Chevdove Posted October 10 Report Posted October 10 On 10/7/2025 at 7:58 PM, frankster said: On 10/6/2025 at 10:50 PM, Chevdove said: ok. You might be right. I may have drifted away from the direct issue. Yes...you have Okay. I probably did. My apologies. I am okay with being corrected and criticized. So, I will try to stay with the subject of this thread "there is no such thing as a race". I do believe that this is a critical subject though, and that is why I have come to this thread. Because this government does acknowledge 'Race', I believe that this subject needs to be addressed. And for African Americans, this is vital, that we address it because this issue of 'Race' has been used to define us and oppress us severely. Because this government uses 'skin color' as a main issue to define Race, this cannot be ignored. Because skin color is one genetic factor, in addition to other genetic factors, in how humans are defined, this aspect of 'Racial identity' cannot be ignored. Because skin color is absolutely linked to other specific genetic traits of humans and certain factors are exclusive to Black African, Original Black Africans, this issue of 'skin color' being linked to the federal classification of 'Racial Identity' cannot be ignored. Because skin color is a specific genetic factor that goes back to an Original Male African origin and female African origin the reality that Colorism has been used by this government to severely hurt dark skinned people, therefore, the issue of Racial identity being linked to skin color needs to be addressed, clarified, and defined based on genetic and scientific basis in order to understand the origins of White Supemacy and racism and hatred against people that are darker skinned. So therefore, to say that 'there is no such thing as Race' and ignore the fact that skin color is a valid and genetic factor that is absolutely linked to the first Modern Human would not be altogether wrong. Because this government does not teach the complete truth as to how humans are distinct based on the genetic factor of skin color and other factors that should also be a included in how humans are classified and may be distinct due to reproduction and with regards to species is the problem. If 'Race' and 'racial classifications' are only defined based on skin color, that does NOT mean 'Racial classifications does not exist, but it would be completely incorrect and a confusion. However, if the human world was defined with a complete scientific explanation based on human genetic origins, then the word 'Race' would correlate to perhaps the classification of 'Family' or 'Genus', etc. Instead of being termed 'Human Race', perhaps, the phrase should be 'Human Family', 'Human genus' and then 'Human species'. But to say that 'there is no such thing as a race' is extremely incorrect. On 10/7/2025 at 7:58 PM, frankster said: Africans it is said have the widest genetical diversity...one would expect to find most genetic phenotypes among them okay. On 10/7/2025 at 7:58 PM, frankster said: Skin Color is based on/in Genetics....yes Skin Color is associated with Race Race is strickly a Social Phenomenon. Not so. Skin color is both based on genetics and linked to 'racial categories'. Skin color is not 'associated' with Race, but it is a genetic factor used to define Race. Race is NOT strictly a Social Phenomenon, rather the genetic factor of skin color is exploited to classify humans in societies based on this one specific genetic factor, and as a result, led to discriminatory practices against humans with other genetic traits that are not obviously linked to not being white or lighter skinned. On 10/7/2025 at 7:58 PM, frankster said: Please....do the research as I find it very intriguing that there are human beings with no eu/pheomelanin I presented some pictures that showed a contradiction to this idea that humans exist with absolutely no melanin. So, if you have input, I would love to see it. On 10/7/2025 at 7:58 PM, frankster said: Light Refracts which may lead to the appearance of color... Not that they have no Melanin....they have no Eu/Pheo Melanin. There is NO other type of melanin. On 10/7/2025 at 7:58 PM, frankster said: Most if not all phenotypes can be found Among Africans.... We all share in and from the same gene pool which is mostly African in origin Absolutely agree.
Chevdove Posted October 10 Report Posted October 10 On 10/7/2025 at 7:58 PM, frankster said: Maybe Melanin is not the only thing that give rise to color Could it be that The Wave Length of Light and or its Speed and or Direction changes when it reflects/refracts from an object depending on that objects Shape Structure or Material Make Up which can give rise to the appearence of different colors? Again, there is no other type of melanin. skin--Human skin produces cells that produce melanin and there are only two types. The pigment stems from cells that manufacture them. Prior to the Modern mankind, there was no human that produced Black pigment.
frankster Posted October 10 Report Posted October 10 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Okay. I probably did. My apologies. I am okay with being corrected and criticized. So, I will try to stay with the subject of this thread "there is no such thing as a race". Cool....I little digression gives context sometimes. 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: I do believe that this is a critical subject though, and that is why I have come to this thread. Because this government does acknowledge 'Race', I believe that this subject needs to be addressed. And for African Americans, this is vital, that we address it because this issue of 'Race' has been used to define us and oppress us severely. Yes we agree on all the above... 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Because this government uses 'skin color' as a main issue to define Race, this cannot be ignored. Because skin color is one genetic factor, in addition to other genetic factors, in how humans are defined, this aspect of 'Racial identity' cannot be ignored. The Government created social class or category called Race.... In which it places certain individual with a particular heritage origin features and skin color I am not ignoring race Yes skin color is genetic 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Because skin color is absolutely linked to other specific genetic traits of humans and certain factors are exclusive to Black African, Original Black Africans, this issue of 'skin color' being linked to the federal classification of 'Racial Identity' cannot be ignored. True. 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Because skin color is a specific genetic factor that goes back to an Original Male African origin and female African origin the reality that Colorism has been used by this government to severely hurt dark skinned people, therefore, the issue of Racial identity being linked to skin color needs to be addressed, clarified, and defined based on genetic and scientific basis in order to understand the origins of White Supemacy and racism and hatred against people that are darker skinned. It has been defined.....it is a Social Construct associated with phenotype and place of origin. 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: So therefore, to say that 'there is no such thing as Race' and ignore the fact that skin color is a valid and genetic factor that is absolutely linked to the first Modern Human would not be altogether wrong. Genetically there are no Races 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Because this government does not teach the complete truth as to how humans are distinct based on the genetic factor of skin color and other factors that should also be a included in how humans are classified and may be distinct due to reproduction and with regards to species is the problem. Differences in Skin color cannot be use a defining trait to base races on Every ethnicity have varing shade of skin color.....Africans run the gamut from what is called white to black 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: If 'Race' and 'racial classifications' are only defined based on skin color, that does NOT mean 'Racial classifications does not exist, but it would be completely incorrect and a confusion. Dr Clarke in saying "that race does not exist" is addressing the idea that.... Race can be categorize Biological/Genetically distinct from other human beings. Race is purely a Social Construct 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: However, if the human world was defined with a complete scientific explanation based on human genetic origins, then the word 'Race' would correlate to perhaps the classification of 'Family' or 'Genus', etc. Instead of being termed 'Human Race', perhaps, the phrase should be 'Human Family', 'Human genus' and then 'Human species'. But to say that 'there is no such thing as a race' is extremely incorrect. No...Race would correlate to Gender Nationality and Class - All Social Constructs Family Genus and Specie are Taxonomic terms. Taxonomy is based on Biology.. Race is purely Social Classification.... 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: okay. Cool 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Not so. Skin color is both based on genetics and linked to 'racial categories'. Racial Categories are associated with Skin Color Skin color is genetics.... Race is not a Genetic or Biological Classification 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Skin color is not 'associated' with Race, but it is a genetic factor used to define Race. Skin Color cannot be genetical define race.... Racist Eugenist have tried for over a 100 yrs to use genetics to define race and failed. Genetists have finally answered the question.....Race is not biological 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Race is NOT strictly a Social Phenomenon, That is precisely what it is.....Social 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: rather the genetic factor of skin color is exploited to classify humans in societies based on this one specific genetic factor, and as a result, led to discriminatory practices against humans with other genetic traits that are not obviously linked to not being white or lighter skinned. Variation in skin color has a lot to due with environment - Epigenetics Thus the same gene can produce/modulate/modify varing hues of skin color from what we call black to white. 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: I presented some pictures that showed a contradiction to this idea that humans exist with absolutely no melanin. So, if you have input, I would love to see it. Are those pictures of individual who are OCA1A Albinos? 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: There is NO other type of melanin. Check out Neuromelanin 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Absolutely agree. cool 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Again, there is no other type of melanin. see above 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: skin--Human skin produces cells that produce melanin and there are only two types. Again see above Eating too much of certain foods can result in changes to skin coloration. 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: The pigment stems from cells that manufacture them. True....but is that the only way we percieve color.. 21 hours ago, Chevdove said: Prior to the Modern mankind, there was no human that produced Black pigment. I do not know this....could you provide some documentation to this fact??
Chevdove Posted October 11 Report Posted October 11 On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Genetically there are no Races It's not scientifically correct to say that Races are non existent because one aspect is based on genetics; the genetics of skin color. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Race is purely a Social Construct Again, this is not scientifically true to discount 'Race' as being defined based on genetics, because it is. Races is based on the genetics of skin color, initially. And as a result a social construction followed, however, it became a confusion because humans only being defined based on skin color is so incomplete. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Race is purely Social Classification.... No, it is not purely a social classification but it initially based on the genetics of skin color. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: No...Race would correlate to Gender Nationality and Class - All Social Constructs Gender is NOT a social construct Nationality is not initially 'a social construct' but based on genetics Class is based on genetics, initially So 'Race' is based on genetics but only one aspect of which brought about confusion. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Racial Categories are associated with Skin Color Skin color is genetics.... Race is not a Genetic or Biological Classification No. Racial categories are NOT associated with skin color, but are based on skin color. Race is based on genetic and biological classification of skin color but with the exclusion of other genetic factors. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Skin Color cannot be genetical define race.... Racist Eugenist have tried for over a 100 yrs to use genetics to define race and failed. Genetists have finally answered the question.....Race is not biological I agree, because 'race' is an incomplete form of human classification. But to discount 'race' as not being based on one aspect of human genetics, ignores the obvious that White Supremacist deliberately exploited genetics to promote a dangerous movement against dark skinned humans from which they came. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Variation in skin color has a lot to due with environment - Epigenetics Thus the same gene can produce/modulate/modify varing hues of skin color from what we call black to white. lol. No. Not true! The genetics of skin color is based on 'a blending affect' and Epigenetics has nothing to do with it! OMG! Let me remind you again, I have 'a letter' in Biology. I earned a B.S. Degree in Biology and have passed National exams with above average scores. Many people are confused about the subject of 'Epigenetics'. Many people are confused about the genetics of reproduction and how genes behave. Although, this is a huge subject, the reproduction of skin color is well understood. I studied the subject of Histology in college and so, NO, melanin does not become altered due to epigenetics. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Are those pictures of individual who are OCA1A Albinos? Yes. Absolutely.
Chevdove Posted October 11 Report Posted October 11 On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Check out Neuromelanin The reports say that it has something to do with aging and occurs in the brain. It occurs in some humans when they age, and has nothing to do with a single human producing a unique type of melanin from birth. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: Eating too much of certain foods can result in changes to skin coloration. For example, eating a lot of carrots, but this is not permanent and does not transfer if a person has offspring. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: True....but is that the only way we percieve color.. Yes. That is the ONLY way humans manufacture skin color. The start of all human skin color stems from being born with eu/pheomelanin. On 10/10/2025 at 6:56 AM, frankster said: On 10/9/2025 at 11:29 PM, Chevdove said: Prior to the Modern mankind, there was no human that produced Black pigment. I do not know this....could you provide some documentation to this fact?? Yes. absolutely. I have in the past shared references about the origin of Black pigment in humans. So, I will go back and try to get those references again. I believe that this subject is so hard for all of us to grasp because of so much hatred against the presence of Black humans. But it may take a while, because of personal reasons, it's hard for me to visit this community everyday, like I wish I could! So for this reason, I will give a brief 'general reference' that i have shared in the past. *Scientist admit that Primitive humans did NOT have Blue eyes. And they have to admit this because blue eyes can only occur due to 'Black pigment' [eumelanin]. Therefore, this is one main reason they know that black humans did not exist until after the manifestation of modern mankind. The origin of blue eyes is confirmed to start in one [black] male individual due to a mutation. Now, this is just one of other references that reveals that prior to modern humans, Primitive humans did not have black pigment.
frankster Posted October 12 Report Posted October 12 On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: It's not scientifically correct to say that Races are non existent because one aspect is based on genetics; the genetics of skin color. The same gene is responsible for Eu/ Pheomelanin....the path way diverge due to expression On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: Again, this is not scientifically true to discount 'Race' as being defined based on genetics, because it is. Races is based on the genetics of skin color, initially. Publish scientists say it is The belief of race as a biological concept with human populations having a distinct biological basis is unconsciously embedded in many individuals’ thinking (Lee, et al., 2021). These individuals think population differences in health and intelligence are the result of immutable, biologically based differences between ‘racial’ groups, despite overwhelming evidence that racial groups are not genetically discrete, reliably measured or scientifically meaningful (Smedley & Smedley, 2005). Because racial groups are not genetically discrete, when the term ‘race’ is discussed, we are referring to the self‐identified races (socio‐cultural constructs)—and not race as a biological entity. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11291859/ On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: And as a result a social construction followed, however, it became a confusion because humans only being defined based on skin color is so incomplete. It was and remains a social construct.... On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: No, it is not purely a social classification but it initially based on the genetics of skin color. Race is purely Social On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: Gender is NOT a social construct Gender is Social Construct Sex is Biology On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: Nationality is not initially 'a social construct' but based on genetics No Nationality is not biological.... Once a people leave the stage of a clan and tribe to village city and or state.....it is no longer biological it becomes National. On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: Class is based on genetics, initially Class was originally based on Wealth and Power... On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: So 'Race' is based on genetics but only one aspect of which brought about confusion. Explain the confusion?? On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: No. Racial categories are NOT associated with skin color, but are based on skin color. Based on implies it is biological.. Associated lets you know it is a social groupings On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: Race is based on genetic and biological classification of skin color but with the exclusion of other genetic factors. All Skin colors come from Black African....All human beings are descendants of Africans. On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: I agree, because 'race' is an incomplete form of human classification. But to discount 'race' as not being based on one aspect of human genetics, ignores the obvious that White Supremacist deliberately exploited genetics to promote a dangerous movement against dark skinned humans from which they came. Yes...Racist use race to exploit other humans...The invented the idea of race for that purpose - and needed it to be genetic in order to continue exploiting. Racists knew if they could prove that so called Black and White People where genetically and biological different, they could continue to treat fellow humans as property. The Abolitionist Argument to end the enslavement of Africans was partly based on the facts that Africans were 100% humans....and within the protection of Christianity Racist Arguments for the Enslavement of Africans was based on the ideas that we were different races and genetically different....and not Christian. On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: lol. No. Not true! The genetics of skin color is based on 'a blending affect' and Epigenetics has nothing to do with it! Really epigenetics may have more to do with how genes express themselves than the genes themselves. On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: OMG! Let me remind you again, I have 'a letter' in Biology. I earned a B.S. Degree in Biology and have passed National exams with above average scores. I have no degrees... You have told me this before... On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: Many people are confused about the subject of 'Epigenetics'. Many people are confused about the genetics of reproduction and how genes behave. Although, this is a huge subject, the reproduction of skin color is well understood. I studied the subject of Histology in college and so, NO, melanin does not become altered due to epigenetics. Melanin may not be altered as you say but it is influence by epigenetic factors... For decades, scientists have known the basic structure of our DNA, the building blocks that make up our genes. Although nearly every cell in the human body has the same set of genes, why is it that different types of cells, such as those from brain or skin, look and behave so differently? The answer is epigenetics, a rapidly growing area of science that focuses on the processes that help direct when individual genes are turned on or off. While the cell’s DNA provides the instruction manual, genes also need specific instructions. In essence, epigenetic processes tell the cell to read specific pages of the instruction manual at distinct times. Some epigenetic changes are stable and last a lifetime, and some may be passed on from one generation to the next, without changing the genes. https://www.niehs.nih.gov/health/topics/science/epigenetics You once used AI so i guess AI Overview epigenetics influences skin color through mechanisms like DNA methylation and histone modification that regulate the genes responsible for melanin production (melanogenesis). These epigenetic changes are dynamic and can be triggered by environmental factors such as UV exposure, which causes pigmentation changes. While the underlying DNA sequence for skin color doesn't change, epigenetic modifications can turn genes on or off, explaining short-term changes like tanning and long-term changes in hyperpigmentation disorders https://www.google.com/search?q=epigenetics+and+skin+color+&sca_esv=2080ab0b38870e5b&sxsrf=AE3TifMnwx5tFAUNAtHx3TWOwKT938fBNQ%3A1760278379022&ei=a7fraM6QAZOcw8cPg6eh4Q4&ved=0ahUKEwiO8vL7656QAxUTzvACHYNTKOwQ4dUDCBA&uact=5&oq=epigenetics+and+skin+color+&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAaAhgCIhtlcGlnZW5ldGljcyBhbmQgc2tpbiBjb2xvciAyBhAAGBYYHjILEAAYgAQYhgMYigUyBRAAGO8FMggQABiiBBiJBTIIEAAYgAQYogRInsQBUOUFWJ-lAXACeAGQAQCYAfABoAHSIqoBBzM0LjExLjG4AQPIAQD4AQGYAiqgArYgqAIUwgIKEAAYsAMY1gQYR8ICDRAAGIAEGLADGEMYigXCAg8QIxiABBgnGIoFGEYY-QHCAgUQABiABMICJxAAGIAEGIoFGEYY-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_LtEG1LxEDiAYBkAYKugYGCAEQARgTkgcFMTYuMjagB6vwA7IHBTE0LjI2uAejIMIHBzItMjAuMjLIB-EC&sclient=gws-wiz-serp On 10/11/2025 at 11:59 AM, Chevdove said: Yes. Absolutely Cool.... So are you challenging the scientific results I quoted that states that these individuals have no melanin or are you saying out right that theses scientist are wrong? On 10/11/2025 at 12:20 PM, Chevdove said: The reports say that it has something to do with aging and occurs in the brain. It occurs in some humans when they age, and has nothing to do with a single human producing a unique type of melanin from birth. It is still melanin and it still is real and existing....and it is human In short there is more than two types of melanin - correct? According to Science Neuromelanin can be found in humans as early as 3yrs old and continues on Neuromelanin is a dark-coloured pigment which forms in the dopamine neurons of the human midbrain. The age-related development and regulation of neuromelanin within these dopamine neurons has not been previously described. Optical density and area measurements of unstained neuromelanin in ventral substantia nigra neurons from 29 people spanning the ages of 24 weeks to 95 years old, demonstrated three developmental phases. Neuromelanin was not present at birth and initiation of pigmentation began at approximately 3 years of age, https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15916835/ On 10/11/2025 at 12:20 PM, Chevdove said: For example, eating a lot of carrots, but this is not permanent and does not transfer if a person has offspring. If one is bought up in a culture of eating lots of carrot then it is very likely you your parents children and grands will express carotenemia .....HCVAD/HHAVAD On 10/11/2025 at 12:20 PM, Chevdove said: Yes. That is the ONLY way humans manufacture skin color. The start of all human skin color stems from being born with eu/pheomelanin. I did not say how we manufacture skin color.....I said how we perceive skin color. The perception of color has to do with light refraction speed direction structure and material quality On 10/11/2025 at 12:20 PM, Chevdove said: Yes. absolutely. I have in the past shared references about the origin of Black pigment in humans. So, I will go back and try to get those references again. Thanks On 10/11/2025 at 12:20 PM, Chevdove said: I believe that this subject is so hard for all of us to grasp because of so much hatred against the presence of Black humans. I harbor no hatred for any color human beings.... Our understanding of the subject matter differ.... On 10/11/2025 at 12:20 PM, Chevdove said: But it may take a while, because of personal reasons, it's hard for me to visit this community everyday, like I wish I could! So for this reason, I will give a brief 'general reference' that i have shared in the past. no rush here take your time this is a labor of love... I appreciate every time you spent time with us and me .... The briefer the better.... On 10/11/2025 at 12:20 PM, Chevdove said: *Scientist admit that Primitive humans did NOT have Blue eyes. And they have to admit this because blue eyes can only occur due to 'Black pigment' [eumelanin]. Therefore, this is one main reason they know that black humans did not exist until after the manifestation of modern mankind. The origin of blue eyes is confirmed to start in one [black] male individual due to a mutation. Now, this is just one of other references that reveals that prior to modern humans, Primitive humans did not have black pigment. What pigment did they have? So all humans with blue eyes have brown/black pigment - eumelanin So everybody today with blue eyes got that from black skinned Africans?
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