Pioneer1 Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 frankster I think you and are share very similar positions on this subject. I believe SOME things are pre-determined and SOME things are random and based on individual choices. What percentage is which...I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Posted March 26 Author Report Share Posted March 26 Does your omniscient being @Pioneer1(anyone) know exactly what we are going to do at every instance of our lives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 Troy Lol..... They wouldn't be very "omniscient" if they DIDN'T know.....would they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Posted March 26 Author Report Share Posted March 26 No, they would not. So what do you conclude now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 11 hours ago, Troy said: No, they would not. So what do you conclude now? I've concluded that I've answered your question. Lol....got another one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Posted March 27 Author Report Share Posted March 27 @Pioneer1 my friend, you are the very definition of incorrigible. i’ll make it plain. If the omniscient being you believe in knows every move we will ever make. How would they know it unless it was predetermined? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted March 28 Report Share Posted March 28 21 hours ago, Troy said: @Pioneer1 my friend, you are the very definition of incorrigible. i’ll make it plain. If the omniscient being you believe in knows every move we will ever make. How would they know it unless it was predetermined? Man....is that your favorite word or something? You're the ONLY one I hear using it online OR offline...lol. But to answer your question.....and it actually is a pretty good question..... The simple and straight forward answer is I'M NOT SURE. But to go in more detail, I'll say consider 2 things............ 1. Knowing everything that will take place doesn't necessarily equate to predetermination. It suggests it, but doesn't equate to it. Kind of like programing a computer SUGGESTS that you will know how it operates.....but this doesn't necessarily EQUATE to it. Only KNOWING HOW IT WILL OPERATE equates to knowing how it will operate, regardless of who programmed it and how it was intended to operate. 2. If you consider the MULTI-REALITY Theory that suggests that ALL possibilities exist and are being played out somewhere in existence. Then ofcourse all things are predetermined by the Omniscient BEING because all things and all scenarios exist actually exist! But as an individual you could still have a choice as to which Reality you navigate through. And yes, the Omniscient BEING knows which Reality you'll choose to naviage through. But that doesn't necessarily mean THEY made that choice for you....THEY knew you'd choose it. Like I said about....knowing the choice you'll make may not necessarily mean THEY programmed you to make that choice. It may suggest it, but doesn't hard rock guarantee that this is the case. So perhaps predetermination AND individual free-will exists side by side if you accept the Multi-Reality Theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Posted March 28 Author Report Share Posted March 28 @Pioneer1 according to Google incorrigible has been used 9 times in 15 years, roughly once every year and a half. Hardly worth mentioning. The word is oh so apropos. If you rolled in more educated circles I’d suspect you’d hear it not often as far as your response. You engaged and a great deal of linguistic gymnastics and dragged out your Multiverse argument which you drag out to explain away anything as it encompasses all possibilities . the idea that we can move between any of the universes we want does not make sense to me, as I doubt anyone would pick their current situation knowing there are an infinite number of better positions they could be in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted March 28 Report Share Posted March 28 6 hours ago, Troy said: the idea that we can move between any of the universes we want does not make sense to me, as I doubt anyone would pick their current situation knowing there are an infinite number of better positions they could be in. Because it doesn't make sense to you, does that discount it as a possibility? If you study Near Death Experiences and those who come back with messages, one of their explanations as to why people come into THIS Reality and go through some of the hardships they go through is to gain EXPERIENCE. Kind of like how a person appreciates wealth more if they've experienced poverty, as opposed to one born and raised in the lap of luxury and may be easily bored with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Posted March 28 Author Report Share Posted March 28 2 hours ago, Pioneer1 said: If you study Near Death Experiences and those who come back with messages, one of their explanations as to why people come into THIS Reality and go through some of the hardships they go through is to gain EXPERIENCE. Where did you learn about the NDE experiences of these people a book, YouTube? Did they also explain why people would come back to be beheaded starve to death, die in infancy, and be raped and tortured? Did they explain what these experiences would provide them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfD Posted March 29 Report Share Posted March 29 Now I'm wondering if I should feel slighted that I've not been able to participate in the near death experience and jumping around in different realities games. Then again, the omniscient has good reason not to pick me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted March 29 Report Share Posted March 29 Troy Several times you've mentioned "this omniscient being". Should I take that to mean you don't believe in God? Where did you learn about the NDE experiences of these people a book, YouTube? Both. I've been studying them for years. All you have to do is ASK some of the people you know who've been in traumatic situations where they've been unconscious for an extended period of time and some of them may have some experiences to share with you too! Did they also explain why people would come back to be beheaded starve to death, die in infancy, and be raped and tortured? Did they explain what these experiences would provide them? Yes. According to many of them, every experience has a reason behind it. ProfD Now I'm wondering if I should feel slighted that I've not been able to participate in the near death experience and jumping around in different realities games. How do you know you haven't? One Multi-Reality theory claims that every single move is part of a different Reality. Their theory claims you're constantly moving through BILLIONS of Realities each moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfD Posted March 29 Report Share Posted March 29 4 hours ago, Pioneer1 said: ProfD Now I'm wondering if I should feel slighted that I've not been able to participate in the near death experience and jumping around in different realities games. How do you know you haven't? One Multi-Reality theory claims that every single move is part of a different Reality. Their theory claims you're constantly moving through BILLIONS of Realities each moment. Maybe so. For over a half-century and counting, it's felt like the same mono-reality. Every time I wake up, I see and hear the same sh8t in the world around me. Surely, if I had jumped into a reality where for the most part, I could just cook and eat; poke that soft and wet and play piano all day, I would have stayed there. Really, I cannot complain about my mono-reality because I'm in good health and I'm well off and there's no shortage of people who love me unconditionally. I have a great life all things considered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted March 29 Report Share Posted March 29 17 minutes ago, ProfD said: Maybe so. For over a half-century and counting, it's felt like the same mono-reality. Every time I wake up, I see and hear the same sh8t in the world around me. Surely, if I had jumped into a reality where for the most part, I could just cook and eat; poke that soft and wet and play piano all day, I would have stayed there. Really, I cannot complain about my mono-reality because I'm in good health and I'm well off and there's no shortage of people who love me unconditionally. I have a great life all things considered. Would you say much of your happiness and success was a result of "luck" or because of good decisions you've made? BTW, you don't exactly see and hear the SAME shit around you. Things change....maybe not as drastically at times...but they change every moment. Your body at 50 isn't like it was at 20. Your home isn't exactly like it was yesterday....even if your car keys are laying in a different spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfD Posted March 29 Report Share Posted March 29 1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said: Would you say much of your happiness and success was a result of "luck" or because of good decisions you've made? I believe success is a combination of effort, decision-making and some luck too. 1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said: BTW, you don't exactly see and hear the SAME shit around you. Things change....maybe not as drastically at times...but they change every moment. Nothing has significantly changed enough to affect my overall reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted March 29 Report Share Posted March 29 3 hours ago, ProfD said: I believe success is a combination of effort, decision-making and some luck too. Then I take it you don't believe everything is pre-determined either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfD Posted March 29 Report Share Posted March 29 10 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said: Then I take it you don't believe everything is pre-determined either. As the resident agnostic around here, h8ll to the naw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted March 31 Report Share Posted March 31 Troy Lol...I know you saw my question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delano Posted April 3 Report Share Posted April 3 On 3/12/2024 at 11:57 AM, Pioneer1 said: Not necessarily. Because there may be MULTIPLE futures in MULTIPLE Realities. An individual's future may be yet to be determined depending on their choices. The Omniscient Being knows the DIFFERENT futures/outcomes of all the DIFFERENT directions they could go but they still can go in any direction they choose. Jesus said one of you will betray me. Judas was fated to be that person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted April 3 Report Share Posted April 3 17 hours ago, Delano said: Jesus said one of you will betray me. Judas was fated to be that person. The author of a book can decide the "fate" of any one of the characters in it. According to the Bible Judas later on committed suicide, which is considered a major sin in Christianity. Was that part of his "fate" also? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delano Posted April 5 Report Share Posted April 5 The following two quotes are from Hellenestic Astrology The study of fate and fortune ... all things are predetermined from the moment of birth, and that there is nothing that a person can do to change their fate, since it is not just external events and circumstances in their lives that are predetermined, but also the person's internal motivations, character and choices as well. ... the choice to act was free, but once an action had been taken, the outcome was predetermined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Posted April 5 Author Report Share Posted April 5 On 3/29/2024 at 6:59 AM, Pioneer1 said: Should I take that to mean you don't believe in God? If you mean some omnipotent being that sits around daming people who don’t follow a prescribed set rules, promises 72 virgins to those who kill infidels, etc. No, of course not. Do you? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted April 5 Report Share Posted April 5 Troy Either you believe in the GOD/CREATOR/SUPREME BEING.....or you do not. I'm not sure how relevant all of those other attributes and qualifications are, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Posted April 5 Author Report Share Posted April 5 @Pioneer1 Do I believe there are beings so advanced of us that they are essentially indistinguishable from a God - almost certainly. Do I believe such a being is preoccupied by us doing their bidding, absolutely not. Is that any clearer? If not, ask a better question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer1 Posted April 6 Report Share Posted April 6 Troy Actually, I do now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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