richardmurray

https://www.tumblr.com/richardmurrayhumblr/782947006872174592/come-now-blackfish-by-richard-murray referral https://www.tumblr.com/richardmurrayhumblr/782947006872174592/come-now-blackfish-by-richard-murray IN AMENDMENT Viola Davis on Juilliard site https://talkeasypod.com/viola/ Video Link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuHydabht-w Video View Transcript 0:00 [Music] this is Talk Easy I'm Sam 0:05 Fosso Welcome to the show 0:12 Biola Davis Yes Thank you for being here Thank you Thank you for having me We're in the Actor's Equity Building Oh my 0:19 goodness This is where I would come every year to do my taxes But the reason 0:24 why I came to the Actor's Equity Building is they would do your taxes for free Oh really Mhm So I'd get here at 0:31 4:00 in the morning sleep in front of that damn door get my taxes done and mail it You got your actor's equity card 0:38 after doing Joe Turner's Come and Gone right That's right I became a professional actress Well I think you 0:44 were 23 at the time 23 Okay So The Building has good but mostly sleepy 0:50 memories is what I'm hearing So let's try to create a a a better more lasting memory Okay Okay Today around your last 0:58 big action hero film The Woman King Yes You said the story quote resuscitated 1:05 you I'm dark-skinned I have a deep voice And my whole life I've been told that 1:10 I'm too strong too masculine We redefine what it means to be feminine in the 1:15 Woman King And it liberated me Is it from that liberation that you felt well the only 1:24 role to play after the woman king is the president of the United States 1:30 It wasn't intentional I think that people see your career so much as intentional and what that would mean is 1:37 that you have so much control over your work and there are there are no words to 1:44 describe the business of acting 1% of actors make $50,000 a year or more and 1:50 usually those are background actors and only 0.04% of actors are famous You don't get 1:56 control over your material Every once in a while you have an actor out there maybe the Leonado DiCaprios who could go 2:03 out there and say "I want to work with this director." But usually with the 2:08 rest of us it's you're on a wing and a prayer right But the thing about this 2:14 profession because there's so much deprivation you always want to figure 2:20 out what to do in order to work So a lot of people copy everyone else's hairstyle 2:26 They copy everyone else's body You know all the women out there trying to lose weight Maybe they get plastic surgery 2:34 Who knows But very few people sort of relish in exactly who they are M And do 2:40 you relish in that I have to I don't know how to be anyone else And yes was I 2:46 liberated from everything that makes you or defines you as feminine Yes for the 2:51 woman king But I've been liberated by everything that that define me as being 2:56 anything I feel like I define me totally 3:02 I don't want any limits on me my sexuality um my sexiness in terms of my sexuality 3:09 my voice what I can or can't do at what age I refuse to um limit myself I think 3:17 that's where progressiveness comes in That person who's willing to step out on faith and do what it is that they're 3:23 called to do Yeah You said that in making this movie that not every film I 3:28 make has to win an Academy Award Oh God Yes But are you sure the Academy should 3:34 overlook the scene where you shoot someone in the foot Punch him in the face all while in 3:41 a red dress Let me tell you something I do need an award for that damn red dress Listen you 3:48 know what the award That's the last joke question I'll ask you No you got we got to have some laughs I mean this is this 3:55 has been a I mean that's one of the reasons why I did the movie too I want people to be able to get together with 4:01 their families at home and watch the movie in the same way they commit to Air 4:06 Force One Die Hard um Sigourney Weaver and Alien I want them to commit to me 4:13 And I don't think that that is a bad thing I don't think that you know every 4:18 movie I make has to make a grand statement even I think sometimes it needs to just be pure entertainment Well 4:25 I was thoroughly entertained You made this film uh through your production company Yes And and the mission 4:32 statement of the company is to quote change the landscape It's hard for people to see us beyond the narratives 4:38 that are didactic We're trying to change that So tell me how does G20 fit into 4:44 that mission statement What what what does change look like to you and your production Because first of all because 4:50 I'm the lead in a movie Yeah I'm 59 years old and I play the president of the United States with my body my skin 4:56 tone my face and the people in the movie reflect the audience but I'm the center 5:03 of the narrative Then you have Ramon Rodriguez You have Patricia Rian who is 5:08 Mexican uh Guadalajara who's directing it It reflects the audience you know so 5:15 often I don't think that we understand It's like I did a movie one time years 5:21 ago and my husband we went to see it in the movie theater He said "You were the only black person in that town Even when 5:28 we looked in the background in the hardware store that you were at there was no one black brown or nothing." But 5:34 a lot of times movies do not reflect the world 5:40 And you know once I got to a certain level then I needed to be the change 5:46 that I wanted to see You know it's like that saying you know once you're free it's your job to free others And there 5:54 is no that closet in the studios filled with scripts for young African-American 6:02 actresses for for older African-American actresses for any actress of color 6:08 they're they're not there And so if you don't create them then what you have is 6:14 maybe actresses who do one really great movie and then they sit around for another 6:20 year or two until maybe they find something else I don't think that people 6:26 understand the deprivation there is in material And it's the material that pops 6:32 you So in this scene that people are about to hear your character President Sutton 6:39 is negotiating with a group of attackers attempting to destabilize the world economy and corner the market on 6:45 cryptocurrency Yeah Odd timing for us to the scene 6:51 Your character speaks first Why would a mercenary take on the G20 What Wait you 6:59 you call me a mercenary lady You fought a war over gasoline I served my country 7:04 just as I serve it now Yeah Blindly You serve it blindly You were used by them then and they're using you now So you 7:11 feel used That's why you terrorize a world and crash markets We want to switch to cryptocurrency So they 7:17 [ __ ] This isn't about crypto You want to crash currencies and get rich 7:22 This seems like something personal What What are you after I'm after you Like we 7:28 said in D20 you play the president and you're the star of the film Yeah Which means like Harrison Ford Yeah In Air 7:36 Force One you were number one on the call sheet Yes But before you went into the film in the middle of the pandemic 7:44 as you began writing your memoir you said in one interview "I had to press a reset button in my life I had a crisis 7:51 of meaning in 2020 You get to number one and that's your life Once I got there it 7:58 felt like somebody lied to me Yeah What does a crisis of meaning look like for 8:05 Viola Davis A crisis of meaning for Viola Davis I think is probably what it 8:10 looks like to everyone When you set out on the path to become something so you think okay I'm 8:18 going to become a famous actress So that's the goal That's the vision All 8:23 right And then you hit it and they realize that's just not it There is a 8:29 disillusionment that happens There's an emptiness that happens And to be perfectly honest there's an isolation 8:36 and a loneliness that happens And that happened to you Oh totally And it's I I 8:41 have to tell you it sort of hit during after the help but really it really um 8:47 reared its ugly head during How to Get Away with Murder Because here's the thing Whatever goal you set in life is 8:54 just the cosmic carrot to what life is supposed to be about The cosmic carrot 9:00 is the goal but really truly it's the journey and who you're becoming It's a 9:06 quote that I've been using again and again during this whole publicity tour which is your purpose in life is not 9:13 what you do It's what happens to people when you do what you do That's it I mean 9:20 I always tell people even now when you push your kid and you want your kid to be the top of the top and the best of 9:26 the best you have to know invest some money in mental health treatment because 9:31 they're going to need it Because what what's what's going to happen is when they are not that thing all the time if 9:39 they're not accomplishing something all the time they don't they're not going to know how to sit with themselves Mhm And 9:45 it's who you are that's more important than what you do That was my big 9:51 There's a Stevie Wonder song Yeah Where he's saying "Show me how to do like you." Yeah Show me how to do it Yeah I 9:59 stole that from Alice Walker She opens that She opens The Color Purple with that quote And it took me the longest 10:06 time to realize that And I realized it was the whole relationship between Sely and Suge Avery where Suge Avery taught 10:14 Sely how to love herself basically taught her how to you know find home And 10:22 I think that's it sounds Kumbaya Listen the show 10:27 is called Talk Easy Yes Kumbaya is just part of the equation Yeah So you do not 10:33 need to apologize for Kumbaya But this book that you wrote Finding Me did feel 10:38 like does feel like an invitation and a gift and an offering to discover and 10:45 rediscover your younger self Yeah And so I want to understand that young version 10:51 of you a little bit Like you you born in 1965 Yep You're delivered by your 10:56 grandmother in her home on the Singleton Plantation in St Matthews South Carolina 11:02 Yes As the fifth of six children most of your family then relocates to uh Central 11:08 Falls Rhode Island Y a small mill town that was close to two racetracks that 11:14 your father worked at Mhm You were also the first African-American family to live in that community But come the age 11:22 of five you meet your older sister Diane for the first time She was maybe 9 years 11:28 old I think Y when she enters the bathroom with you How does that scene unfold as we sit 11:35 here right now How do you see it You know what How I see it now was that was 11:43 the first seed of curiosity which is a very very powerful 11:48 word to me And the curiosity was at 5 years old It was one of the few times we 11:54 had hot water So I was taking a bath and she all I heard was a voice that said "I 11:59 want to see my baby sister I want to see my baby sister And I got out of the bathtub and she stared at me and she 12:07 looked around the house which was we grew up extremely poor and she said the one 12:15 phrase that opened my world which is what do you want to be viola 12:24 And I call that the call to adventure M you know I I think that a lot of people 12:31 feel like the call to adventure is I have this great opportunity for you to work you know somewhere and make a lot 12:37 of money and blah blah blah blah blah but the call to adventure for me was 12:42 what do I want to become who do I want to become and is that exactly what the 12:48 journey should be I didn't know that I mean of course I was 5 years old at the time but I don't 12:56 think that it matters how old you are I think once the seed is planted it's 13:01 planted Why do you think she asked you that How do you think she knew to plant the seed They say that every hero and 13:09 hero I but I what I mean by hero is someone Joseph Campbell is anyone who 13:14 wants to slay their demons in life That's anybody So that could be any of us Any of us because she didn't want to 13:21 be poor She didn't want to It's it's it's very simple She grew up even um at Singleton 13:28 Plantation for many many years and grew up in segregated schools where she was beaten Had no indoor bathroom No indoor 13:35 bathroom And saw a bathroom for the first time when she was right before she came to live with us and she couldn't 13:42 believe it Her jaw dropped because she saw the possibilities in life And I mean 13:49 I think it would be a better question for her But what she did was she passed the baton on to me unknowingly You've 13:56 described your childhood at 128 Washington Street as full of rage and 14:01 alcoholism Yeah It was a war zone If it was a war zone who were the casualties 14:09 I was a casualty My siblings were the casualty My mom was the casualty My mom 14:16 is now in advanced dementia And I absolutely absolutely believe that the 14:22 level of abuse that she endured caused that So you do suffer trauma when you 14:28 grow up in some level of poverty And when you grow up with you know they say the first enemy of a child is an 14:36 unhealed parent And I had two unhealed parents And certainly in every community 14:42 we have unhealed parents But when it becomes the Africanamean community you 14:48 have the one-two punch of family trauma 14:53 and cultural trauma A trauma of people that just don't see you a world that 14:59 just doesn't see you And I think that was a double whammy for my dad who raged 15:05 out of control And I'm just guessing at that because he was not 15:10 curious And so that he raged What do you mean he wasn't curious He wasn't curious 15:16 enough to know what was behind that rage and to heal it is what I'm saying is 15:22 it's all we have is curiosity All we have is curiosity to wake up every single day 15:29 with I don't know you you walk into any situation and you you have anxiety to 15:36 just say what's that Where's that coming from 15:41 Or do you just live with it Do you say that you know what I want to live a 15:47 transcendent life I don't want to roll into my grave being just a sort of mere 15:53 the the crappy version of myself That's what curiosity does It keeps you 16:00 growing you know and it doesn't m mean that it's perfect growth but it does 16:05 mean that you're curious enough to know who you are inside that home I want to 16:12 better understand how you coexisted and and made it through And to do that um I 16:19 thought you could read from page 70 of your book Oh page 70 Okay I have it 16:25 highlighted here Oh my goodness What is page 70 Just the highlighted parts I think 16:32 No but sometimes we would go to the bar back in the day when parents could take 16:37 kids to the bar and play darts and pool and be treated to Sprite and potato chips These happy moments would soon be 16:44 followed by trauma The rage of my dad's alcoholic binges violence poverty hunger 16:51 and isolation In my child's mind I was the problem I would retreat to the bathroom 16:58 put something against the door So no one would come in and I'd sit for an 17:03 inordinate amount of time staring at my fingers and hands and try to erase 17:09 everything in my mind I wish I could elevate out of my body Leave it One time 17:15 when I was about 9 years old I succeeded I left it My body that is in a manner of 17:22 speaking I floated up to the ceiling looking down at myself observing my hair 17:28 my legs and my face Then I faced myself staring directly into me 17:35 Wow I loved it It was a magical secret power Only I didn't see myself as 17:42 magical or powerful I just felt free It was my way of disappearing It was my 17:49 high I couldn't always control this out of body sense But when I could it was 17:54 beyond fabulous The power to leave my body to be relieved of Biola for a while 18:00 was an everpresent image that followed me for decades How did you feel reading that 18:12 Um you know what I when I look back at um little 18:20 Viola I never felt safe You know what Even worse than 18:27 that I felt wrong I felt like whoever was building 18:34 me up there in the sky just did everything 18:40 wrong Put me in the wrong family put me in the wrong 18:45 circumstances didn't make me pretty enough made me too 18:53 black Every aspect of me was wrong I 18:58 didn't see any evidence in life of 19:04 love I couldn't articulate it at the time I 19:09 just sort of disappeared and numbed cuz that's what you do when you 19:17 grow up in violence too You do everything you can to make yourself as small as 19:22 possible And then I was a bed wetter and then add adding the poverty 19:28 with that it just felt wrong If I did 19:34 have a call to adventure it would be to find 19:41 self-love to find some to find God who can put the deusex machina That's what 19:49 they call it in Greek tragedy the god from the machine that would pluck characters out of a play And when they 19:55 pluck them out of the play it was a sign that they were dead But I just wanted to 20:01 be I wanted God to appear to tell me that I was made with love 20:11 or some level of purpose cuz I didn't see any evidence of it None I don't know 20:18 if God appeared but Cesaly Tyson in the autobiography of Miss Jane Pitman did 20:25 appear Yes And she did come down Yes And pluck you Yes 1974 Yes You and your 20:33 family crowding around the TV Yes What happened 20:39 You know what It's that emoji I don't That emoji I I'm using it more now The 20:44 emoji where the brain is being blown to bits That's what it was It was the emoji 20:50 where it was a God moment It was a sermon on the mount It was the burning bush as Elizabeth Gilbert would say It's 20:58 one of those moments where you know the wind stopped blowing because what I saw 21:05 was magic I saw excellence and I saw it in a body 21:11 of a woman who looked like me who really looked like my mom My mom and her very 21:16 very similar And I saw evidence of what I wanted to become and that scene that you 21:23 just read from Yeah In the bathroom disassociating elevating some kind of 21:29 magic trick in that leaving your body becoming somebody else Yeah Do you think that paired with Miss Tyson's work were 21:37 the early foundations for you as a young actor 21:42 Absolutely But there was a lot of early foundations Miss Tyson was one of them 21:48 My sister Diane was one of them Mr Yates my drama teacher was one of them Mr Aces 21:55 who was the head of the glee club was one of them My sister Dolores the birth 22:00 of my sister Danielle who I loved more than anything uh you know on the planet 22:07 All of those were signs that carried me carried you 22:12 to Rhode Island College Having participated in the Upwardbound 22:18 program in high school I heard you used to tell people acting is not what I do 22:24 it's who I am Oh my god I take that back 22:29 I take that back a little bit It is what I do But but at the time it was true At the time it was true because it was 22:36 healing And there's one performance that's not in your memoir Yeah That I think really represents your commitment 22:44 to becoming an actor I don't know if you know what I'm going to say Oh my god I I hope you're not going to say something 22:49 bad but no such thing At some point during college or maybe a little after college you performed this onewoman show 22:58 as musician at a Jones all across Rhode Island You wore a blue dress I don't 23:04 know if it was as blue as that in the performance And you even did the show once at a basketball court Yep Where one 23:12 person was in the audience People were playing basketball and I think there was a dog Yep That jumped on me Tell me 23:18 about this performance It was horrible First of all it was not a good performance But you know what I 23:25 say that with great pride Mhm Cisoretta Jones She's a opera singer out of Rhode 23:31 Island I think in the 19 turn of the 20th century which I can't even sing And 23:38 I think I sang 14 songs I was told you were going to sing a couple of them for us today My god No But you know you know 23:46 what though Here's the thing You really do learn through 23:52 failure You really do Because I remember my sisters came to see it and they were 23:58 like "That was awful." They said "Did you even hear yourself?" I mean it was 24:04 awful And I remember I felt so bad But here's the thing I got up and I did it 24:11 again And it was still bad but a little bit better And then I did it again 24:17 And I did it again And I think that what happens with all of that 24:26 is by the time I got to the final performance it was a final performance where it was just an audience of one and 24:33 it was greatly improved Was that at the basketball court No the basketball court was maybe four people Okay The final 24:41 performance was one person And if you're willing to go through the 24:48 pain and work with fear I think there's some beautiful discoveries 24:54 there And the beautiful discovery I made is I had it in 25:00 me I had the tools to live better to work myself through failure It wasn't 25:06 the performance that mattered That's just a cosmic carrot It's the journey in 25:11 taking out everything that I had within me to keep 25:17 going And for me that's proof positive 25:22 of God's love I call it God's love for me because he gave me the courage to 25:27 know that there was something even better with even within a performance that probably I wasn't even right for 25:35 I love that story and I don't know it's not in the book but I I love that story because if you're going to do it you're 25:43 going to do it anywhere anytime for anyone at any place at a basketball 25:49 court dog barking people playing pickup in the background even in a blue silk 25:54 dress That's you either do or don't It's 25:59 the doing it that's the beauty of it In many ways it's the only thing that really matters That's it Do you show up 26:06 Show up You showed up to um your audition to Giuliard and said "Um I have 26:14 45 minutes for this audition." Uh-huh Is that true That is true And they said 26:19 "What?" They said "Um the first You 26:24 audition a lot at Jiuliard It has a at the time it had a 3% um acceptance rate 26:30 So the first room I auditioned and it I was so nervous at the time but I said "I 26:36 only have 45 minutes I have to get back to the theater in Providence I have to get on the train It's 4-hour trip." And 26:42 so they talked amongst themselves after seeing my audition And then they stopped 26:47 all the auditions that they had There were like it seemed like hundreds of kids there and they took all their 26:53 chairs All of the teachers took all their chairs into the big big um it was 27:00 a it was a rehearsal room It was the biggest think room 103 I remember the room 103 They took all their chairs in 27:08 there because in in at Giuliard you audition for a different set of teachers like maybe five auditions You're there 27:15 all day sometimes two or three days So all of them took their chairs into one room to see me and I knew I had gotten 27:23 in You know what I what I miss about myself at that 27:29 time I'm just thinking about this that I knew that I knew that I knew 27:36 that I was good I think that as you get go along the 27:43 imposttor syndrome can take over more and that's because you're exposed to the 27:49 world and no one could tell you the sort of hyperbiblical level of confidence you 27:55 need when when when you're at that level of your profession You know you almost 28:02 have to have an arrogant level of confidence which I do not have But at 28:07 that point I knew I was good I knew I 28:13 was going to get in I I just did And there's something about that that I miss 28:19 I could take a sliver of that now So you're saying the performer that was in 28:26 $50,000 of college debt was more confident than EGOT winner 28:33 Viola Davis Yeah What the hell does that mean When I say 28:39 confident too is you always want to be better Okay you do I'm contradicting 28:47 myself a little bit What I'm about to say I'm I'm not mad at the imposttor 28:53 syndrome I think that people I think it's um underrated actually 29:01 Okay But at the time I didn't even have imposttor syndrome I just knew that I 29:06 knew that I knew that I was great I did Now that the world has gotten to me it's 29:12 like oh I could have been better Oh you know this Oh you know yeah I got the he got but you know I could have done this 29:18 better I could have done that better Now Viola herself which is different than 29:23 Viola younger Now this is not the work This is just me 29:30 Way more self-love Mhm Those are two different things That's the trade-off Yeah At Giuliard what was the objective 29:38 of their training Were they shaping you into a good actress or a perfect white actress Definitely a perfect white 29:46 actress And what does that look like What it looks like it's technical training in order to deal with the 29:52 classics in order to deal with the Stinbergs and the O'Neals and the check 29:57 offs and the Shakespeare I totally understand that to get your voice everything and but what it denies is the 30:05 human being behind all of that I feel that as a black actress I'm always being 30:13 tasked to show that I have range by doing white 30:18 work So if I can master I don't know Blanch Dubois in Tennessee Williams you 30:25 know street car named Desire which I'd love to see by the way I would love to see it too I did it in class once I 30:31 listen and listen I could do the best I can with Tennessee Williams but he writes for fragile white 30:38 women Beautiful work but it's it's not me or do a fabulous job playing I don't 30:45 know Hermione in Winter's Tale in Shakespeare but we don't put those same 30:51 parameters on white actors You know you can have a white actress who's 54 55 30:57 years old which is a great age to play Mama in Raising the Sun 31:02 Is she going to be able to pull off Mama and Raising the Sun Is she going to be able to pull off Bonita Is she going to 31:08 be able to pull off Molly in Joe Turner's Come and Gone when Molly says I ain't going south and make me believe it 31:16 They don't have to do that So for those four years at Giuliard all the white actor has to do is play all white 31:25 characters That's not me Me I'm tasked to only do 31:31 the classics and no black um writer is included in those classics And then once 31:37 I leave Giuliard guess what Most of what I will be asked to do 31:44 are black characters which people will not feel that I am black enough So then 31:50 I'm caught in a quagmire this sort of in between place of of sort of not 31:57 understanding how to use myself as the canvas 32:03 Giuliard It was an out-of- body experience because once again I did not 32:08 think that I could use me Me needed to be left at the front door Even though me 32:14 was what got me in there you was what also delivered you to the work of August 32:21 Wilson Yes When you leave college speaking of a playright that's not often 32:26 taught Yeah in school People know you from Fences Mahraini King Henley II but 32:36 your first Tony nomination came from your turn in Seven Guitars Yes Um in the 32:42 mid '9s I think it was Yes But on the subject of 32:47 whiteness was there a Q&A you had after one performance where there was a certain 32:54 response from someone that that made you that opened your eyes to to the 32:59 conditions in which you were working Yes It was in San Francisco at ACT You mean 33:05 liberal San Francisco Liberal San Francisco You know sometimes the liberal or you 33:11 know conservative is just a mask for um something else But um it was after a 33:19 performance and one of the um audience members raised their hand and said "Why 33:25 should we care about Floyd school boy Barton which is the main subject the 33:31 character in Seven Guitars who's a blues singer who's just come out of jail He comes out of jail He makes a hit He has 33:38 a hit record and he's about to be um he's about to be famous and he gets 33:43 killed It's a tragedy And in the end this audience member said "I didn't feel 33:49 anything Why should we care about him?" Uh was he famous It's not like he's BB 33:55 King you know Um so why should we care about him He's not in the history books 34:01 He's not in the history books And for me that's something deeper It's a huge 34:07 problem I have with narratives What is it I think that people have a hard time 34:12 sitting with a black character for 2 hours whether it's in a movie or whether it's in a play I think they're okay with 34:20 it if it's an allegory if we're not really representing a human 34:26 being okay If we're representing an idea maybe they will maybe they'll carry it 34:32 okay because then they can be they can look at it academically They can attach it to a politic or something Absolutely 34:39 Right Um maybe they could do it if it's not deep if it's maybe a 34:46 comedy but to have someone sit with you like you would in All My 34:54 Sons Death of a Salesman you know there is a sort of 34:59 bering for our worth in narratives that if I made it into a 35:05 history book then I can know as maybe someone white I'll know that you're 35:13 worthy of my time in the theater Me being worthy of anyone's time in the 35:19 theater is me breathing Tony Morrison coined the 35:25 phrase the white gaze And the reason why she coined it is because she said every 35:31 time she pen to paper she had an imaginary white character on her shoulder that kept saying "Write for me 35:38 Make me understand it I don't understand it Make me understand it." 35:43 And so she felt that every time she read any work even if it were The Invisible 35:49 Man or Frederick Douglas's autobiography she said the reason why she knew it 35:54 wasn't written for her is because they were explaining things that you wouldn't have to explain to her 36:01 Okay She even felt that Frederick Douglas was holding something back when she got her first review for Schula in 36:07 New York Times a glowing review but the one aspect of the review that really 36:13 threw her was the writer said she could be brilliant if she only had white 36:18 characters in it M I want to be seen as human as human as fragile as messy as 36:27 much of a paradox as any character in Tennessee Williams or Anton Czechov or 36:33 Eugene O'Neal And I think that I want you to sit with 36:38 me even if I have five minutes of a silent moment because of what is 36:44 happening in my life As author Miller said in view from the bridge about Eddie 36:51 he's like he may be a despicable character but something is happening to 36:57 him and attention needs to be made Attention needs to be made with us I'm 37:03 many things beyond my blackness Your artistry 37:08 in that play Seven Guitars I never got to see it I think I was three or four at 37:15 the time Yeah 37:22 Parents could have taken me maybe Yeah exactly Um I want to hold like how you saw your purpose and your artistry in 37:29 that moment working long long hours in these theater productions that were paying you okay but you know can't buy 37:38 home And to do that um I want to set up a scene Mhm in the play which is set in 37:44 a Pittsburgh tenement in 1948 where you play Vera the sometimes 37:49 girlfriend to the 1940s blues musician Floyd who's trying in this scene to 37:55 desperately get Vera back Yeah In the production you played Vera Mhm And um I 38:01 think it was Keith David Keith David Yeah Who played Floyd But I'd like to swap roles for today and um see if we 38:08 can read this scene together Um okay here we go 38:16 doing a scene opposite of you as someone who's not an actor is um horrifying 38:26 Uh thankfully this is mostly you talking in this scene Yeah And I'm playing Floyd I mean Okay Ready 38:34 I want to say yeah but what am I saying yeah to Another heartache Another time for you to walk out the door with 38:40 another woman You was there too Vera You had a hand in 38:46 whatever it was Maybe all the times we don't know the effect of what we do but we cause 38:51 what happens to us Sometimes even in little ways we can't see I went up to Chicago with Pearl 38:58 Brown cuz she was willing to believe that I could take her someplace she wanted to go that I could give her 39:05 things that she wanted to have She told me by that it was possible Even 39:12 sometimes when you question yourself when you wonder can you really make the music work for you Can you find a way to 39:18 get it out into the world so it can burst in the air and have it mean something to 39:23 somebody She didn't know if I could do that if I could have a hit record but 39:29 she was willing to believe it Maybe it was selfish of her Maybe she believed for all the wrong reasons But that gave 39:35 me a chance to try So yeah I took it It wasn't easy I was scared But when them 39:41 red lights came on in that recording studio it was like a bell ringing in the boxing match And I did it I reached down 39:49 inside me and I pulled out whatever was there I did like my mama told me I did my best And I figured nobody could fault 39:56 me for that Then when they didn't release the record Pearl Brown left She thought she had believed wrong 40:04 I don't fault her for that But I never lost a belief in myself Then when they released the 40:11 record I realized I didn't have nothing but a hit record I come back to you figuring you 40:17 couldn't say no to a man who had got a hit record but you did And that made me see that you wanted more than Pearl 40:24 Brown I'm here saying I can give it to you Try me one more time and I'll never jump 40:32 back on you in life I got to thinking and I went down to the Greyhound bus station 40:39 too Here See that See what does that say It 40:44 says one way Chicago to Pittsburgh It's good for one year from date to purchase 40:50 I'm going to put that in my shoe When we get to Chicago I'm going to walk around on it I hope I never have to use it 40:58 Well that's all right I forgot all about that scene I 41:04 can tell one person has won a Tony Award Oh in this conversation 41:11 did the music begin to work for you Did it burst into the air into the 41:17 world when you got the role in Doubt Oh most 41:23 definitely That's when it burst in the air because I love that description of art I I think that's I love that line I 41:30 try to use it all the time and I always misquote it You can take that with you today 41:37 cuz that's what you want with your art You want it to mean something to someone 41:42 Authur Miller says it I write so people can feel less alone 41:49 I mean I think that there's probably a lot of young actors coming up now who just want the awards and they want the 41:55 money Um but really a true artist wants it to 42:00 sort of burst in the air and they want it to sort of shift people shift how you 42:07 think about yourself and the world I mean that's the goal It's a lofty 42:15 goal but it's a goal nevertheless You wrote a 100page biography for that 42:20 character in doubt Yeah A character that appears in the movie for less than 10 minutes Yeah Tell me how you go about 42:28 unpacking a character like that Before you go unpack how you go about unpacking any character from that period 42:35 onward I will say that one of the things that I always do is first of all they 42:41 say in acting you have to be an observer and a thief The observing part comes from life and 42:48 the thief probably comes from looking at other actors work but the observing I 42:53 always have to think of something in my life that I can compare it to I was lost 43:00 because I didn't understand the woman who would allow her son to stay with a man that she that could possibly be 43:07 molesting him and just say at least he's mentoring him when his father all the 43:15 father does is beat him I just didn't understand that I felt it was uh too 43:21 stark too allegorical I I I didn't get it 43:27 What happens for me is when I get a character the reason why I write is the more I write I think I can unlock 43:34 something What's their favorite color What's their first memory Now if it's written within an inch of its life a lot 43:40 of times it's already in there I only had 8 minutes so I had to make up something And then I ask people 43:46 questions of course because what I need to find out is what is the driving need 43:52 in their life What do they live for Do they want to be 43:58 loved Do they want to have control And I remember um an acting 44:04 teacher of mine cuz I I I kept trying to figure out and one of the things she said is Biola maybe she leaves her son 44:13 in that situation Here's a big aha moment because she has no choice 44:21 What are you telling me 44:28 I'm talking about the boy's nature now not anything he's 44:35 done You can't hold a child responsible for what God gave him to be 44:42 I'm only interested in actions Mrs Miller But then there's the boy's nature 44:48 Leave that out of it Forget it then You want forcing people to say 44:58 things My boy came to your school cuz they were going to kill him in a public 45:05 school His father don't like him He come to your school kids don't 45:10 like him One man is good to him this priest Then does a man have his reasons 45:19 Yes Everybody does You have your reasons but do I ask the man why he's good to my 45:29 son No I don't care 45:39 why My son needs some man to care about 45:45 him and to see him through the way he wants to go And thank God this educated man with 45:52 some kindness in him wants to do just that This will not do It's just till 45:57 June I'll throw your son out of this school Why would you do that if it didn't start with him Because I will 46:03 stop this You'd hurt my son to get your way It won't end with your son Throw the priest out then I am trying to do just 46:11 that Then what do you want from me Merryill Streep your co-star said the 46:17 director made you go back and reshoot that scene re-shoot the next day again 46:23 and again and again and again Mhm And I wonder did that 46:29 repetition how did you use that How did you continue doing that scene over and 46:34 over Because just doing it once seems like it would take a whole lifetime to 46:39 produce that kind of work Well um that's my theater training I've done plays for 46:45 over a year again and again and again I've done four-hour plays I've done one woman shows I have over a 40-year career 46:53 So he could have done it 50 times and I would have been able to do it over and over again And you were unflapable in 47:00 that I was pretty unflapable You know what I'm an actor who stays in 47:05 my lane What does that mean I'm not trying to be like anyone else 47:12 I wasn't trying to be like Adrien Lennox who you know who auditioned for the part She auditioned for the part and she was 47:19 you know she originated the part Fantastic actor Great I'm not trying to 47:24 be like anyone else I'm just trying to do what I do And um I did not see it did 47:32 not throw me And I didn't have enough experience in my life up until that time to have 47:40 the sort of wisdom for it to throw me I just thought that this is just what 47:45 people do when they do a scene with Meryill Street It goes incredibly well 47:51 You receive an Oscar nomination In the aftermath you talked earlier about 47:56 getting to a place on How to Get Away with Murder where you had that crisis of 48:02 faith a little bit Yeah Yeah And I'm curious in How to Get Away with Murder and In Widows Um you said both 48:09 Shondaanda Rimes and Steve McQueen saw something in me that other filmmakers did not Mhm What did they see an 48:18 explorer that the industry seemed to be ignoring They saw me as a woman 48:26 Usually I'm just seen as mama you know with no sexuality with no 48:37 mess Yeah They saw me as a woman and they saw me as a complicated 48:42 woman And um I think notoriously women who look like me are seen limited like 48:48 that And we always have to bear the weight and the responsibility of it Like why don't you lose some weight wanted to 48:55 make your voice higher wanted to do something different with your hair As if your worth and your personage should be 49:03 bothered Our job as artists is to show you hum a 49:10 human being Human beings are vast It's only in 49:16 movie and TV land where only the guy the guy who gets the girl the girl always 49:23 has to look cute the first scene If the guy is cute the woman has got to be cute 49:28 If if there is a great best friend then she's usually overweight She's really 49:33 really funny And my thing that's not my world I don't understand that world The 49:39 world is way more vast than that And it's our job to be the conduit to bring 49:46 the audience that truth And I think that's what Shondaanda Rimes and that's what um and Pete Noalk who is a 49:54 showrunner of uh was the showrunner of How to Get Away with Murder and Steve McQueen saw in me What did it feel like 50:00 to be seen Feels free 50:05 man You know when other people see you then it forces you to see 50:11 yourself You know after a while when a culture defines you um your family 50:18 defines you you become trapped in definition and 50:25 labels Somewhere in there is you You know you're in there somewhere but you 50:30 don't even know who you are anymore You sort of filter it into a 50:36 profession in order to get the job And then all of who you are gets 50:42 sort of left in a room somewhere because it you feel like it has to look 50:48 a certain way No it doesn't Sanford Meisner says the most 50:54 important question an actor can ask is why I'm going to redefine that question 51:01 I think the most important question anyone can ask is why And then when you 51:06 get to the end of why the most really powerful question you can ask is why not 51:13 Why can't I be the weight I am now Why can't I have muscular arms Why can't I 51:20 have a deep voice Why can't I be a love interest Why do I have to be 35 Why 51:27 can't you be that confident performer that you were at Giuliard 51:33 Well the world hadn't gotten to me yet Yes Okay So now it's gotten to you Now 51:38 the world has gotten to me This is what it looks like to be got to Yes This is what it looks like to be got to I tell 51:43 you it looks pretty damn good Well well thank you very much But what I needed to do is press the pause button and work on 51:52 the other part of me You know the thing about it is I I 51:58 remember every time I would do a really great performance I would feel so jazzed and so happy and then go 52:05 home And Viola didn't feel like anything if she wasn't working If she wasn't on 52:11 stage doing a monologue that made everybody cry and stand up and throw flowers then she was worthless 52:20 And as soon as I stepped off the stage it was like unplugging a phone or and and the phone losing its 52:29 charge The rest of my life looked like a wasteland And I've realized once again 52:37 is the reason why I wanted to be a great actress is because I just wanted to be 52:45 somebody But that ain't it It's just not 52:51 it And I think you know Joseph Campbell talks about slaying dragons and going 52:58 out there and with mentors and allies and then you finally get to that inmost 53:03 cave where you come face to face not with God but with yourself 53:11 And what I realize is I was always worthy 53:17 I didn't have to do anything for that It's not the power cord 53:23 anymore It's just not So what is I'm the power 53:31 cord I am Every single day when I wake up and 53:36 put my feet on the floor my job is to not betray myself 53:42 Acting is just one aspect of who I am And every single time I betray myself 53:49 that's it It's like I've unplugged myself once again It's what gives my life meaning which by the way what gives 53:57 my life meaning is my story Completely embracing 54:02 it you know I'm worthy Who knew I didn't 54:08 think that I I my big thing is okay the bed wetter B viola who would chuck a 54:14 finger all the time and call people [ __ ] [ __ ] at six years old It was the hardest sentence to write in 54:20 the book by the way No one wanted me to open the book with [ __ ] [ __ ] were my favorite words when 54:26 I was growing up But I wanted to capture little Viola Little Viola was fantastic 54:37 She did not betray herself ever She was extremely 54:45 inappropriate She was extremely rough around the edges She 54:54 smelled She was unruly She had three pink slips and four 55:00 white slips Disciplinary action and you know and every single day was in 55:08 detention But she was Viola She was alive And every single time I feel like 55:15 I have to go back to heal her she's sitting on some bench somewhere imaginary bench saying "You don't have 55:21 to heal me I'm perfectly fine I'm waiting for you to heal yourself so we can just sit and just squeal about this 55:27 freaking life that we both created because I'm the one who got thrust out 55:33 into the world and and let other people get at me Your husband said Viola is 55:39 never far away from that little girl she talks about She's never forgot her Yeah 55:45 You think he's right Oh absolutely You know what When I think 55:50 about her it's the only thing that really makes me enjoy my life What What 55:57 do you mean Because it gives me perspective I talk about my therapist 56:02 who you know who said you know when I said I got to you know it's my job to 56:08 heal this little girl because she was really traumatized cuz the violence in the house he was like why I thought she 56:14 was pretty brave Mhm She she she got it done It's a 55 Maybe it was 55 56:20 55year-old Viola that needs help I was like "Excuse me I'm evolved." He was 56:26 like "Let her squeal." You know they say that only two people 56:32 you only anything is six-year-old self and your 80-year-old self 56:37 You know I do And I only have two questions left for us because then we got to go Okay But speaking of 56:44 perspective um in 2008 around doubt when most people were introduced 56:50 to you and your artistry you were 43 years old then Mhm And you did this 56:57 interview on NPR where they asked you about recognition Does it mean anything now 57:03 that you've received the Oscar nomination And I just want to listen to what you said back then This is you back 57:11 in 2008 I don't care what they say The bottom line is they want to do something that 57:16 moves people that affects them in some way or else what you do is kind of 57:22 meaningless So when you get all the buzz and the reaction you know it's hitting 57:28 someone The part that means nothing is the part that hasn't translated into 57:35 anything tangible Buzz doesn't pay the mortgage Buzz doesn't you know buzz is 57:43 buzz And it's also what you don't really do the project for And I always kind of 57:50 feel you know it's just me It's once again they're going to find me out They're building me up just to knock me 57:56 down You know that's the part that doesn't mean anything because you know what At the end of the day you got to 58:01 keep working I am a theater trained actress I'm not a fluke I'm not a body 58:09 I'm not a face I'm an actor I want to be able to do what Helen Mirren Merill Stre 58:16 all of them are doing That is my dream 17 years later as you turn 60 this 58:24 year it's getting deep Is that you say "I'm not a fluke I'm not a 58:31 body I'm not a face." Right I'm an actor Mhm 58:37 to say that in that moment after all that you had been through to get to that 58:43 performance in doubt Yeah To stand on that and to know then 58:48 I guess now that you have lived up to everything that you said you wanted to do 58:54 there What is the dream for you Two 58:59 things I'm always trying to find home Mhm You know I tell my daughter all the time 59:06 I give her that quote you know how silly of me that I did not know that I was the love of my 59:12 life I'm beginning to understand that So that number one Number 59:18 two it's my job in life because we will be no more 59:26 It's coming and we don't know when it's coming It's It's some deep [ __ ] out there But here's the thing I see life as 59:33 a relay race I do I do see it where you see a relay 59:39 race and you see all the great runners Each one that runs their leg of the race is a great runner in and of themselves 59:46 So you're passing the baton I'm passing the baton man to the next great runner 59:51 I need to leave something in people I do And you have that dash of time to be 59:58 able to do it to be able to make that change And I think that that pretty much the 1:00:04 the twofold of loving oneself and leaving something behind 1:00:10 that's what makes a life And Lamont writes "You can either leave something for people or you can leave something in 1:00:17 people." And when you leave something in them it burns like an ember It does It's it's it 1:00:25 burns forever You have a lot of people like Anton Czechov said who are living 1:00:30 lives in quiet desperation And all of us can be healers if we choose whatever we 1:00:38 choose we choose as an elixir to heal You could be fabulous at 1:00:45 what you're doing You can even make a lot of money doing it But ultimately if the goal is not for it to burst into the 1:00:53 air and have it mean something to someone then you're not doing anything 1:00:59 Your elixir since time immemorial was observation Has been 1:01:05 observation And my last question for us cuz we had to go Yeah Can you tell me 1:01:11 about as an observer and thief and actor that woman on the 1:01:17 corner standing in the freezing cold weather Mhm That you saw as a 1:01:27 child I think the one reason why I became an actor is because I see her And 1:01:33 who is she Oh she's everything 1:01:38 She's a little girl who played with Barbie dolls who wanted to be somebody 1:01:44 She's probably someone who had a really deep laugh She's someone who probably fell in 1:01:51 love with everything in her being and maybe got her heart broken She's someone who's worthy of 1:01:59 love belonging I see her And I think that's why I 1:02:06 became an artist is because I see her When you saw her where was she at She's 1:02:12 so many people growing up in Central Falls on Dexter Street on Broad Street 1:02:18 you know with the cigarette and and and the bad skin The bloodshot eyes The bloodshot eyes The dirty sneakers Dirty 1:02:25 sneakers The corduroy coats Corduroy coat You know that with the fall fur and the inside and and the jeans that don't 1:02:31 fit I think that by the time she makes it to the screen she's been so filtered down into a version um acceptable 1:02:39 version of herself And I think that when you water her down into an acceptable version of herself you're telling her 1:02:46 that you don't love her You're telling her that you're not meeting her where she is I meet people 1:02:53 where they are If if a role calls for me take my wig off or to have no makeup or to have snot 1:03:01 coming out of my nose because that's who the person is then I am honoring their truth It's that that's reconciling 1:03:08 little Viola Little Viola who went to school whose teacher said "You got to go home 1:03:14 because you you smell so bad." You 1:03:20 know I didn't feel worthy because I felt like I had to filter myself down I had 1:03:26 to go through a machine of worthiness And worthiness is nothing to be bartered 1:03:31 with It's asis You are worthy as is right now As 1:03:39 my daughter said when she saw this homeless man in Chicago it was at the last day of widows She was 6 years old 1:03:47 and we were in the car getting ready to go back to the trailer It was over And she said 1:03:54 "Oh look at that homeless man Look at mama He's dirty and he 1:04:02 probably smells bad Oh my god." And then there was a big pause and she said "But he's my brother 1:04:14 God says he's my brother And I think that's the most beautiful 1:04:21 transcendent part of being an actor is that when you meet people where they are 1:04:28 and you channel them where they are they become your 1:04:34 brother We're wired for connection And sometimes for me that's where I got it 1:04:40 from in my art And it's been my honor to do that And 1:04:46 sometimes even if I'm I fail at least that was the objective to see the 1:04:51 invisible Yes To recreate them and make them present and visible to all of us 1:04:56 Absolutely Well I um I hope you haven't been watered down or filtered in this 1:05:03 conversation No it's been fantastic Hope none of it gets me in trouble But you 1:05:09 know what Here's the thing You know it's like John Lewis says "Maybe I'll get into some good trouble." I I I I wish 1:05:14 that for us both Yes And and speaking of the work how it lives in me and I know 1:05:20 so many people listening Mhm Thank you 1:05:27 Thank you Thank you I appreciate that Mhm Viola 1:05:33 Davis appreciate you coming in Thank you Thank you for having me 1:05:43 [Music]

Red Rum born 1965 irish legend, love Red Rum, my second favorite horse behind aristides. Aintree legend streetart 1973 won 1974 won 1975 second won by L'escargot 1976 second won by Rag Trade 1977 won https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Rum

First Kentucky derby held 1875 The Colt's name is Aristides newspaper clipping [ The Tennessean Nashville, Tennessee • Thu, May 11, 1876 Page 1 ] https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-tennessean-aristides-breaks-record-f/148895858/ info https://www.espn.com.sg/sports/horse/news/story?id=5086727 Aristides: The first Derby winner Terry Conway Apr 14, 2010, 11:51 PM H. P. McGrath was a barroom brawler who worked his way up from crooked dice games in his native Kentucky to owning posh gambling parlors in New Orleans and New York City. Cashing in his massive profits in 1867, McGrath returned to Lexington as a member of the landed gentry. He built his lordly estate McGrathiana on the crest of a hill a few miles outside town. Breeding, racing, and betting topflight thoroughbreds would dominate the rest of his life. Henry Price McGrath also gained immortality. His blood-red chestnut colt Aristides will forever be remembered in racing history as the first Kentucky Derby winner. The burly Irishman also threw the biggest parties in town. Each spring and fall on the Sunday before the opening of the race meetings, McGrath hosted lavish burgoo feasts. In May of 1875 the carriages of McGrath's racing friends swept up the twisting drive. Under a grove of locust trees at half-past one the feast commenced. First came the burgoo (a sumptuous beef stew) and burgundy, followed by roast dishes of mutton, goat and pig while the champagne and bourbon flowed. Afterwards McGrath paraded the leading lights of his stable before guests on the lawn. Eastern champions Tom Bowling and Susan Ann drew great applause. Not so for Aristides. His heroics were still a day away. Monday May 17 saw most businesses in Louisville shuttered by noon. Merchants realized the lion's share of the money exchanging hands would be at the new racetrack south of town. The previous summer one of the town's leading socialites, Colonel Meriwether Lewis Clark, button- holed 320 of his friends to pony up funds to build the track on 80 acres he leased from his uncle, John Churchill. On that sun-splashed day, streams of Louisvillians rode mule-drawn streetcars down Fourth Street departing for an easy walk to the site of the Louisville Jockey Club. Others arrived on foot or in wagons brimming with race fans. Fringe-topped buggies and handsom carriages led by brilliant teams of hackneys all made their way to the racecourse. Rich gentlemen wore silk hats and fine clothes, while pretty ladies in colorful dresses carrying parasols filled the boxes of the grandstand. Working men in straw hats and shirtsleeves got their first glimpse of the big city.Some paid two dollars for a badge that let them watch near the rail in the home stretch, others trooped into the infield and settled on their patch of grass. As the Derby 2:30 p.m. post time approached, more than 10,000 roamed the grounds. McGrath owned the favorite, a stout and spirited bay colt named Chesapeake. In addition, Aristides was entered as the "rabbit" to soften up the field. "Risty" was a pint size (a little over 15 hands) colt with a white star on his forehead and white socks on his hind legs. Possessing plenty of "bone and substance," as a two-year old Aristides captured three of nine races. Richly bred, the colt was sired by imported English stallion Leamington out of dam Sarong, also by Leamington. His bloodlines traced back to the greats — Glencoe, Sir Archy and Diomed. Frank B. Harper's Ten Broeck turned up for the Derby that bettors considered a "mile-and-a-quarter dash." A week earlier Ten Broeck dominated the field (including Aristides) in the two-mile Phoenix Hotel Stakes in Lexington and would go on to reign as one of the turf's all-time long distance runners. The bugle sounded playing "Boots and Saddles," and 15 three-year old colts jogged onto the track in single file. Parading past the judge's stand Aristides tossed his head following a lad on a lead pony. He sported a saddle blanket "as green as the grass of Erin" bound with a bright orange stripe. In one corner big orange letters spelled "McGrathiana" and in the other "Aristides." The topnotch broadcloth was a gift from Aristides Welch of Philadelphia, the celebrated owner of Leamington. The gregarious Irishman had named the compact colt for his friend. A line was drawn in the dirt and the horses stood to start the race. In unison with the rat-tat-tat of a drummer's beat, Colonel William Johnson dropped the flag. The horses sprang into action. McCreery jumped to the lead, stalked by Volcano and Aristides. McGrath's Chesapeake was one of the last away. As they hit the backstretch Aristides surged to the lead with four horses in close pursuit. Favored Chesapeake was stuck in mid-pack. As they rounded the far turn jockey Oliver Lewis — following McGrath's instructions — began to pull back on the chestnut colt a bit to make way for Chesapeake's run to glory. Then Oliver glanced over to the rail at the head of the stretch where McGrath waved his hat frantically and shouted "go on and win it." Aristides sped to the lead and held off a pair of challengers, dashed under the wire and won by two lengths earning a purse of $2,850. His time of 2:37 ¾ was the fastest ever recorded at the distance for a three-year old. The Louisville Courier-Journal reported: "It is the gallant Aristides, heir to a mighty name, that strides with sweeping gallop toward victory … And the air trembles and vibrates again with the ringing cheers that followed." Epilogue Arisitides' trainer Ansel Williams and jockey Oliver Lewis were both African-Americans, a group who played a critical role in shaping early American racing history. A total of 14 of the 15 riders in the first Kentucky Derby were African-American, with African-American jockeys winning 15 of the initial 28 runnings. Born a slave, Williamson was purchased by Robert A. Alexander, the owner of the famous Woodburn Stud in 1864 where Williamson worked as a trainer and breeder. Following Alexander's death in 1867, Williamson went on to train many great horses including Tom Bowling, who won 14 of his 17 races. Williamson won major races such as the Travers Stakes, the Jerome Handicap, and the Wither Stakes and was inducted into the Racing Hall of Fame in 1998. Jockey Oliver Lewis is less well known. Born in Fayette County, Ky., Lewis was 19 when he won the 1875 Kentucky Derby. He never rode in another Derby. Instead, he became a successful bookmaker (then a legal enterprise) and wrote detailed handicapping charts similar to what appears in today's Daily Racing Form. Lewis was said to be a good family man who raised six children. He died in 1924, and is buried in Lexington. Henry Price McGrath trained as a tailor before pursuing the quick riches as a gambler and bookmaker. He spent a year in a federal jail in New Orleans for fleecing hard spending Union soldiers. His opulent mansion at McGrathiana was fashioned after the United States Hotel in Saratoga Springs. At his New York gambling house he won $105,000 in a single night. Reportedly, McGrath never had a bank account and had large sums of money, in gold and silver, buried on the farm. One of the most prominent turfmen of his era, he bred numerous brilliant runners, and declared Tom Bowling his greatest. A bachelor all his life, he died in July 1881 at a fashionable resort in Long Branch N. J. from a diseased liver and dropsy. McGrathiana was sold to Colonel Milton Young who continued the farm's tradition as a birthplace of champion racehorses. Sold again in 1915 to C. B. Shaffer of Chicago, the breeding establishment was renamed Coldstream Farm. Today, it is owned by the University of Kentucky. The Coldstream Research Campus is home to 1,000 employees working in biotech, pharmaceutical and equine-related companies. Aristides Boulevard runs alongside Coldwater Farm. The runner-up in the 1875 Belmont Stakes, Aristides was on the lead heading into the stretch when jockey Lewis put the chestnut colt under a fierce hold allowing stablemate Calvin to win. McGrath had placed a hefty bet on Calvin and took home a stunning $30,000. Aristides captured the Jerome Handicap, the Breckinridge, the Withers Stakes and triumphed in a match race over Ten Broeck. In 21 career starts (9-5-1) he earned $18,325, quite a fortune in the day. But with the Derby not yet a famed national event, breeders did not flock to his stable door. Aristides died at the age of 21 at the Fairgrounds of St. Louis. To honor his racing achievements Churchill Downs inaugurated the Aristides Stakes (sprint race) in 1988. The track also commissioned a life-sized bronze statue that now stands in the Clubhouse Gardens as a memorial to the "the little red horse." Terry Conway has been a regular contributor to The Blood-Horse magazine since 2003. He wrote a Sunday column on racing for several years for the Chester County (Pa.) daily newspaper and covers racing and the horse world for a number of regional magazines in the mid-Atlantic area. In addition, he has written many historical articles on the art world and business entrepreneurs for a variety of national and regional magazines. Contact Terry at tconway@terryconway.net Pedigree LINK PDF https://www.equineline.com/Free5XPedigreePdf.cfm?page_state=GENERATE&reference_number=5332901&registry=T&horse_name=Aristides&dam_name=Sarong&foaling_year=1872&NICKING_STATS_INDICATOR=Y&include_sire_line=Y&sire_reference_number=0&dam_reference_number=0&color=&sex=&hypo_foaling_year=&breeder=&sig=__NA The jockey's name is Oliver Lewis info https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/the-kentucky-derbys-forgotten-jockeys-128781428/ The Kentucky Derby’s Forgotten Jockeys African American jockeys once dominated the track. But by 1921, they had disappeared from the Kentucky Derby Lisa K. Winkler April 23, 2009 PHOTO ARTICLE CONTINUE James Winkfield was a two-time Kentucky Derby winner and raced across Europe after racism kept him from being the best athlete in America's most popular sport. Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation When tens of thousands of fans assemble in Louisville, Kentucky, for the Kentucky Derby, they will witness a phenomenon somewhat unusual for today’s American sporting events: of some 20 riders, none are African-American. Yet in the first Kentucky Derby in 1875, 13 out of 15 jockeys were black. Among the first 28 derby winners, 15 were black. African-American jockeys excelled in the sport in the late 1800s. But by 1921, they had disappeared from the Kentucky track and would not return until Marlon St. Julien rode in the 2000 race. African-American jockeys’ dominance in the world of racing is a history nearly forgotten today. Their participation dates back to colonial times, when the British brought their love of horseracing to the New World. Founding Fathers George Washington and Thomas Jefferson frequented the track, and when President Andrew Jackson moved into the White House in 1829, he brought along his best Thoroughbreds and his black jockeys. Because racing was tremendously popular in the South, it is not surprising that the first black jockeys were slaves. They cleaned the stables and handled the grooming and training of some of the country’s most valuable horseflesh. From such responsibility, slaves developed the abilities needed to calm and connect with Thoroughbreds, skills demanded of successful jockeys. For blacks, racing provided a false sense of freedom. They were allowed to travel the racing circuit, and some even managed their owners’ racing operation. They competed alongside whites. When black riders were cheered to the finish line, the only colors that mattered were the colors of their silk jackets, representing their stables. Horseracing was entertaining for white owners and slaves alike and one of the few ways for slaves to achieve status. After the Civil War, which had devastated racing in the South, emancipated African-American jockeys followed the money to tracks in New York, New Jersey and Pennsylvania. “African Americans had been involved in racing and with horses since the beginning,” says Anne Butler, director of Kentucky State University's Center for the Study of Kentucky African Americans. “By the time freedom came they were still rooted in the sport.” The freed riders soon took center stage at the newly organized Kentucky Derby. On opening day, May 17, 1875, Oliver Lewis, a 19-year-old black native Kentuckian, rode Aristides, a chestnut colt trained by a former slave, to a record-setting victory. Two years later William Walker, 17, claimed the race. Isaac Murphy became the first jockey to win three Kentucky Derbys, in 1884, 1890, and 1891, and won an amazing 44 percent of all the races he rode, a record still unmatched. Alonzo "Lonnie" Clayton, at 15 the youngest to win in 1892, was followed by James "Soup" Perkins, who began racing at age 11 and claimed the 1895 Derby. Willie Simms won in 1896 and 1898. Jimmy "Wink" Winkfield, victorious in 1901 and 1902, would be the last African American to win the world-famous race. Murphy, Simms and Winkfield have been inducted into the National Museum of Racing and Hall of Fame in Saratoga Springs, New York. In 2005, Winkfield was also honored with a Congressional House Resolution, a few days before the 131st Derby. Such accolades came long after his death in 1974 at age 91 and decades after racism forced him and other black jockeys off American racetracks. Despite Wink’s winning more than 160 races in 1901, Goodwin's Annual Official Guide to the Turf omitted his name. The rising scourge of segregation began seeping into horse racing in the late 1890s. Fanned by the Supreme Court's 1896 Plessy v. Ferguson ruling that upheld the "separate but equal" doctrine, Jim Crow injustice pervaded every social arena, says Butler. “White genteel class, remnants from that world, didn't want to share the bleachers with African American spectators, though blacks continued to work as groomers and trainers," she says. PHOTOS PHOTO INFO 1 James Winkfield retired from horse racing in 1930 after a career 2,600 wins. Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation 2 James Winkfield was a two-time Kentucky Derby winner and raced across Europe after racism kept him from being the best athlete in America's most popular sport. Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation 3 William Walker was already under contract at the age of 11 to an owner named Wood Stringfield and at the age of 13, he claimed a stakes victory. Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation 4 Oliver Lewis rode Aristides to victory in the inaugural Kentucky Derby. Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation 5 In 1892, Alonzo "Lonnie" Clayton became the youngest jockey to win the Kentucky Derby at the age of 15. Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation 6 At the age of 14, James "Soup" Perkins won the Latonia Oaks. The Times called him "the best lightweight jockey of the West." Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation 7 Isaac Murphy was one of America's first sports stars. At the age of 14, he rode his first race at Louisville in 1875. Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation 8 Willie Simms won the Kentucky Derby in 1896 and 1898. Simms also changed the sport of horse racing when he introduced the natural American riding style to England. Courtesy Kentucky Derby Museum / Kinetic Corporation ARTICLE CONTINUE Racism, coupled with the economic recessions of the period, shrunk the demand for black jockeys as racetracks closed and attendance fell. With intensified competition for mounts, violence on the tracks against black jockeys by white jockeys prevailed without recourse. Winkfield received death threats from the Ku Klux Klan. Anti-gambling groups campaigned against racing, causing more closures and the northern migration of blacks from southern farming communities further contributed to the decline of black jockeys. Winkfield dealt another serious blow to his career by jumping a contract. With fewer and fewer mounts coming his way, he left the United States in 1904 for Czarist Russia, where his riding skills earned him celebrity and fortune beyond his dreams. Fleeing the Bolshevik Revolution in 1917, he moved to France, raced for another decade and retired in 1930 after a career 2,600 wins. In 1940, Nazis seized his stables, causing Winkfield to return to States, where he signed on to a Works Progress Administration road crew. Back in France by 1953, he opened a training school for jockeys. In 1961, six decades after winning his first Kentucky Derby, Winkfield returned to Kentucky to attend a pre-Derby banquet. When he and his daughter Liliane arrived at Louisville's historic Brown Hotel, they were denied entry. After a long wait and repeated explanations that they were guests of Sports Illustrated, they were finally admitted. Wink died 13 years later in France. After his 1903 run in the Kentucky Derby, black Americans practically disappeared from Goodwin’s official list of jockeys. In 1911 Jess Conley came in third in the derby and in 1921, Henry King placed tenth. Seventy-nine years would pass before another African American would ride in the Derby. Marlon St. Julien took seventh place in 2000. "I'm not an activist,” says St. Julien, who admitted during an interview a few years ago that he didn’t know the history of black jockeys and “started reading up on it.” Reached recently in Louisiana, where he is racing the state circuit, he says “I hope I’m a role model as a rider to anyone who wants to race." Longtime equestrian and Newark, New Jersey, schoolteacher Miles Dean would agree that not enough is known about the nation’s great black jockeys. In an effort to remedy that, he has organized the National Day of the Black Jockey for Memorial Day weekend. The event will include educational seminars, a horse show, parade, and memorial tribute. All events will be held at the Kentucky Exposition Center in Louisville. Last year, Dean rode his horse, Sankofa, a 12-year-old Arabian stallion, in a six-month journey from New York to California. He spoke at colleges and communities to draw attention to African American contributions to the history and settlement of the United States. "As an urban educator I see every day the disconnect students have with their past. By acknowledging the contributions of African American jockeys, I hope to heighten children's awareness of their history. It's a history of great achievement, not just a history of enslavement.” buried https://web.archive.org/web/20160104062442/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2-7s95OJiM referral info Lexington Public Library presents an original documentary production on a historic African-American cemetery and the small band of Lexingtonians who have spent years restoring it. Thousands are buried at African Cemetery No. 2, including the winning jockey of the first Kentucky Derby, Oliver Lewis, a number of Buffalo Soldiers and a member of the Civil Wars's 54th Massachusetts Regiment. The 141-year-old cemetery was neglected and overgrown before volunteers began the work of restoring the grounds and gathering the life stories of those buried there. Produced by the LPL's Cable Channel 20. Edited and Directed by Thom Southerland. Photography by Thai Emmerich. VIDEO TRANSCRIPT 0:06 John Henry Clark who was a noted historian would be 90 some years old if he was still alive said this about 0:12 history he said that history is like a clock it tells of people the historical 0:18 time of day it tells where they've been where they are and where they yet still 0:24 have to go 1:03 African Cemetery number two earliest recorded Cemetery in Lexington to be 1:08 organized owned and managed by African-Americans the site has been in existence since 1869 trusties of 1:16 benevolent Society number two successfully operated Cemetery many individuals buried here were important 1:23 leaders in the community the people buried in that Cemetery are larg 1:30 the people who put a foundation for African-American communities in 1:37 lexingon following the Civil War and the story of these former 1:45 enslaved men and women after emancipation is just graphically told in 1:52 studying their lives they became the leaders the entrepreneurs the business 1:58 people the Civic organizers um they formed fraternal 2:04 organizations they were part of the Masons the col it fair the colored Oran home all of the all of these people are 2:12 buried in this Cemetery early church leaders who found it and organized some of the early churches in Lexington I 2:19 hold very strongly to a belief that when we do not know our history when we do 2:27 not have opportunities to learn about the 2:32 biographies of people who have gone before us then we lose 2:40 opportunities to understand fully who we came from and who we can 2:48 become there are stories here that have been long dormant it's an almost 2:55 forgotten chapter of of Lexington's history this is a spot where so much 3:01 National History is potentially located and yet it's not really well known about 3:07 uh is to me is is a shame and it it's something that needs to be better brought out I have tried to 3:17 unbe information about African-Americans and bring it to light 3:24 so that hopefully the full Kentucky narrative will be more inclusive of the 3:32 contributions that African-Americans have made that the cemetery has gone through so much 3:39 neglect you know renewal desecration vandalism and it's 3:44 still there it's just been amazing that it has survived I mean just truly cuz so 3:50 many cemeteries just get wiped away and this could have been one of them part of restoration is a 3:58 continuation of the work that has been laid here by our foreparents they're 4:05 taking the task to buy the land and create the cemetery was part of a larger 4:12 effort to create Community create a legacy create a safe 4:18 place for their children and their grandchildren and to know that this Cemetery holds their remains it also 4:25 holds their stories you cannot help but uncover their stories when you start 4:32 looking for their names this story out here on Seventh Street with all this 4:37 industry around us and all these railroad tracks is an important story as 4:42 any other story this is your story too whether you are African-American European American Latino um African 4:50 refugees whoever you are wherever you're from that this story is important to you 4:56 as well this story can inspire you 5:06 once you start working in a cemetery and finding the people that you find the 5:11 question is how did this come to 5:26 be in October 185 2 enslaved men 5:33 organized to help each other care for the sick bury the dead and perform other 5:40 acts of Charity this is before emancipation this is after the 1850 5:47 Slave Code law that required all states to identify any person they feel were 5:56 running away uh back at that time you didn't have things like Social Security 6:01 and insurance and stuff like that people banded together like this Cemetery was 6:07 started by Union benevolence Society number two and that was a group of people that banded together and they 6:13 would contribute to the welfare of the members of that Society that's it was sort of a self-help group that group was 6:20 made up of of freed people and enslave people how could people you who we said 6:27 were enslaved who mean couldn't read and couldn't write how could they come out of 6:33 emancipation and be able to buy land and create businesses and start schools 6:40 African-Americans were told yes you are free but you have no rights you know you 6:45 can't vote uh you can't testify in court uh you we don't recognize you as 6:52 having made contributions to our state or city these men and women who came out of 7:02 enslavement uh knew otherwise they knew they had god-given 7:08 talents they knew that they could make a difference the 7:13 cemetery was uh organized and burials began in 7:18 1869 they purchased the first four acres paid $1,000 at 10% interest and they had 7:26 paid for it in 2 years how did they do that and how did they stay 7:31 organized through the Civil War have such a powerful group that after the 7:38 Civil War and after emancipation they had enough money to purchase property 7:43 this was a benevolent Society meaning they didn't get paid to do this and they didn't say to get paid to take care of 7:49 the poor to get paid for any of those things they said that that was what they were supposed to do Henry King and 7:56 Jordan Jackson actually purchased the property from the am family to found the the 8:03 cemetery the initial 4 Acres when the trustees first purchased this property 8:08 the deed said about a mile and a half beyond the city 8:13 limits while this was charitable many of them were exactly that business people 8:19 and they knew that they had to run this organization the cemeteries and everything that else that they were 8:24 affiliated with in a very businesslike manner by April of 1875 they had 8:29 purchased another for is a joining their first four and they paid for that in 2 8:35 months how is it that these people who are supposed to be ignorant who had no 8:40 education or very little education knew enough to say yes we matter and we're 8:49 going to show you we matter they ban together they formed the school 8:54 committees they formed the self-help organizations that moved African Americans who had newly been freed out 9:02 of enslavement and poverty and so you know we find the early Educators there 9:10 the early ministers just Community Builders in general those who were 9:16 starting organizations and so 9:23 on you know there's a lot of history here not only for African-Americans for 9:29 the City of Lexington and the state of Kentucky the women who were be there there are founders of the colored orphan 9:35 home for that was founded in 1892 they Incorporated they spent two years 9:43 raising money in order to purchase property and a home and they started started a color offing home with pennies 9:50 okay a group of women got together and they put pennies together to Star this colored Oran and Industrial home whose 9:58 purpose was to to care for Orphans and elderly women uh the City of Lexington 10:04 was supporting the white orphan home but there was no room at all for African-American children Jane Sanders 10:11 has a wonderful headstone it's a pillow in the cemetery and on that pillow I had 10:17 to do a rubbing in order to see this but it says founder of the color orphan home 10:24 1894 Priscilla Lacy she was one of the first treasurers uh uh she was a laundry 10:32 lady so she wasn't you know she didn't have Buu bucks but she evidently was 10:37 very trustworthy because they selected her as their their first treasure and she remained treasure until her death 10:43 Mary Gillis was one of the founding members she was a member of first African church and she uh according to 10:50 their information she remained a Sunday school teacher for almost 62 years Charlotte POG was a um matron at the 10:59 home home when it first opened and all of these women took turns at keeping the 11:05 orphan home running they had what I call household duties keeping the day-to-day operation 11:11 and they took turns every week somebody would be responsible they would be the supervisor for what was going on they 11:18 had kitchen Industries they helped the children learn skills that would carry them through life as well as to be 11:24 gainfully employed they had a shoe shop um they had a bakery they had 11:59 the F went down to 12:04 Kentucky just to play the foul it's a Mighty Fine Place you all 12:13 ought to go there the color fair was an organization that promoted the idea that 12:20 African-Americans need to showcase the progress they had made since emancipation it two was for organized in 12:28 1869 but it was a activity that became the largest fair in all the state of 12:34 Kentucky they had visitors from Indiana from Ohio they would ship in here by train they were very very successful and 12:42 established a Amphitheater a racing track went out to the RAC track races 12:49 hadn't started yet we're now to the RAC track races 12:56 hadn't started yet someone said c sloppy boys and I swear 13:04 it was almost all the early jockies uh in our country were 13:09 African-American almost all the Grooms all the trainers all the blacksmiths and 13:15 many of them are buried right here we know that there were at least 80 involved in the industry and the thir 13:22 bread industry would not have developed as thoroughly had it not been for the 13:27 African-Americans presence there's nothing on any of the stones except for one that tell you what his 13:34 profession was there is a a young man Joseph Scott who died at the age of 16 13:40 and all it says is a jockey no one has been able to find 13:45 out who he rode for where he died nothing he was 16 and you ask your question how could a 13:53 child this age be riding African-Americans were put on the horses 13:59 as young child they were introduced to the industry as young children 6 Seven 8 years old they were working in the 14:06 stables and as they got older and developed an affinity for the horses you 14:12 began to sense how to handle them uh groomsmen trainers owners would observe 14:19 this as they developed this this uh Talent OR showed the talent that they 14:26 had they would be put on horses and they would ride actually guide them in 14:31 races quite a few Kentucky Derby winners are buried in that Cemetery in 14:38 1875 the first Kentucky Derby was run and out of the field of 15 jockeys 13 of 14:45 them were African-American the winning jockey was Oliver Lewis he's buried in 14:51 our Cemetery unfortunately his name is not not on the family headstone his uh 14:56 brother and mother's name is Dr and Butler good for her she tracked this 15:01 story down the only thing information that I could find about Oliver Lewis was 15:09 that he um won the first Kentucky Derby and he was running uh riding aises 15:17 there's a tragedy there that there's a statue of aises the first horse to Wi to 15:23 Kentucky Derby at Churchill Downs but there's none of Oliva LS or of anel 15:29 who trained the very first horse to win the Kentucky Derby who was also an African-American there is much 15:36 information about you know the uh bloodline of atitis and so on but I 15:42 couldn't figure out when ol valis was either born or died we sat at the table 15:48 eating dinner and an Dr Butler pulled out this uh big stack of death 15:54 certificates and split them in half and gave me a half and she took a half and she said said Bruce I'm looking for 16:00 Oliver Lewis who won the first Kentucky Derby see if you could find this thing with his name on it when I first started 16:05 doing research archival research I was told I would never find information about African-Americans it would be very 16:11 hard because I was telling people I was looking for my family and they said oh you'll never find it it you can't 16:17 there's nothing there and there's it's not true it is not true I glean through 16:23 a lot of the records at Kean in their Library couldn't find anything and 16:31 ultimately ran across an obituary that mentioned Oliver Lewis The 16:39 Once famous jockey it listed survivors his of his family and she finally 16:47 discovered that um Oliver Lewis had settled in the Northern Kentucky area 16:52 and there was a possibility that they were descendants it turned out to be ala Lewis's 16:57 great-granddaughter she said she called the lady and told her who she was she was Dr Anne Butler Kentucky State 17:03 University and she would like to come up and talk to her and the lady said well 17:08 we knew our father was in grandfather was involved in the industry because he 17:13 was a bookie well my ears you know really perked up to hear that Oliver 17:19 Lewis after ending his racing career ended up being a a booking which then 17:26 was a legal occupation but she was dismissive of that information because 17:33 by the early 30s and 40s uh bookies were uh almost like gangsters you know it was 17:40 considered as gamblers and I'm sitting there knowing 17:46 that oliv vouis developed a racing 17:51 chart a racing form used at the tracks which eventually involved in becoming 17:56 the modern day racing form I pulled out a picture of Oliver Lewis 18:03 and said this is the man I am looking for and she went oh my God the 18:13 tragedy of not knowing is that this woman did not know her great-grandfather 18:19 had won the first Kentucky Derby I could not describe the the the joy at 18:30 introducing this woman to the legacy of her great 18:36 grandfather there's a unique Monument over here an individual named 18:42 cases Clay tankersley on his Monument it said that he was killed at a race at the 18:50 lonia racetrack which is in Northern Kentucky he was 20 years old when this occurred he was riding with the um Piana 18:59 Farm borack um Thomas was the owner Mr 19:05 Thomas had a monument commissioned for him and he has this wonderful 19:10 inscription on the monument telling you know how much he respected this young man as a as a gentleman sup Perkins 19:18 James Su Perkins winner of the 1895 Kentucky Derby is buried there he tied a 19:25 record as being the youngest jockey to have won a derby uh in Lexington he grew up on Thomas 19:31 Street there's a marker that says Perkins beautiful white marker but again 19:37 his name is not on it the famous jockey uh aaac Murphy was 19:45 originally buried here now since then they've moved his Stone out of the cemetery but this is still is known as 19:52 his original burial place he was originally buried in the cemetery in 1896 and he was subsequently moved moved 19:59 to uh to a grave beside Mana War and then manaar and Isaac Murphy were subsequently moved to the Kentucky Horse 20:06 Park what that means is Isaac Murphy was literally buried and reburied the same 20:14 number of times that he won the Kentucky Derby 20:19 three thought I went to see the they call 20:26 man I went to see man W the horse that had 20:33 Le and my baby say he fair but he really haven't got 20:39 my one of the heartaches that I experienced over Isaac Murphy was that 20:47 um the people uh making the decision about 20:52 reentering him forgot about his wife Luc see okay and 21:00 they were from what I can tell virtually Inseparable during life you know and it 21:08 does not sit well with me that she remains in uh an unmarked 21:21 grave our Cemetery holds the remains of 21:27 all economic Strat of the African-American community and some of the stones are so beautiful they 21:33 were just to me Exquisite I mean it's amazing because they were produced in a 21:39 time when they were handcrafted they weren't poured in a in a mold or uh had 21:44 a standard pattern almost every stone in there is 21:55 different there were people in there too poor to put a monument on their grave sites there were people who had friends 22:02 and relatives who actually handcrafted The Monuments and to 22:09 me that that said more than uh having the money to buy one there is a grave 22:17 over in the front left part of the cemetery the uh marker is is broken in 22:25 two but it's it's still very legible and you can put the two pieces together and 22:31 it says Sally B Ford and she died when she was I believe 22:37 7 years old and the marker is it's a very crude 22:43 marker the uh the lettering on it was not cut into the stone it was it appears 22:49 to have been a concrete marker and they they drew it in the wet concrete 23:05 does an African saying that when an elder dies a library closes so I started 23:11 doing the research to find out who the people were and what they had done while they were living and they became family 23:17 to 23:23 me ah Mr Jones is one of my favorite persons here in the cemetery he became 23:28 pre as a result of the will of Elizabeth Parker who was mared Todd Lincoln's 23:35 grandmother his notation importance to us is that he saved funeral notices from 23:44 1806 to 1886 his collection of death notices larger than anyone else's in in 23:51 the state Moses Spencer was one of the free blacks here in the community had 23:56 gained his freedom about 183 33 he became a merchant he owned a used 24:03 furniture business on Broadway uh Clayborn Lee he died when he 24:08 was 111 years old in 1902 so that mean he was born in the late 1700s right so I did a little digging 24:16 and and found out he was a deacon at one of the uh the churches here in Lexington one of the more interesting characters 24:22 that we know is buried in the cemetery is Alexander Campbell vinegar most 24:28 people know him as Peter menar he was a minister here in Lexington he used to 24:34 preach these friy and brimstone uh sermons because the newspaper talked 24:39 about the titles uh not everybody appreciated his sermons from what I've learned Edward Jackson um was a Dairy 24:47 Farmer in Lexington remained in Lexington had 12 children and they all survived and he was probably the only 24:54 African-American in in Lexington that actually had a dairy farm Mr fa was the 25:00 first principal of dumbar high school when it opened in 1923 he wrote a history of education in 25:07 Kentucky as part of his thesis work when he got his master's degree 25:12 James Andrew Scott they called him Andrew he became the first uh 25:19 African-American hired by the United States Postal Service as a male carrier in 1892 birdie Taylor she was an 25:27 educator she was a teacher teacher and she uh Advanced from being a teacher in 25:33 County schools at Maddox toown and Warren toown to County supervisor and 25:38 from there she went on to uh Statewide supervisor for the Eastern uh Kentucky 25:45 counties her tombstone is beautiful it has this beautiful Betty lamp if you 25:51 know what I'm people know what I'm talking about it's a Betty lamp but it's an engraved symbol on her grave side 26:25 you don't you get we there are a lot of individuals with a 26:30 military background buried in the in the cemetery we like to focus on the Buffalo 26:36 Soldiers because Kentucky was one of the recruiting grounds for the Buffalo Soldiers Leslie Bohanan was in company C 26:44 of the 24th Infantry in the Spanish American war Joseph bird it was in company uh G 26:50 of the fifth us Cavalry he was at atics at the end of the Civil War so if you 26:56 think about the role that African-American am an and the union played Kentucky being one of the largest 27:01 suppliers of African-American troops to the union GT prer fought with the 54th 27:07 Massachusetts Infantry and that was the first African-American unit that was formed in the Civil War and fought in 27:13 the Civil War and if you've seen the movie Glory you kind of like know the story that they uh attacked a fort and a 27:21 lot of them were killed he was captured at Fort Wagner he was released after 27:26 some uh some months rejoined his unit and eventually paroled and while it's interesting that 27:33 he fought at Fort Wagner as part of that part of that unit what's even more interesting is the fight that he had 27:40 with the government pension Bureau to get a pension equivalent to white soldiers at that time and there's a 27:46 series of letters back and forth between prer and the pension Bureau he is one of 27:52 the most elegant writers I have ever seen and it was by accident if you read his his re West uh he talks about having 28:00 fought as bravely as any other person but he's only getting half the pension but what we don't know is whether he 28:06 ever got his pension or not so that's one of those unknown unknown stories that would be interesting as a child we 28:12 weren't taught any of these things we knew nothing about the Buffalo Soldiers here or the Civil War soldiers that were 28:19 here that you know the noble effort that those these people made really there was no chance to celebrate it because people 28:27 just didn't know about it 28:33 rco Benjamin uh was a a lawyer a 28:38 newspaper man uh um who lived in Lexington and uh he was killed in a 28:46 fight probably shot in the back I believe 29:01 Mr Benjamin was not a native of Kentucky he was born in u the West Indies In 29:09 1855 he educated himself became an attorney Mr Benjamin was a well-liked 29:15 individual he had been editor of the Lexington standard which was an 29:20 African-American newspaper here in Lexington while he was here he was an advocate for civil rights and he 29:28 encouraged African-Americans to go to the polls and register to vote and this would have been in 1900 people were not 29:34 happy particularly the the Europe european-american Community was not totally happy with Mr Benjamin and his 29:41 agitation for human rights and he actually escorted them to the poll to make sure they got there while he was 29:48 there he heard um the registar asking inappropriate questions while they were 29:55 trying to register so he challenged him there was a a gentleman who was a democratic supporter and he challenged 30:03 Mr Benjamin they got into an argument and a fight and Mr Benjamin filed a 30:10 arrest work a an assault warrant against this man Mike Monahan the sheriff picked 30:16 him up but they didn't put him in jail they released him Mr benjaman did not 30:22 know that so he returned to the polls to take another group of African-Americans and when he arrived Mike Monahan was 30:29 there Mr Benjamin knew that his life was in Peril so he left hurriedly Mike Monahan followed behind him and shot him 30:37 in the 30:48 back unfortunately there was no trial uh Mr Monahan we don't know what 30:54 ever happened to him but he was never brought up on the charge essentially we feel that he was murdered 31:01 and there was no ever justification for it all of the newspapers The Hurl the leader the standard they all were just 31:10 incensed at what had happened it was just a sad situation but we're privileged to have him here to have his 31:17 remains stay here and uh know that we can tell his story even though his life 31:23 was cut short he was about 45 years old when he died and it took them 10 years to finally place a monument at Mr 31:30 Benjamin's grave site but when they did it again was a uh 31:36 Citywide recognition of this man and the contributions he had made to our community so the cemetery I think uh 31:45 represents that sense of of of of of post 31:50 emancipation uh need to build community this post-emancipation period of Renaissance of of of saying well you 31:58 know even though uh you know we we're faced with all kind of Jim Crow laws and 32:03 and the riding Night Riders and the KKK and and all kind of uh examples of Oppression and racism we still have to 32:11 build community when I leave Kentucky I know I really can't 32:18 lose I'm coming back to my baby but I'll have the Le 32:30 it's always puzzled us as to why the cemetery just became so neglected 32:37 Cemetery number two had been in operation over 40 years and they had 32:44 used probably all the available burial spaces the area around them had been 32:50 developed uh the railroad track behind them the lden Avenue um 32:55 subdivision so they were encroached there was no way to go as Society changed uh integration 33:04 started to take place the the community in this neighborhood started to change 33:10 the the African-Americans here started to move to other sections of the town I think the last um records that they have 33:18 where they had any interaction with that group was in U 1932 and that's when the 33:23 majority of the early organizers in the subsequent generation after to them 33:28 started dying out and the cemetery became abandoned and so the cemetery just sort of fell into 33:35 disuse and because the people who had a connection to this Cemetery had moved 33:42 away the whole thing kind of just died down and and became overgrown and people 33:49 tended to forget about it 33:58 and 34:33 and I remember in the 50s driving around we' drive around on Sunday sort of family 34:39 entertainment and I remember driving down 7th Street here and seeing this 34:45 cemetery and at that time it was just overgrown and trash and junk and it was 34:51 just disgusting and uh and it I was about 10 years old at the time 34:58 and it made me wonder how a city could allow that to happen to a cemetery I'd never seen a cemetery in that kind of 35:05 condition before I have talked to people who grew up in the neighborhood and they remember passing through the cemetery 35:11 they remember playing in the cemetery I mean I was probably down in here as a kid I grew up in aspendale which was a 35:16 housing project up OFF Fifth Street and we used to come down in here and play 35:23 pick blackberries raspberries things like that but uh other than that I 35:28 didn't know anything about the cemetery in fact many people were frightened to come here scared of snakes and whatever 35:34 that was here but it was pretty much not cleared and so you had to almost uh cut your way through well I never did go 35:42 down in there and I work night shift at a 35:47 hospital and when I would go out I'd always look over in there just to make sure nothing was coming out to meet me 35:53 when we first moved here it was high would weed and just a lot of growth over there and 36:02 they lot of nice tombstones and stuff was there and they got misplaced and 36:08 broke up a couple of years after that it got so high that you couldn't even see the taller ston and the other thing 36:14 about the cemetery had never been enclosed it was always open just like it had been when they first bought it there 36:21 were had been some wire fence strung along the Shropshire Avenue side and of course along the junkyard side but the 36:27 front and back entrances were always open so people would cross the railroad track come into the cemetery and walk up 36:34 uh 7th Street go Chestnut wherever they wanted to and vice versa and people were dumping uh old refrigerators mattress 36:43 there were people that would come in here and uh U uh homeless people would sleep in here at one time there was a I 36:50 don't know it was a homeless person or what but there was someone actually camped out living down in in the back 36:56 portion of it uh there was one character in the mid 37:01 1900s that Neighbors in this uh area there on Seventh Street talked about and 37:07 his name was lost John he wore a top hat and tails and he walked the streets 37:13 played H Monica he hung out down at the courthouse I understand in the court square and he also walked up and down 37:20 second uh seven Street and several people have said that he helped care for the cemetery 37:30 I'm Going Back Where I Come I'm going back down in Georgia my wife died and 37:37 left me that's I'm going back Georgia you know it's it's just a vague memory 37:42 of me coming to this Cemetery with my grandmother and she would have uh shears 37:47 and she would have all kind of garden tools to try to clean it up you know around the site and then she would plant 37:54 a flower my father many many years ago used to bring me over to the old 38:01 Cemetery to uh on Memorial Day to Remember and clear the grave and that sort of thing so I would know where the 38:07 spot was but it really it was just a wild place it was totally unkempt it was 38:15 um it was in many ways just disregarded and disrespected because nobody was taking care of it uh residents were 38:23 complaining about the vagrants in and out of the cemetery 38:30 about the unkempt condition and the newspaper would have a picture in the paper every year showing how uncapped it 38:37 looked the weeds were higher than the cars I mean truly you couldn't even see you wouldn't know that it was a cemetery 38:43 except they said it was and even though Cemetery number two became 38:51 neglected and it was overgrown because there wasn't a generation that stepped forward to save it 38:58 it still remained unfortunately the cemeteries in 39:05 Lexington once they became overfilled and neglected many of them were 39:11 desecrated uh the city would declare the properties abandoned and they would have the bodies 39:18 removed sometimes many times not and they would just crush the headstones to 39:23 be used on foundations uh or just you know destroyed from 1973 when they started 39:31 documenting um this issue with the cemetery to 1979 the city had assigned 39:37 it to Parks and Recreation well it got to be more than they could take care of so the city decided in 79 after they had 39:44 merged to declare the land abandoned and sell portions of it for development and 39:50 keep a small part for a park they were going to remove all the bodies and 39:56 remove the headstones and place them in another location but in order to do that they had to know how many people were 40:03 buried in the cemetery oral history accounts indicated that there were 3 to 40:09 4,000 uh burials in the cemetery and yet the only surviving document that listed 40:18 the burials uh numbered to around 900 40:23 they hired a company out of uh Owingsville richardon Corporation and he came in and 40:29 determined that there were over 5,000 burials no one had anticipated that 40:35 number at all so then the issue became we don't have the money a to finish 40:41 paying this man for determining how many burials are here cuz he was getting a 40:46 dollar per grave and we don't have the money to disiner this many bodies and move them someplace else by this time um 40:56 people in the community had heard what was going on and they were not happy and and when it was truly threatened there 41:04 were individuals in this community who knew the value of the cemetery and stepped forward and formed the 41:12 organization that saved it so mayor James zato was sitting at the time he 41:18 appointed a committee Reverend HH Green in 1979 was one of the first board members 41:25 he was elected chair of the group that became known as African Cemetery number two they 41:32 Incorporated and he started drawing people into the organization talking to 41:39 descendants uh getting Community Support so that particular generation in 41:47 1979 said we shouldn't allow it to be overrun we shouldn't allow it to be 41:54 desecrated we shouldn't allow it to be con considered abandoned and bodies 41:59 disent teered this is not how we respect our dad so from that 42:05 group for 10 years they operated Reverend green died in 1986 but another gentleman Reverend GM 42:14 Smith he was a minister stepped into the leadership position and he along with other 42:20 churches here in Lexington contined to care for the cemetery again we went through periods of um of of like 42:27 restoration and neglect and we C it a jungle in here uh there's all kinds of 42:35 you know evasive Honeysuckle and bushes and bramble bushes were just everywhere 42:41 it looked better but it was still UNC kept it didn't look as it didn't look like Lexington Cemetery you know it 42:47 wasn't well groomed cuz they could not go in there every every day to do any kind of Maintenance work you start with 42:54 another 10year cycle and Thomas M and Bruce Monday come along and see that 43:00 things have gotten out of hand again and they step into the 43:10 void we kind of like came in around the time that the last of those members were 43:18 still alive their grandparents were buried here and Thomas decided he couldn't necessarily clean the whole 43:24 Cemetery but he was going to clean up his grandparents grave the day I did come my brother was up to the front 43:29 trying to find my grandparents Tombstone which he did and when he found it it was 43:35 so dirty and covered with algae that he put it in the back of his pickup truck 43:40 this I just will never forget he put it in the back of his pickup truck and took it through the car wash I thought oh my 43:48 goodness I thought you're not supposed to do that but when he showed me where the stone was the Stone's beautiful it 43:55 got it clean and you can read it very plainly my brother Thomas was the 44:01 instigator of a lot of this stuff he was in there more than anybody he passed 44:06 daily he enlisted friends and just asked him for one hour a week just come over 44:13 and help me for 1 hour a week well Thomas is very persuasive and he said 44:18 can you do that and I said well yes I can and he said good come back next 44:23 Saturday well Thomas um pested uh Pam Miller mayor Pam Miller to 44:30 death at that time and before long he had people coming and the board got 44:35 reconstituted and it actually looked pretty good and we got a couple of 44:40 Grants we were able to buy some equipment and we came in here and we started just trying to make the place 44:50 presentable the children the the children 44:58 in the water in 45:06 the the going to trouble 45:22 the most of the people who became intricately involved in the cemetery I 45:28 don't remember how I met them okay they just showed up I got 45:34 started with the cemetery after I read an article in the paper I saw that and I 45:40 thought that's the cemetery that I remember when I was a child I had a friend that was working over 45:45 here and uh he asked me to come over and help him uh one hour month and no soon I 45:52 came in he left and I haven't seen him no more so it's almost like I took his place I loaded my lawnmower in the in 45:59 the back of the car and came over here and I've been coming pretty much every Saturday since there are people who um 46:08 you know go there religiously practically every Saturday and do the 46:13 mowing when we came in here there was Japanese nut Sage overtaking the 46:18 cemetery up to your chest it's not a it's not a piece of property that can simply be left alone we used to make fun 46:25 of him because he had this machete and he was going through the cemetery trying to cut the whole Cemetery with 46:30 this machete and we like that fool can't cut that Cemetery with machete well strangely enough he did he Mark worked 46:37 tiously he still works tirelessly to uh maintain this uh Cemetery to maintain 46:43 this sacred place what you see now is really the culmination of uh over 15 46:50 years I guess now of work although it was very difficult to keep up with the grass there just weren't enough people 46:57 and we didn't have the big heavy duty mower it was mostly push mowers and string Cutters but really a lot of hard 47:04 hand labor trying to keep ahead of the of the vegetation when I first came here 47:11 we didn't have the mes that we have now and uh I thought that I could pretty 47:16 much make a a big impact with a push mow and at the same time I thought it would be a good opportunity for me to get 47:22 exercise in the push more well it it really I didn't accomplish much and it kind of wor me out so so later I uh I 47:30 purchased me a self Propel Mo cuz I really thought with a Seth Propel Mo I could really get something done and uh 47:36 it's eight acres here and a Seth bmore didn't do as much good either but actually what I found is that uh uh when 47:45 we you think about various forms of quiet time even though I'm on a mower uh 47:51 every weekend it's actually very quiet contemplative time for me so it's a it's a chance to get away from from everyone 47:57 cuz no one wants to help you when you're when you're mowing it's a stress reliever and even though I don't have 48:03 any family in here you know I do enjoy my my time spent in here after you've 48:09 mowed for for weeks and weeks and weeks and you go by the same tombstones and 48:14 you read the inscriptions you kind of get to know the people they're more like 48:20 family so you you know you want to be sure that they're taken care of well I tell you when I was cutting up in the 48:27 front part the middle section uh and as you cut and you kind of look at the names on it you I was cutting one day 48:33 and I looked down and my name was on one of them so usually when I get to that one I give it extra special attention 48:40 and I even put flowers on it every year I recall numerous times we were back in 48:46 the back just trying to repair the chain link fence and people would come by and 48:51 tear it down and we repair it again and even though we have a fence put in we always were going to have trouble 48:58 keeping out the the other vegetation coming back in so this is an ongoing struggle to make sure that we can keep 49:05 the property of the cemetery wellmaintained and and cleared 49:10 out there was a summer 2003 I believe when someone came 49:17 in with a vehicle and knocked over 36 Stones it 49:22 just just was more than any of us could deal with I mean some of of the prettiest stones that we had the largest 49:29 stones that we had 49:38 Jus to walk 49:46 with we talk about the sadness of uh vandalism and it is sad but there's a 49:54 Christ Christian scripture that says but joy comes in the morning okay we are now 50:01 in the morning of the cemetery and so more than sadness I feel Joy this place 50:07 has a 200 I'm not really sure what the figure is some, fence around it that it's on 50:15 the national register of historic places that tours are done on it Joy comes in 50:22 the morning and so while we know that some things that have been done here 50:28 that are sad once again I say Joy comes in the morning what a glorious morning 50:34 it's a beautiful day today isn't 50:45 it the project both the preservation of the 50:52 cemetery the research efforts are part of an ongoing struggle for 50:59 African-Americans to retain vestiges of africanamerican 51:06 Heritage where we can and it is even a 51:13 struggle to maintain the sight as a sacred burial 51:22 ground our great grandparents uh grandfathers grandmothers 51:27 uh before emancipation post emancipation had recognized the need to create again 51:33 cemeteries schools or his businesses and they said well we're going to do our 51:38 work in our lifetime and we're passing on the Baton what I hope will happen is 51:45 that it will it it will continue to provide a sense of living 51:52 history for the community because it's important that we keep this early 51:57 reminder of who we are where we've come from and how we progressed so I think at 52:05 the point now uh where we are we have the fence around it most of the stones 52:10 are all up we've kind of gotten down to a science how to keep the grass cut uh 52:15 things like that I think now what we trying to do is create this greater 52:21 sense of awareness in the community part of our work early on 52:27 was just to bring young people in here and have them walk in here and get over the fear of being in the cemetery it's 52:34 always glorious to come in here with young people and have them discover things and 52:41 see what they connect up with I don't know exactly how long I've been coming here it seems like as long as I can 52:48 remember it's a nice Cemetery you know it's like a nice place it's not creepy 52:54 at all there's a Emma Bailey's tomb Stone it's like over there behind the bush that's been like my favorite I 53:01 don't know why I just like I like the way it looked it was just really pretty so I remember I'd come like each time I 53:07 came here I'd always end i' go over there I'd like pick a flower and I'd put it there as a present for Emma 53:17 Bailey none of us get paid to do this it's it's all volunteer and we all find 53:23 our passions and this is a passion for the group that's working now now and we'll be passion for the next group that 53:29 comes in behind us the more people know about it then the more they can care for it and take care of it before a lot of 53:37 people didn't know those who did know knew it through 53:42 weeds and overgrown bushes and so it wasn't a comfortable place to come to 53:50 while they had heard stories that didn't get to look the stories in the face now 53:55 you can come look the St is in the 54:07 face you come out here on uh any given morning or late in the afternoon this is 54:13 really a pleasant place to just come and just relax when I 54:20 first came into the cemetery basically I was looking for my own family I had 54:26 asked my mother to go with me and point out uh the headstones that she recalled her great aunt decorating she showed me 54:34 an area she couldn't tell me exactly where the stones were but she showed me the area where she thought they were 54:41 buried after seeing what it had came from and where it was headed uh I 54:46 started volunteering then I end up being on the board and I found out so much history about the 54:53 cemeter uh that I got more and more involved in so now at this point uh it's just a 55:00 label of love for me and as I walked through the cemetery I begun to see these headstones of my 55:09 family when I finally finished uh counting and and recording 55:15 information from all the headstones I discovered I had 42 family members 55:21 buried on my maternal side buried in that cemetery and it was it was almost 55:27 overwhelming for me this cemetery is part of this whole National effort to 55:35 lift up uh if you will all the history all the people who have made this 55:41 country what it is and as I started doing the archival research I found that 55:49 I had relatives who had been instrumental in starting the cemetery and keeping it going during their 55:54 lifetime so then it became a personal 56:01 Journey this tells where we've been and so it's important because we 56:08 need to know that we need to know the struggles and we need to know the 56:15 victories they established the cemetery it was up to a Next 56:21 Generation and sometimes it skips a generation I happen to be that person 56:27 there is a poem that says every tribe has a 56:35 Storyteller and each uh storyteller's responsibility is 56:42 to tell the story of those who've gone before you and that's what I 56:47 do the world's a good place and I only purpose on it is to do good 56:54 work the some cemetery is sort of like a time machine when you're out on sth Street 57:01 you're out on the road in the sidewalk and there are big heavy trucks going by and a lot of traffic and everything but 57:07 the minute you come through those Gates it gets quiet and peaceful and you hear the birds and you the wind blowing 57:14 through the trees and it's a different atmosphere the minute you cross that 57:20 line and you look around and you see the markers and you read the inscriptions and these are the people 57:27 some of the people that helped build this town long before I lived here so we 57:34 owe these people a debt of gratitude and 57:41 respect and helping to maintain the cemetery is is how I do that 57:58 I think this is the one of the prettiest Stones we have has 58:05 a a hand male and female 58:16 hand like in holy matrimony 58:55 see and 59:05 am amen amen join me 59:22 sisters brothers 59:33 am wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oliver_Lewis The trainer's name is Ansel Williamson info https://www.racingmuseum.org/hall-of-fame/trainer/ansel-williamson Ansel Williamson Ansel Williamson’s career spanned the pre-Civil War era of the three-mile heat races into the dawning of the single or “dash” races. Born a slave in Virginia, the point from which his record can be traced with confidence begins in the South around 1860. Inducted 1998 Born 1806, Virginia Died 1881, Lexington, Kentucky Career 1860-1881 Biography Ansel Williamson’s career spanned the pre-Civil War era of the three-mile heat races into the dawning of the single or “dash” races. Born a slave in Virginia, the point from which his record can be traced with confidence begins in the South around 1860. For owner T. G. Goldsby, Williamson trained the horse Brown Dick for important victories in New Orleans, Charleston, Atlanta, and Mobile. Williamson was sold to A. Keene Richards and trained the noted runners Australian and Glycerna. He was sent in 1864 to work for R. A. Alexander of the famed Woodburn Stud in Kentucky. Williamson was then freed but remained in Alexander’s employ and trained a succession of major horses, including the undefeated pair Norfolk and Asteroid. Norfolk won the inaugural Jersey Derby of 1864. “Old Ansel,” as he was referred to in contemporary accounts, later worked for H. P. McGrath and trained Hall of Fame member Tom Bowling, winner in 14 of 17 races, including the Travers, Jersey Derby, and Dixie. In 1875, Williamson trained Aristides, winner of the inaugural Kentucky Derby. That year, Williamson also won the Belmont with Calvin. Both horses were owned by McGrath. Other noted horses trained by Williamson included Merrill, winner of the 1866 Travers; Virgil, the dam of Hall of Fame member Hindoo; as well as Aaron Pennington, Chesapeake, and Susan Ann. Other major races won by Williamson included the Jerome, Phoenix, and Withers. Achievements Triple Crown Highlights Won the 1875 Kentucky Derby — Aristides Won the 1875 Belmont Stakes — Calvin Reproduction of an 1864 Edward Troye portrait of Asteroid with his trainer, Ansel Williamson, holding saddle on right (Keeneland Library)

James Brown born 1933 Please please please from the album please please please by james brown and the furious flames The first album cover for please please please, look at it, you wouldn't think this has anything to do with james brown. Lyrics Please, please, please, please (Please, please don't go) Please, please, please (Please, please don't go) Honey, please don't (Go) Yeah, oh yeah, love, I love you so (Please, please don't go) Baby, you did me wrong (So you got me woman) Well, well you done me wrong (So you got me woman) So you done, done me wrong (Go) Well, oh yeah, took my love, now you're gone (Please, please don't go) Please, please, please, please, please (Please, please don't go) Please, please, please, please, please (Please, please don't go) Honey, please don't (Go) Well, oh yeah, love, I love you so (Please, please don't go) I just wanna hear you say I, I, I, I, I (Please, please don't go) I, I, I, I (Please, please don't go) Honey, please don't (Go) Oh, oh yeah, love, I love you so (Please, please don't go) Baby, take my hand (Please, please don't go) I wanna be your lover man (Please, please don't go) Oh yeah, slipped out of my head Honey, please don't (Go) Well, oh yeah, love, I love you so (Please, please don't go) Please don't go (Please, please don't go) Please don't go (Please, please don't go) Honey, please don't go Ha, I love you so, please, please (Please, please don't go) Songwriters: James Brown, Johnny Terry Try Me from the Album Try Me by James Brown and the Furious Flames look at the album cover, again, really disconnected to james brown, white ownership Lyrics Try me (try me) Try me (try me) Darlin', tell me I need you Try me (try me) Try me (try me) And your love will always be true Oh, I need you (I need you, I need you) Hold me (hold me) Hold me (hold me) I want you right here By my side Hold me (hold me) Hold me (hold me) And your love we won't hide Oh, I need you (I need you, I need you) Oh, I need (I need you) Oh, oh walk with me (walk with me) Talk with me (talk with me) I want you stop my heart from crying Walk with me (walk with me) Talk with me (talk with me) And your love will stop my heart from dying Oh, I need you (I need you, uh) Songwriters: James Brown. Live at the Apollo with the Furious Flames Full Album- first track FULL ALBUM https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_ncWqay8kj4z85sSpuMzIQSLCgOjkpoeEc Cover art- yeah! actually black Papas Got a brand new bag part 1 part 1+2+3 Lyrics Come Here Sister... Papa's In The Swing He Ain't Too Hip... About That New Breed Thing He Ain't No Drag Papa's Got A Brand New Bag Come Here Mama... And Dig This Crazy Scene He's Not Too Fancy... But His Mind Is Might Clean He Ain't No Drag. Papa's Got A Brand New Bag He's Doing The Jerk... He's Doing The Fly Don't Play Him Cheap 'Cause You Know He Ain't Shy He's Doing The Monkey, The Mashed Potatoes, Jump Back Jack, See You Later Alligator. Come Here Sister Papa's In The Swing He Ain't Too Hip Now But I Can Dig That New Breed Babe; He Ain't No Drag He's Got A Brand New Bag Oh Papa! He's Doing The Jerk Papa... He's Doing The Jerk He's Doing The Twist ... Just Like This, He's Doing The Fly Ev'ry Day And Ev'ry Night The Thing's... Like The Boomerang. Hey... Come On Hey! Hey... Come On Hey! Hey... He's Pu Tight... Out Of Sight... Come On. Hey! Hey! Songwriters: James Brown I got you ( I feel good) lyrics Whoa! I feel good I knew that I would, now I feel good I knew that I would, now So good, so good, I got you Whoa! I feel nice, like sugar and spice I feel nice, like sugar and spice So nice, so nice, I got you When I hold you in my arms I know that I can do no wrong And when I hold you in my arms My love won't do you no harm And I feel nice, like sugar and spice I feel nice, like sugar and spice So nice, so nice, I got you When I hold you in my arms I know that I can't do no wrong And when I hold you in my arms My love can't do me no harm And I feel nice, like sugar and spice I feel nice, like sugar and spice So nice, so nice, well I got you Whoa! I feel good I knew that I would, now I feel good I knew that I would So good, so good, 'cause I got you So good, so good, 'cause I got you So good, so good, 'cause I got you Hey! Oh Songwriters: Timothy Jamahli Thomas, Theron Makiel Thomas, Jevon Lendrick Hill. It's a man's mans' mans' world Lyrics This is a man's world This is a man's world But it wouldn't be nothing, nothing Without a woman or a girl You see, man made the cars To take us over the road Man made the train To carry the heavy load Man made the electric light To take us out of the dark Man made the boat for the water Like Noah made the ark This is a man's, man's, man's world But it wouldn't be nothing, nothing Without a woman or a girl Man thinks about a little bit of baby girls And a baby boys Man makes them happy 'Cause man makes them toys And after man's made everything Everything he can You know that man makes money To buy from other man This is a man's world But it wouldn't be nothing, nothing Not one little thing Without a woman or a girl He's lost in the wilderness He's lost in the bitterness He's lost in love, oh Songwriters: James Brown, Betty Jean Newsome Get Up ( I fele like being) a sex machine lyrics Fellas, I'm ready to get up and do my thing (yeah go ahead!) I wanta get into it, man, you know (go ahead!) Like a, like a sex machine, man, (yeah go ahead!) Movin' and doin' it, you know Can I count it off? (Go ahead) One, two, three, four! Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Stay on the scene, (get on up), like a sex machine, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Stay on the scene, (get on up), like a sex machine, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Stay on the scene, (get on up), like a sex machine, (get on up) Wait a minute! Shake your arm, then use your form Stay on the scene like a sex machine You got to have the feeling sure as you're born Get it together, right on, right on. Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Hah! Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) You said, you said you got the, You said the feeling, You said the feeling you got to get You give me the fever 'n' a cold sweat. The way i like, it is the way it is, I got mine 'n' don't worry 'bout his Get up, (get on up) Stay on the scene, (get on up), like a sex machine, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Bobby! Should I take 'em to the bridge? (Go Ahead!) Take 'em on to the bridge! (Take em to the bridge!) Should I take 'em to the bridge? (Yeah!) Take 'em to the bridge? (Go Ahead!) Hit me now! Come on! Stay on the scene, like a sex machine! The way I like it is, is the way it is I got mine, (dig it!), he got his Stay on the scene, like a lovin' machine Stay on the scene, like a lovin' machine Stay on the scene I wanna count it off one more time now (Go ahead!) You wanna hear it like it did on the top fellas? (Yeah!) Hear it like it did on the top? (Yeah!) Hit it now! Get on up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get on up, (get on up) Stay on the scene, (get on up), like a lovin' machine, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Taste, (get on up) Bein', (get on up) Taste, (get on up) Bein', (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Stay on the scene, (get on up), like a sex machine, (get on up) You gotta have the feelin, (get on up) Sure as you're born, (get on up) Get it together, right on, right on right on, right on, (right on, right on) right on, right on, (right on, right on) right on, right on, (right on, right on) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) And then, shake your money maker, Shake your money maker, Shake your money maker, Shake your money maker, Shake your money maker, Shake your money maker, Shake your money maker Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Huh! Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Get up, (get on up) Can we hit it like we did one more time, from the top Can we hit like that one more time (One more time!) One more time! Let's hit it and quit! (Go ahead!) Can we hit it and quit? (Yeah!) Can we hit it and quit? (Yeah!) Can we hit it and quit? (Yeah!) Hit it! Songwriters: James Brown, Bobby Byrd, Ronald R. Lenhoff, Jo Bogaert, Moaso Djogi Manuela Bar Kamosi. The Payback single cover Lyrics Hey! Gotta, gotta payback! (The big payback) Revenge! I'm mad! (The big payback) Got to get back! I need some get-back! Payback! Payback!(The big payback) That's it! Payback! Revenge! I'm mad! You get down with my girlfriend, that ain't right Wow! Smokin'! Hollerin' n' cussin', you wanna fight Payback is a thing you gotta see Hell! Brother do any damn thing to me You sold me out for chicken change (Yes you did) You told me that they, they had it all arranged You had me down, and that's a fact And now you punk, you gotta get ready For the big payback (The big payback) That's where I land, on the big payback (The big payback) I can do wheelin', I can do dealin' (Yes we can) But I don't do no damn squealin' I can dig rappin', I'm ready! I can dig scrapping But I can't dig that backstabbin' (Oh no) The brother get ready, that's a fact Get ready you mother for the big payback (The big payback) Let me hit them, hit them, Fred hit them Lord! You took my money, you got my honey Don't want me to see what you doin' to me I can get back! I got to deal with you! Gotta deal with ya, gotta deal with ya! I... gotta deal with...! Hey, let me tell you! Get down with my woman, that ain't right You hollerin' and cussing, you wanna fight Lookie here! Don't do me no darn favor I don't know karate, but I know ka-razor (Yes we do) Hey! Get ready, that's a fact Get ready you mother for the big payback (The big payback) Hey, I'm a man, I'm a man... I'm a son of a man, but don't they tell you that pappa can Get ready for the big payback (The big payback) Hit me again! No, don't... Get ready, I need it, I need a hit again The same one, the same one, the same one Hit me back Lord! (The big payback) Sold me out for chicken change You said my woman had it all arranged Tried to make a deal, she wanted to squeal But I had my boys on her heels Saw what she had comin', told a lie she broke down and she wanted to cry I don't care what she does She'll be doing just like she was Take those kids and raise them up Somebody drink out the righteous cup Take her, take that woman, it's one place she found Just run that mother out of town Make her get up, make her get up, get out Make her get up, make her get up, get out I'm mad! I want revenge, I want revenge, my... (The big payback) My patience ends, I want revenge My patience ends, I want revenge I want revenge, I want revenge (The big payback) Gonna get some hits, I need those hits I need those hits, hit me! Lord, I need those hits Carry on, carry on, payback melody (The big payback) (The big payback) Alright! Da-dee-ra-da, da-dee-ra-da, da-dee-ra-da! (The big payback) Songwriters: Fred Wesley, James Brown, John Starks Say It Loud I'm Black and I'm proud cover art Lyrics Uh! With your bad self Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Look a'here Some people say we got a lot of malice Some say it's a lotta nerve But I say we won't quit moving Until we get what we deserve We've been buked and we've been scourned We've been treated bad, talked about As sure as you're born But just as sure as it take two eyes to make a pair, huh Brother, we can't quit until we get our share Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) One more time Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) I've worked on jobs with my feet and my hands But all the work I did was for the other man And now we demands a chance To do things for ourselves We tired of beating our heads against the wall And working for someone else Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Oowee! You're killing me Alright! Uh! You're out of sight Alright! So tough, you're tough enough Oowee! Uh! You're killing me, ow! Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it louder (I'm black and I'm proud) Now, we demands a chance to do things for ourselves We tired of beating our heads against the wall And working for someone else Look a'here, there's one more thing I got to say right here Now, we're people We're like the birds and the bees But we'd rather die on our feet Than keep living on our knees Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Lord'a, Lord'a, Lord'a Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Uh! Alright now! Lord! You know we can do the Boogaloo Now we can say we do the Funky Broadway Now we do Sometimes we dance, we sing, and we talk You know I do like to do the Camel Walk Alright now, alright Alright now, ha Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it louder (I'm black and I'm proud) Let me hear ya Say it louder (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it louder (I'm black and I'm proud) Now we's demands a chance to do things for ourselves We're tired of beating our heads against the wall And working for someone else You know, we are our people, too We're like the birds and the bees But we'd rather die on our feet Than keep livin' on our knees Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it louder (I'm black and I'm proud) Let me hear ya Say it louder (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it louder (I'm black and I'm proud) Eh! Oowee, you're killing me Alright!, Uh! You outta sight! Alright! You're outta sight! Ooowee! Oh Lord! Ooowee! You're killing me Ooowee, ooowee! Ooowee, ooh, ow! Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Good God, I feel it! Say it loud, uh! (I'm black and I'm proud) Say it loud (I'm black and I'm proud) Songwriters: James Brown, Mohandas Dewese

Gwendolyn brooks wins the Pulitzer prize 1955 the first black person of african descent in the united states of america to win the pulitzer. It was for the book Annie Allen [ https://nmaahc.si.edu/object/nmaahc_2014.281; https://chicagoliteraryarchive.org/2021/01/28/annie-allen-by-gwendolyn-brooks-1949/] This is gwendolyn brooks reading "Kitchenette Building" Gwendolyn Brooks interview 1967

CBL Juneteenth 05/15/2025

Truth from Jeffrey Sachs 04262025 Paraphrase- a paraphrase isn't a quote When the soviet union ended in 1991 the united states literally believed this is now a u.s. world and we will do as we want, the wars in the middle east, Serbia, the wars in Africa, these are wars that the united states led and caused, and this has been true for more than 40 years, as Europe has not had any foreign policy during this period that i can figure out, no voice, no unity, no clarity, only American loyalty, please don't have American officials as head of Europe , have European officials, have the European foreign policy, you are going to be living with Russia for a long time, so please negotiate with Russia, cause trump and president putin will agree to end the war, if Europe does all it's great war mongering, it doesn't matter, the war is ending, not one word is told to the American people about anything, or to you, or by any of your newspapers these days, this idea that putin reconstructing the Russian empire , this is childish propaganda, so the war started, what was putin's intention in the war, i can tell you what his intention was, when Zelensky said in seven days lets negotiate, i know the details of this exquisitely, I flew to Ankara to listen in detail, to what the mediators were doing, Ukraine walked away unilaterally from a near agreement, why , because the united states told them to, I begged the Ukrainians, and I had a track record with the Ukrainians, I advise the Ukrainians, I am not anti Ukrainian, i am pro Ukrainian completely, I said save your lives, save your sovereignty, save your territory, be neutral, don't listen to the americans, I repeated to them the famous adage of henry Kissinger, that to be an enemy of the united states is dangerous but to be a friend is fatal. COMPLETE Video https://youtu.be/_RNE3X41IvM?si=0GVA2hOPZfapR5hJ Transcript 0:00 Jeffrey Zak is about to give a talk here in the European Parliament enjoy it when 0:05 the Soviet Union ended in 1991 the United States literally 0:10 believed this is now a US World and we will do as we want the wars in the 0:16 Middle East Serbia the wars in Africa these are Wars that the United States 0:21 LED and caused and this has been true for more than 40 years Europe has not 0:28 had any foreign policy during this period that I can figure out no voice no 0:33 Unity no Clarity only American loyalty 0:39 please don't have American officials as head of Europe have European officials 0:45 have a European foreign policy you're going to be living with Russia for a long time so please negotiate with 0:51 Russia Trump and President Putin will agree to end the war if Europe does all 0:57 its great warmongering it doesn't matter the war is ending not one word is told 1:03 to the American people about anything or to you or by any of your newspapers 1:09 these days this idea that Putin's reconstructing the Russian Empire this is childish propaganda so the war 1:17 started what was Putin's intention in the war I can tell you what his 1:23 intention was when zalinski said in 7 Days let's 1:28 negotiate I know know the details of this exquisitly I flew to anchora to 1:34 listen in detail to what the mediators were doing Ukraine walked away 1:40 unilaterally from a near agreement why because the United States told them to I 1:46 begged the ukrainians and I had a track record with the ukrainians I advised the ukrainians I'm not anti-ukrainian I'm 1:53 Pro Ukrainian completely I said save your lives save your sovereignty save 1:58 your territory be neutral don't listen to the Americans I repeated to them the 2:03 famous adage of Henry Kissinger that to be an enemy of the United States is 2:09 dangerous but to be a friend is fatal above all I want to welcome Professor 2:15 Jeffrey saak and today Jeff is probably the person in the world to speak up for 2:20 peace everywhere for peace which all these things combined and therefore I'm very happy that you're here and uh I'm 2:28 here since 6 months and this Parliament and for somebody who worked for the UN I was actually quite shocked to learn that 2:34 this Parliament speaks only about War I think we have now to rethink what we 2:40 want to do and I hope the European Union will also come because I'm Pro European 2:45 Union will come to to realize that we have also to see how we seek peace and how we manage peace and how we create 2:52 again a peaceful Europe and Jeff might give us for these things some insight thank you very much 2:59 [Applause] I've watched the events very close up uh Jeffrey Sachs' Background 3:05 in Eastern Europe the former Soviet Union Russia uh very closely for the 3:14 last uh 36 years I was an advisor to the Polish government in 3:20 1989 uh to uh President gorbachov in 3:26 1990 and 91 to president yelton in 1991 to 3:32 1993 to president kochma of Ukraine in 1993 3:38 94 I helped introduce the Estonian currency I I helped several countries in 3:46 uh former Yugoslavia especially Slovenia uh I've watched the events very 3:54 close up for 36 years uh after after the 4:00 maidan I was uh asked by the new government to come to Kiev and I was 4:05 taken around the maidan and I learned a lot of things uh firsthand I I've been in touch with 4:13 Russian leaders for more than 30 years I know the American political 4:20 leadership uh close up uh our previous 4:25 uh Secretary of Treasury was my macroeconomic teacher uh 51 years ago or 4:33 just to give you an idea so we were very close friends for a half century I know 4:41 all of these people I just want to say this because what I want to explain in 4:46 my point of view is not uh secondhand it's not ideology it's what I've seen 4:52 with my own eyes and experienced during this 4:57 period in my understanding of the events that have uh befallen Europe in many The Origin of Today's US Foreign Policy 5:06 contexts uh and I'll include not only the uh Ukraine crisis uh but uh 5:15 Serbia 1999 the wars in the Middle East 5:21 including Iraq Syria the wars in Africa including 5:27 Sudan Somalia uh Libya these are to a very significant 5:36 extent that would surprise you perhaps uh and would be 5:42 denounced about what I'm about to say these are Wars that the United States 5:48 LED and caused and this has been true 5:53 for more than 40 years now what happened 6:01 more than 30 years I should say to be more precise the United States came to the 6:10 view especially in 1990 91 and then with the end of the Soviet 6:16 Union that the US now ran the world and that the US did not have to 6:24 heed anybody's views red lines con concerns 6:30 security viewpoints or any International 6:35 obligations or any un framework I'm sorry to put it so plainly but I do want 6:44 you to understand I tried very hard in 6:52 1991 to get help for gorbachov who I think was the greatest Statesman of our 6:57 modern time I recently read the archived memo of the 7:05 National Security Council discussion of my proposal how they 7:11 completely dismissed it and laughed it off the table when I said that the 7:16 United States should help the Soviet Union in financial stabilization and in making its 7:24 reforms and the memo documents including some of my former colleagues at Harvard 7:31 in particular saying we will do the minimum that we will do to prevent 7:37 disaster but the minimum it's not our job to help quite the contrary it's not 7:43 our interest to help when the Soviet Union ended in 7:50 1991 the view became even more exaggerated and I can name chapter and 7:58 verse but the view was We Run The Show Cheney Wolowitz and many other 8:06 names that you will have come to know literally believed this is now a US 8:14 World and we will do as we want we will clean up from the former Soviet Union we 8:23 will take out any remaining allies countries like Iraq Syria 8:30 and so forth will go and we've been experiencing this foreign 8:36 policy for now essentially 33 8:43 years Europe has paid a heavy price for this because Europe has not had any 8:49 foreign policy during this period that I can figure out no voice no Unity no Clarity no 8:58 European interests only American 9:04 loyalty there were moments where there were disagreements and very uh I think 9:10 uh wonderful disagreements especially in the last time of significance was 2003 9:17 in the Iraq War when France and Germany said we don't support the United States 9:24 uh going around the UN Security Council for this war that war by the way was 9:30 directly concocted by Netanyahu and his colleagues in the US 9:38 uh Pentagon I'm not saying that it was a link or mutuality I'm saying it was a 9:46 direct war that was a war carried out for Israel it was a war that Paul wolfowitz 9:53 and Douglas feith coordinated with Netanyahu and that was the last time 10:00 that Europe had a voice and I spoke with European leaders 10:07 then and they were very clear and it was uh quite 10:15 wonderful Europe lost its voice entirely after that but especially in 10:22 2008 now what happened after 1991 to get to 2008 is that NATO Enlargement 10:30 the United States decided that unipolarity meant that NATO would 10:36 enlarge somewhere from Brussels to Vlados step by step there would be no 10:42 end to Eastward enlargement of NATO this would be the US unipolar World 10:51 if you play the game of Risk as a child like I did this is the US idea to have 10:58 the peace on on every part of the board any place without a US military base is 11:05 an enemy basically neutrality is a dirty word in 11:10 the US political lexicon perhaps the dirtiest word at 11:15 least if you're an enemy we know you're an enemy if you are neutral you're 11:21 subversive because then you're really against us because you're not telling us you're pretending to be neutral 11:30 so this was the mindset and the decision was taken formally in 11:35 1994 when President Clinton signed off on NATO enlargement to the east you will 11:42 recall that in February 7th 11:47 1991 Hans Dietra genter and James Baker III spoke with 11:54 gorbachov genter gave a press conference afterwards where he explained 11:59 NATO will not move Eastward we will not take advantage of the dissolution of the 12:08 Warsaw Pact and understand that was in a 12:13 juridical context not a casual context this was the end of World War II being negotiated 12:21 for German reunification and an agreement was 12:26 made that NATO will not move one in Eastford and it was explicit and it is 12:33 in countless documents and just look up National Security Archive of George 12:39 Washington University and you can get dozens of documents it's a website called what gorbachov heard about NATO 12:48 take a look because everything you're told by the US is a lie about this but 12:54 the archives are perfectly clear so the decision was taken in 13:01 1994 to expand NATO all the way to 13:06 Ukraine this is a project this is not one Administration or another this is a 13:13 US Government project that started more than 30 years 13:23 ago in 1997 zign binski wrote The Grand 13:30 chessboard that is not just musings of Mr binski that is the presentation of 13:36 the decisions of the United States government explained to the public which 13:42 is how these books work and the book describes the Eastward 13:48 enlargement of Europe and of NATO as simultaneous 13:55 events and there's a good chapter in that book that says what will Russia do as Europe 14:04 and NATO expand Eastward and I knews big binski 14:11 personally he was very nice to me I I was advising Poland he was a big help he 14:18 was a very nice and smart man and he got everything wrong so in 1997 he wrote In detail why 14:29 Russia could do nothing but exceed to the Eastward expansion of NATO and 14:35 Europe in fact he says the Eastward expansion of Europe and not just Europe but NATO this was a plan a 14:44 project and he explains how Russia will never align with 14:49 China Unthinkable Russia will never align with 14:55 Iran Russia has no vocation other than the European vocation so as Europe moves 15:02 East there's nothing Russia can do about it so says yet another American 15:09 strategist is it any question why we're in war all the 15:14 time because one thing about America is we always know what our counterparts are 15:20 going to do and we always get it wrong and one reason we always get it 15:26 wrong is that in game theory that the American strategists play you don't 15:32 actually talk to the other side you just know what the other side strategy is 15:38 that's it's wonderful it saves so much time you don't need any 15:48 diplomacy so this project began and we had a continuity of government for 30 15:56 years until maybe yesterday 16:02 perhaps 30 years of a project Ukraine and Georgia were the keys to the project 16:12 why because America learned everything it knows from the 16:18 British and so we are the wannabe British 16:24 Empire and what the British Empire understood in 185 16:29 53 Mr Palmer Lord Palmerston excuse me is that you surround Russia in the 16:37 Black Sea and you deny Russia access to the Eastern 16:43 Mediterranean and all you're watching is an American project to do that in the 16:50 21st century the idea 16:55 was that there would be Ukraine Romania Bulgaria turkey and 17:03 Georgia as the Black Sea literal that would deprive Russia of any 17:12 International status by blocking the Black Sea and essentially 17:19 by neutralizing Russia as more than a local power brinsky is completely clear 17:26 about this and before rinsky there was mender and who owns the island of the 17:34 world owns the world so this project goes back a long time I think it goes 17:40 back basically to Palmerston in 19 and again I've lived 17:49 through every Administration I've known these presidents I've known their teams nothing changed much from Clinton 17:57 to Bush to Obama to Trump one to 18:02 Biden maybe they got worse step by step Biden was the worst in my 18:09 view uh maybe also because he was not compos mtis for the last couple of years 18:16 and I say that seriously not as a snarky remark the American political system is 18:23 a system of image it's a system of media manipulation every day 18:29 it is a PR system and so you could have a president that basically doesn't 18:35 function and have that in power for two years and actually have that President 18:42 run for reelection and one damn thing is he had to stand on a stage for 90 18:47 minutes by himself and that was the end of it had it not been that mistake he 18:53 would have gone on to have his candidacy whether he was sleeping after 400 p.m. in the afternoon or 18:59 not so this is actually the reality everybody goes along with it it's 19:06 impolite to say anything that I'm saying because we don't speak the truth about 19:12 almost anything in this world right now so this project went on from the 19:19 1990s bombing Belgrade 78 straight days in 1999 was part of this project 19:27 splitting a part the country when borders are Sacro San aren't they indeed 19:33 except for Kosovo that's fine because borders are sacrosanct except when America changes 19:42 them Sudan was another related project the South Sudan Rebellion did 19:50 that just happen because South Sudanese rebelled or can I give you the CIA 19:57 Playbook to please understand as grown-ups what this is 20:04 about military events are costly they require equipment 20:10 training base camps intelligence finance that comes from Big 20:18 powers that doesn't come from local 20:23 insurrections South Sudan did not defeat North Sudan or Sudan 20:30 in a tribal battle it was a US project I would go often to Nairobi and 20:39 meet us military or senators or others with deep interest in Sudan's 20:48 politics this was part of the game of 20:53 unipolarity so the NATO enlargement as you know started in 1999 with Hungary 20:59 Poland and the Czech Republic and Russia was extremely unhappy about it but these were 21:06 countries still far from the border and Russia protested but of course to no avail then 21:15 George Bush Jr came in when 911 occurred President Putin pledged all 21:22 support and then the US uh decided in 21:28 September mber 20th 21:33 2001 that it would launch seven wars in five years and you can listen to General 21:41 Wesley Clark online talk about that he was NATO Supreme Commander in 21:47 1999 he went to the Pentagon on September 20th 2001 he was handed the 21:53 paper explaining seven wars these by the way were Netanyahu 21:59 Wars the idea was partly to clean up old Soviet allies and partly to take out 22:06 supporters of Hamas and Hezbollah because netanyahu's idea was 22:12 there will be one state thank you only one state it will be Israel Israel will 22:18 control all of the territory and anyone that objects we will overthrow not we 22:25 exactly our friend the United States that's US policy until this 22:32 morning we don't know whether it will change now the only wrinkle is that 22:37 maybe the US will own Gaza instead of Israel owning Gaza but the idea has been around at 22:46 least for 25 years it actually goes back to a 22:51 document called clean break that Netanyahu and his American political team put together in 1996 to end the 23:01 idea of the two-state solution you can also find it online so these are projects these are 23:08 long-term events these aren't is it Clinton is it bush is it 23:15 Obama That's the boring way to look at American politics as the day-to-day game but 23:21 that's not what American politics is so the next round of NATO enlargement 23:27 came in 2004 with seven more countries the three Baltic states 23:34 Romania Bulgaria Slovenia and Slovakia at this point Russia was pretty 23:41 damn upset this was a complete violation of the postwar order 23:49 agreed with German reunification essentially it was 23:55 a it it was a fundamental trick or defection of the US from a Cooperative 24:02 Arrangement is what it amounted to because they believe in 24:10 unipolarity so as everybody recalls because we just had the Munich security conference last week in 2007 President 24:17 Putin said stop enough enough stop 24:23 now and of course what that meant was in 2008 the United States Jam down Europe's 24:29 throat enlargement of NATO to Ukraine and Georgia this is a long-term 24:35 project I listened to Mr sakash in New York in May of 2008 and I walked out 24:44 called Sonia and said this man's crazy and a month later a war broke out 24:50 because the United States told this guy we save Georgia and he stands at the 24:57 Council on Foreign ation says Georgia's in the center of Europe well it ain't 25:03 ladies and gentlemen it's not in the center of Europe and the most recent events are 25:10 not helpful for Georgia for its safety and your MPS going there or MEPS going 25:16 there and European politicians that gets Georgia destroyed that doesn't save Georgia that gets Georgia 25:24 destroyed completely destroyed in 20 8 as everybody knows our former CIA 25:33 director William Burns sent a long message back to condalisa Rice net means 25:38 net about expansion this we know from Julian Assange because believe me not 25:45 one word is told to the American people about anything or to you or by any of 25:51 your newspapers these days so we have Julian Assange to thank 25:57 but we can read the memo in detail as you know Victor yanukovich was 26:03 elected in 2010 on the platform of neutrality Russia had no 26:11 territorial interests or designs in Ukraine at all I know I was there during these PE 26:19 these years what Russia was negotiating was a 25-year lease to 2042 26:28 for saastal Naval Base that's it not for Crimea not for the donbas 26:35 nothing like that this idea that Putin is 26:40 reconstructing the Russian Empire this is childish propaganda excuse me if 26:48 anyone knows the daytoday and year-to-year history this is childish 26:55 stuff childish stuff seems to work better than adult old stuff so no designs at all the United 27:04 States decided this man must be overthrown it's called a regime change 27:11 operation there have been about a hundred of them by the United States many in your 27:18 countries and many all over the world that's what the CIA does for a 27:26 living okay please know it it's a very unusual kind of foreign policy but in 27:34 America if you don't like the other side you don't negotiate with them you try to 27:41 overthrow them preferably covertly if it doesn't work covertly you 27:49 do it overtly you always say it's not our fault they're the aggressor they're the 27:56 other side they're Hitler that comes up every two or three years whether it's 28:01 Saddam Hussein whether it's Assad whether it's Putin that's very 28:06 convenient that's the only foreign policy explanation the American people are ever given 28:14 anywhere well we're facing Munich 1938 well we're facing Munich 1938 can't talk 28:21 to the other side they're evil implacable foes that's the only model of foreign 28:28 policy we ever hear from our mass media and the mass media repeats it entirely 28:36 because it's completely suborned by the US government now in 2014 Ukraine Euromaidan 28:44 2014 the US worked actively to overthrow 28:50 yanukovich everybody knows the phone call intercepted by my Columbia University colleague Victoria nuland 28:59 and the US ambassador Peter Pat can't remember if I told you this or 29:04 if I only told Washington this that when I talked to Jeff feltman this morning he had a new name for the UN guy Robert 29:11 Siri did I write you that this morning yeah I saw that he's now gotten both 29:17 Siri and Bon kimoon to agree that Siri could come in Monday or Tuesday okay so 29:24 that would be great I think to help glue this thing and have the un help glue it and you know the EU no exactly and 29:32 I think we've got to do something to make it stick together because you can be pretty sure that if it does if it 29:37 does start to gain altitude the Russians will be working behind the scenes to try to torpedo it you don't get better 29:44 evidence the Russians intercepted her call and they put it on the internet 29:49 listen to it it's fascinating I know all these people by the way by doing that they all 29:57 got promoted in the Biden Administration that's the job now when 30:04 the maidon occurred I was called immediately oh Professor Sachs the new 30:11 Ukrainian prime minister would like to see you to talk about the economic 30:17 crisis because I'm pretty good at that and so I flew to 30:23 Kiev and I was walked around the maidan and and I was told how the US 30:30 paid the money for all the people around the maidan 30:36 spontaneous revolution of dignity ladies and Gentlemen 30:42 please where do all these media Outlets come from where does all this 30:47 organization come from where do all these buses come from where do all these people called in come from are you 30:55 kidding this is organized and 31:00 effort and it's not a secret except to citizens of Europe and 31:09 the United States everyone else understands it quite 31:14 clearly then came Minsk and especially Minsk Minsk Agreements 31:20 2 which by the way was modeled on South troan 31:26 autonomy and the belg could have related to MS2 very well it 31:32 said there should be autonomy for the Russians speaking regions in the east of 31:39 Ukraine it was supported unanimously by the UN Security 31:45 Council the United States and Ukraine decided it was not to 31:51 be enforced Germany and France which were the guarantors of the Normandy process 31:59 Let It Go and it was absolutely another direct 32:07 American unipolar action with Europe as usual playing 32:13 completely useless subsidiary role even though it was a guarantor of the 32:20 agreement Trump one raised the armaments there were many thousands of 32:28 deaths in the shelling by Ukraine in the donbas there was no Minsk 2 32:35 agreement and then Biden came into office and again I know all these people 32:42 I used to be a member of the democratic party I now am strictly sworn to be a 32:50 member of no party because both are the same 32:56 anyway and because this is I the Democrats became complete warmongers 33:02 over time and there not was not one voice about peace just like most of your 33:10 parliamentarians the same way so at the end of 33:19 1991 Putin put on the table a last effort in two security agreement draft 33:28 one with Europe and one with the United States the US put on the table December 15th n uh 33:36 2021 I had an hour call with Jake Sullivan in the white house Sachs' Call with Jake Sullivan 33:42 begging Jake avoid the war you can avoid the war all you have 33:49 to do is say nato will not enlarge to Ukraine and he said to me oh NATO is not 33:58 going to enlarge to Ukraine don't worry about it I said Jake say it publicly no 34:04 no no we can't say it publicly said Jake you're going to have a war over 34:10 something that isn't even going to happen he said don't worry Jeff there will be no 34:17 war these are not very bright people I'm telling you if I can give you 34:25 my honest view they're not very bright people and I've dealt with them for more than 40 34:30 years they talk to themselves they don't talk to anybody else they play game 34:37 theory in non-cooperative Game Theory you don't talk to the other side you 34:42 just make your strategy this is the essence of Game 34:50 Theory it's not negotiation Theory it's not peacemaking Theory it is UN atal 34:59 non-cooperative theory if you know formal Game Theory that's what they play 35:04 it started at the Rand Corporation that's what they still play in 2019 35:09 there's a paper by Rand how do we extend Russia do you know they wrote a paper 35:15 which Biden followed how do we annoy Russia that's literally the strategy how 35:23 do we annoy Russia we're trying to provoke it trying to make could break 35:28 apart maybe have regime change maybe have unrest maybe have economic 35:33 crisis that's what you call your ally are you 35:41 [Music] kidding so I had a long and 35:46 frustrating phone call with suvan I was standing out in the freezing 35:52 cold I happen to be H trying to have a ski day 35:58 and there I was Jake don't have the war oh there'll be no war 36:04 Jeff we know a lot of what happened the next month which is that they refus to NATO's Open Door Policy 36:12 negotiate the stupidest idea of NATO is the so-called open door 36:18 policy are you kidding NATO reserves the right to go where it wants without any 36:26 neighbor having any say whatsoever well I tell the Mexicans and 36:32 the Canadians don't try it you know Trump may want to take over Canada 36:40 so Canada could say to China why don't you build a military base uh in uh in in 36:47 Ontario I wouldn't advise it and the United States would not say 36:53 well it's an open door that's their business I mean they can do what they want that's not our 36:59 business but grown-ups in Europe repeat this in Europe in your commission your 37:08 high representative this is nonsense stuff this is not even baby 37:17 geopolitics this is just not thinking at all so the war started what was Putin's Putin's Intentions in Ukraine 37:25 intention in the war I can tell you what his intention was it was to force 37:33 zalinski to negotiate neutrality and that happened within 7 37:41 Days of the start of the invasion you should understand this not 37:48 the propaganda that's written about this oh that they failed and he was going to take over 37:54 Ukraine come on ladies and gentlemen understand something 37:59 basic the idea was to keep NATO and what is NATO it's the United 38:06 States off of Russia's border no more no 38:12 less I should add one very important Point why are they so interested first 38:22 because if China or Russia decided to have a military base on the Rio Grand or 38:29 in uh the Canadian border Not only would the United States freak out we'd have 38:34 War within about 10 minutes but because the United States 38:40 unilaterally abandoned the anti-ballistic missile treaty in 2002 38:46 and ended the nuclear arms control framework by doing so and this is extremely important to 38:55 understand the nuclear Arms Control framework is based on trying to block a 39:01 first strike the ABM Treaty was a critical component of that the US unilaterally 39:08 walked out of the ABM Treaty in 2002 it blew a Russian gasket so everything I've 39:15 been describing is in the context of the destruction of the nuclear framework as well and starting in 2010 the US put in 39:24 AIS missile systems in Poland and then in 39:29 Romania and Russia doesn't like that and one of the issues on the table in 39:35 December and January December 2021 January 2022 was does the United States 39:42 claim the right to put missile systems in Ukraine and blinkin told lavro in 39:49 January 2022 the United States reserves the right to put middle missile systems 39:55 wherever it wants that's 40:00 your putative Ally and now let's put intermediate 40:06 missile systems back in Germany the United States walked out of the INF treaty unilaterally in 2019 there is no 40:14 nuclear arms framework right now 40:21 none when zalinsky said in seven days let's 2022 Peace Talks 40:26 negotiate I know the details of this 40:31 exquisitly because I've talked to all the parities in 40:36 detail within a couple of weeks there was a document 40:42 exchanged that President Putin had approved that lavro had presented that 40:47 was being managed by the Turkish mediators I flew to anchora to listen in 40:54 detail to what the mediators were doing Ukraine walked away unilaterally 41:02 from a near agreement why because the United States 41:09 told them to because the UK added icing to the cake by having 41:18 Bojo go in early April to Ukraine and 41:24 explain and he has recently and if your security is in the hands of Boris 41:29 Johnson God help us all Keith starmer turns out to be even 41:35 worse it's unimaginable but it is 41:42 true Boris Johnson has explained and you can look it 41:47 up on the website that what's at stake here is Western 41:54 hegemony not Ukraine Western he 42:00 Michael and I met at the Vatican with a group in the spring of 42:05 20122 where we wrote a document explaining nothing good can come out of 42:11 this war for Ukraine negotiate now because anything that takes time will mean massive amounts of deaths risk of 42:20 nuclear escalation and likely loss of the 42:26 war I wouldn't change one word from what we wrote then nothing was wrong in that 42:32 document and since that document since the US talked the negotiators away from 42:38 the table about a million ukrainians have died or been severely 42:45 wounded and the American Senators who are as nasty and cynical and corrupt as 42:54 imaginable say this is wonderful expenditure of our money because no Americans are 43:00 dying it's the pure proxy war one of our Senators near by me uh 43:07 Blumenthal says this out loud Mitt Romney says this out loud it's 43:14 best money America can spend no Americans are dying it's 43:21 unreal now just to bring us up to yesterday 43:28 this failed this project failed the idea of the project was that Russia would 43:34 fold its hand the idea all along was Russia can't 43:40 resist as big new binski explained in 1997 the Americans thought we have the 43:47 upper hand we're going to win because we're going to Bluff them they're not really 43:54 going to fight they're not really going to mobilize the nuclear option of cutting them out 44:00 of Swift that's going to do them in the 44:06 economic sanctions that's going to do them in the himars that's going to do them in 44:13 the attacks the f-16s honestly I've listened to this for 44:21 70 years I've listened to it as semi understanding I'd say for 44:27 about 56 years they speak nonsense every day my 44:33 country my government this is so familiar to me completely familiar I begged the 44:42 ukrainians and I had a track record with the ukrainians I advised the ukrainians I'm not anti-ukrainian I'm pro-ukrainian 44:49 completely I said save your lives save your sovereignty save your territory be 44:55 neutral don't listen to the Americans I repeated to them the famous 45:01 adage of Henry Kissinger that to be an enemy of the United States is dangerous 45:07 but to be a friend is fatal okay so let me repeat that for 45:13 Europe to be an enemy of the United States is dangerous but to be a friend 45:18 is fatal so let me now finalize a few words Donald Trump 45:26 about Trump 45:31 Trump does not want the losing hand this is 45:38 why it is more likely than not this war will end because Trump and President Putin 45:47 will agree to end the war if Europe does all its great 45:54 warmongering it doesn't matter the war is ending so get it out of your 46:02 system please tell your colleagues it's 46:07 over and it's over because Trump doesn't want to carry a 46:14 loser that's it it's not some great morality he doesn't want to carry a 46:21 loser this is a loser the one that will be saved by the 46:26 negoti iations taking place right now is Ukraine second is Europe your stock 46:33 markets rising in recent Days by the horrible news of negotiations I know 46:40 this has been met with the sheer Horror in these Chambers but this is the best 46:47 news that you could get now I encouraged they don't listen to me but I 46:55 tried to reach out to some of the European leaders most don't want to hear 47:00 anything from me at all but I said don't go to 47:08 Kiev go to Moscow discuss with your 47:13 counterparts are you kidding you're Europe you're 450 million people your $ 47:19 20 trillion economy you should be the main economic 47:25 Trading partner of Russia it's natural 47:31 links by the way if anyone would like to discuss how the US blew up nordstream 47:37 I'd be happy to talk about 47:43 that so the Trump Administration is 47:49 imperialist at heart it is a great 47:55 powers dominate the world it is we will do what we want when 48:01 we can we will be better than a 48:08 ccent Biden and we'll cut our losses where we have 48:14 to there are several war zones in the world the Middle East being another we 48:20 don't know what will happen with that again if Europe had a proper policy you 48:26 could stop that war I'll explain how but war with China is also a 48:36 possibility so I'm not saying that we're at the new age of 48:42 Peace but we are in a uh very uh different kind of politics 48:51 right now and Europe should have a foreign policy and not just a foreign policy of 48:59 russophobia a foreign policy that is a realistic foreign policy that 49:04 understands Russia's situation that understands Europe's situation that understands what America is and what it 49:10 stands for that tries to avoid Europe being invaded by the 49:17 United States because it's not impossible that 49:23 America will just land troops in Danish territory 49:28 I'm not joking and I don't think they're joking and Europe needs a foreign policy 49:35 a real one not a yes we'll bargain with 49:41 Mr Trump and meet him halfway you know what that will be like 49:47 give me a call afterwards please don't have American 49:55 officials as head of Europe have European officials 50:02 please have a European foreign policy you're going to be living with 50:07 Russia for a long time so please negotiate with 50:12 Russia there are real security issues on the table but the bombast and the 50:21 russophobia is not serving your security at all it's not serving you security at 50:27 all and contributed to a million casualties in Ukraine from this idiotic 50:34 American Adventure that you signed on to and then became the lead cheerleaders 50:40 of solves Middle East 50:45 nothing on the Middle East by the way the 50:51 US completely handed over foreign policy to Netanyahu 30 years ago ago the Israel 50:58 Lobby dominates American politics just have no doubt about it I could explain 51:06 for hours how it works it's very dangerous I'm hoping that Trump will not 51:14 destroy his administration and worse the Palestinian people because of Netanyahu who I regard 51:22 as a war criminal uh properly indicted by the 51:29 IC and that needs to be told no more that there will be a state of Palestine 51:36 on the borders of the 4th of June 1967 according to international law as 51:42 the only way for peace it's the only way for Europe to have peace on your borders 51:50 with the Middle East is the two-state solution there is only one obst Le to it 51:57 by the way and that is the veto of the United States and the UN Security Council so if you want to have some 52:04 influence tell the United States Drop The veto you are together with 180 countries 52:13 in the world the only ones that oppose a Palestinian state 52:19 are the United States Israel Micronesia naaru 52:27 poao Papa guini Mr 52:32 Malay and Paraguay so this is a place where Europe 52:39 could have a big influence Europe has gone silent about the jcpoa and 52:46 Iran netanyahu's greatest dream in life is a war between the United States and 52:52 Iran he's not given up and it's not impossible that that would come 52:58 also and that's because the US in this regard does not have an independent 53:04 foreign policy it is run by Israel it's tragic it's amazing by the 53:12 way and it could end Trump may say that 53:18 he wants foreign policy back maybe I'm hoping that it's the case finally let me China 53:24 just say with respect to China China CH is not an enemy China is just a success 53:31 story that's why it is viewed by the United States as an enemy because China 53:38 is a bigger economy than the United States that's 53:46 [Applause] 53:55 all there 54:01 [Applause] 54:07 thanks very well now questions please don't make any 54:12 statements just make questions because we are too many and we we don't have 54:18 that all that much time so um where do I start I start with on the left side I 54:25 have a preference to left as you know you come all yeah go ahead uh thank you Jeffrey 54:32 Sak uh from the Czech Republic we are glad we have you here uh we have a problem uh we were cursed by a witch who Europe-Russia Relations 54:39 uh told the EU and the EU is marked uh so uh it won't be improved until 54:46 2029 but what we the central Europeans should do in the meantime especially if 54:52 the Germans doesn't don't happen to vote for SAR enough uh are we supposed to create some 55:00 kind of neutrality for the Central Europe or what would you suggest us to do 55:08 yeah so uh first of all uh all my 55:13 grandchildren are Czech I want you to know uh and Sonia is a Czech born and 55:20 Czech citizen um so we're very proud uh I'm I'm the trailing spouse in this but 55:26 I'm a check wannabe 55:34 um Europe needs to have a foreign policy that is a European foreign policy and it 55:41 needs to be a realist foreign policy realist is not hate realist is actually 55:48 trying to understand both sides and to negotiate there are two kinds of 55:54 realists a defensive realist an offensive realist uh my dear friend John 56:00 mimer who is the offensive realist I I we're very close friends and I love him 56:06 but I believe more than he does you talk to the other side and you find a way to 56:12 make uh an understanding and so basically 56:21 uh Russia is not going to invade Europe this is the fundamental point it may get 56:29 up to the deeper River it's not going to invade Europe 56:35 but there are real issues the the main issue for Russia was 56:42 the United States because Russia as a major power and a the largest nuclear 56:50 power in the world was profoundly concerned about us unipolarity 56:56 from the beginning now that this is seemingly possibly ending Europe has to open 57:04 negotiations directly with Russia as well because the United States will quickly lose interest and you're going 57:11 to be living with Russia for the next thousands of years okay so what do you want you want 57:20 to make sure that the Baltic states are secure the best thing for the Baltic 57:25 states is to stop their russophobia this is the most important 57:33 thing Estonia has about 25% Russian citizens Russian speaking citizens 57:39 ethnic Russians Lota the 57:45 same don't provoke the neighbor that's 57:52 all this is not hard it really isn't Hur and again I 57:59 want to explain my point of view I have helped these countries the 58:05 ones I'm talking about trying to advise I'm not their enemy I'm not Putin's puppet I'm not Putin's 58:12 apologist I worked in Estonia they gave me I don't it's not I think it's the 58:19 second highest civilian honor that a president of Estonia can bestow on a 58:24 non-national because I designed their currency system for them in 58:31 1992 so I'm giving them advice do not stand there Estonia and say we want to 58:37 break up Russia are you kidding don't this is not how to survive in this 58:46 world you survive with mutual respect 58:52 actually you survive in negotiation you survive in discussion you don't 58:59 Outlaw the Russian language not a good idea when 25% of 59:05 your population is has a first language of Russian it's not right even if there 59:12 weren't a giant On the Border it wouldn't be the right thing to do you'd 59:18 have it as an official language you'd have a language of a in lower school you 59:24 wouldn't antagonize the Russian Orthodox church so basically we need to behave 59:31 like grown-ups and when I constantly 59:38 say that they're acting like children Sonia always says to me that's unfair to 59:46 children because this is worse than children we have a six-year-old 59:52 granddaughter and a three-year-old grandson and they actually make up with their 1:00:00 friends and we don't tell them go just just ridicule them tomorrow and every 1:00:08 day we say go give them a hug and go 1:00:13 play and they do this is not 1:00:19 hard by the way well anyway I won't be labor the point Thank you so elect the 1:00:25 new I should say all I should say is change change 1:00:31 policy I don't want to have a political leaning here yeah maybe a lady and does that work yeah hi my name 1:00:39 is Cara I'm a reporter with the Brussels times um thank you for the fascinating talk Jeffrey um I just wanted to ask you NATO 5% Defence Spending 1:00:45 about Trump's statements about wanting uh NATO members to increase their spending by 5% and we're now seeing lots 1:00:51 of countries scrambling to prove that they're going to do that including Belgium and given that Belgium is also 1:00:56 the NATO headquarters um I wanted to ask you what would be the appropriate response to those statements by NATO 1:01:02 members thanks great thank you uh we don't see exactly eye eye on this 1:01:08 question so let me let me give you my own uh my own view 1:01:14 um my first recommendation with all respect to Brussels is move the NATO 1:01:20 headquarters somewhere else uh I I mean it's seriously because one 1:01:28 of the worst parts of European policy right now is a complete 1:01:34 confusion of Europe and NATO these are completely different but 1:01:39 they became exactly the same Europe is much better than 1:01:46 nato in my opinion NATO isn't even needed anymore I would have ended it in 1:01:54 1991 but because the US viewed it as a 1:01:59 instrument of aemy not as a defense against Russia it 1:02:04 continued afterwards but the confusion of NATO and Europe is 1:02:12 deadly because expanding Europe meant expanding NATO period and these should have been 1:02:20 completely different things so this is uh the first point 1:02:27 my own view again with all respect to Michael we only had a brief conversation 1:02:32 about it is that Europe should have Europe basically should have its own 1:02:38 foreign policy and its own uh its own military security its own 1:02:45 strategic autonomy so-called and it should I'm in favor of that I would disband NATO and maybe Trump is going to 1:02:53 do it anyway maybe Trump's going to invade Greenland who knows then you're really 1:02:59 going to find out what NATO means 1:03:04 so I do think that Europe should invest in its 1:03:09 security 5% is outlandish ridiculous 1:03:16 absurd completely absurd no one needs to spend anything like that 1:03:23 amount 2 to 3% of GDP probably under the current 1:03:30 circumstances what I would do by the way is by European 1:03:38 production because actually strangely 1:03:43 weirdly unfortunately in this world and it's a true truism but it's unfortunate 1:03:51 so I'm not championing it a lot of technological Innovation spins off from 1:03:59 the military sector because governments invest in the military 1:04:04 sector so Trump is a arms salesman you 1:04:10 understand that he's selling American 1:04:16 Arms he is selling American Technology Vance told you a few days ago 1:04:23 don't even think about having your own AI 1:04:28 technology so please understand that this increase of 1:04:34 spending is for the United States not for 1:04:40 you and in this sense I'm completely against that approach but I would not be against an 1:04:47 approach of Europe spending two to three% of GDP for a unified European 1:04:54 security structure and invested in Europe and European 1:05:00 technology and not having the United States dictate the use of European 1:05:07 technology it's so interesting it's the Netherlands that produces the only 1:05:12 Machines of advanced semiconductors extreme ultraviolet 1:05:19 lithography it's asml but America determines every policy of asml 1:05:26 the Netherlands doesn't even have a footnote I wouldn't do that if I were 1:05:32 you hand over all security to the United States I wouldn't do it I would have 1:05:39 your own security framework so you can have your own foreign policy framework 1:05:45 as well Europe stands for lots of things that the United States does not stand 1:05:51 for Europe stands for climate action by the way rightly so because our 1:05:57 president is completely Bonkers on this and Europe stands for 1:06:04 indecency for social democracy as an ethos I'm not talking about a party I'm 1:06:10 talking about an ethos of how equality of Life 1:06:16 occurs Europe stands for multilateralism Europe stands for the UN 1:06:21 Charter the US stands for none of those things you know that our secretary of state Marco Rubio 1:06:30 cancelled his trip to South Africa because on the agenda was equality and 1:06:38 sustainability and he said I'm not getting into that that is an honest reflection of 1:06:46 deep anglosaxon 1:06:51 libertarianism egalitarianism is not a word of the American 1:06:57 lexicon sustainable development not at all you probably know by the way that of 1:07:04 the 193 UN member states 1:07:10 191 have had sdg plans presented as voluntary National reviews 1:07:17 191 two have not Haiti and the United 1:07:22 States of America the the Biden Administration wasn't even allowed to say sustainable 1:07:29 development goals the treasury had a policy not to say sustainable 1:07:34 development goals okay I mention all of this because you need your own foreign 1:07:41 policy I issue a report two reports each year one the world happiness report and 1:07:48 18 of the top 20 countries if I I remember correctly are European this is 1:07:53 the highest quality of life in the world so you need your own policy to 1:07:59 protect that quality of life the United States ranks way 1:08:05 down and the other report where's my colleague Gom is somewhere in the room 1:08:10 here there he is Gom La foron is the lead author of our annual sustainable 1:08:16 development report and almost all of the top 20 countries are European countries 1:08:23 because you believe in this stuff and that's why you're the happiest except in 1:08:32 geopolitics but quality of life so you need your 1:08:37 own foreign policy but you won't have it unless you have your own security you 1:08:42 just won't and so and by the way 27 countries cannot each have their own 1:08:49 foreign policy this is a problem you need a European foreign policy and and a 1:08:55 European security structure and by the way although Michael assures me it's dead I was the greatest fan of 1:09:04 osce and believe that occe is the proper framework for European security it could 1:09:11 really work okay and um afterwards first thank 1:09:19 you thank you very much you at the lunch no you can yeah yeah okay uh well uh thank you Professor I'm from Slovakia 1:09:26 and my prime minister Robert fito was almost shot dead because the opinions you had the similar with him uh yes we 1:09:34 are as a Slovakia Slovak government of the few countries in the European Union we are talking to Russians uh two months 1:09:41 ago I was talking with Mr medv uh in two weeks I will be talking uh in Duma with 1:09:47 Mr slutzki who is the chairman of the Russian uh foreign affairs Committee in uh Moscow maybe my question is what 2025 Peace Negotiations 1:09:54 would you be your message to Russians in this moment because as I heard they are on 1:10:00 the Victorious wave they have no reason to not to conquer the dbas because that's their War aim and what can Trump 1:10:07 uh can offer to them uh to stop the war immediately what would be what would be 1:10:13 the message for Russians from your side thank you very 1:10:20 much lots of uh important things are uh now on offer and on the table and I 1:10:27 believe that the war will end quickly because of this and this this will be at 1:10:34 least one blessing in a very uh very difficult time exactly what the 1:10:40 settlement will be I think uh is now only a question of the territorial 1:10:47 issues uh and that is whether it is the complete four OAS including all of Heron 1:10:55 and upper Asia or whether it is on the contact line and how all of this will be 1:11:01 negotiated I'm not in the room of the negotiations so I can't really say more 1:11:07 but the basis will be there will be territorial concessions there will be 1:11:14 neutrality there will be security guarantees for Ukraine for all parties 1:11:20 uh there will be at least with the US an end of the economic sanction 1:11:26 but what counts of course is Europe and Russia I think that there are and maybe 1:11:33 there will be a restoration of nuclear arms uh negotiations which would be 1:11:40 extraordinarily positive I think that there are tremendously important issues for 1:11:48 Europe to negotiate directly with Russia 1:11:53 and so I would urge uh president Costa and the leadership of Europe to open 1:12:01 direct discussions with President Putin because European security is on the 1:12:08 table I know the Russian leaders many of them quite well uh they are good 1:12:17 negotiators and uh you should negotiate with them uh and you should negotiate 1:12:23 well with them uh I would ask them some questions uh I 1:12:30 would ask them what are the security guarantees that can work so that this 1:12:36 war ends permanently what are the security guarantees for the Baltic states what 1:12:43 should be done part of the process of negotiation is actually to ask the other 1:12:48 side about your concerns not just to know what they know as you think is to 1:12:55 true but actually to ask we have a real problem we have a real worry what are 1:13:01 the guarantees well I want to know the answers also uh by the way I know Mr 1:13:07 lavro Minister lavro for 30 years I I regard him as a brilliant foreign minister uh talk with him negotiate with 1:13:16 him get ideas put ideas on the table put counter ideas on the table I don't think 1:13:22 all of this can be settled by pure reason because uh of oneself you settle 1:13:30 Wars by negotiating and understanding what are the real issues and you don't 1:13:36 call the other side a liar when they express their issues you work out what 1:13:42 the implications of that are for the mutual benefit of Peace So the most 1:13:50 important thing is stop the yelling stop the war mongering and discuss with the 1:13:58 Russian counterparts and don't beg to be at the table with the United States you 1:14:04 don't need to be in the room with the United States you're Europe you should be in the room with Europe and 1:14:11 Russia if the United States wants to join that's fine but to beg no and by the 1:14:19 way Europe does not need to have Ukraine in the room when Europe talks with 1:14:27 Russia you have a lot of issues direct issues don't hand over your foreign 1:14:34 policy to anybody not to the United States not to Ukraine not to 1:14:40 Israel keep a European foreign policy this is the basic idea 1:14:49 [Applause] 1:14:55 Hans noof from the sovereignist political group in this Parliament um alternative for Germany as political 1:15:02 party first of all let me thank you Mr Sax for being here and sharing your ideas with us and be assured that many 1:15:10 of your ideas and of your colleague John mimer have well been received by 1:15:16 political groups here and have been integrated into our agenda I widely Beginning of NATO Expansion 1:15:21 share your views um yet there's one question regarding the historical 1:15:27 account that you gave uh where I would like to go in some detail and This concerns the beginning of NATO expansion 1:15:36 um you um uh uh reported from uh um the 1:15:42 website um what gorbachov heard that there are many um quotations from Ganser 1:15:48 for example um that NATO will not move one inch eastwards now the two for 1:15:55 treaty has been signed in September 1990 right in Moscow so at that point in time 1:16:02 the waro PCT still existed and countries like Poland Hungary and czechia were not part of the 1:16:10 negotiations for the two and four treaty so The wara Pact actually dissolved in 1:16:16 July 1991 and the Soviet Union dissolved in December 1:16:21 1991 so nobody who was was present in the negotiations could speak for Poland 1:16:28 could speak for Hungary could speak for Slovakia that they would not try to become member of NATO once the overall 1:16:37 situation has changed so the counterargument um which we have to 1:16:42 counter um is that it was on the will of these countries of Poland of Hungary of 1:16:50 Slovakia that they wanted to join NATO because of the very hist 1:16:55 they had with the Soviet Union and of course Russia was still perceived in a 1:17:00 way um as a follower of the Soviet Union so how do you counter that 1:17:12 argument I have no doubt of why Hungary Poland Czech Republic Slovakia wanted to 1:17:21 join NATO the question is what is the US 1:17:27 doing to make peace because NATO is not a choice of Hungary Poland Czech 1:17:34 Republic or Slovakia NATO is a us-led military Alliance and the question is 1:17:42 how are we going to establish peace in a reliable way if I were uh making those decisions 1:17:52 back then I would have ended NATO nato altoe in 1:17:58 1991 when those countries requested NATO I would have explain to them what our 1:18:05 defense secretary William Perry said what our lead Statesman George Kenan 1:18:11 said what our final ambassador to the Soviet Union Jack Matlock said uh they 1:18:18 said well we understand your feelings but it's not a good idea because it could provoke a new cold war with Russia 1:18:26 so that's how I would have answered it when those countries joined uh in the 1:18:32 first wave I don't think it was that consequential in fact except that it was 1:18:40 part of a bigger project and the project was spelled out already in 1994 there's 1:18:46 a very good book by Jonathan Haslam Harvard University press called hubris 1:18:54 which uh gives a detailed historical documentation of step by step what 1:19:00 happened uh and uh it's it's really worth reading um so this is a now but 1:19:08 the point I would really make is that Ukraine and Georgia were too 1:19:16 far this is right up against Russia this is in the context of the 1:19:23 complete dest ization of the nuclear framework this is in the context of the 1:19:29 US putting in missile systems on Russia's borders if you listen to 1:19:34 President Putin over the years probably the main thing if you 1:19:39 listen carefully that he's concerned about is missiles 7 minutes from Moscow 1:19:45 is a decapitation strike and this is very real the US Not 1:19:51 only would freak out but did freak out when this happened in the Western 1:19:57 Hemisphere so it's the Cuban Missile Crisis in reverse and fortunately Nikita kushev 1:20:06 did not stand up and say open door policy of the Warsaw Pact we can go 1:20:13 wherever we want Cuba's asked us it's none of America's business what kushev said Is War my God 1:20:21 we don't want war we end this crisis we both pull back that's what kushev and 1:20:27 Kennedy decided in the end so this is the real consequential Russia even 1:20:34 swallowed with a lot of pain the Baltic states Romania Bulgaria Slovakia and 1:20:40 Slovenia it is Ukraine and Georgia and it's because of geography it's because 1:20:48 of Lord Palmerston it's because of the first Crimean War it's because of the 1:20:53 missile systems that this is the essence of why there was this 1:21:03 [Applause] war um yeah is there anybody else 1:21:10 because then we maybe close what you want to be the last one oh which one 1:21:19 oh can can we still continue yeah no you you come for the lunch don't take 1:21:25 you thank thank you very much Professor sax for coming um here um you've How to achieve a real European Foreign Policy 1:21:31 mentioned that the European Union needs to formulate its own foreign policy um in the past the German Franco Alliance 1:21:38 was a big driver for for those policies now with the Ukraine war arguably that 1:21:44 received the crack um do you think that in the future when the European Union is going to formulate this new foreign 1:21:49 policy that they are going to be again in the front seat or uh should it be other other countries or other blocks um 1:21:56 trying to make that change thank you very much oh it's hard it it's hard because 1:22:08 uh of course you don't yet have a a constitution for Europe which really 1:22:16 underpins a European foreign policy and it can't be by 1:22:22 unanimity there has to be a structure in which Europe can speak as Europe even 1:22:28 with some uh dissent but with the European policy I don't want to 1:22:35 oversimplify how to get there exactly but even with the structures you have 1:22:40 you could do a lot better with negotiating directly the first rule is 1:22:47 your diplomats should be diplomats not secretaries of War 1:22:58 honestly that would go halfway at least to where you want to 1:23:04 go a diplomat is a very special kind of 1:23:09 talent a diplomat is trained to sit together with the other side and to 1:23:16 listen to shake hands to smile and to be pleasant it's very hard it's a skill 1:23:25 it's training it's a profession it's not a 1:23:31 game you need that kind of 1:23:37 diplomacy I'm sorry we are not hearing anything like 1:23:45 that I'll just make a couple complaints first Europe is not NATO as I 1:23:53 said I thought stoltenberg was the worst but I was 1:24:00 wrong it just keeps getting worse could someone in NATO stop 1:24:08 talking for God's sake about more 1:24:14 war and could NATO stop speaking for Europe and Europe stop thinking it's 1:24:21 NATO this is the first absolute Point second I'm sorry but your high 1:24:28 representative vice presidents need to become 1:24:35 diplomats diplomacy means going to Moscow inviting your Russian counterpart 1:24:45 here discussing this doesn't happen till 1:24:52 now so this is really my point now 1:24:59 I believe that Europe should become more integrated and more unified in the years 1:25:06 ahead I'm a strong believer in subsidiarity so we were discussing I 1:25:13 don't think housing policy is really Europe's main issue I think this can be 1:25:19 handled at the local level or at the national level I don't see it as a European issue but I don't see foreign 1:25:26 policy as being a 27 country issue I see it being as a European issue and I see 1:25:33 security being at a European level so I think things need to be readjusted but 1:25:39 I'd like to see more Europe for truly European issues and maybe less Europe 1:25:45 for things that are properly subsidiary to Europe at the national and the local 1:25:50 level and I hope that uh such an Evolution can take place you know when 1:25:56 the world talks about great Powers right now they talk about us Russia China I 1:26:04 include India and I really want to include Europe and I really want to 1:26:10 include Africa as an African Union and I want that to happen but 1:26:17 you'll notice on the list Europe doesn't show up right now and this is because there is no European foreign policy 1:26:28 okay you maybe after you one more then we when I close is there is there 1:26:33 anybody wanted I would prefer a woman actually if I'm there you you you wanted 1:26:40 no first first this gentlemen and then you close okay sorry for this one it's 1:26:46 a thank you very much and thank you very much Professor for this very courageous speech very clear speech also that you 1:26:52 made I'm an MEP from Luxemburg uh my question is the following what are the long-term 1:26:58 consequences of this lost War we lost the war now we have an uncertain future for NATO we have also clearly and you 1:27:06 refer to it the marginalization of Europe we have um a strengthening of the 1:27:11 bricks countries which can be rivals in many uh respects so will there be a 1:27:17 future for a collective West over the next 20 or 30 years thank you very much 1:27:26 I I don't believe there is a collective West uh I believe that there is a United 1:27:32 States and Europe that are uh in some 1:27:37 areas uh in parallel interests and in many areas not in parallel 1:27:43 interest I I want Europe to lead uh sustainable The Future of the West 1:27:51 development climate transformation Global 1:27:56 decency I believe if the world world looked more like Europe it' be a happier 1:28:03 more peaceful safer world and long longevity and better food by the way uh 1:28:11 but uh just saying um in any event Europe has a vocation that is 1:28:17 rather different from the American tradition and frankly from the angloa 1:28:24 tradition because it's been 200 years of anglo-saxon hegemony or aspirational 1:28:31 hegemony the British still believe they run the world it's amazing what 1:28:36 nostalgia means uh they don't even stop 1:28:42 it's almost like a Monty Python skit actually uh but in any event 1:28:49 um where was I I'm thinking of Monty Python when uh 1:28:54 when the Knight gets all his limbs cut off and says everything's fine I'm Victorious that's Britain unfortunately 1:29:01 uh and so it's uh it's it's really terrible so no I don't believe in the 1:29:07 collective West I don't believe in the global South uh I don't believe in uh I 1:29:13 all these geographies don't even make sense because I'm actually you know I look at Maps a lot and the global South 1:29:20 is mostly in the North and the West is not even West uh and so I don't even 1:29:26 understand what this is about I do believe that um we could be in a true 1:29:36 age of abundance if we got our heads on straight we're in the biggest 1:29:43 technological advance in human history it's truly amazing what can be done 1:29:50 right now you know I Marvel at the fact that that somebody who knows no 1:29:56 chemistry won the Nobel Peace Prize for chemistry because he's very good at Deep 1:30:03 neural networks a genius Demis hbus 1:30:09 um they figured out protein folding uh that uh generations of biochemists spent 1:30:16 their whole lives on and now U Deep Mind figured out how to do it U you know uh 1:30:24 by the thousands of proteins we have friends that spent their entire life on one protein brilliant friends and uh now 1:30:32 what we can do so if actually and same with renewable energy as everybody knows 1:30:38 the prices come down by more than two orders of magnitude the costs we could 1:30:45 transform the planet we could protect the climate system we could protect biodiversity we could ensure every child 1:30:52 gets a good education we could do so many wonderful things right now and so 1:30:58 what do we need to do that in my view we need peace most importantly and my basic 1:31:06 point is there are no deep reasons for conflict 1:31:11 anywhere as every conflict I study is just a mistake it's not we are not 1:31:19 struggling for laon's real that idea that came from Mal 1:31:24 and it became a Nazi idea was always a wrong idea it was a mistake a 1:31:31 fundamental intellectual mistake an intellectual Mistake by the 1:31:37 way cuz leading scientists adopted the idea that we had race Wars we had 1:31:42 National Wars we had Wars of survival because we don't have enough on the planet as an economist I can tell you we 1:31:50 have plenty on the planet for everybody's development plenty we're not in a conflict with 1:31:57 China we're not in a conflict with Russia if we calm 1:32:04 down if you ask about the long term the long term is very good thank you the 1:32:11 long term if we don't blow ourselves up is very good and so this is what we 1:32:18 should aim for a positive shared Vision under International 1:32:24 law because of our technology things operate at a regional scale now it used 1:32:30 to be it was Villages then it was a it was small areas then it was unification 1:32:36 of countries now it's regional that's not just because regions are wonderful 1:32:42 it's because the underlying technological reality say Europe should be an integrated area by transport by 1:32:49 fast rail by digital by and so there's Europe the politics follows the 1:32:55 technological realities to a very important extent we're in a world of regions 1:33:00 now so Europe should be Europe with subsidiarity don't lose all of the 1:33:08 wonderful wonderful national and local elements but Europe should be Europe so 1:33:16 the good side is let's I want Europe to have diplomacy for example with Assan I 1:33:22 spend a lot of time with the aan countries if the the EU green deal wonderful 1:33:31 idea I said many years ago okay to the Assan leaders make an Assan green deal 1:33:39 and then talk with the Europeans so that you have this uh wonderful relationship 1:33:45 trade investment technology so last year they announced an aan green deal what 1:33:51 did Europe do about it nothing it said sorry we're in the Ukraine war thank you no interest so this is my 1:34:01 point the prospects are very positive if we construct the 1:34:08 piece [Applause] yeah because we have to go I get all the 1:34:16 time messages that I should here leave the room can you something very short yeah 1:34:23 um do you think that a way out of the conflict is some kind of style of Finlandization 1:34:28 finlandization um and then like is that what you would have sorry yeah is that what you would have lik to see like 1:34:35 Sweden and finland's foreign policy as an example like is that instead of them becoming members of NATO is that the way 1:34:42 that you would have likeed to see these countries handled out foreign policy um and do you think that these countries 1:34:49 that border Russia should just kind of succumb to their fate that okay we can't provoke Russia like this is the way we 1:34:54 have to live yeah very good excellent question and let me let me just report 1:35:03 one uh part about finlandization finlandization landed Finland number one in the world 1:35:11 happiness report year after year Rich successful happy and secure that's 1:35:21 prenado so finlandization was a wonderful thing number one in the world 1:35:28 when Sweden and Finland and Austria were neutral Bravo smart when Ukraine was 1:35:36 neutral smart if you have two superpowers keep them apart a little bit 1:35:42 you don't have to be right with your nose up against each other especially if one of them the US is pushing its nose 1:35:49 into the other one and so finlandization 1:35:55 to my mind has a very positive connotation so does Austrian 1:36:00 isation Austria 1955 signed its uh 1:36:06 neutrality the Soviet Army left and Austria is a wonderful place by the way 1:36:12 absolutely wonderful and so this is uh basic how to avoid conflict if the 1:36:19 United States had any sense at all it would have left these countries as a neutral space in between the US Military 1:36:29 and Russia but that's where the US lost it thank you very much let 1:36:35 [Applause] me I I just want to end with an appeal I 1:36:42 think we both agree that we will have a the war will end within a month or two 1:36:49 and that means the fighting will end it doesn't mean that we will have peace in Europe the peace in Europe that has to 1:36:54 be done by us by Europeans not by a president from the United States we have to create this peace and that is Europe 1:37:01 which includes of course Belarus Russia and all these other countries so we have to do something and we are here at 1:37:08 Parliament as a parliamentarians we represent people we are the only legitimate democratically legitimate 1:37:14 institution in the European Union maybe we should have become all a little bit more proactive in trying to move this 1:37:22 peace process forward cross party lines I think I don't know how many parties here really are but that we can talk to 1:37:27 each other without saying ah you're from this party you're from this party I think we really have to concentrate if 1:37:33 here we could not take more initiative from the parliament Visa V the commission and saying we are presenting 1:37:40 the people not you we are presenting the people and these people in Europe want peace and that's what we should go so 1:37:46 maybe this is the beginning of one we will make every month I will organize with my colleagues an or the same thing 1:37:53 here about different topics which were all around it and we hope that this one we get a discussion that is different 1:37:59 what we have in the plenum where we basically don't have a discussion but that we have a discussion and also 1:38:04 across the party and invite also people from other political parties we don't bite anybody let's discuss it in the end 1:38:11 we want all want this the same peace for the next generation and I have plenty of children grandchildren you too and 1:38:17 that's what we need okay thank you very much professor [Applause] [Music] 1:38:23 [Applause] [Music] 1:38:33 you

Princeton university head march 21 2025 https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/using-funding-to-force-concessions-threatens-institutions-princeton-president-says MY THOUGHTS 04262025 When I look at the investment of the federal government to research departments of select colleges or universities in the usa + the fiscal allowance of National College Athletic Association [ NCAA] to allow select colleges or universities in the usa to gain wealth while not paying athletes plus gaining athletes from demographic regions different from their own. I see how the white colleges or universities in the usa were engineered for growth. The tragedy is that the legal actions to actually aid Historical Black Colleges or Universities all came in the Schrumpft time as president. why? why not Obama? as Schrumpft said correctly, black elected officials in the united states America have a share of the blame , and a majority share of the blame legally, to the black populace in the united states of America modern condition. A majority , over 90%, of black elected officials, starting circa 1865 when south Carolina had a majority black legislature, in the united states of America never had and don't have a Black Agenda; the heritage stemming from said lacking makes it where black elected officials in the united states of America think it normal that they don't have a black agenda for the primary benefit of black peoples. The historical black colleges,albeit in majority, over 95% , started by white religious institutions, are the second oldest black secular, non religions, institutions in the usa. The first being black newspapers. Yes Black people have existed in the usa since its founding but black history, especially DOSer history, is a completely different story and the lack of that truth in how black elected officials/black advocacy organizations/black communal organizations operate has been one of the greatest flaws for the majority of black people in the usa. Black leaderships desire for waiting for whites to decide or design, has made the usa the most multiracial [race defined phenotypically/religiously/genderwise/financially/linguistically + more] than any other government in humanity which has helped the usa become closer to what the black one percent led by Frederick douglass have always wanted, a composite nation. But most black people in the usa don't want a composite nation, they want black success by any means, including violence, necessary. VIDEO youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yEkSa5hL0o TRANSCRIPT 0:00 AMNA NAWAZ: Columbia University has agreed to comply with a series of 0:03 demands from the Trump administration about how it will handle protests, 0:08 antisemitism, and even some academic departments. The university faced a 0:12 deadline today to either comply or risk losing $400 million in federal funding. 0:18 Columbia agreed to ban masks that conceal identity, 0:21 to give some campus police new power to arrest protesters, review its admission procedures, 0:27 and to appoint a senior university official to oversee several academic departments, 0:32 including those focused on the Middle East, as well as Jewish and Palestinian studies. 0:36 It's part of a broader crackdown on higher education. 0:40 Jeffrey Brown has our latest look. 0:43 JEFFREY BROWN: As colleges are under pressure from the Trump administration, how should they respond? 0:47 Princeton University President Christopher L. Eisgruber is 0:51 speaking out publicly and joins the "News Hour" now for this exclusive interview. 0:55 Thanks so much for joining us. 0:57 I want to start with news that we're both learning about right now, I believe, 1:01 which is that Columbia University seems to have agreed to many of the demands from the 1:06 -+Trump administration, in the hope of keeping that $400 million in research. What's your response? 1:13 CHRISTOPHER L. EISGRUBER, President, Princeton University: Let me say first of all, 1:15 I have huge respect for Columbia University and tremendous respect for their president, 1:20 Dr. Katrina Armstrong. So I don't want to be in the position of second-guessing a peer 1:26 institution, particularly under circumstances where I have just learned about the agreement. 1:30 What I will say is this. Academic freedom is a fundamental principle of universities, 1:35 has to be protected. And so I have concerns if universities make concessions about that. 1:40 And I think once you make concessions once, it's hard not to make them again. So that 1:45 would be a framework that I would bring to this decision at any American university. 1:51 JEFFREY BROWN: In an essay in "The Atlantic" now, 1:53 you refer to what's going on as an assault on academic freedom. 1:57 You write: "The attack on Columbia is a radical 2:00 threat to scholarly excellence and to America's leadership in research." 2:05 Tell us, what do you see going on and how big is that threat right now? 2:11 CHRISTOPHER L. EISGRUBER: Well, what it says is this. 2:12 America's research universities are the best in the world. I think they are also the best 2:16 that they have ever been. If you look back at American history, two of the things that have 2:21 been critical to making American universities as strong as they are academic freedom. 2:25 That is the right of universities to make decisions about how to constitute academic 2:30 departments and the right of faculty, scholars, and scholarly disciplines 2:36 to make judgments about what counts as quality. That's one of the key factors. 2:40 And the second is the partnership with the government that has benefited the American people 2:44 tremendously by producing these great research universities. Right now, when you see that 2:50 government partnership and the government funding being used in ways to kind of force concessions 2:56 from universities around academic freedom, it threatens the strength of those institutions 3:00 by undermining the ability of scholars to insist on the right standards of excellence. 3:05 JEFFREY BROWN: But I think this is an interesting point that many of us are not so aware of, 3:09 which is how -- which is what you write about, how universities became responsible for a large 3:14 part of government scientific and research programs, accepting a lot of money for that, 3:20 but, as you write, therefore, making universities particularly vulnerable, as now. 3:28 CHRISTOPHER L. EISGRUBER: Yes, I think if you look back at American 3:30 history, one of the important developments in making America's research universities the 3:35 strongest in the world was this partnership that originated around World War II. 3:41 The United States government recognized that by asking research universities to perform 3:47 research on behalf of the American people and the American government, 3:50 it could strengthen our economy, improve our health, increase the 3:55 security of the country by making us a world leader in innovation. And it has. 4:00 But, in doing so, the government also became a uniquely powerful patron of all these 4:06 universities. It was supplying large amounts of dollars to universities. And this partnership 4:11 created a kind of interdependence. For decades, leaders and politicians, 4:17 government officials from both parties respected the academic freedom of those universities. 4:22 And that's what's made our universities so great. What concerns me so deeply about what's 4:27 happening at Columbia and elsewhere right now is that the government seems to be using 4:31 that funding stream to force concessions that are violations of academic freedom. 4:36 JEFFREY BROWN: What about, though, the main charge from the administration? Does Columbia, 4:40 do you and other universities, do you have a problem of antisemitism on campus? Or 4:46 do you think that's being exaggerated? And what, if anything, is being done about it? 4:53 CHRISTOPHER L. EISGRUBER: Look, I'm a scholar of religious freedom. I'm Jewish myself. I'm deeply 4:57 concerned about antisemitism. It is an appropriate thing for the government to be concerned about. 5:01 And it's something that all of us as university presidents have to be concerned about. 5:05 There are laws that require us to care about any kind of discrimination our campus, 5:11 including antisemitism on our campuses. And it's important that the government enforce those laws, 5:16 but there are also processes specified in those laws in court decisions and in 5:20 regulations that the government needs to follow. 5:23 So there are right ways and wrong ways to go about that. And the wrong way to 5:27 do it is to use federal funding as a cudgel to force concessions to academic freedom. 5:31 JEFFREY BROWN: We have not yet to date seen a lot of pushback from 5:36 the academic world. Is each university on its own at this point? Do you expect to 5:42 see a more collaborative effort? What do you want to see universities do? 5:49 CHRISTOPHER L. EISGRUBER: Well, first of all, I think all of us need to speak up 5:51 for the fundamental principles that define our universities and that define our missions. That's 5:56 one of the reasons why I wrote the essay that ran in "The Atlantic" that you mentioned earlier. 6:02 It's also the case that universities work together through associations, including, for example, 6:08 the Association of American Universities, which is a group of 70 leading research universities 6:14 in the country. These issues are critical to us. And we want to work with the government 6:21 in order to ensure that the basic principles that I have described around academic freedom 6:25 and this critical compact between research universities and the government are preserved. 6:32 I think that should be in everybody's interest. It's in the interest of the American people. It's 6:37 in the interest, I think, of a government that wants to make America a world leader 6:41 and to preserve our eminence in scientific research and the benefits that come with it. 6:45 JEFFREY BROWN: So how serious is this? Is it an 6:47 existential moment for the university as we know it? 6:52 CHRISTOPHER L. EISGRUBER: I think that, when you are dealing with potential intrusions 6:56 on academic freedom, when you're dealing with very serious threats to the funding 7:00 that has been at the core of this compact between universities and the government, 7:06 you're dealing with very serious issues and a crisis that deserves everybody's attention. 7:13 That principle of academic freedom and the ability of scientists and scholars to follow 7:20 their research where it takes them and the funding that has enabled our research universities to be 7:26 the best in the world have made a difference to our universities and to our country in ways that 7:33 should be the concern of every university, every American and every official in our government. 7:39 JEFFREY BROWN: All right, Christopher Eisgruber is president of Princeton University. 7:43 Thank you so much for joining us. 7:45 CHRISTOPHER L. EISGRUBER: Thank you, Geoff. white house initiative to support hbcu's April 23rd 2025 Uniform Resource Locator https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/04/white-house-initiative-to-promote-excellence-and-innovation-at-historically-black-colleges-and-universities/ TEXT WHITE HOUSE INITIATIVE TO PROMOTE EXCELLENCE AND INNOVATION AT HISTORICALLY BLACK COLLEGES AND UNIVERSITIES Executive Orders April 23, 2025 By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, it is hereby ordered: Section 1. Purpose. Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs) remain integral to American students’ pursuit of prosperity and wellbeing, providing the pathway to a career and a better life. This order will continue the work begun during my first Administration to elevate the value and impact of our Nation’s HBCUs as beacons of educational excellence and economic opportunity that serve as some of the best cultivators of tomorrow’s leaders in business, government, academia, and the military. Sec. 2. Policy. It is the policy of my Administration to support HBCUs in: advancing America’s full potential; fostering more and better opportunities in higher education; providing the highest-quality education; obtaining equal opportunities for participation in Federal programs; ensuring college-educated Americans are empowered to advance the common good at home and abroad; and making our Nation more globally competitive. Sec. 3. White House Initiative on HBCUs. (a) There is hereby established the White House Initiative on Historically Black Colleges and Universities (Initiative), housed in the Executive Office of the President and led by an Executive Director designated by the President. (b) The Initiative shall work with executive departments and agencies (agencies), the President’s Board of Advisors on Historically Black Colleges and Universities established in section 4 of this order, private-sector employers, educational associations, philanthropic organizations, and other partners to increase the capacity of HBCUs to provide the highest-quality education to an increasing number of students. The Initiative shall have two primary missions: (i) increasing the private-sector role, including the role of private foundations, in: (A) strengthening HBCUs through enhanced institutional planning and development, fiscal stability, and financial management; (B) upgrading institutional infrastructure, including the use of technology, to ensure the long-term viability of these institutions; and (C) providing professional development opportunities for HBCU students to help build America’s workforce in technology, healthcare, manufacturing, finance, and other high-growth industries; and (ii) enhancing HBCUs’ capabilities to serve our Nation’s young adults by: (A) supporting implementation of the HBCU PARTNERS Act (Public Law 116-270), including facilitating the Federal agency plan process required by section 4 of that Act (20 U.S.C. 1063d); (B) working to advance my Administration’s key priorities related to promoting innovation and excellence throughout HBCUs in consultation with HBCU leaders, representatives, students, and alumni; (C) fostering private-sector initiatives and public-private and philanthropic partnerships to promote centers of academic research and program excellence at HBCUs; (D) improving the availability and quality of information concerning HBCUs in the public policy sphere; (E) sharing administrative and programmatic best practices within the HBCU community; (F) addressing efforts to promote student success and retention at HBCUs, including college affordability, degree attainment, campus modernization, and infrastructure improvements; (G) partnering with private entities and elementary and secondary education stakeholders to build a pipeline for students that may be interested in attending HBCUs and promote affordable degree attainment; (H) encouraging States to provide the required State matching funds for 1890 Land-Grant Institutions; (I) collaborating with the Department of Agriculture and State governments to establish a framework for addressing barriers to accessing Federal funding to ensure that HBCUs receive the maximum funding to which they may be entitled; (J) collaborating with agencies to improve the competitiveness of HBCUs for other sources of Federal research and development funding; and (K) convening an annual White House Summit on HBCUs to address matters related to the Initiative’s missions and functions. (c) The heads of agencies shall assist and provide information to the Initiative, consistent with applicable law, as may be necessary to carry out the functions of the Initiative. Each agency shall bear its own expenses of participating in the Initiative. Sec. 4. President’s Board of Advisors on HBCUs. (a) There is established in the Department of Education the President’s Board of Advisors on Historically Black Colleges and Universities (Board). The Board shall fulfill the mission and functions established by, shall have the structure set forth in, and shall in all other respects be subject to the provisions of section 5 of the HBCU PARTNERS Act (20 U.S.C. 1063e). The Board shall include representatives of a variety of sectors, such as philanthropy, education, business, finance, entrepreneurship, innovation, and private foundations, and current HBCU presidents. (b) The Board shall advise the President, through the Initiative, on the matters set forth in section 5(c) of the HBCU PARTNERS Act (20 U.S.C. 1063e(c)). (c) The Department of Education shall provide funding and administrative support for the Board, consistent with applicable law and subject to the availability of appropriations. Insofar as chapter 10 of title 5, United States Code (commonly known as the Federal Advisory Committee Act), may apply to the Board, any functions of the President under that Act, except for those in section 6 and section 14 of that Act, shall be performed by the Secretary of Education, in accordance with guidelines issued by the Administrator of General Services. Sec. 5. Accountability and Implementation. (a) The Executive Director of the Initiative shall submit an annual progress report to the President summarizing the Federal Government’s impact on HBCUs and providing recommendations for improvement. Sec. 6. Revocations. Executive Order 14041 of September 3, 2021 (White House Initiative on Advancing Educational Equity, Excellence, and Economic Opportunity Through Historically Black Colleges and Universities), is hereby revoked. Within 14 days of the date of this order, the Administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency shall terminate the Historically Black Colleges and Universities and Minority Serving Institutions Advisory Council. Sec. 7. General Provisions. (a) For the purposes of this order, “historically black colleges and universities” shall mean those institutions listed in 34 C.F.R. 608.2. (b) Nothing in this order shall be construed to impair or otherwise affect: (i) the authority granted by law to an executive department or agency, or the head thereof; or (ii) the functions of the Director of the Office of Management and Budget relating to budgetary, administrative, or legislative proposals. (c) This order shall be implemented consistent with applicable law and subject to the availability of appropriations. (d) This order is not intended to, and does not, create any right or benefit, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity by any party against the United States, its departments, agencies, or entities, its officers, employees, or agents, or any other person. DONALD J. TRUMP THE WHITE HOUSE, April 23, 2025. REFERRAL https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-signs-new-executive-order-to-promote-excellence-at-hbcus/ar-AA1DymIS?ocid=BingNewsSerp PUBLIC LAW 116–270—DEC. 31, 2020 134 STAT. 3325 Public Law 116–270 116th Congress TEXT https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/PLAW-116publ270/html/PLAW-116publ270.htm [116th Congress Public Law 270] [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office] [[Page 134 STAT. 3325]] Public Law 116-270 116th Congress An Act To strengthen the capacity and competitiveness of historically Black colleges and universities through robust public-sector, private-sector, and community partnerships and engagement, and for other purposes. <<NOTE: Dec. 31, 2020 - [S. 461]>> Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, <<NOTE: HBCU Propelling Agency Relationships Towards a New Era of Results for Students Act. 20 USC 1001 note.>> SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE. This Act may be cited as the ``HBCU Propelling Agency Relationships Towards a New Era of Results for Students Act'' or the ``HBCU PARTNERS Act''. SEC. 2. <<NOTE: 20 USC 1063d note.>> FINDINGS AND PURPOSES. (a) Findings.--Congress finds the following: (1) As many colleges and universities across the country kept their doors closed to African American applicants, historically Black colleges and universities (referred to in this section as ``HBCUs'') played a central role in ensuring that African Americans could attain an excellent education. (2) Today, HBCUs continue to play a critical role in ensuring that African Americans, and those of all races, can access high-quality educational opportunities. (3) HBCUs enroll nearly 300,000 students, an estimated 70 percent of whom come from low-income backgrounds and 80 percent of whom are African American. (4) According to the National Association For Equal Opportunity In Higher Education (referred to in this section as ``NAFEO''), HBCUs make up just 3 percent of American institutions of higher education but serve more than a fifth of African American college students. (5) According to the Thurgood Marshall College Fund (referred to in this section as ``TMCF''), approximately 9 percent of all African American college students attend HBCUs. (6) A March 2017 report from the Education Trust concluded that HBCUs have higher completion rates for African American students than other institutions serving similar student populations. (7) According to TMCF, 40 percent of African American Members of Congress, 50 percent of African American lawyers, and 80 percent of African American judges are graduates of HBCUs. (8) According to NAFEO, HBCUs graduate approximately 50 percent of African American public school teaching professionals. [[Page 134 STAT. 3326]] (9) According to the United Negro College Fund (referred to in this section as ``UNCF''), African American graduates of HBCUs are almost twice as likely as African Americans who graduated from other institutions to report that their university prepared them well for life. (10) According to a study commissioned by UNCF, in 2014, HBCUs generated a total direct economic impact of $14,800,000,000 and created more than 134,000 jobs. (11) According to a 2019 report produced by the American Council on Education and UNCF, despite efforts to counter a historical legacy of inequitable funding and notable investments by the Federal Government and many State governments, resource inequities continue to plague HBCUs. (b) Purposes.--The purposes of this Act are-- (1) to strengthen the capacity and competitiveness of HBCUs to fulfill their principal mission of equalizing educational opportunity, as described in section 301(b) of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1051(b)); (2) to align HBCUs with the educational and economic competitiveness priorities of the United States; (3) to provide students enrolled at HBCUs with the highest quality educational and economic opportunities; (4) to bolster and facilitate productive interactions between HBCUs and Federal agencies; and (5) to encourage HBCU participation in and benefit from Federal programs, grants, contracts, and cooperative agreements. SEC. 3. <<NOTE: 20 USC 1063d note.>> DEFINITIONS. In this Act: (1) Applicable agency.--The term ``applicable agency'' means-- (A) the Department of Agriculture; (B) the Department of Commerce; (C) the Department of Defense; (D) the Department of Education; (E) the Department of Energy; (F) the Department of Health and Human Services; (G) the Department of Homeland Security; (H) the Department of Housing and Urban Development; (I) the Department of the Interior; (J) the Department of Justice; (K) the Department of Labor; (L) the Department of State; (M) the Department of Transportation; (N) the Department of Treasury; (O) the Department of Veterans Affairs; (P) the National Aeronautics and Space Administration; (Q) the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration; (R) the National Science Foundation; (S) the Small Business Administration; and (T) any other Federal agency designated as an applicable agency under section 4. [[Page 134 STAT. 3327]] (2) Executive director.--The term ``Executive Director'' means-- (A) the Executive Director of the White House Initiative on Historically Black Colleges and Universities, as designated by the President; or (B) if no such Executive Director is designated, such person as the President may designate to lead the White House Initiative on Historically Black Colleges and Universities. (3) HBCU.--The term ``HBCU'' means a historically Black college or university. (4) Historically black college or university.--The term ``historically Black college or university'' has the meaning given the term ``part B institution'' under section 322 of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1061). (5) President's board of advisors.--The term ``President's Board of Advisors'' means the President's Board of Advisors on historically Black colleges and universities. (6) Secretary.--Except as otherwise provided, the term ``Secretary'' means the Secretary of Education. (7) White house initiative.--The term ``White House Initiative'' means the White House Initiative on historically Black colleges and universities. SEC. 4. <<NOTE: 20 USC 1063d.>> STRENGTHENING HBCUS THROUGH FEDERAL AGENCY PLANS. (a) <<NOTE: Consultation.>> Designating Applicable Agencies.--The Secretary, in consultation with the Executive Director, shall-- (1) identify each Federal agency with which an HBCU-- (A) has entered into a grant, contract, or cooperative agreement; or (B) is eligible to participate in the programs and initiatives under the jurisdiction of such Federal agency; and (2) designate each Federal agency so identified as an applicable agency. (b) <<NOTE: Deadline.>> Submitting Agency Plans.--Not later than February 1 of each year, the head of each applicable agency shall submit to the Secretary, the Executive Director, the Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions of the Senate, the Committee on Education and Labor of the House of Representatives, and the President's Board of Advisors an annual Agency Plan describing efforts to strengthen the capacity of HBCUs to participate or be eligible to participate in the programs and initiatives under the jurisdiction of such applicable agency as described in subsection (a)(1)(B). (c) Further Requirements for Submission and Accessibility.--The Executive Director <<NOTE: Public information. Web posting.>> shall make all annual Agency Plan submissions publicly available online in a user-friendly format. (d) Agency Plan Content.--Where appropriate, each Agency Plan shall include-- (1) a description of how the applicable agency intends to increase the capacity of HBCUs to compete effectively for grants, contracts, or cooperative agreements; (2) an identification of Federal programs and initiatives under the jurisdiction of the applicable agency in which HBCUs are underrepresented; (3) an outline of proposed efforts to improve HBCUs' participation in such programs and initiatives; [[Page 134 STAT. 3328]] (4) a description of any progress made towards advancing or achieving goals and efforts from previous Agency Plans submitted under this section by such applicable agency; (5) a description of how the applicable agency plans to encourage public-sector, private-sector, and community involvement to improve the capacity of HBCUs to compete effectively for grants, contracts, or cooperative agreements, and to participate in programs and initiatives under the jurisdiction of such agency; (6) an identification of programs and initiatives not listed in a previous Agency Plan in which an HBCU may participate; (7) any other information the applicable agency determines is relevant to promoting opportunities to fund, partner, contract, or otherwise interact with HBCUs; and (8) <<NOTE: Criteria.>> any additional criteria established by the Secretary or the White House Initiative. (e) Agency Engagement.--To help fulfill the objectives of the Agency Plans, the head of each applicable agency-- (1) shall provide, as appropriate, technical assistance and information to the Executive Director to enhance communication with HBCUs concerning the applicable agency's-- (A) programs and initiatives described in subsection (d)(2); and (B) the preparation of applications or proposals for grants, contracts, or cooperative agreements; and (2) shall appoint a senior official to report directly to the agency head on the applicable agency's progress under this section. SEC. 5. <<NOTE: 20 USC 1063e.>> PRESIDENT'S BOARD OF ADVISORS ON HBCUS. (a) Administration.-- (1) <<NOTE: Establishment.>> In general.--There is established the President's Board of Advisors on historically Black colleges and universities in the Department of Education or, if the President so elects, within the Executive Office of the President. (2) Funding from ed.--Except as provided in paragraph (3), the Secretary shall provide funding and administrative support for the President's Board of Advisors, subject to the availability of appropriations. (3) Funding from the executive office of the president.--If the President elects to locate the President's Board of Advisors within the Executive Office of the President, the Executive Office of the President shall provide funding and administrative support for the President's Board of Advisors, subject to the availability of appropriations. (b) Membership.-- (1) In general.--The President shall appoint not more than 23 members to the President's Board of Advisors, and the Secretary and Executive Director or their designees shall serve as ex officio members. (2) Chair.-- (A) Designation.--The President shall designate one member of the President's Board of Advisors to serve as its Chair, who shall help direct the Board's work in coordination with the Secretary and in consultation with the Executive Director. [[Page 134 STAT. 3329]] (B) <<NOTE: Time period.>> Consultation.--The Chair shall also consult with the Executive Director regarding the time and location of meetings of the President's Board of Advisors, which shall take place not less frequently than once every 6 months. (C) <<NOTE: Guidelines.>> Performance.--Insofar as the Federal Advisory Committee Act (5 U.S.C. App.) may apply to the President's Board of Advisors, any functions of the President under such Act, except for those of reporting to the Congress, shall be performed by the Chair, in accordance with guidelines issued by the Administrator of General Services. (3) Compensation.--Members of the President's Board of Advisors shall serve without compensation, but shall be reimbursed for travel expenses, including per diem in lieu of subsistence, as authorized by law. (c) Mission and Functions.--The President's Board of Advisors shall advise the President, through the White House Initiative, on all matters pertaining to strengthening the educational capacity of HBCUs, which shall include the following: (1) Improving the identity, visibility, distinctive capabilities, and overall competitiveness of HBCUs. (2) Engaging the philanthropic, business, government, military, homeland-security, and education communities in a national dialogue regarding new HBCU programs and initiatives. (3) Improving the ability of HBCUs to remain fiscally secure institutions that can assist the Nation in achieving its educational goals and in advancing the interests of all Americans. (4) Elevating the public awareness of, and fostering appreciation of, HBCUs. (5) Encouraging public-private investments in HBCUs. (6) Improving government-wide strategic planning related to HBCU competitiveness to align Federal resources and provide the context for decisions about HBCU partnerships, investments, performance goals, priorities, human capital development, and budget planning. [[Page 134 STAT. 3330]] (d) Report.--The President's Board of Advisors shall report annually to the President on the Board's progress in carrying out its duties under this section. Approved December 31, 2020. LEGISLATIVE HISTORY--S. 461: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- CONGRESSIONAL RECORD: Vol. 165 (2019): Feb. 12, considered and passed Senate. Vol. 166 (2020): Dec. 7, considered and passed House, amended. Dec. 11, Senate concurred in House amendment. PDF https://www.congress.gov/116/plaws/publ270/PLAW-116publ270.pdf US CODE https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/20/1063d 20 U.S. Code § 1063d - Strengthening HBCUs through Federal agency plans (a)Designating applicable agencies The Secretary, in consultation with the Executive Director, shall— (1)identify each Federal agency with which an HBCU— (A)has entered into a grant, contract, or cooperative agreement; or (B)is eligible to participate in the programs and initiatives under the jurisdiction of such Federal agency; and (2)designate each Federal agency so identified as an applicable agency. (b)Submitting agency plans Not later than February 1 of each year, the head of each applicable agency shall submit to the Secretary, the Executive Director, the Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions of the Senate, the Committee on Education and Labor of the House of Representatives, and the President’s Board of Advisors an annual Agency Plan describing efforts to strengthen the capacity of HBCUs to participate or be eligible to participate in the programs and initiatives under the jurisdiction of such applicable agency as described in subsection (a)(1)(B). (c)Further requirements for submission and accessibility The Executive Director shall make all annual Agency Plan submissions publicly available online in a user-friendly format. (d)Agency plan content Where appropriate, each Agency Plan shall include— (1)a description of how the applicable agency intends to increase the capacity of HBCUs to compete effectively for grants, contracts, or cooperative agreements; (2)an identification of Federal programs and initiatives under the jurisdiction of the applicable agency in which HBCUs are underrepresented; (3)an outline of proposed efforts to improve HBCUs’ participation in such programs and initiatives; (4)a description of any progress made towards advancing or achieving goals and efforts from previous Agency Plans submitted under this section by such applicable agency; (5)a description of how the applicable agency plans to encourage public-sector, private-sector, and community involvement to improve the capacity of HBCUs to compete effectively for grants, contracts, or cooperative agreements, and to participate in programs and initiatives under the jurisdiction of such agency; (6)an identification of programs and initiatives not listed in a previous Agency Plan in which an HBCU may participate; (7)any other information the applicable agency determines is relevant to promoting opportunities to fund, partner, contract, or otherwise interact with HBCUs; and (8)any additional criteria established by the Secretary or the White House Initiative. (e)Agency engagement To help fulfill the objectives of the Agency Plans, the head of each applicable agency— (1)shall provide, as appropriate, technical assistance and information to the Executive Director to enhance communication with HBCUs concerning the applicable agency’s— (A)programs and initiatives described in subsection (d)(2); and (B)the preparation of applications or proposals for grants, contracts, or cooperative agreements; and (2)shall appoint a senior official to report directly to the agency head on the applicable agency’s progress under this section. (Pub. L. 116–270, § 4, Dec. 31, 2020, 134 Stat. 3327.) 20 U.S.C. 1063e https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title20/chapter28/subchapter3/partB&edition=prelim https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=(title:20%20section:1063e%20edition:prelim) 20 USC 1063e: President's Board of Advisors on HBCUs Text contains those laws in effect on April 25, 2025 From Title 20-EDUCATION CHAPTER 28-HIGHER EDUCATION RESOURCES AND STUDENT ASSISTANCE SUBCHAPTER III-INSTITUTIONAL AID Part B-Strengthening Historically Black Colleges and Universities §1063e. President's Board of Advisors on HBCUs (a) Administration (1) In general There is established the President's Board of Advisors on historically Black colleges and universities in the Department of Education or, if the President so elects, within the Executive Office of the President. (2) Funding from ED 1 Except as provided in paragraph (3), the Secretary shall provide funding and administrative support for the President's Board of Advisors, subject to the availability of appropriations. (3) Funding from the Executive Office of the President If the President elects to locate the President's Board of Advisors within the Executive Office of the President, the Executive Office of the President shall provide funding and administrative support for the President's Board of Advisors, subject to the availability of appropriations. (b) Membership (1) In general The President shall appoint not more than 23 members to the President's Board of Advisors, and the Secretary and Executive Director or their designees shall serve as ex officio members. (2) Chair (A) Designation The President shall designate one member of the President's Board of Advisors to serve as its Chair, who shall help direct the Board's work in coordination with the Secretary and in consultation with the Executive Director. (B) Consultation The Chair shall also consult with the Executive Director regarding the time and location of meetings of the President's Board of Advisors, which shall take place not less frequently than once every 6 months. (C) Performance Insofar as the Federal Advisory Committee Act (5 U.S.C. App.) 2 may apply to the President's Board of Advisors, any functions of the President under such Act, except for those of reporting to the Congress, shall be performed by the Chair, in accordance with guidelines issued by the Administrator of General Services. (3) Compensation Members of the President's Board of Advisors shall serve without compensation, but shall be reimbursed for travel expenses, including per diem in lieu of subsistence, as authorized by law. (c) Mission and functions The President's Board of Advisors shall advise the President, through the White House Initiative, on all matters pertaining to strengthening the educational capacity of HBCUs, which shall include the following: (1) Improving the identity, visibility, distinctive capabilities, and overall competitiveness of HBCUs. (2) Engaging the philanthropic, business, government, military, homeland-security, and education communities in a national dialogue regarding new HBCU programs and initiatives. (3) Improving the ability of HBCUs to remain fiscally secure institutions that can assist the Nation in achieving its educational goals and in advancing the interests of all Americans. (4) Elevating the public awareness of, and fostering appreciation of, HBCUs. (5) Encouraging public-private investments in HBCUs. (6) Improving government-wide strategic planning related to HBCU competitiveness to align Federal resources and provide the context for decisions about HBCU partnerships, investments, performance goals, priorities, human capital development, and budget planning. (d) Report The President's Board of Advisors shall report annually to the President on the Board's progress in carrying out its duties under this section. ( Pub. L. 116–270, §5, Dec. 31, 2020, 134 Stat. 3328 .) Editorial Notes References in Text The Federal Advisory Committee Act, referred to in subsec. (b)(2)(C), is Pub. L. 92–463, Oct. 6, 1972, 86 Stat. 770 , which was set out in the Appendix to Title 5, Government Organization and Employees, and was substantially repealed and restated in chapter 10 (§1001 et seq.) of Title 5 by Pub. L. 117–286, §§3(a), 7, Dec. 27, 2022, 136 Stat. 4197 , 4361. For disposition of sections of the Act into chapter 10 of Title 5, see Disposition Table preceding section 101 of Title 5. Codification This section was enacted as part of the HBCU Propelling Agency Relationships Towards a New Era of Results for Students Act or the HBCU PARTNERS Act, and not as part of the Higher Education Act of 1965 which comprises this chapter. 34 C.F.R. 608.2. https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-34/subtitle-B/chapter-VI/part-608/subpart-A/section-608.2 https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/34/608.2 34 CFR § 608.2 - What institutions are eligible to receive a grant under the HBCU Program? § 608.2 What institutions are eligible to receive a grant under the HBCU Program? (a) To be eligible to receive a grant under this part, an institution must— (1) Satisfy section 322(2) of the Higher Education Act of 1965, as amended (HEA); (2) Be legally authorized by the State in which it is located— (i) To be a junior or community college; or (ii) To provide an educational program for which it awards a bachelor's degree; and (3) Be accredited or pre accredited by a nationally recognized accrediting agency or association. (b) The Secretary has determined that the following institutions satisfy section 322(2) of the HEA. Alabama Alabama A&M University-Huntsville Alabama State University—Montgomery Carver State Technical College—Mobile Concordia College—Selma Fredd State Technical College—Tuscaloosa J.F. Drake State Technical College—Huntsville S.D. Bishop State Junior College—Mobile Lawson State College—Birmingham Miles College—Birmingham Oakwood College—Huntsville Selma University—Selma Stillman College—Tuscaloosa Talladega University—Talladega Trenholm State Technical College—Montgomery Tuskegee University—Tuskegee Arkansas Arkansas Baptist College—Little Rock Philander Smith College—Little Rock Shorter College—Little Rock University of Arkansas at Pine Bluff—Pine Bluff Delaware Delaware State College—Dover District of Columbia Howard University University of the District of Columbia Florida Bethune Cookman College—Daytona Beach Edward Waters College—Jacksonville Florida A&M University—Tallahassee Florida Memorial College—Miami Georgia Albany State College—Albany Atlanta University—Atlanta Clark College—Atlanta Fort Valley State College—Fort Valley Interdenominational Theological Center—Atlanta Morehouse College—Atlanta Morris Brown College—Atlanta Paine College—Augusta Savannah State College—Savannah Spelman College—Atlanta Kentucky Kentucky State University—Frankfurt Louisiana Dillard University—New Orleans Grambling State University—Grambling Southern University A&M College—Baton Rouge Southern University at New Orleans—New Orleans Southern University at Shreveport—Shreveport Xavier University of Louisiana—New Orleans Maryland Bowie State College—Bowie Coppin State College—Baltimore Morgan State University—Baltimore University of Maryland-Eastern Shore—Princess Anne Michigan Lewis College of Business—Detroit Mississippi Alcorn State University—Lorman Coahoma Junior College—Clarksdale Jackson State University—Jackson Mary Holmes College—West Point Mississippi Valley State University—Itta Bena Prentiss Normal and Industrial Institute—Prentiss Rust College—Holly Springs Tougaloo College—Tougaloo Hinds Junior College (Utica Jr Coll)—Raymond Missouri Lincoln University—Jefferson City Harris-Stowe State College—St. Louis North Carolina Barber-Scotia College—Concord Bennett College—Greensboro Elizabeth City State University—Elizabeth City Fayetteville State University—Fayetteville Johnson C. Smith University—Charlotte Livingstone College—Salisbury North Carolina A&T State University—Greensboro North Carolina Central University—Durham Saint Augustine's College—Raleigh Shaw University—Raleigh Winston-Salem State University—Winston Salem Ohio Central State University—Wilberforce Wilberforce University—Wilberforce Oklahoma Langston University—Langston Pennsylvania Cheyney State University—Cheyney Lincoln University—Lincoln South Carolina Allen University—Columbia Benedict College—Columbia Claflin College—Orangeburg Clinton Junior College—Rock Hill Denmark Technical College—Denmark Morris College—Sumter South Carolina State College—Orangeburg Voorhees College—Denmark Tennessee Fisk University—Nashville Knoxville College—Knoxville Lane College—Jackson LeMoyne-Owen College—Memphis Meharry Medical College—Nashville Morristown College—Morristown Tennessee State University—Nashville Texas Huston-Tillotson College—Austin Jarvis Christian College—Hawkins Paul Quinn College—Waco Prairie View A&M University—Prairie View Saint Philip's College—San Antonio Southwestern Christian College—Terrell Texas College—Tyler Texas Southern University—Houston Wiley College—Marshall U.S. Virgin Islands College of the Virgin Islands—St. Thomas Virginia Hampton University—Hampton Norfolk State University—Norfolk Saint Paul's College—Lawrenceville Virginia State University—Petersburg Virginia Union University—Richmond West Virginia Bluefield State College—Bluefield West Virginia State College—Institute (c) If an institution identified in paragraph (b) of this section has merged with another institution, and, as a result of the merger, would not otherwise qualify to receive a grant under this part, that institution may nevertheless qualify to receive a grant under this part if— (1) The institution would have qualified to receive a grant before the merger; and (2) The institution was eligible to receive a grant under the Special Needs Program in any fiscal year prior to fiscal year 1986. (The Special Needs Program was authorized under Title III, Part B, of the HEA before 1986.) (d) For the purpose of paragraph (a)(3) of this section, the Secretary publishes a list in the Federal Register of nationally recognized accrediting agencies and associations. (e) Notwithstanding any other provision of this section, for each fiscal year— (1) The University of the District of Columbia is eligible to receive a grant under this part only if the amount of the grant it is scheduled to receive under § 608.31 exceeds the amount it is scheduled to receive in the same fiscal year under the District of Columbia Self-Government and Governmental Reorganization Act; and (2) Howard University is eligible to receive a grant under this part only if the amount of the grant it is scheduled to receive under § 608.31 exceeds the amount it is scheduled to receive in the same fiscal year under the Act of March 2, 1867, 20 U.S.C. 123. (Authority: 20 U.S.C. 1061, 1063, and 1063a; House Report 99-861, 99th Cong., 2d Sess. p. 367, September 22, 1986; Senate Report 99-296, 99th Cong., 2d Sess. p. 23, May 12, 1986; Cong. Rec. of June 3, 1986, pp. 6588-6589)

corridors of power pbs 04252025 VIDEO https://www.pbs.org/video/the-corridors-of-power-k8hoys/ REFERRAL https://www.pbs.org/show/the-corridors-of-power/ TRANSCRIPT ♪ ♪ ♪ [Radio chatter] ♪ [Airplane engine] [Explosions] ♪ [Footsteps] [Indistinct conversation] Paul Wolfowitz, voice-over: When I think about the Holocaust and what came after World War II ended and how many times people said, "Never again, never again," and it happens over and over again, after a while, you wonder, "Is this just hot air? Are these just words?" ♪ I can tell you for sure, too often there are cases where we make a mockery of this idea of "never again." ♪ Henry Kissinger: If you look at human history, you have to say that genocide has occurred much too frequently. Yes, we should oppose it, but you cannot simply say the United States has an obligation by military force to oppose evil wherever it exists in the world. Are we then willing to stay involved in getting an outcome that we... Anthony Lake, voice-over: With power comes responsibility, and if you have huge power and there are problems in the world that you could fix and you don't fix them, then you're being irresponsible. Lake: Conflicting impulses out of this phenomenon from abroad... Colin Powell, voice-over: We can't go everywhere. We are not the world policeman, although, as has been famously said, guess who the world calls for whenever there's a mugging. Bush: We will have a continuing responsibility... James Baker, voice-over: When the body bags start coming home, if you don't have a significant national interest at stake, you will lose the policy, and you won't be able to sustain it. The human toll shows... Albright, voice-over: There are always people in the room that will argue and say, "Oh, well, you know, why should we care? What does it matter to us?" I believe in peace, but I'm not a pacifist, and I believe that there are times when using force can actually bring stability in the long run and save a lot of people. Barack Obama: Change doesn't come from on high. If you're waiting for Congress... Sandy Berger, voice-over: "Never again" is a moral statement, but is it a guiding operational principle? Does it help answer whether to go into Bosnia or not, whether to go into Syria or not, whether to go into Rwanda or not? ♪ I don't think so. I think it is a moral statement by the world that it should not stand by and watch mass atrocities. It is not neither legally binding or politically binding. [People cheering] ♪ Good evening. These are the sights and sounds of the continuing celebration. The Berlin Wall, once it divided East from West, now on its way to becoming an artifact of history. ♪ Woman, voice-over: In the last few months, the reign of communism ended in Poland, Hungary, East Germany, Czechoslovakia, Bulgaria, and Romania. The U.S.S.R. that controlled Eastern Europe with an iron fist for 4 decades is now dissolved by Mr. Gorbachev. At the end of the Cold War, the U.S. stands as the only global superpower. Powell, voice-over: My whole adult life to that point was participating in the Cold War. Everything that I had trained for, every tactic that I had mastered was now gone because they're gone, you know, and Gorbachev said to me one day at one of the summit meetings-- and his eyes were twinkling-- he said, "Ah, Generale, Generale, "I'm so very, very sorry. You will have to find a new enemy." ♪ Bush: A new world order can emerge, a new era, an era in which the nations of the world-- East and West, North and South-- can prosper and live in harmony, a world where the rule of law supplants the rule of the jungle, a world in which nations recognize the shared responsibility for freedom and justice. [Chanting] [Explosion] [Artillery fire] Woman, voice-over: Fighting raged anew in the former Yugoslav republic of Bosnia-Herzegovina today. Albright, voice-over: With the end of the Cold War, all the different kind of worms started crawling around in terms of the ethnic dislikes that people had of each other, and that was true in the Balkans. ♪ People wanted a new world order, but I think instead, it became a new world disorder. Man, voice-over: The Serbs are trying to reverse the decision to establish the independent Muslim state of Bosnia-Herzegovina. [Speaking Serbian] Woman, voice-over: The Serb logic of the conflict is to create areas that are ethnically cleansed from Muslims. Man: [Speaking Serbian] [Explosion] ♪ [Explosion] ♪ [Dog barking] ♪ Samantha Power: When I graduated from college, I actually moved to Berlin first. While I was living there, thousands of refugees were pouring in from the former Yugoslavia, and, I mean, they were the picture of desperation, and here I, a sentient 20-something, I'm seeing these people, and all I wanted to do was run away. In other words, you know, I just was sad for them in the abstract, but it was not my problem. ♪ [Child crying] ♪ I think for a lot of people, the sense of what one ought to do derives a lot from what one feels one can do, and when you think that you're a 22-year-old liberal arts graduate who has nothing to offer these people, your internal reflexive mechanisms almost seem to say to you, "Then don't bother learning more "because it's going to break your heart "and you won't be able to do anything about it, so, you know, just go check out the soccer game." ♪ Man, voice-over: While shelling continues today in Sarajevo, the news focused on reports of Nazilike detention camps being run by Serbs. Power, voice-over: I moved back to Washington, and I was an intern working for a man named Mort Abramowitz, who had been in government for 35 years. He was consumed with what was happening in Bosnia, and my job as his intern just was to basically prepare him for his speeches, his op-eds, edit what he did, and then, because it was my job, I began learning, and, honestly, I don't know if it was my head or my heart that nearly exploded, but I just could not believe what was being done. ♪ Once I'd had this inconvenient knowledge, then I was off to the ra-- then I had to figure out-- oh, my gosh-- what was I going to do to help, so I went to Bosnia to cover the conflict. [Explosions] Arriving for the first time in Sarajevo, I was most struck by a sense of claustrophobia just by this topography. The hills all around were just lined with gun positions, and, whether that was snipers or actual artillery positions where they were just raining artillery and shell fire onto the city, you just had a sense of vulnerability. [Gunfire and explosions] [People screaming] [Gunfire continues] [People shouting] Aah! Aah! Bush, voice-over: I am very concerned about it, and I'm concerned about ethnic cleansing. I'm concerned about attacks on Muslims, but it isn't gonna be solved by sending in the 82nd Airborne. [Applause] Governor Clinton, you have one minute. We can't get involved in the quagmire, but we must do what we can. It's enormous responsibility to step into the White House, to take over the world in terms of your responsibility. In Clinton's case, we were running against George H.W. Bush, who'd spent his life in foreign policy. Clinton: There are things that can be done... Berger, voice-over: Here's this governor from Arkansas, and our goal was to make sure that Clinton lost no votes because of foreign policy. We weren't going to beat Bush on foreign policy. Clinton: I would begin with air power against the Serbs to try to restore the basic conditions of humanity. History has shown us that you can't allow the mass extermination of people and just sit by and watch it happen. ♪ Man: Ladies and gentlemen, let us all join together in welcoming the next President of the United States of America. [Cheering and applause] Clinton: On this day, the American people have voted to make a new beginning. [Cheering] ♪ Leon Panetta: Every president goes through a learning process. You suddenly walk in the Oval Office, and you're having to deal with national security issues, and you suddenly get a group from the Joint Chiefs of Staff-- all in uniform, all with their medals-- all telling you something that should or should not be done, and, very frankly, it's intimidating because, you know, you may have been a senator, you may have been a governor, but you never had to make decisions that involve life and death. Gore: Or at least that's what all the managers believe. Leon Fuerth, voice-over: There was a peculiar situation as the Clinton administration took over. It inherited the possibility for a different world order because the old world order was gone, and so the question was what the Clinton administration's attitude going to be about the use of force as an instrument of national policy. Yes, you were trying to come up with a policy solution for a given country, like Bosnia, but at the same time, it had to somehow fit into another equation that related to American power almost anywhere in the world. [Explosions] [Siren] Power, voice-over: At the beginning of the war, the Bosnian people had such hope with President Clinton that we were going to act, and that's their sense of curiosity, and, I mean, they knew everything. They knew McCain, Biden, you know, who was up, who was down, who's up for re-election. I mean, when your life depends on it-- And I was struck in the most remote parts of Bosnia how knowledgeable people were who were just desperate for salvation. [Indistinct conversation] Berger: There remain areas of fundamental difference. Berger, voice-over: Beginning of '93, there are a series of meetings in the White House, and there were sharp disagreements, particularly about the use of force. The military was strongly against it. The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff at that point, General Powell, national hero, was adamantly opposed to it. Albright: We were all new, and Colin Powell had just won the Gulf War. He was the hero of the Western world, big, handsome man with medals all over... Minimum loss of life... Albright, voice-over: and he was the best briefer ever. We would ask him, "So what can we do?" and he would always say, "Well, we can take this mountain, and we can do this," and ultimately, he would say, "But it would take several hundred thousand troops and then many billions of dollars," so he would walk us up a hill and say we could do it and then drop us off the other side, but he was the expert. Powell: I never intended to intimidate anyone. I always intended to give them straightforward military advice as to how force could be used, and it was theirs to make the political decision. What Madeleine overlooks in that is that, even though my uniform is very lovely and I know how to brief a group, there was no enthusiasm within that group to send military force into the former Yugoslavia because it looked like it was coming apart. Albright: I have to admit in my case, that I was deeply moved by what I had seen of people being killed or ethnically cleansed not for anything that they had done, but who they were, and I thought, we "We have to do something." I actually got into an argument with him over this, and I finally said to him, "Colin, what are you saving this military for?" and he got really mad at me, and he said, "Our soldiers are not toy soldiers." "Why can't we use this wonderful army you're always talking about?" and I just made the point to her, "We can use it anytime you ask if you have a clear purpose of what you're trying to achieve"... I want to have a strategic force capability that still preserves... Powell, voice-over: and I don't know what objectives would have been set or what political goals the president might have articulated at that time. He didn't articulate any. Look. You know as much about this as I do right now. We'll just have to look into it, and we'll see, but meanwhile... Lake, voice-over: I think the president's instincts were always for stronger action, but I think by temperament, while he was always prepared to act, he also always wanted consensus, and that, I think, for the first year, certainly, of the administration was a particular problem because then he was always looking for the compromise, the consensus. He wasn't making the hard decisions and saying, "Sorry. I'm going with this and this." ♪ [Indistinct conversation] [Dog barking] ♪ Power, voice-over: When you would go into so-called Republika Srpska, you knew you were entering the heart of darkness. You would drive down a road in this little ethnically cleansed statelet run by Bosnian Serb nationalists, and you would see the home lights. You could imagine the hearth inside, windows intact, and then the very next house would have on it graffiti that would say, you know, "Muslims go home"... [Dog barking] and then 4 houses down, you'd see another bright, warm house where people were just going on with their lives. ♪ The sense in the air that evil had transpired is-- I mean, the air felt thick with that recent history somehow. [Whimpers] [Insects buzzing] ♪ Weixiong Chen: Excellencies, distinguished colleagues, I thank you for giving CTED the opportunity to brief the Council on the 14th report... Albright, voice-over: As U.N. ambassador, I saw on a daily basis other members of the Security Council, as well as the representative of Bosnia-Herzegovina, [Indistinct], would come to me every day and say, "Your president said he was gonna do something. You're not doing anything. Do something"... ♪ and I could judge what was going on in Sarajevo because I went a number of times... [Explosion] and driving through Sarajevo, I was just stunned that this kind of a thing could possibly happen. We're talking about the 1990s. ♪ Then the question is, how do you go back and not sound like a blithering idiot, emotional? And I went back to the White House, and I said, "I was in Sarajevo, where buildings had been bombed, "where there were fires still burning "and smoke coming still from a variety of buildings and people huddled on the street." [Gunfire] Man: This--if this-- ♪ Albright, voice-over: "Why should we not help people "that also were living in a war zone that didn't need to be a war zone?" and I said something like, "Gentlemen, history will judge us on this." They would say, "Don't be so emotional, Madeleine." [Gunfire] Woman: [Wailing] ♪ [Gunfire and wailing continue] ♪ [Gunshot] Man: [Speaking Serbian] Girl: [Crying] Woman: [Speaks Serbian] Girl: [Speaks Serbian] Elie Wiesel: Treblinka, Birkenau, Auschwitz-- these names and others were known to officials in Washington. The Pentagon knew. The White House knew. Most governments knew. Mr. President, indifference is a sin, and I cannot not tell you something. I have been in the former Yugoslavia. I cannot sleep since. We must do something to stop the bloodshed in that country. [Applause] Man: In response to the bloodshed in Bosnia, Holocaust survivor Elie Wiesel asked you yesterday to do something to stop the fighting. Is the United States considering taking unilateral action such as airstrikes against Serb artillery sites? Well, first, let me say, as you know, for more than a week now, we have been seriously reviewing our options for further action, and, to be fair, our allies in Europe have been willing to do their part. I do not think we should act alone unilaterally, nor do I think we will have to. Berger: We finally agreed to a position that we would use NATO air power to strike Serb positions if they continued to shell indiscriminately. We took that to the Europeans, and they wanted nothing to do with it. We discovered how boxed in we were by the Europeans. ♪ The Europeans said, "That's not acceptable because "our troops are on the ground "trying to keep the peace "and you can't start a war "with our troops in the middle of this. "You Yanks, you just don't understand. "You're not willing to pay the price, "you're not willing to come in here on the ground, "don't talk about lift and strike. You don't get it"... [Gunfire] so there was friction between us. They were taking losses. Soldiers did die. Man on television: [Speaking French] ♪ [Gunfire] [Men shouting] Lake, voice-over: Being a superpower does not mean you can put up a little sign on your desk saying, "We are the superpower," and then there are buttons you can push and you push a NATO button and the NATO will do what you want, et cetera. You know, superpower means that you have leadership, and that leadership involves bringing along coalitions, bringing along your allies and others, or you're gonna fail. Man: For 22 months, the world has watched and often tried to ignore the bloody civil war in Bosnia. It is hard to watch and impossible to ignore what happened there today. At least 60 civilians-- men, women, and children-- were killed, at least 200 injured when a market full of Saturday shoppers was shelled. Man: Very concerned about the efforts by some elements... Different man: In Africa today, a plane carrying the presidents of two African nations has apparently been shot down in the capital of Rwanda, where a civil war formally ended a few months ago. Woman, voice-over: After the death of the two presidents, the racial tensions between the Hutu majority and the Tutsi minority might spark again into an ugly ethnic war. [Birds chirping] Nancy Soderberg: I was sitting in my office, which was just off the Situation Room, and the Situation Room brought me a alert, which back then, a really serious alert had two red dots on it, literally two red dots, and that was like, "Pay attention to this right away," so I read it, and I had the CIA brief, and I said, "Well, what's the worst-case scenario with these two presidents gone?" and they said, "Another round of violence, maybe 20,000 killed," and I thought, "Well, what should we do to stop that?" and they didn't really have an answer. That's not the CIA's job. Prudence Bushnell: When the airplane went down, I sent the memo up saying that the peace agreement is at risk. You know, there's chaos in the streets, and worst-case scenario, if we don't do anything, hundreds of thousands of people could be killed. Man on radio: [Speaking Kinyarwanda] ♪ [Indistinct conversation] ♪ Man, voice-over: Massacres continue in the Central African nation of Rwanda. The killing is a calculated attempt to exterminate the minority Tutsi that makes up 10% of Rwanda's 7 million people. ♪ Lake: I can recall the first time this really came to my attention, and I remember explicitly asking afterwards one of the people there from the Defense Intelligence Agency, "What's going on? Who's killing whom? Why?" and his basically saying, "Don't know," and I should have when I got back to my office said, "I want to know more," and insisted on getting more involved, and I was at the time arguing about whether to intervene in Haiti and Bosnia and all kinds of stuff, and I didn't, and that was-- that's on me, and I'll regret it forever. Clinton: There are about 250 Americans there, and I'm very concerned about their safety. Man: ...is clearly part of the threat that we have to deal with. George Moose, voice-over: I think it's fair to say that Africa tends to fall to the bottom of the list in terms of our American priorities. You're talking about a lot of factors that lead to that. Some of them have to do with how we calculate our national interests. Some of those are, I would say, racial and racist. All of those things, though, result in the fact that Africa and Africa's concerns and African interests and needs tend to fall to the bottom of that list of priorities. ♪ [Indistinct conversation] ♪ Bushnell, voice-over: Within 24 hours, there were two things that I learned almost simultaneously. One was Madame Agathe, the prime minister. [Cheering] I cannot tell you how she was slaughtered, but she was slaughtered-- she was pregnant-- in front of her husband and her children. At the same time, we were learning that the Belgian peacekeepers who had been there to provide protection for her had been kidnaped and taken to the airport and killed. Oh, my gosh, we knew if they started killing white people, it would be over. We in African Affairs did not have the rose-colored glasses and thinking that, yes, this is a continent like any others and we look upon African people as we look upon European people. John Shattuck, voice-over: The fact that they decapitated the Belgian peacekeepers so gruesomely and that the killings were so violent in that sense, one has to assume that the genocide planners very carefully said, "Let's really kill "some representatives of the international community early in this process to get them to withdraw," and they succeeded. Clinton: I have had extended conversations about the situation in Rwanda, and I just want to assure the families of those who are there that we are doing everything we possibly can to be on top of the situation, to take all appropriate steps to try to ensure the safety of our citizens there. ♪ Laura Lane, voice-over: I remember when the order came that we were gonna start evacuating nonessential personnel and then move eventually to closing down the embassy. ♪ We were focused on how we would get Americans to centers and then move them overland to Burundi and negotiate the ceasefires so that those convoys wouldn't be fired on. [Radio chatter] ♪ Bushnell, voice-over: The deal we made was that in return for safe passage of diplomats-- not only Americans, but diplomats of other embassies-- we would not take any Rwandan citizens with us, and we left our U.S. government employees, colleagues, to fend for themselves. ♪ Lane, voice-over: We could have, you know, any host of other nationalities join our convoy, just not the Rwandans, and I remember thinking at that moment, "How can that be? "The orders that I'm being given, "I get to live because I was born in Evanston, Illinois, "but that woman that just brought her child "to the embassy begging that someone take that child, we're going to condemn that child to death?" [Radio chatter] ♪ You saw images. ♪ The bodies that I saw, I couldn't make sense of it, right? As you're driving along, you just think how out of place it is to see the bodies laying by the roadside. You didn't know how to-- Like, conceptually, I knew that someone had been killed, and I guess I tried to just keep moving on and focus on the task at hand. ♪ Bushnell, voice-over: As soon as the Americans were out of Rwanda, the interest of the White House evaporated. Point of fact, the president had come to State Department for an official dinner and stopped by the crisis group to say thank you and congratulations for getting Americans out, and that was the last I heard about Bill Clinton's interest in Rwanda. Man: They authorized war crimes. Richard A. Clarke, voice-over: It's very easy in hindsight to say that the United States should have dropped the 82nd Airborne into Kigali, but remember the time. The Clinton administration had just suffered enormous political problems by the American people waking up one day and finding out that we had troops in Somalia and that some of those troops got killed, and the American people, the American media, the American Congress asked, "What the hell are you doing in Somalia?" [Helicopter whirring] Man, voice-over: What started as a humanitarian intervention to feed starving people turned into a nightmare. 18 U.S. servicemen were killed today when two Blackhawk helicopters were shot down. They were dragging him by ropes, and they paused every once in a while to allow people in the crowd to abuse the body by kicking it or stomping on it and spitting on it. Berger, voice-over: A horrible thing to watch because they kept running the film of our soldiers being dragged through the streets. It was horrifying to watch, horrible, horrible day. It was one of the worst days for me in the White House. Clarke: After that experience, everybody in Washington and everybody around the country said, "Let's not do that again. "When American interests are not at stake, "Let's not put American forces in a situation where they can be killed." ♪ Bushmill: We saw the United States government take the lead in removing peacekeepers in the face of a genocide. I will never ever forget the look on the face of team members, including our desk officer from Rwanda, when I was notified that we were going to remove the peacekeepers. He looked at me and he said, "Do you know what's going to happen?" It was a look of utter horror because both of us knew what was going to happen, and it did happen. [Distant siren] Clarke: Rwanda was discussed. President knew about it. The senior leaders of the government all knew about it. People were aware. What I'm saying is that no one of all the senior leadership in the Pentagon, the State Department, the White House-- no one ever said, "Gee, let's drop in the 82nd Airborne." Nobody cared. That it was the only way I can--I can put it. Nobody wanted to hear about it. Nobody wanted to do anything about it because the decision had been made we would not. [Helicopter whirring] [Radio chatter] ♪ Shattuck, voice-over: I wanted to actually go and see for myself what was happening. I was the first person in the government to actually fly over Rwanda. I had the plane fly as low as possible, and the most vivid example of what I saw was on the border area between Tanzania and Rwanda, where there was a river. From several thousand feet, it looked as if there were these little logs that were flowing in the river down toward Lake Victoria. I said, "I don't understand this. Let's go down." ♪ These were not logs. These were bodies, and there were many of them. They were flowing down the river, and that's why they looked like logs, there were so many. ♪ The physical elements of the genocide, it's just something that stays with you that you can't ever get out of you. ♪ Sometimes when I'm in a small river, I think I see bodies floating in the river. ♪ I went from this trip to Geneva, and in Geneva, I gave a press conference in which I said, "Genocide is going on in Rwanda," and then I was told by Washington, particularly by the Legal Advisor's Office of the State Department, that that was not the policy. We don't call this genocide. It was against policy. Ha ha! The U.S. policy was that we haven't determined yet that this is a genocide. It was unbelievable. ♪ Frankly, a lot of us, especially after John Shattuck's visit out there, that question was answered. If anything could be called genocide, this was it, and the next step was, "OK. "If you acknowledge "it's genocide, "then what are you going to do about it?" right? If you say it's genocide and we have a genocide convention, what's your obligation? ♪ Alan Elsner: Does the State Department have a view as to whether or not what is happening could be genocide? Well, as I think you know, the use of the term "genocide" has a very precise legal meaning, although it's not strictly a legal determination. There are there are other factors in there, as well. Before we begin to use that term, we have to know as much as possible about the facts of the situation. How many acts of genocide does it take to make genocide? Alan, that's just not a question that I'm in a position to answer. ♪ Moose: The case of Rwanda revealed our bureaucracy at its very worst. ♪ It took us forever to get a paper up to Secretary Christopher that would make the case that this was genocide and we had to declare it as such, even if it meant we did not know what the next step was. ♪ Clinton: I have come today to pay the respects of my nation to all who suffered and all who perished in the Rwanda genocide. During the 90 days that began on April 6 in 1994, Rwanda experienced the most intensive slaughter in this blood-filled century we are about to leave. It may seem strange to you here, especially the many of you who lost members of your family, but all over the world, there were people like me sitting in offices day after day after day who did not fully appreciate the depth and the speed with which you were being engulfed by this unimaginable terror. I did feel, even though I think his apology was genuine, that it was a very hollow moment. It was hollow because, heh, 800,000 people had perished and nothing had been done. The fact is, where there is a political will, there is a political way. I cannot imagine that the President of the United States could not have influenced the policy process, and he did not, and to say later on it was because of ignorance is, to me, unbecoming of the leader of the free world and the American foreign policy, unbecoming. ♪ Power: Walter Laqueur, the Holocaust historian, had a line that I will never forget. He wrote, "By 1943, the vast majority of Americans "knew that more than a million Jews were no longer alive, "but that did not necessarily mean that they knew that they were dead," and, to me, this horror of a concept really speaks to the two kinds of knowledge that people can have, you know-- a sort of surface knowledge where you're processing clinically, cognitively, but nothing is really reaching you and then a different kind where you're, you know, "They've been killed. They're--" and this idea of no longer alive versus dead, I feel, really speaks to a lot of the numbing that bureaucracy can facilitate. Man: Good evening. More than 3 years after the beginnings of the hostilities, the war in Bosnia is still charging a bloody toll on the civilian population. The Serb army is reinforcing its forces positioned around the Muslim enclaves of Zepa, Gorazde, and Srebrenica and is slowly closing in. ♪ The town of Srebrenica was the first of 6 areas in Bosnia that the United Nations Protection Force vowed to actually protect. ♪ Power, voice-over: In the summer of 1995, we began to get word that the Serbs were moving toward what had been declared a safe area. Thousands of civilians did what civilians all around the world do in times of crises when the U.N. is around. They see that blue flag, and they go toward it. That's all they got. Woman, voice-over: From positions less than a mile south of Srebrenica, Bosnian Serb tanks and several thousand soldiers overran a battalion of 400 Dutch peacekeepers. [Speaking Serbian] Power, voice-over: Srebrenica was special to the Serbs, special in the sense that it was atop the list of places where it wasn't just territory they wanted. They wanted to inflict a degree of harm that made it impossible for these people ever to live in this territory again, and the way you do that is genocide. [Indistinct conversation] Power, voice-over: I watched from Sarajevo on Serb TV as Ratko Mladic went, was patting the heads of children, offering them candy. "Nobody will be harmed. Women and children this way, men this way," and you just saw the faces of these people. They knew. Like, we didn't know, but they knew. Mladic: [Speaking Serbian] Peter Galbraith, voice-over: Ratko Mladic was just-- He was a psychopathic murderer. I think that's the only way to describe him, a man of extraordinary cruelty who directed the ethnic cleansing. [Speaking Serbian] Shattuck, voice-over: General Ratko Mladic and his Bosnian Serb forces basically rounded up all of the people of the town, separated men from boys and women and children and old people, sent the women and children and old people on busses out of the town, and basically began to go after the men. ♪ Man: [Speaking Serbian] ♪ Galbraith, voice-over: At this point, everybody is focused on the women and girls who were being bused out and the fact that, you know, the women are being robbed and a few of the girls are being taken off the busses and raped, and so that's the human rights story, and I'm trying to get people to focus on the missing men and boys. [Speaks Serbian] ♪ [Distant machine gun fire] Man: [Speaks Serbian] [Speaks Serbian] [Speaking Serbian] [Distant machine gun fire] [Birds chirping] ♪ [Speaks Serbian] Man: [Speaks Serbian] [Cocks rifle] [Gunshots] [Gunshot] Man: [Speaks Serbian] [Machine gun fire] [Machine gun fire] [Gunshots] [Gunshots] [Gunshot] [Distant gunshot] [Machine gun fire] [Indistinct conversation] ♪ [Gunshot] [Gunshots] ♪ Shattuck, voice-over: Nobody knew quite what had happened to these missing men, and at that stage, I said, "I've got to go." ♪ I went to Tuzla, and I was able, with the help of the local U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees Office, to identify half a dozen men who had escaped from Srebrenica, and we interviewed them... ♪ and they told this extraordinary story about how they were forced out and marched to these open pits, and there, 7,000 of them were executed, and later on, two young CIA officers came up with the actual photographs of the sites with mass graves before the graves were dug, and then afterwards, men standing in a field, and then they were shot. ♪ You know, I said, "It's-- This is genocide again." [Distant siren] Shattuck: Let me tell you, from the perspective of my participation in the trip... Shattuck, voice-over: When I came back from Srebrenica, I was asked to describe literally what I had seen and heard, and there was deathly silence. You could almost hear a pin drop. ♪ Panetta: Now you have another massacre taking place. It's happening today, not 40 years ago. It's happening now, and in many ways, the blood of those who are dying is on your hands, and you've got to deal with it. It's the third year of his presidency, and he's finally saying, "Excuse me. "This is my presidency. "It's my legacy, and history will say "whether or not Bill Clinton did the right thing "in this situation, and, you know, I'm prepared to take that risk." ♪ Lake: I think, frankly, what changed him was, one, he was moved by what he saw happening, and secondly, the political calculus changed also because we got closer to the presidential election in 1996, and the president's political advisors, I think, changed from, "Be careful. Let's not get too involved," to, "You really need to resolve this before 1996." ♪ Clinton: My fellow Americans, in this new era, there are still times when America and America alone can and should make the difference for peace. ♪ The United States led NATO's heavy and continuous airstrikes. Those airstrikes, together with the renewed determination of our European partners, convinced the Serbs finally to start thinking about making peace. ♪ Warren Christopher: The agreement saved countless thousands of lives by ending the fighting between the communities in the Republic. Serious obstacles remained... Lake, voice-over: When we got the signing of Dayton, it was just-- I just felt sad at all the bloodshed, all that had gone before this. They were all so somber. It was, uh-- Bosnia was just sad, I'm afraid. I would love to say that it was a moment of euphoria, but it had been so painful. [Helicopter whirring] ♪ Power, voice-over: When I left Bosnia, being a young correspondent, I felt part of a world that hadn't done enough. ♪ You know, I just had a sense of how many lives could have been saved sooner, you know, had the decision that was belatedly made been made before, and that was a question that long ago as a much younger person I had asked myself about the Holocaust. ♪ My high-school understanding of the Holocaust could be reduced to, "Hitler was exterminating the Jews, and, therefore, we went to war," and I would later learn that the issue of the extermination of the Jews just didn't rise within the system in the way that you would have expected-- or that I would have expected. The idea that the fate of an imperiled people when it came to refugee admissions, bombing the train tracks to just make it a little bit harder, it just was striking to me that those issues in and of themselves just didn't rise. ♪ As somebody who believed in America and the idea of "never again," I just was struck by that because that wasn't ever part of kind of the history lessons that I got in this country. ♪ What I was struck by when I came back from Bosnia was the extent to which our culture was having a surge of commemoration and remembrance related to the Holocaust... ♪ and yet I had just come from this experience where the Bosnian Serbs had attempted to wipe out a people in Europe 50 years after the Holocaust, and the connections weren't really drawn. ♪ It was at that point, then, that I go to the library and, you know, thinking maybe there would be books on the decision makers, on the bystanders. I'll never forget being at Harvard's huge library and it just being very, very clear that question, at least as I was understanding it, had not been posed and the question had not been answered, so initially for a paper for a class, because I was in law school, I began sort of exploring, going back over the cases that I didn't know a lot about-- like the Armenian Genocide, Pol Pot and Khmer Rouge, what Saddam Hussein had done to the Kurds-- and then coming up to the present and my own recent experiences... ♪ and so that paper, then, it became clear there was kind of something there, that this fulsome consensus about applying the lessons of the Holocaust, that was living in great tension with what policymakers were doing, and yet the tension seemed one that was not being grappled with. [Typing] ♪ [Mouse click] ♪ [Typing] ♪ When I was working on my book, "Problem from Hell," what was clear was that there is a sense in many circles that promoting your values is somehow discordant with your interests. My own view is that more often than not that that's a false dichotomy. ♪ The most powerful rendition of this, I think, came when I looked at the Iraq-related cables from the eighties where the cable actually read, "Human rights and chemical weapons use aside, comma," our interests run parallel to those of Iraq"... ♪ and so it's right there. You know, they're just saying that really crummy things are happening through chemical weapons use and horrible human rights abuses, but our interests are divorced from all of that. ♪ Traditionally, our conception of our national interest would include preventing chemical weapons use, and yet here it was, "Chemical weapons use aside, we're good. You know, we've got trade to do." Reagan: Our countries share common interests in developing practical solutions to the problems... Clarke: We certainly knew to some degree what was going on, and we knew that Saddam was using chemical weapons inside his country against Kurds and others. I don't think the Reagan administration, or later the Bush administration, could ever claim that they were unaware of it. They were aware of it... and two administrations were willing to put up with a fair amount of obnoxious activity by Iraq in order to contain Iran. ...our instructions to our ambassador to give him some negotiating room. Dror Moreh: Doesn't it undermine America's credibility when you have relationship with someone like Saddam Hussein while you know that he is engaging in a chemical warfare against the Kurds? You're acting as though anytime you see something you don't like, you pick up and leave, and basically, that would leave you outside of most parts of the United States and in no place in the world. I don't know where you would hold up. It would certainly not be Washington, D.C. Maybe it would be Santa Barbara, California, but there are hardly any places where there's nothing-- where there's nothing wrong... ♪ so problems are everywhere. You got to deal with them. It's the ultimate alibi, right? It's, the interests are just an infinitely elastic concept, so if you want to do something, you say it's in your interests. I can make an argument for why cutting off aid to Saddam Hussein after he gasses his people is in our interests. It's in the interest of U.S. soldiers for chemical weapons not to be used in the battlefield... [Explosions] ♪ and in this instance, this ally ended up invading Kuwait, and the same individuals who thought it had been in our interest to work with him were in a position of having to mobilize vast expenditures, put a huge number of U.S. lives on the line in order to counter his aggression. ♪ [Indistinct conversation] Man, voice-over: Saddam Hussein's tanks and soldiers poured over the Kuwaiti border. Within 24 hours, Saddam came in control of 1/5 of the world's oil reserves, and the Iraqi army is within reach of the Saudi oil fields. ♪ Bush: We see in Saddam Hussein an aggressive dictator threatening his neighbors. Summary executions, routine torture, Hitler revisited. ♪ Moreh: How come all of a sudden, your ally Saddam Hussein turns into "Hitler revisited"? Baker: Well, the occupation was extraordinarily brutal, so if we do have informing our foreign policy, which we do, the concept that we're against human rights violations and war crimes and ethnic cleansing and so forth, then when it happens, that's another justification for doing what we did, and so we reversed it, but I'm also here to tell you, one of the reasons we reversed it was because of the threat to our secure access to the energy reserves of the Gulf. That was a fairly serious national interest. People didn't want to talk about it. "Ooh, you're just fighting over filthy oil. That's so because of money, money, money, money." Well, money's-- money's worth fighting over, in my views. Sanctions were tried, and we included the sanctions. Charlie Rose: Samantha Power is here. She is a lecturer in U.S. foreign policy. Her new book, "A Problem from Hell" examines America's response to genocide in the 20th century. Woman, voice-over: In her Pulitzer-winning work, Samantha Power outlines how all administrations throughout the century have shied away from action. Different woman: Her book is a passionate, normative judgment about what U.S. foreign policy should be, in her view. The system is broken, and we all have to put our heads together to try to fix it. Instead, I'm going to try to inspire you to become, shall we say, upstanders in a world that is sadly crowded with bystanders. ♪ Power: When I first met Barack Obama, it was my book "A Problem from Hell," I guess, that had caused him to reach out. I met him at some steakhouse up on Capitol Hill, you know, should have been an hour-long meal, but it was, like, 4 or 5 hours or something, was just a great meeting of the minds. The fact that there was an American politician who had read a 600-page book on genocide, it seemed, who came away from that book wanting to understand how we could do better at integrating human consequences into our decision making, wanting to understand what is it about all these people of good faith who go into public service to try to make the world better and then somehow this conception of national interests-- this stoic, kind of cold and clinical conception of what we are in government to do--takes over and we forget about the people who might have drawn us into this enterprise in the first place. Foreseeable replacement forces coming in. Power, voice-over: By the end of the dinner, I kind of found myself volunteering to go and work with him in a more official capacity, and I moved down very soon thereafter to Washington, and I advised him day to day. ♪ People of the world, will we stand for the human rights of the dissident in Burma, the blogger in Iran, or the voter in Zimbabwe? Will we give meaning to the words "never again" in Darfur? [Cheering and applause] People of Berlin, people of the world, this is our moment. This is our time. We needed a new infusion of energy into our politics. We needed somebody with a different message and a different story who can turn over a new page and bring something new and different to American politics. [Cheering and applause] Obama: This moment-- this moment, this election, is our chance to keep in the 21st century the American promise alive. [Cheering and applause] Crowd: Yes, we can. Yes, we can. Yes, we can. Yes, we can. Jake Sullivan, voice-over: Barack Obama and Michelle Obama become the President and First Lady of the United States in my lifetime, it said that our country has a special capacity to redeem its highest values. Even though we screw up, even though we're imperfect, we can also reach very high and very far in service of our highest ideals, and that's what it said to me. [People shouting] Woman, voice-over: December 17 in Tunisia, a street vendor, Mohamed Bouazizi, sets himself on fire in a protest against government policies, becoming the catalyst for a Tunisian revolution and the Arab Spring. Within months, demonstrations arise in Egypt, Yemen, Bahrain, and Syria. Man, voice-over: Anger erupted onto the streets, riot police rushing a crowd carrying banners reading, "Yes, we can." Woman: The regional experts say the process will remain a challenge for U.S. presidents. [Shouting continues] Man, voice-over: In Libya, after almost 4 decades of ruthless dictatorship, huge crowds demonstrated in the streets of Benghazi. [Gunfire] It's been a wild 24 hours in Libya. Muammar Gaddafi has made it clear he's not going without a fight. Man: ♪ Man, voice-over: If it's an internal or an external conspiracy, we'll erase it. Sullivan, voice-over: We began to get reports of protests in many different cities in Libya, including Tripoli and Benghazi, and then we began to get reports that those protests were being fired upon. [Gunfire] Sullivan, voice-over: As soon as that happened, it was added to what became the daily agenda of events in the region. "OK. Now we got to talk Libya." [People shouting] ♪ [Gunshot] Gaddafi: [Speaking Arabic] Anderson Cooper, voice-over: What is happening there is a massacre? Alex Crawford, voice-over: There are large-scale deaths. They are women. They are children. They're old people. They're not fighters. Power, voice-over: I remember the feeling we had Gaddafi's own words, just very explicit-- "I'm gonna hunt them down," so it was really more just, "Whoa." This is just one of those moments that you're on the front end of something. You can't predict it. [People shouting] ♪ Very frankly... ♪ Sullivan, voice-over: Secretary Clinton went to the Elysee Palace and sat down one on one with Nicolas Sarkozy, and he was extremely agitated about what might happen in Benghazi and about the absolute, unshakable, undeniable need for France and the United States and the United Kingdom to go do something about it right away. The French and the British viewed Libya as a direct threat to them-- chaos, genocide literally on their doorstep. ♪ Sullivan, voice-over: The time pressure was enormous. We started that process thinking we've got some time, and then town after town fell fast, really fast. Within days, Gaddafi's forces were knocking on the doorstep of Benghazi. [Shouting] Man, voice-over: Colonel Gaddafi's forces are pushing east. They seem unstoppable. Different man, voice-over: The regime claims that within two days, these troops would be in Benghazi. [Gunfire] We are still recovering from our involvement in Iraq. Power, voice-over: On March 15, the president convenes his national security cabinet and a few backbenchers like myself. The president opens up the meeting, and he's not in a good mood. David Petraeus: The fact is that... Rhodes, voice-over: The meeting begins with a briefing from the intelligence community, and there's a map in front of everybody, and there's a dot on the map--Benghazi, a city of several hundred thousand people, and then you can see the progression of Gaddafi's forces, and they're in a town called Ajdabiya, and it is explained to us that this is kind of the last stop on the way to Benghazi, and from this position, they can move in and just-- Gaddafi'd said they were gonna go door to door and kill people like rats, and I remember, you know, going around the table, and Obama is literally asking people, "Should I take action "to save these people in this city "that we all know are going to be killed, or should I not?" Clinton, voice-over: I laid out all of the factors, including the Arab support, not just rhetoric, but commitments for military assets and action, and our major allies in Europe, you know, we historically are always asking them to support us, but now they were asking us to support them. I don't see why that's... Denis McDonough, voice-over: I argued against intervening. The main concern was that it was a set of responsibilities that were beyond what I thought was prudent, given the other demands on the United States at the time. I thought we should avoid another military conflict. Rhodes: Biden says, "No. You'd be crazy to get another war in the Middle East." Bob Gates says no. The military is saying, "We have too much to do "in Iraq and Afghanistan, and we can't afford to move all these resources over here," and I remember I could feel it working its way around to me, and my argument was essentially, "If you don't do this "and these people all get massacred, "how will you explain this? "I mean, how can we tell the world "everybody was ready to act, and what would it say if we don't act in this circumstance?" Antony Blinken: It really went to the fact that we had a unique situation, that there was a responsibility but also an opportunity to demonstrate that the international community could act effectively to stop atrocities, could do it in a way that was grounded in international law, and the failure to take action would contribute potentially to the further unraveling of the international system. Rhodes: Obama described this decision to me as kind of a 51/49 call in his mind. He had to weigh both sets of arguments, and he decided to do it. Woman, voice-over: The question looming over the Security Council today is how Russia or China will vote. In the past, the two superpowers constantly vetoed interventions inside the sovereign state. Man, voice-over: We see China abstaining, Russia abstaining, and here comes the vote total, all necessary measures to protect the civilian population as Gaddafi's forces move in on Benghazi. Obama: The United States, the United Kingdom, France, and Arab states agree that a ceasefire must be implemented immediately. If Gaddafi does not comply with the resolution, the international community will impose consequences. ♪ [Beeping] ♪ Woman, voice-over: U.S. F-15 and F-16 fighter jets have flown dozens of sorties alongside British, French, and Danish jets. The Italians and Spanish are providing... Man, voice-over: France and Britain going to be taking the lead on the airstrikes, with the U.S. playing a key role. ♪ [Explosion] [Man shouts] [Siren] Moreh: Basically, you manage in two weeks to stop him marching to Benghazi, so why did it continue afterwards? These things, they have-- they have a momentum and an inertia and a scale of size and weight. It was very clear that was the main mission, stop Gaddafi, and then the evolution of what happens after that wasn't overly clear. So you didn't debate what will be the next steps after the war? You didn't debate that? No. Experienced men-- Gates, you--how? It wasn't like we didn't put it on the table. They weren't interested. [Shouting] ♪ Panetta, voice-over: Underneath it all is a recognition that ultimately, you're not going to change things without regime change and that, while you don't say it, the reality is that you know the only way you're going to achieve some kind of end here is to end the regime. [Shouting] ♪ [Machine gun fire] [Shouting continues] ♪ [Indistinct conversation] [Shouting] Man: [Shouts in Arabic] [Call to prayer on P.A.] Sullivan, voice-over: Libya's only hope was to have some kind of stabilization force that could tamp down violence and engage in some kind of demobilization of the militias. Secretary Clinton posed the question very directly to the Europeans-- "You know, this is on your doorstep. "What are you gonna do about this? What role are you prepared to play?" and European leaders from France and the U.K., from Italy all said, "We intend to have a significant hand in the shaping of the aftermath of any military action." [People chanting] ♪ McDonough, voice-over: President Obama negotiated with Prime Minister Cameron, President Sarkozy his view that steps post action will be as important to the successful outcome in Libya, and he sought their assurance, and they gave it to him, that they would take the lead on post-action efforts in Libya. Unfortunately, they just were not in a position to deliver. [Gunfire] Man, voice-over: Libya has become increasingly unstable, with rival militias engaged in some of the fiercest fights. Woman, voice-over: Some say it's the worst violence in Libya since the revolution in 2011. [Men shouting] [Gunfire] Rhodes: Obama would call me in and, you know, get frustrated because Cameron and Sarkozy just couldn't do that. He expressed increasing frustration that anybody who says that the United States is not gonna have to end up doing all this ourselves is not acknowledging what we're learning from history but also from Libya, which is that everyone will say, "Sure, we'll do all these things," but on the back end, it was like, "OK. "What is the U.S. gonna do to put this place back together again?" [Distant gunfire] Mullen, voice-over: We'd invaded, if you will. We'd intervened, and then we all left, not just the U.S. Everybody left, and--Colin Powell said this, you know-- if you break it, you own it, and we broke it, and we didn't own it. What stunned me is, having learned some version of that lesson in Iraq, we didn't do it in Libya. I mean, it stuns me to this day. Biden: Tell me what happens. He's gone, what happens? Doesn't the country disintegrate? Sullivan, voice-over: The minute that you walk into the White House Situation Room, you immediately recognize that you've got a collection of imperfect people with imperfect information about what's going on facing imperfect choices and in an imperfect process where it's hard to actually draw in all the right people to contribute to the decision, so it shouldn't come as any surprise that you end up getting imperfect results. Biden: 200,000 300,000 or 150,000 troops... Sullivan, voice-over: Every solution you propose or present or pursue almost necessarily creates new problems, so, even when you think you've done the right thing, you have generated a whole set of additional decisions that themselves put you back in this loop of imperfection. Obama: The United States can't get in the middle of somebody else's civil war. [Chanting in Arabic] Man: [Rapping in Arabic] Man, voice-over: Huge demonstrations today throughout Syria calling for more freedom and dignity. Woman, voice-over: The Syrian government made it very clear today that it will tolerate no dissent. [People shouting and whistling] [Machine gun fire] Man: [Shouting in Arabic] [Shouting continues] [Machine gun fire] Power, voice-over: In Syria, it was so clear that Assad was employing a how-to manual of how to basically be the most savage leader in the Arab world, the most savage responder to peaceful protests. You're seeing him use incendiary weapons. Into 2012, he's using napalm. We're already hearing the reports of what snipers are doing and how people are being tortured with acid and electric shock in the prisons. ♪ I got the sense that Syria was going to be a problem from hell in early 2012, when the Russian Perm Rep to the U.N., Vitaly Churkin, told Susan Rice, who was our ambassador to the United Nations, that the Russians would go along with the resolution. They called for a halt to the violence, and then Secretary Clinton had a meeting with Sergey Lavrov to talk about the resolution before the vote, and Lavrov basically told her, "It ain't happening. We're not supporting it. We're backing Assad," and at that moment, it became clear to me that you now had great powers pitted against each other in Syria and with that, the conflict was going to be very difficult to manage and Assad was going to be empowered to slaughter even more of his own people. ♪ [People wailing] ♪ Derek Chollet, voice-over: We saw the situation in Syria unraveling. It looked that either Assad was going to do something to use the chemical weapons or there would be a loss of control of some kind, and so the question would always come back to, "Well, what happens with the chemical weapons? Around one of those moments with the president, he's asked a question-- "Well, what would happen if these chemical weapons were on the loose?" Chuck Todd. Do you envision using U.S. military, if simply for nothing else the safe keeping of the chemical weapons? We have been very clear to the Assad regime but also to other players on the ground that a red line for us is, we start seeing a whole bunch of chemical weapons moving around or being utilized, that's a red line for us, and that there would be enormous consequences if we start seeing movement on the chemical weapons. Obama violated one of the core tenets of press conferences, which is, you never answer a hypothetical question, so he answered a hypothetical question. That would change my calculus. That would change my equation, all right? Thank you, everybody. At that moment, it became this kind of line in the sand. If chemical weapons were used, the full force and fury of U.S. military power would be used against Assad. ♪ Woman, voice-over: The images you are about to see are so important because they're being held up tonight by Syrian rebels as evidence of what may be the worst chemical weapons attack anywhere since Saddam Hussein gassed the Iraqi Kurds in 1988. The United States government now knows that at least 1,429 Syrians were killed in this attack, including at least 426 children. We know where the rockets were launched from and at what time. Power, voice-over: You have these families who were just sleeping, minding their own business. The gas comes in. It's very clear from where the regime fired it into opposition villages. I mean, the question of who did it is a nonissue. With our own eyes, we have seen the thousands of reports. All of them show and report victims with breathing difficulties, people twitching with spasms, coughing, rapid heartbeats, foaming at the mouth, unconsciousness, and death. ♪ Power, voice-over: Looking at those photographs of those kids lined up, those little kids, you just see the size of them, the size of my own kids at that time, and just lines, just rows of them. You know, I mean-- Man: Oh... [Crying] [Speaking Arabic] So the primary question is really no longer what do we know. The question is, what are we-- we collectively-- what are we in the world gonna do about it? Man: The composition of... Power, voice-over: I went into the first meeting with the president after the strike with my arguments lined up, ready to make the case for how this is an existential threat in the sense that it's a chemical weapon that can kill so many, and I didn't need to make any argument. President Obama knew exactly what he was going to do. 10 days ago, the world watched in horror as men, women, and children were massacred in Syria in the worst chemical weapons attack of the 21st century, and after careful deliberation, I have decided that the United States should take military action against Syrian regime targets. ...ban against the use of chemical weapons and prohibitions against other weapons of mass destruction. Chuck Hagel, voice-over: We wanted to do something that was meaningful, that would hurt him, that would affect his ability to continue what he was doing. The military options were discussed. It was the National Security Council. We gave the president those options. He chose one. We had it all set. It was ready to go. We had all agreed on it. We have options to deal with chemicals, long-range rockets and missiles... We must come together as... Rhodes, voice-over: The first time I saw Obama have second thoughts was the middle of the week, and he's calling Angela Merkel asking her not for troops or planes, just political support, Just a statement in support of bombing Syria. Obama said, "Angela, I need you on this." I mean, you know, he made, like, a forceful plea, how it was a moral case, there's a strategic case, and she said, "Barack"-- she said it with some feeling because they were very close, you know--"Barack, you want to go through this process. "I'm telling you this as a friend. "If you go in now, Putin's going to say, "you know, you made this up. Support's not gonna be there," and I remember him hanging up the phone, and it was the first time I saw some doubt creep in, and he said to me, you know, something along the lines of, like, "People really-- Nobody wants to do this, you know?" Sullivan: The Russians did not want us to attack, and they basically said, "You have no basis or right "to do this because it wasn't the Assad regime. It was the opposition." We asked them for any evidence that they could put forward to justify their claim, and they had nothing. Kerry: ...chemical weapons to the international community. Step by step over the course of that week, events begin to intrude. The British Parliament votes to prevent Cameron from joining this... It is clear to me that the British Parliament, reflecting the views of the British people, does not want to see British military action. I get that, and the government will act accordingly. While we're in a meeting with the leadership of the U.S. Congress that is telling us that they will only support it with congressional authorization... The bloodshed is gonna end. Rhodes, voice-over: and so this question became, "What do we do?" I remember I was in a meeting in Denis' office on Friday afternoon, and Denis gets kind of a tap on the shoulder, you know, "Boss wants to see you," ...and we've wrestled with this issue very... McDonough, voice-over: After several hours of meetings with his National Security Council that day, we took a long walk on the South Lawn. I have a view on these matters, which is that Congress has a responsibility to have a role. The Founding Fathers had a view that Congress declares wars and raises armies. That's my view, that the American people have the confidence that the institutions of the government, including the Congress, are involved in that decision. ♪ Rhodes: Dennis comes back, and then I get a tap on the shoulder saying, "You need to go to the Oval Office." ♪ I get in, and Obama stands up from behind the Oval Office, and there's nobody else there, and he says, "I've got a big idea," and I knew that whatever decision he'd made, he had made that decision just before he even told me what it was by his demeanor, his appearance... Obama: Think that on issues like this, it's important... Rhodes, voice-over: and he said, "I believe I need to seek "congressional authorization "because I don't believe that this will be a one-off. "Like, if we bomb Syria, "this is something we're gonna be doing for a long time, "and I can't sustain this politically without congressional authorization," and then he's getting into the fact that the same dysfunction in the U.S. Congress is present internationally, which is, "All the Europeans say, "We got to do something about this," "but are they gonna be there in a year or two years or 3 years if this thing goes like I think it's going to go?" and then he said, "You know, if it's Syria now, It'll be Iran next, and where does this all end?" and I remember there's a picture of this meeting, and I look like a balloon that has been deflated because I was accepting something I didn't want to accept, which is, I'd operated under the belief that-- for two years that we could do something in Syria, and then I had the President of United States, who happens to be my boss and someone who I know very well, kind of laying out for me why that's not gonna work unless we get congressional authorization. I mean, it was kind of obvious that he was, in some respects, pulling back the throttle. ♪ Kerry: ...because a lot of other countries whose policies challenged these international norms are watching. They are watching. They want to see whether the United States and our friends mean what we say. It is directly related to our credibility and whether countries still believe the United States when it says something. They are watching to see if Syria can get away with it because then maybe they too can put the world at greater risk. It's about choices that will directly affect our role in the world and our interests in the world. It is also profoundly about who we are. We are the United States of America. ♪ Robert Malley: How do you make decisions, and are you thinking about an action today or its consequences in the next year? How much weight do you put on an issue like credibility? If you believe that issuing that red line was a mistake, do you then have to compound that mistake with another mistake in order not to lose credibility? ♪ I think for President Obama, the credibility was the reason the U.S. had made more mistakes in its history than virtually anything else, Vietnam being one of them, and continuing with wrong policy, so human factor, what kind of person are you when you confront those decisions, I think that's what it's all about. Panetta: The one thing you have as president is credibility, and once you give your word, once you say you're gonna do something, then people expect that you will follow through on your word, and if you don't--if you don't, then that will be read as weakness, and people then will think they can take advantage of you because, regardless of what you say, they don't really believe you're going to act on your word, and that, more than anything, can weaken your ability to deal with crisis. This week, when I addressed the nation on Syria, I said that, in part because of the credible threat of U.S. military force, there is the possibility of a diplomatic solution. Russia has indicated a new willingness to join with the international community in pushing Syria to give up its chemical weapons. If there's any chance of achieving that goal without resorting to force, then I believe we have a responsibility to pursue that path. Woman, voice-over: Some say the agreement emboldens Russia. Man, voice-over: This is a Russian plan for Russian interests. Woman, voice-over: President Obama tried to downplay the notion that this is a win for America's historic geopolitical foe. ♪ Power: It was a mistake to go to Congress, and, while we made the best of a bad situation in negotiating the end of Syria's chemical weapons program, it was clear they were always gonna keep some for a rainy day, and it was clear that after that, the threat of the use of force inevitably was gonna mean less than it had meant before. ♪ Man, voice-over: The situation in Syria continued to grow worse by the day. John McCain: Thousands and thousands and thousands, 192,000 dead, 3 million refugees, and we're not gonna do anything about Assad? [People shouting] Power, voice-over: 2014, we were fighting ISIS. We were dealing with U.S. embassies under siege, U.S. journalists being beheaded. The emphasis was on the lives of Americans, but at the same time, to be just reminded again and again of the inadequacy of what we were doing commensurate to our stated objectives, our stated objectives were alleviation of suffering-- not happening; sufferings getting worse-- preventing the rise of terrorist groups, stemming refugee flow, refugee flow getting worse, I mean, on every axis... ♪ but the suffering is one that makes you feel potentially-- certainly, I felt this way at a different level-- but guilty. It makes you feel like you're not-- you know, that you're letting innocents down, and you're the only-- and Obama would be very clear-eyed. He'd have no alibi for himself. He knows that the only hope they have is America. Across the globe, lot of people think something should be done, but nobody wants to do it, and that's not an unusual... Malley, voice-over: Once in the White House, there was a discussion on Syria, and Samantha was pushing back on what we needed to do, and she was getting frustrated, and the president was getting frustrated. After the meeting, he goes up, and he turns around and says, "Samantha, come with me to the Oval. It's not gonna be something that the United States... Malley, voice-over: I don't know what they said, but to me, as I read it, she was always his bad conscience. She was the person who reminded him of the side of him who was idealistic. ...hitting hospitals, hitting refugee... Malley, voice-over: There are very few people that he would have a back-and-forth with in the Situation Room. He would have back-and-forth with her because he respected her views, because he knew she disagreed. We had rules in place dealing with... Power, voice-over: There were a lot of layers in the dynamic between President Obama and myself on Syria. You know, he wouldn't let a Syria meeting end without saying, "Sam, what you got?" you know. Because I'd often be on the screen, he'd say, "I see that look of skepticism," and I could-- You know, sometimes I would speak, and I could just see him getting impatient and not liking the message. You know, one time it was, "We've all read your book, Samantha. "In other words, we don't need to be reminded "of the human consequences "of bystanding in the face of mass atroc--" like, "We get it," like, "Spare us," kind of... ♪ and my view to this day is that he heard moral judgment because that was the voice in his head. No matter how I articulated what I was saying, he heard me saying, "You're a bystander." Geir O. Pedersen: Let me express the gravest concern that the violence is, so far, not abating. No one... Stephanie Ruhle: Realistically, how close are we to any sort of real resolution to stop this? We've got to get a political solution not just for Syria. It's because of a failed policy which has allowed this situation in Syria to deteriorate to the point where people just have to leave. Power, voice-over: I'd had a warm relationship with Senator McCain, so when Tony Blinken, a colleague of mine and friend of mine, was up for being deputy secretary of state and McCain was placing what's called a hold on his nomination, I said, "Tony, I got this," so I called. Senator McCain took the call. I basically got about two sentences into my pitch just to vouch that Tony was very concerned about the Syrians, but McCain, he just cut me off, and he just says, "How can you live with yourself? How?" you know, "You're gonna make the policy better? "This policy is a disaster. "Hundreds of thousands of people are being killed, "and you, the author of "A Problem from Hell," "are part of this administration. You're complicit in this," and he just went on and on. McCain: ...strategy, there is no success. Power, voice-over: You know, I had the phone initially here, and then it was so loud, but I kept trying to kind of reroute it to Tony and saying, "Look. I think if he's in the room, there will be another voice," and he's like, "Please. Another voice. Like yours was a voice?" because he had thought, you know, when I got confirmed, I'd be in the cabinet. I'd be a voice. "You know, this president is not-- "He's feckless," you know, and he would go on, and he said, "Look. You know, not only should Tony Blinken not be confirmed, but you should resign," and then the line went dead. ♪ A number of newspapers were calling on me to resign. Even close friends from Bosnia would say, "Have you thought about--" so I did think about it. ♪ I could have expressed the sort of searing mark that Syria left on me by leaving, but who would that have helped, and-- Who? Tell me one person it would have helped other than me in this interview. I'm in the room with the president. Barack Obama is not cold to what is happening to the Syrian people. What was very challenging was figuring out what is the pathway that is going to do more good than harm, and he made a judgment, not one I agreed with, but a reasonable one. At the same time, he gave me power to try to get more refugees into the country, getting political prisoners out of jail, to ending an Ebola crisis, even though everyone in America wanted nothing to do with West Africa. Those are consequences, and to go back to teaching and writing and hoping somebody reads my op-ed compared to the ability to do something for someone on a given day, it just wasn't a close call. Man, voice-over: Dramatic new drone video tells the tale of destruction. Anti-Assad government rebels held in East Aleppo were hit hard. Security Council resolution calling for a new pause to the fighting was vetoed, and so the Russian-led airstrikes continue. Power, voice-over: Here is what is happening right now in Eastern Aleppo. Syrians trapped by the fighting are sending out their final appeals for help. [Indistinct conversation] ♪ Power, voice-over: This is what is being done by member states of the United Nations who are sitting around this horseshoe table today to the people of Eastern Aleppo. ♪ Aleppo will join the ranks of those events that define modern evil-- [Coughs] Power, voice-over: Halabja, Rwanda, Srebrenica, and now Aleppo. [Shouting] Woman: [Shouting in Arabic] ♪ Are you truly incapable of shame? Is there literally nothing that can shame you? ♪ This is not leading from behind. This is hiding from behind. I mean, we have Samantha Powers, you know, attacking Iran, Assad, Russia, saying, "Have you no shame?" What about the administration? The thing about Syria and the Obama policy is that this tiny country has caused so much destabilization not only for its neighbors, but for Europe and so forth. ♪ Power: How can something so clear in retrospect become so muddled at the time by rationalizations, institutional constraints, and, above all, a lack of imagination? How can it be that those who fight on behalf of these principles are the ones deemed unreasonable? George Bernard Shaw once wrote, "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world. "The unreasonable one persists "in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." ♪ What's happened in Syria is absolutely heartbreaking, and there's not a day that goes by that I don't think about it. ♪ It's natural to want to blame someone for a terrible outcome, and I get that. I think the president gets that. You know, I wish there were an available alternative to us to fix that situation in Syria, but we looked at all the alternatives, and there was not one that worked. ♪ I'll be honest with you sitting here today. Like, I don't know how much of that I had to rationalize the inaction, you know, because I knew after 2013 that I was going to be living with this inaction, and so to this day, I'm torn by-- It's a complicated thing. This gets back to your tugging at your conscience. Do you do you construct arguments to rationalize something that you used to feel passionately differently about, you know? I think there's something like that that's been going on with me. To be a liberal and to deal with these questions, you know, probably inevitably leads to that. Anyone who had any responsibility for Syria and for our policy there has to look themselves in the mirror and see failure staring back at you. On one level, it's as simple as that. We didn't stop the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of people. We didn't prevent millions of people being forcibly displaced from their homes. We look at that bottom line, and you can't but conclude that we failed. ♪ Mark Lowcock: You in this Security Council have ignored all the previous pleas you have heard. You know what is happening, and you have done nothing. ♪ Malley: Syria is a core example of that inability of the international community to come together to try to stop mass atrocities, and this is one of the worst mass atrocities, but they they existed before Syria. They've existed after, and we haven't been able to answer that question. The whole theory of responsibility to protect, which has never really been implemented, you know, it's not the international consensus today. ♪ Sullivan: I believe that the United States bears responsibility to try to rally action in response to genocide, mass killings, mass atrocities so that the world does not descend into darkness and madness. We have an obligation to play a central role, but not a singular role. Murray McCully: The draft resolution has not been adopted owing to the negative vote of a permanent member of... Power, voice-over: Great power politics don't go away just because of the responsibility to protect. The Security Council gave 5 permanent members a veto, and for any of the permanent 5 to be a sole arbiter of whether you can kill your people or not, that's not what the founders, you know, had in mind. ♪ Man: Mr. President, the General Assembly by unanimous vote affirmed that genocide is a crime under international law which the civilized world condemns and for the commission of which principals and accomplices are punishable. [Applause] ♪ Lake, voice-over: There will always be genocides or war crimes because human nature hasn't changed. If you look around the world, you can see how the forces of selfishness and of barriers and of denial of rights are growing, and they are growing, I believe, because the democratic institutions that were put in place 70 years ago are all under assault and in too many countries, they are losing, including the values themselves. Man: World peace, world justice... Lake, voice-over: Every nation in the world agreed that the international community has a responsibility to protect people against genocide and war crimes, et cetera, and then find practical ways not to implement it, and so the lesson that wasn't implemented is a lesson not taken. George Clooney: We were brought up to believe that the U.N. was formed to ensure that the Holocaust could never happen again. This genocide will be on your watch. How you deal with it will be your legacy-- your Rwanda, your Cambodia, your Auschwitz. ♪ ♪ ♪ COVER IMAGE REFERRAL https://www.pbs.org/video/obamas-cabinet-and-libya-pldhu2/

Mermaid 2025 DTIYS Black Artist OF Tumblr 04252025 https://www.tumblr.com/richardmurrayhumblr/781819416682905600/draw-this-in-your-style-lmao IN AMENDMENT Why The Disposable Black Girlfriend Is A Problem from Princess Weekes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIDOUXna8EA TRANSCRIPT 0:00 I am a pretty solid fan of the series the first season was incredible the 0:05 memes were fantastic and with there being so many different superhero deconstruction shows and adult animated 0:11 series it managed to still feel fresh I will also watch almost anything with JK 0:18 Simmons in it almost anything but there was one aspect of the show I've always 0:24 strongly disliked I heard you took a few on the chin for me again Invincible was originally a comic book series by Robert 0:31 Kirkman who also co-created and co-wrote The Walking Dead it began publication in 0:36 2003 and lasted for 144 issues and 25 volumes ending in 2018 as the show has 0:43 been adapted for the animated am*zon Prime series Kirkman has admitted to rewriting certain parts of the series 0:48 and updating it the comics had a lot of very Peak 2000's humor gay jokes rward 0:54 poorly written female characters messy depictions of sexual assault so with over a decade Plus distance changes were 1:01 made and I think that's commendable I think that it's really cool to be able to know that your work can be updated 1:06 and then when you're given the opportunity to do so you take it Kirkman told radio times when we sit down with 1:11 the source material if we feel like everything is working we just try to make sure that we uphold what existed in 1:17 the comics trying to put a Fresh coat of paint on it trying to expand things where we can expand them truncate things 1:23 where you feel like that's necessary following the finale for this past season a lot of attention was made to 1:28 the monologue that the character Conquest made that was not present in the original comic no one wants to be my 1:34 friend they think I am unstable [ __ ] me too when I write an episode I always go 1:40 through the comic and think about how I can make things more interesting because I'm writing myself I feel an extra 1:46 responsibility if I'm going to write the same thing a second time I need to make it interesting for me and hopefully make 1:53 it better for the audience one change that happened while 1:59 making the new series series was having the main character Mark Grayson also known as half Korean I think 2:05 representation matters not to get on a soap box or anything especially in the world of superheroes you didn't start 2:11 getting nonwhite superheroes regularly until the 70s and even then through the 2:16 ' 80s and '90s and 2000s they're still somewhat rare yeah but they don't tell them that they all think it's organic 2:22 diversity there's nothing about his race that is essential to that character his race could literally be anything I think 2:28 because we were in that position we decided it'd be a responsible thing to do and a really cool thing to do and do 2:35 something with his race that was interesting in the animated series and that's why we decided to go down that 2:40 road down down down the road down the witches Road in the comics Mark and his 2:46 mother Debbie are very white-coated and I did see the arguments about the our style being ambiguous but using just 2:54 kind of like media General literacy like we can inert that they are white because that is the default in American comics 3:00 and I think up until Mark was confirmed to be Korean in this I don't think anyone would have doubted his whiteness 3:05 anyway Steven Yun is Korean and was cast as the voice actor for Mark and Sandra o voices his mother and so visually they 3:12 were changed to be more Korean in design the show however has never really given 3:17 a lot of cultural markers for the characters beyond that not even the obligatory like no shoes in the house 3:22 but that's not my culture or background to critique it is just interesting that I think the most explicit mention of 3:29 Mark's non whiteness recently was like Dr seismic calling him like token diversity which is like it's my old 3:36 friend's token diversity and gender stereotype another character whose race 3:41 was changed was Amber in the comics Amber was a white character who is L show the difficulty of being the 3:47 girlfriend of a superhero it's very like early Gwen Stacy Lana Lang except she 3:52 gets to live so in the adaptation they wanted to add a bit more layer to the character make her more fleshed out and 3:58 because she is voiced by zaz beats she was turned from a white character to a 4:03 black character and this as often happens with race bending is where the 4:10 trouble [Music] begins hi I am princess weeks if you 4:17 enjoyed this video please like share and subscribe I talk about the intersections between pop culture and gender race etc 4:24 etc and so forth I also have a podcast called open tabs where where I talk 4:30 about fanfiction it is not safe for work but it is very enjoyable uh so if you are interested in 4:37 something about fanfiction uh that is a little bit you know like having a dirty conversation with friends over you know 4:44 the smudy queer fanfic that you enjoy uh check it out we all know that data collectors and spammers have found ways 4:51 to collect the personal information we have floating around the internet often without our knowledge or consent we 4:57 don't think about where we put it and then when certain companies go bankrupt 5:03 we suddenly realize that we have given sites a lot more information than we should have and I think we have all 5:09 recently seen the importance of cyber security when it comes to phone numbers and group chats incog is a powerful 5:17 service that helps you reclaim your online privacy by removing your personal information from data broker databases 5:24 here's why I love it it automates the process of contacting data Brokers to remove your information it is incredibly 5:30 userfriendly and does all the hard work for you and it provides regular updates on the status of your data removal 5:36 requests I have been using incog for a while and it always is updating and I'm constantly getting alerts that there are 5:42 just too many things about me that I have to remove um you know I feel very popular but not in a good way within a 5:49 few months of just starting to use it I saw a significant reduction in spam calls and emails try and cogn for 5:55 yourself and see the difference it can make use code princess weeks at the link below to get exclusive 60% off an annual 6:01 incog plan that's 6:20 incognitomotion shows especially the women essentially the dbg is a black 6:26 female character who exists in a relationship as a orary placeholder for the main relationship the black woman in 6:33 this case is there for diversity she is there to be a foil to whomever the end game romance will be 50/50 she has 6:41 natural hair and the character doesn't have to be poorly written but she is fundamentally a prop and is never a real 6:48 genuine romantic Choice while I am being specific to black women in this Trope people of color in general can often be 6:54 written to fill this role I can think of many black men who have served this 6:59 function oh my God you're Jimmy Olen the photographer from The Daily Planet but let's get back to Invincible even before 7:06 I looked into the comics I felt like Eve was always intended to be endgame for Mark I always got the feeling that he 7:13 was into Eve and that if she hadn't been daing Rex he'd probably have gone for her in the first 7:19 place and when Mark and Amber started dating at least for me it never felt like this was like his great one first 7:26 love it always felt like I'm going to watch him go through all of this just to get to his actual soulmate Eve who is 7:34 non- derogatorily the like comic cliche of overpowered busty redhead who can't 7:40 actually use all her powers because then she would just break the format tragically boring but a friend of mine is working on a video about that and 7:46 they'll cover that there but like yeah that undercurrent poisoned my entire experience of watching Amber Amber was 7:52 already not liked by fans because she was seen to be the worst kind of thing a woman on a show like this can be 7:59 a hypocrite did you hear what I just said I know you're a superhero you know 8:05 you you know I'm not an idiot I figured it out weeks ago oh she knew he was invincible the whole time oh does she 8:12 not want him to save people why is she so mad about the goddamn soup kitchen 8:17 it's not about the soup kitchen she's not really mad about the soup kitchen it's about the whole lying thing but no 8:24 one cares and I'll say this I think Amber was always going to fail with an audience because that kind of character 8:31 is always hated the CW arse hate boards are filled with angry comments about 8:37 women who don't understand why their partner is always ditching them and they don't understand the mission and their 8:43 struggle and their Journey like this happens all the time on Arrow despite the fact that we the audience knew that 8:50 Oliver cheated lied and kept personal stuff from his then partner Laurel in 8:55 their relationship including the fact that her sister who he cheated on Laurel with was alive Laura was always framed 9:01 as the bad guy because her reaction to being lied to was an endless patience 9:08 plus they already had like two cool girl side options on the roster for him anyway but people already hate the kind 9:14 of character narrative Amber was a part of tie that with a character who is opinionated and assertive and black mess 9:22 and even when they do this as well as they can you are never really set up to 9:28 take the side of the person you were always made to feel like that woman is tripping it's already hard and then on 9:34 top of it this is not an important long-term relationship it is meant to teach him a lesson and it's a lesson 9:41 that we have seen done all the time so that's annoying and then on top of it 9:46 because Amber is black we now have to experience racism and Amber is now the only female black character of note in 9:53 the entire series as of right now and when I brought this up on Tik Tok there was a question of if Amber was always 10:00 meant to be sort of a disposable character as a love interest why does it matter if she's black or white why is 10:07 this so of Merit that it has a name and any relevance 10:17 well I have another video coming up shortly about the tragic motto stereotype so I don't want to repeat 10:23 things over and over again so for the sake of this video I need to accept a few things that I would hope you you 10:29 know but here we go race is a construct but it matters in terms of society 10:34 before we had the concept of race as we know it now a lot of stereotypes about women men sex Etc was all nationalistic 10:42 if you look at something like genital herpes which has existed for as long as there have been humans in England they 10:48 call it the French disease in France they call it the napole disease you know white on white violence very elegant um 10:56 which is why when people say they want European nationalism it's like the global impact of the transatlantic 11:01 slave trade and then later European colonialism did help refine race along 11:07 different Norms than previously nationalistic borders this is why even though there has always been slavery 11:13 imperialism Empire Etc we talk about this so much as having an impact because we are still actively dealing with those 11:20 repercussions today that's why we like oh whatever was over Savannah we know Savannah I hear 11:27 you but we have sociology that tells about how it infects us right now in Sabrina strings fearing the black body 11:32 she explains the racial roots of European and American fat phobia in early parts of the book strings 11:38 discusses beauty standards in the 14 and 1500s when the Portuguese started the slave trade major cities became more and 11:45 more familiar with African women and therefore they became part of the regular conversations and trius on 11:51 beauty African women were described as well proportioned and plump and consequently viewed as physically 11:56 appealing yet the burgeoning discourse about African suggested that their purported distinctive facial features 12:02 made them facially unattractive black women were further denigrated due to their surval status therefore despite 12:09 black women's reputations as well-formed Beauties their purported African physiy 12:14 and status as slaves became the early basis of social distinctions between low 12:20 status African women and their High status European counterparts strings then explains that one of the big 12:26 cultural Transformations from African women being seen as physically appealing to a more hypersexualized way was the 12:33 exploitation of Sarah Bartman also known as the hot and tot Venus Bartman was an 12:38 African woman who was part of an erotic freak Show in the 19th century she was a slave who was brought to places in 12:44 Europe where people especially white men would gawk at her cartoonishly depicted large backside it was usually very 12:51 exaggerated and used to place the African female body as Savage and primitive but also inherently sexual 12:59 this racial ftiz worked to do two things hypersexualize black bodies and establish their sexuality as something 13:06 that did not belong to themselves but to white people in the public sphere when 13:11 we think about the role of gender in this time under the patriarchy the ideal woman was meant to be an innocent 13:17 domestic being and this was one way to remove black women from Womanhood 13:24 culturally but then especially in the Americas it was also done legally In 13:30 1855 the state of Missouri prosecuted a slave named Celia Celia murdered her master Robert Nome while he was in the 13:37 process of sexually assaulting her something he allegedly did to her since he purchased her as a teenager during 13:42 her trial her lawyer argued that the laws in missoury concerning ravishment included enslaved women courts rejected 13:49 that as IR rationale the enslaved could neither give nor refuse consent nor 13:55 offer reasonable resistance yet they were criminally responsible and liable 14:01 the slave was recognized as a reasoning subject who possessed intent and rationality solely in the context of 14:08 criminal liability as a result Celia was found guilty of murder and was hanged adding on to this Dynamic of black women 14:15 not being able to be under the law while being subj to the harassment of their owners white women who were married to 14:21 these slave owners possessed resentment towards black women for being their husband's Mistresses which could 14:29 contains so much more agency than an the slave woman would have Mary boyin chestn not known for her diaries about the 14:35 Civil War and probably like the Confederate version of Lenny refall said that slave women were the culprits 14:40 responsible for their husband's downfall and forced decent white women to live with disgraced white men and be 14:47 surrounded by prostitutes I know sometimes when you're asked why a Trope 14:52 exists and someone gives you this long historical answer it can be like really overwhelming because for many people 14:58 it's just not that serious ious they are viewing the experiences of these characters from show to show but to 15:03 understand what the Disposable black woman is a problem you need to understand the social construction around the disposability of black women 15:09 in this country black women could be violently gang and the white men could brag about it and nothing would be done 15:15 it wasn't until the rap of Betty Jee Owens in 1959 that white men in the South were sent to jail for her and one 15:23 of the men who was convicted was paroled tried to kill Owens murdered another black woman and put her in a shallow 15:29 grave this was 66 years ago the new Senate's median age is 15:36 64.7 years which is down from 65.3 the start of the previous Congress and let's 15:42 think about this the transatlantic slave trade starts roughly around what people say is like 15:48 1526 the first significant case of a black woman getting legal justice for 15:54 her sexual assault happened in 1959 do you think that 433 years of seeing 16:01 black women as sexual trinkets as disposable goes away in 60 years or does 16:09 that mentality evolve and translate into other ways that black women now are still spoken and treated sexually in the 16:16 modern era especially when it comes to dating and relationships especially when 16:22 you have to watch dating shows Temptation Island is a humiliation 16:30 ritual where women take men that have cheated on them and test them to see if they're done cheating at least that's 16:36 what I got from the season that I watched they're all beautiful if you guys can take them you can have them 16:42 they get 12 hot men and 12 hot women to serve as Temptations one of the couples 16:47 on the show on this latest season was Taylor and 16:53 Tyler Taylor noted that Tyler's type is Tiny and blonde but during the first 16:58 opportunity they have to pick a date Tyler picks Courtney this beautiful sexy 17:04 black woman and the reaction was telling who do you think that he was 17:09 going to pick yellow dress that is his type to a tea to be honest I'm really proud of him at first I was like Taylor 17:18 what do you mean that it's really Brave of him that's weird however as the series progressed she clocked that tea 17:23 because the girl that Taylor initially clocked as being someone that Tyler would have dated is who he hyper fixates 17:30 on for the rest of the season Courtney this beautiful black woman was simply being used as a prop in this moment for 17:37 him to say something about himself on national television and to stun on his ex let's talk about it so in that moment 17:45 in which Tyler chose me for the first 17:51 date the entire group of girls standing beside me gassed but their gas wasn't in 17:58 a happy gasp it was more in a disappointment gasp in her book The End 18:04 Of Love yeah she's back Sabrina strings quotes from B hooks's 1992 essay eating 18:12 the other while teaching at Yale I walked one bright spring day in the downtown area of New Haven and found 18:18 myself walking behind a group of very blonde very white jock type boys seemingly on aware of my presence these 18:24 young men talked about their plans to [ __ ] as many girls from other racial SL ethnic groups as they could catch before 18:32 graduation they ran it down black girls were high on the list Native American girls hard to find Asian girls all 18:39 lumped into the same category deemed easier to entice were considered Prime targets talking about this overheard 18:46 conversation with my students I found that it was commonly accepted that one shopped for sexual partners in the same 18:52 way one shopped for courses at Yale that raisin ethnicity was a serious category on which selections were B B to these 18:59 young men and their buddies [ __ ] was a way to confront the other as well as a 19:05 way to make themselves over to leave behind white Innocents and enter the world of experience as is often the case 19:12 in this Society they were confident that non-white people had more life experience were more worldly sensual and 19:19 sexual because they were different getting a bit of the other in this case engaging in sexual encounters with 19:25 non-white females was considered a ritual of transcendence a movement out into the world of 19:31 difference that would transform an acceptable right of passage give me just 19:37 half a second what the [ __ ] black women are acceptable to have sex with and date but 19:43 their roles as wives and mothers is not seen as prominent as them being sexual 19:49 objects it doesn't go away when the media attempts to craft characters who were once white into women of color in 19:55 general it often happens with a lack of understanding of what changes about that character due to those dynamics that to 20:01 be a woman of color in the west carries a lot of sexual sociopolitical baggage that needs to be accounted for in 20:07 writing characters if only to be aware of what tropes exist you don't have to like reinvent the wheel but you should 20:15 know a little bit about the women that you're going to be writing 20:23 about the thing about this troop is that when it shows up in media it's like this 20:28 death by a thousand paper cuts because a lot of people are again viewing this Dynamic solely from the perspective of 20:34 the one show itself they're not trying to automatically build connections it is a building block and usually from shows 20:41 that want to be inclusive but they still put black characters in very cliche roles or they race Band characters and 20:48 ignore race hoping that it will be received as a colorblind accomplishment Allah a Hamilton or a brandy Cinderella 20:56 that ignores that the stage in the Disney musical are almost most very organic moments for colorby and casting at least a couple years ago and that 21:03 they are short content compared to a long television series one of the most 21:08 recent examples of this that really gets on my nerves has been the casting of the members of the House valan on House of 21:16 the Dragon uh just spoilers for what's on the show no spoilers for the future just generic book wiing your lips are 21:23 moving and you're complaining about something that's winging this one's been killed six times 21:29 you don't hear him bitching about it in the book series H Valerian is one of the surviving houses along with the 21:35 targaryens from old Valeria and they often have silver gold hair and purple eyes they've intermarried with the House 21:42 Targaryen quite often and they even arrived in Westeros before their dragon flying kin for example Egon the conquer 21:49 and his Sister Wives had a father who was a Targaryen and a mother who was from house Valyrian actor Steve tucon 21:56 was cast as Lord corus valy and his family has been portrayed as an interracial black family the problem I 22:02 had with this casting was not the the cast themselves they're all really excellent the problem is that if you read Fire and Blood you know that Lor 22:10 and Lena were going to die so there is already that element now being added onto them as being these biracial black 22:17 visibly characters who are like the in between spouses for Damon and rira in 22:22 the show's defense they do try to make Lor a more complex gay man and I think that's really good but it's not that 22:29 great either and with Lena they completely admit Damon actively courting her mourning her trying to saved their 22:37 life you know Lena and Rene's relationship which is also somewhat sapply coded is completely ignored and 22:43 other than like when he's tripping balls there's no indication that Damon valued their marriage or their daughters which 22:49 is deeply [ __ ] annoying you know like even in the Next Generation Baya is engaged to Jace and yes they have spoken 22:56 to each other but these characters are super hardcore engaged and there is zero romantic attention given to them at all 23:02 it's like I know there's a war but his mother has room to kiss so why not he they made an entire house of characters 23:10 mixed race most of them are going to be characters that are not going to do anything relevant give them little to no development on top of it and they have 23:17 framed it in a way where like the targaryens and the valyrians are visually racially 23:23 distinct and in reality they wouldn't be because if you're going to say that house valaran is black 23:28 and house Taren is white and even when that combination happens you can have a blackl looking character like Baya who 23:35 according to this is like 1/4 black if we're going to use pundit Square weird race science and they still look like 23:42 that I'm just saying R could look like hi Berry if we're really going to keep it a bug 50 like there it doesn't really 23:48 make that much sense they're just kind of hoping that we don't think about it and I find that to be a little annoying 23:54 cuz I do enjoy the show but that racial Pol politics of it and and just kind of 24:00 like putting them into all these spaces while omitting actual black characters it it greates the nerves flipping onto 24:07 another genre brierton which I'm only bringing up slightly cuz I can't talk about that franchise but other than 24:13 Queen Charlotte the series has yet to have a black woman at the center of a romance and we will see what happens in 24:19 the next season CU they did do the whole um gender bent and I discussed this in a previous video but Marina that character 24:26 was plucked from an entirely different book to be a false romantic rival in the relationship between Colin and Penelope 24:32 that became very racist and very racialized coded and if they keep the same element around for the book cannon 24:39 with Eloise is going to be an issue again but I think my favorite example of this that really gets on my nerves is 24:44 the originals which is the spin-off series of The Vampire Diaries if your life would Chang to a 24:51 man you left you despite your devotion what choice would you have but 24:56 to break fre Elijah Michael has two kinds of Love interests white brunettes 25:02 and black women and three of those white brunettes are pretty much the same person okay and I could go on and on 25:08 about how that series totally played in the face of every single black character on it but I won't today but it would be 25:14 exhausting to like have time to spend with alijah having these very deep intricate relationships with these black 25:21 women in his past only for them never to matter as much as his Precious Precious Haley they will constantly have these 25:28 these men these white men having sex having these intimate relationships with all these black women even like in the 25:34 case of Elijah with one character AA who is like this really big epic relationship who does she get merked by 25:45 [Music] Haley played in our faces like the most 25:52 successful relationship between a Michaelson and a black person are it's it's oh my God it's 25:58 Freya and her and her girlfriend who's a werewolf who she tortured when they start who she tortured the whole time um 26:06 um Marcel and Rebecca who are also related cuz they're like step aunt and step nephew Julie PL is never going to 26:12 see Heaven if if I go to heaven and Julie ple is there I'm leaving expeditiously it's not just women as I 26:18 said before you have Jamie James olon from Supergirl hail from Lost Girl dolls from her Robin from Buffy Finn from 26:27 [ __ ] star Wars oh my God my 26:33 Shayla my Shayla anyway now to address the 26:40 counterargument that I can hear some people saying does this mean that every single ex-girlfriend who is Black is 26:47 this tro no no actually I think a really good example of this oddly is from the 26:54 show you well hello there he was about this stalker 27:00 serial killer named Joe who attaches to a woman in a very unhealthy way while giving some very intense voice over 27:06 every season and in season 3 The Twist starts off as that he's interested in one woman at first but then that woman 27:13 dies and eventually he ends up falling for this character named maranne who is played by iconic blazion tati Gabrielle 27:20 and she is treated with the exact same kind of attention Vigor and intensity as Joe's other love interest she's also one 27:28 of them who doesn't die okay Joe Al Al 27:34 Ally Al no no impossible and there's actually another black girl who Joe does date in season one who is somewhat Adas 27:41 to this Trope but she is a never expected to be treated like a traditional love interest like it's very clear like what she that she's being 27:48 used in that sense and B not only does she survive but she left the relationship with such dignity that it 27:54 actually makes her a more memorable character despite being only in like I think two episodes you're 28:01 dumping me I'm not dumping you you're amazing I'm amazing but you kind of what 28:07 don't want to do me anymore there's never a good time do not talk for a minute please oh she's going to slap 28:13 me my curling iron okay then that's it like the problem is not them breaking up 28:19 or the relationship not being endgame it's the framing the treating of them as a stepping stone to a better wider 28:27 relationship this this is why even though boy meet's world ended with Shawn and Angela not being a couple them being 28:32 open-ended enough was already having the possibility of them getting back together especially because this is a show with unrealistic romantic 28:39 expectations only to then jump to the spin-off and make it so that Angela was married to some random man hasn't had a 28:44 relationship with the cor cast in years and returned to give Shawn her blessing 28:49 to marry a tiny blonde white woman so that he could be Sabrina Carpenter's father-in-law and I love Sabrina 28:55 Carpenter now but that was very hard for me for some people that's one of the rare places where you saw a very white 29:01 show have a black woman Be Loved These Things Are deeply frustrating we have so 29:06 little representation and it's not that we needed to be perfect we would just want it to be done with like care and 29:12 consideration and concern from the beginning it shouldn't take you like three seasons to finally figure out how 29:19 to style Anna joke properly as Starfire you know like although it is Titans and everyone 29:25 did look busted so in that case there is a a little a little bit of Grace to be had it's deeply frustrating it's deeply 29:31 frustrating to have such a rampant whitewashing of certain characters of color and comics and moves and adaptations but in the comics they can 29:38 be turned into like whatever prompt people need them to be it is frustrating that even when they're like the kindest 29:44 most cam androll race B version of a character that they can be turned into a villain for being in the way of a 29:49 non-existent gay ship it is deeply unserious to show a character dating and having deep relationships with a black 29:56 woman all the time but then make every important screen time for a relationship with them be a white woman so we remain 30:03 connected you and I in spite of everything that you have done and then to turn off the screen and then live in 30:09 a society that doesn't want to teach or acknowledge history or social context when you in habit and existence 30:15 constantly being dictated by said 30:20 realities the Disposable black girlfriend is a frustrating Trope I think the reason why it's so difficult 30:26 is because it sits at this intersection of sexism racism and bad writing especially that last one going back to 30:33 Amber from Invincible the fact is that female love interest for superheroes often get caught in this Dynamic that if 30:39 they are not totally at the whim of the man they are villainized into someone un 30:44 trustworthy who doesn't get the life you know add Racin to it and you end up in a situation like Iris West Allen on the 30:51 flash where the audience is so antagonized about the idea of Iris being 30:57 like in important like the reaction to Iris saying We Are The Flash should be 31:03 studied how Candace pad was treated as a race band character is like literally like academic worthy I know that often 31:10 when you talk about issues of race people who are reactionary go to this idea of like oh you're teaching black women not to see themselves as lovable 31:17 by repeating this stuff and there is something to the fact that people are very quick to to weaponize statistics 31:23 about black women's relationships at the same time black women already know these things because they date 31:28 we live in the world we know how we're hypersexualized we know how we're stigmatized it isn't new and for me just 31:34 thinking back to myself explaining that it was invented purposefully to reduce you might be a new experience and that's 31:42 why it's important to talk about it because these things are not written in stone it doesn't mean it has to be this 31:47 way and for the record also before someone says it I'm also not saying that you need to date black women okay uh if 31:53 you don't want the little taste of Africa get away from me okay you don't have to date black women and that's not what anyone is saying uh but it is worth 31:59 examining why you think of black women as an inferior pick same with latino women or any kind of women it's not 32:06 about changing your preference it's about examining your racism your 32:11 internalized racism that's see how it's different you know my preference is Jin 32:17 Wu from solo leveling and toi from jiujitsu Kaizen and somehow I manag to 32:23 wake up every day and not treat other people like [ __ ] some at the middle of the night I like I think about Andromeda 32:30 in Greek mythology Andromeda is the princess of Ethiopia and because her mother talks about 32:36 aphrod first mistake she is chained to a rock to be fed to a monster like classic damsel and distress stuff Ethiopia as 32:43 far as we know in the ancient world is probably around like Sudan ancient Nubia 32:49 the word allegedly means like burnt faces and again there was no Africa or African identity at this point it was 32:55 very tribal so you have Andromeda this princess this ultimate archetype of 33:01 Damsel in Distress looking less like the classical images that we see of her in 33:06 the text is is said to be a darker skinned woman and it's Ved between like African Asian they don't really know how 33:13 geography Works back then so but we can we can say likely probably African right 33:19 there's nothing inherent about the way people have treated black women it is programming and learn behavior and it can be unlearned it just has to be named 33:26 and called out because black women CIS and trans have been taught to be strong 33:31 in the face of every disrespect but the people who started that those who perpetuate it fixing it should be their 33:39 burdens to carry we have always had this potential to be loved and we deserve to 33:44 have it be seen on TV and if you're going to put black women in your shows put some goddamn respect on our 33:52 names thank God for Castlevania doct turn season 2 33:59 actually let me go rewatch that right now thanks for watching 34:04 [Music] 34:28 n [Music] 34:59 n [Music] 35:22 [Applause] 35:28 he 35:34 [Music] 36:02 he [Music] [Applause] [Music] 36:26 [Music] 36:52 oh [Music]

Malintrashadowmoon 2025 BDay gift 04/25/2025 https://www.deviantart.com/hddeviant/art/Malintrashadowmoon-2025-BDay-gift-1187178030 IN AMENDMENT Princess Mononoke: More Relevant Than Ever froom The soak https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUoLoNFidik TRANSCRIPT 0:07 to search for evil with eyes unclouded to me this line is both the essence of 0:12 Studio jibles Princess monoke and the most profound takeaway that I had from the film I think the movie's most 0:18 obvious message is the stuff about how we treat nature and how we should better live in harmony with it but I have no 0:25 interest in talking about that not because it's not relevant or important but because I think everybody has talked 0:31 about that to death already in this video I want to talk to you about another message entirely one that I had 0:37 missed until recently the ability to see with eyes unclouded by hate or more 0:42 specifically to learn to see the goodness in others even when it seems like they're not on your side I doubt 0:48 when hay Miyazaki made princess monoke in 1997 that he could have predicted the age of social media tribalism and 0:55 political turmoil that we find ourselves in in the 2020s but the film explores all these ideas in the complex subtle 1:03 yet pointed and sometimes inscrutable way that all jibli films explore their themes watching and rewatching the film 1:10 today I was surprised by how the struggles of the protagonist Ashi taka act as an incredible parallel for the 1:15 journey we all have to navigate in the Modern Age and it gave me a lot to reflect on how we can do it to learn to 1:22 navigate a divided world with eyes unclouded now don't get me wrong this is not going to be a video essay that's 1:28 just an allegory for Centric is M or that both sides any issue are bad and that we should sit on the fence I think 1:34 to read the film that way would be wrong and we'll talk about how the real message is so much more profound and 1:40 relatable than that in fact there's lessons in here about class Warfare dehumanization and how even in a bleak 1:47 world we must find the value in life stuff that hit me so much harder than 1:52 when I watched the film when I was younger so let's take a look at Studio ji's monoke Hime a film whose English 1:59 translated title of Princess monoke is in of itself a misunderstanding of what the film is trying to say because I 2:05 think there's a lot we can learn from its characters even today about what it means to navigate a broken world at more 2:12 with itself [Music] Part One: To See With Unclouded Eyes 2:26 [Music] the context of this quote to see with eyes unclouded comes from fairly early 2:34 on in the film ashitaka who has just reluctantly killed the bore God turn demon that was threatening his village 2:40 finds himself cursed and The Village's Oracle tells him that this curse will likely kill him but there is a chance 2:47 that there could be a cure if he travels far to the west where the boore and the source of the curse came from it is 2:54 during this section that she tells him that on his journey he must search for evil with eyes unclouded 3:00 the reason I think this line is so important is that it sets up the theme for the entire rest of the film at least 3:06 in terms of what Ashi taka's approach and philosophy is throughout the movie people will constantly try to pull Ashi 3:13 taka to one side or the other and they will frequently question his Allegiance multiple times a character asks out loud 3:19 towards ashitaka whose side are you on and time and time again he defies that 3:25 categorization he helps one faction then the other and no one can quite figure him out this is why for some people I 3:31 think it's easy to read this as a metaphor for essentially a both sides approach to life both sides are bad 3:38 therefore I won't pick a side but again I think it's a lot more interesting than that it's not that ashitaka just refuses 3:45 to pick sides he refuses to see sides in the first place to me that is the 3:50 precient message of the film that is so applicable to a society that seems so divided today in the age of social media 3:57 we'll explore this idea at length later in the video rather than get too abstract too quickly 4:02 let's first talk through some key scenes in the film then I'll explain how I interpret them the first important scene 4:08 for me at least in terms of ashitaka's philosophy comes when he arrives at the Iron Works and he meets lady eboshi at 4:15 this point in the film he's just saved two residents of the Iron Works from certain death and carries them all the 4:20 way back here in a pseudo mystical Journey to the dear God's Woods I think pretty quickly on arriving at the Iron 4:26 Works ashitaka realizes that the thing he's searching for is here he's looking for the source of the iron musket pellet 4:33 that came from the body of the bore God who cursed him and he hopes that finding the source and dealing with it in some 4:39 way might lift the curse that plagues him he talks to Lady eboshi The Matriarch who runs the Ironworks and 4:46 explains why he's here she asks him if you find the source of this pellet what will you do and it is here that ashitaka 4:53 repeats that Central quote that I spoke about earlier and in doing so sets up the philosophy he will adhere to in the 5:00 entire film he tells her that I will see with eyes unclouded and decide hearing 5:06 this lady eosi laughs and guides ashitaka to her inner sanctum sharing with him what she says is her Greatest 5:12 Secret she shows him the place where she's having guns and weaponry made and here she confesses that it was she that 5:17 shot the pet that corrupted the Bor God and it is at this point that we get the first of many moral dilemmas for 5:23 ashitaka and where we can start to paint a really fascinating picture of what we can learn from the film in initially we 5:30 see that ashitaka is full of rage and he wants to condemn Lady eboshi this is such a beautiful and complex moment the 5:37 kind that appears so often in ji films because there's so many reasons and emotions at play here for our 5:42 protagonist firstly I think the very Way Lady abushi lives takes off ashitaka he 5:48 is a member of the Mishi tribe in fact not just a member but the prince the emishi live in harmony with their 5:54 environment and do their best to respect nature when the bore God Appears outside the village Ashi Taka first instinct is 6:00 to simply try and reason with it he begs the Bor God to quell its rage and calm down to leave the village in peace for 6:07 they mean him no harm but when it's clear that the God is about to attack and kill some of the girls from the 6:12 village including ashitaka's sister only then as a last resort does he strike and 6:17 take down the boar but even after this the Oracle of the village arrives and treats the boar god with respect doing a 6:24 little ritual and telling him that they will erect a monument in his honor here because they bear him no ill will and 6:29 they hope he will do the same for them so I think on a philosophical level ashitaka finds ibushi's way of life to 6:35 be abhorent not only does she confessed to killing the bore Spirit but she very casually tells the tale of how she 6:41 burned down half the forest and took over this area to mass-produce her iron with which she seeks to take over the 6:47 country this is the complete opposite of the way the emishi live but there's more than that there's also a personal 6:53 grievance here from ashitaka because it is eos's actions that directly led to him being cursed and you can see a 6:59 vindictive anger in him here where maybe he just wants revenge for giving him this curse that might well kill him and 7:06 finally of course there's the actual curse ashitaka's arm Bubbles and boils to life threatening to act on its own to 7:13 draw his blade and strike down neosi the curse itself is demanding retribution 7:19 she asks him your right hand wants to kill me and then must it kill us all to 7:24 find peace but ashitaka resists he holds down his arm because he doesn't want to be this kind of person and this is when 7:31 the idea of seeing with eyes unclouded will really manifest during this tense confrontation one of the other people in 7:37 the room speaks up because this inner sanctuary of eois is home to a few dozen outcasts who suffer from leprosy and who 7:44 are the ones who design and make ibushi's weapons one of them speaks up and he says a beautiful line young man 7:51 he says I too am cursed I understand your rage and grief the leper relates to 7:56 ashitaka and he tells him that while his anger is just ified he should not see Lady eboshi as an evil person he tells 8:03 ashitaka about how lady eboshi is the only person who ever saw the lepers as people and treated them with respect 8:10 tending to them and washing and bandaging them herself While others shunn them and then he says a line that 8:16 really hits home for me and is another theme that we will investigate in the last section of this video he says life 8:22 is suffering and pain the world and its people are cursed but still we wish to 8:28 live hearing all this both ashitaka and we the audience are reminded that people are not just one thing they are not 8:34 straightforwardly evil or straightforwardly good they are complex creatures for all her greed destruction 8:41 and lack of sanctity for the natural world lady abushi is also kind gentle and empathetic she looks after not only 8:48 the lepers but in the first scene that we meet her she's considerate towards the villagers too she knows them all by 8:55 name apologizes for the harm that comes to them and is thankful that they are okay when she sees that ashitaka has 9:00 carried them back after this scene with the lepers ashitaka walks around the rest of the settlement and he sees the 9:06 women working in the Forge even helping them with their work he talks to them and they tell him about how Lady eosi 9:13 treats them earlier when ashitaka is talking to the men in the tavern we learn that anytime lady eosi encounters 9:18 a woman who is being enslaved she frees them and gives them work in the Iron Works while a few of the men Express 9:25 that the women here are a bit spoiled ashitaka replies that a good V has happy women what he means by that I think 9:32 whether consciously or subconsciously is that a good place is one where even the most marginalized and endangered people 9:38 are happy and protected and so to confirm this for himself Ashi taka later 9:43 asked the ladies of the forge is life hard here and they tell them that it is but it's far better than life anywhere 9:50 else they do have to work long days but they're well-looked after and the men here behave themselves it is through 9:56 these encounters that ashitaka learned something really important something that is Central to the idea of seeing 10:01 with eyes unclouded he learns that even a place that can produce evil in the form of weapons and destruction can also 10:07 be a place that produces so much goodness the Iron Works are both a weapons Factory that desecrates its 10:13 environment but also egalitarian Utopia where everyone is able to live with happiness and respect no matter their 10:19 background gender or disability if Ashi taka was more straightforward if this was a different film with a different 10:25 message he might just have come in killed lady eosi and acted the Vengeance that his curse demands an eye for an eye 10:33 but seeing with eyes unclouded means recognizing both the good and the evil in something without preconceived bias 10:40 even if he doesn't agree with how eboshi lives her life and runs the Iron Works he can't deny that she's made something 10:45 valuable and worth protecting as I mentioned in the intro I think this is the most profound message of the film 10:52 there is always more to a situation that meets the eye and we can only see that when we put aside our hate I think we 10:58 can confirm this by looking at another quote that actually comes directly from the film's maker hay Miyazaki who is 11:05 quoted as saying the following you must see with eyes unclouded by hate see the 11:10 good in that which is evil and the evil in that which is good pledge yourself to neither side but vow instead to preserve 11:17 the balance that exists between the two now problematically I was not able to find the direct source of this quote 11:24 lots of websites attribute this as a quote from Miyazaki but don't site where he actually said it but if we trust that 11:30 this is a real quote I think it does resonate a lot with ashitaka's approach in the film this philosophy of seeing 11:36 good and evil and evil in that which is good I think speaks to a cultural difference too it is very much in line 11:42 with Shintoism and Buddhist beliefs which I think can feel a bit foreign or Mystic to many in the west where 11:47 individual action and oppositional factions are a lot more common as I've spoken about in previous videos but 11:54 regardless I think it's an idea that is equally relevant today in a world that seems so thoroughly divided on so many 12:00 fronts being able to see the value in things that on the surface don't seem to be on your side is something so vital 12:06 and important for us to do but I also think both we and the film can go much deeper because I don't think any of this 12:13 means that we should arbitrarily stay in the middle of any dispute or that there isn't a right or a wrong that we should 12:18 adhere to it's actually about making sure we find the right by looking for it with unbiased or unclouded eyes and the 12:26 real profound Insight that I felt from watching the film and thinking a lot about it is that actually there are no 12:32 sides both in the movie and in our lives and even when there are sides it's people being pushed to fight each other 12:38 for misguided reasons it's parties who actually have a shared goal and are not realizing it I think ashitaka is the 12:45 only person in the film who realizes this at least until the end and to illustrate what I mean and elaborate on 12:51 that further let's pick up where we left off in the film because not long after the conversations ashitaka has with 12:56 eboshi the Iron Works is under attack by none other than son the mon noime of 13:02 the title son breaks into the Iron Works makes her way to where eboshi is and risks her life to try and kill her eosi 13:09 in turn tries to shoot down son with guns and it culminates in the two having a sort of intense Street KN fight once 13:16 again what's fascinating is that both sides of this confrontation are justified in their beliefs and abushi 13:22 even acknowledges it when son is stood on the roof eosi calls out to her and says you seek Vengeance for your tribe 13:29 well there are some here who seek Vengeance for their husbands killed by your wolves this sets up another theme 13:34 in the film The idea of a cycle of hatred it's a vicious cycle where one grievance justifies another and then 13:40 another in return till no one can remember where it started but both sides feel grieved and justified in their 13:47 pursuit of Vengeance son and her wolves killed the loved ones of the people in the iron works but those people burned 13:52 the forest and killed other spirit gods but those gods were stopping the villagers from getting natural resources 13:58 they needed and so on and so forth the buck can always be passed one further step back but the end result is a 14:05 destruction of both sides and we can see that literally as s and neosi fight to 14:10 the death both ready to die in the pursuit of destroying the other ashitaka 14:15 however is the only one capable of seeing that this cycle of hatred will never end like this he yells at s first 14:22 and then eosi and her people to stop the fighting but when it's clear that no one will listen he is forced to physically 14:28 step this is where you can see the curse flare up and manifest because the curse 14:34 is born from Rage and hatred and it's fueled by the resentment and Malice that all the people present are holding for 14:40 one another ashitaka physically walks in between eboshi and Son telling them there is a demon inside you and her then 14:47 he turns to everyone else and tells them to look at the bitterness and hatred that curses him what he's trying to 14:53 explain to everyone is that this demon is there within all of us whether literally as in his case or 14:59 metaphorically as in the case of son and neosi the demon is the hatred and resentment it is the anger and the 15:06 malice that we all hold and he desperately implores everyone that they shouldn't give into it what he wants is 15:12 for people to strive to see things with unclouded eyes to see that nature and humans can live in harmony but 15:18 unfortunately for ashitaka and for everyone in the film The Message falls on deaf ears eosi and Son don't listen 15:25 and ashitaka is forced to physically subdue them as he tries to carry son out one of the ladies of the Iron Works 15:30 draws her weapon on him she threatens to shoot ashitaka and her justification is so interesting because she simply says 15:37 you hurt lady eosi and in return comes this look oh This brilliant look I feel 15:43 like I've never seen disappointment better shown on screen without a word being said than this ashitaka simply 15:49 looks back at this woman with eyes that just kind of speak for him as if to say you still don't get it despite 15:55 everything I'm telling you and showing you you're still going to say that because saying you hurt lady abosi so 16:00 thoroughly misses the point of what ashitaka was trying to illustrate yes he hurt lady abushi but that is the point 16:07 that there's always a step back he could turn and say well I only hurt lady eboshi because she was going to hurt son 16:13 and then eosi would say well I was only going to hurt son because she was going to hurt me and so on and so forth the 16:19 cycle of hatred it can never be broken by more hatred more anger more Vengeance 16:25 cannot stop the destruction only a genuine attempt to look Beyond it to forgive where possible and make amends 16:31 where it's not that is the only way anyone here can move past it but this lady refuses to see it and while she 16:38 doesn't try to shoot ashitaka her gun accidentally goes off and hits him directly in the back this of course will 16:44 kick off a different section of the film where Ashi taka will now spend his time in the forest with son but before we 16:50 talk about her I want to reiterate something that I spoke about earlier I don't think the message of the film is that ashitaka is not picking aside 16:57 that's certainly not the message of what I'm saying what I think is profound about what ashitaka does is that he's the only one 17:02 who sees that there are no sides because as everyone realizes at the end of the film the humans in the forest can live 17:08 in harmony ashitaka's emishi tribe is proof of this these sides can work 17:14 together they're just so blinded by their rage that they can't see that the dear God who is Central to the film is 17:20 the perfect representation of this idea that there can be a balance and Harmony between seemingly oppositional forces 17:26 because he is both life and death and yet so many characters don't see that the bores for example are angry at 17:33 the dear God because they think the dear God is only supposed to protect the forest when son brings the injured 17:39 ashitaka to him the dear God heals him but didn't heal Nago the boore that eventually became the cursed demon which 17:46 upsets the boore tribe to them the dear God should be picking sides he's supposed to be about life and protection 17:52 for the forest so why did he not help one of them and then goes and helps a human meanwhile the humans only see the 17:59 dear God as the source of death and danger in fact I think one of the most profound illustrations of this comes 18:05 right at the end of the film from a very small easily missed line after a dramatic climax where their dear God is 18:11 shot and killed by aosi he then transforms into a vengeful version of the night walker and nearly destroys the 18:16 entire forest in pursuit of his head finally when his head is given back by ashitaka andan he collapses into the 18:23 water bringing with him a wave of healing and regrowth before seemingly dying it is that this point that koroku 18:30 one of the villagers says aloud I didn't know the dear God makes the flowers bloom to me this represents the 18:36 fundamental misunderstanding of the humans in the Ironworks you can see it as misinformation you can see it as 18:42 propaganda or you can see it as simple ignorance but they don't actually understand what the dear God or the 18:48 forest does we'll talk about specifically eboshi later but as a whole the people at the ironwork seem to have 18:54 this mistaken belief the forest is only a place of danger to them what they don't realize is that the dear God is 19:00 life as much as it is death it is not one side it is not either or it is both 19:07 this is what ashitaka sees and understands throughout the film and what we can all learn from on the flip side s 19:14 doesn't understand this either because she says that even restored these are not the dear God's Woods their dear God 19:20 is dead once again it is ashitaka who is the only one able to see the truth and he says that the dear God cannot ever 19:27 die because he is both life and death and that in this act of regrowth he's 19:32 telling us all to live this is another theme we will explore in the final section of this video about the value of 19:37 life itself but before we talk about that let's elaborate more about s's behavior and attitude because like 19:44 almost every other human in the film she too is unable to let go of her hatred in order to see the truth in front of 19:53 her one of the central questions about son in the film is who and what is she Part Two: Who Is Mononoke-Hime 19:59 there's ambiguity about her identity itself but also is she human wolf or 20:05 something else entirely again she views herself as part of a binary a wolf 20:10 fighting against humans but others also view her binarily when lady eosi first 20:15 describes son she says that she is a girl whose Soul the Wolves stole and she thinks that if she destroys the forest 20:22 it will break their hold on son and she'll go back to being a normal human this is probably a good point to talk 20:28 about the of the film that I promised I'd explain because the original title of the film in Japanese is monoke Hime 20:35 which actually translates to monster princess this is actually the title that the residents of the Iron Works give her 20:41 so what it speaks to is how they view both her and the spirits monsters now 20:47 whether she is the princess of the monsters a monstrosity of a princess or a princess belonging to the monsters it 20:53 is a pejorative term they attach to her the English translated title of princess monoke Ashley misses a subtle but 21:00 important part of this description because princess monoke just sounds like a name like that's what this character 21:05 is called but she is son she has a name it's just that the people of the Ironworks either never got a chance to 21:12 learn it or never bothered to and their referral to her and the spirits as monsters says more about their approach 21:19 than her reality in fact it's interesting that when they first encounter ashitaka they fear he might be 21:25 a monster too in this scene as ashitaka is carrying Koro Who and the other villager he's rescued back to the Iron 21:31 Works these guys sitting by the river see them approaching and one of them says the phrase Mona now monoke means 21:38 monster as we've discussed and the C indicates a question so he could be asking if it's a monster in general 21:45 that's approaching or you could be worried that monoke hee is approaching either way it represents his paranoia 21:52 anything coming from the woods is a monster to him even though it's three people two of whom are his own friends 21:58 all of this is to say that the villagers have a one-dimensional view of son and she has a one-dimensional view of 22:04 herself son refuses to accept herself as a human and in fact her stance at the end of the film is telling and how she 22:11 refuses to grow as a character over the course of the film one of jbl's rare prominent female characters to do so 22:17 after the dear God's head has been returned and order is somewhat restored son turns to Ashi taka and says I love 22:23 you ashitaka but I cannot forgive the human race and so the two come to an agreement that ashitaka will help the 22:29 people of the Iron Works rebuild a better home something we'll talk about soon while son will remain in the forest 22:34 with the Wolves and the two can meet whenever they want now of course what son is saying is equal parts 22:40 understandable but equal parts ridiculous it is understandable that she's unhappy with what the people of the Iron Works particularly lady eboshi 22:47 did in terms of killing the deer God or at least his corporeal body but son is 22:53 also being a massive hypocrite firstly she says she cannot forgive the human race but of course she doesn't include 22:59 ashitaka in that she loves him and she's able to separate him from the idea of humanity but even more hypocritically 23:06 she's excluding herself from this distinction too she's giving herself a benefit of the doubt that she refuses to 23:12 extend to any of the iron work's residents she recognizes that she and ashitaka might be human beings that are 23:18 able to live respectfully and harmoniously with the forest but she Paints the rest of the entire human race with one brush condemning them as 23:25 essentially evil and incapable of Behaving well this again really spoke to me as a line of thinking that so many 23:31 people still use today to tarnish entire groups of people as dangerous and irredeemable whether that's immigrants 23:37 or trans people or whoever is so fundamentally wrong especially when that characteristic is innate not based on 23:43 the evidence of their behavior like being human for example the vast majority of the people of the Ironworks 23:49 are just trying to live their lives and doing what they're told you can argue that eosi is the villain that s views 23:55 all of humanity to be and we'll talk about her soon I promise but you can't say the same for the rest of everyone 24:00 else they're no more at fault for what happened than a random boar from the forest is and yet in her stubbornness 24:06 and petulance son refuses to see that Nuance now you might argue that she doesn't view herself as human but I 24:13 think clearly on some level she knows she is if she didn't she wouldn't be in love with ashitaka she wouldn't react 24:19 the way she does when he calls her beautiful everyone even the forest Spirits know that she is human they just 24:26 accept her regardless right after the scene where ashitaka carries her out of the Iron Works one of the monkey Spirits 24:31 says wolf girl not care wolf girl human when talking to S which anger one of her 24:37 Wolf brothers and he threatens to bite the monkey's head off this shows us that everyone here is aware of the reality of 24:43 what son is her brothers are sensitive because they don't want her to feel different to them but she is Morrow 24:50 acknowledges this too when she's talking about son with ashitaka ashitaka demands that son be freed because she is human 24:57 to which Morrow barks fact that she is neither human nor wolf and calls her my 25:02 poor ugly lovely daughter Maro in fact holds a similar style of thinking to s 25:07 in that she too sees things as oppositional Maro dismissively asks will you join s and fight the humans Nashi 25:15 taka replies that no that will only breed more hatred which goes back to this idea of the cycle of hatred that we 25:21 spoke about earlier which ashitaka is right in asserting cannot be broken with more hatred then when ashitaka asks her 25:28 can't the humans in the forest live in peace Mora replies that nowhere is safe as long as humans are around again she 25:35 doesn't believe this about son or even ashitaka but spous it as fact regardless 25:40 showing how she like son refuses to accept complexity rather than binaries 25:46 and here there's also a fascinating parallel with what she says about son's relationship with the forest with what 25:51 eosi said Morrow says that s is now tied to the forest and that if the forest 25:56 dies s will die too this is the actual opposite of what eashi says if you remember who claims 26:03 that destroying the forest will actually liberate son ultimately maybe they are both right and wrong because if the 26:09 forest dies maybe monoke Heime the child of the Wolves will die but perhaps s the 26:15 human will be freed either way the fact that they both make this claim confidently shows how they are not 26:21 viewing things with unclouded eyes but rather through their biased lenses as it happens the forest isn't destroyed it's 26:28 saved andan chooses to forsake Humanity displaying an inability to view the world with the nuance and unclouded eyes 26:35 that ashitaka has been doing and asking for others to do too funnily enough there is one woman who he does get 26:41 through to by the end of the film lady eosi after son's declaration that she cannot forgive humans we then shortly 26:48 cut to lady eosi talking to her people she remarks that she can't believe she was carried to safety by a wolf of all 26:55 things then she says that the people of the Iron Works will start over but that we will build a good Village here 27:02 suggesting that she wants to build a better home this time to me I think that's a pretty clear indicator from her 27:08 especially in light of those two lines coming back to back that eboshi has seen that she can in fact live in harmony 27:14 with the forest that the wolves are not an evil force they're just living creatures trying to protect what they 27:19 hold precious and that she can build a version of the Iron Works that doesn't desecrate or seek to destroy the forest 27:26 this is also why I think ashitaka chooses to stay because he also believes that it can be done that the humans can 27:32 rebuild in a way that resembles how his Mishi Clan live in harmony with the world around them now as for eosi there 27:39 is another theme I want to talk about one that is definitely not explicit in the film but stood out to me as a great 27:45 metaphor for how the world works today and that is the lies of the 1% screwing 27:50 over the rest of the Part Three: The Lies of the 1 27:55 99 as I've mentioned earlier in the video ashitaka is Keen to emphasize that there are no sides to this situation and 28:02 everyone can live harmoniously but on the occasions that there are sides it's 28:07 the wrong people being pit against each other and perhaps the biggest example of this is lady eboshi now don't get me 28:14 wrong ibushi is not a victim or some innocent Damsel in Distress quite the opposite she's shown to be ruthless cold 28:21 when needed and deeply ambitious she half jokingly half seriously declares her desire to rule the entire our 28:28 country but as we've discussed she's a nuanced character who is kind gentle and 28:33 Noble at times as well her beef with the forest Spirits though is largely based on misinformation and ignorance like I 28:40 mentioned earlier where she seems to believe that not only is the dear God a threat and a source of death but also 28:45 that killing the forest will restore son back to her human self at one point she even posits that the blood of the dear 28:52 God is set to cure any illness and she could use it to cure the lepers that she houses of their condition 28:58 the people of the Iron Works don't realize that the dear God also brings life and provides the resources that 29:04 they're using and the person seeking to exploit this ignorance is the character of Goo the reason I want to talk about 29:10 the 1% and the 99% in this section is because goo is very directly the voice 29:16 and the will of the emperor in princess monoke in this scene he comes to eboshi 29:21 and shows her a letter from the emperor that demands that she kill the dear God and bring his head to him eboshi is 29:28 initially reluctant and feels like the iron production is going well enough but Joo softly threatens her that all the 29:34 men they've supplied her with weren't just sent to get iron and you can see his expression change from serious to 29:40 the fake innocent that he pretends to be as he adds or at least that's what his majesty would say all of this is a 29:47 reminder that not only can he take ibushi's resources away but he can use those very men against her but funnily 29:54 enough one sentence later when eboshi questions of the emperor believes that the deer God's head will give him 29:59 immortality jico claims oh I don't know what the emperor thinks this is of course a direct contradiction to what he 30:06 just said and it reveals J's true nature and purpose he's here to get what he wants one way or the other it's clear 30:13 that jico is a substitute for the emperor acting as a force of coercion that makes the central conflict arise in 30:19 the film and we can see that coercion not just from the verbal and financial threats but also before this scene J has 30:26 a horde of goons that he brings with him he tells them to hide and wait for him which is to imply that if eboshi didn't 30:33 willingly agree to kill the dear God he'd make her do it by force and eboshi 30:38 understands this because right after agreeing to kill the dear God she tells jico that he can summon that shady Bunch 30:44 hidden under the cliff and joico simply laughs with this fake innocent expression again and says oh you saw 30:50 them did you what all of this shows us is that eosi is aware of the threat that jico brings with him for her own part 30:57 she's ly fighting a war with a human the nobleman Lord asano who's trying to steal the Iron Works from her not only 31:04 is this guy a wealthy powerful Samurai but he's also a bit of a scumbag because we learned through dialogue that he 31:10 tried to conquer this area himself and was driven back by the Boors but now that eboshi has managed to conquer it 31:16 he's demanding that she give him half again under the threat of violence so if 31:21 taking the wealth from someone else's labor without doing anything of your own isn't a Marxist allegory I don't know 31:27 what is it's all subplot so none of the following is discussed explicitly but it feels pretty clear to me that eboshi is 31:33 essentially caught in a tough political sandwich on the one hand she has a wealthy established Noble trying to 31:39 forcibly take her business and it's not a stretch to say that this guy likely has the emperor's favor whereas the 31:45 upstart woman in neosi probably doesn't on the other side she has J requesting 31:50 but really demanding as we've seen that she go to kill the dear God in the emperor's name and of course the minute 31:57 she goes off to to do so and leaves the Iron Works relatively unguarded Lord oano attacks with his army you have to 32:03 wonder where would he have gotten this information from that the Iron Works are currently unguarded I think it's almost 32:09 certain that jico is pulling the strings on this getting everything he and by extension the emperor wants which is the 32:15 dear God's death the appeasement of one of his Nobles and the removal of an ambitious Rogue element in abosi J in 32:23 fact actually directly tells eboshi there is no time to fight men just give a all the Iron Works fulfill your 32:30 promise to the emperor so it's pretty clear that he doesn't care what happens to her and later when they're in the 32:35 forest one of his Scouts asks if they really even need eosi and J declares quietly that when it comes to hunting a 32:42 god they should let her do the dirty work so all of this is to say that while eosi is herself ambitious and dangerous 32:49 it's clear that she's being manipulated and coerced by a higher authority who arbitrarily creates the conflict between 32:55 the Iron Works and the dear God for his own ends in fact everything in the film is basically a consequence of J's 33:01 actions first in the town when he first meets Ashi taka he is the one who convinces everyone that the little gold 33:07 pellet that ashitaka gives the woman in exchange for rice is super valuable but 33:12 he does so in such a loud and obvious way that it inevitably draws the attention of everyone around including 33:18 these people who want to Rob ashitaka and then conveniently jico is there again to war Nashi taka and run away 33:25 with him was this all part of his plan possibly he then tells ashitaka to go to 33:30 the Iron Works and the dear God's Forest to find the answers he's looking for again to me at least the class parallel 33:36 is pretty clear despite him being an Envoy of the emperor J manages to convince everyone in this little village 33:42 that this humble traveler from a remote tribe is somehow super wealthy and turns them against him while hiding his own 33:49 power and Status constantly both here and later he's peing people against each other to mask his own ends and if we 33:55 continue down the idea that he's essentially a substitute for the Emperor then this is a pretty clear and I'd argue astute metaphor for a class 34:02 struggle and the way in which the truly wealthy and Powerful manipulate others into fighting for relative scraps while 34:07 they get what they want once Chico reaches the Iron Works himself he specifically asks about ashitaka and if 34:14 abosi has seen him presumably because he wants to use Ashi taka again to which aboshi replies that he came and went 34:20 already and I'm finally and perhaps most tellingly there's this line he says when the hunt for the dear God is taking 34:26 place ashitaka having seen the Iron Works is already under attack goes to find ioshi he finds the men from the 34:32 Iron Works who describe the horrors of what's just happened including how they were used as human Shields Joo and his 34:39 crew had planted bombs and grenades underneath where the men of the Iron Works were told to hold the line and 34:44 when the bores approached the bombs were set off and all lives were lost human 34:50 and animal J's plan clearly did not care about collateral damage but ashitaka 34:55 again refusing to see sides rescues one of son's Wolf brothers from underneath the pile of bore corpses and even 35:02 convinces the men of the Iron Works to help him do so I think it's really telling that when we see this first 35:07 instance of the animals and the people of the Iron Works working together it's J's guards who try to stop them again 35:14 trying to keep the two sides divided but when they attack ashitaka it's the men of the Iron Works who revolt and fight 35:21 back as they realize that the wolves are not their enemies rise up against your greedy overlords comrades the men then 35:27 work together to free the wolf and the Wolf in turn also doesn't show any hostility towards the workers once it's 35:33 freed and instead proceeds to guide ashitaka to where son is on the way ashitaka stops in front of eboshi and 35:40 tells her what's happening that the Iron Works under attack and that she should abandon her hunt for the dear God you 35:45 can see J's nervous expression here as if he's worried that he'll actually convince eboshi to stop doing his dirty 35:51 work for him she replies you want me to kill Samurai instead of the dear God to which ashitaka says no can't the forest 35:58 and the Iron Works live in peace and it's at this point that jico says a really telling line he says whose side 36:05 is he on this is a pretty clear distillation of the point I've been building to here is ashitaka saying that 36:10 the forest and the people can live in harmony once again it's not that he's not picking sides he refuses to see 36:17 sides and here is goo in return telling him hey whose side are you want trying 36:22 to insist that there are in fact two binary factions that must try and destroy each other 36:28 but we know he's wrong we've just seen ashitaka unite the two sides in a unified goal without hostility or 36:35 conflict but no matter what he claims J doesn't care about what happens to the people of the Ironworks and even the men 36:41 realize that when ashitaka comes to find them and they say they're willing to sacrifice us all they're using lady 36:47 eboshi now thankfully eosi has an inherit distrust of men which she explicitly States the ladies of the Iron 36:53 Works she says she's more afraid of men than monsters and tells them to be on their guard while she's away and so Toki 37:00 and the others are able to fend off the attack on the Iron Works of course her and other lady's distrust of men is 37:06 valid in the context of what they've been through but I also think it doubles as a mistrust of hierarchy because eashi 37:12 doesn't distrust ashitaka who she very quickly asked to join her cause after first meeting him nor does she distrust 37:18 her right-hand man but she does distrust Lord asano and jico men with power and authority the 1% who are recklessly 37:26 willing to sacrifice lives to get whatever they want this is Illustrated in another really poignant line that 37:31 jico says right to the end of the film here he's fleeing with the dear God's head even while watching the entire 37:37 forest and Iron Works be destroyed by the way which really clear metaphor here guys San and ashitaka stop him and tell 37:43 him to give the head back to which he says something that completely illustrates his world view he says The 37:49 Thirst to possess Heaven and Earth is what makes us human this is so interesting because it's demonstrably 37:55 untrue here is goo standing in in front of two humans who clearly do not share this Instinct of his and yet he declares 38:01 so confidently that what he was doing was in fact human nature again to me 38:06 this just speaks to joo's inherently manipulative nature where he's trying to convince everyone that they should all behave like him but Ashi taka and son 38:13 refus and they begrudgingly do get through the chico getting him to give up the head which they then take and return 38:19 to the dear God all of this is to say that this is just another part of princess monoke that struck me as so 38:25 relevant when watching it now in a time where the wealth divide between the richest and the poorest in society has 38:30 only grown in most of the western world for the last 50 plus years the theme of the powerful minority manipulating the 38:35 majority could not be more profound the tactics of misinformation misdirection and coercion blaming a vulnerable group 38:43 for problems they didn't cause these are all things that are probably even more true now than they were when the film 38:48 released in 1997 but while this is a rather Bleak worldview and indeed it's a pretty 38:53 brutal life depicted in Princess monoke there's also subtle optimism that permeates the film and that's the last 38:59 thing I want to talk to you about because I think it's another thing we could really do with hearing in the modern day that life may be hard but 39:05 it's worth [Music] living I've already spoken so far about Part Four: Life Is For Living 39:11 the idea of seeing with eyes unclouded about not seeing ourselves or others as one-dimensional or as binary opposites 39:18 and of resisting the manipulations of the elite and Powerful but there is one other recurring message that appears 39:24 throughout princess monoke and that is the idea that the world world is a cold bitter place but the value of life is 39:30 still sacran and as long as we're alive we can make the world a better place 39:36 there is lots of ambient misery depicted throughout princess monoke the emishi tribe are dying out and now forced to 39:42 give up their prince Samurai and natural disasters are destroying Villages the forest gods are dying out and getting 39:48 weaker and even the people of the Iron Works live difficult lives all of this while an outof of touch Emperor focuses 39:55 on trying to find immortality but there there are also times when The Bleak state of the world is made verbally 40:00 explicit it first comes from jico when he's sitting down to talk with ashitaka for the first time remarking on the men 40:06 who were potentially looking to Rob ashitaka he says that it wasn't always like this but that Hearts have grown 40:11 cold throughout the land he says that the area around here was a fine Village once but whether it was a flood or a 40:17 landslide it was destroyed and now the land presumbly referring to the country as a whole teams with bitter ghosts dead 40:24 from war sick or starved and Fallen where they stood a curse you say the 40:30 world is a curse if you remember from earlier in the video this actually Echoes what the leper will say later in 40:35 the Iron Works that life is suffering in pain the world and its people are cursed but we still wish to live but notice 40:42 that what the leper says and what Chico says as well end with slight optimism the world may be a curse but we still 40:49 want to live as human beings and Cho has a similar philosophy when he tells ashitaka that everyone dies some now 40:55 some later but the trick is to avoid the jaws of death or so his master used to say at this point ashitaka L man said I 41:03 shouldn't have gotten into that fight I killed two men referring to the fact that as he was riding here he 41:08 encountered a samurai raid on a village and when they attacked him he was forced to defend himself and kill the two men 41:14 in the process ashitaka feels guilt for this act but jico tells him hey you may have killed those guys but you helped me 41:21 and others escape this is a reminder of course of the pragmatic worldview that the film espouses that life and death 41:28 are very closely related and indeed in this instance ashitaka's actions bring both death and life simultaneously much 41:36 like what the dear God does this little optimistic spin on things does seem to get through to ashitaka and what we see 41:42 for most of the rest of the film is that he spreads a rather hopeful message to everyone else that he meets and that's 41:47 simply to live live just for the act of living and the value all life has but 41:53 also because through living you can make the world a better place and also express your gratitude to those who have 41:59 sacrificed to get you here ashitaka does this both through his actions and his words in his actions he's basically as 42:06 much of a pacifist as you could realistically be in the film at every occasion before he enters a physical 42:11 conflict he beseeches the life in front of him to stop to not fight first he does it with the curse for Nago 42:18 imploring him to quell his rage multiple times before he's finally forced to strike when the demon is about to attack 42:23 other people with the aformentioned samurai who were attacking G and the others ashitaka again yells at them to 42:30 let him pass it's only when they refuse and attack him does he fight back the same again happens twice more at the 42:36 climax of the film first he's riding towards the Iron Works when Lord aso's invading Samurai spot him he again 42:43 implores them to let him pass but they start firing on him regardless then a short while later they send Riders to 42:49 chase after him and again ashitaka implores them to put down their arms when it's clear that they won't he 42:55 shoots down one of the men but still lets the other one Escape so time and time again ashitaka avoids taking life 43:02 or even attempting to do so unless he absolutely has to and in the verbal message he gives to others he implores 43:09 them to live when he carries son out of the Iron Works after her fight with eosi she questions why he helped her he says 43:16 I didn't want you to die to which son replies I'm not afraid to die if it will drive away the humans this is another 43:23 area where the two of them are philosophically Polar Opposites and Son shows an image maturity of attitude that 43:28 speaks to someone who hasn't really gotten the chance to mature and develop as a person repeatedly son seems happy 43:34 to throw her life away for seemingly nothing she does this later as well when she charges in with a boes of the climax 43:40 of the film to attack Chico in eos's encampment even though she admits it will be certain death but Ashi taka is 43:46 always trying to get her to stop thinking like this even as son draws his blade against him and threatens to kill 43:51 ashitaka he simply replies live before Rising her up by telling her that she's 43:56 beautiful which completely throws her off guard partly because I think it reminds her of her Humanity I'll have to remember this 44:03 tactic if an attractive woman ever points a sword at my throat at the end of the film when the dear God has seemingly died s says that all is lost 44:11 because the dear God is dead to which ashitaka replies that the dear God cannot die for he is both life and death 44:16 and that through this Final Act he is telling us to live again this is a really optimistic message in a world 44:23 that's so full of pain and misery as we've discussed live because you're Alive live because you can do something 44:29 with that life because giving up is not just illogical but flies in the face of all of those who are dead who no doubt 44:35 would have loved a chance to live longer themselves and that's what ashitaka's plan is at the end of the film s just 44:40 Retreats back into the woods which is a great metaphor for how she hasn't grown at all throughout the film she just goes 44:46 back to being the exact same person in the same location as before Ashi taka by comparison decides to live in the Iron 44:52 Works to help them make a more ethical Society he could just as easily go back to the Mishi tribe now that his curse is 44:59 lifted and return to the life he lived before but that goes against his message live because you can still make this 45:05 cruel world a better place and that's what he plans to do in this new location indeed I think the wisest characters in 45:11 the film shared this message again towards the end of the film koroku The Iron Works villager who ashitaka saved 45:18 watches the fire envelop the Iron Works and he says once the four stars to burn it's all over to which his wife Toki 45:25 replies no it isn't we're still alive again like son koroku is too concerned 45:30 with the temporary and the physical if we lose this material thing we lose it all what is the point of life without it 45:37 but Toki and ashitaka are there to act as reminders to them and us the audience that hey you're still alive aren't you 45:44 so nothing is lost because within you there's an infinite potential to make and create more things worth living for 45:51 and that's the note I'd like to end this video on because I do believe that it's a really valuable lesson for us to carry 45:56 on into our lives amongst the many relevant contemporary messages that I felt the film brings even today the 46:02 world is a bleak place in our real lives too sometimes we're living through an era where it feels like social progress 46:08 is going backwards more and more people are being made to suffer through exploitation and more than anything 46:14 people's empathy just seems to be fading the passive cruelty and vindictiveness of so many has been so starkly on 46:20 display but even when it seems like all is lost it isn't because we are alive 46:26 and with that life life we owe it to those who've lost Theirs to keep going and with this life comes endless 46:32 possibilities of things we can do to change the darkness around us to keep striving to make the world a better 46:37 place for all of us to live in and I hope by making this video and reaching out to you I've helped do so in some 46:44 small tiny way if you've made it all the way to the end of this video then please listen to 46:50 just one more thing easily the hardest part of making video essays like this one is the copyright is issues I won't 46:57 go into too many details so as to not bore you but media analysis like this is covered by a law called fair use which 47:04 allows the use of copyrighted content for the purpose of transformative analysis however big media companies 47:11 love to abuse the power they have and make false copyright claims on videos like mine because well they can and 47:18 there's no punishment for them what this means is that my videos are always at the risk of being flagged temporarily 47:23 taken down or the copyright holder can take all the revenue from the video for themselves all of this is to say that I 47:29 would really really appreciate it if you would consider becoming my Patron and supporting this content directly the 47:35 soak is now my full-time job and it's very stressful to rely primarily on YouTube Revenue as I currently do 47:41 because that's always liable to be cut from or taken away entirely copyright strikes can hit at any time literally 47:48 years later and three strikes result in the termination of a YouTube channel if I don't contest the strike and win which 47:54 thankfully I've managed every time so far but my latest video for example had to go down for 2 weeks while I fought a 48:00 copyright battle with studio jibli and all that time it was taken down for mened got killed in the algorithm as you 48:06 can see here not only does patreon help me feel more comfortable making video essays but I'm also able to provide my 48:12 patrons with access to the videos even if and when they do get taken down and also give Early Access before the rest 48:18 of the public if youve made it all the way here I'm going to go out in the limb and say you at least somewhat enjoy this video so I hope I might have earned some 48:25 of your support and if you'd prefer to use a onetime donation and the link to my PayPal is in the video description as 48:30 well anyways that's it for the financial plug I want to thank you so much for watching the video all the way through 48:36 and I hope you enjoyed it thank you to all my current patrons and do let me know in the comments what you'd like to see me cover next and I hope I'll see 48:42 you very soon for another video have a great day

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