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zaji

Melanin and Money

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How do we, as melanin rich people around the world, measure up in capitalism? Essentially, do we have any leverage in this monetary system that could globally affect change for us? Why or why not?

 

 

 

 

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Zaji

Excellent topic.

Delano has seen more of this world than I have so probably he's better qualified to answer your question but let me just say...............

I believe based on my observations that with a few exceptions like East Asians....most people of color around the world are doing quite poorly economically speaking.  Slavery and colonialism have stripped them of their ORIGINAL KNOWLEDGE and replaced it with Western civilization.
Because of this 2 problems have arose:

1. Most communities of color around the world no longer know how to provide the basic necessities for themselves in the amount necessary to sustain themselves independently.

2. Also important is that fact that Western civilization has change the VALUE SYSTEM of people of color around the world so that what they value NOW isn't necessarily what they valued hundreds of years before contact with European powers.

You mentioned the monetary system, however TRUE wealth is:

Health.....knowledge of medicine and the body
Land...to build shelter and grow food
Knowledge.....not simply going to a university in a Western country just to get a useless degree and beg for a job with Amazon, but REAL knowledge that allows you to do whatever you need and desire to do.
Family.....proper marriage and mating customs that produce harmony between the sexes

Money is just a means of exchange, all of the money in the world is useless unless you have secured the above mentioned.

People of color need to RE-PRIORITIZE their values and recognize that they have the ability to produce an abundance of REAL WEALTH right where they stand.....and they don't need "money" to do it.

All they need is a real desire to re-build their civilizations and break their love affair with Western civilization, then their own creativity will take over.

But to answer your question more directly....yes we DO have leverage, especially those of us here in the United States.
The United States is in a unique position of being a very wealthy nation but with far fewer financial regulations than most other wealthy nations; which means it's easier for Black people in the United States to accumulate money and play around with it than in most other parts of the world where either they DON'T have the money available to them OR they have it but it's all tied up in red tape and their ability to use their money is restricted.
 

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@Pioneer1

 

I am against a monetary system but have always been curious how others see this system.

 

I'm all about real wealth and finding ways to acquire it.

 

 

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Pioneer there's nothing missing in your post. 

 

It can be approached by building a self defining community and or self suffucient. Or learning the ability to amass or control resources.

 

Your goal is about giving Black people pride and reason. Its ambitious and if history is a barometer. Ot is likely to get you killed if you have any margin of success. Power doesn't like sharing but does form.allegiances. That you can levrage.

In short its about investing in oneself and not branding self.

Let me know if you want more detail. And i will share my observations. 

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Zaji

Without some sort of currency or monetary system, what incentive would there be for MOST people to work or atleast do enough to keep the society functioning?

I say "most" because ofcourse you have some people who would do things for free for the good of the community, but I don't think most people would.



Delano

If Black people worried about getting killed by White people everytime you generated wealth or makd money then you wouldn't have Oprah, Bill Cosby, and countless other wealthy Black people known and unknown.

It's NOT HAVING money that is more likely to get you killed.

When you're broke and desperate on the street you're more likely to commit crimes that will get you either killed by other Blacks, by the police, or just get you incarcerated.


Elijah Muhammad and his followers called White people "devils" to their faces and amassed a multi-million dollar empire....lol.

Black people are the original owners and rulers of this planet bro.
Collectively we get what we WANT to get when we make up our minds to get it.
I've seen this personally on multiple occasions.

The main reason Black people in America (and quite possibly around the world) are in the condition they're in today is because most are too lazy to think for themselves and would rather do the easy thing which is beg White people to take care of them.

In other words.....
Instead of investing the effort to learn how to build a car for themselves and doing it.....they'd rather beg one White man for a job and take the money they earned to BUY a car from another White man.

But don't worry....
Trump is putting an end to that, lol.

 

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59 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Without some sort of currency or monetary system, what incentive would there be for MOST people to work or atleast do enough to keep the society functioning?

I say "most" because ofcourse you have some people who would do things for free for the good of the community, but I don't think most people would.

 

It's a strange question for me given the way I think and imagine the society can be restructured. Remember, I believe anything is possible. LOL. Edward Bellamy created the culture I've imagined in his fiction novel, Looking Backward. I really enjoyed the work because I see the way that writer sees. Others may not see his work as valuable or possible, but I see the culture working well the way he created it. Grab a copy if there is any interest.

 

LOL @ "Trump is putting an end to that. Indeed he is trying his best. 

 

I don't know, but from what I see, this culture's egregore is nuts. Plain unstable. It's all madness to me. But, so it goes. I do what I do and hope something will be undone.

 

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You may have misunderstood me. it's not making money that will get you killed. it's showing people that they matter. That's what got King and X killed .

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Zaji

If we build a Utopia, it has to be built based on BLACK THOUGHT or the way the BLACK PSYCHE operates.

Bellamy's work was entertaining, but it's impractical for Black people because what motivates White people to behave a certain way aren't necessarily the same things that will motivate Black people.

This is one of the reasons that the type of Communism and Socialism that Marx and Engles promoted didn't produce the results among Black societies who tried it the way it did for Europeans societies.

The societies of color where it DID work....China, Cuba, North Korea....it had to be modified from it's original doctrine.

One of the major reason for this is despite Communism's atheistic approach....because of it's European origins...it's basic social morals are is still rooted in the Judeo-Christian moral ethic that so dominates the psyche of most Europeans.

Meaning, even those who call themselves ATHEIST still believe in Christian priciples of morality.

So for example..........

The EUROPEAN vision of a Utopia would still hold up the NUCLEAR FAMILY as ideal and probably still ban prostitution and sexual liberation; however we know that for Black people the EXTENDED FAMILY is best and we also know that sexual oppression and suppression is one of the major reasons there is NOT a Utopia on the planet currently.

So the very principles OF those who claim they want a Utopia are the very principles that will CANCEL OUT that Utopia for others.

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45 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Zaji

If we build a Utopia, it has to be built based on BLACK THOUGHT or the way the BLACK PSYCHE operates.

Bellamy's work was entertaining, but it's impractical for Black people because what motivates White people to behave a certain way aren't necessarily the same things that will motivate Black people.

This is one of the reasons that the type of Communism and Socialism that Marx and Engles promoted didn't produce the results among Black societies who tried it the way it did for Europeans societies.

The societies of color where it DID work....China, Cuba, North Korea....it had to be modified from it's original doctrine.

One of the major reason for this is despite Communism's atheistic approach....because of it's European origins...it's basic social morals are is still rooted in the Judeo-Christian moral ethic that so dominates the psyche of most Europeans.

Meaning, even those who call themselves ATHEIST still believe in Christian priciples of morality.

So for example..........

The EUROPEAN vision of a Utopia would still hold up the NUCLEAR FAMILY as ideal and probably still ban prostitution and sexual liberation; however we know that for Black people the EXTENDED FAMILY is best and we also know that sexual oppression and suppression is one of the major reasons there is NOT a Utopia on the planet currently.

So the very principles OF those who claim they want a Utopia are the very principles that will CANCEL OUT that Utopia for others.

 

@Pioneer1

 

Yes. Everything must be from how WE operate.

 

I think Belamy's work is great with some tweaks that inject black thought. 

 

Much of Socialism/Communism actually comes from Black systems of living if one looks at them closely. But bastardized. TERRIBLY bastardized by those who thought they could co-opt it without consequence. So I don't dismiss them. They simply don't think the way we do, so when they attempt to recreate our ways of living, communal ways, they have no idea how to execute it without injecting their greed, hierarchy, violence, etc., etc., etc. Even countries where it worked to a degree, Communism had already been grossly bastardized because those cultures were already decades bastardized. 
 

You are too right reference atheists. Where this proves true is in science. It expresses like a new religion. So far, much of what I've seen of science and its dogmas matches Christian principles and mindset. The process of coming to conclusions in science feels frighteningly religious when it comes to their conclusions about their observations. 

 

Indeed reference European ideas of Utopia. Yes. Without a change of mindset, nothing else can change.

 

 

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Zaji

Much of Socialism/Communism actually comes from Black systems of living if one looks at them closely. But bastardized. TERRIBLY bastardized by those who thought they could co-opt it without consequence.


Just like most of these organized religions....lol.

They take bits and pieces of ancient African philosophy and culture and run off with it half-cocked without a full understanding of them and invent oppressive belief systems with very little spiritual value and a lot of empty rituals that they have to continue to revise with each generation.

 

 

 

As far as an ideal economic system....for me, a health MIX would be best.

For example, when it comes to basic necessities that people must have to live and function normaly in society like health-care and housing....I think these things are best SOCIALIZED and controled by the COMMUNITY so that everyone gets something.

But when it comes to things like entertainment or inventing new machines, I prefer a more free enterprise based system where people are directly rewarded for their talents and efforts.

Having worked with and around Black people for so long, I know that in order to get the best out of most of our people there must be a REWARD or PUNISHMENT tied directly to the deed.
Too many of our people have a "lazy streak" in them that is only exacerbated when they see people around them working...lol.

People often point to Mexicans or Chinese and how 8 or 9 of them can all live in one house, work, and pool their money together to purchase a businesss and get rich;  and ask why can't Black people do the same thing.

Lol......would you like to know the reason I give them for why we don't?

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On 2/11/2018 at 10:25 PM, zaji said:

Essentially, do we have any leverage in this monetary system that could globally affect change for us? Why or why not?

 

Yes and no.  We'd have leverage if we stop spending and borrowing.   Also if we chose not to work for corporations but instead grew and produce raw materials, assembled products and sell wholesale to large corporations.   Becoming producers would allow us leverage.   We'd absolutely have to function as a monolith to make that happen.

As far as wealth is concerned, however, we don't have leverage.  We spend a lot of money but we own next to nothing.  Black wealth is near zero percent here in America.  Less than 1 percent of Black-American families have a net worth of 1.4 million.   According to an article I read, 98 percent of  available land is owned by white families.  So, if we were to grow our own food or raise cattle or dairy cows we wouldn't have enough land to allow our animals to graze or provide them enough water. 

 

So, monetarily, if we were a country - we'd be a poor country with a lot of debt.   Democratic capitalism isn't working for black folks as a whole here in America or elsewhere . 

Aside: I've pulled this information before when looking at the state of black women. Here's a link to an article that shares a lot of the stats I've read in the past. 

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Mel

What's with you and all this "Black women gotta do this" and "Black women gotta do that" ?????

Are you and Michelle Obama trying to get together and start your own Black Girls Rock Amazon tribe.....lol.



Also if we chose not to work for corporations but instead grew and produce raw materials, assembled products and sell wholesale to large corporations. Becoming producers would allow us leverage. We'd absolutely have to function as a monolith to make that happen.


I don't think we have to be a monolith as a community to make this happen.

We have so many Black people in America that even if just 10% of Black people agreed to work together to produce our own food and assemble our own products that would still be 4 to 5 million people....which is more than enough to do it.

Elijah Muhammad with the Nation of Islam grew their own food, made their own clothes, and ran their own stores and restaurants with less than 1 million members in the entire organization.

Infact, look at the Amish and what they're able to accomplish with their minimal numbers.

Our biggest problem is that the SMARTEST of Black people too often would rather take their intelligence and talents and negotiate a pay check from White people to help build White society INSTEAD OF staying in their own communities and using those same talents to build up Black America.

 

 


As far as wealth is concerned, however, we don't have leverage. We spend a lot of money but we own next to nothing. Black wealth is near zero percent here in America. Less than 1 percent of Black-American families have a net worth of 1.4 million. According to an article I read, 98 percent of available land is owned by white families.


You have an excellent point about the available land mostly owned by White families, however this is where the more CONSERVATIVE side of me comes out.

While I don't disagree with anything you said, I will say this.

When we speak of wealth, White people didn't get their wealth from the moon.
Besides the land they took from the Native Americans and the labor they forced Black people to engage in....they basically MADE THEIR OWN WEALTH and gave it value by working dilligently in their own economic system.

Black people are going to have to learn that real wealth isn't GIVEN...it's PRODUCED.

Going to work for Google and getting a $2,000 a week pay check from them isn't wealth.

If I get a plot of land and plant 1500 banana trees.....those bananas are WEALTH.
The land it's own is WEALTH.
The money I get from selling them is WEALTH.

It's not really wealth if someone else controls it's distribution and flow; it's not really wealth until YOU have a measure of control over it.

In other words, Black people need to stop waiting on White people to GIVE them loans, grants, and a template or framework in which to acquire wealth and instead use our own creativity and what we already have at our disposal to start generating it among ourselves.

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