Troy

@Pioneer1, to @Chevdove's point. maybe you should check out this book; African Origins Of Major "Western Religions" by Yosef Ben-Jochannan

@Pioneer1 all of what you wrote assumes that aliens would be concerned with something as mundane as "race" relations between the animals running around on this planet. That seems virtually impossible.

I explained this an you have clearly rejected the response. Yes, I explained this too. You took information out of context to make you point. Didn't the pretty graph I provided, from the CDC, help you see that yes they recommend that vaccinated people can go maskless while unvaccinated people should wears masks under certain circumstances. Will this change? Probably? This is not a contradiction it is a reaction to different conditions. Like, perhaps the Delta variant. Again this is new territory and things can change quickly. This is compounded by a wide variety of conspiracies being spread, partisan politics, and irresponsible behavior of the public. What do you expect? Do you expect the CDC to issue a single mandate that never changes over time despite the conditions? It is easy sit back an question the CDC's reactions with the benefit of hindsight. I'm not sure if you understand how extremely difficult a situation we are in. From the little I've seen of the CDC -- which I did not reference until this conversation I did they have done a great job of relating information, but you want to blame them for being contradictory. I don't see it. What is contradictory is our collective reaction so the pandemic. Some states have less than 50% of their adult population vaccinated! You really believe this is because of contradictory information being put out by the CDC? Really?! Perhaps. Assuming this is true, again, it is far easier to point out the mistakes of others after the fact. No one (except you perhaps) expects a perfect reaction during this time of crisis. Mistakes will be made. hopefully they will be learned from.

Yes but you are cherry picking; selectively using information that makes your point while ignoring information that runs counter to your point. You also change your argue and setup straw men. Again you @Pioneer1 wrote: Nor does it help when so-called scientific experts routinely contradict themselves.They announce that it's now safe for people to take off their masks and stop taking precautions.....then wonder why the virus is surging again. There are a wide variety of instances when people should or should and should not wear masks. Most notably are the differences between vaccinated and unvaccinated. Many unvaccinated people can not be vaccinated -- no one is tell these folks to take off there masks. If the majority of scientists "contradict" themselves it is usually because they are in new territory and new information is coming in all the time. Contradicts ignores that fact that scientists are willing -- indeed must change -- their position if new information comes in that say what they previously believed was inaccurate -- that is they way it works. So if some new mutation comes along that the current vaccinations offer no protection, the CDC will say put your masks back on -- That is not contradiction, right? Nuance seems to be beyond your grasp, why does everything have to be binary with you?

Exactly!

I seem to remember hearing something about this, but do not remember where and did not look it it.

Sure, Pioneer communicates to be understood by others. I'm not so sure about communicating to understand himself. Here is why: I seek to understand my own motivations. I'm very willing to change my position on an idea when I'm presented with compelling information to the contrary, especially when it is presented by larger groups of people who are experts in a field of study. For example, I've dispensed with the idea of race having a genetic basis and recognize it purely as a social construct. Of course, this also forced me modify my beliefs about race and racism - it does not matter what I'd like to believe or what makes be feel good. Pioneer is unwilling to change his beliefs on this basis. He is too invested in the notion of a genetic foundation of race and how he sees the world. It does not matter what the science community says. To change would require challenging old beliefs and this is hard. This is not just hard for Pioneer, but it is also hard for many people, perhaps most... I'm not sure most people seek to understand their underlying motivations. Perhaps this is something we can never truly understand. @Delano have you ever done something and later ask yourself; "Why the hell did I do that?" If so, were you always able to come up with an answer? Once I was in a room with 3 other people (a group project back in B-School). I said something to the group, that as soon as the words left my mouth I was like, "What did you say that for?!" Everyone just looked at me like I had two heads, decades later I still have no idea way I uttered the words. It was one of those thoughts that crosses one's mind that one knows to keep to themselves. It was like I did not have control over myself. Sometimes, I encounter someone who seems to have this problem chronically, they come across as assholes and, as a result, turn people off without understanding why. I have sympathy for these people. Our brains are complex and difficult to understand, so it is not surprising that understanding our own motivations might be difficult as well.

see this is what i mean, where did you learn that the CDC had told people masks are no longer necessary? (This is question I’d like you yo answer please) Have you visited their website or are you repeating something from your social media feed?

I have no idea why he was stopped. I simply chose to stop short of saying it was because he was Black, especially since Del suggests that was not the motivation.

I did not say you said that. This is the statement is contest. You've expressed it numerous times, in a variety of ways, before. It is fundamental to your view of so called Caucasians, which is founded in your belief in the inherent differences in people to due to their so called races. Again, this is why you will not -- indeed can not -- entertain the idea that a white policemen in Switzerland may have pulled Del over for a reason other than his race.

I dunno, if an instrument of war, a tool of American imperialism, is the best way to honor than man. Renaming the Edmond Pettus Bridge after him would be apropos. The 2020 Olympics should have an asterisk after it. The whole concept of the Olympics needs to be reimagined. It is far too expensive to host and over commercialized like most sports. They starting screwing it up by allowing professional athletes to compete. Skateboarding is an "Olympic" sport for Christ's sake. The IOC should add "Shark Jumping" as a sport, they are good at that.

I had the opportunity to be interviewed on State of Play the weekly public affairs show that airs on BNC (the Black News Channel). The show is hosted by former District of Columbia Mayor, Sharon Pratt and co-anchored by former Deputy Chief of Staff to President Clinton, Karen Tramontano, and journalist/activist, the Rev. Mark Thompson. The program also included Dr. Brenda M. Greene, Professor Joshua Clark Davis, and Ramunda & Derrick Young. We all discussed the state of Black books. The video below is queued to where I begin speaking. You can, of course rewind, to the beginning. The entire program is 43 minutes and 30 seconds.

Was my presumption incorrect? Are you willing to explore the possibility that there are white people — entire countries of them even — who don’t have the characteristics you’ve described and can treat Black men with respect? Or is Del’s prescription correct?

Following statement and countless others. the presumption here was that the maltreatment of Black people is universal. You are willing to accept this as axiomatic rejecting the experiences of a Black man who has, presumably, been there. You have also asserted here and many other conversations that there are behaviors that are inherent to all white people regardless of their culture or when they lived.

Anecdotally, it seems an increasing number of people dogs today — often 2 or 3. Man’s best friend seems to take the place of human friendships for many people and I’m talking about Black people. Cultures that domesticated cows drank milk it is not a function of race. Deep. You know Del is right about that one. Based upon your response Pioneer, there is nothing Del could have written to change your mind. It is interesting that you have no problem formulating an opinion about a place you have never been, but will reject an opposing opinion from someone who has been there.

Well the problem in cases like this is not science, it is the media and how people consume it. There are wide variety of problems including the fact that media outlets often misreport science and give an equal sometimes a larger voice to people who are not well informed. Social media has put this problem on steroids. Of course, from time to time as more information is discovered the scientific consensus will change -- as it should. "... so-called scientific experts routinely contradict themselves..." is mistakes the process, because on the bleeding edge of any subject new information comes in all the time. The Covid vaccines are safe; climate change is real, and humans are making it worse; the Earth revolves around the Sun. These things are not up for debate as far as the scientific community is concerned. Parisian politics, driven by greed and an ill-informed public, is the reason we are still debating these things. In the case of Covid, a great many people have died and will continue to die unnecessarily.

Both of those are cultural characteristics and can easily be applied to people of all so called races.

I guess it depends on media you consume. There are conspiracy theorists on both the left, right, and in between. It is part of the human condition. Most people don’t trust (or understand) science, as far as I can tell, as a result, we are primed for conspiracy theories. If you don’t understand science, on some level, you need conspiracies to make sense of the world.

Man, that is a cynical thought. I communicate to both understand myself and to be understood. I communicate to relate information that I think is important to us a a community. I'm also an educator, so I seek to teach as well. That never rises to the level of manipulation or indoctrination. Perhaps. If you have to ask twice, he is not going to answer it. What puzzles me is sometimes is that Del will point out that I have not answered a question! If I don't answer a question directly posed to me it is simply because I missed it and I'll ask that the question be asked again. This is factually inaccurate and technically racist. There are no behavioral characteristics that you can apply to Caucasians universally that are not also true for all humans.

I'd bet She'd put some moves you that would make you forget all about how muscular she is 🥰

No, I don't, but again this is why Del asked you if you'd even been to Switzerland. Since you've never been, it might be hard for you to wrap your brain around the fact that there may be a place on Earth where Black men are not troubled simply for being Black. Del's approach is more nuanced than yours. I'm not making a value judgement. I just pointing out the difference makes it more challenging for you too to communicate. I speak from experience with you both 😉

They are effectively tumbling on trampolines. It requires skill, but it completely different that what was being used in the 1970s. Check out Cathy Rigby at the Munich Olympics in 1972. This was before American Black women were able to compete in the games. Today, I would expect a good high school female gymnast to be able to do this routine -- with the same equipment. Today there is way to much focus on entertainment and how people look (women in particular) and it has distracted from the sport. The ultimate outcome would be a sport like wrestling which is strictly about entertainment -- shedding all presence of actual competition. Boxing is heading down that route with bloggers and midget basketball players providing the entertainment.

@Pioneer1 what about Simone Biles?

You realize both of you Brothers have difficulty answering direct and simple questions. This is interesting to witness. I think there are two things as play here. @Pioneer1 resists answering direct question because he does not want to get hemmed up into a corner that would expose a flaw in his reasoning. Del I think does this too, but his primarily motivation, more often, seems to illicit a response or thoughts that would ultimately lead the question asker to answer they we seeking. I think in an online forum it is simply easier to answer the questions posed. That said, I can easily answer both questions: @Pioneer1, Del might be into tarot and and astrology, but he is not a mind reader, therefore he can not possibly have known the motivation of the police officers who pulled him over. @Delano, Pioneer has not been to Switzerland. How many Black race men from Detroit go to Switzerland?

Women's floor exercise has changed a great deal since my day as a gymnast. Top Olympic gymnasts could not perform most of the tricks these college gymnasts performed, but that is more due to the equipment than the athlete. I was more impressed by Katelyn Ohasi her tumbling passes were more difficult. I imagine the judges ignore the music, prancing and butt wiggling, but I guess this is why these videos go viral.