Jump to content

Miles Apart


Recommended Posts

In the latter years of his career, jazz legend Mils Davis and Prince became friends. During the MTV era in the 1980s Miles, looking very Princesque,  even made a video playing his version of Cyndi Lauper's, 'Time after time".  Jazz purists were miffed by Miles' cross over into the pop domain, but he brushed them off. ''So What?"  is vintage Miles, and a phrase that could sum up his approach to life. Also appearing on this video another jazz icon, John Coultrane.   https://fb.watch/8pW5Nyh5Hm/

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Miles Davis was another musical genius who refused to be shackled by Jazz purists. He was the trailblazer who kicked in the door for everything Jazz became as it was infused with electronics and Funk and became Fusion.

 

Miles' progeny of musicians is lengthy but his lead was followed by Herbie Hancock (Headhunters), Chick Corea (Return to Forever), Joe Zawinul and Wayne Shorter (Weather Report).

 

Miles Davis' influence rippled through every aspect of black music. The planet is better off that he visited too. 😎

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, ProfD said:

Miles Davis was another musical genius who refused to be shackled by Jazz purists. He was the trailblazer who kicked in the door for everything Jazz became as it was infused with electronics and Funk and became Fusion.

 

Miles' progeny of musicians is lengthy but his lead was followed by Herbie Hancock (Headhunters), Chick Corea (Return to Forever), Joe Zawinul and Wayne Shorter (Weather Report).

 

Miles Davis' influence rippled through every aspect of black music. The planet is better off that he visited too. 😎

Miles Davis was a contemporary of many jazz trailblazers, "straight ahead" cats  like Charlie Parker, Oscar Peterson, John Coltrane, Dizzy Gillespie, Wes Montgomery, Max Roach to name a few.  They all paved the way for the  jazz fushion movement and the saccharine "smooth jazz" brand.  Too bad that jazz, along with the Blues and the big band swing music of Count Basie and Duke Ellington and, of course,  negro spirituals, all of which were originated by black musicians are under-appreciated nowadays  due to the popularity of  Rap. and the longevity of R&B.  Delta Bluesman, Robert Johnson, so revered by white blues lovers, is thought to be a genius in his field. but appreciation for his lean laments is an acquired taste.  

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Surely, Miles' contemporaries were trailblazers in their own right. But, most of those cats remained straight ahead Jazz musicians. They did not embrace amplified instruments in the way Miles did on his landmark albums... "In a Silent Way" and Bitches Brew". Those records laid the groundwork for Fusion Jazz. 

 

While I'm extremely MOM (Musically Open Minded), I *hate* that "saccharine "smooth jazz" brand". There's zero soul in it. They removed all of the fat and calories and overloaded it with high fructose corn syrup.  Smooth Jazz will put your ears in a diabetic coma. 😁

 

But, as a musician and not to come off like a grumpy old man longing for the black music of yesteryear, there's still some cool stuff worthy listening to in the offspring that became Soul, R&B, Funk, Rap/Hip-Hop, Neo-Soul, etc.

 

Most musicians use their talent and influences to make music for their peers. So they're not consulting with and/or thinking about me and what I want to hear when they organize their noise (definition of music).

 

The further removed we are from the peer group for whom the music is intended, we either get in where we fit in or tune it out and rely on the soundtrack that shaped our lives i.e. the music made by our peers. 

 

Yeah, I can appreciate some newer music but mainly from the periphery because I know it wasn't made and/or intended for me.

 

However, I did watch Billie Holiday vs the US gov't movie. Andra Day who is a fantastic singer in her own right was excellent in her portrayal of a tortured soul.

 

Billie Holiday had her struggles but she was awesome behind that microphone. "Strange Fruit" is one of the best songs ever written and recorded. 😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Cynique said:

 

In the latter years of his career, jazz legend Mils Davis and Prince became friends. 

 

 

************************************************************************************

 

What about the gossip that Miles and Prince were getting busy?

 

Do you all think it's true???

 

 

prince2.jpg.6862cd38c9d0d9dc7171c717797c0e34.jpg

 

 

************************************************************************************ 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, Mzuri said:

What about the gossip that Miles and Prince were getting busy?

 

Do you all think it's true???

 

 

 

I do not believe there's any truth in that tea. Of course, I have no proof. 

 

However, I can imagine the mutual respect those two mercurial cats would have had for each as musicians.😎

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, ProfD said:

But, as a musician and not to come off like a grumpy old man longing for the black music of yesteryear, there's still some cool stuff worthy listening to in the offspring that became Soul, R&B, Funk, Rap/Hip-Hop, Neo-Soul, etc.

i wouldn't label someone who longed for the black music of yesteryear, as being a "grumpy old man".  i'd call them someone who  rightfully wants to preserve and respect the legacy of jazz classics that gave rise all the variations on a theme that followed the original. You must be a Millennial.   LOL 

1 hour ago, Mzuri said:

What about the gossip that Miles and Prince were getting busy?

 

Do you all think it's true???

 

i never heard those rumors. i have no idea whether they might be true. i tend to think Prince was straight.  i did hear that Miles was HIV positive something  he could've gotten from his heroin addiction and the exchange of needles.  It was also rumored  that this was the reason Cicely Tyson dropped him. i also heard later that he actually had sickle cell anemia. Whatever. May they both rest in peace.  

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, Cynique said:

i wouldn't label someone who longed for the black music of yesteryear, as being a "grumpy old man".  i'd call them someone who  rightfully wants to preserve and respect the legacy of jazz classics that gave rise all the variations on a theme that followed the original. You must be a Millennial.   LOL 

I'm definitely not a millennial. 😁

 

But, I know that music cannibalizes itself for better or worse depending on the listener.

 

As musicians, we're always trying to come up with something "new" using influences from the past. 

 

As the songwriter Benard Ighner penned on Quincy Jones record "Everything Must Change". 😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@ProfD  So do you think black jazz masters are not on a par with Beethoven, Mozart. Chopin , Shubert. Handel, et al, whose works are timeless and who hold  permanent places of honor in the annals of white classical music?  Why do you think vintage jazz artists and present day ones can't co-exist  and be judged on their individual merits???  Why does it have to be one or the other when it comes to listening to them? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So do you think black jazz masters are not on a par with Beethoven, Mozart. Chopin , Shubert. Handel, et al, whose works are timeless and who hold  permanent places of honor in the annals of white classical music? 

 

I absolutely do think black Jazz masters and their works are timeless on a par with and held in high regard within the Jazz community just like their European counterparts of classical music.

 

Why do you think vintage jazz artists and present day ones can't co-exist  and be judged on their individual merits???

 

Vintage Jazz artists and present day musicians do co-exist. The former are canonized. The latter are judged on their individual merits within their ability to interpret the music and keep it alive.

 

Within the Jazz community,  musicians do honor and respect the legacy of the past masters both in the way they play and as evidenced by the fact that there are plenty Jazz tunes (standards) that every Jazz musician should know.

 

Jazz musicians past up to present are still playing and recording standard tunes. A Traditional Jazz musician should be able to hit with other players on any Jazz gig, anywhere on the planet without a single rehearsal based on their common knowledge of tunes left to us by the giants of Jazz.

 

Why does it have to be one or the other when it comes to listening to them? 

 

That depends on the listener(s).  Jazz is America's classical music. But, it's also an acquired taste. When someone says they like Jazz, it helps to know what kind of Jazz they like. John Coltrane and Kenny G are worlds apart.

 

Traditional Jazz was a popular form of music from the 1930s through the mid-1960s. It's popularity began to wane as other styles of music emerged in the 1960s and beyond. As I mentioned, Miles incorporated new sounds into Jazz which led to different styles of it.

 

As a result, listeners moved accordingly. Like Brussels sprouts, a small group of folks still listen to and appreciate Traditional Jazz. I think most Jazz listeners nowadays prefer the McDonalds version of it. 😎

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Miles Davis was at the forefront of major changes in Jazz. Jazz stopped changing when he wasn't there to change it. I am not certain who made that quote. I was a Prince fan and more interested in Miles Davis as a personality. Although I heard him play live in the late 80's. He was one of those musicians I wanted to hear before either of us died. I am not a Jazz head but I have heard some of the greats.

and some of the newer musicians

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Delano said:

Miles Davis was at the forefront of major changes in Jazz. Jazz stopped changing when he wasn't there to change it. I am not certain who made that quote. I was a Prince fan and more interested in Miles Davis as a personality. Although I heard him play live in the late 80's. He was one of those musicians I wanted to hear before either of us died. I am not a Jazz head but I have heard some of the greats.

and some of the newer musicians

 

Miles is credited with "the birth of cool" after  he moved on following a short flirtation with the frenzy of BeBop.  I'm a late comer to the Miles cult. when he was  breaking ground, like a good 1950 college girl that I was, i was into Dave Brubeck. and his sideman saxophonist Paul Desmond   I was always a fan of jazz piano and i loved his style of playing it. this was way before his commercial hit Take 5. Yes, Brubeck was a white musician, but - it was the bland 1950s... 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I first saw Miles Davis on Miami Vice and a Honda Scooter ad. It was another few years before I came back to him.

There's a good radio show about Miles Davis narrated by Quincy Troupe. A poet who co-wrote his autobiography. It's called the Miles Davis Radio Project.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Cynique said:

Miles is credited with "the birth of cool" after  he moved on following a short flirtation with the frenzy of BeBop.  I'm a late comer to the Miles cult. when he was  breaking ground, like a good 1950 college girl that I was, i was into Dave Brubeck. and his sideman saxophonist Paul Desmond   I was always a fan of jazz piano and i loved his style of playing it. this was way before his commercial hit Take 5. Yes, Brubeck was a white musician, but - it was the bland 1950s... 

Dave brubeck and Erroll Garner were *hated* by Traditional Jazz musicians during that time. They were considered "cocktail" pianists. The modern equivalent would be Smooth Jazz. 😁😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, ProfD said:

Dave brubeck and Erroll Garner were *hated* by Traditional Jazz musicians during that time. They were considered "cocktail" pianists. The modern equivalent would be Smooth Jazz

Maybe Brubeck who was considered rather pedestrian by Jazz  aficiandos. But  not Errol Garner. He was a bona fide jazz pianist, -  a  genius who played by ear.  His "Concert by the Sea" album is considered a jazz classic. i was around "during that time". 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Cynique said:

Maybe Brubeck who was considered rather pedestrian by Jazz  aficiandos. But  not Errol Garner. He was a bona fide jazz pianist, -  a  genius who played by ear.  His "Concert by the Sea" album is considered a jazz classic. i was around "during that time". 

You're absolutely right about Erroll Garner. Awesome that you were there to witness his genius.

 

Erroll Garner was a monster Jazz pianist among his contemporaries and one of the greatest of all time. No doubt about it.

 

However, some traditional Jazz musicians and critics didn't appreciate the "ornamental" elements of Erroll Garner's playing and the audiences to whom he appealed.

 

Those musicians and critics didn't consider Garner's playing "hip" or "cool". To them, his style was "corny". Then, there was the phenomenal success of "Concert by the Sea". That drove them crazy. 😁

 

Nowadays, we call those people "haters". Since the beginning of time up to present, every supremely gifted and/or talented person has their share of them. It's par for the course.😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, ProfD said:

Nowadays, we call those people "haters". Since the beginning of time up to present, every supremely gifted and/or talented person has their share of them. It's par for the course.

Jazz elitists look upon their community as being esoteric, Once one of their of own gains broad acceptance by the public  this dulls their sheen in the eyes of these snobs. Dave Brubeck became tremendously popular and was anointed by Down Beat Magazine, which is the bible of the jazz world, but he was dismissed by certain critics.  Whatever.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

36 minutes ago, Cynique said:

Jazz elitists look upon their community as being esoteric, Once one of their of own gains broad acceptance by the public  this dulls their sheen in the eyes of these snobs. Dave Brubeck became tremendously popular and was anointed by Down Beat Magazine, which is the bible of the jazz world, but he was dismissed by certain critics.  Whatever.

Exactly.  Elitists and snobs still exist to this very day in all areas of human activity. 

 

In fact, shortly after the artist was born, so too was the critic.  It's widely belived that a critic is usually a failed artist. 😁

 

A gifted/talented but struggling musician or artist will be a god-send initially.  As soon as they pull in fame and/or fortune, the same folks who loved them in the trenches turn into haters. It's the craziest  sh8t but has been ongoing forever. 

 

I just conjured up an image of a bunch of slaves idolizing one of their own.  As soon as he or she got pulled up to the big house, they couldn't stand that n8gglet.  Nevermind that they were all still slaves.😁

 

Back from my detour...I'm thankful to the universe for sending trailblazers like Ellington, Tatum, Powell, Parker, Coltrane, Monk, Garner, etc. to name a short few. 

 

I think it's important for Jazz musicians especially to appreciate Herbie Hancock while he's still on planet too.  He's one of the few trailblazers of Jazz who's still with us. 😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@ProfDYes, Chicago's finest, Herbie Hancock,  has earned jazz immortality! along with his homeboy  Quincy Jones, and home girl Chaka Khan, a favorite of Fred Hampton who is from my suburb of Chicago hometown..    

 

Here is a cut from the album that launched Dave Brubeck into the jazz stratosphere. This is what woke up the 1950s silent generation and lured the "gray boys" away from Pat Boone and Elvis Presley. The R&B crowd at least tolerated him  and, for better or for worse. he's worth listening to if you're a jazz buff.  Saxophonist Paul Desmond was also underrated. Anyway, does this sound like "smooth jazz" or "cafe music" to you? 

 

 

   https://youtu.be/0fommAa94ow

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Cynique said:

@ProfDYes, Chicago's finest, Herbie Hancock,  has earned jazz immortality! along with his homeboy  Quincy Jones, and home girl Chaka Khan, a favorite of Fred Hampton who is from my suburb of Chicago hometown..    

 

Here is a cut from the album that launched Dave Brubeck into the jazz stratosphere. This is what woke up the 1950s silent generation and lured the "gray boys" away from Pat Boone and Elvis Presley. The R&B crowd at least tolerated him  and, for better or for worse. he's worth listening to if you're a jazz buff.  Saxophonist Paul Desmond was also underrated. Anyway, does this sound like "smooth jazz" or "cafe music" to you? 

 

Chaka Khan is my favorite singer.

 

The last time I attended Taste of Chicago, Chaka and Stevie Wonder (another favorite of mine) were performers. They were awesome.

 

Chaka, Herbie, Quincy, Curtis Mayfield, Gil Scott-Heron, etc., Chicago stand up. 

 

Dave Brubeck and Paul Desmond would have been perfect playing in Starbucks across the country. Their music wasn't sonic diabetes but cafe music for sho.😁😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@ "Whomever" I am blocked by a firewall named Go Daddy from stating new posts here. I can just add to my old posts or comment on someone else's thread.  My smart phone and my computer are hopelessly entangled because of me trying to register as myself on my smart phone so i could post from it, and then trying to unsuccessfully open another account under another screen name since i couldn't pull off the first procedure.  It's like artificial intelligence is getting its revenge on me.   

 

Of course, it's possible that the Universe is trying to tell me something to the effect that it's best to keep my thoughts to myself. Might be a quantum physics message cluing me that  all those posts I bypass don't exist because they are unobserved. Could even be I am being punished - or rewarded for divorcing my race.  Or - maybe Troy simply got tired of my pictures and music videos. Who can blame him? Whatever.   

 

See ya when i see ya.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Cynique said:

I am blocked by a firewall named Go Daddy from stating new posts here. I can just add to my old posts or comment on someone else's thread. 

@Troy  This also happens to me whenever you update the website.  In fact, the ad server is causing an additional page before I can get to the content I've selected. It is making the pages load painfully slow -which is frustrating.  Please help us!

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

************************************************************************************

 

 

@Cynique and @Mel Hopkins

 

 

I have had some glitchy experiences as well. 

 

On my iPhone, there are ads that have to be turned off before I can proceed.

I think it's the same thing that Mel described.

 

And on my desktop, sometimes when I click on a topic, the page is fogged

over and the web address turns to something about google, but it doesn't

happen that often.

 

I also don't see the point in displaying ads for things like tractors.  

 

Troy was asking why there isn't more  participation and I wonder if the

ads are having an impact, since some people don't like ads at all.

 

You Ladies should probably contact him directly since he might not

read all these comments.

 

 

 

                 image.gif.b05fef28d3e6760b4f9376c41adcdba5.gif

 

************************************************************************************

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are a lot of viruses period going around on the internet.
There's no telling what these devils may have put out to jam up people's systems.

I'm not a computer expert but I don't understand why they have to be so complicated in the first place.
They MAKE them so that they're vulnerable to glitches and viruses.

On top of that......

When dial-up first came out it was moving fast.
Then the DSL cable came out....and dial-up started "slowing down".  If you wanted faster service you had to go with DSL.
The wifi became more prevalent....then DSL mysteriously started "slowing down" so that everyone gets wifi.

It's a GAME these people are playing.
They make up a bunch of damn problems just to get you to spend more money to get back to where you were originally.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, Cynique said:

@ "Whomever" I am blocked by a firewall named Go Daddy from starting new posts here. I can just add to my old posts or comment on someone else's thread.    

Same here. I'm fairly computer literate but haven't put any extra effort into figuring out the problem. 😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...