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You Betrayed Us / The Abortion Decision Is Indirectly The Fault of AfroAmericans


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A few months ago I was having a conversation with an older White woman in her 70s and we were talking about the Civil Rights movement and why so many White women today voted for and supported Donald Trump and the Republican party and she said something that made a lot of sense.

She said back in the 60s and 70s White women saw the Black Power movement as an opportunity to break the strangle-hold that White men had on the reigns of power in this country and they decided to link up with us and take advantage of that collapse to free themselves.
But since then, the Black power movement has waned with integration and White men have slowly gained much of their power back....especially when Reagan got back in office.

She said a lot of liberal and radical White women felt betrayed by the Civil Rights generation who decided to stop fighting "the man".

She said that White women subconsciously know they can't rely on Black men to protect them from the power of White men so there's no real benefit in being strong allies with us politically or socially.
Some people would have been insulted or puzzled by this....but I found it profoundly insightful and it explained a lot.....AND it made sense.

There are a lot of people who WOULD like to side with AfroAmericans and help us out against racial abuse, but what benefit would it provide for them and who would come to their rescue when the White Establishment goes after THEM?

 


Why do I bring this up now?

 

Because I believe this abortion decision handed down by the courts is INDIRECTLY our fault.

 

We (especially AfroAmerican men) are hands-down the most feared demographic in this nation.  And when WE stand up and put our foot down on something....it get's done.
Even when only a percentage of us decide to do it.
All it takes is a decisive percentage of Black people to stand up and raise sand about something and we bring society to a halt and things get done.
I've seen examples of this more times than you can count

.

So when Black people STOP fighting.
STOP standing up for Progressive idealogy and turn to self-destruction, drug use, indifference, apathy, or just plain juvenile infighting and immature entertainment....it allows the right-wing in this nation to run wild.

 

The election of Trump.
The routine stealing of elections since 2000.
And this latest abortion ruling is just SOME of the many examples.
 

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23 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

There are a lot of people who WOULD like to side with AfroAmericans and help us out against racial abuse, but what benefit would it provide for them and who would come to their rescue when the White Establishment goes after THEM?

 

When you have a breakfast of eggs and bacon - you'll see the chicken made a contribution but the pig made a commitment.  As you can see in a supremacists' nation, 'white' women contribute.  They can go back to their neighborhoods and blend in.  But Black Men like Martin Luther King, Jr,  Malcolm X, Medgar Evers,  Fred Hampton et al, made commitments.  It's those commitments that leave our community with PTSD .  We don't give up we just fall back for a moment.  Those who are with us - stay with us.  So betrayal in this context is disingenuous. 

 

And this one... that speaks to commitment 

 

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You know, of course, that Fred Hampton, Chairman of the Illinois Chapter of the Black Panther Party was from my home town. Not really a contemporary of his,  I, nevertheless, watched him transform from an idealistic NAACP youth council leader into a radicalized black militant. As  an onlooker I knew i was witnessing history in the making.  A few years later, i stood in the long line to view his body and - to wonder what the future held.   And here we are...

 

                    446343906_fredhamptonstatue.jpg.4a7756d39bc20f677c5d3835e413affd.jpg

A bust of Hampton is on display outside of the local swimming pool named in his honor.  He promised the young black kids who had no place to swim that he would one day change  that.  And he did. 

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  • Pioneer1 changed the title to You Betrayed Us / The Abortion Decision Is Indirectly The Fault of AfroAmericans

Mel


As you can see in a supremacists' nation, 'white' women contribute.  They can go back to their neighborhoods and blend in.  But Black Men like Martin Luther King, Jr,  Malcolm X, Medgar Evers,  Fred Hampton et al, made commitments.  It's those commitments that leave our community with PTSD .  We don't give up we just fall back for a moment.  Those who are with us - stay with us.  So betrayal in this context is disingenuous. 

 

Yes most White women are loyal to the system of racism in this nation, but so are many if not most BLACK PEOPLE!

If you look at more than just behavior but INTENT and DESIRE...you'll discover that the only difference is that they being White can blend in easier and get farther with White men than our people...most of whom WISH they were in that position!


Now, from an emotional point of view, you're right.

According to Greg...lol....the "hood talk" the questions are:

You DOWN with us?
Are you a REAL RIDER?
Are you RIDE OR DIE?

 

We want people to be loyal to us through thick and thin no matter what.

 

However from a more coldly logical point of view.....

Everyone in an alliance has to have something to bring to the table.


White women who are NOT spies and agents but genuinely want to destroy the stranglehold that White males have on this society can bring their wealth as well as their nearest to White men to the table to be used as a benefit in this struggle.

But as a White woman, what benefit do I have being loyal to people who have shown time and time again that they will fight to  accomplish a goal but won't fight to keep it?
Let alone have the economic, legal, and social power to protect me if I throw my lot in with them?


With sucn a history of instability, it's hard to separate those who are "genuinely" (for lack of a better term) racist and those who are racist out of disappointment and a feeling of betrayal after formerly siding with us to go after the system.
 

It's like a son who stands up for his abused mother only for her to embrace her abuser over and over again.
This causes disappointment and confusion is his mind.

 

 

 

 


Mel and Cynique

 

I respect Fred Hampton as an intelligent and brave young man who stood up for and died for his beliefs, however I'm not in alignment WITH those beliefs.
I believe he was slightly off the mark.

 

He was a Black Panther and like many if not most Panthers he supported Marxist or Communist ideas that go contrary to the African way.

He erroneously believed that racism was a by-product of Capitalism when in truth, it was the other way around.
As was Communism.
 

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9 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

With sucn a history of instability, it's hard to separate those who are "genuinely" (for lack of a better term) racist and those who are racist out of disappointment and a feeling of betrayal after formerly siding with us to go after the system.

 

OMG, whyte people CAUSED our history of instability! 😂

 

Every time we set up shop somewhere, they make laws to knock them down. Are you kidding me? Have you been drinking "Flint Water"... 

 

Do you remember the Emergency Manager law in Michigan that led to poisoning the water? https://ccrjustice.org/home/press-center/press-releases/law-led-poisoned-flint-water-racially-discriminatory-civil-rights

  

How about the law that Robert Moses used to build the cross Bronx expressway that allowed the Bronx to be decimated? https://pages.vassar.edu/realarchaeology/2019/11/10/the-cross-bronx-expressway-and-the-ruination-of-the-bronx/ 

 

 How about the law passed in South Carolina that is displacing families... https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/interactive/2021/highways-black-homes-removal-racism/

 

NORTH CHARLESTON, S.C. — Weary-eyed and feeling all of her 85 years, Hattie Anderson doesn't want to fight anymore.

For most of her life, she held on to the large plot of land that she and her late husband Samuel pinched pennies to buy — even after the state ran a freeway through their mostly Black community after the city used eminent domain to take nearly nine acres for a sewage drain, and after the state added a beltway. But now, as state officials plan another major road expansion, Anderson is offering to sell them her land and leave.

"If they don't take my house," she said, "I'm going to be just in a little corner, in a little hole by myself. Where I am, it's like a dead end."

 

How about the whole ass beach front property whyte folks took from a black family, destroying their legacy, any opportunity to build generational wealth and have a place for black families to go when they weren't allowed anywhere else... After 93 years of fighting, they are finally getting their property back! https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/la-county-return-bruces-beach-black-family-descendants/2923656/

 

Black people have never stopped working to get this country to live up to its ideals of a more perfect union that Madison, Hamilton, and 'em drafted.

Whyte folks keep displacing us, so we must do our work on the run.  But every time they knock us down, we get up again. 

 

Eff their disappointment. I call B.S. on those "worthless whyte women."  

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Mel


When I speak of our instability....I'm talking about our political instability and what we're willing to fight for, not necessarily the GENERAL instability in our community. However that said....

White people caused MUCH of the instability of our community but not all of it, and probably not even most of it.

Our people have a long history of infighting and jealousy among eahcother that goes back centuries even before the Trans Atlantic Slave Trade.

Our INTERNAL instability and being so divided over petty differences is what allowed Caucasians to take advantage of us in the first place and is STILL the primary source of their power.

 

The Flint Water Crisis that you brought up is a perfect example....

 

Flint is a majority Black city with a majority Black city council and a Black mayor.
So why did they ALLOW White folks to come in and poison their water without physically stopping them from doing so?
Infact, given the history of Caucasians in general....why didn't they AUTOMATICALLY suspect them of being up to no good before it got this far?

 

Black people don't have a history of poisoning the water in White communities....yet in most White communities a Black man can go strolling down the street without being noticed and suspected of not belonging there and being up to no good!
 

Back in 2016 when it jumped off me and some other people went up to Flint and found out that a few years earlier they had even re-arranged the pipes underground so that the water would affect only certain neighborhoods.
YES I blame the racists for this....but I blame that Black people of the city even MORE because they aren't a bunch of squirrels, they could have seen what was going on and put an end to it if they WANTED to.


When I was doing community work for the homeless....it was the White people (whether they were sincere or not I don't know) who were more willing to fight and challenge the city and county than the majority of the Black people who were homeless themselves!

 

"We" as a community aren't getting up and fighting....a SMALL PERCENTAGE of our people have and that's what got us our rights.
Most of our people AREN'T fighting but are either selling out or DESIRE to sell out but don't know where to start...lol.

It's a SMALL PERCENTAGE of intelligent and brave Black people who are carrying the load for the rest of the community who benefits from their labor.
And the small percentage of Black people who are willing to stand up and fight and challenge the system has gotten smaller and smaller over the past few decades and has brought us to where we are right now.

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1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

I respect Fred Hampton as an intelligent and brave young man who stood up for and died for his beliefs, however I'm not in alignment WITH those beliefs.
I believe he was slightly off the mark.

 

He was a Black Panther and like many if not most Panthers he supported Marxist or Communist ideas that go contrary to the African way.

He erroneously believed that racism was a by-product of Capitalism when in truth, it was the other way around.
As was Communism.
 

@Pioneer1Enter the straw man argument. Offering a reason for your not being a supporter of Fred Hampton's politics was in response to what?  Who said i was aligned with his beliefs? 

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5 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

When I speak of our instability....I'm talking about our political instability

I've pulled up enough links today to support my position.

 

So, I'm going to ask you to pull up our record of social and civil movements, voting history  and institutions since black men got the right to vote in 1870... That gives you 5 years grace period from enslavement.  And then tell me with evidence, that we haven't continuously moved to make this place equitable since 1870.  Note: Black Women didn't get to vote until 1920.

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 No offense but Blacks really arent known for getting abortions and using birth control. I understand over turning Roe vs Wade is a great talking point and a reason to start riots and everything but Cmon !!!!!! Does it really affect blacks ? No.

Most blacks live in Liberal area’s where abotions will still be performed anyway so why all the fake outrage??? It wont affect anyone living in a democratic state and most blacks dont get abortions. Whats the issue????

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19 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

When I was doing community work for the homeless....it was the White people (whether they were sincere or not I don't know) who were more willing to fight and challenge the city and county than the majority of the Black people who were homeless themselves!

 

You may have seen some white people out there working with you but they make up the majority of the population. Pareto Principle - If 20 percent of the people do 80 percent of the work then you will see 8,200,000 black people working in the social movements alongside  46,200,000 white folks.  AND we don't live in the same states!  So please don't say black people aren't working - there are 41 million black people in the U.S. and as usual we are working twice as hard to get half as much.  

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Mel


I've pulled up enough links today to support my position.

So, I'm going to ask you to pull up our record of social and civil movements, voting history  and institutions since black men got the right to vote in 1870... That gives you 5 years grace period from enslavement.  And then tell me with evidence, that we haven't continuously moved to make this place equitable since 1870.  Note: Black Women didn't get to vote until 1920.
 

I didn't say we haven't.
That's not my argument.

My argument was that:

a) Only a HANDFUL of people in our community have been the ones doing the fighting, not the majority or even a sizeable percentage.
and
b) Our community has been too politically and socially unstable to form alliances with other groups.

A few quick examples would be the fact that a Black man (Uncle Tom Thomas) helped overturn Roe vs Wade.
Another is that of all people....BLACK people (especially Black men) INCREASED their support for an open racist like Trump:

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-54972389 

https://www.thedailybeast.com/more-black-men-went-with-trump-this-time-i-asked-a-few-of-them-why 

https://thecincinnatiherald.com/2020/11/one-in-three-black-men-backed-trump-in-blue-wall-states/ 

 

Trump displayed more open racism than any President in modern history and for some reason his support among many AfroAmericans INCREASED.
I know this to be true based on personal observation.
 

 

 

You may have seen some white people out there working with you but they make up the majority of the population. Pareto Principle - If 20 percent of the people do 80 percent of the work then you will see 8,200,000 black people working in the social movements alongside  46,200,000 white folks.  AND we don't live in the same states!  So please don't say black people aren't working - there are 41 million black people in the U.S. and as usual we are working twice as hard to get half as much.

 

Slow down and CALM down...

 

You are arguing against points that I haven't even made!


I said the Whites who WERE working with me were more hyped and ready to fight and take on the system than the Black people there, including the Black people who were homeless.

It wasn't a matter of who made up the majority in the organization, it was a matter of DESIRE and who wanted to be in the movement and more importantly who wanted to be ACTIVE in the movements itself.


Our movements were founded by Black people like myself, but often times when Whites would join we had to FIGHT TO KEEP THEM FROM TAKING OVER!
They'd show up at every meeting and offering all kinds of suggestions while most of the Black folks who DID come would be chilling at the back of the room.
 

They showed more of a DESIRE to confront the system and make changes....even if they weren't sincere about it and had other motives.  They atleast put on a good show.

I couldn't even get the average negro to do THAT.
Couldn't get him to even PRETEND to give a damn...lol.

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21 minutes ago, Greg said:

Most blacks live in Liberal area’s where abotions will still be performed anyway so why all the fake outrage??? It wont affect anyone living in a democratic state and most blacks dont get abortions. Whats the issue????

Most blacks live in the states where the abortion laws are going into effect, Greg.  If you bothered to look at an actual report from an reputable agency that keeps all the statistical health records you'd see that majority of black people live in republican-run states.  

"The 10 states where 60 percent of African Americans resided were: New York, California, Texas, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, North Carolina, Maryland, Michigan and Louisiana. Five of these had more than 2 million Blacks each: New York, California, Texas, Florida and Georgia." - Census

You'd also learn, that births are down in every ethnic group - while academic degrees are up. 

 

BUT THE ISSUE IS BODILY AUTONOMY!!! No one should have the right to tell you what to do with your body.  Did you like the mask mandate? How about the vaccine mandate?  How about a mandatory vasectomy? 

12 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

Slow down and CALM down...

😂😂😅  If I had a nickel for every time a man said that to me.. I'd be as rich as Elon Musk LOL

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20 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Whites who WERE working with me were more hyped and ready to fight and take on the system

Ok fair 

 

22 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

I said the Whites who WERE working with me were more hyped and ready to fight and take on the system than the Black people there, including the Black people who were homeless.

It wasn't a matter of who made up the majority in the organization, it was a matter of DESIRE and who wanted to be in the movement and more importantly who wanted to be ACTIVE in the movements itself.


Our movements were founded by Black people like myself, but often times when Whites would join we had to FIGHT TO KEEP THEM FROM TAKING OVER!
They'd show up at every meeting and offering all kinds of suggestions while most of the Black folks who DID come would be chilling at the back of the room.
 

They showed more of a DESIRE to confront the system and make changes....even if they weren't sincere about it and had other motives.  They atleast put on a good show.

I couldn't even get the average negro to do THAT.
Couldn't get him to even PRETEND to give a damn...lol.

 

Ok. I've had this same experience... I misunderstood your perspective - it felt like you were saying we gave up.  Because there are so many people fighting to make this better than we found it.  And let me tell you, you working to help folks who can't/won't help themselves especially when they want the help is hella sexy. 😍

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8 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

BTW...
You've been extra nice and attentive to me lately.
For some reason, I feel that the other shoe is about to drop.....lol

 

LOL! Maybe later but for now... I missed you so much🥰

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Mel

 

Wow...☺️
What a way to start off the week!

 

 

 

Cynique

 

 

 Offering a reason for your not being a supporter of Fred Hampton's politics was in response to what? 

 

Your and Mel's posts featuring him.

 

 


 Who said i was aligned with his beliefs? 

 

Who accused you of being so?

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@Pioneer1, while running for POTUS, as Senator John McCain told the white woman who was disparaging future POTUS Barack Obama..."I'm not gonna let you do that...he's a good man."😁

 

In the grand scheme of things, white women know their place especially within the system of racism. They're always on code.

 

The reason white women aligned their movement with AfroAmerican Civil Rights movement is because white men were vulnerable and listening. 

 

White men used the white women's movement as a way to put another layer between themselves and AfroAmericans. That's why white women earn more than black folks. 

 

White men got a 2 for 1 deal.  They were able to calm down the home front and add another income to the household. 

 

IMO, white women weren't betrayed by black men during the Civil Rights struggle. They used it to their benefit. 

 

While it may never happen, if there was a race war, rest assured that white women would do as Dolly Parton instructed when she sang...stand by your man.

 

Yep. Lilly will be locked and loaded with an AR-15 or Smith & Wesson busting shots just like her daddy taught her as a teenager. She might even be wearing a p8ssy hat. 🤣😎

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4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Trump displayed more open racism than any President in modern history and for some reason his support among many AfroAmericans INCREASED.
I know this to be true based on personal observation.
 


I said this in 2016 even before Trump was elected and was attacked. Then I repeated my allegation just before Joe Biden defeated Trump and wouldn't ya know it? I got attacked again.

I actually posted LINKS from reputable publications acknowledging how many Black men and women had abandoned their people who were still struggling and chose to support Trump.  But I was later accused of not proving my contentions. All I could do is laugh and realize the turncoat problem is much worse than anyone thinks. 

So, why don't we ask the political turncoats to list for us what exactly has Trump accomplished for Black people? Except insult us a lot.

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@Stefan, it's not surprising that you were attacked by black right-wing defendants. Black folks supporting racists goes back to slavery. 

 

Slaves would snitch on those who had escaped and they would whip those who had been recaptured and/or committed other infractions. 

 

Nowadays, black folks (police officers, lawyers, judges, correctional officers, etc.),  enforce racist laws against their own people just as effectively if not better than the white folks who put the laws in place.

 

So, politically, there's no shortage of black folks who will see that half full/half empty jar in one direction or the other and drink up the Kool-Aid. 

 

I've asked women what their rationale was for staying with someone folks would consider a *no good* man.  The response I received fell along the lines of...I'd rather stay with the devil I know rather than pick up a new one.  

 

Black folks are faced with the same conundrum.  Support a racist that has revealed it or align with a racist suspect. 😎

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 Complacency

The space between the rock and the hard place. 

 

 

Shirley Chisholm, U.S. Representative, NY - 12th District, 1969-1983, ahead of time and on time! 

 

Edited by Mel Hopkins
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Some may not be aware that decades ago, many Negroes who managed to snag a power position often lorded it over other Negroes who lacked their standing.

In company offices, (before the term corporations was universally adopted), we called these ones HNIC's. For Head Nigger in Charge. And man, did many enjoy the little bit of power they had. 

From some of their actions and sense of entitlement, I vowed that if I ever became a manager, to treat everyone with respect. And I did. 

It's a sad individual who's been little regarded most of their life and when they get a piece of power, they act as if they're demented sultans. Drunk with the authority to supervise, some will embark on campaigns to make others' lives miserable. You see this is a lot in retail, fast food and in the lower echelons of the job market. 

We'll always have such folks. But the people I am focusing on are the egocentric knuckleheads who see themselves as superior to  other Blacks. These toadies are the dangerous ones. Along with the insecure and envious, these will seek to undermine, frustrate and if they can, destroy any other Black that can do something they cannot. Jealousy kills people. Believe it.

Be extremely wary of such individuals and create your own support group and sounding board. 

This is how we members of the National Association of Black Journalists managed to survive the constant brickbats, lies and phony complaints many of us had to endure from White counterparts.

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Stefan

 

As Pro-Black as I am....I understand SOME of the reasons many of our people sell out.

 

For one thing, what "benefit" is it in being loyal to other Black folks when you do reach a higher position of power?

Often times it's the WHITE FOLKS who put you in that higher position, not other Black folks.  So human nature encourages you to be loyal to and beholden to whoever is giving you the most benefits.

 

Yes, many Black folks who get positions of power "lord" it over other Black folks. But more often than not, it's more like SCOLDING other Black folks for not being more ambitious and SEEKING higher positions in a business or government.
I don't know how many times I've asked other Black folks at the various jobs I've had to apply for manager, supervisor, assistant manager and other positions of power and they didn't want the responsibility.  

A lot of our people are in the subservient positions they're in because they SEEK to remain in them. Power and more responsibility seems to scare them.

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@Pioneer1

Your theory may not always hold water. I never sold out. And while some Black supervisors and managers I knew did, this was more a result of self-doubt. But many others I knew steadfastly refused to.

When you are secure in your ability, happy in your own skin and confident in your own talent, there is no need to attack others or try to diminish them. Only a behind-the-scenes fear of failing pushes one to act this way.

Theory sounds nice - in principle. But nothing replaces years of experience seeing this up close. 

I will NEVER understand why some Black people sell out, especially if they know their actions will hurt another Black Man or Woman. Or a Friend.

That's being a Coward. You know this person. You know they are as human as you. Now, they may not have the same talent level.

But you're still okay with undermining them? Do you ever think about if they have a family? Children? A partner? A mother or father who may be proud of them?

You are honestly fine with the psychological blow you may deliver to their self-esteem? To those who may depend on them? 

We are better than this. We have a duty to uplift and protect all.

Okay, so you may not feel like helping. But at least don't hurt. 

 

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Stefan

 

What you're describing are the values that work in an IDEAL WORLD.

 

It sounds like a Meritocracy, where virtues like honor and loyalty are extoled.

 

But that's not THIS society.

In THIS society, the Uncle Toms and Sell Outs often times get more benefits and support from the White racists than their own people if they would remain loyal to them.


-You go to a job and start kissing White folks ass....they give you a promotion, a better job with more money and invite you to various parties.

 

-You "keep it real" and stay loyal to the niggaz and you end up being lied on, have your things stolen, end up being threatened in the parking lot for looking at somebody's woman, and don't even get a pleasant "good morning" when you come in.

If you get fired, the niggaz you were loyal to don't even look in your direction when you're fired and escorted out of the office.

In this society, often times there are simply more TANGIBLE BENEFITS to get from selling out than being loyal to your own.

The Black community needs to make the environment more enjoyable and beneficial to dissuade people FROM selling out rather than relying on "loyalty" and other intangible values that don't pay the bills.

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