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How To Have Better Conversations


Troy

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I have to stop lecturing and getting bogged down in the wonky details.  

 

It was interesting to hear her describe the fact that you can learn from anyone and that everyone is a an expert in something.  I always believed that that is one of the reasons I want to hear other people opinions.  

 

4 hours ago, Delano said:

I am focusing on having less pointless two sided monologues. 

 

I hear you.  In the real world this is easy to do because these are boring conversations.

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There is nothing more engaging than listening to an articulate person who knows what he or she is talking about. The problem arises when an authority on a subject assumes you know as much as they do, and they proceed on that assumption leaving the listener unenlightened  That's why brilliant people often make bad teachers. 

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Her Grandfather was a Black composer and she performs his compositions.

33 minutes ago, Cynique said:

problem arises when an authority on a subject assumes you know as much as they do, and they proceed on that assumption leaving the listener unenlightened

It's a talent to be able to communicate effectively to a diverse audience .

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In the video, Celeste mentioned that a conversation should be similar to two people playing a game of catch with a ball.

 

Back in the day, a tennis match where the objective is to serve and volley was used to convey the same principle.

 

The point being that neither person can throw/serve/talk and catch/volley/listen at the same time. 

 

A conversation should flow the same way. It's rude and impolite to listen with one's mouth. 😁😎

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25 minutes ago, ProfD said:

In the video, Celeste mentioned that a conversation should be similar to two people playing a game of catch with a ball.

 

In social situations, I  don't have a problem with a one-sided conversation  wherein I am being a good listener because what the other person is saying is  interesting and informative.  

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I listened to 50 minutes of it.....didn't bother with the last 9 minutes.

She makes a few good points, however I seriously doubt it will have much impact on changing someone's behavior and how they hold conversations.

People are who they are personality wise, and it's pretty much gonna take a MIRACLE to change them.

I've found that what works best for me is to learn how a person is, and vibe with them on THEIR level instead of using the same approach on everyone.

Some people hate when you interrupt them, other's don't mind.
Some people actually love it when you can finish their sentences for them...others don't.

Women and men not only communicate differently but actually EXPECT different things from the opposite sex that they don't expect from the same sex.
I've noticed that a woman will let ME dominate a conversation in a way she'd never let another woman do.
Just like there are certain things I or another man will let women say we'd never let another man get away with.

The same thing goes for race, social status, ect.....

Some of this stuff is learned from simply LIVING and can't (or it's hard to) be really taught.

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15 hours ago, Delano said:

maybe go back and watch the last 9 minutes


Ok...I listened to it.


The only thing I got out of it as an opportunity to see the speakers chubby legs sitting in that old fashioned dress, lol.

 

 

 

428398728_Screenshot(243).thumb.png.6730b6280aed8e3636032167610fe22a.png

 


Which didn't look TOO bad to me...based on my personal tastes.

 

 


Was there something about the last 9 minutes of particular importance?

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54 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

The only thing I got out of it as an opportunity to see the speakers chubby legs sitting in that old fashioned dress, lol.

Yeah. I'd imagine she dressed herself for that presentation. I have an idea of where she bought that whole get up. Bless her heart.😁😎

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3 hours ago, ProfD said:

Yeah. I'd imagine she dressed herself for that presentation. I have an idea of where she bought that whole get up. Bless her heart.😁😎


Lane Bryant or someplace???

Looks like she got it from a 2nd hands thrift store and freshened it up.
That dress looks out dated....lol.

But I've seen quite a few women walking around with those "Olive Oil from Popeye" looking dresses on now.
I'm not sure if it's a trend or what.

Remember back in the day when PREGANT women used to dress in that oversized shit with the large bows and funny collars?
Even if she wasn't showing...you knew she was pregnant based on how she was dressed, lol
 

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26 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

Lane Bryant or someplace???

Not to further derail the thread but yeah, that outfit looks like it came from Lane or The Avenue or Catherine's or Wally World (Walmart). 😁

 

The outfit doesn't take anything away from her message. She was on point there. I just would have dressed her differently. 😎

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19 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

She makes a few good points, however I seriously doubt it will have much impact on changing someone's behavior and how they hold conversations.

 

On 10/29/2021 at 2:19 PM, Troy said:

I have to stop lecturing and getting bogged down in the wonky details.  

 

It was interesting to hear her describe the fact that you can learn from anyone and that everyone is a an expert in something.  I always believed that that is one of the reasons I want to hear other people opinions.  

 

 

19 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

I've found that what works best for me is to learn how a person is, and vibe with them on THEIR level

  On 7/19/2021 at 10:24 AM, Pioneer1 said:

What opinions have I formed OR rejected about this place?


Following statement and countless others.

 

  On 7/15/2021 at 9:12 PM, Pioneer1 said:

How do you know the reason they stopped you in the first place wasn't related to your skin color?


the presumption here was that the maltreatment of Black people is universal. You are willing to accept this as axiomatic rejecting the experiences of a Black man who has, presumably, been there.

 

 

 

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It is difficult for a person who reasons from experience to understand abstract concepts. Something being outside of your experience does not negate its existence. It took Cynique said that Pioneer doesn't think in the abstract. It hadn't occurred to me that people couldn't think conceptually. I thank you @Cynique for that pearl. I have very low to no expectation of concrete thinkers understanding, what to them are foreign concepts

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11 minutes ago, Delano said:

...no expectation of concrete thinkers understanding...

 

The complete willingness to reject new information and hold tight to an idea was surprising to me too.

 

But I do not think it is inability to think abstractly. For example, I used to believe what @Pioneer1 believed about race.  Most of us did.  However after the human genome was mapped and it became crystal clear that was no generic basis for race, I dispensed with the idea as well as all the conclusions based upon that idea -- which required a substantial change in one's world view.

 

That is the part that I think people find difficult to to do, change their world view.  It is hard -- especially when the new and more accurate idea does not dove tail with your personal experience.

 

After you present people with facts that run counter to their world view and they refuse to change -- that is a person who will not incorporate who will never accept the new information.  Indeed they will twist anything they read to fit their old and incorrect understanding.

 

One would that it is easier to accept the truth, but for some it is far more difficult.  In fact it is abstract thinking that make it possible to distort reality and hold onto a fiction.

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4 hours ago, Delano said:

It is difficult for a person who reasons from experience to understand abstract concepts. Something being outside of your experience does not negate its existence. It took Cynique said that Pioneer doesn't think in the abstract. It hadn't occurred to me that people couldn't think conceptually. I thank you @Cynique for that pearl. I have very low to no expectation of concrete thinkers understanding, what to them are foreign concepts



Atleast a solid concrete thinker is well GROUNDED.....he doesn't have his head up in the clouds or in an imaginary world of "theoretical" thought.

Who cares about your ability to think in the abstract if you can't even hold a simple conversation?

Even your biggest fan Cynique can't understand what you're saying half the time and have to repeatedly ask you for detailed explanation of your riddles...lol.

Unless he's an author for novels or movies, a man's thinking should be more SOUND and ON THE GROUND...while he's STILL AROUND.
 

 

 

 

 


the presumption here was that the maltreatment of Black people is universal.



That wasn't a presumption.
It was a QUESTION.

.....a question you REFUSED to answer because you knew the only HONEST answer you could have given was that you did NOT know.

 

 

 

 

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18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Atleast a solid concrete thinker is well GROUNDED

Buried 

18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Who cares about your ability to think in the abstract if you can't even hold a simple conversation?

 

18 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Even your biggest fan Cynique can't understand what you're saying half the time and have to repeatedly ask you for detailed explanation of your riddles...lol.

 

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Delano

 


Buried 

 

Where do you find the gold, oil, diamonds, and other precious gems???
BURIED under ground.


Lol, and what happens to the man who spends too much time up in the mountains with his head in the clouds?

He gets dizzy and lightheaded from lack of oxygen and his perception becomes distorted.

He starts babbling incoherently and even his loved ones have to struggle to understand what the hell he's saying.



Amazon.com : Zirni Guy Straight Jacket Crazy Cartoon Sticker Decal Design :  Sports & Outdoors
"It takes two rose bushes to eat
up the thorns  in the ping pong patch.
Those who can't think  abstractly
won't understand!  Hee hee..."



 



ProfD


Stating the obvious, humanity needs both concrete and abstract thinkers.

Some folks can see the big picture (concepts) while it takes others to bring it to fruition (produce).  That's how we survive and thrive


Absolutely you need both.

However more than the abstract thinkers who's poetic utterings do little more than provide CHEAP ENTERTAINMENT instead of actual solutions....... you need practical VISIONARIES can use their powerful imaginations and abstract thinking to solve the problems that society faces.

I'm not talking about Del btw, I'm talking in general.
You have too many who love to play with the emotions of people....especially vulnerable women who are looking for answers in their lives.
People who suffered emotional trauma often have voids and these snakey niccaz come along and attempt to FILL it with their psuedo-intellectual garbage
 

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On 10/31/2021 at 7:26 AM, Delano said:

I have very low to no expectation of concrete thinkers understanding, what to them are foreign concepts

On 10/31/2021 at 8:43 AM, Pioneer1 said:


Unless he's an author for novels or movies, a man's thinking should be more SOUND and ON THE GROUND...while he's STILL AROUND.

 

 

3 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

ProfD


Stating the obvious, humanity needs both concrete and abstract thinkers.

Some folks can see the big picture (concepts) while it takes others to bring it to fruition (produce).  That's how we survive and thrive


Absolutely you need both.

However more than the abstract thinkers who's poetic utterings do little more than provide CHEAP ENTERTAINMENT instead of actual solutions....... you need practical VISIONARIES can use their powerful imaginations and abstract thinking to solve the problems that society faces

 

On 10/31/2021 at 7:26 AM, Delano said:

I have very low to no expectation of concrete thinkers understanding, what to them are foreign concepts

On 10/31/2021 at 8:43 AM, Pioneer1 said:


Unless he's an author for novels or movies, a man's thinking should be more SOUND and ON THE GROUND...while he's STILL AROUND.

 

 

3 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

ProfD


Stating the obvious, humanity needs both concrete and abstract thinkers.

Some folks can see the big picture (concepts) while it takes others to bring it to fruition (produce).  That's how we survive and thrive


Absolutely you need both.

However more than the abstract thinkers who's poetic utterings do little more than provide CHEAP ENTERTAINMENT instead of actual solutions....... you need practical VISIONARIES can use their powerful imaginations and abstract thinking to solve the problems that society faces

I also don't have discussion with people whose logic is internally inconsistent. You may want to ask the other members to explain  an internal logical inconsistency. Cynique is more likely to engage you than I.

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On 10/31/2021 at 8:32 AM, Troy said:

After you present people with facts that run counter to their world view and they refuse to change -- that is a person who will not incorporate who will never accept the new information.  Indeed they will twist anything they read to fit their old and incorrect understanding.

It is not easy to accept that you may not have the capacity to know when you are wrong.

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1 hour ago, Delano said:
On 10/30/2021 at 4:32 PM, Troy said:

After you present people with facts that run counter to their world view and they refuse to change -- that is a person who will not incorporate who will never accept the new information.  Indeed they will twist anything they read to fit their old and incorrect understanding.

It is not easy to accept that you may not have the capacity to know when you are wrong.

 "He who knows not, and knows not that he knows not, is a fool."   

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On 10/30/2021 at 1:26 PM, Delano said:

 It hadn't occurred to me that people couldn't think conceptually. I thank you @Cynique for that pearl. 

 


Then:

 

 

3 hours ago, Cynique said:

 "He who knows not, and knows not that he knows not, is a fool."   

 

 


Delano

🧐 Perhaps you should thank Cynique AGAIN for her recent designation....lol

 

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1 hour ago, Cynique said:

He who knows not, and knows not that he knows not, is a fool.

If you talk with a fool , you are the bigger fool.

1 hour ago, Pioneer1 said:

Delano

🧐 Perhaps you should thank Cynique AGAIN for her recent designation....lol

 

1 minute ago, Delano said:

If you talk with a fool , you are the bigger fool.

 

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Since the latter part of this discussion made mention of  my reference to abstract thinking, and  those who disagreed with what they thought my definition of abstract thinking is, let me make myself clear. To me,  abstract  thinking has to do with ideals and symbols  - thoughts not things, hypothetical speaking - all of which reside  in the realm of the imagination, as opposed to the immediacy of the physical world.  Also, the phrase: "he who knows not and know not that he knows not is a fool" is a quote; somebody else's words, not mine.   

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