Chevdove

Yes, I do agree. Definitely (a) Racism More correctly, the term is not actually 'Racism' though, but Colorism and White Supremacy, that came first before slavery. The motivation comes before the act. Slavery is a response to the issue of hating Black people and people of color.

LOL @Jeffrey Okay. This is so funny. I am guessing that you are referring to Candice Owens. This thread as branched off into other interesting points but I maybe reading too deeply into your comment, however, it has a punch to all of what is being discussed. LOL. I think many of us, Black women wear our hairstyles in extreme ways but today, it has become normal to think that it is okay to portray ourselves as being defined as having BONE STRAIGHT HAIR. I think to some extent, this is okay, but when it becomes an obsession, then it shows self-hatred, however, this aspect of Self-Hatred is being completely ignored. Not completely. It depends. When I think about my late father-in-law, I have mixed emotions. I become hostile in my spirit in one sense but I do appreciate him in another sense. He always told his son that most of his relatives chose to PASS for White, but he loathed 'the White man'. Therefore, just as the federal books report, there were a small but significant number of Natives that bonded with Black African Americans during the time of the wars and they married Black women. He was booked very well. However, he carried a lot of his old ways with him. He became a Long Shoreman and made a lot of money and squandered most of it away on women, etc. He left nothing for his sons. The Black Native Americans, I would say define the bottom, but not all of the Straight-hairs. Yes, during the time of the massacres, many of the Straight-Hairs were the bottom though, I would agree. But in any case, the Black Natives were the bottom of the bottom, imo. They actually knew how to melt back into the woods and the Europeans had a difficult time with that aspect.

ROFL! True! You know, I think you're right! LOL! Okay, I dying of laughter here! @Mel Hopkins Yes, me too.

Not so @Pioneer1 at any rate, I am referring to Black African-typed. Many of them have African traits such as Nappy hair. Some Dravidians have straight hair like many Australian Aboriginal people but some of them have nappy hair and this means they have Y-DNA African origins as well. Yes, I understand you that you believe that White Caucasian men have their own set of unique Male Y-DNA and do not come from Black African male origins. So this is why you believe that White Caucasians are a superior race that have unique traits that dominate Black African traits. Just like you said, scholars today can make you look at something and believe in a lie and not what is obvious. You fail to realize that at one point this entire planet was ONE MASS and the earth did NOT split for a long time, therefore your version of Europe being considered West Asia has a false basis completely. Europe was never considered to be Asia.

I don't even automatically love and trust anyone, no matter what 'race' though. @Pioneer1 It may be easy to lump White people in one bag due to this American system's origins in the enslavement of Black people, but it is just not that simple though.

@Pioneer1 Like I said, I understand you in that you think all White men and your version of Adamu have their own set of Y-DNA and don't stem from one Black African Y-DNA origin. AGAIN, I understand you in that you think all White men and your version of Caucasians have their own set of Y-DNA and don't stem from one Black African Y-DNA origin or any Black Male origins. AGAIN, I understand you in that you think all White men and your version of Jews have their own set of Y-DNA and don't stem from one Black African Y-DNA origin or any Black Male origins. I understand that you think Moses of the Bible did not exist in Egypt and you think he came down out of the mountains the then went back up the mountains and has a set of Y-DNA not originated from the Black African male. I understand @Pioneer1 that you ignore the fact that Eritreans and certain Ethiopians claim to be Jews and originate from Black African Male origins. I understand you beliefs in that the Jews today in the Middle East are the Jews and not the Ethiopians. Yes!!! LOL. I understand your beliefs. I realize that you reject the 'Out of Africa' studies of the Y-DNA origins of all modern mankind in that they all stem from one male origin in Africa! I get you! LOL!

That's not true because Neanderthals are White and they are scripted to be here long before the term Caucasian was scripted. Go to the Smithsonian and that is one obvious reference. The Biblical script do not say this about the Jews. The Jews come from Abra-Ham and he was not White Caucasian. @Pioneer1 You provide no concrete references. So what you are saying is that Caucasian men and Adam men have their own Y-DNA, I get you.

But never in history has Europe been defined as such because it was originally inhabited by Black Negro-typed people and obviously because of it's proximity to the very continent of Africa @Pioneer1 Like you said, it's obvious why it would be called Eurasia, but the term ASIA refers to Asiatic people of which Negroes are not Never would Caucasian genetics dominate over Negro genetics, they have a lot of recessive traits. Barak Obama is obviously part-White but the script never defines Moses as such. Barack Obama and a lot of us Negroes today have a lot of White Caucasian ancestry but it doesn't mean that we are part Caucasian. No @Pioneer1 Europe is closer to Africa not Asia. The original inhabitants of Europe were not Asiatic or Neanderthal. Now that's true!!!

Moses lineage in the Bible does not define him at all to be Caucasian. @Pioneer1 The term MUSA goes way back even before Moses, and you are speaking about the Greek script which came thousands of years even after Moses.

This is not true @Pioneer1. The Caucasus mountains are not in Central Asia. There are mountain ranges in Central Asia, but not the Caucasus mountains. Europe is part of the Eurasian Continental expression, but I don't recall it being defined as Asia. From what I vaguely recall, Western Asia begins somewhere around present day Iran or ancient Persia. No, I don't think so. Today's description is definitely different from ancient times, but I don't recall Europe being defined as West Asia. I think West Turkey was the marker for the end of what would be 'the western world' and then East Turkey was the beginning of Central Asia. I don't recall Europe ever being termed West Asia. But, I am going to search for script reference to make sure. I think you've got that wrong. But for a certainty, the Caucasus Mountains is not considered Central Asia at all. The specific scriptures that define Moses' skin color are absolutely written and yes, I did get this from the Bible. The scriptures that I provided in addition to the egyptian records go hand-in-hand with the intense conflict of colorism of those times. The Bible does define Moses to be 'very light skinned' and uses the terms 'fair' and 'exceedingly fair' to define within context Moses as being both very good looking and very light skinned. Joseph was defined as being 'goodly looking', and the Egyptian records do show him as being brown skinned. I gave earlier scripture references to the conflicts such as with Moses' sister Miriam of which is one of the most dramatic descriptions of how colorism was a major issue even amongst the Hebrew Israelites because they had been affected by the Egyptians. That event in and of itself should reveal the issue of colorism and in how she reacted to her brother Moses' for his choice in marrying a Cushite woman. That event alone should confirm that Moses was light skinned. Moses did not want her brother to be with a dark skinned Black woman. And to add further to this account, the scripture goes on to state how the Creator further dealt with this issue and it is very dramatic and amazing.

WOW @Pioneer1 this word 'CAUCASIAN' amazingly speaks to this very subject!!! RACE is a modern day construction!!! I completely understand why you refer to White people 'from the Caucasus Mountains' as being Caucasian, but as you know, you and I go rounds ever so often about this term! I have researched this word, and THE ORIGINIAL CAUCASIANS are NEGROES, DARK BLACK/BROWN NEGROES from the ancient east world. I do understand too, today this term is exclusive and refers to White Europeans who have origins from the Caucasus, but I tell you the origins of this term does go back to ancient east world Negroes and scholars try to block this truth but there are scripts that reveal this origin. This term 'CAUCASIAN' is a perfect example of how RACE is a social construct! Caucasians today are a manifestation of a Racial Construct and are defined to be pure Caucasians meaning-- White skinned or Pure White skinned people. But we know, scientifically that can't be true because White Caucasians today have melanin. Unless they have albinism, then they have melanin and this stems from BLACK AFRICAN ORIGINS!!! So when you say; That would be only partially true!!! Because the Original Caucasians were African Negroes! But Caucasians are a dominant manifestation of intense racial inter-breeding of two different early species. The presence of the ANATOMICAL Straight Y-DNA Male origins begins from ONE AFRICAN MALE ORIGIN but prior to this humans on this planet earth were completely intersexed for hundreds of thousands of years. These intersexed beings did have an earlier origin to which, yes there were anatomically Y-DNA REPRODUCTIONS that did occur but those early BLACK or DARK SKINNED hominids completely died off. There DNA MARKER continued to be expressed in Neanderthals though, but all Neanderthals are intersexed to various degrees--every single one of them. So, to respond to your statement, CAUCASIANS, meaning White Caucasians CANNOT possibly be INTERSEXED no more than anyone else, black or white on this planet because their origins are from Africa! White Caucasian men reproduce and sons are born from them! BUT this too is the mystery as to obsession of having baby boys be born amongst the higher number of baby girls being born; the mystery lies in the presence of Black African Y-DNA. After the 3rd-4th generations of White Sex Selection with the purpose of having a Pure-White-Race [Racial Construction], I would believe the potential at this time for more intersexed births would be higher! So this is why 'Population Genetics' would be important to understand! So in order to understand the many intersexed births that are still occurring today, you have to go much farther back in time, way before the presence of todays White Europeans even. Now the percentage of intersexed births are much higher in White people than African people because it is based on the genetic presence of Black African DNA and definitely melanin. But even today, there are African people born intersexed.

I don't know about this @Pioneer1 WOW That is interesting! YES! You're right!!! I am a product of what you are saying here! I was a latch-key kid for these very reasons! Black women were indeed encouraged to do just what you wrote about! And yes, it caused a lot of damage to the Black family structure.

Oh no, I do not see women as being the same as men. Yes, I do agree. Oh yes, I do agree. However, when it comes to inter-racial relationships, I do not see a difference in White men loving Black African women or Black men loving White women, meaning normal! NORMAL, what is normal; I believe that racism cannot be ignored so then when men and women engage into inter-racial relationships with this understanding then they are acting responsibly but when they engage out of 'a spirit of racial superiority' then they are submitting to racial superiority. Too many times I hear Black men and Black women want to engage in relationships with White people because of something they hate about being Black and that is not normal. That kind of 'White Supremacist' is operating out of racial hatred. It is difficult, I believe though, to NOT blame the whole gender for experiencing Black-on-Black oppression, but I feel that we as Black people need to try to look beyond 'self' at times and look for the positives and then if you decide to engage in inter-racial relationships, it won't be out of 'race hatred'--Black Self Hatred. That kind of motivation will lead to a bad relationship for sure.

I believe you! @Pioneer1 for more reasons that one! This attempt to target people of color to be born intersexed goes way far back in time! And this is the very reason why there has been a movement to define people of color to have this INTERSEX PRESENCE. Many of the original intersexed beings way back in ancient times have resisted this category of defining intersexed beings as being 2/3RDS MALE! Nevertheless, there is no way around it, all intersexed beings stem from MALENESS! It may seem unfair, but that is the science of it. Even if intersexed people express a high 'physical appearance' of being female, it does NOT erase the fact that their beginning development stems from having male organs and this is the key. That is just it. The presence of female traits are NOT being totally ignored and that is why these kinds of births are called INTERSEXED but no matter what, ALL INTERSEXED BEINGS STEM FROM THE FOUNDATION OF HAVING MALE ORGANS DEVELOP first. There is no such thing as a 'female developing organs first and then male organs develop'!!! ALL INTERSEXED PEOPLE are initially born with MALE ORGANS THAT SECRET MALE HORMONES. In other words, they have A Y CHROMOSOME!!! That absolutely means MALE. So the anatomically straight Y-DNA African male NEVER expressed this INTERSEXED PRESENCE, not until species interbred!!! @Pioneer1 I hope you are understanding what I am getting at here? This is part of the problem with White Supremacy today! So today, yes, people are assigned genders, but no matter what they look like physically, they still have a Y-DNA present!!! It may seem unfair, but that Y-Chromosome is still there. If a X-Chromosome has an attached SRY-gene that moonlighted then, it is because of the presence of a Y Chromosome. There are many types of definitions of intersexed births, but again, all of them have a Y-Chromosome that was present!!!

So would it be fair to say that some people don't have hate who are racist? some racist people have racist viewpoints but don't operate out of hate? I can sort of accept that point of view. I can see where some people may be prejudice but not act out of hate. But when someone is not hired because of his 'race' then, I feel that is hate. If someone is not allowed to move into a neighborhood because of his 'race', I feel that is hate. And if someone is attacked because he or she dates another person of another 'race' then, I feel that is hate. Yes, I feel that in America, some people try to ignore racial issues but it is difficult to do that. Yes, I can see where Black men can be against this type of relationship, but I still don't understand the double standard aspect though. I feel, as a Black woman, that Black men have been exploited too, in 'inter-racial relationships', but I don't shun it today, nonetheless because of the positive aspect of it. Even in the slavery times, there are love stories of White men and Black women. Normal people will always be attracted to each other no matter the race, imo, but to be colorblind and ignore the negative aspect, no, I don't think that is good either.

No, that would defy all scientific classifications on a global level. scientific classification in how Family is determined, how Genus is determined, how species are determined, etc. are all based on a repetition of reproduction. so no matter what, if a baby is born with male organs that secret male testosterone, etc. then that baby is definitely male. Only males can secret this type of 'androgen' [?], not females. Therefore, scientifically, that baby is male, no matter how little the level of androgen is secreted or how much. There is no such occurrence as Female organs having this trait, at all.

Yeah, I agree! @Pioneer1 Well, on that note, I think about my Great grandmother who was brought over here to America as a slave at the age of around 10 years old... then at 12, she gave birth to an half-white offspring and then at 14 she did again... then she was sold away... Yeah right, escaping poverty doesn't require criminal activity!? LOL the Americans that set up this system didn't do criminal activity because it was not define that way by them. smh.

Ouch! LOL. That's a lot of money! But, I agree that she should not have put you on blast like that. @Troy I don't think so, at least not for me. @Pioneer1 I agree that Black disrespect is rampant!!!--But no, that does not mean that other non-Black people don't have the same conflicts and it does not mean COMPLETELY that we as Blacks would not get angry or indignant when non-Blacks err in their businesses. And while I'm at it, I want to say this. Way back, years ago, when I first joined this community, I did buy a book! It was about a single Black woman who successfully raised her offspring. But, I never received the book!-- However, I never complained at all, because I believed that I must have made a mistake. It was my first time ordering from this community. At the time, I was disoriented and was transitioning to another home and I did not immediately follow up with my order. It probably came to my house and someone in my house may have displaced it!--Believe you, me!--This has happened several times. So, I would never even dream of blaming the company, whether it be a Black business or not, because I did not follow up myself. And since that time, I have ordered books from Troy and they came right on time! But Pioneer1, if someone serves me bad food, you bet, I do complain! I don't care who it is. And your wrong, non-Black people can get real ugly when you complain about their business, I know this!

I have mixed emotions about that book. @Troy And I looked at the overview to refresh my memory. Firstly, I love some aspects because it is what I strongly believe and don't see much about, but then there are other points the author speaks about and this is what I believe is the major problem today with the issue of accountability. I don't feel that Black people today want to be accountable for the mistakes our ancestors made in the past, therefore, we will never be free under this type of arrogance. Here are a few quotes: Book Excerpt – Sacred Woman: A Guide to Healing the Feminine Body, Mind, and Spirit by Queen Afua Contrary to popular belief and ignorance, my Ancestors, the Black people of the Black land of the Nile Valley, did not worship many gods and goddesses. My Afrakan Ancestors viewed NTR, the Creator, as the undifferentiated One/All-Divine from which all life emanates. However, NTR has many wondrous divine attributes, and all of these manifestations--the NTRU--are aspects of Its wholeness. Consider, for a moment, such divine emanations as Maat https://aalbc.com/books/excerpt.php?isbn13=9780345423481 The western world conveniently lie and state that our ancestors worships many gods and goddesses and I love that she brings this point out! But then, she immediately slips in the term MAAT and as usual, it seems to be a contradiction in the definition of 'WHOLENESS': The Khamites, my ancestors, believed that within the heavenly realm the presence of the Divine is reflected in the balanced worship of NTR--the Mother/Father Creator, where both aspects in One are given equal respect. https://aalbc.com/books/excerpt.php?isbn13=9780345423481 Now, this is what I also believe, however, it seems that this definition always takes a turn to elevate the female over the male, and that is what brings out much confusion to the Black world. From this twist comes a lot of contention about gender equality in the Black world and for this reason, the enemy has creeped in and been allowed to exploit this issue and divide and conquer: By contrast, most present-day Western religions recog-nize only the male priest and worship only a male God in a heaven of male angels. In the ancient Afrakan spiritual tradition, there is deep respect for the Mother Creator and the female priestess as well as for the Father Creator and the male priest. CONFUSION!!! Unless there is accountability then, the Black world will continue to be exploited and oppressed under White Supremacy. This Earth Mother, Mother Creator, Mother Earth... whatever the term has been used to encourage African women to hate Black men for their taking 'evil dominance' over us, oppressing us and bringing in White women to be over us... So, of course I understand this aspect, however, it's a deceptive ploy to cause Black women to run to White domination in order to throw down the Black man and that's why I run from books like this @Troy. There has to be accountability. The ancient Black men and woman share an equal part in worshiping White people. The ancient Earth Mother was the first to worship non-African men and this needs to be dealt with. I do not want to be a part of gender division at all.

@Pioneer1 WOW, I think your response sort of supports what I am saying here. This system has exploited the term 'sex' and have defined it on 'their construction' and not true science. They define 'sex' based on what they determine to be Male or female. They assign gender today NOT based on true science. Let me explain more. When a baby is born INTERSEXED, today doctors 'assign' a gender based on their construction and for this reason, historically, many intersexed people have been reported to have significant problems due to this non-scientific decision. However, scientifically as as the ancient scriptures say as well, if a baby is born with male organs, then that baby is definitely MALE!!! Now, there are so many variants of intersexed people, for example, some may appear to have more of a female aspect and therefore doctors today will make a choice and then there are new categories made. But science dictates that if that person has male organs, it is MALE. And again, this is the very issue of what I am addressing about the term 'sex' and 'race'. When people today in this government choose for others what they want to say whether man or woman or 'race' then, it will be confusion because we are not just apart of this system but we are a part of the world. So, eventually, this confusion will be dealt with on a broader level, globally, because mankind does NOT set the rules. When intersexed men are categorized as being female, sooner or later, it will cause major problems as it did in ancient times. the term 'race' today is defined NOT based on true science, so this is why imo, there is so much problems today. YES, I understand this question!!! Thanks @Pioneer1 for this question! Even though today the races of people are based on mankind's construction, still to say that "There is only one race" as @Troy states, needs to be more understood. It's true that there is one origin to us, based on my understanding, but for specific reasons, the human races is stratified and for some strange reason some 'races' of people have come to oppress others based on Colorism.

No, I don't get that and perhaps because I am not defining the term Racist as others. When I think of 'a racist' I think of a person that acts out of hate and rage. Well, I haven't figured it out yet.

Yes! It seems like this lock down is causing some of us to go a little 'stir crazy'--me included! Well, I think that maybe many of the Black people have done the same as you and have come to believe that it's a waste of time to care about other Black people being harmed. This system has been attacking us so much that maybe we are not focusing on issues in a healthy way but instead have turned and become frustrated with each other. And yes, it's difficult to see the bigger picture when we narrow the focus to negative Black people, but @Pioneer1 maybe, the younger generation are lost because of our past ineffective Black leaders. The younger generation have been victimized and have become disconnected in many ways. So maybe we should not focus on the negative but keep hope for a positive solution. Yes, I understand that many people don't want others to succeed and I definitely believe that for some Black people, their conditions have been an improvement here in America. I would agree that there are people who only want to feed chaos and have bad spirits I too have been homeless and on welfare and I am still poor. I agree that poverty is the result of choices and I continue to agree with my choices that unfortunately has caused me to still be poor. But I disagree in that poverty in this society is 'not a permanent position'. For me, in this society my poverty will continue to be permanent but, I do have hope that things will change for me with the help of positive people that may be inspired to fight against human sacrifice and human rights violations. Well, I hope that I have not distracted you from progress. Okay, I can respect your decisions. But I believe that Kaepernick's choice can't destroy America.

YES I think that is strange too. However, some of the Black activist MEN have been extremely beneficial in the plight of dealing with Black oppression via White Supremacist Movements. I especially, highly, esteem and appreciate the late Ivan Van Sertima's contribution and yet, I believe that he married a White woman. I don't think Alfre Woodard would be viewed as a Black Activist, however, based on some of the films that she was featured in such as about the life of the late Nelson Mandela, I appreciate her contribution to the cause. She's one of my favorite actresses and I believe that she is married to a White man. Well, ECONOMICALLY and eventually, would that have any affect on the welfare of Black communities and/or Black businesses? Would White Supremacist Movements exploit your Black business and put you into a position unknowingly to become dependent on White economy to continue operating as an independent Black business? If this would not happen, then I would say, marrying a White woman would not be a problem at all. And also, this White dominated economy IMO would not be able to control Black free thought due to other Black people who do make bonds with each other and that is the key. As long as there are a significant presence of Black relationships in this world, then for others who do marrying White people, it would not be a negative affect at all to the Black world. WOW @Troy Those are not racist thoughts. But yes, we are all a product of our environment. It normal, its human to think about other humans and the kind of relationships that could occur. IMO though, it's also good to consider other issues too and to not be blind when considering this subject. When we engage in relationships with other people, we are also going to have to deal with issues such as nationality, cultural aspects, etc. LOL. Now that is a double standard! WOW @Pioneer1 That's crazy.

Absolutely understand you on this point! @Pioneer1 Oh no! I don't think so. The word 'Race' is the problem here for me. It is NOT equal to terms used from a concrete, biological categorization at all. I think, maybe, that the term RACE is something used by this system and they have completely distorted the truth. Like I said, I really came to think about what @Troy was saying, and I do believe that the term RACE is some kind of 'construct', that stems from this system. That's just it! Mankind does NOT have that right to make those determinations! Science and reproduction dictates those rules. Yes, but all of those terms apply, for the most part, to people who share a common genetic and phenotypic basis. Therefore, when mankind construct African people based on our traits to be 'lesser' then, that to me maybe what a racial construction defines? I don't know, I am still in the learning process. LOL! It all sound pretty BRITISH or White to me!

Man! You ain't jokin! @Pioneer1 YES. I agree. And I know a lot of births defects occurred during this time too, due to alcohol Fetal Syndrome.