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Troy

Oh My, Nicki Minaj

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I just sat down to look at some youtube videos before calling it a night.  I generally watch Youtube video on a regular TV. I usually search for subjects that interest me.  I started to watch an Inconvenient Truth but after a few minutes I grew bored...

 

I decided to see what was trending on youtube (something I almost never do), the #9 video was the one shown below . This video was watched over 8 million since in the last two days.  That is 8 times more than the number of view all of my videos have received in the last decade!

 

I watched at least 1/2 of the video. I doubt anyone would confuse the music with being great, but after watching the video for 5 seconds it is obvious the music was secondary this video was all about Nicki's bangin' body!  Her body is so off the chain it doesn't even look real.  

 

Imagine the views I would get on a video if I could get Nicky to shake her thang while an author was reading from their book. Shoot I might even sell a few books.

 

Still I wonder who this video is for, really.  Is it designed for the teenage white boys who buy most rap. Is it for Black women to give them something to aspire to.  Is if for all men to give them something to, well.. use your imagination...

 

Again I can't image it is to listen to the music..., but what I know I'm too old to appreciate this music.  

 

Where else does one watch music video nowadays anyway?  

 

 

 

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This is an example of hip hop music -next generation.  Future is huge in the hip hop world as is Nicki Minaj- put the two together and you have a bona fide hit...
Nicki looks amazing but she always does ... I love the way her body is sculpted but don't take away from Future's presence - he is a big draw too . Wait that's an understatement - He had back-to-back number 1 albums on billboard's 200  Check out this article lol The title is funny. 
 Nicki has also  had a few movie roles too - but her presence, so far, outside of the hip hop arena hasn't translated into a box office draw...  But I wish she would promote black books too - because I find her another a-list talent that is moving into her own power. 

 

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I never heard of Future until last night.  Maybe this is a man thing, but were it not for Minaj, I would not have watched for than 30 seconds of the video. 

 

I guess I'm in the minority regarding Future's music, but again I know I'm not the demographic, so this is not surprising.

 

Del I was just too tired to give Inconvenient Truth a good watch, that is really what I meant when I wrote "bored."  I was too tired to give the film the focus needed to watch it critically--a Minaj video does not require the same mental capacity. ;)

 

I do plan to get to it and to IT2 well.  I'll let you know what I think on the other conversation.

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@Troy  In answer to your question, you can watch music videos of all genres  all day long on cable Music Channels VH1 and BET.  

 

This video is really well-produced; the hook is catchy and Future and Nicki really complement each other.  They certainly typify what rivets black folks: "bling and swag". 

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Yes the production quality was very high. Clearly, they have created a video that appeals to a great number of people, I found it compelling until I realized that I was simply riveted by Minaj's physique and I had to turn away before I spent the rest of the evening looking for Minaj videos to watch all night  :o

 

Despite my fascination, I did not feel compelled to buy the music.

 

Man, I have not thought about BET or VH1 in years!  I would be willing to bet that more people watched the video on Youtube than VH1 and BET combined. The video has been viewed over 9 million times in less than 3 days!

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6 hours ago, Cynique said:

This video is really well-produced; the hook is catchy and Future and Nicki really complement each other.  They certainly typify what rivets black folks: "bling and swag".

@Cynique , yes thank you! I couldn't describe the feeling but you nailed it. 

You know @Troy  I would have missed the video premiere if not for your post. I, tend to  stick with contemporary jazz, soul, funk and old school house these days - but this was a great find. 

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Hate to piss on the praise parade but................

This video is a bit disturbing for a number of reasons:

1. If you notice, why do they have so many WOMEN looking at Nicki's body in a sexual manner?
Even the hotel maid takes a look at Nicki and looks like she's getting hot as she whips out her hair.

2. Besides Future, why are the ONLY Black men in the video being chased down and beat up by NON-BLACK police officers?
(right around the 2 minute mark)

What's up with that?

What kind of message is that sending, that Black men who look at a good looking woman must be chased down by the police and beat up?

Or when you see Black men being beat up by the police you should just walk by looking sexy like Nicki did as if it's a common everyday thing?

What's the message?

3. Finally, it's not the biggest deal but......
Nicki is an attractive woman but she doesn't really represent "Black women" or the way most Black women look.
So constantly praising women who look like HER or BEYONCE or AMBER ROSE and talking about how beautiful they are really tells darker skinned Black women with more African features how UNattractive they are.

But again, what's up with all the women lusting after Nicki and what's up with the brothers being beat down by non-Black police?

 

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Who says that music videos can't be political and provocative ???

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Sure Pioneer the video sends all kinds of crazy messages. I completely understand why the Hotep crowd, the religious right, and prudes would be taken aback. This is Viola Davis time cover taken to another whole 'nother level.

 

But Maybe it is just a fun video and ain't all that serious... 

 

How would you make the video differently? Would you have Minaj wear a burka?

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Pioneer is a "stick in the mud".  Pop culture is not his strong suit.  He's always trying to "intellectualize" trivia.  Art imitates life.  This video is not sending messages; it's reflecting what's already  out there in the mix.  

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Pop culture is not my strong suit either, but after listening to y'all I've learned to lighten up.  

 

When I was a kid I could give you the programming on all of the TV stations.  I did not need a TV guide, but there were only about 10 station--6 that people really watched NBC, CBS, ABC, PBS, and two local stations.  I also new all of the popular songs by Black people. I went to every Black movie that came out and I watched every Black sitcom.  When cable become available I would sit with my VCR ready to record all the black music videos so that I could watched them whenever I wanted.  I LOVED BET! I listened to Black radio exclusively. I mean I grew up in Harlem, witnessed, first hand, the birth of Hip-Hop.

 

But that all started to change once I got into college.  After I started the website and was really exposed to the world of books--pop culture failed to interest me.  Despite being completely immersed in Black pop culture for the first 30 years of my life, I didn't really know shit about what it really means to be Black.  I guess I felt like I had to play catch up ever since.

 

But watching that Minaj (is her name a play on ménage à trois?) video if felt like I missed the last 20 years of music videos--like I was locked up for 20 years, get out and seeing an Galaxy 8 cell phone for the first time. Now seeing scantily clad honeys shakin their rumps in music videos is not new on me--BET made billions promoting those.  This video was just so much better than was I recall ever seeing seeing. 

 

It is not enough for me to start watching VH1 or BET again, but it was an entertaining diversion from trying to listen to Al Gore drone on about climate change...

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@Troy No need for anybody to apologize about not keeping up with pop culture.  It is a lot of vapid blather.  I just follow it so i can hate on all the phony, air head celebrities, - and participate in the conversation when others discuss it.  

 

I've always tried to be a well-rounded person, conversant on a broad scope of subjects.    This is a throwback to my 1950s up bringing, back when girls were always advised to be this way in order to hold a boy's interest.  It was considered having a good personality.  But it didn't necessarily work with guys who were more interested in loose girls with big boobs and fine legs. :o

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Cynique
 

Who says that music videos can't be political and provocative ???


It can.

Infact, race and sex are often intertwined anyway.

However, if the video IS political.....exactly what type of message is it trying to send?

 

 

 

Troy
 

Sure Pioneer the video sends all kinds of crazy messages. I completely understand why the Hotep crowd, the religious right, and prudes would be taken aback. This is Viola Davis time cover taken to another whole 'nother level.

But Maybe it is just a fun video and ain't all that serious...

How would you make the video differently? Would you have Minaj wear a burka?


No.
I have no problem with her sexuality.
She could get butt naked in the video and I'd love it....I watch porn from time to time myself, lol.
And even ENGAGE in it occasionally.....lol.

My questions were simply why does she have WOMEN looking at her in a seductive way and why are Black men being attacked and beaten up by non-Black police officers for no apparent reason.




Both


This is one of the problems I have with a lot of these AfroAmerican artists and entertainers who try to make political statements.
You can't figure out what the hell they're trying to say.

Even with Colin Kaepernick, or Beyonce.....you get the feeling that they're trying to "stand up" for something or "speak out" on something but they are so confusing and vague and symbolic you can't figure out what they're trying to say or what they're trying to accomplish.

Like Beyonce and Bruno Mars' performance at the Superbowl the other year.
It was supposed to be some sort of statement about police brutality, but it didn't actually tell the public what they should do about it.

I'm not the biggest fan of Kanye West but one thing I LOVE about the brother is he tends to speak his mind regardless as to how crazy he sounds.....instead of speaking in garbled and coded language.
He came right out on live television and said George Bush doesn't care about Black people.....straight up.
There was no confusion or vagueness about what he was saying and everyone could understand it and most agreed with it.

But this video......what the HELL was the point in showing a bunch of Black men holding eachother back while slobbering over Nicki and then later on getting beat up and arrested by cops?

What????

I admit, I'm not the smartest man in the world so help a brother out.

What was the PURPOSE of that scene....somebody tell me.

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@Pioneer1, 45 speaks his mind too.  I think there is some value is discretion.  Besides how does a Kanye know who Bush likes or does not like.  Maybe he does not like poor people, maybe his reaction to Katrina was incompetent but that had nothing to do with his personal predilections and more to do the failings of the local and national administrators. Sure Kayne's statement, like 45's tweets are great for the media, but counterproductive.

 

I'll have to watch the entire video with my "Hotep Hat" and third eye engaged, and get back to you.

 

The problem is that our activists are validated by media and they are usually celebrities.  Celebrities can assist, but they can not be the leaders.  Baldwin, Angelou, Belfonte assisted King and other civil rights leaders in the civil rights struggle, they did not lead it.  Celebrities get all the attention because that is the way the media get more people to watch.  This does us a disservice.

 

Whenever we attempt to choose our own non-celebrity leaders the media marginalizes them, focuses on their flaws and failures, or simply don't cover them.

 

King, Malcolm, The Black Panthers, etc, had media campaigns launched against them and may Black people were turned against these institutions and men.  Sure Dr. King is universally celebrated now, but he was not during his day.  I doubt a Dr. King  could rise to prominence today.  We'd probably be fixated on whatever a Little Richard had to say about civil rights if it the media operated the way it did today...

 

So Colin K. the professional football player, has been thrust into the limelight as if his kneeling during a football game, given the media coverage, is the more important civil rights action that has taken place since the march on washington. And (choose your favorite local activist), struggles for the support to make a difference in obscurity.

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@Pioneer1  Maybe the message Nicki is sending is that she identifies with her fans and is "keepin' it real" because  what she portrays  and depicts in the video is what is already happening in their culture.  I repeat: "Art imitates life".   

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If the genre doesn't appeal to you. Perhaps you are not the intended recipient. Except for perhaps the last sentence is all predictive text. 

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Troy

I agree and I don't expect our celebrities (or those PROPPED UP to be our celebrities) to be leaders.
But I do expect them to be intelligent enough to be conscious of what they do and say in public and I CERTAINLY don't expect them to be COUNTER-productive in the political struggles of their community.

I like the new features you've added to the site, by the way.
I like how I can now edit my posts with all of he same tools that allowed me to post in the first place!


Cynique

The problem is, when you have White supremists who are controlling the entertainment industry.....too often LIFE imitates ART.

Currently, most Black people won't walk past Black men being brutalized by non-Black police officers and ignore it.
Even if they don't or can't do anything about it, they'll atleast cry out against it or record it with their cell phone.

After more videos like this making police brutality seem like an "everyday" thing to be ignored, who knows what the results will be.

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Why can't this just be a pop video meant to entertain and not taken seriously or be deconstructed?   The music and the lyrics are the hook.  The setting is incidental.   

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Again, nothing in a video is put in there by accident.
Everything is designed.....orchestrated....choreographed.

So my question was why was this particular scene of Black men struggling with eachother and then being beaten up by non-Black (not Black....but NON-BLACK) police officers inserted?

If they are vacationing in some Carribean island, why didn't they choose Black cops which are so abundant in the West Indies instead of non-Black cops?


What does that scene have to do with the song, the lyrics, and the good beat?

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“Nicki is an attractive woman but she doesn't really represent "Black women" or the way most Black women look.”

 

OMG! Seriously??? Why should represent anyone?? Where is it written that a personality, celebrity or whatever must physically represent the majority of their race? Please tell me because I do not understand your statement. I’ll wait for a detailed response.

 

“So constantly praising women who look like HER or BEYONCE or AMBER ROSE and talking about how beautiful they are really tells darker skinned Black women with more African features how Unattractive they are.”

 

Wow! Here we go again! Ya now, I really don’t follow your logic. I really don’t. If Niki, Beyonce or Amber Rose are perceived as being attractive –why is race politics being injected into their appeal? Why can these women not be attractive and represent who they are as individuals (and their craft) minus race animus and petty racial carping? American Negro females are so schizoid and paranoid about not being perceived as being desirable and attractive to most people. For example, a young black woman posted a video on YouTube, complaining that Beyonce makes her and black women who look like her feel undesirable and unattractive. WTF??!! YOU DON’T SEE ANYTHING WRONG WITH THIS TYPE OF NONSENSICAL JUVENILE THINKING? These women are very talented for what they do. Yes, they are attractive but it was their craft that got them where they are. The looks was a big benefit and perhaps had they not been attractive they might not enjoy the success they have. But this unfortunate protocol of having to be attractive in order to enjoy success is not limited to Negroes. You do realize this don’t you?

 

As far as dark complexioned BW with Negroid physical features not being seen as attractive is concerned, well -that is pretty much a lost cause because there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. It is what it is. We have discussed this before. In fact, I wrote a very detailed rebuttal to the discussion were having about attractiveness  vs. Gabourey Sidibe and Viola Davis phenotype a while ago. I never posted it because the computer I had written it on crashed and I had to remove the hard drive and rebuild the entire box. I still have that treatise on one of the 20 different hard drives I have. Rather than research for it hd by hd I would rather recreate the argument if needed. We can pursue that discussion again. I’m more than willing to do that but for now, let’s focus on this black female pity party because some black women are seen as attractive while others feel slighted, bitter and left out. I have no idea how you are going to convince the world that what they perceive as attractive is misguided and wrong.  Don’t get me wrong, I understand the consternation of dark complexioned BW. But it’s like convincing women that given all things being equal, a man that is 5’1” is equally attractive as a man that is 6’1”. Good luck with that…..

 

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Xeon


OMG! Seriously??? Why should represent anyone??

Because by human nature you tend to look up to and immulate people who LOOK LIKE YOU.

If you are Black and/or DARK SKINNED and the only positive (and beauty and sexuality are positives) images you see are represented by WHITE or LIGHT people then you grow up with damaged self esteem.

 
 

Wow! Here we go again! Ya now, I really don’t follow your logic. I really don’t. If Niki, Beyonce or Amber Rose are perceived as being attractive –why is race politics being injected into their appeal?
 

OK.....here's the logic.

Race is being injected because Nicki, Amber, and Beyonce are all NON-BLACK women who are being marketed heavily towards BLACK PEOPLE and especially BLACK GIRLS.

And that marketing of non-Black women to young girls who look nothing like them is very damaging and ruinous to the self-esteem and psyche of these young girls.


 

 

. For example, a young black woman posted a video on YouTube, complaining that Beyonce makes her and black women who look like her feel undesirable and unattractive. WTF??!! YOU DON’T SEE ANYTHING WRONG WITH THIS TYPE OF NONSENSICAL JUVENILE THINKING?
 

I'm actually glad who ADMITTED and ARTICULATED her frustration in this way.
I'm proud of her for doing this.
Most women just bottle it up without admitting it and their frustrations are released in other ways.

She's being honest....and is justified in her frustration...at the fact that the promotion of these very light non-Black women are damaging the self esteem of Black girls in a society that promotes the image of White women as the most desirable.

 

Yes, they are attractive but it was their craft that got them where they are. The looks was a big benefit and perhaps had they not been attractive they might not enjoy the success they have. But this unfortunate protocol of having to be attractive in order to enjoy success is not limited to Negroes. You do realize this don’t you?

There are plenty of DARK SKINNED Black women who are just as beautiful and talented but they weren't promoted by the WHITE MEDIA EXECUTIVES who run the mainstream media.

Look at Kelly Rowland.
She's more beautiful than Beyonce and can pretty much sing just as well....why wasn't SHE promoted the way Beyonce was when Destiny's Child broke up?


 

I have no idea how you are going to convince the world that what they perceive as attractive is misguided and wrong. Don’t get me wrong, I understand the consternation of dark complexioned BW. But it’s like convincing women that given all things being equal, a man that is 5’1" is equally attractive as a man that is 6’1". Good luck with that…..

Well, first of all a
man's height isn't the ONLY thing about him that women look for when it comes to physical attractiveness.
I've seen plenty of inshape muscular SHORT men holding it down with beautiful women while tall fat sloppy men are home alone jacking off because the women don't want them.
Height is just one of MANY physical features that makes a man attractive and physical features is just one of MANY characteristics that women look for in men.

Infact, I think a man's height matters more when dealing with OTHER MEN than it does when dealing with women.....but I could be wrong.


As far as convincing the world about who is and isn't attractive.......

There's no need to convince or sway the world, I say just leave them alone and stop brainwashing them through the media and NATURE will eventually take it's course and what NATURE has determined to be the most attractive women and men will eventually win out.

Which means women won't be choosed based on their skin color or hair texture, but by how wide their hips are, how healthy their skin is, how white their teeth and eyes are, and other attributes of health and fertility that have little to do with race.

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On 8/11/2017 at 8:13 PM, Xeon said:

But this unfortunate protocol of having to be attractive in order to enjoy success is not limited to Negroes. You do realize this don’t you?

 

Men don't have to go this this at all.  There are plenty of unattractive Black men with successful careers, because they are talented. Forrest Whitaker, Samuel L. Jackson, Chris Rock, etc, etc.

 

I think the video advances the objectification of women, which does not really serve us very well.  But that is in my opinion and I'm sure people will disagree.

 

The conversation that has emerged here, and arguably the video itself reveals the sexism inherent in our culture.  I agree women do have to look much more attractive than men performing the same task.  Women who fall short get a lot of grief where men don't.

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Troy

I agree with everything you said but the fact is for some reason a woman's looks weigh more heavily on her success in life than a mans and this is a WORLD WIDE standard that is pretty much the same through out ALL CULTURES.

Man are prized on their intelligence and strength while women are prized on their beauty and femininity.
Which is why when I hear Black women promote the "strong Black woman" theme, it makes me cringe a little.

Some cultures prize a women for their intelligence, but I don't know of any that prize women for thier strength except for the mythical "Amazons".

What I've noticed is that a man's looks only work against him if he's VERY unattractive.
If he's average to good looking then he's OK.
Infact, good looks tend to be a plus.

But even if he's slightly below average in looks....if he is relatively normal in intelligence and physical ability he can manage to do great.
If he's gifted in intelligene or physical ability he'll do VERY good.

But if a man is VERY unattractive then that tends to work against him heavily and it's hard to overcome.

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i have been hearing this conversation for years and i'm curious as to why it doesn't resonate with me.   I grew up going to the movies, beginning in the 1930s  because my mother worked at a movie theater and i could get in for free. I'd go to the show every time the pictures changed, and back then a trip to the movies meant a double feature.    When i sat in my seat, munching on pop corn, gawking at the silver screen watching all the legendary movie stars, it never bothered me that these people were white and i was  not.  I simply viewed them as actors who were in the business of supplying entertainment and escapism for moviegoers like me.  The characters didn't have to look like me to advance the story line or to amuse me, all they had to do was to embody emotions that i could relate to; human emotions and sentiments that applied to everyone. Back in the 30s and 40s, the only black characters in these movies were either ones grinning and tap dancing or maids and chauffeurs, none of whom i identified with because  because  i was never around servants who wore uniforms or people who bucked their eyes and danced on tables.   

 

I remember going to see "Carmen Jones" in the 1950s when i was in my twenties.  It starred Harry Belafonte and Dorothy Dandrige and had an all-black cast. I looked upon the movie as a novelty,  and i didn't identify with the characters because the people were the same color as me, i enjoyed it because it was a compelling story and its character types were universal.  In the heyday of the blaxploitation movies, i was amused by their absurdity but i certainly didn't identity with the black pimps and ho's and  action heroes and heroines. I've always been big on separating fantasy from reality.   To me, these characters were caricatures. The same with Nicki Minaj  who has had breast and butt-cheek implants, making herself over as a voluptuous Barbie doll.     Yes, men can get by with an average-looking face  but women do like well-toned bodies. Halle Berry and Beyonce have both been cheated on by their mates so beauty ain't all it's cracked up to be.  Women in touch with the real world, know that looks can only get you so far.  And it's not like plain women don't get men.  They do and there's a whole population of fine women who are constantly being asked why they're still single.  Sometime it's because men find them intimidating.  Other times it's because the Mr. Right they think they deserve, doesn't exist.  

 

I retrospect, maybe i am a natural born spectator, possibly a product of my passive era because it also didn't bother me that i never had a black teacher.  My role models were people i knew, either in the community or in my family.  But I was , and still am, impressed and proud when in real life situations, a black person gives a good accounting of themself.  

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That is interesting Cynique.  I think you are a product of your time.  How do you feel about a white Jesus? 

 

I'm old enough to remember all white TV and I remember being excited when Black people were finally depicted on the screen.  It makes a difference to see yourself reflected in movies and to have stories that speak to your experience.  

 

More importantly it is important for others to see our experiences as well and not just a ghetto dwellers or big booty vixens in music videos.  Perhaps if white folks saw us in films with universal stories that resonated with them, they would not be marching in Charlottesville.  

 

You see we are presented with broad diversity of they humanity everyday, but they are not presented with ours

 

Most of the Blaxploitation films were filmed in my neighborhood so they were really exciting.  When I watch a film like Shaft I marvel over how much Harlem has changed.  

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Well, there are plenty of movies and series on TV  out there now that depict black people in diverse roles or in their natural environment; not only on  cable channels like BET,  TV-One and Oprah's channel, OWN, but on network TV, too.  i don't think watching  these programs  make a lot of white converts.  Even millennials haven't gotten past their white entitlement. There was an undercurrent of resentment over  black characters debuting in  the super hero community.  Whites balked  at the idea of a black James Bond,  and muttered about the main character in the last Star Wars movie being black.  Many whites just can't get past skin color.  

 

i don't even remember what i thought about Jesus being portrayed as white.  Maybe i accepted this idea because he didn't seem to give a damn about what was happening to black folks.  When i abandoned religion in my 20s, i did think that it was ridiculous how he was Anglo-sized  when he was supposedly a Jew from the middle east.

 

Maybe i am an alien which is why i'm detached about a lot of things.  :wacko:

 

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Yes there are indeed a great many Black folks on TV now.  Interestingly I don't watch any of the programming.  I may try Queen Sugar, based upon Natalie Brazille's novel, I hear that show is good.

 

I don't know how many more white people now see us as human as a result of more Black folks being portrayed on the small screen. But I'm sure it is more than if would be otherwise.  I think Black people are in a better place than we would be otherwise.  

 

 

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Cynique you aren't alien, you objective and not a slave to either time or place. It's like people say surfing is a white sport.

No Troy, I think Eddie Murphy said it best. One time he was shopping and someone called him a nigger. When he turned around the guy was like Yo it's Eddie Murphy. He was no longer a nigga. So celebrities may exist in a separate reality from mere mortals because they are Stars.

 

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Ahh, I remember Carmen Jones.....
And I still remember her in that black bra and zebra panties.



Del, what you said reminds me of that scene in Do The Right Thing when Mookie and Pino were discussing race and when Mookie (Spike Lee's character) asks Pino (the Italian racist) why he's so racist and calls Black people "niggers" when his favorite entertainers are Black like Prince and Magic Johnson.....Pino responds by saying that Prince and other celebrities aren't "niggers", they're "different".

I thought that was a brilliant scene by Spike because it illustrates the distorted thinking of a lot of White people who see THEIR FAVORITE Black person as different than the OTHER Black people of society in general that they may see more negatively.

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Most people, even racists, view and treat celebrities as if they are superior to other humans.  But this of course has nothing to do with the person.  If I'm a white racist and I don't happen to know you are a celebrity you are just another nigger to me...

 

In any event, this is simply not enough to make a red neck change his thinking about Black folks in general -- unless it was possible to make every Black person a celebrity.

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"OMG! Seriously??? Why should represent anyone??

Because by human nature you tend to look up to and immulate people who LOOK LIKE YOU.

If you are Black and/or DARK SKINNED and the only positive (and beauty and sexuality are positives) images you see are represented by WHITE or LIGHT people then you grow up with damaged self esteem.

 

............I say just leave them alone and stop brainwashing them through the media and NATURE will eventually take it's course and what NATURE has determined to be the most attractive women and men will eventually win out.

Which means women won't be choosed based on their skin color or hair texture, but by how wide their hips are, how healthy their skin is, how white their teeth and eyes are, and other attributes of health and fertility that have little to do with race."

 

Ya know…I read your response. In fact, I read it twice. I thank you for your very thoughtful opinions. With that said, at first I had a number of very detailed responses to everything you wrote. But after mauling over it a few days, I couldn’t finish my retort. Why? Because the absurdity of your statements was not worth the effort. I say that not to be disrespectful (that’s not my interest nor intention) but I could not bring myself to argue with the idea that an artist who is extremely popular should be criticized because their attractiveness makes girls who are less attractive feel bad about themselves. That’s like me saying the guys in the NBA or NFL make me feel bad about myself because I do not possess the level of athleticism they do. If your self esteem and feelings of self worth are so low that an entertainer makes you question your own self worth and self-perception of attractiveness –I think that says it all. The sheer absurdity of such thinking is ridiculous. And you defending their butt hurt adolescent feelings because a popular entertainer that is deemed attractive by the general public is equally ridiculous.

 

I mean, seriously, I can’t debate this because such thinking is so outrageous and gelastic it’s not worth my time. Unfortunately, these girls that you speak of do not meet the standards of what is attractive. Your argument is these girls have a particular physical phenotype that may be deemed as less attractive than the entertainers and this is unfair? If the standard is 6’ and you’re only 5’7”, well –whose fault is that? The person who is 6’? They should be called out and lambasted because you (5’7”) can’t meet the standard? I don’t think so. And as far as you blaming the media, that makes no sense either. Never in human history has a very unattractive person been deemed as equally desirable as a very attractive person. You want Beyonce and Leslie Jones to be seen as equally attractive by the world so girls who look like Leslie Jones won’t feel bad about themselves? REALLY? Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Good luck with that. We have discussed the general phenotype that is seen as attractive by the overwhelming majority of the human race. You and I both may disagree with these standards but at the end of the day –it is what it is and there is nothing you nor I can do to change it…PERIOD! I suggest these over sensitive immature thinking girls stop allowing entertainers to usurp their self esteem and develop their own sense of self worth instead of blaming “other people” for their lack of attractiveness. I don’t know what else to tell you…..

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Troy

Most people, even racists, view and treat celebrities as if they are superior to other humans.  But this of course has nothing to do with the person.  If I'm a white racist and I don't happen to know you are a celebrity you are just another nigger to me...

With some White people, infact a LOT of White people.....being a celebrity or just being very successful in general makes White people hate you even WORSE.

If you notice, a lot of White people seem to LOVE Black people they CLEARLY feel they're superior to.
They love to see homeless Black folks out begging, they'll even give them money and a hug or take a picture of them and put it in a publication for a story.
Why?
Because it re-enforces the belief that Black people are poor and need their help.

Meanwhile they'll hate on the wealthy Black entertainer or athlete and talk about all the money they have or spread rumors about some sex scandal or vice they're involved with.

Truth be told......
I believe this is one of the reasons so many athletes find themselves in trouble with the law and in court.
You have poorer White police officers and other public officials with less money and fame who are angry and jealous and they make it a point to "go after" wealthy Black entertainers to teach them not to get too "uppity" and forget their status.


I used to work with a White dude who would grab the paper every morning and read it aloud just to antagonize his co-workers and one of the things he liked doing is talking about all the money these football players or basketball players were getting.







Xeon
 

I could not bring myself to argue with the idea that an artist who is extremely popular should be criticized because their attractiveness makes girls who are less attractive feel bad about themselves


It's not the physical attraction of these artists that is the problem, it's the fact that they only seem to find attractive artists who LOOK ALMOST WHITE.

You have attractive and unattractive people in every race, but they'll disregard the dark skinned attractive man or woman to promote the one who looks nearly White in order to promote "white beauty" among Black people.



 

That’s like me saying the guys in the NBA or NFL make me feel bad about myself because I do not possess the level of athleticism they do. If your self esteem and feelings of self worth are so low that an entertainer makes you question your own self worth and self-perception of attractiveness –I think that says it all. The sheer absurdity of such thinking is ridiculous.


You clearly don't understand SOCIAL ENGINEERING and how it operates.

Everything you believe about beauty has been TAUGHT to you.

 

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The video is ridiculous. Nicki Minaj doesn't even look like Nicki Minaj. Her hair is fake. Her body parts are fake. Her wardrobe looks like a strippers wardrobe and she inspires Black women to emulate her and empowers them to wear weaves. Also, she identifies as a bad bitch. But what does that mean? Because if you look at her style, she shows that being a bad bitch, is dressing like a whore and her job is to turn men's heads by showing all to the public. New age rap music is single handed one of the most destructive forces destroying the Black community. Nicki is no exception.

Let's understand exactly how the industry works. Like I said, Nicki Minaj is not even Nicki Minaj.

 

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@Del, the fake woman in the video is the draw.  At least it is what kept my attention for a couple of minutes.  I never did go back and watch the full video.  

 

My feelings the video mirror @NubianFellow's for the most part, but I probably don't feel as strongly about it as he does. Basically if women themselves don't agree with that assessment, it will be a very difficult battle to wage, as evidenced with the Viola debate. Even if your intent is to protect Black women, you get accused of "mansplaining," overstepping your bounds, or something else just as counterproductive.  Now I think the MInaj video is far worse for Black women than the Viola Davis photo, but again that is just me.

 

While I view the video as the very definition of the objectification of women, some women view it as a demonstration of exerting their power and no man is qualified to even speak on the matter... and so it goes.

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I agree brother @Troy, that our people are super sensitive most of the time and it has never helped us to get ahead. We need to understand how to speak with and deal with each other. It's a lot of nonsense our brothers are doing wrong too, that is perhaps even more destructive. This all needs to be pointed out by anyone brave enough to deal with the criticism that will follow. Women get on me all the time. I told one lady that she was too beautiful to have that damn trash in her hair (weave) and to throw that stinking mess in the trash. The next thing got back was I need to find god. Something about her private parts and more rudeness. But wait sista, all II did was call you beautiful if you examine what I said. We need to learn how to put our emotions to the side as a dominant people of the planet.

 

But yea, as far the feminists go. They don't respect men at all so we can never oppose them or we are done. Feminists believe they are superior and that men should be the submissive ones.. LOL

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I, for one, hate dread locks.  i think they are inauthentic because they are synthetic,  and are also serpentine and  ugly and whether they smell or not, they look like they do.  I'm sure if i expressed this distaste to a man wearing them , he would feel insulted or indifferent.  I also hate full grown beards like NBA hoopster James Harden wears.   I am a supporter of Colin Kaepernick but i not a big fan of his big Afro.  If i were still in the mix, my appreciation for males would lean toward clean-shaven or neatly barbered ones.  Does anybody care about this? Hell no. 

 

Hair has always been an issue with black folks.  Yes, black women are brainwashed by popular standards of beauty.  Because they want to be popular.  Why wouldn't the female of the species not want to make herself look like what men are  salivating for?  My only advice to my black sistas is to also cultivate your mind so that when the lights come back on you can bedazzle and amuse  your stud with some interesting pillow talk.

 

As to whether or not i would overlook what i consider a bizarre hairstyle on a man if he was brilliant and  virile, i would simply say, it's not something i ponder about since it's not a situation that i would encounter at this stage of my life.  :o

 

 

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@Cynique I feel you queen. And that makes sense - what you just said. However, let's consider the chain that we build, like a slave chain for example... If a Black woman hates her natural hair state, then that means this is something about herself that she hates. So she changes the state. This means that she will never come to accept and love this state - something of which is a part of her. The way god intended for her to be. Now imagine an entire nation of people who feel this way about themselves. Now imagine many nations of women who hate this natural state they are born. Let's delve a little bit further and now imagine just about every Black nation on the planet having a complex with their own natural state. 

 

A new social dynamic is created where hardly any Black people on earth embrace their natural state. But these are just our women. The goddesses right?

 

Now imagine most of these women being solely responsible for the development of our new generations. They are raising our Black men and Black women of tomorrow. These will be the warriors responsible for leading us to a better place socially, financially and civilly. They are already raised to not embrace THEIR own natural state. Most Black nations on the planet embrace a form of beauty that is not their own to claim. They are actually appropriating another race and emulating traits that they were never meant to possess.

 

Now let's understand that these are genetically weaker traits that are being embraced.

 

For instance, let's take a flower. Since birth, I raise children to believe that roses are ugly and give detailed explanations of why that is so. Everything that is beautiful, I create reasons as to why they are inferior traits and why that sweet smelling rose is ugly. Indoctrination. All their lives these children will hear why roses are ugly and terrible plants. I have taught them to love and embrace cactuses. Most will form an opinion of how ugly these plants are. They will not want to associate or be around roses. They will embrace cactuses. Which explains the behavior of Black people. We embrace cactuses. 

 

A cycle is being created and embedded into our mental state. Research shows that these ideas don't just get passed down mentally, but also genetically. Our ideas, opinions, and beliefs do affect our genetics. So we have to responsibly consider the damage we are doing to ourselves, not just culturally, but on a genetic scale as well. Why should goddesses strive to be trolls?

 

Everyone else from every other culture and race on the planet is taught to love themselves. Black people are the only ones who embrace everyone else and not ourselves. But somehow, we have come to accept that this is perfectly fine. It's not queen. It will never be.

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