Chevdove
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@Mel Hopkins Yes, I read about the American Slave Albert Perry and the new information on the AO HAPLOGROUP, Y-DNA. I have to tell you though,
for the past year, I have went over the Y-DNA HAPLOGROUPS and I can see the manipulation here in regards to the science community, and I will explain in a little while.
I have not been able to make a conclusion though, I just see some contradictions in what has been reported about the Y-DNA.
I will get some quotes though.
1 minute ago, Mel Hopkins said:
@Chevdove LOL!!! I was just getting ready to edit to update it to say - not extinction of MEN - just the "Y" . One those studies indicated post modern humans created different sexes in other ways...
really. Tlhat's new for me. I would love for you to shed some more information on this!
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32 minutes ago, Mel Hopkins said:
As it relates to anthopology, the mtDNA mutates almost every 8000 years . The mutation here refers to assigning mtDNA haplotypes into halplogroups which is represented here in this phylotree ( A comprehensive phylogenetic tree of worldwide human mitochondrial DNA variation, currently comprising over 5,400 nodes (haplogroups) with their defining mutations.)
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0008260 Molecular Clock of the mtDNA hominid
credit: van Oven M, Kayser M. 2009. Updated comprehensive phylogenetic tree of global human mitochondrial DNA variation. Hum Mutat 30(2):E386-E394. http://www.phylotree.org.
Also, the mitochondria is not a chromosome such as the Y that recombines slightly or X that recombines with the other X chromosome and a little with the Y.(See this 2001 study on the question of mtDNA recombination https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1461814/pdf/11606549.pdf )
The Mitochondria are small membrane-bound structures contained in the cell's cytoplasm. It is responsible for generating energy needed for cell function. The mitochondria contains its own DNA and protein-synthesizing machinery. It reproduces by splitting in two to make a second copy of the DNA . https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-do-researchers-trace/
The offspring inherits the mtDNA from the mother.
The father inherits his mother's mtDNA but males cannot pass it on. The Y only passes from father to son, whereas the mtDNA goes from the mother to both son or daughter. This link leads to an early study of Y-Chromosome mutation https://www.nature.com/news/2009/090827/full/news.2009.864.html .
And yes, mutation is limited to the Y- because its the X that has all the genetic information to combine with the Y to form a viable human. Recent studies, previously stated the Y chromosome was on its way to extinction because it only recombines to provide genetic information for male reproductive organs - and had emptied itself of other genetic material. According the article (link) it has found a way to stabilize itself. https://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/news/140513_ychromosomehttps://www.hhmi.org/biointeractive/evolution-y-chromosome
But as you know the origin of mankind was the X chromosome. According to studies, and the aforementioned article) there was no Y chromosome until about 180 million years ago.
Yes! Thank you for the correction. I once, many moons ago a teacher and I just could not remember the correct terms. You're right, the mitochondria is on the outside of the nucleus and the Y-DNA HAPLOGROUP is one strand of the Genome. I need to look over my notes, but I have come to realize the subject is extensive.
Look!--I HOPE NOT!--I hope the Y chromosome doesn't become extinct! LOL! I don't want to live in a world without men! LOL.
But I would like to share some of my notes about this topic, only, I need to find my notes.
The RECOMBINATION I mention, I think there might be another term I need to use to explain what I found.
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16 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:
Krazy Alexander 2 uttered:
"I associate with white folk only when necessary and infrequent as possible in person."
Oh come on nowKrazy Klarence....I mean Krazy Alexander....
Do you REALLY expect us to believe that????
How can you call your contact with Whites "infrequent" when they feed you and give you your medication several times a day?
BTW, I thought you said there was NO SUCH THING as race.....so who are these mysterious "White folk" that you speak of....lol.
Chevdove & Tsegal
It's great to know and understand scripture but I think it's dangerous for Black people to put too much faith in "end times" and the "end of the world".
...especially when we expect it to be THE answer to all of our problems.
It pacifies too many of us and prevents us from actually DOING THE WORK that need to do to make this planet a better place for ourselves.
That's one of the main problem I have with most of these organized religions an their protocols.
They keep you waiting and waiting and waiting on something OUTSIDE of yourself to change your environment.
Our people have a "laziness" problem where all they need is an excuse to sit down and DO NOTHING.
Waiting on "the lord" to take care of it all provides a convenient excuse for that.
Most of them were waiting on Jesus to come back during slavery to put an end to it but generation after generation was born, enslaved, tortured and died until a CIVIL WAR where hundreds of thousands of people were killed and maimed finally brought "official slavery" to an end.
We must always put our faith in the SUPREME BEING.
However we don't know the Plans of The SUPREME BEING, so it's often best not to guess at them and begin to roll up our sleeves and get busy doing what the Chinese, Indians, and other groups are doing which is WORKING.
China and North Korea and India ain't waiting on Jesus to come back or pointing their finger at Europe telling them that "karma" or the devil is going to pay them back for what they did.
They are building factories and sky scrapers and mapping out the future for their children and future generations so that they will no longer be in a vulnerable position to be mistreated.Yes, I absolutely agree with what you have said.
I say, pray without works are dead, dead, dead.
And as far as 'end times' I have gotten out of my past mentality and the understanding and conditioning of what I once believed about it anyway.
I do hope though, while I work for a better existence from the issues going on today in this world when it comes to racism.
12 hours ago, Mel Hopkins said:(((HUGS))) @Chevdove WOW, if this was a memoir it would be riveting because what you shared here rocked me! Your mother was sad she didn't give birth to sons?
Oh snap, As you mentioned this took a terrible toll on you and your siblings. And if I understand correctly, she had your children taken away? See, this is what I mean about broken people. If your mom is broken - then how does a broken woman raise children and not break them too? In ways that she may not realize? I had to realize that about myself - there are certain behaviors that I developed in response to my upbringing. - My parents were loving parents to me - but they were broken too and that can't help but spill over into the home.
I agree - if you let western society have their way, black women aren't even supposed to get pregnant ... We are made to feel ashamed for taking time to have babies in wedlock - and if we choose to be single parents -then...well that's unacceptable. I wrote a blog post about Bridget Jones ' Baby - because a black woman could have never starred in that movie, without all of society especially black america having the movie pulled before it aired LOL....
I remember when I was carrying my twins - and I had to go on bed rest; My woman Indian doctor, at the time, was reluctant to say mine disability papers lol... Even after the emergency room doctor ordered it. I found a black woman ob-gyn with quickness to care for me and deliver my girls. So yes, I absolutely understand. You have a very powerful story - I hope you've shared it already - and if you haven't I hope you find your voice.@Mel Hopkins I really need that hug! Thank you.
You know I still sometimes that I never left that conflict. And you said a lot when you speak about broken parents raising children. That is what brings me so much inner turmoil. I think about the Black women of these past generations, and I am so glad that I was not in their shoes!--But at the same time, what kind of escape do children have when they are in a situation, an environment like that? I find it fascinating though, that you had twins and furious at the conflict you faced...cause I know how that feels when a female, doctor[!] reacts negative ... to a Black mother-to-be!
Thank you and I hope we collectively find our voice... because I don't believe this system will improve if we, as Black women don't have the proper voice.
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I forgot to address you question about career. I did not go after my career with the mindset that I would be a homemaker and that is the most shocking part of it all! I never even considered that would even be an issue until I was faced with the issue of trying to find a good babysitter. I didn't want my kids to suffer like some of the stories I have heard and what I went through. Both of my sisters were sexually abused and I've heard so many terrible stories like this, and I suffered as 'a latch key kid'. I never saw my mother as she was a career woman and yes, the women in my family demanded that I do the same. But I came to a point where I refused. But when it comes to BLACK WOMEN, I believe it is a terrible saga due to societal persecution. We are damned if we leave are kids and work and then, we are damned if we don't. We are viewed as selfish if we seek a career and then we are framed as lazy soap opera watching stay at home Moms if we don't, but other women don't get this treatment, in my opinion.
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Wow! this thread is interesting. The photos you posted are very interesting.
You know, I have worked in a genetics lab and my major is in Biology with emphasis in Secondary education. And after I've studed about the mtDNA and the Y Haplo group, it seems to me the scientist are not revealing everything. Actually, I think it is the other way around, but I need to look at my notes regarding the mtDNA. That is the one that does 'mutate'. But the term for the Y-Dna haplogroup is that it is more stable and it does not RECOMBINE like the mtDNA and this is why scientiest know the origins of mankind, which they say is much more recent than the Mitochondrial Eve. Alll Y-DNA has a basal MARK that shows their origin is in Africa and it is called 'basal a'. All males have this 'basal a' mark and it does not recombine.
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4 hours ago, Mel Hopkins said:
I read this earlier and had an epiphany, a coming to jesus meeting and experienced nirvana - all in that order. Thank you.
Please keep in mind, I'm not saying your feelings and experience aren't valid, but what I'm about to write is based on my journey. And because of what you expressed, I can see now what I missed.
From my perspective, the only difference I see between men and women are their goals.Successful opposite sex relationships arise from the two being goal mates. For example, If the mates' goal is to ensure the success of their offspring, then they will do everything together that is necessary to make that happen.
You've written that black women were your oppressor but could they have also been your savior? What were their goals for you? You mentioned in a follow up "
Did they hope that you would do more than be a mother and caregiver for the next generation? Did you go through your academic and professional experiences with the goal to be a mother and caregiver? (Hypothetical question, because although I have a fabulous professional life but I went through hell and high-water to raise my girls. They came first because raising powerful women was my goal. My ex-husband had the same goal - we just had different goals for marriage .
(20-20 hindsight speaking, here).
My ex-husband is german-french ancestry because right up until I met him; men of african ancestry had been "my oppressor." - I realized from reading your response - that was a lie I told myself. They weren't my oppressor -they just weren't my savior. If we're looking for a savior - chances are we're going to find a lot more folks looking to be saved. And they will most likely break our hearts. But I digress.
I was heart "broken" by the time I met my first love, a black man. Up until him; I was a "player" in a game that was set up against women - but I didn't care because my heart wasn't in it. It wasn't my goal to be someone's property. It was my goal to... I actually had no goals.
Coming to someone broken is a heavy load for the other to carry - especially when they may be broken too. We are so much like sheep - we hide our wounds in an effort to not be vulnerable - but we expect someone to care for our wounds that they can't see. I remained "broken" but expert at hiding my wounds. So anyone that wasn't like the one who didn't "save" me - was the hero.
All this to say, we are all broken... no one is an oppressor ... We're just a bunch of broken vigilantes instigating and carrying out a bunch of mini-battles since the dawn of time- we are the anti-christ, the beast.
This, I believe, is why the idea of a supernatural savior and the idea of a supernatural energy called LOVE is so appealing. We can access it but first we have to stop lying to ourselves about who the real enemy is.
$0.02
Greetings! You have a lot of insight! I love what you wrote. And I appreciate so much, your input!
You know, I am still deeply hurt what has happened to me but, because of the positive experience I have had from so many other women during that particular saga in my early marriage, I still do view my victory based upon the other Black women that came forward on my behalf. I did write that but I think, it was missed. I was too beaten down and trained and conditioned to not defend myself against my mother, and today, I still believe in that. Deep inside, I believe that it is dangerous to confront your elders in a outright hostile manner, so therefore, when I gave up, it seemed out of no where, I got calls from the Church mother, and long story short... I was told that a coalition of church mothers had gotten together, and called the Judges mother! LOL. One of the Church mothers actually knew the judge's mother and was named after her. And they told her my story.
... So, the judges mother called her son and told her to "give that woman her sons back"! They told me to hold on, don't give up, you are going to get your kids back... and I did. I couldn't believe it! I resigned earlier. I quit my career job, because I had a nervous breakdown. My kids meant everything to me. My father told me that my mother was mentally off and angry because she didn't give birth to a son.
My mother was a social worker and she made friends with the judge, a Black woman, and my kids were seized, with no warning, no trial... 3 years later, I got media attention from WB22, a news station owned by Jews, and they did aggressive media and uncovered the conspiracy... Even though my mother had no contact with me, my husband, or my kids for over a year, she alledged that my husband, sexually abused his sons, my own sons... they were five and seven when they were seized, so they very upset, years later when they heard the details...
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30 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:
There can, in reality, be no oppressive Black women in America, just lose whatever compassion they may have.
Any Blackman or woman in America who claims they don't experience after-effects from slavery is lying to themselves. Those who attempt to hid it pay the greatest price.
Clam down, Chevdove, that's the extreme focus that brought us this discussion ... during these posts you've used the pronouns "me, my, and I more than 10-times; how about 'them,' your children? Fuck everybody else, what they say and do!!! What are you doing?
lol... It's hard to 'forget' about everybody else... But thank you. I do need to keep focus on my real goal, my offspring... that is the focus... the next generation.
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This thread was really enlightening but then, it went south.
Too bad.
I really don't know what to think after what I REad though, and I read this thread twice. Europeans, Caucasians, European Jews, White Jews, Hebrew Israelites, Ethiopians, Mexicans, Native Americans... etc. I still learning, so I can't make any sound conclusions yet, on what is going on in this world except for that Racism, and White Supremacy and Colorism has plagued this world on a Global scale. But based on my recent research, I am rethinking about the kind terms like European Jews and such. Now, I am repharsing this term, and saying Jews in Europe, because when I think 'European Jew' I was condition to visualize White Jews, but this is not the whole truth.
Anyway, I want to share more about myself. I am not particular right now if I am defined as being Black, or African American, however, I specify though, that I am a Black African American descendant of slaves. Because my maternal Great-grandmother came over here through the slave ship rather late, I know about her through my relatives. My aunt, my mother's oldest sister, is still living today and she's in her nineties. When she kept me when I was young, she talked about her, the slave woman' because she knew her first hand. Every year at the family reunions, her oral history was repeated.
My great-grandmother was stolen as a little girl in the AD 1800s, from East Africa and from the Port-of-Sudan byway of Arab Slave Traders. She was caught when she was doing her chores, carrying water from the well. She was put on a British Slave ship, at a time that, by law, the British had supposedly outlawed slavery!!! She was stolen during a ten year period that a notorious Black slave trader had operated and his name was Bakir. By the time she came to America, she was impregnated and she gave birth to a son, that was light skinned and grew to be tall. She was about thirteen, she just started her menstruation. My aunt said, that she saw her sometimes write Arabic letters in the sand. She lived through 1850 and in 1865, her first husband, who was sold earlier further south, walked all the way back to be reunited with her in South Carolina. ... She died in the early AD 1900s, I think. I wrote it down, but can't remember exact date right off hand.
[2] Fast forward, when my son was about five, I searched for tutor, paid, and took my son to learn ARabic, because I wanted to him to learn a language from Africa. I read books to him from the library on Swahili, but I couldn't find any other AFrican tutor at the time, so I settled on Arabic. It was a brief time, because the woman that began, after a few weeks she told me that she consulted a British professor at the college, and was advised to stop. However, for a couple of weeks, my husband and I would go to their place. After a few weeks, she told me that she was not Jordanian, but Palestinian. She wanted me to know that every time I came over, she asked her husband to get up because she was afraid of my husband. Both her and her husband told me that my husband was, for certain, Hebrew Israelite. ...
[3] One of my sons worked at a grocery store where a young Ethiopian girs worked. She told my son, "You are not African American, you are Ethiopian. You look like my uncles."
When he was in college, his friend, an AFrican young man from Rwanda or Uganda? told my son, that he looked like he was from Ethiopia. So I don't know... My mother's people, my sister, looks just like those people over there in Eritrea and Ethiopia. scary.
So this thread is interesting to me. I don't know what to think. I am just learning about the history of Anatolia Turkey, and it is 'blowing my mind'. The notorious slave trader, Bakir, was enslaved as a boy, and I think he was from Turkey Anatolia.
White Supremacy has done a great damage to the ethnic world. Recently a few years ago, when Obama was in office, Miss Israel pageant winner was from Ethiopia. But recently, she was pictured on tour in America at a Jewish event and she was seated in front of the Jewish flag. But the Ethiopian Jews' flat is NOT THE SAME! Such exploitation. Nevertheless, made friends with a European Jewish girl years ago, and she reminds me so much of one of my sisters, in traits. So, I just don't know what to think.
[4] But here's another riddle to this puzzle: When I first met my husband, he look like any average Black African American man to me and he sported his afro. But on my first date, I sat down beside him at the table, ... and after a few silent moments, he started laughing silently... he saw me out of his side view, ... I was staring at him... it caught me off guard. His profile caught me off guard... He was all into Black POwer, he showed me his books on Malcolm X, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., he talked about Black music, he loved jazz, ... and he introduced me to his college friends and etc. But I never sat near him until that day. He had long black eyelashes that I had not noticed until that moment, and his hair, his afro was very, very black. But what stunned me, was that his eyes were very deep set, he had... like a forehead... well... lets leave at that. He was laughing silently, and then he said, "yeah, I get that a lot." Then before I stopped myself, I just --without thinking-- I said, "What are you!" My uncles, my fathers people, the fellows I knew growing up... Black African American men... After a while, he said that his father was full blood Native American and his mother was Black African but from another tribe. Now, my other son's got her forehead... and he looks to me, like he's from the Carribean. So there ya go... I dunno. ...
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13 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:
Thank you, Chevdove, excuse me if I take as a compliment!
Are you referring to something else or the discussion between me and you? We men tend to be more impatient than women, we lash out whether something is apparent or not so obvious because we believe our way is better; especially if we see ourselves as more informed. In other words, we're stupid!!! Even when it is clear you were right. Not to go against our 'man-code' but I should keep it real, right?
For the life of me, it is unconscionable that a human being, any human being could ignore suffering, mercy on the little ones who need both parents. Unfortunately, people have different reasons for doing what they do or allow to be done, even where their own children are concerned. The fact that we consciously do things that harm children is a good part of what makes for 'pessimism' in me. Only a man who is coward would allow another to seize his child and do nothing. Little else justifies violence.
Unless a response would jeopardize well-being other family members ... like with Black slaves. Interfering with the slave-master could get everybody killed.
DAMN
Thank you.
This is a tough issue for me and difficult to talk about. It is my constant rage and motivation at the same time.
I don't even know how to frame it because most of my oppressors were actually Black women. I think a lot of Black women have trauma from the slave experience and it's ignored today. But I think what happened to me stems from that foundation. Nevertheless, there is no excuse, in my opinion, for a Black woman to throw down another, if she chooses to fend for her little ones. I love my mother still today, but I also confused and angry. She did me in. She threw me down. and she had a lot of help. If it had not been for the other Black women, her age and generation, that defended me, I would have been completely destroyed. My sons, her grandsons, don't want anything to do with her. They are still upset, and, believe it or not, sometimes they blame me!
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20 hours ago, Kalexander2 said:
Yeah, I hear you, when you're hungry, you gotta eat! Me, I just sacrifice the damn meal, bless an empty table and go to bed satisfied.
I love your analogy and I thinking...
Haven't made up my mind yet, but this kind of conflict makes me wonder about men vs woman when it comes to tough decision making. Let me bring it home a little better:
More than 20 years ago, my husband and I went through a terrible human conflict and, I am grateful for him being with me through it. But due to making this a long story short; I wonder many times what people would do if they were faced abruptly with the reality of their little children being abruptly seized and taken from them... like slavery...
I think men cope with this issue differently than 'a true natural mother'. I've seen many stories where some women don't seem to 'lose it' if their children are taken from them, some have abused their own children, and etc. But me, I lost it. I know what it's like to have your spirit broken. I went through hell. I was severely persecuted by my own family members because they wanted me to stay on the job, put my babies in day care... I fought for my college degree and career job... First AFrican American woman in the Shipyard as an Industrial Hygienist, etc. etc. etc. ... but when I couldn't find a decent babysitter, I kept my own babies... tough decision... Stay-at-home-Mom--- Penalty... YOU WOULD NOT BELIEVE IT IF I TOLD YOU... FAST FORWARD... When your enemies are your own people... and other step forward to help you.... Well, ... This American system is based on Colorism and White Supremacy... but that doesn't mean that Black people are not White Supremacist...
What some mothers will do for their children... When you're hungry, you gotta eat! ...
... I was thrown to the wolves...
13 hours ago, TSegal said:Let me interject here about the end times. A person does not have to read or study the Bible to see what's happening, although the Bible (from the Old Testament) has foretold what we can see as obvious today. For instance, God warned Israel (His chosen), that because they could not seem to stay focused on worshiping him throughout time, and chose to worship idols, he would cause them to go into captivity to another nation. That nation was Babylon, a cousin of Israel. And because Babylon mistreated His chosen during the captivity, he promised both - Babylon and His Chosen - that he would punish them all using a strange nation.
That nation was not yet developed nor were they desendents of the original people and tribes of the earth, who were mostly Black and brown.
22 Thus saith the Lord, Behold, a people cometh from the north country, and a great nation shall be raised from the sides of the earth.23 They shall lay hold on bow and spear; they are cruel, and have no mercy; their voice roareth like the sea; and they ride upon horses, set in array as men for war against thee, O daughter of Zion. (Jeremiah 6)This nation from the north are all European and Slavic peoples, who are white by nature. They have been a curse to brown and Black people since the time of the captivity in Babylon by traveling, plundering and pillaging the earth and other countries. They are warmongers, cruel and merciless, and still are. They have never been a spiritual people and have little to no connection to any Divine Being. They will fulfill the prophesy of the end times because they have developed the capabilities to destroy this earth using nukes, chemical and biological weapons.They rule the seas, and have perfected armies and the art of war.It's just a matter of time.@TSegal LOVE IT! AMEN.
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Just now, Kalexander2 said:
Can't help it, it's easy to get away, a privilege not afforded to most Blacks. Besides, I find them no fun to be around.
LOL I hear you, but for me, it's okay. There were times when I needed help, ... and guess who came to my rescue!?
Anyway, peace out! I'm going to force myself to go to sleep... somehow.
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Just now, Kalexander2 said:
Good for you! I can't help but see below the surface, of the deception, fickleness, and stupidity the people think they are concealing. I associate with white folk only when necessary and infrequent as possible in person.
LOL Don't do that!
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Just now, Chevdove said:
@Chevdove: It's perfectly okay if you were religious, I learn the seriousness of right wrong by both the rod and the Bible. As I alluded to before, your efforts are admirable and noble. Your frustration seems to be getting the best of you though.
We live in a world that has no pity for the downtrodden, nor mercy for the weak, especially if you're Black. The oppression we experience is often done with lies and deliberate misguidance through biblical scriptures. Unfortunately, you'll have to physically fight Black folk if you try to wake them up to that fact.
Fact is, passages from the Bible may soon prove to be useless when you hit the heart of your research project. Be prepared for hurt and disappointment. In case you may not have noticed, I'm a pessimist with no faith in mankind, Black, nor especially white folk. Yeah, like I said, if you have an idea about something on your mind, pursue it with vigor. But be honest with yourself first; whether it's worth your while and/or capable of changing how you feel.
Again, Thank you for your response.
LOL. I have to agree with much of what you just said!
So, I put on thick skin and get peace my own way!
I understand how people can be pessimistic but I find so much peace in focusing on the positive too in all kinds of people. I've had some crazy good experiences with White people too, and I focus on that too when I do research and deal with racism.
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@Chevdove: It's perfectly okay if you were religious, I learn the seriousness of right wrong by both the rod and the Bible. As I alluded to before, your efforts are admirable and noble. Your frustration seems to be getting the best of you though.
We live in a world that has no pity for the downtrodden, nor mercy for the weak, especially if you're Black. The oppression we experience is often done with lies and deliberate misguidance through biblical scriptures. Unfortunately, you'll have to physically fight Black folk if you try to wake them up to that fact.
Fact is, passages from the Bible may soon prove to be useless when you hit the heart of your research project. Be prepared for hurt and disappointment. In case you may not have noticed, I'm a pessimist with no faith in mankind, Black, nor especially white folk. Yeah, like I said, if you have an idea about something on your mind, pursue it with vigor. But be honest with yourself first; whether it's worth your while and/or capable of changing how you feel.
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Just now, Kalexander2 said:
Still, where do they match?
Ignore that statement. That was a mistake it came from the first page of this thread
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9 hours ago, Kalexander2 said:
Ah, a thin skin tender-foot. You know what they say you should do when it's too hot in the kitchen.
Your assertion(s), Chevdove, is an IDIOTIC CONSPIRACY THEORY. And that's a generous statement:
“The study’s analysis concluded that people do not tend to believe in a conspiracy theory because of the specifics of a scheme but rather because they possess higher-order beliefs that support conspiracist thinking in general. A strong distrust of authority would be one such overarching ideological lens. In a belief system in which authorities are fundamentally [a] untrustworthy alternative— even outlandish and contradictory—explanations for troubling events can seem plausible, as long as they are consistent with a skepticism toward the powers that be.”
Sound familiar?
You're taking your gift of human cognition to an UNHEALTHY EXTREME. Now I know you feel attacked and insulted, "and I don't care," but KEEP IT UP; you'll soon find yourself under the psychological scrutiny of white folk who just want to shut your big mouth up forcing psychotic drugs down your throat. That's lately become a political solution to extremist thinking. But suite yourself!
C
15 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:@Chevdove: It's perfectly okay if you were religious, I learn the seriousness of right wrong by both the rod and the Bible. As I alluded to before, your efforts are admirable and noble. Your frustration seems to be getting the best of you though.
We live in a world that has no pity for the downtrodden, nor mercy for the weak, especially if you're Black. The oppression we experience is often done with lies and deliberate misguidance through biblical scriptures. Unfortunately, you'll have to physically fight Black folk if you try to wake them up to that fact.
Fact is, passages from the Bible may soon prove to be useless when you hit the heart of your research project. Be prepared for hurt and disappointment. In case you may not have noticed, I'm a pessimist with no faith in mankind, Black, nor especially white folk. Yeah, like I said, if you have an idea about something on your mind, pursue it with vigor. But be honest with yourself first; whether it's worth your while and/or capable of changing how you feel.
okay and thank you for the advice.
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1 minute ago, Kalexander2 said:
It seems to me that what you're trying to do is illuminate social disparities in the world that religion ought to take a closer look at and prove it by showing how people use scripture, or miss the real messages.
Actually, I'm not a religious person, but I like what you saying about social disparities. I am very frustrated with the Church because they only present part truths. If they use the Bible as thier text, they should use the whole Bible and this is not the case. So absolutely, people use only part of the Bible and are missing the real messages. You are so right.
Yes, I get what you saying; My information, for example on BLUE EYES today, is scientifically proven by scientiest and published to be a mutation, but my research in connection to the Biblical description of Cain that matches the date today of the archeological evidence as being around 6000 years ago and found around the BLACK SEA, would be a theory. I agree with you on that. That is my conclusion and interpretation of the data provided. So yes, people need to draw their on conclusions.
I don't know where you are at right now--time zone-- but I am up at some ridiculous hours for the past weeks--my sleep is off. I can't sleep. I'm up researching. I need to go to sleep... but can't.
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5 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:
You're welcome. Though your research hasn't backed up anything. But now you, at least, have a thesis statement to guide your research. Good luck!
5 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:I hope that people will focus on the facts though, the reference that is presented and published, NOT BY ME, but by others. Anyway, again, I appreciate the interchange and the well wishes, I have so much more to present.
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14 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:
@Chevdove: What is the point, exactly? A reference? If so thanks for sharing. Or, a theory that science proves something in the Bible if so, you've failed to show it, still. No, they do not have the same conclusions. There's the Gnome Project right above where is it concluded that 'original sin, blue eyes' is in the Bible?
Okay, why would offer a reference, what's the reason, to show us scientific facts, stories from the Bible, or what? OR, are you trying to prove a point, namely, that "According to the Genome Project, the Bible proves that's original sin, satanism, white supremacy which affects all people is a scientific fact." Even the Bible doesn't prove that!
Just presenting scientific facts and this is crucial in any kind of research. People can draw any conclusion they choose but facts are based on evidence.
NEANDERTHALS and their presence today is a fact.Where they defined in published words compiled in the Bible; Yes, absolutely.
Do the dates quoted by scientist today match Bible accounts; Yes, absolutely.
So, my research, I choose to back up with both ancient records from the Bible, Egyptian records, and published scientifice works today.
Anyway, I do appreciate the interchange with you. thank you.
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16 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:
Science and theology do tend to be at odds, nothing anywhere can authenticate the validity of the Bible. Science validates theories through observation and experimenting with real tangible stuff. You can read the Bible, accept or reject it but you can't prove anything in it. Likewise, science can't prove anything in the Bible and does not require the Bible to prove anything.
But that is not th point. It is REFERENCE MATERIAL. The ancient published written works compiled in the Bible and dated are references that confirm the subject at hand; NEANDERTHALS. This is the point.
The GENOME PROJECT and the Bible have the same conclusions.
1 minute ago, Kalexander2 said:Right, your theory is "According to the Genome Project, the Bible proves that's original sin, satanism, white supremacy which affects all people is a scientific fact? Is that the thesis statement you're offering?"
The Genome Project does not prove original sin nor anything in the Bible.
The Bible did not predict 'blue eyes' nor does science prove God made Blue eyes. "6000 years ago' what? Blue eyes or what?
it's not about prediction; it about referencing published written works. This is a scholarly process that has been established for thousand of years--REFERENCING.
The Bible defines MUTATION and today's scientist discovered archeological proof around the BLACK SEA AREA of Black AFrican specimens that have DNA of BLUE EYES.
This is a proven MUTATION. It's dated 6000 years ago and that is the exact time span the Bible details Cain.
But that is not th point. It is REFERENCE MATERIAL. The ancient published written works compiled in the Bible and dated are references that confirm the subject at hand; NEANDERTHALS. This is the point.
The GENOME PROJECT and the Bible have the same conclusions.
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4 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:
Okay, you want me to prove your theory even though I disagree, OKAY.
Below is excepts for the project report, I've even highlighted some possible connections to the Bible but I fail to see how they support your thesis statement. What did I miss?
The Genome Project-Write- Jef D. Boeke*,
- George Church*,
- Andrew Hessel*,
- Nancy J. Kelley*,
- Adam Arkin,
- Yizhi Cai,
- Rob Carlson,
- Aravinda Chakravarti,
- Virginia W. Cornish,
- Liam Holt,
- Farren J. Isaacs,
- Todd Kuiken,
- Marc Lajoie,
- Tracy Lessor,
- Jeantine Lunshof,
- Matthew T. Maurano,
- Leslie A. Mitchell,
- Jasper Rine,
- Susan Rosser,
- Neville E. Sanjana,
- Pamela A. Silver,
- David Valle,
- Harris Wang,
- Jeffrey C. Way,
- Luhan Yang
See all authors and affiliations
Science 08 Jul 2016:
Vol. 353, Issue 6295, pp. 126-127
DOI: 10.1126/science.aaf6850The Human Genome Project (“HGP-read”), nominally completed in 2004, aimed to sequence the human genome and to improve the technology, cost, and quality of DNA sequencing (1, 2). It was biology's first genome-scale project and at the time was considered controversial by some. Now, it is recognized as one of the great feats of exploration, one that has revolutionized science and medicine.
Although sequencing, analyzing, and editing DNA continue to advance at a breakneck pace, the capability for constructing DNA sequences in cells is mostly limited to a small number of short segments, which restricts the ability to manipulate and understand biological systems. Further understanding of genetic blueprints could come from construction of large, gigabase (Gb)-sized animal and plant genomes, including the human genome, which would, in turn, drive development of tools and methods to facilitate large-scale synthesis and editing of genomes. To this end, we propose the Human Genome Project-Write (HGP-write), named to honor HGP-read but embracing synthesis of all large genomes.
Responsible Innovation
Genome synthesis is a logical extension of the genetic engineering tools that have been used safely within the biotech industry for ∼40 years and have provided important societal benefits. However, recent technological advancements—e.g., standardized gene parts, whole-genome synthesis, and clustered regularly interspaced short palindromic repeats (CRISPR)-Cas9 genome editing technology (3, 4)—are revolutionizing the field (5). Some applications are controversial; human germline editing in particular has raised intense moral debate (6). As human genome-scale synthesis appears increasingly feasible, a coordinated scientific effort to understand, discuss, and apply large-genome engineering technologies is timely. HGP-write will require public involvement and consideration of ethical, legal, and social implications (ELSI) from the start. Responsible innovation requires more than ELSI, though, and involves identifying common goals important to scientists and the wider public through timely and detailed consultation among diverse stakeholders.
We will enable broad public discourse on HGP-write; having such conversations well in advance of project implementation will guide emerging capabilities in science and contribute to societal decision-making. Through open and ongoing dialogue, common goals can be identified. Informed consent must take local and regional values into account and enable true decision-making on particularly sensitive use of cells and DNA from certain sources. Finally, the highest biosafety standards should guide project work and safety for lab workers and research participants, and ecosystems should pervade the design process. A priority will be cost reduction of both genome engineering and testing tools to aid in equitable distribution of benefits—e.g., enabling research on crop plants and infectious agents and vectors in developing nations.
To ensure responsible innovation and ongoing consideration of ELSI, a percentage of all research funds could be dedicated to these issues, enabling inclusive decision-making on the topics mentioned above (7). In addition, there should be equitable distribution of any early and future benefits in view of diverse and pressing needs in different global regions. The broad scope and novelty of the project call for consideration of appropriate regulation alongside development of the science and societal debates. National and international laws and regulations differ, and as in stem cell research, a major burden of responsibility for setting standards rests with the scientists and their community. Existing stem cell research guidelines (8) may serve as a useful template.
From Observation to Action
The primary goal of HGP-write is to reduce the costs of engineering and testing large genomes (0.1 billion to 100 billion base pairs) in cell lines to 1/1000th of previous efforts within 10 years. This will include whole-genome engineering of human cell lines and other organisms of agricultural and public health significance or those needed to interpret human biological functions—i.e., gene regulation, genetic diseases, and evolutionary processes.
This goal is necessarily ambitious, because building a human genome at today's prices would cost more than HGP-read (9) (see fig. S1). However, an expectation of HGP-write is that a sharp price drop will be catalyzed as new technology development occurs apace with advancement of the project, as with the cost of DNA sequencing in HGP-read. Small viral (10) and bacterial (11) genomes synthesized from scratch and organisms with recoded genomes (12) derived from large-scale genome editing (13) have demonstrated the feasibility and utility of synthetic genomes. By focusing on building the 3 Gb of human DNA, HGP-write would push current conceptual and technical limits by orders of magnitude and deliver important scientific advances.
HGP-write will aim to address a number of human health challenges. Potential applications include growing transplantable human organs; engineering immunity to viruses in cell lines via genome-wide recoding (12); engineering cancer resistance into new therapeutic cell lines; and accelerating high-productivity, cost-efficient vaccine and pharmaceutical development by using human cells and organoids. The project could encourage broad intellectual property access via patent pooling. Extreme cost-reduction is feasible, as demonstrated by the $1000 genome grant program (2), as well as sharing of CRISPR tools from over 80 labs through www.addgene.org. Furthermore, because DNA synthesis, like sequencing and computation, is foundational technology, HGP-write could also facilitate biological engineering of many organisms, accelerating research and development (R&D) across a broad spectrum of life sciences and supporting basic R&D of new bio-based therapies, vaccines, materials, energy sources, disease vector control, and nutrition.
.
Pilot Projects
Similarly to other Gb-scale genomic projects, including HGP-read, ENCODE (which aims to map genome functional elements), and Sc2.0 (which is synthesizing a heavily edited yeast genome) (14, 15), HGP-write would be conducted in phases with explicit goals and metrics. Each of the earlier large-scale projects began with pilot projects focused on a fraction of the genome, typically ∼1%. For HGP-write, the pilots should provide resources of immediate value for advanced biomedical research and/or biotech development. Technology development will likely also occur early in the project to propel large-scale genome design and engineering.
A series of pilot projects making use of very long DNA sequences that are nonetheless short of a full genome are anticipated: (i) synthesizing “full” gene loci with accompanying noncoding DNA to help explain still-enigmatic roles of noncoding DNA variants in regulating gene expression and leading to more comprehensive models for the role of noncoding genetic variation in common human diseases and traits; (ii) constructing specific chromosomes—e.g., chromosome 21—or complex cancer genotypes to more comprehensively model human disease; (iii) producing specialized chromosomes encoding one or several pathways—e.g., all genes needed to make a prototrophic human cell or pathways to transform the pig genome to make it more amenable as a source for human organ transplantation; (iv) a potential transformation of gene therapy, with freedom to deliver many genes and control circuits to improve safety and efficacy, provided that delivery challenges can be met. Indeed, many substantial and useful innovations may be realized in such “stepping-stone” projects that are short of whole-genome reengineering but require substantial improvement in synthesis capacity of Mb- to Gb-sized DNA. Both genome-wide and more modest changes could be tested for their impact on, e.g., organoid development and function in vitro, facilitated by ongoing progress in stem cell differentiation and “organ-on-a-chip” technologies. Novel cell culture technologies may, in some cases, be many times more cost-effective and accurate than current whole-organism testing.
Additional pilot projects being considered include (v) using induced pluripotent stem cells (16) to construct an “ultrasafe” human cell line via comprehensive recoding of protein-coding regions and deletion of corresponding genome features to increase safety of such a cell line (see the box); and (vi) developing a homozygous reference genome bearing the most common pan-human allele (or allele ancestral to a given human population) at each position to develop cells powered by “baseline” human genomes. Comparison with this baseline will aid in dissecting complex phenotypes, such as disease susceptibility. The pervasive nature of the required changes makes whole- or partial-genome synthesis an efficient route to these goals.
Project Launch and Administration
The goal is to launch HGP-write in 2016 with $100 million in committed support, from public, private, philanthropic, industry, and academic sources from around the world. The costs of the project lie not only in obtaining de novo synthesized DNA but in the assembly, integration, and functional assays required to evaluate and understand the modified genomes. Total project costs are difficult to estimate but would likely be less than the $3 billion cost of HGP-read.
HGP-write could be implemented through one or more centers [similar to Centers of Excellence in Genomic Science (CEGS) and the Brain Research through Advancing Innovative Neurotechnologies (BRAIN) initiative centers] that will coordinate and support formation and work of multi-institutional and interdisciplinary research teams working in a highly integrated fashion responsive to and engaged with a broad public outreach.
We celebrate 2016—the 25th anniversary of HGP-read—as a major step forward for human knowledge and health. In this spirit, we look forward to the launch of HGP-write.
Excellent. No it's not my theory, the GENOME PROJECT is scientific fact. But again, I've added about the mutation of BLUE EYES.
I forgot to add that the date scientist provide is 6000 years ago; that is the exact dating of CAIN.
... another finding today that supports the Bible on THE
ORIGINAL SIN in reference to CAIN. Recently scientiest also found archeological specimens around the BLACK SEA area and,
DNA analysis proves them to have the DNA of an African-typed man, and with BLUE EYES. Scientist know now through
these findings that BLUE EYES stem from BLACK PRESENCE because pre-Adamah beings did not have blue eyes!!!
And they further know that Blue eyes are the result of a mutation.
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1 minute ago, Kalexander2 said:
Now we've gotten somewhere, but I don't know where we are.
Prove it, you've already described where in the Bible, but describe now; where, in the Genome Project report support your thesis statement? Quote it!
All you need to do is google it. This GENOME PROJECT was released to the public I believe in 2012, so it's common knowledge now.
There are so many links and I do plan to present references from secular sources, only now, I choose to concentrate on the Bible.
as you did post the OXFORD DICTIONARY definition of INTERSEXED all of what I am saying here is so easy to check yourself.
But I would love to add on to this subject right now and also add another finding today that supports the Bible on THE
ORIGINAL SIN in reference to CAIN. Recently scientiest also found archeological specimens around the BLACK SEA area and,
DNA analysis proves them to have the DNA of an African-typed man, and with BLUE EYES. Scientist know now through
these findings that BLUE EYES stem from BLACK PRESENCE because pre-Adamah beings did not have blue eyes!!!
And they further know that Blue eyes are the result of a mutation.
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4 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:
The Human Genome Project is a global, long-term research effort to identify the estimated 30,000 genes in human DNA (deoxyribonucleic acid) and to figure out the sequences of the chemical bases that make up human DNA.
How, what are your findings?
These are a psychological phenomenon that can be explained through science, most of it anyway, not biblical in nature.
Yes. The Bible supports the science of today.
The GENOME PROJECT has successfully mapped a portion of NEANDERTHAL DNA.
The major confirmation is sort of ironic; when I was young, I heard most of the Church goers, Blacks, say
that CAIN WAS CURSED and turned BLACK, but the science of today proves that could not be possible; based
on the GENOME PROJECT and so many other facts; the presence of the NEANDERTHALS and that they could not
produce a VIABLE MALEFACTOR amazingly confirms the bible account of GENESIS 3:15.
Prior to the modern mankind, there was no VIABLE MALE REPRODUCTION going on!!!-- Not until the African man
was on the earth in recent human history!!!
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5 minutes ago, Kalexander2 said:
That's a mere statement, not a proposition nor a thesis statement. All research, scientific or otherwise must have bases; or the reason(s) for the research.
For example:
Thesis: The Bible and science often reference information within of each, neither is purely part of the other.
Proof (or premise): Science is the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment. Whereas the Bible the Christian scriptures, consisting of the Old and New Testaments "stories"; or the Jewish scriptures, consisting of the Torah or Law, the Prophets, and the Hagiographa or Writings.Further development will involve details of my proof that "The Bible and science often reference within of each, neither is purely part of the other." which is why your replies are so confusing. While there's no need to complete and formal, it's only courtesy to provide a base for your assertions.
Oh, and I was wrong to assume the original post was yours. You're just another commentator, as I.
That the Neanderthal that had sex with Eve was White.
or more scientifically put ALBINO.
The GENOME PROJECT supports my findings and it also supports the Bible account of THE ORIGINAL SIN.
Also, Science is observational as well. Look around you, what do you see; a world filled with racism and Colorism. This beginning
of this phenomena revolves around SATANISM. SATANISM and WHITE SUPREMACY is one and the same. We are all, whether we are White, or
African, affected by this REPRODUCTION that occurred of which the Biblical account of it I referenced in GENESIS 3:15.
Is. America. The. Beast,Revelations-13
in Culture, Race & Economy
Posted
That is hard. May I ask how old were you when this happened? You are right though, I agree. At some point, there needs to be some kind of accountabilty, that was your father. No wonder many Black women don't know how to feel...about our fathers, Black men. Sometimes, adult mothers are so caught into the hardship they deal with, they lose sight of their role, still, as nurturers and they keep the cycle going. For you, you had daughters, so you were put right back in under the role. But for me, I did not have daughters, but, I always think about how to react to young girls especially the ones that my sons interact with.
It scares me to think that I would be as cold to younger Black women or girls in general, in the way I felt my mother treated me.
@Pioneer1
@Kalexander2
Okay . LOL! Can I ask for a Time out here!!!
I just want to make a comment to men, and since you both are commenting in this thread, it seems good to direct it to you both:
I feel that as @Mel Hopkins stated, that black mothers should take the blame for bad behavior. And, if Black men care so much about the Black woman being victimized, what about the victims striking at children--the victims? What role should Black men take in this REALITY? Shouls you just stand by and say nothing, do nothing, just feel sorry for the whole group without making any intervention?
I feel strongly about this issue here. Shouldn't Black men, fathers do something in this situation? Don't you realize that some Black women are dangerously abusive to the Black child? They strike at the child, and take out their being victimize on the Black child? I feel that Black men should do something too, help out the Black children too, when this kind of abuse is going on. This kind of abuse is incredibly prevalent, I feel, in the Black culture.