Chevalier review on Movies That Move We

[richardmurray]

 

 

 

1:02 Thank you for saying the truth. I wonder what your thoughts are to non documentarian biopics influencing how people view identities in history?

 

1:53 The movie was written by Stefani Robinson
< https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/atlanta-writer-stefani-robinson-talks-female-creator-label-1130971/ > 

I Quote her
"Being a woman is not in the forefront of my mind every second of every day. I am a woman, I live as a woman, and my perspective is most definitely female, but there’s this implication that for me (or women) to create a piece of work ?or put myself into the shoes of others, I have to somehow filter it ?through this resolute female mental block. It’s a contradiction, because I’m proud to be a woman and want females to be celebrated. But on the other hand, the focus on that sometimes feels a little condescending and demeaning."
The problem with all artists who suggest araciality is they forget no artist has the ability to create absent bias. Bias isn't always negative. In Chevalier, her desire to show this competitive mulatto artist in France is from her own view, but the film could had went another way that may have achieved greater reception.

 

I quote her again
"Representation absolutely matters. The fact that I didn’t have many female TV writers to look up to when I was young is a big reason why I felt compelled to pursue ?my career. But I reject the idea that you can only tell a story if you’ve lived it. How clinical and boring. Artists should have the freedom to explore anything that moves. But this also demands that everyone is allowed a seat at the table.?"
The problem with many of my fellow artists is they confuse labels with restrictions.  And they confuse the ability to tell a story with the ability to tell a story with a perspective that will reach out to all. I am black, male, hetero, anglo <the language i primarily speak is english>. Does this mean I can't write a story inspired by don quixote? of course not. Am I from spain? no. Do I speak spanish? no. But I can still write a story about don quixote. BUT, if I am free to wrtie what I want will my culture emit through my telling of don quixote? yes. And of course, what will the commercial quality of my work be? well, that is a complicated question but at the end of the day, do those who are interested in my work or variants of don quixote have a large enough quantity and, will my work be able to attract those who are not interested in my work or don quixote? 
I have been writing my entire life, I have no bounds, but just because I can create whatever I want doesn't mean commercially it is viable? And based on what she has written in the past, has she shown viability in the genre of biopics? And to the movie, after chevalier, would you pay for her to write another? 
This is the key between all artists creativity side commerciality. 
Edgar Allen Poe, a white man , died poor, and not financially grand. Mark Twain wasted fortunes made from books with various ventures, but earned a lot of money. But today, many more know more references of Poe over Twain. Does it make either artist bad creatively? no. Does it mean either artists has different qualities commercially  ? yes
Opportunity to make profit is rare for all artists but when given an opportunity if you fail to make money, you fail. And even if statistics are skewed or augmented to emphasize failures unfairly, it is up to the artists to keep creating. 
I paraphrase <I am typing one go , no checking> the preface of the play , The Escape by William Wells Brown
"This play was written for my own amusement , and not with the remotest thought that it would ever be seen by the public eye. I read it privately, however to a circle of my friends, and through them was invited to read it to a Literary Society . Since then, the drama has been given in various parts of the country. By the earnest solicitation of some in whose judgement I have the greatest confidence, I now present it in a printed form to the public. As I never aspired to be a dramatist, I ask no favor for it, and have little or not solicitude for its fate. If it is not readable, no word of mine can make it so; if it is, to ask favor for it would be needless"
And I paraphrase, same as before WEB Dubois, who isn't my favorite writer , but is true sometimes.
"The Negro today fears any attempt of the artist to paint Negroes. He is not satisfied unless everything is perfect and proper and beautiful and joyful and hopeful. He is afraid to be painted as he is, lest his human foibles and shortcomings be seized by his enemies for the purposes of the ancient and hateful propoganda"

My two points using the two paraphrases above < and I apologize for all this preaching, my own preaching does sicken me> is first,  to emphasize an eternal truth, whether in the late 1800s or on MArs circa 2672, Black artists, like all other artists in humanity,  are totally free to create whatever we want, but that doesn't mean we warrant or must be given opportunity to profit from it; and , second, that Black DOS artist, like all other artists in humanity, need to feel no shame in admitting thier culture , including all of its unique ways, like being the only people forced to immigrate to the american continent and enslaved in it. 

 

3:33 That is a great artistic question from Nike. In films concerning characters in history, the film industry has common aspects. For example, anytime a white jewish character  is in film at the time period commonly called world war II, significant time is always, always given to concentration camp life for jews,always. I have personally witnessed in many writing groups, black writers desire an end to the mentioning of enslavement to whites in the usa or the european colonies that preceded it. And I comprehend the source of this artistic movement. Black DOSers have a problem. We are the only group that was forced to immigrate and exist enslaved in the usa, the only one, so no oher group in the usa has our fiscal /governmental/cultural path in the usa, no other group. In the arts this is played out whenever slavery is displayed. So to be apart of the usa en large, if black people simply dismiss our enslavement in the arts, we are internally moving from it to join the other groups in the usa. Enslavement to whites will always be a historical fact, but the arts have the ability to create perceptions to the past, ala Bastille day in france or the october revolution in russia are prime examples. The french republic didn't start at bastille day , but those in power in france wanted to create a living myth that the french republic was started at the time marie antoinnette lost her head. But it isn't true, monarchism thrived long after the bastille was stormed ala Napolean and his descendents. And same to Russia, the February revolution is where the Czar really lost it, and he chose to step down willingly, the legislative body of russia , like in most governments with a highly   multiracial populace was unable to finda center where non exist, which is perfectly human, and thus led to more chaos later that year in october. But, this is the power of modern myths, designed to make more complicated stories simple. It is easier to say, France rid itself of monarchy with the chopping of marie antoinette's head, it is easier to say the russian monarchy was blindsided by the power of the peasants, it is easier to say the usa is the land of the free and the home of the brave merely with the signing of a declaration of independence. Bullshit. 

 

3:47 Joseph Bologne was lucky. The reality is, many Black artist like to use rare black examples and tout that as the story to emphasize in a time. Were all black people ensalved to whites in the european colonies that became the UA? no , but does that mean the story of land owning blacks needs to be emphasized over the over ninety percent of black people completely enslaved to whites? I say no. Robinson chose to do what I heard in black writing circles many black writers suggest, I quote :"why do we have to talk about slavery all the time". The majority in any community dictates most of their narrative, the black community in the usa his an anaomaly in that the minority in the black community in the usa tedns to try to dictate the larger narrative. Ala the talk about human equality , fighting for freedom, being statian <allegiance to the usa> , and many philosophies stem from the black minority in the black community in the usa, in opposition to the black majority in the usa which is historically or modernly, anti white, anti usa, pro segregation, yes seperate while equal. Note: Remember, the plantation is a form of integration. 

 

6:10 yes, mullato is little mule. The Casta is something started by spain and this is where the terms, mestizo/mullatto/alvino/quadroon/octoroon come from. The problem with Casta is that it is a natural insulting system. Think of the Caste system in india. People like the Dalit are deemed less than by others in the more potent castes. It is an automatic insult. Saying Mulatto wasn't like saying Nigger. It is more like when someone is called black in the usa and they say, why do you have to call me black. It goes back to the writer and that philosophy or human equality. Don't call someone by a label, call someone by how they want to be referred to. So not the black dancer who made thriller but michael jackson who made thriller. The problem is not everyone is insulted when called mulatto. In South America, the simon bolivar side others were proud mestizoes, which is word kin to mulatto. For the record: mestizo is white parent side native american <regardless of native american phenotype> , Mulatto is white side black <regardless of geographic lineage, so native american or african or asian>, albino or quadroon is someone with morisco and white european <morisco parents are white and mulatto, mullatos paretns are white european and black> , octoroon is from a quadroon with another white european parent. Someone like rebecca hall, director of the film passing basedon the book by nella larson falls somewhere in that range of octorron and quadroon. 
ala 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Castas_07tornatras_max.jpg 
Is Casta or terms from it like Mulatto based on genetics , no. It is science, or knowledge, but it is based on lineage. And why does lineage matter historically? law plus inheritance. This is why the descendent of Gannibal <a statue of him is in russia today>, Alexander Pushkin <russians know this writer in russian literary circles> own descedents are all white. 
Gannibal <
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f3/Петровское._Бюст_А.П._Ганнибала.jpg >
Ossip Abramovich Gannibal
Nadezhda Ossipovna Gannibal < https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2b/N.O.Puskina.jpg >
Alexander Pushkin < https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/56/Kiprensky_Pushkin.jpg >
Natalia Alexandrovna Pushkina < https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e7/Pushkinana.jpg >
Sofia Merenburg < https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countess_Sophie_of_Merenberg#/media/File:Countess_Sophie_of_Merenberg,_Countess_de_Torby_(LOC_ggbain.00604).jpg >
from Sofia 
Anastasia de Torby < https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/26/De_Torby_Anastasiya_Mikhailovna.jpg >
Nadejda de Torby < https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a6/Nadejda_Mountbatten%2C_Marchioness_of_Milford_Haven_(LOC_ggbain.16855).jpg >
 You may scoff at my going through this but do the research on their lives and you will notice their background had influence on their rank or inheritance. It is that simple. 
What is the problem? In modernity in the USa, the aracial philosophy that many aspire to, suggest that any system that disallows individuals is by default an extremely negative system. The Casta/Lineages determining inheritances all are against individual rights, which is what the writer by her own words above champions and it appears in her screenplay. But it is misplaced in the context of France during Joseph Bologne's time. Said France isn't the USA 2023. White people in France duing said time did not freely intermarry with each other. The caste/rank/lineage mattered to those with money, rightyl or wrongly, so to suggest a modern sentiment is a falsehood historically. But, is artistically acceptable. But notice it is both and how that relates commercially. This movie didn't shake up the world.

 

7:43 yes, European countries in the 1700s , 1800s , had very small black populaces, so small the term negligible can be applied. And in Europe, the peasant, the descendant of the White statian was the lowest class. And to be blunt, while blacks could never be considered royals in europe at that time, i argue, from Gannibal to Thomas Alexandre, while they were never regals in europe, to suggest they lived liked white peasants in europe is a lie. And I argue, that modern Black people living in white countries: usa or in western europe, falsely attribute to them an equality goal when I think they merely did what all did in the regale system of europe which is social climb. 99% knew they will never be the crowned but the goal of all was to reach for it. And the playground in between the regale and the no name peasant is where the action was. 

8:50 yes that was a funny modernity. BUt I will say this, if that conversation did happen, I would had loved to hear that back in the day. 
Pourquoi n'epouser pas un Africain ? 

 

10:30 exactly or white peasants. 

 

10:46 yes, the white father in marie antoinette's time gave the black father after ronald reagan in the usa time speech, very tropy:) of  Robinson, I wish  I knew if that was true.

 

12:46 To be fair, Europe had a long history of art destroying, ala bonfires, through religious movements or wars and the period commonly called the french revolution <remember bastille day is a lie> was chaotic to no end.

 

14:46 yes at the end of the day I see in chevalier, Robinson as a fellow artist who by her own admission is contained in a multiracial while unfair media environment <hollywood> or country <usa> stating how the strategy of non violent artistically endeavored growth is a tradition for black people in white countries and the friction that provides said black folk with their phenotypical peers <like his mother who questions his intents or desires> or the white people with whom he wants to be embrace <marie antoinette's court>. 
Now none of his life is easily confirmed. But, from what I comprehend from a distance, the real guimard, whom he spurned, had influence over the court and undermined him in getting the opera position. While, the real Marie Josephine was abandonned by her husband in real life. I wonder why Robinson chose the style of interpreting them. For someone so interested in universalism, why not admit the woman Chevalier snubbed, Guimard, the daughter of an out of wedlock relationship some call love child, was bitter and worked against him. Robinson makes her more of an after thought when I think a great lesson in their relationship of two people born into low classes where he rejects and in her bitterness as any woman may have, used her influence to go against him a little.  While the woman he supposedly wanted, married to an Soldier engineer but a man whose financial fortunes went up and down, had a baby whose destiny is unknown. Robinson choses to caricature Marc Rene into a Simon Legree light. 
I could be totally wrong on the history of Bologne but if what I know from gossip is true, I think how she constructed the relationship between the Chevalier side Guimaud/Marie Josephine/MArie Antoinette is her free artistic choice but doesn't align to her publicized viewpoints. I do think the mugging of him side his friend which is actually on record, though the source is uncertain, would had been a great tool to the power of universalism. 

Bologne fenced more and had, to be blunt, more complicated affairs than Robinson lets on and denies Bologne's life, even in a fictional nondocumentarian interpretation, the seat at the table or the absence of a filter she says she warrants or can provide as an artist in her modern workplace. 

 

 

[ProfD]

Knowing the history behind it, I saw the movie when it was in theaters. It was entertaining enough.

[Chevdove]

I vaguely remember seeing a documentary about him. 

I'm interested.

The history of France is very interesting and during that time period in gneral, I also like to read about all of Europe.

It made a serious impact on America.

I'm happy she mentioned it is on HULU.

[ProfD]

4 hours ago, Chevdove said:

I'm happy she mentioned it is on HULU.

That was fast. Seems like just yesterday the movie was in theaters but it was released back in April. 

[richardmurray]

@Chevdove

well in terms of history, remember one key thing. France or england have one great historical commonality with the usa, all three are not indigenous. All three are born from the invaders side their enslaved who over a long bloody, raping, fucking history, create a community that makes a mythology of itself based on lies.

@ProfD Netflix for most of its history was unprofitable financially and has learned how challenging it is to profit when you don't own a lot of well known content or have the industry to expose globally

[Chevdove]

On 7/12/2023 at 5:09 PM, richardmurray said:

well in terms of history, remember one key thing. France or england have one great historical commonality with the usa, all three are not indigenous. All three are born from the invaders side their enslaved who over a long bloody, raping, fucking history, create a community that makes a mythology of itself based on lies.

 

Never thought of this reality and commonality in that all three of these countries share. Amazing observation @richardmurray! 

You know, I would have thought that America would incorporate their history in Europe a little better than they do in our educational system.

I find it so fascinating about the earlier people in Europe such as the Celts and Gauls, and so many others long before the Europeans migrated into this country and became unique. 

[richardmurray]

@Chevdovekeep researching