Interesting Debate On The Origins Of Hiphop

[Pioneer1]

 

 

 

Interesting debate I came across between Tariq Nasheed and a Puerto Rican urban historian on the origins of Hiphop.

 

Perhaps @Troy  and/or  @Delano being from The Bronx may find this interesting given his presence there during the birth of Hiphop.

 

 

 

[ProfD]

I'll defer to Troy and Delano to give their NY perspective. 

 

However, from a bottom up perspective, through Jazz, Rhythm & Blues, Rock & Roll,  Soul, Funk etc., AfroAmericans either created or heavily influenced all music produced in the 20th century to present.

 

Reggae and Afrobeats were was inspired by AfroAmerican music. Bob Marley was heavily influenced by Motown,Doo Wop & R&B groups of the 1960s.

 

Hip-Hop music was built on breakbeats from Funk and Soul records. Of couse, music producers went on to sample everything else musically.

 

Hip-Hop rapping started with AfroAmericans like Gil Scott-Heron and Oscar Brown Jr. well before the Last Poets and  Hip-Hop MCs co-opted it.

 

As an aside, it's a known fact that white folks stole the Blues from AfroAmericans to create Rock music.

 

The dominant society will always do whatever they can to strip AfroAmericans of their inventions and contributions or give credit to someone else.

 

That's why it's important for AfroAmericans to codify and control their own sh8t especially when it comes to wealth-building intellectual property...inheritance.

[Troy]

Yes, thank you for deferring to someone you actually lived through the emergence and rise of hip-hop.

 

Tariq can only relate what he has read or learned from others, as he was not there and is too young to really know what was going on even if he was. 

 

I don't know who Dr Colon, but be appears to be older and says he is from the Bronx, so I'm sure he knows a lot more Tariq and I would probably defer to him.

 

I did not listen to the whole review because Tariq kept saying no one knows these dudes and calling Dr. Colon a liar.

 

Know there is A LOT I don't know or remember from back in the day.  I have not studied the history of hip-hop, so Tariq will know more about what has been published or what the hip artists he has spoken to. 

 

But I know things they don't know because I have witnessed things neither have. 

 

I also do not like the way Tariq talks about Puerto Ricans in the context of hip=hop.  Anyone was actually there I would not question Puerto Ricans contributions to hip-hop.

[Delano]

Yeah I stoped listening after 10 minutes. There were Puerto Ricans I. Early hip-hop. The Cold Crush brothers had two DJs Charlie Chase and Tony Tone they were both Puerto Rican. There's an interview on drink champs with Crazy Legs who I believe is either Puerto Rican or Dominican.

 

Plus I am pretty sure there were Puerto Rican Graffiti artist. There was also a white guy called White Flash but I never heard him.

 

I Lived in the Northeast Bronx in the 70's. However the South Bronx had Puerto Ricans. There's a bunch of Puerto Rican in the Rock Steady Crew.

Tareeq is to young to have been there. So he is going on what he has been told. Dr Colon would have seen some of it even if he wasn't involved. In the same way my parents heard rap from what I was playing.

[Pioneer1]

Well.........

I found it rather disappointing that you both ( @Troy & @Delano ) got so easily offended the friction between them that yall decided not to finish listening to the exchange.
Quite a few names and groups that I certainly hadn't even heard of were dropped during the dialog.


What you two and Colon were saying about Puerto Ricans being major contributors to the early rise of Hiphop makes a lot of sense.
But to Tariq's point and the point that he and many others have been making for years and something I too have noticed is that when you start giving SOME credit to Latinos  or non-Blacks for a particular art or invention....it opens the door for several years down the line for them getting ALL of the credit for it and the Black presence get's erased.

You already have a lot of people running around trying to claim that Eminem is the "best" rapper of all time......completely forgetting about  Ice Cube, LL Cool J, Rakim, and others.
Some want to make Justin Timberlake the best "soul" singer or R-n-B singer.

We need to "own" and "codify" our inventions and culture. 

[Troy]

12 minutes ago, Pioneer1 said:

I found it rather disappointing that you both ( @Troy & @Delano ) got so easily offended

 

I was not "offended."  Maybe if Tariq was not so confrontational it would have been a more productive conversation, one I would have been more interested in listening to.  I suspect Traiq does that because he understands that it draw more attention. Some one can now create another video and entitle it "Tariq Nahseed Destroys Dr. Colon." and get even more track attention.

 

I think Eminem is an excellent rapper, he past muster with Dr. Dre.  Whether he is the GOAT of a purely subjective assessment, if someone wanted to say that Eminem was the Goat would not quarrel about someone's opinion.

 

IMHO he is not better than Rakim or Biggie or Chuck D or Gil Scott Heron.

 

No one in their right mind would say Justin Timberlake the best "soul" singer, come on man LOL!

 

[Pioneer1]

Break Dancing is one of the best and entertaining forms of dance this world has seen yet....and WE AfroAmericans invented it.
It should have been codified as our "national" dance.

Just like Greeks, Italians, Russians, and other ethnic groups have their own ethnic dances that they pass down from generation to generation.....Pop-lockin', Break Dancing, The Prep, and other dances from the 1900s and 2000s should be protected and codified as officially part of OUR culture.
So that every time people see those dances  they think of us and our greatness.