Black American vs AfroAmerican

[Pioneer1]

 

On 1/23/2026 at 1:33 PM, aka Contrarian said:

Of course "high yellows"should not be given preferential treatment. But neither should their skin color automatically disqualify them for representing their people in beauty pageants, etc.

There are universal standards of beauty that have nothing to do with color, and the "cuteness" trait is found among all species. 

It depends on who "their people" are, or what people you are referring to.

There are 2 distinct groups in the United States who are closely linked to eachother and usually overlap:  Black American and AfroAmericans.

Black Americans are....as the title implies....people of the Black race who are American citizens.
AfroAmericans are the descendants of enslaved Africans who are primarily Black but mixed with other races to various degrees.
Almost to the point that many aren't even Black at all.

Miss "AfroAmerica" can feature light skinned contestants but not Miss Black America, in my opinion ofcourse.

[ProfD]

2 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

There are 2 distinct groups in the United States who are closely linked to eachother and usually overlap:  Black American and AfroAmericans.

Right. Back in the day, I remember when Jamaican dudes didn't have too much love for their AfroAmerican brothas. The tension was high and killings were real.

 

It has calmed down over time. There's still not a solid alliance between AfroAmericans and Black Americans.

[Pioneer1]

16 minutes ago, ProfD said:

Right. Back in the day, I remember when Jamaican dudes didn't have too much love for their AfroAmerican brothas. The tension was high and killings were real.

Squo?

I didn't know West Indians were beefing like THAT on the Eastcoast, lol.

In Michigan they didn't have much to do with AfroAmericans and there was often tension on jobs, but the only time you'd hear about a Jamaican or Haitian killing somebody is if there was some sort of criminal activity involved like rival drug gangs.

Infact, I didn't see a lot of real West Indian gangsters until  I started going to Canada.
In America, most of the West Indians tended to be well educated and professional.....or business owners like restaurants and small shops.
It wasn't until I went to Toronto and saw a bunch of bruthaz in standing on the corner smoking weed and looking like the Wu Tang Clan in dreadlocks. 
I stopped to greet them and couldn't understand WHAT them niggaz were saying...lol




"Whatta bumba clotta chat meh fa???"

 

Neely Fuller Jr. said, try to talk to the WRONG Black man on the street and you'll end up getting chased DOWN the street....lol.

[aka Contrarian]

 

12 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

...There are 2 distinct groups in the United States who are closely linked to eachother and usually overlap:  Black American and AfroAmericans.

 

@Pioneer1Whatever. In my tribal designations, Black American and African American are interchangeable and are terms that refer to this countries slave descendants. "Afro -American" is simply a generic slang.

Immigrant Africans and their American-born offspring  are simply identified by their countries such as Nigerians and Kenyans . Actually, their surnames alone brand them. They are pure Africans who come to America and take advantage of the rights and benefits that the ancestors of the hybrid slave descents known as Black/African Americans fought and died for and, in my opinion, are like carpetbaggers.

Bottom line, there is no official termnology, and no consensus when it comes to categorizing America's negroid population. To white racists, of course, a nigger is a nigger.

 

The "Miss-fill-in-the-bank" pageants are just a lot of overrated superficial frivolity that set their own standards and rules. So be it.

 

As far the entertainment industry goes, like in every other sector, it appears that people of color in this country will just have to settle for whatever their minority status warrants.

The Oscars have just patted them on the head by recognizing  the black-produced movie "Sinners" with 16 nominations.

Eat your crumbs and move on.

[Pioneer1]

To most ignorant hardcore racists (some would argue that all racists are ignorant....but that's not so) Black is Black and it doesn't matter what a Black person calls themselves or what country they came from.

I said to the IGNORANT ones.

But the SOPHISTICATED and ELITE racists think differently.
They know that DIVIDE AND CONQUER is a strategy that has worked for them excellently over time, so they continue to employ it.

They may not like any Black people but they like some better than others based on their ability to use them and profit off of them.

For work, Africans are preferred.
For entertainment and AfroAmericans are preferred.

[Troy]

5 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Black Americans are....as the title implies....people of the Black race who are American citizens.

 

Here again, your love for this arbitrary term leads to nonsensical conclusions. There is no meaningful difference between Black American, African American. Afro American, Colored American, or Negro American the terms change over time and to white people we are still all spooks LOL!

 

Being "Black" is about how and where you were raised our shared cultural experiences and here in American the legacy of enslavement is part of the culture. Booting people out of the ethnicity because you think their lips are too thin makes no sense.

[Pioneer1]

Troy

Here again, your love for this arbitrary term leads to nonsensical conclusions. There is no meaningful difference between Black American, African American. Afro American, Colored American, or Negro American the terms change over time and to white people we are still all spooks LOL!
 

This is what happens when you don't control your own narrative.

With the exception of "AfroAmerican", most of those terms are titles GIVEN to us by White people
Titles that are not only inaccurate but confusing.
 

Dr. Amos Wilson said:


"Power is the ability to define reality and to have other people respond to your definition as if it were their own."
 

It's not about what THEY call us, but what WE choose to start calling ourselves that give whatever term we choose to use real meaning.

Now a lot of AfroAmericans are choosing to call themselves FBA which....although still not too accurate....carries more respect because it's a name we choose for ourselves instead of being branded with it like "negro" or "colored".
 

 

 

 

 

 

Being "Black" is about how and where you were raised our shared cultural experiences and here in American the legacy of enslavement is part of the culture.
 

If this is the case, what about the Sudanese or Congolese who came to the United States after 1965?
Since they aren't part of the culture or shared legacy of slavery, are THEY Black?
 

[aka Contrarian]

Nobody I know uses the term "Afro-American". As far as I'm concerned, it is an obsolete label  like - "jive-assed nigga". 

 

Over the past 50+years, "Black" is the most common word used  when referring to America's  slave descendants.  Previously, Whites soliciously refrained from publicly calling us what was considered a derogatory term until we started calling ourselves that via the "Black is Beautiful" slogan embraced by the Black Panthers who took their cue from Malcom X. This all took place back in the late 1960s, and from that time forward we, as a people, proudly became "Black" with a capital "B"; going from an adjective to a noun.

The idea of blackness being "a state of mind" also came about  during this era, presumably to promote inclusiveness, especially since such dynamic activists as Huey Newton, Angela Davis, and Malcom, himself, were light-skinned.

 

In the present, calling negroid Immigrants  "African" suffices, because that is what they are, and nobody is confused as to what segment of the American population is being referred to when using that description.

This applies to West Indians as well.

[ProfD]

42 minutes ago, aka Contrarian said:

Nobody I know uses the term "Afro-American". As far as I'm concerned, it is an obsolete label  like - "jive-assed nigga". 

Well, you don't know me in real life but I think we're cool in this virtual realm. 

 

I use FBA/AfroAmerican quite a bit to differentiate FBA (Foundational Black Americans) aka descendants of slaves from our Black brothas & sistas from abroad.

 

I've also replaced jive-assed n8gga with n8gglets.

 

Unlike Noah Webster, I will not be writing a dictionary any time soon.

 

Using words and phrases is enough to get the meaning and point across.

[Pioneer1]

Cynique

Nobody I know uses the term "Afro-American". As far as I'm concerned, it is an obsolete label  like - "jive-assed nigga". 
 

Malcolm X routinely referred to our people as AfroAmericans.

But I understand why many of our people are reluctant to use the term because they often think of the Afro hairstyle when they hear it, lol.

 

Over the past 50+years, "Black" is the most common word used  when referring to America's  slave descendants.  Previously, Whites soliciously refrained from publicly calling us what was considered a derogatory term until we started calling ourselves that via the "Black is Beautiful" slogan embraced by the Black Panthers who took their cue from Malcom X. This all took place back in the late 1960s, and from that time forward we, as a people, proudly became "Black" with a capital "B"; going from an adjective to a noun.

I use the word "Black" too.
However in honesty...it's an inaccurate and misleading term that should be replaced in my opinion.
Not only are very few people actually "Black", but when people not very familiar with the English language hear it...it confuses them as to why some people who look almost White are called Black while others who are darker but from a different race like the East Indians or some Latinos...aren't.

 

 

 

The idea of blackness being "a state of mind" also came about  during this era, presumably to promote inclusiveness, especially since such dynamic activists as Huey Newton, Angela Davis, and Malcom, himself, were light-skinned.
 

The problem with basing Blackness on a "state of mind" is that White racists can easily infiltrate Black circles by pretentious means.

There are so many White people who are good at talking and sounding like a typical "AfroAmerican" even down to the very inflections on the voice that if you didn't see them in person, you'd think they WERE AfroAmerican.
Certainly they can do this online.

With such lax rules, they could easily steal the identify of AfroAmericans in a generation or two like they did with the Native Americans.
 

 

 

In the present, calling negroid Immigrants  "African" suffices, because that is what they are, and nobody is confused as to what segment of the American population is being referred to when using that description.
 

2 issues with this:
 

1. What about the ones who actually gain their American citizenship?
They are no longer JUST African but are Americans too.
 

2. What about the descendants....2nd and 3rd generations...of those born here to those African immigrants who are clearly American not just legally but culturally two?
Should they just generically be labeled as "Africans' even though they as individuals are just as American culturally as anybody else?

[aka Contrarian]

All  the above input proves is that "black" means different things to different people. Not surprising because as I have previously noted, there is no collective consciousness among American negroid people of color. I'm not trying to recruit others to my point of view and don't feel the need to further defend it.

 

I do find the possibility of people trying to "masquerade" as black, a ludicrous fear. As much as y'all bitch and moan about all the ongoing injustices of racism, why would anybody want to be black? Why would a white person want to be black? Why would a fair skinned person of color claim to be a "second class" citizen and all the baggage that comes with that if they were not intrinsically black?? 

 

The issue of what is and who are black is a slippery slope and I maintain that no one person is empowered enough to pass final judgment. 

 

I've always felt that the diaspora of hybrid slave descendants over the hundreds of years have created their own unique culture and identity and deserved their own niche in the American annals. African immigrants and their American-born offspring are a different breed and can blaze their own trails. 

At this point, I don't give a damn. We are what we are, and lotsa luck in making that work for you. 

Ho-Hum. I remain me.

[Pioneer1]

17 minutes ago, aka Contrarian said:

 

I do find the possibility of people trying to "masquerade" as black, a ludicrous fear. As much as y'all bitch and moan about all the ongoing injustices of racism, why would anybody want to be black? Why would a white person want to be black? Why would a fair skinned person of color claim to be a "second class" citizen and all the baggage that comes with that if they were not intrinsically black?? 

 

Whites will...as they often have...pretended to be "Black" in order to infiltrate AfroAmerican circles and manipulate them for social and political reasons.

Also, when Reparations are approved and distributed either now or in the future, there will be many Whites (and other races) who seek to take advantage of this by claiming AfroAmerican ancestry and bringing up a long lost Black grandmother or use some other trick or form of deception in order to reap the benefits.

You see them doing this right now by White people with blonde hair and blue eyes claiming to be Native Americans to get casinos and other benefits allotted to Native Americans.

[Troy]

13 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

If this is the case, what about the Sudanese or Congolese who came to the United States after 1965?
Since they aren't part of the culture or shared legacy of slavery, are THEY Black?

 

Sure, if they identify as such.  You can keep them out the Black club.  I choose not to and welcome them with open arms.

 

Again, I assert rejecting, embracing, or assigning characteristics to people based upon how they look is simply dumb. 

 

 

[Pioneer1]

Troy

 

Sure, if they identify as such.  

 

And that's the problem.
In your opinion people can identify however they CHOOSE to identify and that identity will be accepted.
I think this is a TERRIBLE mistake.

 

 

 

You can keep them out the Black club.

 

Yes you can.
White folks know who is and ain't White and do a pretty good job of gate keeping....lol.

If...by YOUR definition - not mine...being Black is linked to our ancestry and culture and the Congolese shares none of that, then they aren't Black and shouldn't be accepted as such.

 

 

 

 

I choose not to and welcome them with open arms.

 

Would you also welcome a man....who insists that he's a woman....with those same open arms?
It's the same thing.

 

 

 

 

Again, I assert rejecting, embracing, or assigning characteristics to people based upon how they look is simply dumb. 

 

How one looks is PART of their characteristics...lol.

Again, would it be dumb for you to reject this person as a woman based on how they look?

 

[Troy]

If homey want to be a woman that is fine with me.  I'm not sleeping with him, but I'm sure there is someone who would.

 

Genetics play a MAJOR role in determining one's gender (if you have a Y chromosome you are very likely gonna be a dude). While race, as has been demonstrated abundantly here, is PURELY arbitrary. 

 

The problem with your reasoning is that you treat race the same way you treat gender.

[Pioneer1]

Troy

 

20 minutes ago, Troy said:

Genetics play a MAJOR role in determining one's gender

Outside of a historical or traditional context, genetics plays little to no role in determining a person's gender.

 

THAT is a purely social construct.

 

20 minutes ago, Troy said:

The problem with your reasoning is that you treat race the same way you treat gender.

And the problem with your statement is it mixes apples with turnip greens....lol.

You're mixing genetic/phenotypical classification with social identity.

[frankster]

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

It depends on who "their people" are, or what people you are referring to.

Africans come in various forms..

 

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

There are 2 distinct groups in the United States who are closely linked to eachother and usually overlap:  Black American and AfroAmericans.

The Racial Caste System is rooted in the idea of fomenting Intra-Racial Discrimination and seeming Privilege.

In order to whiten African descendants and provide Rich white men with legal extra marital sex partners(placage)
In a Social Pigmentocracy Black American and AfroAmericans are the same.....unmixed African - so to speak....as in white or caucasian

Mixed African depending on how much European features they exhibit were called octoroons quadroons mulatoo etc

 

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Black Americans are....as the title implies....people of the Black race who are American citizens.

The Racial Caste system led to the development in the African community of discrimination based on skin tone shade or complexion - as in colorism shadeism and featureism

 

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

AfroAmericans are the descendants of enslaved Africans who are primarily Black but mixed with other races to various degrees.
Almost to the point that many aren't even Black at all.

Your emphasis is on complexion....as the main if not the only deciding factor.

 

22 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

Miss "AfroAmerica" can feature light skinned contestants but not Miss Black America, in my opinion ofcourse.

 

While you are using Black to denote Skin Tone and or Complexion

To me Black as in people usually refers to.....Descendants of EnSlaved Africans in the West

While Afro Which really references an Hair texture that is Natural or common to people of African descent or mixture.

Both terms are in a sense appropriate

I prefer to called descendants of Western enslaved Africans Black and all others Afro-Americans or add their nationalities as a suffix

 

Here is where  problem can arise.

Africans who lived here in West and are not descendants of slaves but came direct from Africa as free persons and remained are then called what?

What are White persons born and bred on the African continent for generations then  called?

[Delano]

I don't have bandwidth to play Blacker than Thou.

[ProfD]

5 hours ago, Delano said:

I don't have bandwidth to play Blacker than Thou.

Brotha @Delano...I see how you're going in 2026.

 

You're right....we have to use our bandwidth judiciously. Our time is finite & only getting shorter.

[Troy]

On 1/25/2026 at 1:01 PM, Pioneer1 said:

Outside of a historical or traditional context, genetics plays little to no role in determining a person's gender.

 

That is scientifically false.

 

On 1/25/2026 at 1:01 PM, Pioneer1 said:

And the problem with your statement is it mixes apples with turnip greens....lol.

You're mixing genetic/phenotypical classification with social identity.

 

No Mr. Strawman I was rejecting the analogy YOU drew with Race and gender.

[Troy]

On 1/25/2026 at 2:03 PM, frankster said:

Africans who lived here in West and are not descendants of slaves but came direct from Africa as free persons and remained are then called what?

 

Some go by the country which is easiest for Americans to understand (ex. Nigeria).  I imagine amongst themselves they go by their ethnicity (Yorba, Hausa, etc.)

[Pioneer1]

frankster

 

Africans come in various forms..

 

True.
But at what point does a person STOP being African because there is little to no African blood running through their veins?

 

 

The Racial Caste System is rooted in the idea of fomenting Intra-Racial Discrimination and seeming Privilege.

 

True.

 

 

 

In a Social Pigmentocracy Black American and AfroAmericans are the same

 

Ofcourse.
Because in the System of so-called White Supremacy, ALL non-White people are the same regardless of color, shade, or degree of admixture.

However as AfroAmericans we can't afford to let others....especially our enemies...label or categorize us.

 

 

The Racial Caste system led to the development in the African community of discrimination based on skin tone shade or complexion - as in colorism shadeism and featureism

 

True again.
Part of the problem is in the English racial caste system (which America followed) they lumped everybody together and CALLED them "Black" regardless of the degree of Black ancestry they actually had.

 

The Spanish racial caste system was a little different where they actually made a separate races for their mixed offspring -Mestizo or Mulatto.
Actually this was more accurate.

 

Some say it's more divisive, but actually....the divisions exist between mixed race people and Black people REGARDLESS of what we want to call ourselves.  Many if not most mixed people think they're better and often relate to White people more than unmixed Black people.
They think they look better and think they are smarter, and a lot of Black people feel this way also.
Calling EVERYBODY "Black" and lumping everybody into the same group was a formula for confusion.

 

 

 

 

Your emphasis is on complexion....as the main if not the only deciding factor.

 

How do you know?
I take in ALL of the obvious phenotypical feature into account, not just skin tone.
Actually calling someone "Black" or "White" to denote their race does this very thing!
 

If I went by complexion alone, I'd be calling all albinos White....lol.

 

 

 

To me Black as in people usually refers to.....Descendants of EnSlaved Africans in the West

While Afro Which really references an Hair texture that is Natural or common to people of African descent or mixture.

Both terms are in a sense appropriate

I prefer to called descendants of Western enslaved Africans Black and all others Afro-Americans or add their nationalities as a suffix

 

VGQ (Victim's Guaranteed Qualification)

 

 

Here is where  problem can arise.

Africans who lived here in West and are not descendants of slaves but came direct from Africa as free persons and remained are then called what?

 

In my opinion, THEY should be the ones called "African Americans"....lol.

 

 

 

 

What are White persons born and bred on the African continent for generations then  called?

 

Squatters....lol.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Delano

 

 

I don't have bandwidth to play Blacker than Thou.

 

But you have the bandwidth to insinuate that MLK was a homosexual?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Troy

 

That is scientifically false.

 

If it is, then produce data showing gender's "genetic" foundation.

 

[ProfD]

3 hours ago, Pioneer1 said:

What are White persons born and bred on the African continent for generations then  called?

 

Squatters....lol.

That's hilarious. Those white folks have only been there since the 1650s. That's a long time to be squatting.

[Pioneer1]

4 hours ago, ProfD said:

That's hilarious. Those white folks have only been there since the 1650s. That's a long time to be squatting.

Maybe they were constipated.

[Troy]

On 1/28/2026 at 9:01 PM, Pioneer1 said:

If it is, then produce data showing gender's "genetic" foundation.

Did you take high school biology? Do you know what X and Y chromosomes are? 
 

On 1/28/2026 at 9:01 PM, Pioneer1 said:

In my opinion, THEY should be the ones called "African Americans"....lol

I’m gonna take a page out of pioneers playbook and relate an experience I had on my job. I knew a white guy from South Africa. He was explaining to me how his ancestors built a life in South Africa. I didn’t particularly care for the guy. He struck me as low-key racist, but any right, I said hey you’re an African-American. He said no I’m not, almost as if he was insulted. I thought that was kind of funny, but I did not argue the point.

 

 

[Pioneer1]

Troy

 

 

Did you take high school biology? Do you know what X and Y chromosomes are? 

 

Can you PLEASE produce data showing that GENDER specifically biological or genetic?
That's a clear and concise question...lol.

 

 

 

I’m gonna take a page out of pioneers playbook and relate an experience I had on my job. I knew a white guy from South Africa. He was explaining to me how his ancestors built a life in South Africa. I didn’t particularly care for the guy. He struck me as low-key racist, but any right, I said hey you’re an African-American. He said no I’m not, almost as if he was insulted. I thought that was kind of funny, but I did not argue the point.

 

This isn't a problem UNLESS a society's thinking and vocabulary is limited.

 

I personally have 2 definitions for the word "African".
Not one...but 2.
One is racial, and the other is regional.

 

African 1: A person from the continent of Africa
African 2: Any person predominately of sub-Saharan African descent regardless of where they reside on the planet

 

By my first definition, that may would absolutely be considered an African American (if he had American citizenship.....lol).
By my second definition, no he wouldn't.