Pioneer1

Neely Fuller has said for decades that the biggest and LAST trick of White Supremacy....is to try and fool people of color about their sexuality and get them sexually confused.

Let me make a correction on that statement you quoted that I didn't notice until you quoted it: I meant to write if he were banging them and HE were smiling, not if I were smiling. Other than that, my statement still stands. As long as they were above puberty and he didn't physically force himself on them, he's not a monster in my opinion. Would I have done it? No Do I think it was inappropriate? Maybe However like I said, I judge a man on the wealth of his deeds not on bits and snippets and again, as far as I'm concerned his sexual behavior was between him, them, Sister Clara Muhammad, and The Supreme Being Who will be his ultimate Judge. Stop thinking like your oppressor who believes that having sex with someone is the worst thing in the world. They'll go to a nation and slaughter THOUSANDS of people....men, women, and children with weapons.....and get called a "hero". But if that same person instead decided to grab someone and f*ck them instead of killing them, they would be called the worst of scum. Why? Because SEX is the "orignal sin" in the Caucasian psyche......not violence. Which is why graphic violence is allowed on U.S. televison but nudity isn't. Stop thinking like your oppressor Del. A man who has sex a lot of indiscriminate sex isn't the worst person in the world. Chev Professor Griff was a member of the 80s/90s rap group Public Enemy.

While I'm doing that.....maybe YOU should look up the words LIBEL and SLANDER.

Del I didn't say people who knew you thought you were gay. I'm just accepting what YOU revealed about yourself about people thinking you were gay (whether they took time to get to know you or not)......and offered an explaination as to possibly why. Perhaps it was how you carried yourself moreso than your intellectual abilities. Instead of trying to read INTO what I write....why not simply READ what I write and take it as is, lol.

Del Do you know why Professor Grif was kicked out of PE? According to what he's said it was because Chuck and some others were pressured into kicking him out over alleged anti-semitic remarks he made while in Europe. 　 Who told you a self acknowledged drug dealer was a 5%. Do you know why they are called 5 percenters? Lol..... That MUST be a rhetorical question. Why in the world would I tell you about an organization I didn't know about myself???? Jay-Z repeatedly refers to himself as "god" and "cipher" in his songs. And there are many who claim the Five Percent who also sell drugs, smoke weed, and steal. They are called "POOR Righteous Teachers" because poor doesn't just mean financially poor but also a term used for empathy. What's your source.  I never heard any called cipher growing up. Do you know what it means? Because they would stand around in circles (cipher = 0) and recite the Nation of Islam lessons. Cynique As for you treatise about Elijah Muhammad and the black Muslims having more impact on black America than any other organization, 　 I never said that. Lol, you really need to stop yawning and pay attention.

Del Didn't you just say in this very thread: "I have people tell me I am quirky, non aggressive , sensitive, good cook, good dancer, psychic, smart. So for a lot of people that makes me gay." Apparently the projections aren't coming from me. I'm not "a lot of people"....only one person...who has no idea as to your sexual orientation and not terribly concerned about it, lol. As for my Korean friend..... I left him back on the Westcoast but we still keep in touch from time to time. Lol, do you you want his phone number??

Since YOU seem to be their designated spokesman, if I had any questions for them I'd probably just ask YOU....lol. BTW......... Troy and Del A little bit of information you may find interesting. Since you both grew up Uptown in the 70s you DO realize that many of the rappers like Jay Z, Nas, and Poor Righteous Teachers as well as many others belong to a Nation of Islam splinter group known as "the nation of gods and earths" or "Five Percenters" right? This group was started back in the 60s in Harlem when one of Elijah Muhammad's ministers Clarence 13X was put out of the Nation of Islam and decided to start his own organization using much of the Nation of Islam's teachings but with fewer restrictions. It became really popular with many of the young people in the streets and it heavily influenced rap music. Erykah Badu and the Wu Tang Clan also are adherents to the Five Percent Nation. They often call eachother "god" and "cipher".

Flip It Cynique I'm always suspicious of male homophobes. i'm among those who wonder if these guys hate gay men because the latter make them question their own manhood. .....and THIS, from the same person who said in another thread: "Political correctness is becoming as stifling as those it targets. It is totally shutting down comedy and satire, forbidding people to laugh at the foibles of the human condition. " https://aalbc.com/tc/topic/5550-kevin-hart-shows-some-heart/ 　 So which is it Lady Liberty? Should people have the right to express their own opinion without being shamed, or does any attempt to criticize homosexuality deserve your suspicion as being homophobic????

Naaaaah...... All attempts at diversion will fail, lol. YOU started this thread accusing MLK of having affairs with BOTH men and women, and when challenged to produce evidence of this so far you haven't been able to. Any further points you'd like to make before this case is laid to rest?

.....just as long as you don't confuse SUPPORTING Black women with actually PROTECTING them. People in distress need a police officer not a damn cheerleader, lol.

Lol...... Is that your "scenic route" way of saying that you actually HAVE NO OTHER sources or evidence of those homosexual allegations against Malik Shabazz outside of some "book" you forgot the name of as well as ABSOLUTELY NO sources to back up your allegation that King was involved with men? So you're just gonna go right ahead and put those accusations out there anyway huh???? Well......I'm a little disappointed that you'd do that.

Yes but look how it took a brother like NICK CANNON to come to Kevin's rescue and point out the hypocrisy of some of the same Caucasian women like Chelsea Handler and Amy Schumer who calling Hart "homophobic" but were actually using gay slurs in the past THEMSELVES ! https://www.essence.com/celebrity/nick-cannon-defends-kevin-hart-over-homophobic-tweets/ I have much respect for Nick Cannon for this one. @Chevdove Chev Did you know that the United States and other Western nations are now THREATENING to cut aid and humanitarian resources off from many African and Carribean nations unless they change their policies and start accepting homosexuality and transgenderism in their societies? Homosexuality is being actively promoted toward people of color in both Africa and Asia.

I'll tell you why.....right AFTER you tell me why if Malik (whom you still call "Malcolm") "told it like it was" and was the example of a real man who reminded you of a father figure then why the hell didn't YOU join the movement so that you could either MEET a man like that or support it simply to encourage them to keep producing more men like that. Don't wait 50 years later when Malik has gone off the scene to start praising him as a real "man's man". You had your opportunity to do it when he was alive. The only reason you CLAIM to respect and admire him now is because he's gone and not on this site calling you out on your hypocrisy. As to your other question....... Besides the man you CLAIM to admire so much, Elijah and the NOI produced: Muhammad Ali one of the world's greatest boxers Naim Akbar one of the world's greatest AfroAmerican psychologists Kareem Adul Jabbar one of the world's greatest basketball players Minister Louis Farrakhan who in 1995 organized the largest demonstration ever to be held in Washington D.C. The Black Panthers came out of the Nation of Islam The fact that so many Black people call eachother "brother" and "sister" today is as a result of the Nation of Islam. The fact that so many Black people call eachother "Black" today instead of "colored" or "Negro" is as a result of the influence of the Nation of Islam Much of Rap and Hiphop and artists like the Wu Tang Clan, Ice Cube, and Public Enemy are a product of those who've accepted the teachings of the Nation of Islam. Ungrateful woman...... You need to STOP getting it twisted and recognize that it was ELIJAH MUHAMMAD and his organization who cleaned up the man you CLAIM you admire today.....stopped him from being a pimp, drug dealer, and abuser of women and helped make him the man the world remembers today. If you wanna start condemning organizations that abuse young children, take your ass to the nearest Catholic church and START THERE and perhaps you may have just a little more credibility with me.

Perhaps you're right. I haven't been to Africa yet so I'm not sure how the majority of people on that continent actually look. However going by most of the Africans I've seen and met HERE in the United States....they tend to have nicer skin and better physiques that most of the AfroAmericans I've seen. Keep in mind I keep saying "MOST" because I've seen a lot of beautiful fit AfroAmericans and some busted Africans, lol.

Chev A CHILD SHOULD NOT BE FORCED TO HAVE SEX WITH A GROWN ASS MAN! Hey, I agree 100% And if any man is found to have forced himself on a child sexually he should be punished.

Del It is speculation about whether both Malcolm X and MLK had homosexual experiences. Well WHO is doing the "speculating"? Again, can you provide me a source.....preferably a more credible source than Gay Edgar, lol? I've only read in ONE BOOK that came out decades after Malik's departure that accuses him of some sort of homosexual encounter, and only then it merely IMPLIES that he "went into a room with a man and locked the door for the night" or something of that nature if my memory serves me correct. Other than that book, nothing else. WHERE did you hear about Malik or Martin engaging in HOMOSEXUAL relationships? Chev I can understand part of what you say here! I feel that there is a serious problem with how we as BLACK AMERICANS have been conditioned to go against the BLACK MALE LEADERSHIP! But, on the other hand, if Black men have bought into that old timey DOMINATE BLACK WOMEN SYNDROME, then they do not need to be leaders. When we speak of leadership....the onus is on the leader and what they do. When we speak of domination...the onus is on the followers and it implies that those followers are being FORCED into their position. A good leader doesn't have to FORCE his/her followers into submission. If they are a good leader the people will naturally respect their leadership and will WANT to follow them. Also...... Keep in mind when I think of Black male leadership I don't think of ALL Black men dominating and ruling over ALL Black women. I think of a few QUALIFIED Black men (along with qualified Black women to help) leading and ruling over the majority of both Black males and females with justice. Just like you can't exclude the female, neither can you exclude the male....which is what many are trying to do today. There is no properly leadership without the influence and input of BOTH genders male and female. There must be a balance.

Chev Naaaaah Alice honey, you aren't going to take me down THAT rabbit hole......LOL. I'm going to focus on MY POINT that Elijah Muhammad and the Lost Found Nation of Islam was one of the most effective forces in reforming and advancing the socio-economnic status of the masses of poor Black America in the 20th century and his personal indiscretions will not change nor tarnish that fact. All this about discussion about which age is the most appropriate for marriage and how soon should a female have sex and puberty and menstration and all of that.....I'm not going there. Just like I told our brother Nubian as he tries to engage me over the relevance of African traditions, I'm not going there. I'll sit back and observe, but don't expect me to actively participate.

Well stop screaming...lol. Perhaps I answered too quickly and didn't grasp the full meaning of your question so I will RE-answer it. If that man.....or any man....sexually FORCES himself on my teenaged daughter I would seriously injure or kill that man. Does that answer your question?

Del have people tell me I am quirky, non aggressive , sensitive, good cook, good dancer, psychic, smart. So for a lot of people that makes me gay. Naahhh, I'm not sure if I buy that one. I grew up in an AfroAmerican community and have lived in and interacted with AfroAmerican communities all over the nation so I'm qualified to say that just about the only way a man gets labled "gay" in the Black community (besides actually being gay) is: a) If you exhibit feminine mannerisms commonly associated with females like how you talk, sit, hand gestures, ect... or b) Exhibit behavior that may be perceived as cowardice when challenged like always running from and trying to avoid physical confrontations Now understand that I DON'T agree with these assumptions because a man could be gay as hell and still be maculine and brave, however those traits I outlined above are what usually gets males labled as "gay" in most Black American communities. ....not being smart, knowing how to cook, or reading a lot. I may not have your smarts but my mother taught me how to read at 3 years of age and have loved reading ever since. I was rarely seen without a book even while growing up in the hood and even now but my masculinity was NEVER called into question. So whether it's justified or not, it's how you carry yourself that makes people question your sexual and gender status not how smart you are. Troy I share your observations that AfroAmerican men tend not to socialize with eachother for the heck of it as much as AfroAmerican women do. Especially those of the lower socio-economic classes. And probably for the same reasons me and Del was talking about. Many AfroAmerican men of lower socio-economic status think it's not very masculine for men to bunch up together and just sit around and talk with eachother....and would probably see it as a form of GOSSIP....not realizing the importance of NETWORKING. AfroAmerican men will get together when a CLEAR PURPOSE FOR MEETING is given; like to discuss a business opportunity, to plan some sort of event, or to discuss a particular problem. But to just get together and chit-chat for the hell of it, most brothers aren't into that. There ususally has to be a clear purpose or goal in mind.

Nubian Brother you make many good and valid points, however most of them are IRRELEVANT in relationship to the point I'm making. Cannibalism and whether or not we should adopt ancient African traditions have little to nothing to do with MY POINT that we should judge a man by a balance of his ENTIRE life's work instead of condemning him simply for his infrequent episodes of misconduct. Also, although I don't advocate it as the most ideal system I wouldn't entirely dismiss the idea of arranged marriage. Sometimes your parents and elders know YOU better than you know yourself in your youthful ignorance and immaturity and thus they may know more about what and who is best for you in the long run. Many times I've had older men in my family warn me about the character of certain females I was involved with that I later found they were right on point because they were wise enough and had been around long enough to KNOW better than I had.

Del Yes it is true it's called mores or morals. Which are universal for any given culture and and time. However you can't compare across cultures and temporally it can break down over time. Mores and morals are NOT "universal" across cultures. Different cultures have different ethical and moral codes. Hell, even the SAME culture often will change their morals over time as they advance or decline. Homosexuality was once illegal and condemned in Western culture, now it's generally accepted. 　 You have your own code of what you consider ethical. We clearly inhabit different world's. You're absolutely right about this. As you said I have my OWN code, and you don't. You seem to be using SOMEONE ELSE'S code for your ethics instead of using the brain that The Supreme Being gave you to define your own ethics. 　 　 Nubian As I said earlier, I don't advocate for arranged marriages or marrying girls off to older men, it was more of an attempt to put things into historic perspective; however look at the people who come from those nations and compare the stability and productivity of THEIR families to the stability and productivity of the average AfroAmerican family. Do we have any room to criticize them and how they are doing things? Since integration AfroAmericans collectively have ATTEMPTED to model our family structure after the Caucasian families we see around us hoping it will work for us the same way it has worked for them. It's only led to 50 years of failure, broken families, and dyfunction. You can criticize arranged marriage and the suppression of women in African cultures all day long but African families are in a heck of a lot better shape that most Black American families. Their divorce rate is much lower, their households make more money, and the children function better in school than the average AfroAmerican family. The nuclear family structure CLEARLY doesn't work for us. I personally think was as a people need to sit down and intelligently design a brand new family structure specific to our people and our unique circumstance here in America.

Del Sally Hemnibgs The only people who bring up Sally Hemmings are OTHER BLACK PEOPLE. Most White people sweep that issue under the rug, act as if it never existed, and rarely if ever mention it except when a Black person brings it up and forces them to acknowledge it. See, they protect THEIR own historic figures from shame and ridicule. We should do the same. Again, I ask you WHERE did you hear about Martin sleeping with MEN? Can you show me a source? I haven't even heard that one from the FBI ! Or why aren't there more women dictators. Well, just look at the average AfroAmerican household being governed by the authoritarian rule of the single Black mother. Then ask yourself would the entire world be better off if it were functioning like you see that household, lol.

Delano Lol..... Here you go again speaking for and advocating the issues of Black women. We currently have atlest 3 AfroAmerican women who frequent this forum, yet you reliably seem to feel Black women need YOU as their advocate and spokesperson. My question for you is what exactly is it about THIS particular article that grabbed your attention?

Chev 　 So, it wouldn't matter if he was banging your young daughter, --along with other young girls--just that he did a good job as a contractor working on your house? Great question. Yes, his behavior as it relates to my daughter WOULD be a concern of mine....it it were brought up. I seriously doubt a subject like that would be brought to my or any other customer's attention unless that contractor's competitors or enemies were trying to launch a smear campaign against them. However, even with all of that...... If he was good enough at his job and wealthy enough, depending on my daughter's age I just MIGHT consider whether or not he'd make a good HUSBAND and PROVIDER for my daughter! In the old days, men actually LOOKED to marry their daughters to successful accomplished men with the understanding that they liked sex and would be having sex with them. I'm sure you remember that in the older days some of our grandmothers and great grandmother's were being married BY THEIR FATHERS to older men at 15 and 16 years of age! I don't advocate that, however from their perspective I'm sure they were looking out for their and their children's interests by trying to pair them with men they thought would take care of them. We all must understand something..... In historic Caucasian society sexhas been condemned as nasty and filthy and the worse thing you can do to a person; which is some of the worst insults revolve around giving peope the finger and saying "f-you". This is why historically they have had so many sexually dysfunctional societies. We need to define OUR OWN codes of morality.

Just like Mel, I rest MY case from the previous thread at how Delano and the ladies seem to always take eachothers sides and have eachothers' backs. Like Stevie Wonder said: This is more than a coincidence or a lucky chance...... Del you are confusing your lack of knowledge with information. And YOU are confusing mere information....actually DISINFORMATION....with verified FACTS. Again, I asked you what CREDIBLE sources you got this from and you listed Hoover's FBI. ((shakes head)) Del and Cynque I can't believe you two just sat up there and attempted to legitimize Hoover and his COINTEL program! I see how readily you accept information coming from an organization who at the time ADMITED they were putting out lies and disinformation to sway the public against Civil Rights organizations and it's leaders and divide them against eachother. Mel So much for being a leader when you can't even handle your own family business It's funny how you almost NEVER hear the leadership of poweful and wealthy White men like George Washington or Thomas Jefferson being questioned by White society because of who they slept with. Hell, Trump can sleep with whoever he wants and STILL ends up President with major support. Sometimes I believe some of you are just looking for any excuse to de-legitimize and tear down the authority of Black male leadership. Any lies and accusations are good enough to do the job in your minds.