Leaderboard

@Pioneer1 No, let's not look at the wording. It's like, you are attacking! IMO, you are missing the point here, @Mel Hopkins was married. This man married her and acknowledge her life, and this means that not only did she choose him, but he chose her! How beautiful. 2 hours ago, Pioneer1 said: In your mind the bar or standard has been raised to the level of this White man so by default no Black man can compare. That was her husband!!! The two of them deserve an opportunity to work this out without being attacked for issues that ALL OF US--THE WHOLE WORLD HAS TO DEAL WITH. Pioneer, it's like you are reading into this too much. Get Off Mel!!! When a past debate came up about 'a particular non-Black young woman' Ms. Ariande Grande, I don't remember you attacking her--IN THE WAY THAT SHE DRESSED-- Umh... Did you give her a pass, even though she showed up in a predominantly Black funeral affair dressed like she was going to a bar? But you think that we, Black women should receive scrutiny from Black men who feel they have the 'masculinity' and right to 'check' Black women for wearing spandex, and blonde hiar and such. @Pioneer1 Isn't that what you are doing? It is as if you are trying to make Mel's statement the blueprint for what you believe others have done. I feel your assessment is mis-directed.

@Pioneer1 OK if Mel's motives can't be trusted what about mine. I'm a Black man with over 1/2 a century of experience. I advocate for Black people on a daily basis. Ali came across as an anachronism, a misogynistic throwback with a narrow minded perspective. Sure the women looked fine, and if they wanna dress that way cool. I don't, however, but believe that any Black women should be compelled to dress this way or in any fashion dictated by a so called religion. But I give Ali some latitude, he was a great boxer, but in the video he was young, not the most educated person, and a devotee of the Nation of Islam. As a result, I don't expect profound ideas to come from this man. I do expect him to talk shit and knock people out in a boxing ring for my entertainment. The problem we have is our fixation on entertainers for ideas. As if some rapper or athlete is capable of deep thought simply because they are famous. This is not true for white folks, but for Black folks this is the surely the case. We all know how reporters seemingly seek out the craziest sounding Black person when a comment is need for a story. This is true across the board. If we need some insight on how well the president is doing -- lets hear from Kanye. Need relationship advise -- get Steve Harvey on the phone. Need in depth political analysis -- give Al Sharpton a TV show...

@Chevdove Oh Yes! To all of what you’ve written! 💕 🙌🏽 @Cynique Yes!!! Confidence!! You always express what I can’t find the words for because they are wrapped in my emotions. It’s so funny how a person can subconsciously desire all these things but not know how to express it - Yes, Yes, Yes! I never sought a “white” man... I thought these attributes & characteristics existed in the black men I dated and held in high esteem. That is until they revealed themselves. I wonder how many black women, have denied themselves wonderful experiences and a life partner because they are waiting for these traits to appear in a black man. I wonder if they too feared losing an opportunity to comment on the pathologies in the black community because their non-black partner? Confidence does allow one to be kind to others. I remember my former husband saying he didn’t look in the mirror too long -because it invoked a false sense of security. I never understood what he meant by that until now. Damn.

i have yet to hear what you don't agree with about the Nation of Islam! You swear by everything Elijah Muhammad and Farrakhan say. The obvious question raised by your "facts" is why don't you have the courage of your convictions and marry a Muslim woman or 2 or 3 of them instead of laying up with airheads who call you "Daddy"? How can you like the results of the Nation of Islam lifestyle and not live their lifestyle? Your inconsistencies taint your credibility. Your whole vibe is one of telling others to do as you say do, not as you do. A role model you are not. When it comes to the appeal of white men, "power is a great aphrodisiac". Intelligence is sexy. What's even more appealing is a powerful white man who is secure enough to be a kind person. if this type is appreciative of a black woman, this erases a multitude of sins. At some point, bitching about racism gets old. How true!

That's how I feel as well. Racism has damaged Black people by diminishing the self worth. It has also damaged White people by giving them an over inflated sense of self importance. Black people and White people live in different worlds. I believe Mel said that both implicitly and explicitly. That he was the best Man for her. She even stated that she didn't know about all White Men just this particular man.

This is so sad, @Pioneer1 and I recently wondered the same thing. It breaks my heart. Do you know , a white police officer have stopped traffic to help me make a u-turn when I was lost. Once I was driving with my lights off in the whitest city of america, where Sandra Bland was from ... and a white police officer pulled me over - told me my lights were off and after I apologized and told him I didn’t realize it and that I was going to pick up my daughter - he said be careful and told me where I might find her. My point is there are two americas for black people. Sandra Bland lived in one of the wealthiest neighborhoods in America. When she left to move Texas - I believe she forgot we black women of privilege don’t get to carry it with us. We have to feel the temperament and tone of the environment before we speak.

@Pioneer1 Isn’t it funny how things work out like that? What’s the saying “you’ve tried all the rest, now try the best”? Seriously, though it appears that you believe recognizing someone who is treating you well or with kindness is a matter of brainswashing and conditioning. And it could be - but i’m not a church girl and didn’t allow my daughters to go to church without adult supervision - so my conditioning is not “white jesus” nor is it - that a woman is here to be subservient to a man nor subjugated by him... Now is my former husband kind because he’s white? I don’t know - but that’s not my concern ... He’s the kindest man I know. By the way, you do know you can only judge character by actions, right? Not one or two actions but what they do consistently. My former husband has a good heart - and does his best to make everyone whole - it’s how he uses his privilege.

@Pioneer1 History, Huh? Lol! My history is filled with black men. My father was black. My first born daughter’s father is black. I know black men well enough to write a book and I’ve written two! BUT critiiquing black men is not my job. Ali played himself in that video clip. He was a straight embarrassment. Now let me help you out here with MY history. I’ve only had 1 marriage. I married 1 blond hair blue-eyed french /german white man who to this day still loves this dark-skinned kinky-hair black woman and the ground she walks on. And he ain’t soft like you like to think about white men. You can’t roll with me and be soft. He would kick anyone’s ass who would dare to step to me , his black stepdaughter (yes he stepped up and raised her like his own) and African/european descent daughters... no matter what they or I wear. And trust, no one dictates what we wear or what we do ... and he’d still defend and protect us for exercising our rights. But then again he’s white in America so maybe that’s privilege lol. Even though we’re no longer married I considered myself lucky for choosing this strong white man as partner. He is the kindest man I know. Ironically, he never tried to control me or the girls...but I guess there was no need. So no, I didn’t choose white supremacy; I chose freedom -and what resulted is a white man who worships us black women...daughters of Africa, with all the respect due us.

i don't know what Mel's response to Pioneer will be when it comes to her ex-husband, but she sure got it right in her assessment of that loud mouth hypocrite Ali, whose choices of women were always examples of those consistent with western standards, - always bragging about them having long pretty hair which was anything but kinky. He also regularly referred to joe Fraizer as a monkey. In his heyday he was typical of misogynisitic chauvinistic men of islam, expecting their women to be totally subservient and obedient to their dumb asses, but in his final years, Ali was a helpless cripple at the mercy of his controlling manipulative 4th wife. Poetic justice. Always the defender of Islam and its shady leaders, one can't help but wonder why Pioneer never became a Black Muslim. They exemplify everything he believes in.

Guest Loren Carle Guests Report post (IP: 204.113.88.245) This guest post was buried in the "Black Women are Beautiful' thread, invisible because it had not been approved by a monitor. I rarely exercise my monitor privilege on this site but this was an interesting commentary so i took the liberty of approving it and hope Troy doesn't have a problem with my doing so. Cynique. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted 1 hour ago This topic hurts my heart. I am a white man, and so feel that very little I have to say in the matter will be helpful. However, here goes. My personal response over the few decades of my adult life has been a decision to have my natural facial hair, and a relaxed attitude to my head hair. I don't spend any money on shaving stuff, and ask my wife to cut my beard the way she likes best once in a while. I keep my head hair in some kind of reasonable state of tidiness, without thinking too much about it. I used to have it long and in a braid, hoping for solidarity with Native American men. I'm not sure anymore that the effect of a long, thin blonde braid on a white man with a red beard was the desired one. I recognise that I probably experience a lot of privilege in making these decisions, but I hope it's one way that I can reject the privilege afforded to shaven, short-haired white men. The difficulty seems to lie in black women being forced to choose their battles. Do their employers or co-workers comment on their self-presentation in ways that give them fear for their income that supports their children? This is what should not be! I would like to hear from black women about this topic. If we men, of any origin, presume to tell any women how they should appear, it's just the same old sad story of men presuming to dictate how women should present themselves, expressing the same old sick power dynamic. We gotta just stop, guys, and love the women and men we love by honouring their dignity with acceptance, support, and appreciation of their own personal aesthetic—wait for it—choices. What we can do is examine work on our own attitudes honestly and privately, without looking for kudos (or to get laid) for being woke: nobody owes us anything. We need then to notice how those attitudes are reflected in whom we find attractive, and whether and how we express that attraction. peace

@Delano And Religion - I refused to allow my daughters to go black baptist or evangelical churches.

I don't think America will ever be prepared to really know what a person like me thinks about this issue initially. I am screaming inside because when I hear about these Me Too cases, I stuck on about 200+ years of the kind of Me Too stories about Slave Masters and etc. that will never be brought to light in this AMerican court that way that it has been for these women!!! Do I have Me Too stories . . . smh. smh. smh. ... Me!? Get retribution!? LOL. What a joke. But yeah, these stories are horrible!!! HIs last statement-- WOW!!! Creepy. He seems to have demoralized these women! Did he pay them money, or did they get some kind of gain way back when this happened to try and keep them quiet? Has he admitted to any of these acts in court? BAsed on my personal experiences, I don't have much faith in this court system, but, why would these women lie? I am beginning to think they are telling the truth.

Have a listen and telk me what you think.

@Pioneer1 CONTEXT is your friend, Black man! When I was creating my “THE BEST MAN”- he ain’t had no color!!! Just good character!

Mel What are the facts? Seriously, I missed the facts.  Well ONE fact is you said: This statement says a number of things: 1. You chose him.....suggesting you actually went out looking for a White man. 2. You praise the strength of this White man....but White men who are strong have been known to use this strengh to brutalize and murder people of color around the planet. 3. You call him the kindest man you know....which means of all the thousands and perhaps millions of men you've come across in your life, that particular White man beat them all in terms of kindness. Now let's look at your wording........... You didn't say: "He treated ME kinder than any other man that I know" -Because if you had said this, I wouldn't have had a problem with that statement. You said, "He WAS THE kindest man you know" Which suggests you know about the kindness and good deeds about all of the other men you know and have evaluated them and found them lacking in compared to this one who happens to be a White man. You made HIM the epitome of kindness without really knowing how kind other men that you know are. In your mind the bar or standard has been raised to the level of this White man so by default no Black man can compare. Not that you agree with it.....but do you atleast UNDERSTAND my point? Speaking of Sandra Bland and the police...... Did you know that the same White police officers in New York who shoved that broken plunger up Abner Louima's ass back in the 90s was married to a Black woman? It doesn't matter how much love ONE White man has for ONE Black woman, even that one White man can "snap" and turn into a vicious racist when it comes to a Black person who is not his object of affection. Even during slavery there were violent racist Whites whom had favor and bestowed love on PARTICULAR slaves that they liked....but it didn't make them any less racist. History is FULL of examples of White people we THOUGHT were cool and kind turning around and committing heinous acts or bigotry. My point is, we can't let individual interests and "falling in love" cloud our judgement to the point that we project our own individual experiences on the entire reality of race relations. 　 　 My man is not my father - and I’m not his mother. Please don’t creep me out here. Well you can do you. I've DEMANDED (as only a "controling" Black man can do) most of my girlfriends call me "daddy" atleast once a week....lol.

I have not followed up on this particular story about Cosby, but I'm one of those Black folks who don't believe that Cosby should have been thrown in Jail for the crime he committed. Cosby had previously given the woman 3 million dollars which she took. But smart people can argue the point... If these other powerful white men (Harvey Weinstein, Les Moove, et all) get off that is just adding insult to injury., but also par for the course here in America.

Nubian Well if that's what he meant then that's what he should have said, lol. I would have agreed, because I too was disappointed at Motown leaving My-town (Detroit) and moving to California where I think it lost much of it's flavor by leaving it's Black urban base and going "Hollywood". Never the less, you can't dismiss the powerful impact Motown had on it's first 20-25 years bringing the world people like Diana Ross, The Temptations, and Marvin Gaye. It showed the world and most importantly Black America what we can do when we make up our minds to control our OWN talents instead of staying on the plantation begging "massa" for justice. I also agree with you but forgot to say until you brought it up that yes.....one of the reasons more Black people didn't stand with Monique was because she wasn't standing with them. She didn't start talking Black unity until she got HER "n*ggger wake up call" and then all of a sudden she wants to act like Queen Nzinga and wage war against the industry, lol.

What Monique doesn't realize is that demanding to be paid more money by Netflix, regardless of the reason they paid her a lower salary, is still slavery. If she has beef with them, no one is stopping her from actually growing her own empire that could employ more black people and maybe even become real competition. So I don't buy her sob story. Why not use the 500k that she got from Netflix to open up Moniqueflix? Or find an already black existing company that she can take over or invest in, even as a silent investor if she didn't want to get her feet wet? Black celebs have always been too happy with masta's money and then complain when they get ripped off more than they are used to being ripped off. Funny thing is that they are the least likely ones to invest their money back into the black community and create more opportunities for the people who made them rich but that's showbiz. Even more ironic is that would also be where their true wealth lies I'm certain. Monique wasn't standing up for the black community. That's why no one took her temper tantrum seriously. She was acting out of self interest because she personally felt targeted. She was motivated by her own greed and ambition. Now she has to make amends with the same people she insulted so she may have a career. @Pioneer1 I believe @Troy is referring to the fact that Motown sold out to Universal. They also sold cheaply for 61 million dollars. They haven't been black owned since the 80's. That's why they are not mentioned among black owned businesses. Now I believe they are worth in the billions. Same with BET who sold to Viacom. The powers that be pretty much prohibit black people from having media control. And I think Google is in on it too.

Seems like Cosby considers himself a political prisoner and has compared himself to Martin Luther King, who was once jailed for his civil disobedience. There is apparently an interview out there somewhere where he talks about his incarceration. He is embracing the role of a martyr who white America is making an example of, and a lot of black folks, especially male ones, are buying into this. He may yet reverse the tide and clean up his legacy. Nothing surprises me any more. His sympathizers can take solace from how Harvey Weinstein, CBS CEO Les Mooves, and certain other accused white celebs may escape jail but will never clear their names.

@Pioneer1 this clip actually makes @Mel Hopkins's point. I agree no woman, or man, should worship at the alter of a European designer. However, any religion, or man exposing such a religion, that mandates chaste attire for women is oppressing women. I've seen women in the ocean down here in burkas (or whatever you call that crazy getup some muslin women wear that covers everything but their eyes). Is that really what you in favor of? Pioneer truth be told some of what you write is confusing and inconsistent. I recall previously you saying man was millions of years old. Now we are billions of years old. Which means we must be extraterrestrials because Earth could not support our form of life billions of years ago. When presented with this info you come if with something that some people believed centuries ago. Given your conversation with Chevdove about the Bible I figured you must be a Christian or some pioneerized version of one. I was curious to know which parts you believed.