Strategic Framework- external functional reply 01

[richardmurray]

Every time i get an external reply of quality  to the following post i reposted elsewhere I will add, the reply is after the forum link below

The reply

 

I don't see leadership on a broad scale, as far as movements comparable to those of the past. As far as which movements have the most disciples in modern day,  I don't think there's a right answer for that. People are likely influenced by a combination of theories or ideals from each. If we're talking activism, I think it has been resigned to social media. A lot of talk and outrage for the internet, but no mobility.
 

my reply

@MissArquay hmmm You pose four great questions in my mind. At least as I comprehend your pose. You are saying, I think : the modern black college of leaders are mostly flexible strategically, not firm in any strategy or multi strategist as per a situation while they are also mostly technologist in terms of relating to the masses. But four questions come to my mind. 1) some of the strategies can not be combined functionally. for example. militancy can not be combined to rule of law, so the first question is can leaders be functional if they are mixing ideas that don't mix?  2) in the AALBC post, I have a poll. I don't know if you are a member, it is free:) . But,  In the poll I listed various strategies. I think the strategy , in brackets] [ mixed strategy <case by case basis> while technologist in communication]is an option for leaders I didn't state. Technologist meaning, an absence of ground work, offline work, exist for many black leaders.  3) the third question is only because I am uncertain. You referred to people, not necessarily leaders. Are you saying what I call hyper individualism, the leader of self over the leader of the group is the modern majority way. sequentially that is another strategy mix, in brackets [hyper individualist<case by case basis> while technologist <if possible as not all individuals have equal access to tools or resources>]  4) The last question isn't about strategies but relates to said individualism. If , if :), most black leaders in the usa are in truth, black individuals <not just obama or shaprton but you side me> leading our individual selves, then why do we complain about the lack of collective action or cohesiveness in the village? I will explain my question. Hyper individualism isn't negative but it doesn't functionally mix with the idea of black communalism or collectivism at a high quantity. Individual allowance at a high rate can not go hand in hand with collective unity. By default individual allowance at a high rate, not an absence, but a high rate, will create fissures or holes in any collective unity. So the question isn't to undo the individualism you refer to but to reinforce it by rejecting the complaint to collective weakness if the majority body is hyper individual. DO you see my point? I will rephrase. When black people complain why don't we work together more, well the answer is simple, we don't because we don't want the same thing outside of an elemental, betterment. Yeah, The DC Snipers and Barack Obama both want black betterment, but I don't think the dc snipers wanted to become elected officials while obama didn't want to kill his fellow americans. do you see? Black betterment comes in many forms. Do you see my fourth question MissArquay? It isn't that I am trying to suggest you are right or wrong but if you are correct, that the majority of black leadership today in the usa is the individual leading self  then the majority of black political discourse online is dysfunctional. Because most black discourse online suggest that black people anywhere need a collective unity of function. But, that can't be true in the usa if hyper individualism is the majority way in the usa for black people. If most people in a group are not strategically aligned then most people in a group complaining that most in the group isn't aligned is dysfunctional:) 

 

Citation

 

 

IN AMENDMENT

The idea of this post is to define black leadership in the usa and then relate it to discourse. Debating or discussing in this community, I realize, I too often present thoughts/ideas/strategies that are relevant to particular groups in the black community globally, but do not reflect the relationship between how the black community in the usa in particular is being led. Black communities in countries with a majority black population or regions in a country with a majority non black population are functionally dissimilar to the black community in the usa. Sequentially, the assessment to actions or leadership are too variant to make similar arguments. Jamaica/Congo/makran in balochistan in pakistan or similar countries or regions in a country are situationally to different to the black populace in the usa as a whole or as a part of any state in the union as black people do not make up in modernity any majority population of a state in the usa. Talking about black leadership or strategy in a populace where black people do not have a population advantage except at the tiniest municipal scale: counties or cities in the usa that are majority black can not relate or are dysfunctional to be related to black leadership in a place like haiti or south africa. The question is, what is black leadership in the USA and how should black people communicate in light of that truth. Cause it is clear to me that black people, including myself, in the usa communicate against black leadership in the usa's true self. 

[richardmurray]

MissARquay replied

I think people complain about lack of community effort because they know recognition and the promotion of change requires mass interest and large numbers. So although people are being led by self interest, or what you refer to as hyper individualism, it doesn't stop them from wanting or needing backing. Although I refer to "technologists" as online activists, it's not a bad thing. They bring mass awareness to causes we otherwise wouldn't know about. They also help people to wake up sometimes, so they do their parts. I referred to people as opposed to leaders because I don't know of modern leaders comparable to the ones posted. I think elements of different strategies can go together and be functional. It depends on which ones are used.

 

My response

the question is how much backing does a black person in the usa want? if they want the 50 million <floor number> black people in the usa to be together and do something or half of that 25 million or a quarter of that 12.5 million or an eighth of that 6.25 million or a sixteenth of that 3.125 million which is approximately the populace of black people <between floor and ceiling> in the NYC metropolitan area to support or back you as a black individual, what you want will have to be far less to your individual desires. Do you see my point? All human beings want support but , in NYC metropolitan area for example, when black people who are members of the elephants or the donkeys want all black people in the NYC metropolitan area to vote. What do they say? I am American , and voting is vital. The only problem is, with that individualism or sub community <black registered members of the donkeys or the elephants > position is its inherent views of allegiance or love or hope to the USA.  Garveyism isn't dead? Militancy isn't dead? How many black people in the NYC metropolitan area consider the NYC metropolitan area a loving place for black people? How many black people in the NYC metropolitan area only miss their loving ones in the area and not the area itself ? My point. Asking people to be engaged in a place they can't stand is dysfunctional. yes? You love the usa, you have hope to the usa, you side other registered elephants or donkeys have love or hope to the USA, great. But what about the majority of black people who never had and do not. And, most black people may not be able to give all names or dates, but most black people know everything from extreme non violence to extreme violence has been tried and everything has failed to make a happy black community in the NYC metropolitan, including voting, let alone the larger USA. So, the black people wanting support for 90% or above voting are complaining every year dysfunctionally. Some black people in NYC metropolitan area want black people to mostly support black business. But again, the average black person is financially poor in the NYC Metropolitan area and the average black business in said area demands market rate and above for goods or services so their customer base is truly only the black one percent or wealthy which exist in the black community in NYCMA but is far from the majority of black people in said area. Only a few Black owned grocery stores exist so most black food businesses are eateries and most black people can't afford the ten dollars or above a plate. I only know one black owned eatery in my section of harlem, harlem has circa 75,000 black people while the average town in the usa complete populace is 7,000 people ,  provides an affordable scenario for all financial ranges of black people, with quality food. Do you see my point? I hope you see my point. Let's spend online time, communicating the positive or the truth. telling the black majority of people who cant afford to eat at your store to eat at your black owned store is dysfunctional. Telling the majority of black people who have always been , even when we voted in the 90% , harmed and injured by the usa government to act fully engaged for engagements sake is dysfunctional. Black businesses in the NYCMA need to complain that black businesses need to make more affordable products with quality. black elected officials in the NYCMA need to complain that black elected officials don't make policy that changes how black people see the usa. No problem exist in self interest nor wanting help but lets be functional. Let's communicate functionally. I think most black people and i include myself, waste posts wanting what isn't functional. Back to the percentages. a thirty second is 1.5625 million. which is about the black populace of queens + brooklyn combined. A sixty fourth is 0.78125 million which is about the black populace of brooklyn alone. A one hundred and twenty eighth is 0.390625 of a million.  We have to go past two hundred and forty sixth and use four hundred and ninety second, which is circa 0.09 of a million or 90,000 to reach a near the black populace of harlem. A populace that is 1000% bigger than the average town but has no governmental representation what so ever. But that 390,625 is doable from the black community in NYC, but many black institutions or agendas have that level of support now in NYC. But if they want more... you can't want it merely for your purposes. it has to be finessed. I can give another example. During the harlem empowerment zone which voted in by a black majority black elected officials, of a harlem back then over 50% black, supported publicly didn't give financial assistance to black businesses in .. harlem. Only one black business got something. Mr Copeland and it was only cause he knew someone. BUT said black elected officials  in harlem want black people in harlem to vote with some vigor when they couldn't even help black businesses in harlem when they had all the power in the world too. But what is the point? they didn't want to. They were about themselves. And fair enough, they have the right to want more support. But asking the village to support you while you never support the village...  The variance in black individuals self interest will not allow mass support to something that isn't very well constructed, it can't be a generality. ... I comprehend your term technologist, i apologize if I suggested being a technologist is a bad thing. But remember, during the pandemic, white people even admitted than over 80% of black people in the continent of africa were absent the internet ability to live remotely. And I can attest this having been in the financially common places in parts of africa. the point, nothing is bad, but while the internet is helpful to those with it, if you want the larger village to be helped, you go to go offline. Do you see? I know black people from various lands in the continent who love the internet. But, how will that help the majority of people in the land in africa they come from? it isn't about right or wrong but quality of function. I am trying to get their in how i communicate...  I comprehend to your point about modern black leaders.  In my view, from the description in the poll: Obama is like Douglass or the abolitionist. AL SHarpton is like the black church <I heard him say he wanted his movement to be based in the church>. Sister zakia of harlem who lives in the caribbean is like the garveyites. I think modern examples exist. I will argue, the hebrew israelites are like, not the same but like, nat turner. I think similars exist in black leadership. Now you can say you you disagree or oppose all my assertions to similarity of modern black individuals to black individuals in the past. That's fine. I am not proselytizing to you. One fact, Black leadership in the USA has never had a member who is dominantly rich, can exist in the same financial spheres as the rockefellers of old or the Gates of today. Maybe black leadership never will have such a member, but if it does, that will be an interesting thing. SHirley Chisholm <in my view of the exoduster or tulsa category > before she died said black people must focus financially, she didn't say black people should exodus government altogether but I will assume<I wish someone in news media had asked her> she was stating positions of government beyond black municipality need to be unconsidered or not priorities. And that is clearly the exoduster mentality. The exodusters wanted to be american and live peacefully, nonviolently aside whites or others BUT they were not convinced of any betterment in interaciality in communities. Integration to them was best as integration of segregated communities as part of the usa not a literal integration of white institutions or municipal seats with black people or of racially integrated communities themselves.