Jump to content

We Need To Unite With EACHOTHER First


Recommended Posts


@Stefan  I remember you said in another thread we as AfroAmericans need to form coalitions and alliances with other groups as a political strategy but I forgot which thread it was.
At any rate......

How are we gonna link up with other groups when we haven't even united (to a certain degree atleast) among OURSELVES first?

AfroAmericans are one of the most divided demographics of this nation.
Divided religiously, politically, socially, even sexually.
There's even a massive divide and conflict between several GENERATIONS among our people....all pointing the finger and blaming eachother for current and past problems.

 

When you're weak and suffering from such a low self esteem and high self hatred as the AfroAmerican community is currently....forming an alliance with other groups would basically only be trading in ONE slave master for another.  Because other groups will see your weakness and vulnerability and take advantage of it and assume power over you.

I've seen it many times.
Black folks form meetings with some of these other groups like Latinos and Arabs to try to get some political or social work done and THEY end up dominating the meeting and organization with THEIR agenda.  Even start having the meetings being catered with THEIR own ethnic dishes....lol.

The group was originally founded by Black activists who INVITED Latinos to join as a Black-Brown coalition....next thing you know fat niggas sitting up in brown leather chairs eating tacos grinning with their eyes bucked while Pedro and Pamela are standing at the head of the table passing out paper and telling US what they "agenda" is gonna be.

Now obviously as humans you're not gonna get ALL or even MOST AfroAmericans to unite and agree with eachother for a specific political or social purpose.  That has been tried many times.  It will take a MIRACLE or some other Divine Act to make that happen. However I say we need to focus on a CORE GROUP of like minded individuals among us and establishing a set agenda that works for US first...then we will be healthy enough as THAT GROUP to form a coalition with others.


And when we DO form that coalition, we need to make sure WE are in charge....no co-leadership.....US.
The ONLY alliance is the one WE control.
If they want to come along for the ride and help us....fine.
But if THEY ever want to help take the wheel....the deal is off.
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/10/2022 at 4:41 AM, Pioneer1 said:

AfroAmericans are one of the most divided demographics of this nation.

I'm a huge proponent that we need to close ranks and recalibrate as an AfroAmerican family before we can form alliances with other groups of people.

 

In fact, I believe AfroAmericans have been encouraged to work with others in order to keep us infiltrated and divided.

 

Many decades ago, that's why Jewish businesses thrived in black  neighborhoods before Asians showed up. 😎

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, ProfD said:

In fact, I believe AfroAmericans have beenencouraged to work with others in order to keep us infiltrated and divided.

 


I absolutely believe this!
Especially when White folks are encouraging it.

I suspected and discovered a long time ago that many White folks want to join our organizations and live among us not to actually HELP us but to stir up division among us as well as keep an eye on us to see what we're talking about, planning, and doing.

It was so frustrating the try and tell other AfroAmericans this only for them to disbelieve it.


I also believe that many AfroAmericans who encourage alliances with other groups and stress the importance of working with other races REALLY are inlove with members of those other races and see that strategy as an opportunity to get closer to them and have access to more interracial sex.

They don't want to just come right out and admit they're looking for an Asian woman or Latina man to hook up with and marry.
No....lol....that's too obvious.
They talk a lot of pro-Black talk then start mentioning different events for us to attend where we can link up with them.  Next thing you know they're bringing them to meetings and having lunch with them.


How many sisters I've had to distance myself from because they got into heavy relationships with White men who they INSISTED weren't White.

 

 

image.png.90275cf14a27d486431c731d7519f74c.png


"What's the problem?
That man ain't White....he Italian.
Damn!"

 

 

 

image.png.b57e9da73e9afee8db85a2c1a7b4ea14.png


"How many times we gotta go through this.
I told you...he ain't White.....he Polish!"


 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

60 years ago, the Honorable Malcolm X explained everything AfroAmericans are still dealing with today. Malcolm X told us it was not a good idea to allow others into our business. 

 

If AfroAmericans collated and codified everything Hon. Malcolm X spoke into the form of a Bible...we could eliminate confusion and teach future generations how to love each other and live more abundantly.

 

Ultimately, AfroAmerican unity would be the cornerstone of destroying the system of racism white supremacy. 

 

The trick of the enemy is to relying on the passage of time to wash away AfroAmerican history and any formation or semblance of unity among our people. 😎

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/10/2022 at 4:41 AM, Pioneer1 said:


I remember you said in another thread we as AfroAmericans need to form coalitions and alliances with other groups as a political strategy but I forgot which thread it was.
At any rate......

How are we gonna link up with other groups when we haven't even united (to a certain degree atleast) among OURSELVES first?

We Have done so before.... From The Abolitionist Movement and The Civil Rights to the NOI and the Black Panther Party

 

On 12/10/2022 at 4:41 AM, Pioneer1 said:

AfroAmericans are one of the most divided demographics of this nation.
Divided religiously, politically, socially, even sexually.
There's even a massive divide and conflict between several GENERATIONS among our people....all pointing the finger and blaming eachother for current and past problems.

Yes we have Issues ......but none that is insurmountable.

We made great strides... with much less

What we need is a Message and a Messenger equal to the task.

 

On 12/10/2022 at 4:41 AM, Pioneer1 said:

When you're weak and suffering from such a low self esteem and high self hatred as the AfroAmerican community is currently....forming an alliance with other groups would basically only be trading in ONE slave master for another.  Because other groups will see your weakness and vulnerability and take advantage of it and assume power over you.

After having a Black President.....We have a low Self Esteem?

Examples of success is One of the greatest encouragement of Self Confidence  and Competence

You are looking in the wrong direction to start a movement ....if that is you be wanting to do?

 

On 12/10/2022 at 4:41 AM, Pioneer1 said:

I've seen it many times.
Black folks form meetings with some of these other groups like Latinos and Arabs to try to get some political or social work done and THEY end up dominating the meeting and organization with THEIR agenda.  Even start having the meetings being catered with THEIR own ethnic dishes....lol.

The group was originally founded by Black activists who INVITED Latinos to join as a Black-Brown coalition....next thing you know fat niggas sitting up in brown leather chairs eating tacos grinning with their eyes bucked while Pedro and Pamela are standing at the head of the table passing out paper and telling US what they "agenda" is gonna be.

Now obviously as humans you're not gonna get ALL or even MOST AfroAmericans to unite and agree with eachother for a specific political or social purpose.  That has been tried many times.  It will take a MIRACLE or some other Divine Act to make that happen. However I say we need to focus on a CORE GROUP of like minded individuals among us and establishing a set agenda that works for US first...then we will be healthy enough as THAT GROUP to form a coalition with others.

Yes...it happens ...we all human in need of direction.

 

On 12/10/2022 at 4:41 AM, Pioneer1 said:

And when we DO form that coalition, we need to make sure WE are in charge....no co-leadership.....US.
The ONLY alliance is the one WE control.
If they want to come along for the ride and help us....fine.
But if THEY ever want to help take the wheel....the deal is off.
 

Coalition is an Alliance of Two..... to Act as One in the furtherance of an agreed on Plan or Common Goal.

The Leadership of the respective Groups or of the Coalition is never in question...Only Strategy Tactics Method and Actions to be taken Are. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

31 minutes ago, frankster said:

 

After having a Black President.....We have a low Self Esteem?

Examples of success is One of the greatest encouragement of Self Confidence  and Competence

You are looking in the wrong direction to start a movement ....if that is you be wanting to do?

 


Well, to be clear we had an AFROAMERICAN President...I wouldn't necessarily call him "Black" and definitely not FBA.
However our people ABSOLUTELY have still have low self esteem despite having HAD an AfroAmerican President.

Your self esteem is more than your accomplishments and confidence but your MORAL WORTH as well.
Many if not most of our people subconsciously see themselves as more criminal and wicked than Caucasians.
It's ingrained in many of them since childhood because of the teachings of Christianity, especially the European kind.

Many AfroAmericans like many Black people around the globe see themselves as spiritually and morally INFERIOR to Caucasians and believe they are somehow "cursed" as seeds of Cain or Canaan or Ham or the Devil.

 

St. Michael Vanquishing the Devil' Art Print - Bonifacio de Pitati | Art.com



This is one of the reasons since as far back as you can remember many Black males took pride in calling themselves "bad".
Even little Black boys will defiantly tell their mothers "I'm bad" before challenging her.
This low self esteem and self worth is ingrained through religion and enforced through the media.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:


But you know brother Malcolm was a RELIGIOUS man and firmly believed that Islam was the key to AfroAmerican salvation.
Atleast this was his firm belief in the months before he was taken from us.

Yep. Brotha Malcolm X was raised as a Christian and Islam changed his life.

 

But, brotha Malcolm X 1) realized the limits of religion and 2) never told AfroAmericans to be passive and/or that a sky fairy would deliver our salvation from racism white supremacy. He rejected the non-violent movement too.

 

Brotha Malcolm's stance changed a little bit after his return from Mecca but he never really got a chance to cook outside the NOI. 

 

Had brotha Malcolm X not been assassinated, I believe AfroAmericans would be in a much better net position both in terms of self-awareness and unity.😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ProfD
 

 

Had brotha Malcolm X not been assassinated, I believe AfroAmericans would be in a much better net position both in terms of self-awareness and unity.

I agree.
I'd also say the same for Dr.King and Khalid Abdul Muhammad to a certain extent.

With powerful exact and uncompromising voices like THOSE speaking to and for us....it would have been HARD for our community to go in the wrong direction.

Malcolm would have hipped us to the dope and Gangsta rap before it even materialized.
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

With powerful exact and uncompromising voices like THOSE speaking to and for us....it would have been HARD for our community to go in the wrong direction.

That's why the most powerful AfroAmerican voices are silenced in one way or another.  They're either assassinated or bribed/bought to parrot a narrative and/or pander to the AfroAmerican community.😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:


Well, to be clear we had an AFROAMERICAN President...I wouldn't necessarily call him "Black" and definitely not FBA.

Black ADOS Colored Negro FBA Moor AfroAmerican.......African.

In America Society for all intents and purposes he is Black

 

14 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

However our people ABSOLUTELY have still have low self esteem despite having HAD an AfroAmerican President.

Yes.....but I will not belittle this accomplishment instead I would rather use it to inspire

 

14 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Your self esteem is more than your accomplishments and confidence but your MORAL WORTH as well.

Moral Worth is Dignity and Self Respect....Self Esteem is Confidence and in One's abilities.

 

14 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Many if not most of our people subconsciously see themselves as more criminal and wicked than Caucasians.
It's ingrained in many of them since childhood because of the teachings of Christianity, especially the European kind.

 

 

14 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Many AfroAmericans like many Black people around the globe see themselves as spiritually and morally INFERIOR to Caucasians and believe they are somehow "cursed" as seeds of Cain or Canaan or Ham or the Devil.

Yes that is truth....not as much as it was before

 

14 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

St. Michael Vanquishing the Devil' Art Print - Bonifacio de Pitati | Art.com



This is one of the reasons since as far back as you can remember many Black males took pride in calling themselves "bad".
Even little Black boys will defiantly tell their mothers "I'm bad" before challenging her.
This low self esteem and self worth is ingrained through religion and enforced through the media.

 

When adult or teenage Blacks use the word "Bad"...it is bad as in good - a sort of revolutionary act.

A Whole lot different from when toddlers to preteens us it...as in character flaw

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, ProfD said:

Brotha Malcolm's stance changed a little bit after his return from Mecca but he never really got a chance to cook outside the NOI. 

 

Had brotha Malcolm X not been assassinated, I believe AfroAmericans would be in a much better net position both in terms of self-awareness and unity.😎

 

As you said, after he came back from the Middle East, his views changed.

Years ago, I was part of a book study with Islamic AfroAmerican MEN!--LOL.

 It was around the time of the Million Man March and it was one of the best experiences of my life. It was at this time that I learned a lot about the Civil Rights Movement.

I had no idea that a lot of Islamics came together with the late Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.!? I went to an HBCU and didn't even learn about this and a lot of history. 

 

But also, I learned that there became a huge division when the late Malcolm X came back from the ME. He did not change a little, but a lot, from what I heard at the table.

My husband read a book about him, I think the author was the late Alex Haley, and in it, I was told that it was revealed that Malcolm X had an obssession with White women. I think he was a complex man. 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Delano said:

We have been divided for centuries.

True.  The 1960s was the most unified AfroAmericans had ever been in our history. A moment in time.

 

Otherwise, the lack of unity among AfroAmericans is the reason we could not:

 

1) end slavery

2) save Black Wall Street 100 years ago

3) keep our leaders from being assassinated

 

Today, AfroAmericans still are not unified in such a way to protect ourselves from the system of racism white supremacy. 

 

The reason is institutionalized...divided and conquered a long time ago. 

 

Considering the technologies and resources available to AfroAmericans, there is no excuse for continued disunity among us.  😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Troy said:

For all the reasons Deion Sanders took a role at Jackson State then left for Colorado pretty much sums our unification predicament up.  

You're absolutely correct.

 

Sanders didn't want to work his way up the coaching ranks under white folks at a PWI (Predominantly White Institution).   

 

Instead, it was Prime's objective to build his coaching resume by using his fame and celebrity to lure 5 star recruits to Jackson State University. 

 

He used AfroAmerican athletes to show white folks that he could recruit athletes and build a winning program. 

 

If it was not all about him, Deion Prime Sanders could have single-handedly lifted HBCU athletics and admissions.  Funding would have flooded HBCUs. 

 

A modern day example of an AfroAmerican selling out the community for personal gain.  That white ice always seems to be colder.😎

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

3 hours ago, ProfD said:

True.  The 1960s was the most unified AfroAmericans had ever been in our history. A moment in time.

It continues....We currently have Many Black Organization  and Institutions In US and Globally, each addressing various Political Social and Financial issues we as Black people Endure.

 

3 hours ago, ProfD said:

 

Otherwise, the lack of unity among AfroAmericans is the reason we could not:

1) end slavery

We did end Chattel Slavery....except for Prisons

 

3 hours ago, ProfD said:

2) save Black Wall Street 100 years ago

True

 

3 hours ago, ProfD said:

3) keep our leaders from being assassinated

No Movement Nation or Organization on Earth can offer such a guarantee

 

3 hours ago, ProfD said:

 

Today, AfroAmericans still are not unified in such a way to protect ourselves from the system of racism white supremacy. 

The Struggle Continues...

 

3 hours ago, ProfD said:

 

The reason is institutionalized...divided and conquered a long time ago. 

What form does Institutionalized Racism (divided and conquered) take - how exactly does it impact us..

Who are the individuals(members) who keep these Institutions alive and  Administer their aims and goals

Where Are their Located

When do they meet

 

If we answer the above at least 5 different ways with all being truth we can create a message to dismantle institutional racism.....Germination

The Question is Who is going to bell the Cat..

 

 

3 hours ago, ProfD said:

 

Considering the technologies and resources available to AfroAmericans, there is no excuse for continued disunity among us.  😎

What does Black Unification Looks Like to You...?

Is it that none of the Current  Black Organization  and Institutions quite fit your Idea of Unity?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, frankster said:

We did end Chattel Slavery....except for Prisons

 

No Movement Nation or Organization on Earth can offer such a guarantee

 

What form does Institutionalized Racism (divided and conquered) take - how exactly does it impact us..

 

What does Black Unification Looks Like to You...?

AfroAmericans did not end chattel slavery.  It took a  whole Civil War between white folks and a US President to end the practice.

 

The wealth of America was built on slavery and the PTSD (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder) has affected generations of AfroAmericans for centuries.

 

Just like the US Secret Service protects the POTUS, the Fruit of Islam (FOI) has done a great job of protecting the Honorable Minister Louis Farrakhan.   

 

As AfroAmericans, we should be able to protect and avenge for our own.

 

The system of racism white supremacy is a multilayered institution that has been operating for centuries now.  It permeates from governments down to public and private concerns and is over-arching in every area of human activity. 

 

Dismantling the system of racism white supremacy will require the cooperation of multiple institutions on several fronts.

 

The Jewish community (Jewish Defense League, Anti-Defamation League, B'nai B'rith) is an example of how AfroAmerican unification should look. 😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Frankster

 

 

Yes.....but I will not belittle this accomplishment instead I would rather use it to inspire.

 

Well, my observation on how little effect he had on the MORAL self esteem of most AfroAmericans isn't a belittlement of his accomplishments. It's merely an observation of facts.


Did Obama's Presidency reduce the amount of crime and violence in the AfroAmerican community?
Moral esteem aren't the ONLY factors in crime and violence but how you view yourself and others who look like you certainly is a BIG factor in this.

 

 

 

Moral Worth is Dignity and Self Respect....Self Esteem is Confidence and in One's abilities.

 

I agree with you on confidence, but not on self-esteem and moral worth.

Self-esteem INCLUDES confidence but not limited to or "is" Confidence in an of itself.
Further....

 

Your "moral worth" is your MORAL principles and codes.
This has more to do with your honesty, treatment of other people, and your relationship to The Divine.
An IMMORAL man can still have dignity and self-respect which are more ethical and personal characteristics.

 

 

 

 

 

When adult or teenage Blacks use the word "Bad"...it is bad as in good - a sort of revolutionary act.

 

I understand this.
However the ROOT REASON for this "revolutionary act" is to show society (i.e. White folks) that if they are the "good people" then the Black folks are the "bad people" to counter them and challenge them.

It's less revolutionary and more REBELLIOUS.

 

A REVOLUTION is calculated with a plan on the other send of it.
But a REBELLION is just an act of defiance against a superior power out of anger with no clear aim or objective other than irritating that power.

A big temper tantrum.

 

When Black folks started calling themselves "bad" as a positive term, still subconsciously it was a term of being "rebellious" against White authority or White society seen by them as "good" or "ordained".

 

My point is.....we need to GET OUT of their societal and moral norms and establish (or re-discover) and embrace OUR OWN moral and societal norms and be "good" again.

 

Time out for being a serpentine devil in someone else's Garden.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Chev

 

 

This is one-sided @Pioneer1

Where is @Cynique! Man! LOL.

 

Lol...so why don't YOU apply for the Push-Back-On-Pioneer position while she's taking a leave of absence?

 

 

 

 

ProfD & Frankster

 

The lack of unity isn't just an AfroAmerican problem but a BLACK problem globally.

The continent of Africa has more languages (over 1000) and ethnic groups than any other continent and it's not just because of population but because Black folks are do divided from eachother.


One nation may have 100 different tribes living in it fighting with eachother for power and resources.

 

Shaka Zulu was actually on his way to solve this problem by using his superior Zulu military to conquer one African kingdom after another until eventually the entire continent would be united under him....kind of like what the Roman Empire did with Europe.
The British saw this progress happening and stepped in to stop it.

 

By nature the DOMINANT TRIBE conquers the smaller ones and THAT is how unity takes place.
But White folks have been artificially inflating and arming smaller weaker tribes to keep nature from taking it's course and keep things off balance.


And it's the same here in the United States.

Black movements like the UNIA and Nation of Islam would have gobbled up and replaced the other little scams and shams operating in the AfroAmerican community and would have UNIFIED our community....if it weren't for White interference. 
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, ProfD said:

AfroAmericans did not end chattel slavery.  It took a  whole Civil War between white folks and a US President to end the practice.

Are you saying we played no part?

No doubt white people played apart.....so did black peoples.

I choose to emphasize our role.....as No one question the whites role in the end of chattel slavery.

 

4 hours ago, ProfD said:

 

The wealth of America was built on slavery and the PTSD (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder) has affected generations of AfroAmericans for centuries.

 

Just like the US Secret Service protects the POTUS, the Fruit of Islam (FOI) has done a great job of protecting the Honorable Minister Louis Farrakhan

 TRUE....they do but even Presidents have been assassinated....there is no guarantee

 

4 hours ago, ProfD said:

As AfroAmericans, we should be able to protect and avenge for our own.

Prefer the word Justice to avenge

 

4 hours ago, ProfD said:

 

The system of racism white supremacy is a multilayered institution that has been operating for centuries now.  It permeates from governments down to public and private concerns and is over-arching in every area of human activity. 

Yes....Then deal with one layer at a time.

Start with the layer you label....Private Concerns

 

4 hours ago, ProfD said:

 

Dismantling the system of racism white supremacy will require the cooperation of multiple institutions on several fronts.

True that why we have many organizations

 

4 hours ago, ProfD said:

 

The Jewish community (Jewish Defense League, Anti-Defamation League, B'nai B'rith) is an example of how AfroAmerican unification should look. 😎

We do....National Urban League, Congress of Racial Equality and CEMOTAP, NAACP to name a few.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, frankster said:

We do....National Urban League, Congress of Racial Equality and CEMOTAP, NAACP to name a few.

As long as those organizations are accepting money from white folks, they will be in a weaker position to dismantle the system of racism white supremacy. 

 

Also, I didn't hear anything from those organizations when Kanye West and Kyrie Irving were being charged with antisemitism. 

 

The NAACP has been compromised for over 50 years. Back in 1963, Malcolm X articulated that it was a bad idea to let white folks be involved in AfroAmerican organizations. 

 

I would like to see organization(s) committed to unifying AfroAmericans and codifying the AfroAmerican agenda and working for reparations to name a few. 😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Pioneer1

Blacks will never be able to unite unless we get our thinking straight.  

You demand Blacks need to leave California because Latinos have the numbers in Southern California. Which eliminates any chance of Blacks having a major voice in U.S. presidential elections for the future. If you are not a resident of California, then you cannot vote there. Which lessens the chance of Democrats winning the state's electoral votes.

That is not a strategy. That is surrender. 

And all because you are still pissed off about a citation you received for jaywalking years ago.

You also claimed that Haiti needs to return to pre-Christian traditional African beliefs. On what basis? Because YOU think so?

The only way to quell the horrible gang violence in Haiti is a military intervention and the country in the best position to accomplish this is the United States. Calling on spurious spirits will not help at all. 

It sounds as if you don't know a lot about Haiti's 20th Century history or even what led to it which is the Monroe Doctrine and chicanery and skullduggery by vile U.S. politicians and their Black turncoat lackeys.

I also recall you demanding a group of Blacks take revenge on the Buffalo, N.Y., Tops Supermarket shooter by traveling there and killing him. The only problem was the dude was already in custody and just as I predicted, is not going to see the light of freedom for the rest of his natural life. 

At times, you pop off with weird shit that is always based on your ego. 

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

This is one-sided @Pioneer1

Where is @Cynique! Man! LOL.

 

Lol...so why don't YOU apply for the Push-Back-On-Pioneer position while she's taking a leave of absence?

 

 

Well, I hope that she is taking a leave of absence and will be back to catch you in your genderism issues.

WHAT about @Mel Hopkins?

 

You don't think that you are being disrespectful to the sistas that chose to mate with a non-Black man?

Why would you need to distance yourself, @Pioneer1?

Why should a sista or a Brotha have to explain to you that their significant other is 'NOT-WHITE'? What does that have to do with them being Black?

The culture is the issue, here. 

If an AfroAmerican is intact with their identity, then that should not take away from their choice in a mate. 

America has done a lot of damage due to its racist agenda, but your understanding here, is flawed, imo.

 

 

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

44 minutes ago, Chevdove said:

WHAT about @Mel Hopkins?

🙋🏽‍♀️ Here!  Hi lovely!  

 

Nope! I have no patience for gender issues.  I’ve grown tired of some men trying to dictate a woman’s partnership choices.  It’s a waste of time. 
 

If those men were so concerned. They would simply show up be present and stay put.  Anything less, is lip-service, bitchin’ and moanin’.

 

Edited by Mel Hopkins
More to say
  • Like 3
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How can you talk about race unity and make divisive personal comments?

 

Ego and unity appear to mutually exclusive.

3 hours ago, Chevdove said:

You don't think that you are being disrespectful to the sistas that chose to mate with a non-Black man

Using that same argument would you discount Frederick Douglas's contributions?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Yes.....but I will not belittle this accomplishment instead I would rather use it to inspire.

 

Well, my observation on how little effect he had on the MORAL self esteem of most AfroAmericans isn't a belittlement of his accomplishments. It's merely an observation of facts.

Well Thanks....is  here a study done by a Harvard Professor seems to say different....

 

The inspiring role model that Mr. Obama projected helped blacks overcome anxieties about racial stereotypes that had been shown, in earlier research, to lower the test-taking proficiency of African-Americans, the researchers conclude in a report summarizing their results......Ronald F. Ferguson, a Harvard professor who studies the factors that have affected the achievement gap between white and nonwhite students, which shows up on nearly every standardized test. “There is a certainly a theoretical foundation and some empirical support for the proposition that Obama’s election could increase the sense of competence among African-Americans, and it could reduce the anxiety associated with taking difficult test questions.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/23/education/23gap.html#:~:text=The inspiring role model that,a report summarizing their results.

 

stereotype-defying success is having a positive impact on African-American students academic performance. A quasi-experiment performed last year by researchers at Vanderbilt University found that Obama had a profound effect on the exam performance of a sample of black test-takers, effectively eliminating the black-white test score gap in the days following Obamas victory in November. Researchers theorized that Obama serves as a salient role-model for students, helping to close the gap between white and black students achievement by disconfirming the widespread image of blacks as unintelligent.

https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2009/may/widespread_obama_effect.html

21 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:


Did Obama's Presidency reduce the amount of crime and violence in the AfroAmerican community?
Moral esteem aren't the ONLY factors in crime and violence but how you view yourself and others who look like you certainly is a BIG factor in this.

It accelerated the decline of crime in black communities.

 

according to the latest numbers from the FBI’s Uniform Crime Reporting Program, but they appear to have accelerated in some cities. In the first half of 2009, homicides plummeted an astounding 67 percent over 2008 in Minneapolis, 47 percent in Seattle, 39 percent in Charlotte, 31 percent in New York, and 17 percent in Los Angeles. As surprisingly, these declines occurred in black communities, which suffer disproportionately from unemployment and stagnating wages and from crime (about half of all violent crimes in the United States involve blacks)—even as the growth in the prison population, also disproportionately black, has halted.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2011/10/the-obama-effect-a-surprising-new-theory-for-the-continuing-crime-decline-among-black-americans.html

 

21 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

 

Moral Worth is Dignity and Self Respect....Self Esteem is Confidence and in One's abilities.

 

I agree with you on confidence, but not on self-esteem and moral worth.

Self-esteem INCLUDES confidence but not limited to or "is" Confidence in an of itself.
Further....

 

Your "moral worth" is your MORAL principles and codes.
This has more to do with your honesty, treatment of other people, and your relationship to The Divine.
An IMMORAL man can still have dignity and self-respect which are more ethical and personal characteristics.

Self Esteem is confidence in Oneself  and One's abilities to succeed in a given task.

Moral Worth has to do with One's adherence to a Moral code of Ethics...Dignity and self Respect  is the feelings and accolades One receives - Honor and Noble

 

21 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

When adult or teenage Blacks use the word "Bad"...it is bad as in good - a sort of revolutionary act.

 

I understand this.
However the ROOT REASON for this "revolutionary act" is to show society (i.e. White folks) that if they are the "good people" then the Black folks are the "bad people" to counter them and challenge them.

It's less revolutionary and more REBELLIOUS.

 

A REVOLUTION is calculated with a plan on the other send of it.
But a REBELLION is just an act of defiance against a superior power out of anger with no clear aim or objective other than irritating that power.

A big temper tantrum.

 

When Black folks started calling themselves "bad" as a positive term, still subconsciously it was a term of being "rebellious" against White authority or White society seen by them as "good" or "ordained".

One Rebel against that which is despicable.....Rebellion is one of the signs of defiance in which change is demanded.

Civil rights Leader and Congressman John Lewis says instead of "Bad" ... "Good Trouble"

 

Protest is a voice crying about Injustice.

Civil disobedience is action take to disrupt the normalization of continued Injustice.

Insurrection is a Rising Dissatisfaction with Injustice

Rebellion is a Willingness to confront Injustice.

Revolt  is Confrontation with the Forces of Injustice and a Demand for Change.

Revolution is the Change

 

21 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

My point is.....we need to GET OUT of their societal and moral norms and establish (or re-discover) and embrace OUR OWN moral and societal norms and be "good" again.

 

Time out for being a serpentine devil in someone else's Garden.

Moral and Ethics as well as Good and Evil are Perspectives.....and changes depending on Time Place and Culture.

Beneficial as in Life  and Well being Promoting changes a lot less.

 

21 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

ProfD & Frankster

 

The lack of unity isn't just an AfroAmerican problem but a BLACK problem globally.

The continent of Africa has more languages (over 1000) and ethnic groups than any other continent and it's not just because of population but because Black folks are do divided from eachother.


One nation may have 100 different tribes living in it fighting with eachother for power and resources.

Most Things in Nature is diverse....

Diversity and Variety is a Natural adaptation and survival skill....it is not a weakness but a strength.

 

 

21 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

Shaka Zulu was actually on his way to solve this problem by using his superior Zulu military to conquer one African kingdom after another until eventually the entire continent would be united under him....kind of like what the Roman Empire did with Europe.
The British saw this progress happening and stepped in to stop it.

 

By nature the DOMINANT TRIBE conquers the smaller ones and THAT is how unity takes place.
But White folks have been artificially inflating and arming smaller weaker tribes to keep nature from taking it's course and keep things off balance.


And it's the same here in the United States.

Black movements like the UNIA and Nation of Islam would have gobbled up and replaced the other little scams and shams operating in the AfroAmerican community and would have UNIFIED our community....if it weren't for White interference. 
 

Do Not Confuse Unity with Conformity.

Conformity cannot be maintain without force and subterfuge.

Instead seek Harmony by finding Common ground and Beneficial sausion

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Many Black men, and I suspect this of some in this forum, remain insanely jealous of Barack Obama.

His ability to think rationally is far superior to them

His superiority at public speaking diminishes them

His calmness galvanizes others to be inspired by him


Unlike the grandstanding phonies among us, Obama does not seek to isolate Black people. But welcomes all who agree with our progress.

The ones who claim Obama did little for Black people miss the entire point of his campaign and time as POTUS. So, one more time for the clueless: Barack Obama was not elected President of Black America. He was elected President of the United States. And he was great at that job. 

He was not able to embark on a grand Marshall Plan for Black Americans. There remained so much hatred, angst and uncertainly immediately after his 2008 election, many Blacks held their breath when it came to his well-being. I guess so many of forgot (or didn't even know about) the Tea Party, "We want our country back!" and the thousands of threats that poured in daily after the Obamas moved into the White House.

And I imagine you also neglect to recall the kindness and welcoming sentiment of the Bush Twins toward Malia and Sasha. 

Know how Obama triumphed? He built a multi-ethnic political coalition. It was not all Black. Obama recognized he could not with Black votes alone. The same with Sen. Raphael Warnock in Georgia. He appealed to all constituencies and Asians went for Warnock in a big way, according to exit polls. 

This is why I ignore those on this forum who call themselves "writers" but cannot author a coherent paragraph. They are often mistaken on their claims about history or how Slavery ended. Some act as if we Blacks alone triumphed over Southern Racists. Bull.

The Union Army, thousands of Abolitionists and scores of sympathizers, including Britain's Royal Navy, Mexicans, Native Americans and some Canadians all aided our struggle. Often for years and if caught, were punished severely. As a reporter, I was tasked with interviewing the late C. Everett Koop, at the time, the U.S. Surgeon General under Ronald Reagan. Koop's grandfather was part of the Underground Railroad. He spent time rowing escaped Slaves who made their way North into Staten Island across the Narrows into Brooklyn.

I betcha ya'll didn't know that chit.

Just one example of how some sympathetic Whites helped us. 

This does not mean Blacks did not achieve anything. We have a bevy of inventors, explorers and luminaries in art, science and literature. 

But when it comes to politics, the only way forward for Black America is through political coalition, alliances and cooperation. The Obama Coalition comprised African-Americans, Latinos, women, independents, millennials and those with a college education. 

Obama recognized coalitions work and win. Why can't you?


 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Stefan said:

Many Black men, and I suspect this of some in this forum, remain insanely jealous of Barack Obama.

 

"Insanely Jealous" I'm not sure which Black men said what to prompt this conclusion. 

 

When people point out that Obama, who has a white mother, is not a descendant of enslaved Africans, was raised quite differently than most Black people and simply is very different than most  Black Americans.  Acknowledging that difference is not jealousy.

 

Similarly, when people point out that Obama bailed out the crooks in the banking industry, his financial backers, while millions lost homes without getting any relief; that is not jealousy it is calling out inequity that has contributed to accelerating the wealth gap in the country.

 

@frankster The New York Times has a paywall so I read this article regarding the achievement gap Obama closed after his inauguration.  To me to give Obama that much credit seems extreme.  The study admittedly used a small sample set and has not been peer-reviewed.  What are the long-term effects since the study was conducted? 

 

Presumably, Black people do not get immediately smarter after Obama was sworn into office. Are we to believe that Obama's election had the immediate effect of reducing test-taking anxiety because of Black people's increased sense of competence among African-Americans after Obama was sworn in  --  immediately and completely eliminated differences in test scores? 

 

 

As far as Obama's impact on reducing violence in the Black community, to attribute any declines to one man, even President Obama, is a stretch -- on it's face.  Violent crime was on a decline nationwide before Obama was elected.  It is like Giuliani taking credit for a decline in crime in NYC because of his "broken windows" policy.  Changes in crime are complex and usually not attributable solely to one person. 

 

That is like blaming the increase in violent crime, in Chicago, on Lightfoot.

 

Obama is clearly a person who can "think rationally," is great "at public speaking" and, can galvanize "others to be inspired by him."  These are fine qualities but there are many Black people with these characteristics,

 

Obama will always be great as he was the first Black president.  Now some might be a little jealous of the privilege, riches, and other benefits that come from this 😉 In fact that is probably normal...

 

But "Insane" jealousy against Obama, as demonstrated by what anyone has written here, is hyperbolic. 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Troy

What was written here? You gotta be kidding. There are not that many good writers on this forum.

And what I said is true, judging from the attitudes of Obama Detractors. They act as if they have all the answers. 

Obama was not responsible for crime. Those who commit the crimes were.

"Obama didn't do this for Black people. Obama didn't do that for Black people." As if any of those loudmouths had Obama's charisma, his communications talent, his ability to sway detractors and non-believers to his side. Obama did what he was elected to do, prevent the Great Recession from morphing into another Great Depression and ending the Iraq War.

With the amount of venom directed at Obama, his first Lady and their two daughters, it is practically a miracle the U.S. Secret Service managed to keep them all unharmed in this super racist country, where the most violent are armed to the teeth. I wish Obama could have done more, but he faced unending and unswerving hatred and opposition. 

The problem with most folks on news forums and in discussion groups is they do little but whine and gripe. They rarely offer workable solutions. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, I'm not kidding.

 

Now I freely admit I have not read everything posted on these forums.  But I don't recall reading a number of posts that would justify your statement:

 

"Many Black men, and I suspect this of some in this forum, remain insanely jealous of Barack Obama."

 

Please share a single post from this forum that you think would characterize the poster as "insanely jealous" of Obama.

 

I've posted quite a few things critical of Obama on these forums, but I would not characterize myself as jealous of Obama. 

 

Were you aware that a full two years into his presidency Obama would not give a Black-owned newspaper an interview?  Why do you think Obama chose not to speak with the Black press?

 

George E. Curry editor of the NNPA News Service, complained last week that President Obama was disrespecting the black media, too.

 

“There is a disrespect for the black press that we have not seen in recent years. For example, we have requested — every year — an interview with the president. He can ignore 200 black newspapers and 19 million viewers but he can give one to every stupid white comedian there is on TV, the black ones and the white ones, and has time for all types of buffoonery but they will not respect the black press enough to give us an interview,” Curry said on TVOne’s NewsOneNow with Roland Martin.
—from Richard Prince’s Journal-isms

 

I think Obama avoided the Black press because they would have attempted to hold him accountable to Black people.  White media is not inclined, or even able, to do this. They harped on him being the first Black President and being "so articulate." 

 

We HAVE to support our own platforms to be unified.  If the first so-called Black president refuses to grant the Black press an interview, that is a SERIOUS problem for Black unity. 

 

Am I wrong about this?

 

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Stefan said:

The problem with most folks on news forums and in discussion groups is they do little but whine and gripe. They rarely offer workable solutions

You resemble that remark.

It's not the first time your criticisms apply to you 

 

In a thread about unity, you make ad hominem attacks and make emotional statements.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Troy said:

 

@frankster The New York Times has a paywall so I read this article regarding the achievement gap Obama closed after his inauguration.  To me to give Obama that much credit seems extreme.  The study admittedly used a small sample set and has not been peer-reviewed.  What are the long-term effects since the study was conducted? 

I know the effect of Positive strong Black Men and Women on the Minds of Black youth starved of Images and Narratives of Black African Success....The Presidency is success on another level.

High School and College leaves many Black Youth feeling alienated and foreign  to the subjects taught....And sometimes worst Humiliated Ashamed Embarrassed and Guilty.

The Reason why Black Achievements has been removed from Education curriculum is to created Apathy in Black students toward Education....Remember the Phenomenon Of Black Kids Accusing Other Black Kids of  "acting white" if and when they excelled in academics. - which led to introduction "dumbing down" . "ebonics".

Obama's Presidential  success flip that script....

 

6 hours ago, Troy said:

 

Presumably, Black people do not get immediately smarter after Obama was sworn into office.

Black were and are and have been smart wise capable and intelligent.

Tests taking have always been one of the method used to exclude Black from higher education....for many reasons.

Make no mistake Anxiety was always a Factor.

 

6 hours ago, Troy said:

Are we to believe that Obama's election had the immediate effect of reducing test-taking anxiety because of Black people's increased sense of competence among African-Americans after Obama was sworn in  --  immediately and completely eliminated differences in test scores? 

Yes and Yes and Yes.

 

6 hours ago, Troy said:

As far as Obama's impact on reducing violence in the Black community, to attribute any declines to one man, even President Obama, is a stretch -- on it's face.  Violent crime was on a decline nationwide before Obama was elected.  It is like Giuliani taking credit for a decline in crime in NYC because of his "broken windows" policy.  Changes in crime are complex and usually not attributable solely to one person. 

True......Reduction in crime started before Obama.

What we can say for sure is that his Election and Terms in Office did not slow or stop the decline in Crime.....It Accelerated the decline.

For that I think he is deserving of some credit.

 

7 hours ago, Troy said:

That is like blaming the increase in violent crime, in Chicago, on Lightfoot.

What evidence  do you have that Obama is not a Factor in the Acceleration of the Decline in Crime.

 

7 hours ago, Troy said:

Obama is clearly a person who can "think rationally," is great "at public speaking" and, can galvanize "others to be inspired by him."  These are fine qualities but there are many Black people with these characteristics,

TRUE but .......How many of them became President of The USA?

 

7 hours ago, Troy said:

Obama will always be great as he was the first Black president.  Now some might be a little jealous of the privilege, riches, and other benefits that come from this 😉 In fact that is probably normal...

 

But "Insane" jealousy against Obama, as demonstrated by what anyone has written here, is hyperbolic. 

The Problem Black America has with Obama is that he is Not a So called ADOS or FBA...These are new lines of division in the Black community - foment by Racist whites.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Stefan said:

 There are not that many good writers on this forum. 

The problem with most folks on news forums and in discussion groups is they do little but whine and gripe. They rarely offer workable solutions. 

I don't believe this forum was intended to be a writing class. 

 

I don't read our fellow forumites posts as a "whine and gripe". Everyone is entitled to their opinions. 

 

Constructive dialog can lead to ideas and solutions.😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@ProfD

Discussion Forums are not writing classes. Constructive Dialogue is all well and good when it is constructive.

What has been constructive in these forums? The capitulation to lying and racist Republicans who want to do Black Folk in?

Defense of some of the most addled-brained politicians in recent memory? Minority children must be deprived of nutritious meals because tax money most go to the richest through tax cuts? I have not seen any constructive criticism.

How do we stop this? Not by Blacks fleeing California, holding Mike Pence up as a sterling example of the Intelligentsia, endorsing endless overseas wars, putting down the poor and voting for politicians who think it's their right to deny healthcare to the most vulnerable. I have yet to read of any workable solutions to these problems. 

If you read the lines or between them, you'll glimpse the complaints. I don't expect to find good writers on most forums. But I loathe the ones who lionize those who hate us.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, Stefan said:


If you read the lines or between them, you'll glimpse the complaints. I don't expect to find good writers on most forums. But I loathe the ones who lionize those who hate us.

If you read all of the posts, there's plenty dialog that isn't a complaint and could be constructive.

 

However, if you only choose to focus on the posts that get under your skin that's a different concern. 😎

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, ProfD said:

However, if you only choose to focus on the posts that get under your skin that's a different concern

Prof D you are  wasting your time. Some people have funhouse mirrors at home. Making a complaint about complaints is like meta complaining. From a person that is constantly complaining about other not being able to write, or being able to see he has the solutions to systemic  problems. I can accept criticism from Mel and Cynique, not just because they write but because they think and they are offering a critque  not a criticism, that is mean spirited. Denigrating people to lift yourself never works. I have met a few writers they all seem to have a common thread. The writing is supported by intellectual accuity and the ability to see from more than one perspective. I am not going to name names but there is some confusion with being a writer, a reporter or typist.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Stefan @Stefan

 


Blacks will never be able to unite unless we get our thinking straight.

 

Well, if you're sitting around waiting for all of our people to get their "thinking straight"....then you're essentially saying Blacks won't unite....lol.

 

 


You demand Blacks need to leave California because Latinos have the numbers in Southern California. 

 

Yes.

 

 

 

Which eliminates any chance of Blacks having a major voice in U.S. presidential elections for the future. 


False.

 

We can increase OUR population and THE population of any state we choose if we'd focus on doing it. Including California....but that would be too hard of a battle and not worth it.
We are only SLIGHTLY less than Latinos in population, so leaving California and concentrating in other states will be very beneficial strategically.

 

 

 

 

If you are not a resident of California, then you cannot vote there. Which lessens the chance of Democrats winning the state's electoral votes.

 

Who cares?  The state is lost anyway.
Let it drop in the ocean

 


And all because you are still pissed off about a citation you received for jaywalking years ago.

 

You're delusional....lol.

 

 

 

 

You also claimed that Haiti needs to return to pre-Christian traditional African beliefs. On what basis? Because YOU think so?

 

On the basis of THAT is actually won Haiti her independence in the first place.
Abandoning White Jesus and Christianity and embracing African Spirituality again.

 

 

 

 

The only way to quell the horrible gang violence in Haiti is a military intervention and the country in the best position to accomplish this is the United States. Calling on spurious spirits will not help at all. 

 

The United States and the West are likely the ones who are FORMENTING the gang violence in the first damn place.
So why in the hell would you think THEY would be the ones to quell it and establish peace?????

 

 

 

 

It sounds as if you don't know a lot about Haiti's 20th Century history or even what led to it which is the Monroe Doctrine and chicanery and skullduggery by vile U.S. politicians and their Black turncoat lackeys.

 

It sounds like you don't know too much about Haitian history and White racism PERIOD if you think begging White nations to come to Haiti to help her is the "solution".



 

I also recall you demanding a group of Blacks take revenge on the Buffalo, N.Y., Tops Supermarket shooter by traveling there and killing him. 


Nope.
Never said such a thing.
Although I wouldn't stand in the way of them if they did...lol


 


The only problem was the dude was already in custody and just as I predicted, is not going to see the light of freedom for the rest of his natural life. 

 

Has he been tried and convicted yet?
How do you know what is fate will be?


 

At times, you pop off with weird shit that is always based on your ego. 


🤣 Lol...look who's talking.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Chev @Chevdove

 


WHAT about @Mel Hopkins?

 

Lol...Mel is too smart to get tangled up in a back and forth with me.  

 

 

 

 

You don't think that you are being disrespectful to the sistas that chose to mate with a non-Black man?

 

No, but many of the sistas who choose to mate and dote on and fawn over and "fall in love" with non-Black men ARE being disrespectful to the bruthas and openly so.
Many will OPENLY walk around with a White man on their arms laughing loudly and showing the world how good of a time they are having now that they've found a non-Negro as a lover as a way of "getting back".


Most Black men don't do that.
Most Black men with a White or non-Black woman just want them for sex but could care less about "getting even" or trying to show them off to spite Black women.

 

 

 

 

Why should a sista or a Brotha have to explain to you that their significant other is 'NOT-WHITE'? What does that have to do with them being Black?

 

They're still Black.
Their RACE isn't in question....their LOYALTY is.

 

 

 

 

 

 


Mel @Mel Hopkins


Here!  Hi lovely!  

 

Lol...😊....Hiiieeeee!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Frankster  @frankster

 


The first article you referenced on the academic performance of AfroAmericans is irrelevant because whether or not Obama's Presidency had an impact on desire for AfroAmerican youth to achieve higher goals academically and politically is undisputed.

 

Again, my question is what impact did he have on our MORAL disposition in general?

I think Troy may have pointed it out already but according to FBI statistics crime was already going down nation wide....not just in the Black community for years BEFORE Obama took office and just continued on a slight decline.
Any decline likely had nothing to do with Obama's Presidency which means him being in office did little to change the moral esteem of most of our people.

 

 

 

One Rebel against that which is despicable.....Rebellion is one of the signs of defiance in which change is demanded.

 

Ok...but just being defiant and angry doesn't always lead to change.
Sometimes it just leads to death and removal.

 

Being a gangsta and selling dope isn't "revolutionary" it's just rebellious.

 

 

 

 

 

Insurrection is a Rising Dissatisfaction with Injustice

 

In some cases.

Many of those who witnessed the insurrection of January 6th may beg to differ that THAT one was fueled by "injustice".

 

 

 


Rebellion is a Willingness to confront Injustice.

 

Not necessarily "confront" it.
Just disobey it.
There's a difference.

 

 

 

 

 

Revolt  is Confrontation with the Forces of Injustice and a Demand for Change.

 

A revolt isn't a "demand" for change.
At that point....the demands are over.

 

During a Revolt....the Revolutionaries are making the changes THEMSELVES...lol.

 

 

 

 


Moral and Ethics as well as Good and Evil are Perspectives.....and changes depending on Time Place and Culture.

Beneficial as in Life  and Well being Promoting changes a lot less.

 

True.
However it hasn't much, in our community over the past 40 years or so.

 

 

 

 

 

Most Things in Nature is diverse....
Diversity and Variety is a Natural adaptation and survival skill....it is not a weakness but a strength.

 

True in most cases.
But in come cases "diversity" and "variety" are symptoms of disease and dysfunction.
Abnormality.

 

Grey hair is a variant of it's original darker color, but it's a sign of melanin deficiency and age.

 

 

 

 

Do Not Confuse Unity with Conformity.

Conformity cannot be maintain without force and subterfuge.
Instead seek Harmony by finding Common ground and Beneficial sausion

 
Sometimes you need to FORCE conformity on one generation to ACHIEVE unity with the next.

Especially when you're dealing with a people who are being PURPOSELY divided and kept divided from both internal AND EXTERNAL forces.

Racists use force and deception to keep our people divided....so we must also use a measure of force to unite them.

The UNITED States used FORCE to keep the Union together and keep this nation from splitting apart....and now it's among the most powerful in the world.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Stefan

 

 

But when it comes to politics, the only way forward for Black America is through political coalition, alliances and cooperation. The Obama Coalition comprised African-Americans, Latinos, women, independents, millennials and those with a college education. 

Obama recognized coalitions work and win. Why can't you?

 


With all of this Rodney King "can't we all get along and love eachother" wishful thinking.....you're neglecting a few things.

 

1. Alliances and coalitions can't be ONE SIDED.
In order for you to work with Whites, Latinos, and Asians they have to WANT to work with and form alliances with you...and most don't.
Most just want to USE AfroAmericans for their own benefit and exploit our community to benefit theirs.


Black folks are running around BEGGING for an alliance with others, but they aren't begging....asking...or even wanting an alliance with YOU.
They want you OUT OF THE WAY so they can get closer to White folks.


2. Any coalitions and alliances made must be beneficial to US.
You don't unite and form alliances with other people JUST BECAUSE.
We have to actually GET something out of it.

 

The White folks who supported Obama did so because they stood to BENEFIT from him being in office whether they were politicians who needed his charisma and popularity to help THEM get into office or members of the LGBT community who would benefit from his presidency by him ushering in more LGBT friendly laws.


The Latinos who DID support him....many if not most didn't...did it because of the assumed open border policies of the Democrat party.

Most Asians did NOT support him because they didn't see any benefit for them.


Most people with good sense and high esteem don't go around supporting people JUST BECAUSE but they do it strategically because they see a benefit in it for themselves and their community.

You want us to form coalitions and alliances with these other groups just to be "liked" by them even if it benefits nothing for us.

What benefit is there for us to unite with these people MORE than uniting OUR PEOPLE with eachother first?
What do they have to offer us????

We have the numbers.
We have more political power than any other demographic except White Americans.
And although it's disproportionate, we actually have more WEALTH than any other group outside of White Americans.

Again, what do THEY have to offer US for an alliance????

Like I said earlier, when it comes to these other non-Black groups it seems YOU want an "alliance" with them.....THEY DON'T.
They either want to exploit you or want you out of their way so they can get closer to White power.
 


 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Frankster  @frankster

 


The first article you referenced on the academic performance of AfroAmericans is irrelevant because whether or not Obama's Presidency had an impact on desire for AfroAmerican youth to achieve higher goals academically and politically is undisputed.

How is it Irrelevant.??

We are not questioning whether or not blacks aspire to academic  success...that is undisputed.

We questioning whether or not that OBama becoming President Impact Black Students Test Taking Results Success Rate...My Answer is YES.

 

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Again, my question is what impact did he have on our MORAL disposition in general?

What are you looking at as a  significant social criteria as a  reflections of Moral Disposition?

I thought Educational Success and Crimes Rates are ?...

Both of which Obama's Presidency is having a Good Effect...

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I think Troy may have pointed it out already but according to FBI statistics crime was already going down nation wide....not just in the Black community for years BEFORE Obama took office and just continued on a slight decline.

They decline in the crime rate....ACCELERATED  under Obama.Well 

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Any decline likely had nothing to do with Obama's Presidency which means him being in office did little to change the moral esteem of most of our people.

Did Obama Presidency initiate the Crime Rate decline.....No

Did Obama's Presidency have and Effect - Yes it Accelerated the Decline.

According to a study that has yet to be Peer Reviewed or Duplicated....it has a positive effect

 

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

One Rebel against that which is despicable.....Rebellion is one of the signs of defiance in which change is demanded.

Ok...but just being defiant and angry doesn't always lead to change.
Sometimes it just leads to death and removal.

True

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Being a gangsta and selling dope isn't "revolutionary" it's just rebellious.

Depends on the Cause...

Is it to aggrandize yourself...

Is it to feed Your Family...

is it to feed the hungry and shelter the Homeless..

Is it to better your community...

 

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

nsurrection is a Rising Dissatisfaction with Injustice

 

In some cases.

Many of those who witnessed the insurrection of January 6th may beg to differ that THAT one was fueled by "injustice".

In My and it seems your opinion it was.....but to those who participated at the time , I am sure to them it was not an Injustice.

This will always be the case...The moment any individual believe in Good and Bad people

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Rebellion is a Willingness to confront Injustice.

 

Not necessarily "confront" it.
Just disobey it.
There's a difference.

Tell Me the Difference?

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Revolt  is Confrontation with the Forces of Injustice and a Demand for Change.

 

A revolt isn't a "demand" for change.
At that point....the demands are over.

 

During a Revolt....the Revolutionaries are making the changes THEMSELVES...lol.

The Rebellion is usually met with open hostilities......A contest of Wills ensues - That is the Revolt

The Demand is the Conflict....The Victor of the Conflict decides Whether the Revolution Succeeds or criminals were Vanquished.

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

Moral and Ethics as well as Good and Evil are Perspectives.....and changes depending on Time Place and Culture.

Beneficial as in Life  and Well being Promoting changes a lot less.

 

True.
However it hasn't much, in our community over the past 40 years or so.

Please Clarify.

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Most Things in Nature is diverse....
Diversity and Variety is a Natural adaptation and survival skill....it is not a weakness but a strength.

 

True in most cases.
But in come cases "diversity" and "variety" are symptoms of disease and dysfunction.
Abnormality.

True

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

Grey hair is a variant of it's original darker color, but it's a sign of melanin deficiency and age.

True

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

Do Not Confuse Unity with Conformity.

Conformity cannot be maintain without force and subterfuge.
Instead seek Harmony by finding Common ground and Beneficial sausion

 
Sometimes you need to FORCE conformity on one generation to ACHIEVE unity with the next.

Especially when you're dealing with a people who are being PURPOSELY divided and kept divided from both internal AND EXTERNAL forces.

Yes that is true...usually best for quick short term results

The Best policy is usually Education and  Information for long term Unity

 

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Racists use force and deception to keep our people divided....so we must also use a measure of force to unite them.

The UNITED States used FORCE to keep the Union together and keep this nation from splitting apart....and now it's among the most powerful in the world.

Yes...

You must know  Why and What type of force to use....

Gandhi and Martin use Moral Force....

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


frankster

 


How is it Irrelevant.??

We are not questioning whether or not blacks aspire to academic  success...that is undisputed.

 

I'm not.
Maybe that's the discussion between you and Troy, but I believe Obama had a rather positive impact on Black academic performance.

However, it's irrelevant because academic performance and self-moral evaluation are two different subjects for two different concepts.

 

Perhaps they may overlap eachother sometimes, but they are pretty much separate issues.

 

 

 

 

What are you looking at as a  significant social criteria as a  reflections of Moral Disposition?

 

Crime
Violence
Family structure
Social interaction in society

 

We already discussed crime....

Did the number of out of wedlock births in the AfroAmerican community go down under the Obama Administration?

Did domestic violence in the AfroAmerican community go down under the Obama Administration?

Did the number of gangster rap songs and violent lyrics decline under the Obama Administration?

 

In other words, did Black folks just become "better people" period and more righteous under the Obama Administration that we can point to and say he had a positive impact in improving the moral self esteem of AfroAmericans?

 

 

 

 

They decline in the crime rate....ACCELERATED  under Obama.Well 

 

It was already on a downward trend and continued on that trend.
I'm not sure about the acceleration part, I didn't see that in the stats I looked at.
The downward trend looked pretty steady....I didn't see any steep declines in the graphs.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Depends on the Cause...

Is it to aggrandize yourself...

Is it to feed Your Family...

is it to feed the hungry and shelter the Homeless..

Is it to better your community...


A  couple points:

 

1. EVEN IF it's to "feed your family" and provide shelter to the homeless....being a gangster or dope dealer isn't "Revolutionary".
It's basically playing with the cards one was dealt by an unjust system that neglected those whom you cared about and rebelling against that system in order to help your loved ones.
But it's NOT Revolutionary because it doesn't seek to REPLACE that unjust system.

 

2.  Realistically speaking, how many gangsters and dope dealers are doing it to feed their families or even ARE feeding their families???

Most gangsters and dope dealers enter that lifestyle of selling poison, harming, and exploiting people in their own commmunity at a relatively young age BEFORE THEY EVEN HAVE FAMILIES to take care of.  So they certainly weren't doing it for those reasons.
Many if not most of them MAKE children they don't take care of and accumulate women they don't take care of either.

The majority of them who engage in that lifestyle did it for fast and easy money and/or the thrill of crime and violence.  If a few just happen to use it for good like feeding the homeless or their families in the process...that's good.
But they are a minority.

 

 

 

 

 


Tell Me the Difference?

 


The purpose of rebelliousness is to DISOBEY/BUCK the system.

 

The purpose of revolution is to REPLACE the system all together.

 

See the difference?

 

 

 

 


Yes...

You must know  Why and What type of force to use....

Gandhi and Martin use Moral Force....

 

Yes they both used moral force, but the reason it worked was because it exposed the hypocrisy of Caucasians to the rest of humanity.

The greatest weapon of White racists is Deception/Confusion.
Having people think that THEY are the "good people" and the "moral people".

 

Both Gandhi and King showed the rest of humanity of color that despite their Christian rhetoric, most American and British White people were atheistic hypocrites who only used religion and civility as a mask to hide their savagery.
This exposure forced White racist to...not change themselves...but change THEIR TACTICS so as to become effective without looking so hypocritical and demonic as they did in the past.

They needed to find a new way to trick people of color since the old way was no longer working after being exposed.

 

Let me take time out to say........

I don't agree with everything you post, but I have to admit I like the fact that you acknowledge the points that you DO agree with me on instead of ignoring them just to focus on points of difference like a lot of posters do.

It's well balanced.
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I concur, Black people need to unite functionally. I read all the comments, so I am not feeling the desire to comment long.  The comments here show two things. 

One, the definition of who is black has become more complicated within the black community in the usa at least. To rephrase. Black people in the usa do not have consensus on who else is black and that needs to be clarified but it isn't easy for the internal variance in the usa of whom is black is wide. Black people in Jamaica or Nigeria or India have an easier path to self identity.  I don't know if a people can have an open definition to themselves but either black people make a definition all black people accept or an open definition is developed. 

Two, all Black leaders want betterment for Black people, and that includes Clarence Thomas or Barack Obama,  but all black people in the usa have to comprehend  that Black leaders in the USA come very varied and thus what they do you may disagree with vehemently, and that has to be ok. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/18/2022 at 8:02 AM, Pioneer1 said:

No, but many of the sistas who choose to mate and dote on and fawn over and "fall in love" with non-Black men ARE being disrespectful to the bruthas and openly so.
Many will OPENLY walk around with a White man on their arms laughing loudly and showing the world how good of a time they are having now that they've found a non-Negro as a lover as a way of "getting back".


Most Black men don't do that.
Most Black men with a White or non-Black woman just want them for sex but could care less about "getting even" or trying to show them off to spite Black women.

 

 

You are insane @Pioneer1.

This is disrespectful to women in general. To think that any positive woman, White or Black would submit to allowing Black men to reduce them to be exploited just for sex is a reflection of your ignorance and arrogance in not acknowledging the racial issues that plague both Black men and Black women.

 

Both Black men and Black women have had to deal with disrespect towards each other due to racism and violence that began in slavery.

Black women, though have especially suffered in may ways especially when it comes to their offspring in having support in raising their children.

Black women need to have a certain amount of economical coverage and for a long time, Black men as a whole could not step up to that plate. 

Therefore, if Black women felt abandoned, it is because we were therefore, if a sista finds love and support from a non-Black man, that should not be seen as a negative issue. 

The disrespect in flaunting a non-Black man as a lover and vice versa, stems from the slave yard and if we want to unite, then we need to acknowledge this did occur from both aspects. 

Black men have been extremely disrespectful, too on this score and again, it stems from the slave yard, pitting gender against gender. 

I've met so many well rounded Black men in my life with non-Black women, however, they have shown the highest repect to a sista, no matter what, but then, there are the kind of Black men that lash out against Black women and use this a the motivation for dating non-Black women. And, some of their reason, need to be understood too, though, in order to heal. Black men have been hurt by Black women, I can see this, especially in the nurturing aspect. 

 

@Pioneer1You very statement is extremely DIVISIVE and your kind of thinking is a very good example of one major reason for a continual Black Disunity. smh.

To think that you started this thread on Black Unity!!! LOL.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:


frankster

 


How is it Irrelevant.??

We are not questioning whether or not blacks aspire to academic  success...that is undisputed.

 

I'm not.
Maybe that's the discussion between you and Troy, but I believe Obama had a rather positive impact on Black academic performance.

However, it's irrelevant because academic performance and self-moral evaluation are two different subjects for two different concepts.

 

Perhaps they may overlap eachother sometimes, but they are pretty much separate issues.

 

 

 

 

What are you looking at as a  significant social criteria as a  reflections of Moral Disposition?

 

Crime
Violence
Family structure
Social interaction in society

 

We already discussed crime....

Did the number of out of wedlock births in the AfroAmerican community go down under the Obama Administration?

Did domestic violence in the AfroAmerican community go down under the Obama Administration?

Did the number of gangster rap songs and violent lyrics decline under the Obama Administration?

 

In other words, did Black folks just become "better people" period and more righteous under the Obama Administration that we can point to and say he had a positive impact in improving the moral self esteem of AfroAmericans?

 

 

 

 

They decline in the crime rate....ACCELERATED  under Obama.Well 

 

It was already on a downward trend and continued on that trend.
I'm not sure about the acceleration part, I didn't see that in the stats I looked at.
The downward trend looked pretty steady....I didn't see any steep declines in the graphs.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Depends on the Cause...

Is it to aggrandize yourself...

Is it to feed Your Family...

is it to feed the hungry and shelter the Homeless..

Is it to better your community...


A  couple points:

 

1. EVEN IF it's to "feed your family" and provide shelter to the homeless....being a gangster or dope dealer isn't "Revolutionary".
It's basically playing with the cards one was dealt by an unjust system that neglected those whom you cared about and rebelling against that system in order to help your loved ones.
But it's NOT Revolutionary because it doesn't seek to REPLACE that unjust system.

 

2.  Realistically speaking, how many gangsters and dope dealers are doing it to feed their families or even ARE feeding their families???

Most gangsters and dope dealers enter that lifestyle of selling poison, harming, and exploiting people in their own commmunity at a relatively young age BEFORE THEY EVEN HAVE FAMILIES to take care of.  So they certainly weren't doing it for those reasons.
Many if not most of them MAKE children they don't take care of and accumulate women they don't take care of either.

The majority of them who engage in that lifestyle did it for fast and easy money and/or the thrill of crime and violence.  If a few just happen to use it for good like feeding the homeless or their families in the process...that's good.
But they are a minority.

 

 

 

 

 


Tell Me the Difference?

 


The purpose of rebelliousness is to DISOBEY/BUCK the system.

 

The purpose of revolution is to REPLACE the system all together.

 

See the difference?

 

 

 

 


Yes...

You must know  Why and What type of force to use....

Gandhi and Martin use Moral Force....

 

Yes they both used moral force, but the reason it worked was because it exposed the hypocrisy of Caucasians to the rest of humanity.

We expose their Hypocrisy to Themselves..........They Have a Conscience. - cognitive dissonance

 

18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

The greatest weapon of White racists is Deception/Confusion.
Having people think that THEY are the "good people" and the "moral people".

In his own eyes every man is on the Right side Of Good

 

 

18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

Both Gandhi and King showed the rest of humanity of color that despite their Christian rhetoric, most American and British White people were atheistic hypocrites who only used religion and civility as a mask to hide their savagery.

Savagery is a state of Physical Reality from which we Human has yet to totally Emerge...

It is Beneficial We seek Victory On Moral Grounds

 

18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

This exposure forced White racist to...not change themselves...but change THEIR TACTICS so as to become effective without looking so hypocritical and demonic as they did in the past.

True

 

18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

They needed to find a new way to trick people of color since the old way was no longer working after being exposed.

True....even though the old way still seems to work on some of Us

 

18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

 

Let me take time out to say........

I don't agree with everything you post, but I have to admit I like the fact that you acknowledge the points that you DO agree with me on instead of ignoring them just to focus on points of difference like a lot of posters do.

It's well balanced.
 

Thank You

I enjoy your single minded zeal

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Before establishing any non-familial relationships, AfroAmerican men and women should have their sh8t together (mental, physical, financial, spiritual) to the highest degree. 

 

Individual self-esteem should be very high. Low self-esteem is toxic and leads to dysfunctional behaviors and it is destructive to healthy relationships.

 

A sound mind and body; high self-esteem and confidence produces positive and constructive results within humanity.  Winners *train* to be the best.

 

When well-balanced human beings get together, good things happen for the greater good of humanity overall. 😎

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chev

 

 

You very statement is extremely DIVISIVE and your kind of thinking is a very good example of one major reason for a continual Black Disunity

 

Good, maybe we DO need more division in our community.
But divided along the RIGHT lines.

 

 

 

Frankster

 

In his own eyes every man is on the Right side Of Good

 

For the most part, yes.

But then again, most people who lie and practice deception have a pretty good understanding of whether God Approves of their behavior or Not.

 

 


Savagery is a state of Physical Reality from which we Human has yet to totally Emerge...

 

Perhaps savagery isn't a state we emerge from, but deviate too...from the more normal and natural civility.

 

 

 

 

 

True....even though the old way still seems to work on some of Us

 

Lol, on a LOT of our people.

 

 

 


Thank You

I enjoy your single minded zeal

 

Not sure whether to take that as a compliment or veiled insult....lol

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


ProfD

 

 

Before establishing any non-familial relationships, AfroAmerican men and women should have their sh8t together (mental, physical, financial, spiritual) to the highest degree. 

 

This sound advice is good for individuals as well as the collective.

 

How can you love others when you don't even love yourself?

How can you work WITH (not for...we know how to work for others) others when you haven't even learned how to work with yourself first?


People with low self esteem and emotional dysfunction usually get taken advantage of by those who see and recognize their weakness.
When people of other racial and ethnic groups start working around AfroAmericans and realize that the ONLY reason some of our people love and respect and revere them is because of their tan skin and wavy hair.....they'll use them up like toilet paper on sale.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...