Anthony "Van" Jones and his twin sister, Angela, were born on September 20, 1968 in Jackson, Tennessee to Loretta and the late Willie Jones, a teacher and principal, respectively. Van graduated from the University of Tennessee with a bachelor's degree in communications and political science, before earning a Juris Doctor at Yale Law School.
Jones is currently teaching at Princeton University, where he holds a joint appointment at both the center for African-American Studies and the Woodrow Wilson School of Public and International Affairs in the Program for Science, Technology and environmental Policy. He is also serving as a Senior Fellow at the Center for American Progress and as a Senior Policy Advisor at Green for All.
Here, he talks about all of the above, and about his appearance in Carbon Nation, a cautionary documentary about the consequences of climate change. The film opens in theaters in New York City on February 11, and will open elsewhere around the country later in the month and in March before becoming available on DVD in April.
Van Jones - The "Carbon Nation" Interview
with Kam Williams
Kam Williams: Hi Van, thanks for the time.
Van Jones: Thank you.
KW: My readers sent in a lot of questions for you. I'll start with Sam
Chekwas, who asks: What interested you in appearing in Carbon Nation?
VJ: Back in 2007, I met this white guy [director Peter Byck] with a lot of
hair and a video camera, at a conference that I happened to be attending for
the launch of an organization called Blacks in Green. I had never heard of
him and Peter had never heard of me. We just started talking; he liked what
I had to say, so he asked me if I'd be willing to be in this documentary he
was doing about carbon pollution. I said, "Sure!" It was kind of a
no-brainer.
KW: Before you got interested in environmental issues, you started the Bay
Area Police Watch, a San Francisco-based organization with an emergency
hotline and a lawyer referral service for victims of police abuse. What
inspired that?
VJ: I saw in the Nineties that we were increasing police power with get
tough policies and 3 strikes laws, but without additional oversights. I had
this radical idea that the police should obey the law. My view was that any
human system without adequate checks and balances will tend towards
corruption and abuse. That's why you have meat inspectors. Not because you
hate butchers, but because of an understanding of human nature. Similarly, I
felt like you gotta have some oversight of law enforcement. And though the
rampant racial injustices throughout the criminal justice system were
offensive to me and to millions of other people, I've never drawn a tight
circle around the black community to define the limits of my moral concern.
But that narrative tends to get imposed on you, if you're an
African-American activist. But in the aftermath of
Hurricane Katrina, we did
create Color of Change, an organization which focused on African-Americans
in particular, because we felt that there was a big gap there in terms of
online advocacy which had left the black community particularly vulnerable.
KW: Pres Edwards, Sr., asks: Where are the jobs in the Green Economy? In
which industries? Who are some of the larger employers? What are some of the
entry-level jobs?
VJ: There are 80,000 jobs in the wind energy industry right now. And you can
quadruple that number, if you have the right policy in place to promote
clean energy. There are about 46,000 jobs supported by the solar industry
right now. That's fewer than it should be, too. And you have a whole other
set of jobs in energy-efficiency in buildings and in creating the "Smart
Grid," as we call it. There's also manufacturing smart batteries and
bio-fuels, Those are just the energy jobs. Then we have the water, food and
other industries which are also experiencing some redirection. As far as
employers who are hiring, Vestas is a big wind company, and Solyndra is a
solar power company. But some of these companies are starting to struggle in
the absence of America's committing to a cleaner future by way of
Congressional action. The prospects of green economic opportunity is going
to be determined to a great extent by politicians arriving at some sort of
bi-partisan resolution.
KW: Ben Thypin asks: How do you respond to those who say that green jobs
are, at best, limited in their potential impact in terms of the number of
and quality of jobs created and, at worst, "make-work" jobs that form just
one part of the grand socialist apparatus designed to crush the private
sector and, implicitly, all that is patriotic and holy?
VJ: [Laughs] That's funny. I used to be called the "Green Jack Kemp" because
of my promotion of entrepreneurial and work-based solutions for poor people.
As champions of green jobs, we're asking questions that progressives should
like, like "How are we going to avoid baking the planet," and "How are we
going to create jobs for ordinary Americans?" Meanwhile, we're offering
solutions that conservative should like. I'm not calling for more welfare;
I'm calling for more work. I'm not asking for more entitlement programs; I'm
asking for more enterprise. I'm not calling for redistributing wealth; I'm
calling for reinvigorating our stuck energy sector, so some new
entrepreneurs can create some new wealth." Right now, when you go and hit
the light switch in your house, you're participating in a state-protected
monopoly. You're being forced to accept dirty power from a single producer.
I'm the guy that's trying to break up that monopoly to introduce free
enterprise and competition to the energy sector. I'm saying you should have
the right not only to be an energy consumer but an energy producer. Follow
the money to understand why my message keeps getting drowned out. Big oil
and big coal are terrified by the green jobs message. We're just trying to
end illegitimate government support for a single technology, which is
un-American. We should be leading the world in the next generation of
technological innovation. But we can't unleash private capital because of
what the government is doing to stifle innovation and to choke competition.
The government built the grid to favor one industry over others. But I don't
hear any conservatives screaming about that. Folks don't understand that the
elite economic interests that are holding them down are also feeding them a
bunch of lies.
KW: Attorney Bernadette Beekman asks: How would you assess the state of the
union?
VJ: I think there's going to be a tug of war in this country over who are
the real patriots because at a time of national crisis, economic collapse
and calamity, ecological peril and social dislocation, the American people
deserve to be a partner to the American government. Nobody wants a nanny
state, where the government is stamping out initiative and telling us what
to do, but the idea that the only alternative to that is to throw the
American people overboard into a global economy with no protections to
cushion us from some of these blows is absurd on its face. That's why I
think there's been a concerted effort to distort my message. When you hear
me speak beyond the sound bites taken out of context, I think I make a lot
of sense to people, even those in Red States like the one where I grew up.
KW: Children's book author Irene Smalls asks: Has your approach to fighting
for change changed since you left the
Obama administration?
VJ: I hope everybody's getting smarter. I'm learning and changing all the
time, and I expect to continue doing so my entire life.
KW: Irene also asks: What do you think is the one environmental thing this
country has to get right in the next ten years?
VJ: Carbon. We're going to bake this planet, and be a curse to all species,
including our own, if we don't find an alternative to carbon-based fuel.
That's the #1 problem.
KW: Irene says: I don't hear many young people talking about green jobs. How
do you feel you can make green jobs "sexy" to appeal to young, poor
unemployed or underemployed youth?
VJ: The problem isn't that the green jobs aren't sexy enough. It's that
they're not plentiful enough. A young person looking for a job isn't looking
just for a sexy job, they're looking for any job. And, unfortunately, we
have a 50% unemployment rate among our urban youth of color. It's not about
making green jobs more attractive. It's about making them more available.
And that requires Congress passing legislation that will give a real break
to the people who want to introduce new technologies to the American
marketplace.
KW: Lois Clark asks: Do you have any resentment about being made a
sacrificial lamb in the Fox News wars against President Obama?
VJ: There's no higher honor, in my estimation, than being asked to serve in
the White House. I learned more in those six months than in the prior six
years. I don't think that anybody who has had the privilege to serve the
country at that level should walk out and behave like a crybaby. And I plan
to continue to serve the country in other capacities.
KW: Teri Emerson says: I would like to know if, looking back, you have any
regrets about resigning your position at the White House; and whether the
President fought at all for you to stay.
VJ: No, I don't have any regrets about resigning. Once it became clear to me
that the right-wing was not going to let me serve in the way I wanted to
serve, I resigned. I didn't ask President Obama to defend me. His focusing
on getting healthcare passed so every baby in the nation could see a doctor
was far more important than his having to explain every aspect of my
colorful past.
KW: Ilene Proctor asks: How would you surmount the unhinged, right-wing,
Republican/corporate coalition coming into power this year which vehemently
clings to their denial of climate change that puts our whole planet in
peril?
VJ: I think we were naive during the first two years of the Obama
Administration because the Republicans didn't fight us on this point during
the 2008 Presidential Election. Obama and McCain both ran on a clean energy
platform. But now, uncontested lies have eroded hard-won public
understanding. So, we have to go back and make the case again.
KW: Larry Greenberg says: I sometimes hear corporate polluting compared to
littering. Is there a better simile, one that could inspire real action?
VJ: To me, that analogy is inspiring. Ordinary Americans can't pollute for
free. You can't dump your trash on the sidewalk or throw all your refuse
into your neighbor's yard. I don't understand why corporate polluters should
be allowed to dump megatons of carbon, the most dangerous pollution in the
history of the world, into our thin shell of an atmosphere, and not pay a
penny to do it. So, from my point of view, it is a very motivating
framework.
KW: Legist/Editor Patricia Turnier asks: What advice do you have for
attorneys who want to climb the ladder of success by becoming a partner in a
big law firm?
VJ: I wouldn't know. That isn't the route I went.
KW: Patricia has another question: Latinos and African-Americans of West
Harlem are exposed to dumping grounds for noxious facilities and unwanted
land uses. This situation creates serious health problems such as lung
diseases. The New York City asthma death rate is higher than any other city
in the U.S. As an environmentalist and as a lawyer which riders and other
measures are needed to correct this phenomenon?
VJ: I don't like to comment on a specific local issue because there are
plenty of people already working on the problem who know a lot more about it
than I do. In this case, Patricia should reach out to We Act, a great
Harlem-based environmental justice group.
KW: Reverend Florine Thompson asks: Who or what has been your greatest
source of inspiration and encouragement in life?
VJ: That's a good question. I have many sources of inspiration. I'd have to
point to Dr. Martin Luther King, first and foremost. But my parents were
good, hardworking folks who kept us in the church and the public schools,
and out of trouble, for the most part. Along the way, I've had a chance to
meet some of my civil rights heroes and, more recently, members of the young
generation around Obama, people in their teens and twenties who were
determined to make history and who were too idealistic to think that what
they were trying to do might be impossible. They proved that visionary
pragmatism can win over the majority. That comes from a particular place in
your heart that generation Y is offering America. They just can't afford to
be naive now, in terms of the ferocity of the opposition. They give me a lot
of inspiration. And so does being a father, which has really made me much
more committed to trying to solve these problems, and not just to protesting
them.
KW: Reverend Thompson has a follow-up: What do you see as the role of "The
Church" in this new green economy? How should the Black Church, which is
basically the largest people base in the African-American community, begin
to forge a foothold in the green market?
VJ: First of all, fighting for and defending the values from the pulpit is
critical. You can't love the Creator, and disrespect the creation. We have
to make that very clear as people of faith. So, we've have to heed our
Biblical obligation to be good stewards of the Earth after leaving the
Garden of Eden. And secondly, it's time to start bringing the congregations
down to City Hall and to ask the mayors, the city councils and the school
boards, "What's the plan? What's the local government going to do for us?"
There are some cities that are doing good stuff, but there aren't enough of
them. If you don't fight for what you want, then you deserve what you get.
And in politics, if you don't ask, you don't get at all. In addition, black
folks need to attend green conferences, too. We just self-segregate and
don't go. They might even waive your fee if you apply on a diversity basis,
because they'd be so shocked to see somebody from a different background
wanting to be a part of the green movement.
KW: The Tasha Smith question: Are you ever afraid?
VJ: All humans have fear, and those of us who are fortunate have faith.
KW: The Columbus Short question: Are you happy?
VJ: I'm happier than I was in 2009.
KW: The Teri Emerson question: When was the last time you had a good laugh?
VJ: Yesterday, dealing with my two year-old son who is certifiably insane.
KW: What is your guiltiest pleasure?
VJ: Pop Tarts.
KW: The bookworm Troy Johnson question: What was the last book you read?
VJ: Mad as Hell, which is about the Tea Party.
KW: The music maven Heather Covington question: What are you listening to on
your iPod?
VJ:
Mad as Hell, I'm listening to it on audio book.
KW: What is your favorite dish to cook?
VJ: Scrambled eggs.
KW: When you look in the mirror, what do you see?
VJ: Indescribable gorgeousness!
KW: The Ling-Ju Yen question: What is your earliest childhood memory?
VJ: Shirley Chisholm speaking at the 1972 Democratic National Convention. I
was almost four.
KW: Is there any question no one ever asks you, that you wish someone would?
VJ: Yes, "Did you sign that petition implicating the Bush Administration in
9/11?" Because I never signed it, and I hate being vilified for a
controversial idea I never espoused. The reason they love to beat on that
drum is because it's so discrediting. In a two-year period, all my dreams
came true: the birth of a son… publishing a best-selling book… launching a
successful organization… joining the Obama Administration… And then all my
nightmares came true.
KW: What advice do you have for anyone who wants to follow in your
footsteps?
VJ: Trust your intuition and be resilient. If you have real breakout ideas,
even your friends will laugh at you secretly until you can prove their
viability. I've never launched any initiative or campaign that people
thought was a slam dunk.
KW: The Dule Hill question. Do you attribute your success to yourself or to
God?
VJ: To the God in myself is probably the most honest answer. I think
everybody has a divine destiny. There's the God within and the God without,
and you have to attend to the alignment of the two of them.
KW: The Tavis Smiley question: How do you want to be remembered? What do you
want your legacy to be, and where are you in relation to that at this point
in your life?
VJ: I want to be remembered as one of the great innovators among social
justice advocates of the 21st Century. I'm only 42, and I've got a lot more
tricks up my sleeve.
KW: Thanks again, Van, and best of luck with all your future endeavors.
VJ: Thank you.
Purchase a copy of Van Jones' book, "The Green-Collar Economy"
CNN Crossfire hosts
Van Jones and Newt Gingrich agree on the fact that the United States is an exceptional nation.
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