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29 minutes ago, Chevdove said:

 

@Michel Montvert Oh! Where's your evidence to prove against my evidence!? I provided reference from WHITE people!

Now you are trying to interject that I don't respect White people for being positive and worthy scholars. LOL.

 

 

SEE you supremacist go again--LOL! inserting comments to suggest that some else has said something that they really did not say.

I did NOT use the word GENOCIDE, but previously you tried to relay that. I carefully used the word MASSACRE! LOL. 

I could have used the phrase genocidal attempt, but my word 'massacre' was sufficient to relay the point that the Europeans did wipe out the Orginal Mayans--AFRICANS.

 

You can babble on about 'me saying that primitive hominids not having YDNA'-- THERE YOU GO AGAIN, BEING A SUPREMACIST.

 

I repeatedly responded to you in that I agree that Neanderthals had to have YDNA, because they did reproduce!!!

However, they could NOT produce ANY VIABLE OFFSPRING THAT WAS MALE. The only offspring they could reproduce was either INTERSEXED or FEMALE.

PERIOD!!! Neanderthals came from DENISOVANS and these 'black' hominids were completely extinct while the Neanderthals existed for a long time afterwards.

MY REFERENCE--One would be the Smithsonian!!! GO CHECK IT OUT!

 

LOL!

 

 

 

 

 

That's bullshit

 

I hope to present research about the White movement in ancient times.

 

 

LOL! Okay, I call a truce on this because I don't agree with the NOI teaching. That Pioneer1. He puts out a lot of that belief, not me.

Again, I provided you references and you've not address any of it.

You speak against the late Ivan Van Sertima, and I have given you other references to support him.

 

the 500 Nations documentary-Kevin Cosner

The Son of the Morning Star [?] book by a Native American

etc.

 

 

 

LOL! I agree with you on this one.

That, imo is racist garbage.

 

There is no "supremacism" in anything I said. Apparently if I disagree with you that makes me a supremacist. For a white supremacist I must be a huge failure, because I was married to a Jew and 2 Mexicans. I don't think the Klan would approve. You don't know me, but I am minimally even connected to whites at all. The white people here in Virginia I do not see as my people, I do not really know how to talk to them. Anyway. my comments here have been in defense of American Indians. not whites.

 

No, you are confused about Y-DNA. Neandertals produced males just fine. The problem was when they interbred with sapiens. the male offspring usually did not survive due to genetic incompatibility. That is to what you refer, I'm sure. Neandertals and sapiens split 900k years ago and so there are genetic problems with their interbreeding. Neandertals and Denisovans were on that same line which split from sapiens. They then split subsequently. More accurately. probably, would be to say that they both evolved from Homo antecessor. The sapiens line at that time was Homo bodoensis (formerly called heidelbergensis), as sapiens didn't evolve until 300k yrs ago, from what we now know.

 

What evidence do you have for white racism in ancient times? I've never seen it. The Greeks, for example, called nearly all non-Greeks "barbarians", whether they were black, white or other. I'm sure the Greeks had a higher opinion of black Egyptians than they did of white Celts. And I've seen no evidence that the Romans gave a damn about skin color. There were blacks in the Legions. and in fact one town in England was discovered to have African DNA in nearly everyone in the town, due to retired Legionnaires who'd settled there and been absorbed by the Britons.

 

Racism is unnatural, and to think that whites somehow are inherently racist is nonsense. Racism as we know it was developed to rationalize the abuse of non-Europeans who were just being "discovered". They had no theories of black inferiority when black Moors were oppressing them and enslaving whites. They developed those theories to justify THEIR oppression against Africans (and others).

 

Ok let's not flame war. Ultimately we're on the same side, just in being anti-racist if nothing else.

 

 

The early Olmecs originated adjacent to the Maya, in Soconusco. The Mayan calendar was developed in that time. Olmec culture can be easily traced with continuity from the Gulf Coast back to Soconusco.

 

Good point this guy makes about Afrocentrism and Eurocentrism. But the salient point: NO genetic evidence of any but Native Americans has been found in America, specifically in the Olmec region.

 

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21 hours ago, Michel Montvert said:

No, you are confused about Y-DNA. Neandertals produced males just fine. The problem was when they interbred with sapiens. the male offspring usually did not survive due to genetic incompatibility. That is to what you refer, I'm sure. Neandertals and sapiens split 900k years ago and so there are genetic problems with their interbreeding. Neandertals and Denisovans were on that same line which split from sapiens. They then split subsequently. More accurately. probably, would be to say that they both evolved from Homo antecessor. The sapiens line at that time was Homo bodoensis (formerly called heidelbergensis), as sapiens didn't evolve until 300k yrs ago, from what we now know.

 

@Michel Montvert

 This statement you made is totally insane! You have presented no proof! ALL OF THE SCIENTIST WORLDWIDE still say they have not been able to get one single YDNA from any male Neanderthal, and that is because THEY WERE NOT VIABLE PURE YDNA males themselves. 

 

"Neandertals produced males just fine."

 

That is crazy! LOL. You have not proof. The YDNA sample that they recently CONSTRUCTED was done with modern Male YDNA. That is why you do not hear any other reports. Prior to the Creation of the African male, all earlier hominids were COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ANYWAY, that's what the Bible reveals, and I hope to shed more research on that later. Prior to the Creation of mankind with STRAIGHT VIABLE YDNA from which ALL MODERN MANKIND STEMS FROM, the primitive hominids that were male were totally different as MALES. The problem with the NEANDERTHALENSIS SPECIES is that they are DENISOVANS THAT MUTATED and this is the key to why they could not produce MALES like the DENISOVANS. 

 

"Neandertals and Denisovans were on that same line which split from sapiens."

 

No that's not what the scientiest of the Smithosonian say! The Denisovans were wiped out thousands of years before the Neanderthals. The Neanderthals existed on this planet as the only primitive hominids for thousands of years before the modern mankind manifested. 

 

"The sapiens line at that time was Homo bodoensis (formerly called heidelbergensis), as sapiens didn't evolve until 300k yrs ago, from what we now know."

 

There is no proof! NONE. I saw the heidelbergensis in the Smithsonian and the date given is way before modern mankind. 

The 3 trees that I presented provide absolute evidence that all mondernmankind stem from the A HAPLOGROUP and one African male individual. 

 

21 hours ago, Michel Montvert said:

Good point this guy makes about Afrocentrism and Eurocentrism. But the salient point: NO genetic evidence of any but Native Americans has been found in America, specifically in the Olmec region.

 

 

"NO genetic evidence of any but Native Americans has been found in America"

 

And this then is the repeated statement you keep making that proves to show that you are the most extreme White Supremacist of any kind.

For you to have the entitled freedom to come into a Black community and TELL US NEGROES this unsupported belief of yous with NO evidence is so disrespectful and an insult. For you to dismiss my evidence of the genealogy trees and say that there is no evidence the Native Americans being connected to their AFRICAN ORIGINS is so disrespectful. 

 

Even in Africa, the haplogroups vary amongst Africans, so what give you the right to define the haplgroups of Native Americans as showing no original 'African' traits!?

 

THE ANSWER IS you are a supremacist and can't bring youself to accept scientific evidence that you cannot say this as being truth about Native Americans.

The problem is that you cannot say anything about the White Europeans coming into all of the ancient Americas and launched a massive movement of initially killing off the African Natives of the Americas with a genocidal attempt long before they turned against the Straight-haired Natives and went them too with evil intent. 

 

White racist people can never accept that they stem from African people so, they try to say that earlier hominids were here as male and female and that is just not true!!!

 

Are you a racist @Michel Montvert[?]--No, I don't completely believe that you are, however, you are a supremacist based on what you are doing here. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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28 minutes ago, Chevdove said:

 

@Michel Montvert

 This statement you made is totally insane! You have presented no proof! ALL OF THE SCIENTIST WORLDWIDE still say they have not been able to get one single YDNA from any male Neanderthal, and that is because THEY WERE NOT VIABLE PURE YDNA males themselves. 

 

"Neandertals produced males just fine."

 

That is crazy! LOL. You have not proof. The YDNA sample that they recently CONSTRUCTED was done with modern Male YDNA. That is why you do not hear any other reports. Prior to the Creation of the African male, all earlier hominids were COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ANYWAY, that's what the Bible reveals, and I hope to shed more research on that later. Prior to the Creation of mankind with STRAIGHT VIABLE YDNA from which ALL MODERN MANKIND STEMS FROM, the primitive hominids that were male were totally different as MALES. The problem with the NEANDERTHALENSIS SPECIES is that they are DENISOVANS THAT MUTATED and this is the key to why they could not produce MALES like the DENISOVANS. 

 

"Neandertals and Denisovans were on that same line which split from sapiens."

 

No that's not what the scientiest of the Smithosonian say! The Denisovans were wiped out thousands of years before the Neanderthals. The Neanderthals existed on this planet as the only primitive hominids for thousands of years before the modern mankind manifested. 

 

"The sapiens line at that time was Homo bodoensis (formerly called heidelbergensis), as sapiens didn't evolve until 300k yrs ago, from what we now know."

 

There is no proof! NONE. I saw the heidelbergensis in the Smithsonian and the date given is way before modern mankind. 

The 3 trees that I presented provide absolute evidence that all mondernmankind stem from the A HAPLOGROUP and one African male individual. 

 

 

 

"NO genetic evidence of any but Native Americans has been found in America"

 

And this then is the repeated statement you keep making that proves to show that you are the most extreme White Supremacist of any kind.

For you to have the entitled freedom to come into a Black community and TELL US NEGROES this unsupported belief of yous with NO evidence is so disrespectful and an insult. For you to dismiss my evidence of the genealogy trees and say that there is no evidence the Native Americans being connected to their AFRICAN ORIGINS is so disrespectful. 

 

Even in Africa, the haplogroups vary amongst Africans, so what give you the right to define the haplgroups of Native Americans as showing no original 'African' traits!?

 

THE ANSWER IS you are a supremacist and can't bring youself to accept scientific evidence that you cannot say this as being truth about Native Americans.

The problem is that you cannot say anything about the White Europeans coming into all of the ancient Americas and launched a massive movement of initially killing off the African Natives of the Americas with a genocidal attempt long before they turned against the Straight-haired Natives and went them too with evil intent. 

 

White racist people can never accept that they stem from African people so, they try to say that earlier hominids were here as male and female and that is just not true!!!

 

Are you a racist @Michel Montvert[?]--No, I don't completely believe that you are, however, you are a supremacist based on what you are doing here. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That is utter nonsense. A supremacist? For saying the Olmec and Maya were 100% Native, I'm a supremacist?  That doesn't even make sense.

 

And you do not understand DNA. obviously. All mammalian species have males, with Y-DNA. Look at chimps. They have males. So did neandertals. There is no Y-DNA analyzed from neandertals because DNA decays! And in the damp climate of Europe it decays faster than in a dry place like Syria. It is not that neandertals lacked Y-DNA, it is that we've so far been unable to extract a sample.

 

Whites online and elsewhere are constantly accusing me of "hating white people" because I criticize them for their racism. So if I'm a racist, I must hate the entire human race. And in fact humans as a whole do piss me off...

 

Why would I be on a black forum? Because AA forums are the best ones! There's more of interest, more intelligence. Most forums are shit shows. This one is a breath of fresh air. This is true generally of AA sites online.

 

I've lost track of what you're arguing. I know that there is ZERO evidence for Africans or anyone else in America, so really this gets down to... see if you can find evidence. I keep up with anthropology and know very well that there is none. or I'd have heard of it. Show us: African boats, African human remains. African DNA. African cultural items, African crops. I am requesting that evidence if you are going to persist in supporting unfounded theories about human migrations.

 

Just the facts, ma'am.

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4 minutes ago, Michel Montvert said:

That is utter nonsense. A supremacist? For saying the Olmec and Maya were 100% Native, I'm a supremacist?  That doesn't even make sense.

 

It doesn't make sense to you @Michel Montvertbecause you're entitled.

 

100% native means they were definitely African.

I repeatedly agree that Neanderthals had YDNA, YOU KEEP TRYING TO INTERJECT A LIE.

 

6 minutes ago, Michel Montvert said:

So did neandertals. There is no Y-DNA analyzed from neandertals because DNA decays!

 

Then stop pushing your evolution.

 

7 minutes ago, Michel Montvert said:

It is not that neandertals lacked Y-DNA, it is that we've so far been unable to extract a sample.

 

Never said they did!!! You keep pushing lies.

Scientist know full well that Neanderthal DNA is around due to the females they have successfully been able to extract!

They know about the YDNA of Neanderthals, easy because of the presence of TRAITS that the modern African males and modern mankind DO NOT EXPRESS.

They know due to hybridization. 

 

9 minutes ago, Michel Montvert said:

Why would I be on a black forum? Because AA forums are the best ones! There's more of interest, more intelligence. Most forums are shit shows. This one is a breath of fresh air. This is true generally of AA sites online.

 

You can come into AA forums because we generally are a welcoming people and would not treat you the way that we've been treated. And the other reason is because we've been oppressed for so long due to White domination, that some of us have been weakened. So, even if you were a racist, a troll or whatever, Black sites get that kind of behavior all the time. 

 

12 minutes ago, Michel Montvert said:

I know that there is ZERO evidence for Africans or anyone else in America, so really this gets down to... see if you can find evidence.

 

This really bothers you. LOL.

I've presented enough evidence. You just totally upset about this thing.

Just because a genocidal attempt was made to wipe the African presence in the ancient Americas does not erase YDNA evidence found in native Americans today and yesterday. You just don't want to accept it.

 

 

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7 hours ago, Chevdove said:

 

It doesn't make sense to you @Michel Montvertbecause you're entitled.

 

100% native means they were definitely African.

I repeatedly agree that Neanderthals had YDNA, YOU KEEP TRYING TO INTERJECT A LIE.

 

 

Then stop pushing your evolution.

 

 

Never said they did!!! You keep pushing lies.

Scientist know full well that Neanderthal DNA is around due to the females they have successfully been able to extract!

They know about the YDNA of Neanderthals, easy because of the presence of TRAITS that the modern African males and modern mankind DO NOT EXPRESS.

They know due to hybridization. 

 

 

You can come into AA forums because we generally are a welcoming people and would not treat you the way that we've been treated. And the other reason is because we've been oppressed for so long due to White domination, that some of us have been weakened. So, even if you were a racist, a troll or whatever, Black sites get that kind of behavior all the time. 

 

 

This really bothers you. LOL.

I've presented enough evidence. You just totally upset about this thing.

Just because a genocidal attempt was made to wipe the African presence in the ancient Americas does not erase YDNA evidence found in native Americans today and yesterday. You just don't want to accept it.

 

 

Neandertals... controversial because when it was discovered that non-Africans had mixed with them. everyone jumped on it. To whites suddenly neandertal ancestry was an advantage. To blacks it was often, ha ha we knew you were cave apes. The reality is that neandertal ancestry was negative and positive. The negative aspects have been eliminated by natural selection (evolution, always true). The positive traits were retained, mostly those conferring disease immunity.

 

Non-European Eurasians of course also have this neandertal admixture, and in the east, especially the far southeast, they also have significant Denisovan admixture.

 

Sorry, African folks, but it has been found that W-Central Africans also mixed with a non-sapiens species, likely Homo bodoensis (formerly heidelbergensis or rhodesiensis). Neandertal DNA was also carried into Africa, especially in the areas of North Africa. obviously, also Ethiopia, around the Chadic speakers (such as Hausa), into Madagascar by the Malagasy from SE Asia, and in recent centuries in South Africa (Euros, Indians, and others).

 

The least mixed, the purest sapiens. would be an African who managed to avoid all that admixture. likely from Sudan or Ethiopia area not affected by Semitic or other immigration.

 

As for America, you've presented no evidence, you just stated that Africans are here. I keep asking for boats, DNA, human remains. cultural items or crops, but there is nothing. But don't feel bad. Such evidence does not exist, so there is no way you can find it. The claims that Olmecs, Maya. etc., were other than purely Native American are considered racist by many indigenous/Mexican activists and scholars. The leading expert on Mesoamerican archaeology, Michael Coe (yes, he's white), utterly dismisses any such claims of anyone coming here but Native Americans.

 

For a while people were claiming that Luzia, a find in Brazil, was either African or Melanesian/Australian. However. subsequently the DNA of her and other individuals whose remains were found with her at Lagoa Santa was analyzed and it was 100% Native American. Despite that, many online continue to claim that she somehow was "black", a nebulous term which must be defined to use it scientifically. And Kennewick Man, from Washington state, also was confirmed as 100% Native, not in any way European. Many are unaware that Native Americans and Europeans are related through the QR Y-DNA clade which evolved in central Eurasia or northern India (Q ending up in America, R in Indoeuropean speakers and pre-Aryan Indians).

 

That is the closest link to whites science has found for Native Americans. It is some 25k yrs old. For Africans, it is at least twice that long since there is common ancestry. which would be at the time of OOA. Among Native Americans, the only ancestral DNA found in living or excavated remains is: Y-DNA C & Q; mtDNA A, B, C, D & X. None of those is African. African Y-DNA is A, B & E; mtDNA is L.

 

The people with African admixture and cultural influence are mostly in Europe and the Mideast. That is not surprising, since those are the regions closest to Africa. The largest genetic influence into Europe was by way of the Neolithics, many of whom had Y-DNA E1b1b, which is African, by way of the Natufians. The Natufian culture influenced the Mideasterners who mixed with them and then created the Neolithic. After that, the greatest cultural influence on Europe from Africans was from Egypt.

 

There was African trading contact with India in very ancient times, a lot of interaction across the Red Sea, and even in Palaeolithic times there was movement in both directions between Iberia and the Maghreb. Europeans had contact across the continent to China, and with Africa north of the Sahara, and of course the Mideast. Before the Viking visit and then the "Age of Exploration", there really is zero evidence of either Europeans or Africans reaching America.

 

No, no proof that the Vikings had copper mines in Michigan. no proof of Celtic origins of Iroquois culture, no proof of lost Romans. Phoenicians. Hebrews, Greeks, or anyone else.

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@Michel Montvert You keep repeating yourself. 

Again, I am a biology major so NO, EVOLUTION IS ONLY A THEORY, nothing has been confirmed. I teach this because it is on the educational curriculum. 

Nothing has been proven about evolution.

 

"Sorry, African folks, but it has been found that W-Central Africans also mixed with a non-sapiens species, likely Homo bodoensis (formerly heidelbergensis or rhodesiensis). Neandertal DNA was also carried into Africa,..."

 

 Again, NO other HOMINIDS EXISTED AT THE TIME OF MODERN MAN other than NEANDERTHALS. That is in the Smithsonian. The date of the heidelbergensis and all other dark skinned hominids were completely extinct by the time the African man was created. THAT IS FALSE INFORMATION you are putting out and not science based at all.

 

THAT AFRICAN INDIVIDUAL HAD NAPPY HAIR, all of the dark skinned primitive hominids DO NOT HAVE NAPPY HAIR!!!

The curl patterns, wave patterns, etc. of mankind today would be another fact that separates modern mankind from even NEANDERTHALS!!!!! 

 

I do agree that Neanderthal DNA was also carried into Africa and not just in certain areas but this whole world has a degree of DNA, however, in African people, it is not as much as others. As you said, the immunity of Neanderthals was a benefit to the females and intersex beings but on the other hand, it was fatal to modern mankind!!!

Black Americans and Native Americans are getting their azzes kicked by the diseases we get from Neanderthals!!! LOL.

 

You see, you are an extreme Supremacist Michel. But hey, you were given a pass to put out these lies with NO EVIDENCE in black communities. LOL. 

 

I have posted 3 genealogical trees and ALL MODERN MANKIND STEM FROM ONE AFRICAN INDIVIDUAL. 

ALL NATIVE AMERICAN HAPLOGROUPS stems from an African origin. 

Now all you are doing is being harassing. 

 

I have posted references: 500 Nations documentary--Kevin Cosner showing the presence of ancient African Native Americans all across the Americas.

I have given you much evidence but you refuse to accept it.

My father-in-law hosted POW WOW annually, and many Natives, including him admit that they have African origins. 

You are not native American, but yet you are so upset about the African presence in Native Americans. 

I have not looked at your video on Olmecs and Mayan, but I hope to, however, I am not that interested in that research right now.

 

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22 hours ago, Chevdove said:

@Michel Montvert You keep repeating yourself. 

Again, I am a biology major so NO, EVOLUTION IS ONLY A THEORY, nothing has been confirmed. I teach this because it is on the educational curriculum. 

Nothing has been proven about evolution.

 

"Sorry, African folks, but it has been found that W-Central Africans also mixed with a non-sapiens species, likely Homo bodoensis (formerly heidelbergensis or rhodesiensis). Neandertal DNA was also carried into Africa,..."

 

 Again, NO other HOMINIDS EXISTED AT THE TIME OF MODERN MAN other than NEANDERTHALS. That is in the Smithsonian. The date of the heidelbergensis and all other dark skinned hominids were completely extinct by the time the African man was created. THAT IS FALSE INFORMATION you are putting out and not science based at all.

 

THAT AFRICAN INDIVIDUAL HAD NAPPY HAIR, all of the dark skinned primitive hominids DO NOT HAVE NAPPY HAIR!!!

The curl patterns, wave patterns, etc. of mankind today would be another fact that separates modern mankind from even NEANDERTHALS!!!!! 

 

I do agree that Neanderthal DNA was also carried into Africa and not just in certain areas but this whole world has a degree of DNA, however, in African people, it is not as much as others. As you said, the immunity of Neanderthals was a benefit to the females and intersex beings but on the other hand, it was fatal to modern mankind!!!

Black Americans and Native Americans are getting their azzes kicked by the diseases we get from Neanderthals!!! LOL.

 

You see, you are an extreme Supremacist Michel. But hey, you were given a pass to put out these lies with NO EVIDENCE in black communities. LOL. 

 

I have posted 3 genealogical trees and ALL MODERN MANKIND STEM FROM ONE AFRICAN INDIVIDUAL. 

ALL NATIVE AMERICAN HAPLOGROUPS stems from an African origin. 

Now all you are doing is being harassing. 

 

I have posted references: 500 Nations documentary--Kevin Cosner showing the presence of ancient African Native Americans all across the Americas.

I have given you much evidence but you refuse to accept it.

My father-in-law hosted POW WOW annually, and many Natives, including him admit that they have African origins. 

You are not native American, but yet you are so upset about the African presence in Native Americans. 

I have not looked at your video on Olmecs and Mayan, but I hope to, however, I am not that interested in that research right now.

 

I'm sorry, but much of your information is simply wrong. First, evolution is a "theory", but that doesn't mean it isn't proven. Cell theory is proven. Any scientific construct is a theory. There is a mountain of proof confirming that evolution is true. Creationists lie about this, and pretend it doesn't exist. They are liars, and proven to be liars. Ken Ham and all the rest of them: liars. You got a degree in Bio but don't know what a "theory" is? Very strange...

 

Also, there were half a dozen Homo species alive when sapiens had already evolved, not only neandertals. The list includes: Homo bodoensis, daliensis, Denisovans, naledi, floresiensis, erectus and luzonensis, at the least, making eight Homo species contemporary with sapiens. Bodoensis was still alive in Africa to interbreed with W-Central African sapiens. The anthropologist who discovered this is named Hammer.

 

I am no supremacist, and that is just name-calling. You simply do not know much about this topic, and when I post real facts you become hysterical. The fact is I'm well-informed about these matters, and you are not. If you wish to engage this topic, learn more about it first, so as not to embarrass yourself.

 

You "evidence" is statements from people with Native blood! Having Native DNA doesn't give one anthropological knowledge, sorry. Oh hey, I'm part Scottish, so if i say Scots descend from Hercules. it must be true, right? Because I would somehow KNOW this due to my Scottish DNA. That is the argument you're making about Native DNA.

 

I'm not "upset" about anything. I argue strongly against those who claim Egypt was created by whites or Arabs, since I know that the evidence shows that it was created by black people. So... I'm not black, so why am I "upset" about Egypt? Because my goal is to teach truth.  to dispel lies, to combat racism. Denying the African role in building civilizations like Egypt is racist. Claiming Africans created Native American civilizations is also racist, following the same culture-vulture pattern.

 

The diseases afflicting Native Americans did not come from neandertalensis. They were brought by European whites. Natives died due to lack of immunity. Europeans in Africa often died because they had no immunity to African diseases. That has nothing to do with other species.

 

You continue to use the term "intersex" which has no meaning. There were no such individuals. The DNA of the several species mixed with sapiens did not change gender in any way. It was just that male hybrids usually did not survive. Neandertal DNA is not in modern humans because since males did not survive, the Y-DNA was not passed on. Perhaps you are aware that females do not carry the Y chromosome.

 

So far at least 3 other species are positively identified to have mixed with modern humans: neandertals, Denisovans and the unknown African species which is likely bodoensis. W-Central Africans have a higher % of ancestry from that species than Europeans have from neandertals. Melanesians have twice as much Denisovan ancestry than Europeans have neandertal. In all cases, some of the DNA was deleterious and was eliminated via natural selection (you know, evolution). Advantageous DNA was retained, in all cases. Example: Tibetans interbred with Denisovans and acquired a gene which enables them to better process oxygen at high altitudes.

 

Graham Hancock has appeared on Joe  Rogan's show! LOL!!! that is where these alternative archaeologists belong... in the nutcase corner. That would have been a good venue for Van Sertima, utterly devoid of academic legitimacy, pop schlock nonsense.

 

Please indicate some evidence for any of the following in America. If you cannot... well, then move on to some other topic.

 

1. African DNA

2. African cultural remains

3. African physical remains

4. African boats

5. African crops

 

....or, any of that from America found in Africa before Columbus.


I know for a fact there is none.

 

Also, please look up the meaning of "supremacist". You seem not to understand that word either. Someone trained in science and knowledgeable on the topic of human evolution... that doesn't make the person a supremacist in any way. A racist supremacist believes one imaginary "race" is superior to another. Since race doesn't even exist scientifically, the entire notion is absurd and impossible.

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On 9/5/2022 at 10:01 AM, Michel Montvert said:

African boats, African human remains. African DNA. African cultural items, African crops. I am requesting that evidence if you are going to persist in supporting unfounded theories about human migrations.

 

@Michel Montvert, are you familiar with the work of Ivan Van Sertima? Start with him. Clearly, there is a lot you don't know about that subject. 

 

As far as DNA it was hard to understand where the point of contention is, a percentage of so-called white people have some Neanderthal DNA. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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21 minutes ago, Troy said:

 

@Michel Montvert, are you familiar with the work of Ivan Van Sertima? Start with him. Clearly, there is a lot you don't know about that subject. 

 

As far as DNA it was hard to understand where the point of contention is, a percentage of so-called white people have some Neanderthal DNA. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fact modern humans have other species mixed in. We know of neandertals, Denisovans and a species in Africa, likely bodoensis. It is not only Europeans with this admixture, but nearly everyone.

 

Van Sertima is not a legitimate academic. He is in the category of "alternative" archaeology, like Graham Hancock. I am familiar with all of his writing and that of others in a similar vein. The fact is, there is still no evidence of anyone in America before Columbus. besides indigenous people, with one exception, a small failed viking settlement in Labrador.

 

There are people claiming all manner of nonsense for America. Vikings mining copper in Michigan. Someone from the Old World building the mounds. Africans in Mesoamerica. Chinese in California. NONE of this is proven, and it is all rejected by legitimate scholars.

 

In the popular mind there is much confusion about this. For example, stating that "white people have neandertal admixture." In fact, all non-Africans have it, and many Africans do as well. It is not a "white thing". and Europeans have less non-sapiens admixture than eastern Eurasians have. The people found to have the most non-sapiens admixture are Melanesians. The percentage of presumed bodoensis admixture in W-Central Africans is twice that of neandertal admixture in Europeans.

 

Nobody really can point a finger at anyone else about being mixed with another species of Homo.

 

Over the centuries there have been a lot of crazy ideas about human migrations and civilization. 19th-century Europeans tended to believe that all civilization diffused from Egypt. We now know this is not true, as there were civilizations elsewhere as early or earlier, and without any Egyptian influence. Europeans loved to claim that Native American civilizations were the work of outsiders, as they couldn't believe, due to their racism, that the indigenous people could have done it. Claims of African Olmecs or Mayans are just more of the same, attempting to steal other peoples' civilizations.

 

Vague cultural similarities are found all over the earth and prove nothing. The Vikings and Polynesians used the same means of securing planks on their boats. So were they related in some way? Did this knowledge diffuse? No, it was independently invented.

 

There is NO evidence for anyone coming to America before Columbus. None. Nothing is being suppressed. Academia is so competitive that no such cover-up could succeed. To prove African contact, we'd need something from this list:

 

1. African DNA

2. African boats

3. African human remains

4. African cultural remains

5. African crops

 

NONE of that has been found in America. DNA has been tested of many precolumbian remains and not ONE bit of African DNA has been found. Nor European. Nor Chinese. By stating this I only indicate that I know anthropology and am informed about developments. For example, I know of the genome analysis done of the Lagoa Santa remains, which include the notorious Luzia, and their DNA was proven 100% indigenous. Yet again, all claims of outside contact fail for lack of evidence.

 

There is a lot of information coming out which indicates civilizations in Africa as yet unidentified. One is in the Sahara, and preceded Egypt. Another was in the Congo basin and created extensive irrigation systems, about which we know virtually nothing. These and many other finds coming out of Africa should stimulate people to explore that. to find out about civilization created by Africans rather than casting about hither and yon to find someone else's civilizations to claim. The ongoing attempt to claim nearly every civilization on earth as "really African" resembles more than anything the 19th-century diffusionists trying to make every civilization on earth the work of white people.

 

Many people seem not to understand that 2/3 of the earth's people are neither white nor black!

 

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@Michel Montvert

 

I'm not reading anymore of this racist rhetoric that you are putting into this Black community.

You ave come here under false colors.

You have provided NO references to support anything you have said.

You spent time telling us how we need to provide references yet, you've not provided any to support what you are saying simply because you are lying.

 

I have provided numerous references.

Therefore, I am asking you @Troy to intervene.

This guy is really racist.

 

The references of the genealogy trees that I posted reflect the other references in that GENOME PROJECT is fact based.

I provided reference of the Genome Project in that it is an internationally accepted project of scientist across the world and 

states that ALL MODERN HUMANS STEM FROM ONE AFRICAN MALE INDIVIDUAL.

 

The educational curriculum includes evolution and states that it is a theory and so far to date, nothing has been proven based on evolution.

 

Black African people today have NO other primitive hominid DNA other than like other 'races' some do show Neanderthal DNA.

@Troy I want you to realize that this @Michel Montvert putting blatant lies about people of African descent having other hominid DNA. This is very far fetched and extremely racist. 

 

 

20 hours ago, Troy said:

are you familiar with the work of Ivan Van Sertima? Start with him. Clearly, there is a lot you don't know about that subject. 

 

As far as DNA it was hard to understand where the point of contention is, a percentage of so-called white people have some Neanderthal DNA. 

 

 

Yes, he is completely disrespectful about the late Ivan Van Sertima who was highly educated and his work has been confirmed.

This is definitely a racist attack against this Black community.

 

 

19 hours ago, Michel Montvert said:

There is NO evidence for anyone coming to America before Columbus.

 

@Troy This racist is completely ignoring numerous publications which obviously shows his intent on being here.

I have shared in the past in several other threads about how, more than 100 years prior to Columbus, that over a million Aztec ancestors migrated from Europe around the time of THE BLACK DEATH PLAGUE which occurred around the AD 1330s. And soon after the Toltec civilization came to an end. I have written about the many people who fled the Old World from Africa to the Americas long before Columbus and here, this idiot is so evil with his racism that he is tripping over obvious historical facts to try and keep the Africans confined in Africa. LOL.

 

No Troy, I hope that you look into this. Please and thank you.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Chevdove said:

@Michel Montvert

 

I'm not reading anymore of this racist rhetoric that you are putting into this Black community.

You ave come here under false colors.

You have provided NO references to support anything you have said.

You spent time telling us how we need to provide references yet, you've not provided any to support what you are saying simply because you are lying.

 

I have provided numerous references.

Therefore, I am asking you @Troy to intervene.

This guy is really racist.

 

The references of the genealogy trees that I posted reflect the other references in that GENOME PROJECT is fact based.

I provided reference of the Genome Project in that it is an internationally accepted project of scientist across the world and 

states that ALL MODERN HUMANS STEM FROM ONE AFRICAN MALE INDIVIDUAL.

 

The educational curriculum includes evolution and states that it is a theory and so far to date, nothing has been proven based on evolution.

 

Black African people today have NO other primitive hominid DNA other than like other 'races' some do show Neanderthal DNA.

@Troy I want you to realize that this @Michel Montvert putting blatant lies about people of African descent having other hominid DNA. This is very far fetched and extremely racist. 

 

 

 

Yes, he is completely disrespectful about the late Ivan Van Sertima who was highly educated and his work has been confirmed.

This is definitely a racist attack against this Black community.

 

 

 

@Troy This racist is completely ignoring numerous publications which obviously shows his intent on being here.

I have shared in the past in several other threads about how, more than 100 years prior to Columbus, that over a million Aztec ancestors migrated from Europe around the time of THE BLACK DEATH PLAGUE which occurred around the AD 1330s. And soon after the Toltec civilization came to an end. I have written about the many people who fled the Old World from Africa to the Americas long before Columbus and here, this idiot is so evil with his racism that he is tripping over obvious historical facts to try and keep the Africans confined in Africa. LOL.

 

No Troy, I hope that you look into this. Please and thank you.

 

 

You should stop the name-calling and the lying. I spoke no racism, nor did I speak falsely about anything. I simply reported what science knows of this issue.

 

Your behavior is reminiscent of Trump followers who simply want to silence all voices they don't like. As for Van Sertima, he is respected only by cultists, his work is worthless, and he proved nothing. Find ONE of the proofs of anyone here before Columbus. You cannot, and you know it, hence the vitriole and vile lying name-calling. How disappointing... and you call me racist, while one of your first statements was that no scientist can be trusted who is white!

 

You lost the argument. You produce no evidence. Because there is none. Find it, if there is. Something real, not Van Sertima's vain speculation.

 

Why did he not get peer-reviewed? Why does all real science reject his "work"? Because it's bogus.

 

And the RACISM is in trying to steal other peoples' histories. Get y'all's hands off the Maya and Olmec and worry about someone else.

 

And cease and desist with the slander against me. You lost, be gracious and mature and move on. Why would this get you so heated? Agitated, like racists get. Listen to them seething over BS like CRT and you'll hear attitudes similar to yours. Check yourself.

 

If you want online discussion to be nothing but an echo chamber for those in your own cult, you could find some really nasty fora to join... this one generally seems reasonable and intellectual, so I wonder why you think throwing temper tantrums is appropriate here.

 

I've already won this argument and am interested in discussing issues of importance to the betterment of this society, and specifically black people. There is a big scandal brewing over BLM leadership which the white racists will seize on... I wonder where the anti-racist movement goes from here... It's getting nasty out there! Don't make it nasty in here, too, please.

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@Chevdove if I got rid of everyone who disagreed with me, or you, there would be absolutely no one left. 🙂

 

I admit, I liked a lot of what Michel has previously posted, he came across as sincere, articulate, and well-meaning.  I thought he added something to the conversation given that he is (or presented himself as) an older white guy with a great deal of experience in the Black community. That said he seems to have flipped.  It doesn't seem like the same guy.  

 

@Michel Montvert yeah you are coming across as very racist right now.  You posted a video by a couple of nobodies, but reject Van Sertima?!  Who is the guy in the photo below, from the video you shared?  What are his credentials? 

 

You obviously have not read as much as you say you have on the subject of Africans in the Americas before the era of Columbus.  Columbus did not discover America he never set foot here -- despite what we were taught in school. 

 

I'm not going to try to convince you otherwise. You obviously have your own opinion and I'm confident there is nothing I can write, or share with you, that will change your mind.  Your belief system was forged by a system of white supremacy.  (i.e. Chevdove don't waste your time) 

 

Racists can't see their own racism and this makes it exceedingly difficult for them to change.

 

@Michel Montvert where did you get the following?

 

On 9/7/2022 at 3:07 PM, Michel Montvert said:

For example, stating that "white people have neandertal admixture." In fact, all non-Africans have it, and many Africans do as well.

 

Can you cite a reputable source that says "many Africans" have neandertal DNA?  It has been some time since I read on the subject, but I never read that. I wonder where you got it from.... probably the guy below, huh?

 

 

losers.jpg

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LOL...what in the world.........

Well, if it seems like I'm coming to the defense of the White person....I am, lol.

I think White people are devils (ask me to define "devil" before you get too offended, lol), are inherently racist, and I don't trust them.

However, having said that-

I haven't read anything Michel has said that comes over as overtly racist or outrageously offensive.

Hell.....
When it comes to SCIENCE and ARCHEOLOGY....the same things they (btw....what makes yall think Michel is a "he"??? I haven't read everything they said but I don't remember them explicitly identifying their gender.  Infact, it seems to me they went out of their way to AVOID revealing it...lol) have said on this site are the same things MOST Caucasian scientists in most universities say and teach!
From promoting evolution, claiming  Black people are less evolved, calling the work of Black scholars "psuedo-science", and denying everything except the "authorized versions" of history and science is the NORM in typical Western academia.
That's just what White people do in general....not sure why some of you are so shocked...lol.

Actually, outside of the scientific and historical assetions, most of what Michel has said about politics, economics, and society so far has been RIGHT ON the money.

Whether "they" really believe it or not,  "they" (until I'm sure they're a male or female....lol) is hitting the nails on the head when it comes to their political and social commentary.

Although I believe MOST White people are inherently racist, I don't believe in outright accusing them of such because of disagreements and we have to be careful of that type of emotionalism.

If some of yall didn't LOVE White folks so much and seek their approval, you would be so angry and offended when they disagree with you...lol

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15 hours ago, Troy said:

@Chevdove if I got rid of everyone who disagreed with me, or you, there would be absolutely no one left. 🙂

 

I admit, I liked a lot of what Michel has previously posted, he came across as sincere, articulate, and well-meaning.  I thought he added something to the conversation given that he is (or presented himself as) an older white guy with a great deal of experience in the Black community. That said he seems to have flipped.  It doesn't seem like the same guy.  

 

@Michel Montvert yeah you are coming across as very racist right now.  You posted a video by a couple of nobodies, but reject Van Sertima?!  Who is the guy in the photo below, from the video you shared?  What are his credentials? 

 

You obviously have not read as much as you say you have on the subject of Africans in the Americas before the era of Columbus.  Columbus did not discover America he never set foot here -- despite what we were taught in school. 

 

I'm not going to try to convince you otherwise. You obviously have your own opinion and I'm confident there is nothing I can write, or share with you, that will change your mind.  Your belief system was forged by a system of white supremacy.  (i.e. Chevdove don't waste your time) 

 

Racists can't see their own racism and this makes it exceedingly difficult for them to change.

 

@Michel Montvert where did you get the following?

 

 

Can you cite a reputable source that says "many Africans" have neandertal DNA?  It has been some time since I read on the subject, but I never read that. I wonder where you got it from.... probably the guy below, huh?

 

 

losers.jpg

I've said nothing racist and you know it. Nothing flipped. I am simply supporting indigenous rights against outsiders trying to steal their history.

 

Africans have Eurasian admixture. Eurasian DNA is common in the Horn, northern Nigeria and Cameroon, and other places. Eurasians means neandertal genes!

 

Also it was discovered by an anthropologist named Hammer that W-Central Africans are mixed with another species, which is likely bodoensis. What we learn from this is that our species interbred with other Homo species wherever they were encountered. There are at least 3 species included in "Denisovans", and all 3 mixed with sapiens.

 

None of this is racist. It is simply scientific fact. Very few humans on earth are pure sapiens. As I am graduate educated in anthropology, I know about this material. I know about Van Sertima and why he is not accepted by real science. He did NOT provide any citations, any real evidence. It's all hearsay and speculation.

 

Do I CARE who are ancestral to whom? No. Anyone on earth could be part black or part white and why should I care? Only a racist would be bothered by that. What I care about is science, logic, evidence, facts.

 

My primary interest in this forum is in the politics of the movement for liberation, specifically of African-Americans, a cause I've supported since childhood. I am interested right now in what will occur in the future regarding BLM, who now has a scandal going on. My view is that black lives matter, without the caps, and that is the focus of struggle, not any particular org. I'm hoping that the various crises mounting rapidly will impel change on many fronts, including attention to ending the racism in this country. It's about time, no?

 

I'm tired of having a flame war with someone who doesn't understand the science and only calls me names. I mean, for dismissing Van Sertima, one is a racist? That is ludicrous. Keep in mind that white anthropologists assert that Egypt was created by black people, that humanity originated in Africa from black people. Yet we're racists? I think not.

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22 hours ago, Troy said:

That said he seems to have flipped.  It doesn't seem like the same guy.  

 

@Troy LOL.

 

Thank you so much for taking the time and checking this out.

Yes, he definitely came in with an agenda, that unfolded.

And, I do understand that you cannot get rid of everyone, but he needs to go, imo.

Some non-white people may seem 'entitled' but then in this case, he seems to have come from Storm front.

People like him, stalk and only join black communities with the intent to do racial insult, demean, and attack.

Nevertheless, I highly appreciate you looking into this, and accept your decision.

I can't tell you how much I appreciate you and your forums. 

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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21 hours ago, ProfD said:

Considering there are suspects, that's not a good idea according to code.😁 😎


Also according to code you're not supposed to directly call a White person a racist UNLESS they identify themselves as one.....lol.

We can and should suspect every White person we meet of being a racist and don't let your guard down UNLESS they prove beyond a shadow of doubt TO YOU that they aren't. 

But that doesn't mean you go around with your eyes closed shouting and stammering out: 

 

 

image.jpeg.4d44b473bd81ba242c2e8920f670e108.jpeg

 


"You're a racist....you....you....RACIST!"

 


Every time a White person makes you mad, lol.

That's not civil and it makes you look childish.
It's also very poor strategy when actually dealing with racism.

If the White person IS a racist....will telling them this and accusing them of it get you what you want?


I'm certainly not accusing anyone on this site of this but I DO see it a lot in U.S. society.
While REAL racism is running rampant and they're poisoning water systems and indoctrinating children with all types of foolishness....this nigga is calling some White man a racist because he won't let him borrow his cigarette lighter to smoke a Newport.
Or because some White woman at Walmart won't let her return her clothes and get a refund without a store receipt.....lol....NOW the cashier is a "racist".

Stupid shit.

If you KNOW that a White person is a racist....learn how to COUNTER it with affirmative action.
Throwing temper tantrums isn't a viable solution in my opinion.


As far as Michel goes......
Or any other White person for that matter whether we agree or disagree with them.....

This is a Black site and we are CLEARLY in power.
Troy has this thing on lock.
There are atleast a dozen intelligent Black folks up in here getting busy.
We need to ACT like the master of our own home and show some restraint and decorum.

Really, we should take a lesson from THEIR play book and don't even bring up their race unless THEY want to talk about it.
 

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23 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Also according to code you're not supposed to directly call a White person a racist UNLESS they identify themselves as one.....lol.

We can and should suspect every White person we meet of being a racist and don't let your guard down UNLESS they prove beyond a shadow of doubt TO YOU that they aren't. 

 

If the White person IS a racist....will telling them this and accusing them of it get you what you want?

If you KNOW that a White person is a racist....learn how to COUNTER it with affirmative action.

Really, we should take a lesson from THEIR play book and don't even bring up their race unless THEY want to talk about it.

Right.  A rationale and effective response should never be emotional. 😎

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@Pioneer1 as @Cynique would say STFU! 😉 You know there is virtually nothing you have written about genetics that I (or the science) agrees with. If I was Michel I should take your validation as cause for concern.

 

7 hours ago, Michel Montvert said:

I am simply supporting indigenous rights against outsiders trying to steal their history.

 

Phuleese! Oh great white savior who says they need or want your help? 

 

 

7 hours ago, Michel Montvert said:

Africans have Eurasian admixture. Eurasian DNA is common in the Horn, northern Nigeria and Cameroon, and other places. Eurasians means neandertal genes!

 

Not before the colonizers arrived!  Come on man you are being intellectually dishonest.  That said, produce ANY evidence that "many" Africans -- even those who are mixed with Europeans neanderthal DNA, or just admit this is something conjured from your imagination.

 

7 hours ago, Michel Montvert said:

I am interested right now in what will occur in the future regarding BLM, who now has a scandal going on.

 

You keep mentioning a supposed BLM scandal -- why? Who cares? It is like you are trying to create descent.  There are a great number of people and organizations working to liberate Black people; find another one that suits you. White folks anointed BLM and now y'all are apparently, trying to tear it down. 

 

7 hours ago, Michel Montvert said:

I'm tired of having a flame war with someone who doesn't understand the science and only calls me names. I mean, for dismissing Van Sertima,

 

Yeah because you are all talk, articulate, but ill-informed.  Again, who are the dudes in the video that you give more credence to than Dr. Ivan Van Sertima. Is it because they are white and Van Sertima is Black? Surely, you are not that unsophisticated... but you still have not justified your reasoning.

 

White folks have a long history in this country of tearing down and marginalizing Black people when they are engaged in activities to uplift Black people. These white people are racist whether they know it or not.   

 

13 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Every time a White person makes you mad, lol.

That's not civil and it makes you look childish.
It's also very poor strategy when actually dealing with racism.

If the White person IS a racist....will telling them this and accusing them of it get you what you want?

 

Did I say STFU yet?  Nobody (well I'm not) is mad. I'm just making an observation.  I think Michel (assuming He, Him) made some comments that come across as racist.

 

1 hour ago, Chevdove said:

Yes, he definitely came in with an agenda, that unfolded.

 

Based on what I have read so far, and despite what Pioneer wrote, I tend to agree with your assessment. 

 

This is what will happen (speaking from experience now): Michel will escalate to the point where I have no choice but to boot him, or he will take his marbles and go somewhere else.

 

Here is what will not happen:  Michel will not seriously consider what you and I have written and reflect on it.  He will not apologize or acknowledge what he is writing comes across as racist. Again, racists usually don't see themselves as such.

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Troy


 

Quote

 

 

@Pioneer1 as @Cynique would say STFU! You know there is virtually nothing you have written about genetics that I (or the science) agrees with. If I was Michel I should take your validation as cause for concern

 



Hey Michel...ignore the next couple of sentence will ya....lol.





Validation???
NIGGA PLEASE....I haven't even validated the BLACK FOLKS who've been up on this site for years, let alone other folks who just popped up in the past few months...lol.
I can only validate MYSELF because I know me, can't speak for some of these other jokers running around here....lol.


My words in defense of Michel is hardly "validation"....just like your observation of them is hardly an attack based on being "mad".
It's simply putting things in perspective.
But in reality, it's actually not about Michel or any other White person or White people in general so much as it's about US and how we conduct ourselves even when WE are clearly in power.

We....collectively....need to learn HOW to properly combat what we perceive to be racism in a more effective manner and like I said, throwing emotional tantrums isn't the way to go.

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23 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

We....collectively....need to learn HOW to properly combat what we perceive to be racism in a more effective manner and like I said, throwing emotional tantrums isn't the way to go.

 

Emotional tantrum?!  Come on, my calling out his comments as racist can't possibly be described as throwing a tantrum. 

 

Drop the hyperbole and describe a better tactic.

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3 hours ago, Troy said:

 

Emotional tantrum?!  Come on, my calling out his comments as racist can't possibly be described as throwing a tantrum. 

 

Drop the hyperbole and describe a better tactic.


Did I say you threw an emotional tantrum?

As far as a better tactic......

Unless it's outright offensive and racist (not covertly or subliminally because that's gonna be MOST White folks...lol) I'd say let Michel or any other White person say what they like and either counter it with more facts or just ignore it.

Like I said, this is a Black site and we CLEARLY are in power here.
Unless the "powers that be" on the internet decide to shut this site down....no White person can or will control the conversation up in here.

 



Also like I said earlier, we need to take a page out of their play book and not even MENTION race at all.

Let them tell it, if they criticize you it'll be about everything BUT your race.....lol.

We know that most White scholars reject Ivan Van Sertima's work for racist reasons regardless of the mountains of evidence he's presented both in his  academic works as well as his speeches and presentations.   But they don't SAY it.  They just DO it.
 

 

Just like the Critical Race Theory fiasco and how Black folks are running around crying and pointing the fingers as White teachers and professors accusing them of being racist and not wanting the truth told about America.


Hell nigga JUST TEACH IT.
No need to ask White folks for permission or accuse them of being racist and hateful.
You already know that....so take action and teach the TRUTH about history.
 

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OK so when you wrote, "we" who were you talking about Chevdove? 

 

I already said my tactic of informing the person would be ineffective and emotional tantrums are a short-term tactic used by babies.

 

In any case, the question stands; what is a better tactic since informing the person and an emotional tantrum are ineffective?

 

 

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3 hours ago, Troy said:

would say STFU! 😉 You know there is virtually nothing you have written about genetics that I (or the science) agrees with. If I was Michel I should take your validation as cause for concern.

 

 

LOL.

 

3 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Also according to code you're not supposed to directly call a White person a racist UNLESS they identify themselves as one.....lol.

 

Maybe. lol. 

 

3 hours ago, Troy said:

but you still have not justified your reasoning.

 

And, he hasn't at all. He came into this thread explaining about needing valid references but after awhile, I noticed that he provided NONE regarding the topics that he was stressing over. 

 

@Troy He may have put out confusion over the issue of NEANDERTHALS because he is interjecting other primitive hominids. 

Again, I spoke about how I visited the SMITHSONIAN and therefore, knew exactly how he was completely lying and that is why he has not provided any references.

I did make statements about Neanderthals but, I don't want to be confusing so, I hope to restate what I said later.

However, if anyone has had the opportunity to visit the SMITHSONIAN then, I hope that you will share, otherwise, the point that I made in calling him on his lies may not be understood.

 

When I went into the museum of the Human Origins, there were several specimens of early hominids around the room and ALL OF THEM WERE VERY DARK SKINNED except for one species: NEANDERTHALENSIS. Thats it. Just one with pale skin. 

And so far, all of the dark hominids and the one this racist spoke about in this thread is no connection to African origins or modern mankind at all.

 

There are specific genetic markers that anyone can see what scientist speak of which completely separates modern African-typed people today from all of the primitive hominids including the NEANDERTHALS. 

 

But one main phenotype would be that ALL OF THE PRIMITIVE HOMINIDS HAVE THIS MASSIVE BROW RIDGE. 

 

Now, do Black people today show this huge forehead and brow ridge!??? Well, after 400 years of chattel slavery and being raped, what do you think?

However, that phenotype is definitely prevalent in the White/European 'race' and would be one of several phenotypes that shows why scientist admit that there has been some degree of hybridization.

 

Again, I specifically mentioned 'nappy hair' and this is the hallmark that separates Black African-typed people today from having any connection to the earlier dark skinned hominids and this is obvious if you go to the smithsonian.

 

3 hours ago, Troy said:

Based on what I have read so far, and despite what Pioneer wrote, I tend to agree with your assessment. 

 

This is what will happen (speaking from experience now): Michel will escalate to the point where I have no choice but to boot him, or he will take his marbles and go somewhere else.

 

LOL. It would be good if he could just bounce on his own. 

 

I went to do an errand and came back and WOW, this thread blew up! LOL.

Anyway, I had mentioned something about the Aztecs more than once, but never gave a reference and hope to share more about that perhaps in another thread.

The reason why I think they are important when it comes to pre-Columbian history is because like the early African presence all over the Americas, the western world has definitly put out a BLACKOUT on this subject. So the fact that this guy is so adamant about keeping us Negroes confined to the continent of Africa until after Columbus is why now, I can't find the reference even about the Aztecs! 

Thankfully due to the WWW, World Wide Web, and other civlizations, the western world will not be able to continue to hide history as they have done for a long time. 

For some strange reason, the western world has hidden a lot of history about what happened during the A.D. 1300s and that is why the late Ivan Van Sertima's research is so important.

 

 

 

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17 hours ago, Chevdove said:

When I went into the museum of the Human Origins, there were several specimens of early hominids around the room and ALL OF THEM WERE VERY DARK SKINNED except for one species: NEANDERTHALENSIS. Thats it. Just one with pale skin. 

 

Chev why would you apply the concept of race, something made up by racists a few hundred years ago, to non-homo sapiens sapiens?  There is no scientific basis for applyinhg these terms to humans and I can guarantee you the Smithsonian did not do this in a single exhibit.

 

Gorillas are dark-skinned does that make them Black? Some people believe this, then it becomes reasonable for them to assume that Black people are a more direct descendent of the Gorilla and therefore less evolved than the so-called white man.  Of course, none of this is true, but our unwillingness to relinquish the concept of race makes it harder to ditch the flawed conclusions that flow from it.

 

17 hours ago, Chevdove said:

the western world has definitly put out a BLACKOUT on this subject

 

The blackout goes beyond the African presence in America prior to the European.  The Greeks, for example, are considered the source, of western culture Herodotus the father of medicine, etc.  However, it is commonly known that the Greeks learned from Africans.  This has been known all along but never taught in American schools.  Black kids are taught that Black history begins with our enslavement in America.

 

Of course, when white folks are presented with the truth they reject it outright or disparage the scholar who presents the information.

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19 hours ago, Troy said:

 

Chev why would you apply the concept of race, something made up by racists a few hundred years ago, to non-homo sapiens sapiens?  There is no scientific basis for applyinhg these terms to humans and I can guarantee you the Smithsonian did not do this in a single exhibit.

 

Gorillas are dark-skinned does that make them Black? Some people believe this, then it becomes reasonable for them to assume that Black people are a more direct descendent of the Gorilla and therefore less evolved than the so-called white man.  Of course, none of this is true, but our unwillingness to relinquish the concept of race makes it harder to ditch the flawed conclusions that flow from it.

 

 

The blackout goes beyond the African presence in America prior to the European.  The Greeks, for example, are considered the source, of western culture Herodotus the father of medicine, etc.  However, it is commonly known that the Greeks learned from Africans.  This has been known all along but never taught in American schools.  Black kids are taught that Black history begins with our enslavement in America.

 

Of course, when white folks are presented with the truth they reject it outright or disparage the scholar who presents the information.



That's why I said the theory of human evolution is a RACIST theory that shouldn't be accepted by ANY Black person with good sense.
Caucasians came up with that theory after society became less religious and that "curse of Ham" nonsense failed.  So they had to come up with another LIE to continue to categorize Black people as inferior so Darwin and the other racists developed the human evolution theory that calls OUR people the "missing link" between the apes and White folks....lol.

Also....

If we know that Caucasians have a history of lying and not accepting the truth and proof of our greatness and discoveries, why get so offended and outraged when one or most of them continue to do it today?
I've come to accept this about them, so it doesn't bother me one bit.
I really don't waste time arguing with them.....I spend more time arguing with other Black people whom are more likely to accept the TRUTH about our history, lol.
White folks ALREADY know it....they just don't want to accept it.
 

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18 hours ago, Troy said:

Chev why would you apply the concept of race, something made up by racists a few hundred years ago, to non-homo sapiens sapiens? 

 

I absolutely understand @Troythe point you make. I don't like that term 'race' at all and believe it is a concept exploited to promote Colorism.

However, I do not apply this term to "non-homo sapiens sapeins", however scientist use the term SPECIES and that is what I refer to.

The Neanderthalensis is how it is termed in the Smithsonian and so, they are a seperate species and not of the homo sapien species. Specifically, 

the Neanderthalensis fit the definition of SPECIES for specific reasons and fall under the category of hominids.

 

Now do scientist say that homo sapiens intemixed with Neanderthals?

Absolutely. Scientis say that modern makind do show a certain percentage of Neanderthal DNA. 

So they know that there is a certain degree of hybridization still occurring on this planet.

 

 

18 hours ago, Troy said:

There is no scientific basis for applyinhg these terms to humans and I can guarantee you the Smithsonian did not do this in a single exhibit.

 

I agree. the term 'race' is NOT used! 

 

18 hours ago, Troy said:

Gorillas are dark-skinned does that make them Black? Some people believe this, then it becomes reasonable for them to assume that Black people are a more direct descendent of the Gorilla and therefore less evolved than the so-called white man. 

 

Yep. I remember this was a commonly spread misinformation during the 60s. But I don't think that GORILLAS are even dark skinned. I think their skin is very light skinned, anyway. It's their hair/fur that is dark, I thought. But that is the confusion that was spread by racist. But scientist knew this could not possibly be true from the begiinning however, they kept quiet for many years. And then even when the genome project completed their findings, it took the scientific community about 4 YEARS to publish!!!

LOL. The western world has a hard time admitting their racism. BUT BACK TO THE SUBJECT OF GORILLAS:

 

Scientist kept quiet and let racism run rampant and therefore the fact that primates have the ABO bloodgroups was used to suggest that Black African-typed people evolved from apes, however, here is the problem with this;

 

Scientist also know about the RH NEGATIVE FACTOR and this is linked to many White people and others with the O Negative blood and is not common at all in the Black African world nor primates. In fact, if a woman with this blood type becomes pregnant with a RH POSITIVE man, the medical procedures that she must go through is intense!!! This RH NEGATIVE FACTOR is a huge scientific issue and would completely knock down any possible thoughts of Black people evolving from apes, more importantly, it points to another reality that cannot be ignored about earlier species on this planet that are not the same as modern mankind. LOL.

 

 

 

 

 

18 hours ago, Troy said:

The blackout goes beyond the African presence in America prior to the European.  The Greeks, for example, are considered the source, of western culture Herodotus the father of medicine, etc.  However, it is commonly known that the Greeks learned from Africans.  This has been known all along but never taught in American schools.  Black kids are taught that Black history begins with our enslavement in America.

 

Of course, when white folks are presented with the truth they reject it outright or disparage the scholar who presents the information.

 

okay, WOW! Never thought about this angle. You're right. 

And furthermore, that is the issue that really angers me in that, Black kids are taught that our history begins here at the time of chattel slavery as if we were invented or created only for the cause of America.

We are the only people in the entire planet whose history does not begin thousands of years ago, but we are conditioned to believe that we begin here. That is pure evil.

 

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

That's why I said the theory of human evolution is a RACIST theory that shouldn't be accepted by ANY Black person with good sense.

 

LOL! Agreed!!!

 

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Caucasians came up with that theory after society became less religious and that "curse of Ham" nonsense failed.  So they had to come up with another LIE to continue to categorize Black people as inferior so Darwin and the other racists developed the human evolution theory that calls OUR people the "missing link" between the apes and White folks....lol.

 

yes. Absolutely.

 

 

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Also....

If we know that Caucasians have a history of lying and not accepting the truth and proof of our greatness and discoveries, why get so offended and outraged when one or most of them continue to do it today?
I've come to accept this about them, so it doesn't bother me one bit.

 

Sheeiit, speak for yourself @Pioneer1. I am a woman, and maybe that might be an issue, I don't really know, but I am NOT going to let some racist come up in my environment and I not get angry. I do try to keep it as respectful as I can though, but sometimes, I feel I sleep better if I just deal with it. 

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:


I really don't waste time arguing with them.....I spend more time arguing with other Black people whom are more likely to accept the TRUTH about our history, lol.
White folks ALREADY know it....they just don't want to accept it.

 

I wish I could be calm, but it's not working right now. 

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Doesn't bother me one bit.

Just like that other White guy that Troy banned....keep forgetting his name, lol....came up here spouting all kinds of racist shit and making thread after thread talking about baby mammas....didn't bother me one bit.

The only time I even start to get concerned if if I I think they're having some sort of effect on OTHER Black folks who may start believing them....then I'll go to war against them and crush their rhetoric.
Other than that, I've lost the desire to contend with them on history and science just for the heck of it.

Maybe if some MONEY was involved...lol.
Let's debate science, history, and who got to the Americas first....Africans or Europeans....and the winner gets $10,000!

 

THEN you'll see me show up and show out.

 

Carlos Muhammad aka Abdul Salaam Muhammad on Twitter: "Minister Malcolm X  Shabazz & "The Chalk Board" Temple #7 F.O.I Class 1960 #NOIARCHIVES  #HISTORYMATTERS http://t.co/XVqbMfS4Ft" / Twitter


 

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