nation aren't slaves.

Cynique you're playing WORD GAMES.

When you say "our country" are you implying that a person must OWN the entire nation and have a cash receipt in their back pocket as proof that this country is theirs???

We're talking about CITIZENSHIP...not necessarily OWNERSHIP.

To say a country is YOUR country doesn't mean you OWN the nation and have total control of it.  It means it's the place of your nationality....and the 14th Amendment solidifies this regardless of your feelings otherwise.

 

-You were born in the U.S.
-Got jobs in the U.S.
-Raised a family in the U.S. and probably bought a house in the U.S.
-And now are getting a Social Security check and other benefits from the U.S.

.....but wanna sit up there talking about you're "struggling" to become a first class citizen and playing word games.

 

 

 

 


.In regard to your thoughts on conspiracy theories, cherry-picked facts make theories inconclusive and selective data is the gist of conspiracy theories which is why all these theories do nothing but provide choices for habitually suspicious people. Can you cite a theory that has ever been officially declared to be true?...As for resorting to autism, grasping at straws as a possible way of incapacitating black men, how far fetched can you get? 
 

Claiming this isn't your country while you're collecting a check from it is far more "far fetched"...lol.

If despite all of the evidence and proof that racists have sat around and conspired to harm Black folk, if you STILL deny that conspiracies exist.....you're on your own, lol

Even as we speak the Republican party is going from state to state conspiring to prevent as many Black folks from voting as they can.  But you STILL want to sit up there with your arms folded and deny the reality of conspiracies.  Well, you're welcomed to do so.  
I'm not gonna argue with you, lol

 

 


Under existing circumstances, black men are perfectly capable of self-destructing on their own.

 

You do you know those "existing circumstances" weren't conspired for that very purpose???

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 @Pioneer1We have no common ground because when it comes to America, my sentiments are in the abstract, and are about ideals and concepts while you, as usual, resort to conjuring up images and scenarios and providing pictures and articles, all in support of what you  consider your "critical thinking" which reeks with irrelevancy.   You are patriotic. I am not. You revere the flag. I don't. You think America is your country I think it's where I reside. How people feel about America is very subjective. So I don't have to justify my cynicism or provide you with explanations for it. Nor do I need you to impose your standards on me. (btw, I earned the pension that i am living on).... I never said that conspiracies don't exist.  it's the theories they concoct that i question.  In the course of human events wherein humans do what humans do, no organized secret plots are necessary for shit to happens as nature takes its random course. That's the way of the world. Public policy or political conflict are not conspiracies; they are overt not covert.   I look at the big picture but you create your own B-movies that premiere in Pioneerville.  

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On 8/2/2021 at 6:08 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Kenneth

 

I'm gonna give you the solution to solve over 90% of the problems you're listing.

Intelligent and decent Black folks MUST separate themselves from the fools, thugs, and ratchets and build our own separate communities around this nation.

That way we can march towards progress and do a grand RESET for our people.  It's the stupid and immoral in our community who are the biggest threat at this point.

 

 

 

 


Cynique

 


and America is not our country. It was not created for us nor does it return our "love". We just live here.

 

After 400 years of deeply rooted history in this land, I would say America is MORE our country than anyone elses besides the Native Americans.

Certainly AfroAmericans have more of a claim to America than Trump and his German grand parents.

 

Just because we have less power in this nation, doesn't mean it's not ours.  Even a young CHILD has a home whether she has power in it or not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Troy

 

 

 "They" could have used the MMR vaccine which far more people, including kids

 

According to some they're already using it to increase the rates of Autism in Black boys.

And that's not conspiracy THEORY....according to Dr.Wesly Muhammad that is conspiracy FACT.
 

 

 


In 20 years Trump, Mitch McConnell and the old school racist will be out of office and almost certainly be dead.  

 

And a new generation of racists while rise up to take their place...just like the Reagan generation before them and the Nixon generation before them.

Although I seriously doubt that they'll have anywhere near as much power then as they do now on this planet.
 

 

Thanks Pioneer for your response....

 

I don't think black people or anyone else can afford to divide ourselves into good versus bad people. Don't get me wrong there are plenty of us hurting ourselves and others. There are consequences for that one way or another that people have to pay. However we can't write everybody off. Think about it - someone as great as Malcolm X who was a criminal and served time in prison. But his life was changed by the teachings of the Honorable Elijah Muhammad and working in The Nation of Islam. To me our problems and struggles are not a zero sum gain. We have do lots of things to better ourselves and this country. 

 

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Cynique


We have no common ground because when it comes to America
 

We have no common ground because I'm grounded in REALITY while your position is admittedly abstract and theoretical (e.i. "wishful thinking")?

How can you find common ground with another person's IMAGINATION?

 

 


You revere the flag.

I do?
That's news to me.

 

 



You think America is your country I think it's where I reside.


And is that a necessary contradiction?



 


btw, I earned the pension that i am living on


((said in a deep voice and a side glance))

Yeah, and WHERE did you "earn" it, Cynique???
Hmmm??
What NATION gave you the opportunity to work in and earn the money?
 

 

 

 

 

I never said that conspiracies don't exist.  it's the theories they concoct that i question.  In the course of human events wherein humans do what humans do, no organized secret plots are necessary for shit to happens as nature takes its random course. That's the way of the world. Public policy or political conflict are not conspiracies; they are overt not covert.   

 

OK
So in other words since you can't support what you said about Conspiracies never turning out to be true....you resort to a "who cares" attitude.

Well perhaps that should have been the position you took all along.  I would have respected that much better than your initial  attempt to DISMISS them as foolish and ridiculous.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Kenneth

 

 

I don't think black people or anyone else can afford to divide ourselves into good versus bad people. Don't get me wrong there are plenty of us hurting ourselves and others. There are consequences for that one way or another that people have to pay. However we can't write everybody off. Think about it - someone as great as Malcolm X who was a criminal and served time in prison. But his life was changed by the teachings of the Honorable Elijah Muhammad and working in The Nation of Islam. To me our problems and struggles are not a zero sum gain. We have do lots of things to better ourselves and this country. 

 

You're more than welcome my brother!

 

The question isn't can we afford to divide ourselves between the good versus bad, the question is can we afford NOT to!

When we have a large and increasing percentage of our people who are drug addicts, gangsters and wanna-be gangsters, little children getting shot around the nation on a daily basis, and other atrocities happening....clearly ALL skin folk ain't kin folk.

The righteous and intelligent among us can't afford to put their safety in jeopardy for the sake of "uniting" with the montrosities that racism has made of many of our people.  
 

What you said about brother Malcolm is absolutely correct but brother Malcolm was reformed by a MIRACLE.  Miracles are acts of the Divine, not human beings.  So you can't waste time expecting all or even most wayward people to all of a sudden change for the better and become an asset to our community.  You'll be waiting for 2 centuries and many good brothers and sisters during the wait.

 

At some point, those of us who already woke and righteous must cut our losses, get together, and move on for the sake of our children and our future.


 

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On 8/2/2021 at 5:08 PM, Pioneer1 said:

According to some they're already using it to increase the rates of Autism in Black boy.

And that's not conspiracy THEORY....according to Dr.Wesly Muhammad that is conspiracy FACT.

 

Dude that is not a "Fact."  The "fact" is that is a conspiracy is a conspiracy theory.  THINK!  More Black boys died from the diseases virtually eradicated by the vaccines Black boys take as children. 

 

A FAR more effective way of killing Black people would be to keep the vaccines from us.

 

7 hours ago, Cynique said:

...wallowing in the subterfuge of superfluous drivel. 

 

🙂

 

2 hours ago, KENNETH said:

I don't think black people or anyone else can afford to divide ourselves into good versus bad people.

 

Of course this is true.  "Bad" people can raise good or even great people, and great people can rear bad people.

 

6 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

The question isn't can we afford to divide ourselves between the good versus bad, the question is can we afford NOT to!

 

This sounds like what a eugenicist would say.

 

8 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

...brother Malcolm was reformed by a MIRACLE.

 

No he was reformed by other people and his own will.  This is not a miracle my friend.

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Troy


 

A FAR more effective way of killing Black people would be to keep the vaccines from us.
 

Who said their ONLY objective was to KILL Black people?
Perhaps the objective of the racists are to LIMIT the Black population and NEUTRALIZE Black progress by producing a generation of autistic and intellectually compromised youth.

Do you think that the Black youth born after 1970 are smarter than the Black youth born BEFORE 1970s, collectively speaking?

 

 

 

"Bad" people can raise good or even great people, and great people can rear bad people.

 

There's a difference between CAN, DO, and LIKELY.

Ofcourse bad people CAN raise good children, but what is the LIKELIHOOD of them doing so?
You COULD have had just as good of an education and career going to your local highschool instead of a specialized highschool...but what was the LIKELIHOOD of you doing so?


A person CAN fall from the Empire State building and survive....but what is the LIKELIHOOD of them doing so?
 

Let us focus on REALITY and PROBABILITIES...instead of basing arguments on THEORY and POSSIBILITY.


 

This sounds like what a eugenicist would say.


What me and the Eugenicist have in common is that neither of us want to be in a community with people we find undesirable.

The Eugenist doesn't want to be in a community with Black people.
I don't want to be in a community with violent criminals, thugs, racists, sexual deviants, ect...
 

So I admit we do have THAT in common.
 

What about you?

BTW.....I find it interesting that you don't believe in "conspiracy theories" but obviously believe in EUGENICISTS.
 

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5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

OK
So in other words since you can't support what you said about Conspiracies never turning out to be true....you resort to a "who cares" attitude.

Well perhaps that should have been the position you took all along.  I would have respected that much better than your initial  attempt to DISMISS them as foolish and ridiculous.

 

@Pioneer1OK, hell. A typical example of how you frame your rebuttals by putting your spin on what has transpired, supplying motives for what you say someone has done as if you can read their minds. Which you can't. You can't even manage your own discombobulated mind. This desperate tactic says more about you than the people you try to discredit. And, believe me, the stigma of your respect is something  i can do very well without!  For somebody who thinks he's so smart you obviously  cannot make a distinction between "conspiracy" as a noun and "conspiracy" as an adjective.  When the word conspiracy is used as an adjective to modify the noun "theory", then it's a whole new situation. I never said there were no such thing as conspiracies. What I contended  was that theories about the nature of a possible conspiracy were what i was skeptical about, especially since none of the theories had ever been officially declared to be indisputably true - the reality of which your brain can't seem to process. Now excuse me while I borrow another of your pathetic ploys: making up scenarios... I can picture you over there in the corner, mentally as well as physically contorted as you attempt to pat yourself on the back for the strike-outs you've convinced yourself were home runs, - something your warped ego demands.   

 

 

 

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On 8/2/2021 at 4:11 PM, Cynique said:

I applaud your good intentions but I don't think systemic racism will ever be abolished

America would not exist without racism . Even before it was a nation it had institutionalized racism and oppression .

 

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Cynique  AKA SPINderella

 

 

OK, hell. A typical example of how you frame your rebuttals by putting your spin on what has transpired, supplying motives for what you say someone has done as if you can read their minds. Which you can't.


Who needs a mind reader for you when you're an OPEN BOOK of spins and contradictions...lol


 

 I never said there were no such thing as conspiracies. What I contended  was that theories about the nature of a possible conspiracy were what i was skeptical about


LOL..SPINDERELLA

 

I see how you spun that position around when you were challenged on it.

 

Female DJ playing turntable wearing black cap and white sleeveless top HD  wallpaper | Wallpaper Flare

 

"I..I..I...never..nev...nev...never....saaaaid 
I didn't belieeeeeve"
...lol

 

 

 


And, believe me, the stigma of your respect is something  i can do very well without!

 

I guess that means I don't have to worry about you tarnishing my brand by having wearing my respect then....lol

 

 

 


 For somebody who thinks he's so smart you obviously  cannot make a distinction between "conspiracy" as a noun and "conspiracy" as an adjective.  

 

...and for someone who thinks I'm so dumb and discombobulated, you sure are investing a good amount of time and energy TRYING to counter what I'm saying...lol

 

 

 


especially since none of the theories had ever been officially declared to be indisputably true - the reality of which your brain can't seem to process. 

 

That's because it's NOT reality.


The reality is...MANY Conspiracy THEORIES have been turned into Conspiracy FACTS...or just plain old "conspiracies" as you prefer

Most criminal investigations involving multiple suspect are Conspiracy THEORIES in their early stages until enough evidence and proof is gathered to make them ESTABLISHED FACTS.

 

 

 


Can you cite a theory that has ever been officially declared to be true?

 

Yes.
It was theorized that the Russians were helping Trump to win the election in 2016...and after an investigation it turned out that indeed they were.

What was once a THEORY of Conspiracy turned out to be a Conspiracy FACT.

 

 

 


I can picture you over there in the corner,

 

Try picturing me standing in front of a chalk board with you sitting in front of me as I try to educate you on certain matters, lol.

 

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8 hours ago, Delano said:

America would not exist without racism . Even before it was a nation it had institutionalized racism and oppression .

 


America could definitely exists WITHOUT racism.  
It just wouldn't keep this same structure.  Without racism, much of the excessive laws and regulations and structures that exist in the U.S. today may as well be dissolved because they were set up for racist purposes in the first place.

 

Originally, the ONLY laws the founders of the U.S. intended for their nation was the Constitution and a few state/local laws.  But because of racism they started adding more and more laws and regulations designed to be enforced SELECTIVELY to limit the success of AfroAmericans.

For example.......

If racism no longer existed in the U.S. you would have UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE within a year.
So there would be no need for a Medicare, Medicaid, and VA system and many of the insurance companies would go out of business too.

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On 7/31/2021 at 2:52 PM, KENNETH said:

We lost the family. We started killing each other over drugs and turf.

 

 

Oh yes! You've brought out many points and I don't know if I agree with everything, but I certainly believe that we lost the family structure and we do have a responsibility too, for how things have gotten worse. 

 

 

On 8/3/2021 at 6:55 AM, Pioneer1 said:

Simply REFUSING to accept the evidence and proof offered doesn't mean it wasn't proven.
 

 

Oh Man! I hope that you remember this when we debate in other forums! LOL! @Pioneer1

 

On 8/3/2021 at 2:34 PM, Pioneer1 said:

If despite all of the evidence and proof that racists have sat around and conspired to harm Black folk, if you STILL deny that conspiracies exist

 

I don't know anything about the MMR being a conspiracy or not, however, I do believe that this system has conspired against African Americans to some degree.

 

 

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Chev

 

 

Oh Man! I hope that you remember this when we debate in other forums! LOL!

 

Not only will I remember it...I'm likely gonna SAY IT AGAIN TO YOU, lol.

Got a lot a few people around here who like to deny reality and dwell in abstract/theoretical worlds.

 

 

 

I don't know anything about the MMR being a conspiracy or not, however, I do believe that this system has conspired against African Americans to some degree.

 

Check out the works of Dr. Wesley Muhammad, Umar Johnson, and Rizza Islam.

I know quite a few people who said their children got sick or changed in personality right after they were given the shot.

Whether we believe this or not, it's clear to anyone over 50 that there is definately a difference in personality and intellect between the various generations of AfroAmericans and SOMETHING has caused it.

When Black folks were having our own babies at home with midwives the infant mortality rate may have been a little higher but the babies who grew up didn't have NEARLY the problems so many Black children have today.

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I don't know the work of Muhammad or Islam is there work in pediatric medicine, immunology, or anything related to this subject?  I'm surprised you are citing Johnson (Did he ever open that school).

 

Just because you know "Quite a few" people who said something, does not mean the MMR vaccine is a conspiracy to kill Black people.  First this is all hearsay and even if it was true, who knows why the kids' personality changed -- it could be a variety of things -- including normal development.

 

Yes infant mortality is WAY down thanks, in part, to the MMR vaccine, but Black people are also living longer (save last year because of the pandemic). 

 

Lets be clear more people will continue die, needlessly, suffering on ventilators, struggling to breathe... simply because they were not vaccinated or infected by someone else who would not get vaccinated to wear a stupid mask.

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Troy

 

 

I don't think the MMR was a conspiracy to kill Black people.

Frankly, I'm not sure what the MMR was designed to do, however as I said before that maybe it was designed to NEUTRALIZE Black progress by producing more Autistic Black boys as well as a host of disabling mental and physical defects.

 

 

 


Yes infant mortality is WAY down thanks, in part, to the MMR vaccine, but Black people are also living longer (save last year because of the pandemic). 

 

You're conflating two issues:


1. Black infant mortality 
....with

2. Black people life span


First of all, including a low infant mortality rate into the average to make the claim that Black people are living longer is a bit deceptive.

For one thing, maybe nature INTENDS for some weaker babies to die so as not to contaminate the gene pool with weak or defective genetics.
So artificially LOWERING what would normal Black infant mortality rate may actually cause more harm than good in the long term by allowing very weak genetically defective babies to not only grow up but even reproduce their defective and weak genes in their offspring


Also, if we remove the infant mortality rate factor....how do we KNOW the lifespan of Black people has actually increased since the introduction of the MMR?

The MMR was introduced sometime around the late 60s and early 70s.
With the level of violence, drug addiction, incarceration, ect...that has affected the the generations of Black people born since...how do we KNOW for sure that it has increased the lifespan of Black people?

We're Black people born in 1970 healthier than their parents and grand parents???  Many older people would say no.


And besides the high homicide rates....

There are Black people who are getting cancer and diabetes in their 20s and 30s....something totally unheard of a few generations ago.

 

 

 

 

Lets be clear more people will continue die, needlessly, suffering on ventilators, struggling to breathe... simply because they were not vaccinated or infected by someone else who would not get vaccinated to wear a stupid mask.

 

It seems to me that BIGGEST reason people are dying from the virus has less to do with who was and wasn't vaccinated and more to do with the federal and various state and local governments ENDING the mask and social distancing mandates too early when they knew the Delta variant was rampaging through out some communities.


Don't tell the public that the coast is clear and that it's alright to walk around Wal-mart without a mask on and without social distancing because you've been vaccinated (and we'll take your word for it that you were) and then sit up and point fingers at OTHER people for the surge.


 

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On 8/7/2021 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

NEUTRALIZE Black progress by producing more Autistic Black boys as well as a host of disabling mental and physical defects.


Again allowing negroes to catch measles, mumps, or rubella would be more effective

 

On 8/7/2021 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

conflating


No I wasn’t.

 

On 8/7/2021 at 6:47 PM, Pioneer1 said:

cause more harm than good in the long term by allowing very weak genetically defective babies to not only grow up but even reproduce their defective and weak genes in their offspring


again, spoken like a true eugenist.

 

…I’ll finish next time I’m in front of a computer.

 

XcG7VhcXToCLcjLs5

 

 

 

 

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Troy

 

 

Again allowing negroes to catch measles, mumps, or rubella would be more effective

 

Maybe according to YOUR thinking, but not necessarily to the racists who MAY have designed these different programs.

 

Measles and mumps make people physically sick.
Perhaps they don't want a PHYSICALLY SICK population who they have to take care of and can't do any work for them.
Maybe they just want to screw up their MINDS so that they can physically work but but don't pose a threat.

 

 


again, spoken like a true eugenist.

 

Lol..well how many eugenists do you know to make that comparison??

The root of the word "eugenics" is EU....as in EUropean.

Eugenics is promoting EUROPEAN genes.

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On 8/10/2021 at 7:35 AM, Pioneer1 said:

Lol..well how many eugenists do you know to make that comparison??

 

Other than you, I'm not sure I know any others personally, but I've read about them.

 

On 8/10/2021 at 7:35 AM, Pioneer1 said:

The root of the word "eugenics" is EU....as in EUropean.

 

You kill me with your word derivations, LOL!   Eugenics is derived from the same root as the words Euphoria, Euphemism, meaning good.

 

But sure white racists used eugenics to justify their evil like enslaving Africans and gassing Jews...

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 8/7/2021 at 11:39 AM, Pioneer1 said:

Not only will I remember it...I'm likely gonna SAY IT AGAIN TO YOU, lol.

Got a lot a few people around here who like to deny reality and dwell in abstract/theoretical worlds.

 

I don't believe I do that. 

 

On 8/7/2021 at 11:39 AM, Pioneer1 said:

When Black folks were having our own babies at home with midwives the infant mortality rate may have been a little higher but the babies who grew up didn't have NEARLY the problems so many Black children have today.

 

I don't know about that, specifically. I do feel that, again, there is some truth to it though. But I don't believe that drugs have altered the brain to a great degree 'alone'. I feel that there are so many other factors as well, that have been a negative affect on Black people, and some of it has been brought about by our own actions as well. 

 

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Chev

 

 

I don't believe I do that. 

 

Trust me..lol...you do, from time to time.

 

 

 

 

 

But I don't believe that drugs have altered the brain to a great degree 'alone'. I feel that there are so many other factors as well, that have been a negative affect on Black people, and some of it has been brought about by our own actions as well. 

 

I actually agree with this statement 100%.

See....
Like I said; you don't ALWAYS deny reality, just SOMETIMES when it comes to religious discussions.

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