On 8/17/2026 at 8:36 PM, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Does second hand experience matter?

meaning I have experience it by observation of what one could call possessed..

Absolutely.

I'd be glad to read of any examples of possession that you've witnessed.

Here is my experience in. a Nut shell...only the salient/important points

A Drugs using Schizophrenic who regularly experience mental break....after one of his episode - some people start saying he grew horns.

I laughed on the inside and said maybe you mistook his hair for horns as it was unkempt....mind you he does not wear dreadlocks and usually keeps his hair very low and well groomed as he is a barber by profession.

About 6 months later he experience another mental break down and this time I saw him....he look like a dog and behaved like one - physically and actually.

Now he was still physical a human being - there is no denying or mistaking that....but his whole demeanor was that of a dog - Every one who saw him said he look like a dog

The thing that stay with me....is that his shadow left no doubt he was a dog crouching on two legs

On 8/17/2026 at 8:36 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Can a Spirit be Caught in a Bottle.....Yes

Now some can be and some cannot....so not all Spirits can held captive in a bottle.

The same people who laugh at the thought of a spirit being held captive in a bottle reminds me of people 1000 years ago who would have laughed at the concept of a television and watching people and entire cities being "held captive" in a square box that you can fit on your lap.

Technology and time makes the difference.

True....

The cruel and capricious God of the Old Testament....Early Egyptian Christians Known as Gnostic taught that he was not the Creator but a Demiurge whose real name is not Yahweh but Yaldaboath

In todays language Demi means Small and Urge can be another word for Compulsion....

https://share.google/JCXi7VWXA9jpAAVgS

Looks like a parasite....

We all know parasite can be caught in a bottle and that some parasites are able to take over your mind while most control your appetites....especially food and sex.

Most possession is Parasitic...

As far as I know.....most parasites are invisible to the naked human eye - as a result can be considered spirits

On 8/17/2026 at 11:43 PM, ProfD said:

Technology has changed a lot over 1.000 years.

People who lived 1,000 years ago would have been blown away by railroads & electricity & motor vehicles & mass transit & highways, etc.

To date, the best technology to which we have access cannot capture spirits if they did exist.

No way a human can capture & stuff spirits in a bottle.

Modern Scientists and Engineers are still blown away with the Pyramid.....

Modern Scientists are just beginning to discover many of the Spiritual Sciences of the Ancients are real....

The Ancients say you have Seven Invisible bodies layered in and around your physical bodies.....Modern science have found at least one the can no longer deny.

On 8/17/2026 at 11:43 PM, ProfD said:

Not familiar with a true holographic picture being made up of tiny images of the main.

I always thought holograms were created by manipulating light around an object.

Using holographic technology, they can create a Tupac or Michael Jackson or Prince concert.😁😎

Some great tech

1 hour ago, frankster said:

The Ancients say you have Seven Invisible bodies layered in and around your physical bodies.....Modern science have found at least one the can no longer deny.

Modern scientists still cannot capture & stuff spirits in bottles.🤣😎

11 hours ago, ProfD said:

Modern scientists still cannot capture & stuff spirits in bottles.🤣😎

Are you sure....

Can you see Parasites like Toxoplasma gondii?....with only your naked eye or with the aid of a magnifier?

Now have them in a petrie dishes test tubes and bottles....That you can only see with the aid of a magnifier.

25 minutes ago, frankster said:

Are you sure....

Can you see Parasites like Toxoplasma gondii?....with only your naked eye or with the aid of a magnifier?

Now have them in a petrie dishes test tubes and bottles....That you can only see with the aid of a magnifier.

There's still a difference between a microscopic parasite that can be observed with a magnifier & a spirit which is invisble.

If spirits existed & got trapped in bottles, it would be a accident....not on purpose.😁😎

Hummm... on my way out, this post about spirits caught my eye, what with my long time interest in the paranormal.

Are y'all talking spirits as in demonic "entities" - which the Catholic Church has special rituals to exorcise in the event said spirits possess people?

What about "incubus" and "succubus", nocturnal demons who have long been said to exist and given these names to refer to them as, and who purportedly sexually harass or seduce people during sleep episodes.

There was a famous case about a woman who was put under observation in a sleep laboratory after she "complained" of being repeatedly "raped" by an incubus. Sure enough, upon being watched while asleep, there was reason to confirm that something was copulating with her, causing her to have orgasms. 😵🫪

OK, back to my AI universe. 👋

ProfD

Technology has changed a lot over 1.000 years.

People who lived 1,000 years ago would have been blown away by railroads & electricity & motor vehicles & mass transit & highways, etc.

Correct, however my point is that years ago these things you mentioned would have been considered "magic" or impossible to do by those people back then.

Why?

Because the technology to do them wasn't available for them.

To date, the best technology to which we have access cannot capture spirits if they did exist.

No way a human can capture & stuff spirits in a bottle.

Just because YOU don't know how to do it or don't know of it being done, doesn't mean it can't be done.

They capture GAS in bottles and pressurized tanks don't they?

If they can capture gases and put them in bottles and tanks, why do you think it can't be done with finer substances?

Modern scientists still cannot capture & stuff spirits in bottles.

Most modern scientist are trained in WHITE institutions.

So their knowledge is limited by how much White people know.

Practices like Voodoo and Santeria...where spirits are often put in bottles....claim knowledge far more ancient and extensive.

The same type of science that allows people to be taken almost to the point of death and re-animated without their essence.

In other words TURNED INTO A ZOMBIE.

Now where do you think their "spirit" or "soul" goes when it's taken from their bodies?

Troy

Thank you for admitting that we can continue to have a conversation :-)

I had no choice.

When I'm clearly show where I error, I accept it.

Honestly, every article that I’ve read that you cited did not support your argument. Now that’s not saying that I’ve read every article that you’ve ever posted.

You're argument has been that either race itself didn't exist or that race did exist but MULTIPLE races didn't exist.

I've provided articles to prove both assertions; but you simply wouldn't accept them.

I’m just reiterating your words calling in a Coke bottle doesn’t change the meaning it just helps you see how ridiculous what you’re saying sounds.

Like I told ProfD, you can accept the fact that science (modern science) can capture and store gas in bottles and tanks under pressure...but see it as utterly ridiculous that a finer substance such as a spirit can't be stored under similar conditions.

Isn't that a bit short sighted?

frankster

Thanks for that example.

A Drugs using Schizophrenic who regularly experience mental break....after one of his episode - some people start saying he grew horns.

It would be interesting to know which came first...his schizophrenia diagnosis or his drug use.

The cruel and capricious God of the Old Testament....Early Egyptian Christians Known as Gnostic taught that he was not the Creator but a Demiurge

Not sure about that, but when you actually read the Old Testament in it's original Hebrew and Aramaic languages you quickly and pretty clearly see that they aren't talking about ONE Deity but multiple.

And They had offspring.

The Ancients say you have Seven Invisible bodies layered in and around your physical bodies.....Modern science have found at least one the can no longer deny.

Chakras and Auras are evidence of this.

Various energy bodies.

1 hour ago, aka Contrarian said:

There was a famous case about a woman who was put under observation in a sleep laboratory after she "complained" of being repeatedly "raped" by an incubus. Sure enough, upon being watched while asleep, there was reason to confirm that something was copulating with her, causing her to have orgasms. 😵🫪

No matter where that woman slept, she was having a recurring dream about something that satisfied her.🤣

2 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

To date, the best technology to which we have access cannot capture spirits if they did exist.

No way a human can capture & stuff spirits in a bottle.

Just because YOU don't know how to do it or don't know of it being done, doesn't mean it can't be done.

They capture GAS in bottles and pressurized tanks don't they?

If they can capture gases and put them in bottles and tanks, why do you think it can't be done with finer substances?

You're right. I don't believe in spirits so there is no reason that I would even consider capturing & putting them in bottles.😁

2 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Practices like Voodoo and Santeria...where spirits are often put in bottles....claim knowledge far more ancient and extensive.

The same type of science that allows people to be taken almost to the point of death and re-animated without their essence.

In other words TURNED INTO A ZOMBIE.

I often wonder how & why Black folks didn't use their magical practices to prevent the transatlantic slave trade & defeat & overcome the system of racism white supremacy.

Also, it seems as if spirits existed they could be working in our favor too.😁😎

8 hours ago, ProfD said:

There's still a difference between a microscopic parasite that can be observed with a magnifier & a spirit which is invisble.

EXACTLY....

There is no difference to those who neither know of magnification and or have heard of microscopy...to them if the naked eye cannot see it - it is a spirit.

8 hours ago, ProfD said:

If spirits existed & got trapped in bottles, it would be a accident....not on purpose.😁😎

Nevertheless it would prove that spirits....can be trapped.

4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

ProfD

Technology has changed a lot over 1.000 years.

People who lived 1,000 years ago would have been blown away by railroads & electricity & motor vehicles & mass transit & highways, etc.

Correct, however my point is that years ago these things you mentioned would have been considered "magic" or impossible to do by those people back then.

Why?

Because the technology to do them wasn't available for them.

This is true of the vast majority of people back then....

It also depends on how far back you go.....

4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

To date, the best technology to which we have access cannot capture spirits if they did exist.

No way a human can capture & stuff spirits in a bottle.

Just because YOU don't know how to do it or don't know of it being done, doesn't mean it can't be done.

They capture GAS in bottles and pressurized tanks don't they?

If they can capture gases and put them in bottles and tanks, why do you think it can't be done with finer substances?

I Concur

4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Modern scientists still cannot capture & stuff spirits in bottles.

Most modern scientist are trained in WHITE institutions.

So their knowledge is limited by how much White people know.

Practices like Voodoo and Santeria...where spirits are often put in bottles....claim knowledge far more ancient and extensive.

The same type of science that allows people to be taken almost to the point of death and re-animated without their essence.

In other words TURNED INTO A ZOMBIE.

Now where do you think their "spirit" or "soul" goes when it's taken from their bodies?

True

Have you read the book or seen the movie "Serpent and the Rainbow"...

It is the story of an Anthropologist/Ethnobotanist search for how Zombies are made....

Which tells you they know zombies are real....

In the story a low level witchdoctor sold the secret....under the condition he was taken out of the country as the other witch doctors will know and kill him

Now here is how remarkable it is....the active agent is a chemical found in an organ in the brain of a specific fish the size of a rice grain..

This chemical induces anesthesia/comatose so low and near to death that heart and or brain does not register on a EKG or EEG machine.

The individual can be held in this state for three weeks without Air Food or Water with no harm to body or mind....

It is what the witchdoctor does to the Zombified after they are coming from under....that allows the Witchdoctor to control them - charming bewitching beguiling spellbinding enchanting or bedazzling.

In short it is Ancient Science called bush doctor or witchdoctor.....but really all they were - were Chemist and Botanist

4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Thanks for that example.

A Drugs using Schizophrenic who regularly experience mental break....after one of his episode - some people start saying he grew horns.

It would be interesting to know which came first...his schizophrenia diagnosis or his drug use.

I cannot say...

My thoughts would be that the drug use allowed latent schizophrenia to express itself.

4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

The cruel and capricious God of the Old Testament....Early Egyptian Christians Known as Gnostic taught that he was not the Creator but a Demiurge

Not sure about that, but when you actually read the Old Testament in it's original Hebrew and Aramaic languages you quickly and pretty clearly see that they aren't talking about ONE Deity but multiple.

And They had offspring.

It does appear that way...

I personally think the issue is with those interpreting the Will and Wishes of the Deity.....

4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

The Ancients say you have Seven Invisible bodies layered in and around your physical bodies.....Modern science have found at least one the can no longer deny.

Chakras and Auras are evidence of this.

Various energy bodies.

True

2 hours ago, ProfD said:

No matter where that woman slept, she was having a recurring dream about something that satisfied her.🤣

Sounds like fun.....but was it.

2 hours ago, ProfD said:

You're right. I don't believe in spirits so there is no reason that I would even consider capturing & putting them in bottles.😁

You do not have to believe in them.....nor is it important what you call them - they are Real regardless

What is important is do you understand it?

2 hours ago, ProfD said:

I often wonder how & why Black folks didn't use their magical practices to prevent the transatlantic slave trade & defeat & overcome the system of racism white supremacy.

What do you think magic is?

Who said they did not....

Who said we still not using it....

2 hours ago, ProfD said:

Also, it seems as if spirits existed they could be working in our favor too.😁😎

It is reputed that King Solomon Captured 72 demons and used them to build his now famous Temple....

One of them was a demon called FurFur......Electricity/Lightening - in a jar(Baghdad battery){Dendera Temple}

ProfD

I often wonder how & why Black folks didn't use their magical practices to prevent the transatlantic slave trade & defeat & overcome the system of racism white supremacy.

Who said we DIDN'T?

There are many stories and anecdotes of Black people using "magic" and "witchcraft" to outsmart and defeat White folks on an individual and isolated basis.

The Haitian Revolution is one of the more famous of them.

Also, it seems as if spirits existed they could be working in our favor too.

2 things to keep in mind:

-As much as I would love for these Spirits to destroy White racism and help put Black people on top, just because they haven't done it...yet....doesn't mean they don't exist.

It simply means they haven't done it...for whatever reason.

You can write letters to the President asking and begging him for benefits and help, but just because he doesn't help you or even respond to your requests....doesn't mean he doesn't exist.
It simply means he hasn't responded yet...and that's the only fact you can't conclude.

-If we are infact IMMORTAL beings who have always existed and will continue to exist....the period of White rule and especially our currently lives on this planet is very short.

How do we know that these Spirits aren't already working in our favor in other ways we can't even imagine?

Compared to Eternity, we only see a short bandwidth of time.

frankster

Nevertheless it would prove that spirits....can be trapped.

Isn't that what the movie "Get Out" was about?

People's souls being trapped in their own bodies as others took control over them.

Yet people can easily believe and understand this concept when it's explained as hypnosis.

True

Have you read the book or seen the movie "Serpent and the Rainbow"...

I've seen the movie, but I haven't read the book.

It is the story of an Anthropologist/Ethnobotanist search for how Zombies are made....

Which tells you they know zombies are real....

In the story a low level witchdoctor sold the secret....under the condition he was taken out of the country as the other witch doctors will know and kill him

Now here is how remarkable it is....the active agent is a chemical found in an organ in the brain of a specific fish the size of a rice grain..

This chemical induces anesthesia/comatose so low and near to death that heart and or brain does not register on a EKG or EEG machine.

The individual can be held in this state for three weeks without Air Food or Water with no harm to body or mind....

It is what the witchdoctor does to the Zombified after they are coming from under....that allows the Witchdoctor to control them - charming bewitching beguiling spellbinding enchanting or bedazzling.

In short it is Ancient Science called bush doctor or witchdoctor.....but really all they were - were Chemist and Botanist

This is ancient Black science.

But you know what's sad?

While so many Black people have dismissed the entire concept of Zombies as ridiculous (unless they personally witnessed it)...many White scientists will study this and then incorporate it in their own!

How many times have White people stolen ideas, technology, and chemistry from Black people...claimed it as their own...only for Black scholars and educated negroes to ASSUME that it originated from White folks all along?

It is reputed that King Solomon Captured 72 demons and used them to build his now famous Temple....

Now we have to be careful when dealing with this particular subject.

The claim that Solomon captured Demons and used them to build his Temple is a common story in Jewish history.

The claim that Solomon captured Jinn and used them to build his Temple is a common story in Muslim history.
I had been hearing both for years and noticing the similarities between the two, I decided to do a little research.

When you actually read the Old Testament itself....it talks about how the Israelites invaded that land of Canaan and after killing most of it's inhabitants...put the rest to work under slavery.

1 Kings Chapter 9:

²⁰ There were still people left from the Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites (these peoples were not Israelites). ²¹ Solomon conscripted the descendants of all these peoples remaining in the land—whom the Israelites could not exterminate^[i]—to serve as slave labor, as it is to this day. ²² But Solomon did not make slaves of any of the Israelites; they were his fighting men, his government officials, his officers, his captains, and the commanders of his chariots and charioteers. ²³ They were also the chief officials in charge of Solomon’s projects—550 officials supervising those who did the work.

So perhaps the Beings that these stories are calling Demons and Devils are actually PEOPLE who were indigenous to that land and were enslaved after being conquered.

When you read Jewish and Islamic literature and read about some of these Beings they don't sound like spirits but actual physical beings who wore clothes, spoke languages, and ate food.

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

ProfD

I often wonder how & why Black folks didn't use their magical practices to prevent the transatlantic slave trade & defeat & overcome the system of racism white supremacy.

Who said we DIDN'T?

There are many stories and anecdotes of Black people using "magic" and "witchcraft" to outsmart and defeat White folks on an individual and isolated basis.

The Haitian Revolution is one of the more famous of them.

True

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Also, it seems as if spirits existed they could be working in our favor too.

2 things to keep in mind:

-As much as I would love for these Spirits to destroy White racism and help put Black people on top, just because they haven't done it...yet....doesn't mean they don't exist.

It simply means they haven't done it...for whatever reason.

You can write letters to the President asking and begging him for benefits and help, but just because he doesn't help you or even respond to your requests....doesn't mean he doesn't exist.
It simply means he hasn't responded yet...and that's the only fact you can't conclude.

-If we are infact IMMORTAL beings who have always existed and will continue to exist....the period of White rule and especially our currently lives on this planet is very short.

How do we know that these Spirits aren't already working in our favor in other ways we can't even imagine?

Compared to Eternity, we only see a short bandwidth of time.

True

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Nevertheless it would prove that spirits....can be trapped.

Isn't that what the movie "Get Out" was about?

I think that was one of its message

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

People's souls being trapped in their own bodies as others took control over them.

Yet people can easily believe and understand this concept when it's explained as hypnosis.

True

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

True

Have you read the book or seen the movie "Serpent and the Rainbow"...

I've seen the movie, but I haven't read the book.

Great

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

It is the story of an Anthropologist/Ethnobotanist search for how Zombies are made....

Which tells you they know zombies are real....

In the story a low level witchdoctor sold the secret....under the condition he was taken out of the country as the other witch doctors will know and kill him

Now here is how remarkable it is....the active agent is a chemical found in an organ in the brain of a specific fish the size of a rice grain..

This chemical induces anesthesia/comatose so low and near to death that heart and or brain does not register on a EKG or EEG machine.

The individual can be held in this state for three weeks without Air Food or Water with no harm to body or mind....

It is what the witchdoctor does to the Zombified after they are coming from under....that allows the Witchdoctor to control them - charming bewitching beguiling spellbinding enchanting or bedazzling.

In short it is Ancient Science called bush doctor or witchdoctor.....but really all they were - were Chemist and Botanist

This is ancient Black science.

Yes Ancient Science...

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

But you know what's sad?

While so many Black people have dismissed the entire concept of Zombies as ridiculous (unless they personally witnessed it)...many White scientists will study this and then incorporate it in their own!

That how it's done....

I read an account that Isaac Newton got his theories from an interpretation of Ancient Egyptian writings

After European force Africans to teach them to read hieroglyphics....they killed every African that could read it - and then forbade Africans from learning.

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

How many times have White people stolen ideas, technology, and chemistry from Black people...claimed it as their own...only for Black scholars and educated negroes to ASSUME that it originated from White folks all along?

Too man times.....

Have you read George GM James Stolen Legacy?

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

It is reputed that King Solomon Captured 72 demons and used them to build his now famous Temple....

Now we have to be careful when dealing with this particular subject.

The claim that Solomon captured Demons and used them to build his Temple is a common story in Jewish history.

The claim that Solomon captured Jinn and used them to build his Temple is a common story in Muslim history.
I had been hearing both for years and noticing the similarities between the two, I decided to do a little research.

Cool

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

When you actually read the Old Testament itself....it talks about how the Israelites invaded that land of Canaan and after killing most of it's inhabitants...put the rest to work under slavery.

1 Kings Chapter 9:

²⁰ There were still people left from the Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites (these peoples were not Israelites). ²¹ Solomon conscripted the descendants of all these peoples remaining in the land—whom the Israelites could not exterminate^[i]—to serve as slave labor, as it is to this day. ²² But Solomon did not make slaves of any of the Israelites; they were his fighting men, his government officials, his officers, his captains, and the commanders of his chariots and charioteers. ²³ They were also the chief officials in charge of Solomon’s projects—550 officials supervising those who did the work.

So perhaps the Beings that these stories are calling Demons and Devils are actually PEOPLE who were indigenous to that land and were enslaved after being conquered.

Could very well be

6 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

When you read Jewish and Islamic literature and read about some of these Beings they don't sound like spirits but actual physical beings who wore clothes, spoke languages, and ate food.

And maybe they do

15 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I often wonder how & why Black folks didn't use their magical practices to prevent the transatlantic slave trade & defeat & overcome the system of racism white supremacy.

Who said we DIDN'T?

There are many stories and anecdotes of Black people using "magic" and "witchcraft" to outsmart and defeat White folks on an individual and isolated basis.

The Haitian Revolution is one of the more famous of them.

I often hear folks reference the Haitian revolution & Black people down in Louisiana & the Mojaura spirit fightig off white supremacy.

The Haitian people I know are cool & they will be the 1st to tell why they ldft fheir home country & came to build a life in the USA.

The southern USA still has major challenges when it comes to racism white supremacy.

Maybe the mojaura spirit will rise up & overcome racism white supremacy.

15 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

2 things to keep in mind:

-As much as I would love for these Spirits to destroy White racism and help put Black people on top, just because they haven't done it...yet....doesn't mean they don't exist.

It simply means they haven't done it...for whatever reason.

-If we are infact IMMORTAL beings who have always existed and will continue to exist....the period of White rule and especially our currently lives on this planet is very short.

How do we know that these Spirits aren't already working in our favor in other ways we can't even imagine?

Compared to Eternity, we only see a short bandwidth of time.

Gotcha. I'll kick back & listen to some old Jodeci:

Time is short in the grand scheme of things especially in relation to the age of the planet. 😎

frankster

That how it's done....

I read an account that Isaac Newton got his theories from an interpretation of Ancient Egyptian writings

Most prominent White men in Western civilization are part of secret societies where this knowledge is passed around.

Sometimes they CHOOSE who will get credit for an "invention" that has already existed for thousands of years but kept away from the masses.

Marconi wasn't the first HUMAN to discover sound waves and invent the radio.

He's just the first person in White History to get the credit for it.

After European force Africans to teach them to read hieroglyphics....they killed every African that could read it - and then forbade Africans from learning.

And to a certain degree, you still have that going on today.

Have you read George GM James Stolen Legacy?

Yes.

It's been a while, but I have...lol.

ProfD

I often hear folks reference the Haitian revolution & Black people down in Louisiana & the Mojaura spirit fightig off white supremacy.

The Haitian people I know are cool & they will be the 1st to tell why they ldft fheir home country & came to build a life in the USA.

I believe one of the reasons Haiti is in the chaotic condition it's in isn't because of Voodoo, it's because they MIX Voodoo with Catholicism.

Which is a big NO NO.

Just like Jesus said in the Bible you can't serve 2 masters, you can't serve 2 different opposing religions.

You can't serve the religion of your Ancestors AND mix it up with the religion of your Oppressors, and that's what most of them do down in Haiti.

Haitians were Catholic as slaves.

They had a ceremony where they rejected Catholicism and White theology and pledged themselves to Voudou and traditional African religion and their Ancestors and THAT got them their freedom and gave them the power to whip every White/Western power that threatened them.

But later on at some point they started slowing accepting Catholicism and Christianity again and mixing it up and THAT'S when you saw their power waning and poverty and natural disasters increasing.

Maybe the mojaura spirit will rise up & overcome racism white supremacy.

Perhaps.

One thing is for sure, we shouldn't be mixing up African Spirituality with the religions of the oppressors.

If you're going to be Christian, BE a Christian.

If you're going to be a Muslim, BE a Muslim.

Don't mix our Ancestral religions in with European or Arab religions and ride the fence thinking you're being smart or slick.

The Spirits and Ancestors are MORE than human....they are ABOVE the intelligence of human beings, and the idea that you can "trick" them or "fool" them by trying to play both sides or lie about where your faith and loyalty is, is ridiculous...lol.

On 8/20/2026 at 10:38 PM, frankster said:

As far as I know.....most parasites are invisible to the naked human eye - as a result can be considered spirits

That is just word play, something @Pioneer1 loves to do too.

On 8/21/2026 at 4:13 PM, aka Contrarian said:

There was a famous case about a woman who was put under observation in a sleep laboratory after she "complained" of being repeatedly "raped" by an incubus. Sure enough, upon being watched while asleep, there was reason to confirm that something was copulating with her, causing her to have orgasms.

Oh, please, share the study of this "famous" case I never heard of nor can find a source to substantiate any such sleep laboratory study Pioneer.. I mean @aka Contrarian 😘

On 8/21/2026 at 4:21 PM, Pioneer1 said:

You're argument has been that either race itself didn't exist or that race did exist but MULTIPLE races didn't exist.

I've provided articles to prove both assertions; but you simply wouldn't accept them.

No. What you have always shared are articles where the word race is used. Even I use the word "race" and racial terms like Black, but that does not mean there is a scientific basis for it. You will not find a peer review study supporting a scientific study supporting race, for obvious reasons.

Race is a man-made social classification, not a scientifically defined genetic classification. If that is your definition, then we are on the same page. Since our debates I use the word race a lot less frequently in public I might use ethnicity and class when speaking about groups of people.

As far as possession demonic or otherwise;

• The film Get Out was a horror flick, not a documentary

• Just because people are looking for Zombies does make them real.

• ...and by the way Zombies are not real,

People are willing to say anything, and still others are willing to believe anything. For example, Trump can say something outlandish and their are those tat will defend what he say even thought what is said is provably false.

22 hours ago, frankster said:

I read an account that Isaac Newton got his theories from an interpretation of Ancient Egyptian writings

After European force Africans to teach them to read hieroglyphics....they killed every African that could read it - and then forbade Africans from learning.

This is one idea I'm inclined to entertain 😉 I just don't buy the Newton went away for a couple of years invented calculus and derived the law of motion, optics, etc.

My problem with history of mathematics, science, religion, science (which @Pioneer1 call "white," meaning of European origin), ignores and/or takes credit for contribution of ancient Africans.

Troy

31 minutes ago, Troy said:

Oh, please, share the study of this "famous" case I never heard of nor can find a source to substantiate any such sleep laboratory study Pioneer.. I mean @aka Contrarian 😘

🤔 -of all the JIVE ass nonsense???
......please, don't EVER confuse us or even our names again, lol.

Race is a man-made social classification, not a scientifically defined genetic classification. If that is your definition, then we are on the same page. Since our debates I use the word race a lot less frequently in public I might use ethnicity and class when speaking about groups of people.

No one has denied that race and racial classifications are man-made.
It's simply a way of grouping or categorizing people with similar phenotypical characteristics.
In that respect, RACE has a biological foundation.
That's been MY position.

YOUR position has gone from it not existing, to it being a social construct, to their being only ONE race, not many
-although by definition categories ARE multiple, and not just one.

..and by the way Zombies are not real,

That's like saying people being in comatose conditions aren't real.

Haitians believe and KNOW that Zombies are real and most scientists who study the phenomena know they are real.
Perhaps you have the wrong understanding of what a Zombie.

It's like you describing some woman trying to stuff a spirit into a plastic coke bottle and screwing the cap on tight and making the claim that spirits trapped in bottles CAN'T be real based on THAT image you provided.

@Troy Lol. I was just "choppin things up", as ProfD says. You know I'm into the paranormal and I have had some personal experiences with the supernatural so your overreaction surprises me...

The terms "incubus" and "succubus" have been around for centuries usually in the context of mythology. They are referred to as either mischievous or sinister nocturnal "demons".

I remember hearing about the case I referred to many years ago, but YouTube has never been my reference source so I can't come up with any videos to confirm the validity of the case in question. I do intend to check elsewhere in regard to any "rumors" on this subject .

I don't have any criteria as to what constitutes spirit entities and have never heard the claim about capturing them in bottles. That sounds like voodoo to me.

But I can tell you this: Beginning around 15 years ago, in the middle of the night around 3:am the bewitching hour, if it happens to be a night that I am in the bed dozing rather than up and about piddling around, something that is part of my routine of "living around the clock", I have been jolted awake by what begins with a slight jerk followed by a tingling feeling starting at my toes, and slowly spreading throughout my entire body, terminating around my neck, - never resulting in any orgasmic activity, however. This petrified me the first time it happened but I subsequently began crossing my fingers when this sensation occurred because I read somewhere this is a defense against demons. Upon doing this, the tingling gradually dissipated and faded away.This has been happening to me on a regular basis for years. Sometimes I just let it play out, and other times I'll sit up and turn on my night light and "normalcy" gradually returns. Now, I've become used to it and I just let it pass like all the other weird things that I experience on my journey toward oblivion...

I would really appreciate some feedback from Del on this phenomena. I think he could enlighten and neutralize your hysterical indignation and pioneer's repugnant smugness.

Check ya later.

5 hours ago, Troy said:

That is just word play, something @Pioneer1 loves to do too.

Yes.....it is word play and more.

In popular conception......Characteristics spirits and parasites share

The ability to inhabit a host.

Invisible to the naked human eye...

Influence the desire and behavior of the host....Mental usurpation.

Make the host sick....effect physical manifestation in and on the physical body of the host.

Transference from one host to the other.

etc...

6 hours ago, Troy said:

...and by the way Zombies are not real,

The Hollywood or popular conception of Zombies are not real...

But what Africans call Zombies are real

5 hours ago, Troy said:

This is one idea I'm inclined to entertain 😉 I just don't buy the Newton went away for a couple of years invented calculus and derived the law of motion, optics, etc.

The Historian that I read who made these statements....I can not find or remember his name

5 hours ago, Troy said:

My problem with history of mathematics, science, religion, science (which @Pioneer1 call "white," meaning of European origin), ignores and/or takes credit for contribution of ancient Africans.

True.

George G M James did a great job in his book"Stolen Legacy"

Ivan Van Sertima did a equally great job in his anthological work "Blacks in Science: Ancient and Modern"

7 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

That how it's done....

I read an account that Isaac Newton got his theories from an interpretation of Ancient Egyptian writings

Most prominent White men in Western civilization are part of secret societies where this knowledge is passed around.

True

It was a secret society in England that provided Isaac Newton with Ancient Egyptian of the Papyri....

7 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Sometimes they CHOOSE who will get credit for an "invention" that has already existed for thousands of years but kept away from the masses.

True

7 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Marconi wasn't the first HUMAN to discover sound waves and invent the radio.

He's just the first person in White History to get the credit for it.

True

7 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

After European force Africans to teach them to read hieroglyphics....they killed every African that could read it - and then forbade Africans from learning.

And to a certain degree, you still have that going on today.

True

7 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Have you read George GM James Stolen Legacy?

Yes.

It's been a while, but I have...lol.

Cool great book

7 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

ProfD

I often hear folks reference the Haitian revolution & Black people down in Louisiana & the Mojaura spirit fightig off white supremacy.

The Haitian people I know are cool & they will be the 1st to tell why they ldft fheir home country & came to build a life in the USA.

I believe one of the reasons Haiti is in the chaotic condition it's in isn't because of Voodoo, it's because they MIX Voodoo with Catholicism.

Which is a big NO NO.

Just like Jesus said in the Bible you can't serve 2 masters, you can't serve 2 different opposing religions.

You can't serve the religion of your Ancestors AND mix it up with the religion of your Oppressors, and that's what most of them do down in Haiti.

Syncretization

7 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Haitians were Catholic as slaves.

They had a ceremony where they rejected Catholicism and White theology and pledged themselves to Voudou and traditional African religion and their Ancestors and THAT got them their freedom and gave them the power to whip every White/Western power that threatened them.

But later on at some point they started slowing accepting Catholicism and Christianity again and mixing it up and THAT'S when you saw their power waning and poverty and natural disasters increasing.

Not totally my take

7 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Maybe the mojaura spirit will rise up & overcome racism white supremacy.

Perhaps.

One thing is for sure, we shouldn't be mixing up African Spirituality with the religions of the oppressors.

If you're going to be Christian, BE a Christian.

If you're going to be a Muslim, BE a Muslim.

Don't mix our Ancestral religions in with European or Arab religions and ride the fence thinking you're being smart or slick.

The Spirits and Ancestors are MORE than human....they are ABOVE the intelligence of human beings, and the idea that you can "trick" them or "fool" them by trying to play both sides or lie about where your faith and loyalty is, is ridiculous...lol.

I am of the opinion that...... there is but One Spirituality - that has been made into many religions

frankster

Syncretization

That's the official name of it.

However in my opinion a lot of it is trying to be "slick" and play both sides.

I can understand slaves and other oppressed people doing it to hide their practices from their oppressor so they can continue to practice without being caught and punished.

But generations later after the oppressor leaves and you're STILL worshipping Jesus and Mary or some European Saint and burning candles to them and claiming they are only a SYMBOL of an African Deity???

Nah...I'm not buying that.

You're trying to be slick thinking you can hold on to BOTH your Ancestral religion AND your Oppressors religion.

It's like a woman with a husband AND a boyfriend.

She wants her husband to take care of her and please her sexually, but if he can't or won't...she runs to her boyfriend who she knows will get the job done.

But she doesn't want to DEDICATE herself to her boyfriend.

Just uses him as a last resort.

I could almost guarantee that if Haiti had a mass abandonment of Catholicism and focused strictly on African Voudou the fortune of that island change almost over night.

I am of the opinion that...... there is but One Spirituality - that has been made into many religions

Sure, however at this point I'd separate religion from Spirituality.

Most religions are either a political tool or just a CULTURAL INTERPRATION and often times MIS-INTERPRETATION of Spiritual truths.

In other words.......

The fact is when we leave this life we go to another one, usually a better one on a higher plane of existence.
The Christians may call it one thing.
The Muslims may call it something else.
The Buddhists may call it something else.

And these religions often times put stipulations on how to get there, who's up there, what the names of that place is, etc.....

Cynique

2 hours ago, aka Contrarian said:

, I have been jolted awake by what begins with a slight jerk followed by a tingling feeling starting at my toes, and slowly spreading throughout my entire body, terminating around my neck, - never resulting in any orgasmic activity, however. This petrified me the first time it happened but I subsequently began crossing my fingers when this sensation occurred because I read somewhere this is a defense against demons. Upon doing this, the tingling gradually dissipated and faded away.This has been happening to me on a regular basis for years. Sometimes I just let it play out, and other times I'll sit up and turn on my night light and "normalcy" gradually returns. Now, I've become used to it and I just let it pass like all the other weird things that I experience on my journey toward oblivion...

Sounds like sleep paralysis and the typical initiation of Astral Projection.

Crossing your fingers to get yourself out of it has nothing to do with demons.
It's a common method that is almost instinctive for most people to wiggle their fingers or toes to get the rest of their body working in order to break the paralysis.


For those who want absolute proof of the Spirit World, this is one of them.

During one of these episodes if you can focus on NOT being afraid but focus on intentionally raising out of your body, you'll open yourself up to a brand new world.

stfu. You don't know what you're talkin about. It's not the "witch riding my back" sleep paralysis. I am wide awake and can move freely when this tingle sensation happens; that's how I am able to cross my fingers, - a hand exercise that triggers a certain area in your brain which helps to relax you.

Always some weird ass nuanced, "not this but that" with some of you around here, lol.

Most people experience a level of sleep paralysis when they start feeling like that, but you're an exception.
You're able to get up and do jumping jacks.....lol....OK.

3 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

frankster

Syncretization

That's the official name of it.

However in my opinion a lot of it is trying to be "slick" and play both sides.

I can understand slaves and other oppressed people doing it to hide their practices from their oppressor so they can continue to practice without being caught and punished.

But generations later after the oppressor leaves and you're STILL worshipping Jesus and Mary or some European Saint and burning candles to them and claiming they are only a SYMBOL of an African Deity???

Nah...I'm not buying that.

You're trying to be slick thinking you can hold on to BOTH your Ancestral religion AND your Oppressors religion.

It's like a woman with a husband AND a boyfriend.

She wants her husband to take care of her and please her sexually, but if he can't or won't...she runs to her boyfriend who she knows will get the job done.

But she doesn't want to DEDICATE herself to her boyfriend.

Just uses him as a last resort.

I could almost guarantee that if Haiti had a mass abandonment of Catholicism and focused strictly on African Voudou the fortune of that island change almost over night.

You could be right...

3 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I am of the opinion that...... there is but One Spirituality - that has been made into many religions

Sure, however at this point I'd separate religion from Spirituality.

That is so

3 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Most religions are either a political tool or just a CULTURAL INTERPRATION and often times MIS-INTERPRETATION of Spiritual truths.

True

3 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

In other words.......

The fact is when we leave this life we go to another one, usually a better one on a higher plane of existence.
The Christians may call it one thing.
The Muslims may call it something else.
The Buddhists may call it something else.

And these religions often times put stipulations on how to get there, who's up there, what the names of that place is, etc.....

I certainly hope it's a better place...no matter what is called