Pioneer1

If I may "spice" the conversations up a bit............... Troy I'm not sure if I'm willing to take a neutral stance on the majority of Black preachers and whether or not they're good for the community. Some would argue that the religion of Christianity itself is not good for our people (AfroAmericans) because much of it is based on false doctrine as well as Roman and Greek mythology. But what makes it even worse for our people are the morals that it espouses....... Many of the morals and ethics espouses in traditional Christianity are either unnatural or irrational and doesn't "jibe" with the psyche of the average Black male and female. For examples: -Telling people not to worry about sinning because their sins are already "paid for" -Telling people that they can't engage in polygamy but strictly monogamy only -Telling people to "turn the other cheek" when an injustice is commited against them Any person or institution promoting these type of values to and among AfroAmericans (and this would include MOST preachers) could be seen as helping to keep them in a vulnerable condition.

We may not agree on the terminology but atleast we can all agree that CYNIQUE was wrong when she said that science never espouses religion, lol. The information provided in this thread has proven otherwise!

Del I think the fact that AfroAmericans for the most part don't have their own culture has some good points and also some.....actually many more.....bad points. But what's worse than not having your own culture is actually trying to adopt another person's culture. It's so shameful to see Black folks walking around on St. Patrick's day with green beads around their necks drinking beer, grinning, and talking loud. It seems like I've seen more of it these past few years than even when I was a kid grown up! Atleast back in the 70s and 80s Black folks had enough pride in themselves to not engage in what so many Whites were doing.....this generation seems to be clueless. 　 　 　 Cynique That's the whole point of race being an artificial construct. It enables tribes to dominate and discriminate against those whom they feel superior to. The social construct of "bias" is exemplified by the class distinctions which occur within the tribes. But none of these man-made classifications can neutralize the fact that humans are all the same species because they can mate and reproduce no matter how different they look. First of all...... Racial classification is an artificial construct.....RACE ITSELF is not. Secondly..... No one is arguing over whether or not all human beings belong to the same species. And just because people can mate and reproduce together DOESN'T mean there aren't clear and obvious differences between them. You're interjecting nonsense and distractions into the argument. Inbred in Homo Sapiens, is apparently a survival instinct to dominate, - to be the Alpha Male/King of the Hill. Blacks portray themselves as a sympathetic noble group, but they are in reality just unlucky. If black humans had managed to hold on to their dominance, they would treat other tribes just as bad as they are treated by them - because they all have the same mentality, and power corrupts. Black is not a "tribe"...it's a race. And Blacks HAVE been in charge of other races through out history whether you're talking about Egyptians and Ethopians ruling much of Arabia OR you're talking about African Moors ruling much of Europe. Yet despite those hundreds and thousands of years of Blacks having power and domination over Caucasians can you point to the same level of treatment that AfroAmericans and Native Americans have endured in the Americas by Europeans. So your argument is faulty. 　

Cynique Can pioneer come up with 3 reputable sources that say there is more than one race? Instead of requesting that Troy justify his claims which are aligned with current conventional wisdom, pioneer should reinforce his stance - which is mostly opinion-based. Well since you DID believe in multiple races one time - then claimed you DIDN'T - then claimed you DID again - and I guess now the wind is blowing in the NOT-RIGHT-NOW direction.............. Maybe YOU can provide us both with scientific sources to cover BOTH arguments since you obviously hold BOTH positions depending on which side of the bed you wake up on in the morning.....lol.

Besides the excellent entertainment it provides, I still maintain that much of the value of Black Panther is in it's ability to INSPIRE. I considered Barack Obama to be a pretty ineffective "stuffed suit" of a President as far as Black issues are concerned, but just his presence in the White House had the ability to INSPIRE millions of Black children to better themselves with the hope of achieving greatness. This film is the same. It's has tremendous ability to INSPIRE Black people to build a bigger and better society for themselves.

It also sounds like you believe that being in a religion is the only motivation for one not to around acting the fool. It might not be the only one, but it's a MAJOR one. I place it right up there with genetic markers and family upbringing.

Let's start at the beginning.......... Please present to me 3 scientific based studies that definitively state that either race DOES NOT exist or that there is only ONE race.

Speaking of regularly exposing...... If you're disillusioned and weary....AKA "bored".....try going public and EXPOSING yourself....lol. I guarantee you it (along with all it's repercussions) will bring some excitement in your life and break up the monotany. Just a thought.

Troy The racial/cultural stereotypes you believe are giving you a grotesquely distorted picture. Again it is a mistake to base your opinion, on over a billion people, upon your personal experience with Chinese people you've known (even if Del says this is cool). I'm sure well over a billion Chinese people practice some of religion. Grrrrrrrr...... Troy you're starting to make me angry man.....lol. Come on man, are you seriously telling me that I have to personally MEET and GET TO KNOW over a billion people before I can have any sort of opinion about them or a perspective about their way of life? I haven't been to China or Korea nor have I met all the Chinese and Koreans in the United States, but I've met ENOUGH Chinese and Koreans to the point that my expecations about them and their behavior pretty much line up with what actually happens. Meaning, I USUALLY get the reaction that I expect and predict to happen with them. For example, when I was younger and used to travel by bus and train for oppportunities to meet girls......I learned pretty soon that Black and White girls were easier to meet and sleep with than East Asian girls. Especially for Black men. White men seemed to have little problems meeting them and apparently sleeping with them. So based on my EXPERIENCES, I stopped approaching them. Now listen Troy....lol....I didn't have to waste time running up in EVERY Asian woman's face grinning and trying to "spit game" at her to realize that we were pretty much not going anywhere.....lol. What was I supposed to do? Say, "I don't want to be prejudice and assume.....so let me approach the 70 year old Korean woman at the local grocery store and tell her how nice her butt is and SEE if she'll sleep with me!!!" LOL.. No, it only took a few times to learn the lesson that most Asian women for whatever reason weren't into Black men as they were into White men. When I learned this I would tell some of my boys when we'd go out not to waste too much time trying to sleep with Asian women but even SOME OF THEM bought into this "we're all the same" crap......and got dissed left and right until they learned better. Now does that mean ALL Asians think and act the same? Certainly not, there are many exceptions to the rule and I've known East Asians who were poor, a few who liked Black men, some who were Christian and religious, and even had a Korean friend who followed me (a Black man) around like a puppy..... But this has less do with PREJUDICE and making ASSUMPTIONS and more to do with LIFE EXPERIENCE and what YOU OR ME have actually gone through.....damn some article in a magazine trying to tell you different. Black people need to stop buying into this "we're all the same" or the just as bad "never assume anything about anybody" crap. Most other people don't believe this and they SHOW YOU they don't believe we're the same as them. The only thing it does is confuse our people into wondering if "we're all the same" why they get treated so harshly by these other groups.

Perhaps we should invent (perhaps one already exists) a NEW WORD that encapsulates the knowledge and the methods used to arrive at this knowledge by human beings both modern and ancient which would INCLUDE "science" and the scientific method but would also include much much more. Again, to call what the Africans and Native Americans did and how they did it "science" would be like going up to a Jewish or Buddhist and asking them about their "church". What they have isn't called that. And what the Africans and Native Americans had wasn't called "science". But if people want to continue to use that term for lack of a better one until a new one is invented or revived....I understand.

I don't know why I was disappointed in this thread..... A thread that was advertised as a CONFESSIONAL but turned out to be a verbalized DAY DREAM. But given the pattern, I guess I should have KNOWN better.....lol.

Troy I know facts, no matter how compellingly presented, have not moved you to change your opinion on a subject in the past. Lol, have you considered using the SCIENTIFIC METHOD? Do an experiment............. Instead of lamenting and shaking your head over why I simple don't abandon my beliefs, fall in line, and agree like a Trump supporter....lol.....why not try actually presenting some FACTS to me that clearly deny the existence of race, and approaching me with logic and rationality. Then we'll SEE if I reject it.

And here I was expecting to open up the thread and read REAL ACTUAL CONFESSIONS to some sort of inappropriateness or possibly criminal behavior of the past....lol.

What continues to amaze me is how Communist and presumable mostly atheist nations like China and North Korea produce people with such uptight conservative and supposedly moralist values. For example.......... Most of the Chinese I know are strict on studying, are serous about marriage and monogamy, and are quite loyal to their families. Although I don't DISAGREE with these attributes, it just doesn't make a lot of sense to me how a person who doesn't believe in The Supreme Being nor a life after physical death will be so disciplined and moral. I've even pulled many Chinese and Koreans to the side and asked them these questions! "If you don't believe in God or any afterlife why are you wasting time working hard and getting married? If you're gonna die like an animal why not just have as much fun as you can right now before you go?" Most of the time they'll sit there looking at me with pleasant looks on their faces or talk some nonsense about "family expectations". I admit that many of them are clearly successful, but the motives and behavior of some of these people just doesn't make a lot of sense to me given what they claim to believe or not believe. On a similar note, I still don't know why atheists....especially atheist men....get married, lol.

Troy Lol..... I might pick up a copy and browse through it if I remember to do so when I'm out and about BUT....what difference should a magazine article make to me? I've been studying and pondering the issue of race for over 30 years and the conclusions are all over the map; why should ONE ARTICLE from the National Geographic give me some sort of epiphany? Pioneer asserts that his opinion is factually correct despite ample evidence to counter it. Exactly what opinion have I asserted as factually correct and what was the evidence to counter it? Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't YOU YOURSELF say a while back you didn't have the time nor the evidence to actually refute my beliefs that more than one race exists? So how can you be so cock-sure that your beliefs on the issue are infallible?

Troy Pioneer, equating science to the "west" is like equating religion or spirituality to the west. Don't get caught up in western language and constructs. African the cultures that predated western civilization engaged in what we might call science and religion. I'm inclined to agree with you on religion because the definition of what constitutes a "religion" is so vague that many of the practices around the world from past to present can be labled as religion or religious. But again, calling the knowledge ancient cultures "science"....while I understand what you MEAN when you say "science".....I have to go back to the fact that what they knew did not fall under the technical concept of "science" as it is known in the West. Again.............. Don't confuse KNOWLEDGE with SCIENCE For it to be "science" it has to be derived from a strictly specified type of method that simply didn't exist back then. Del What's te difference between Eastern and Western Science. @Troy Great question!

Even the Arabs are getting on the Black Panther train! https://www.msn.com/en-us/movies/news/‘black-panther’-to-break-saudi-arabia’s-35-year-cinema-ban/ar-AAvuNGe?OCID=ansmsnnews11 They're breaking rules in their own countries just to see this movie.

It's weird how America makes you feel. I remember going to Belgium and while I was at the airport a woman I didn't know walked up to me very close handed me an expensive camera and asked me to take a picture of her and her friends. I stood there stunned for about 5 seconds before she apologized thinking she may have been bothering me. I apologized myself and took the picture and explained to her why I reacted the way I did.....lol. This is why I constantly encourage Black people to get out and visit other parts of the planet from time to time just to experience a different type of reality. Sometime as simple as just sitting on a park bench and having a complete stranger who is White or Arab sit down next to you and start a conversation with you is common in Canada but almost unheard of (unless he's gay) in the United States....lol. Del I heard they banned Hip Hop in China. Is it true? Are they showing any rap music on the television over there? Any hiphop magazines? Obviously you can use the internet, but are there some sites that you're restricted from using?

While I'm not against it, I would much rather Black people focus on getting the government (federal, state, and local) to DO THEIR JOBS and adequately fund these schools so that they don't have to rely on charity and philanthropic donations to meet their needs! The government has BILLIONS of dollars to invest in education....if they really wanted to. They don't need Disney's little 2 or 3 million. I love seeing girls in bikinis. But seeing public school girls running around in bikinis washing cars just to raise money for their softball or basketball team???? Seriously?????? Boys going door to door begging people to buy candy bars just to raise money for their football equipment??????? What happened to all of his lottery money that they claimed would go to help the schools?

I always find it interesting how people try to separate "religion" from "a way of life". A religion IS a way of life. Or atleast that is what it's supposed to and designed to be. The problem is most people in the West don't practice the religions that they preach or claim to believe in so many grow up believing that "religion" is merely something that you do one or two days out of the week rather than 24/7. Also, the author....like most people....is equating KNOWLEDGE with SCIENCE. The two are pretty much synonymous in today's colloquial conversation. But technically.......Native Americans and Africans didn't practice "science". They had their own sets of knowledge, beliefs, procedures, and other concepts. But "science" in it's most literal sense actually belongs to the West because "science" involves a particular and specific set of procedures in order for it to be accepted. So to call the knowledge of ancient Africans and Native Americans "science" would be like calling their ancient places of worship "churches".

Being able to buy liquor and get into bars at an earlier age was one of the main reasons I started going to Canada! But after finding out how much Canadian women loved Black men, me and my friends stopped going to bars and clubs there and just started haning out at the malls for free....lol. In Detroit the two most popular ways of going to Canada was either on the Ambassador bridge or through the Windsor tunnel and when I was a kid most Black people would tell you stay away from the tunnel and take the bridge. Back in the day, the Ambassador Bridge was owned by the Queen of England and they rarely searched you and your car or gave you a hard time when you went across. No hassles. But things are different now, especially since 9/11. Now people of color.....Black, Latino, and Arab....get hassled left and right either by bridge or by tunnel. Black men get stopped by Border Patrol Agents and get asked all types of crazy and personal questions....and you STILL are subject to being pulled over and searched for 2 hours. Meanwhile, a car full of drunk White teenagers with their feet hanging out the window gets to pass on through with no problems.

Troy Now you freely admit that you have no clue how the builders of the Pyramids acquired the knowledge to construct. Given you lack of knowledge on the subject how can you be so positive how they were not constructed? By a rational process of elimination. The "scientific method" is a relatively recent concept that was developed by Western scientists well within the past 500 years. The pyramids were constructed over 10,000 years ago! So whatever method they used to construct the pyramids it COULDN'T have been the "scientific method" that didn't exist at the time. It is interesting that you mentioned experimenting as a possibility. You said you understood the scientific method. If you do then you'd also know that experimentation is part of that process. Now I'm not saying the process was called "science" 5 thousand years ago, but likely the practice was the same -- and certainly more plausible than anything else you come up with. Regardless of whatever similarities may have been shared between the ancient pyramid builders and modern scientists.....the "scientific method" was NOT used to construct the pyramid. It would be like saying Alexander Graham Bell used the Android cell phone to design his newly invented telephone.

Yes. I've been to dozens, but I only "frequently" post on maybe 3 or 4.....including yours. But I can't give you any names because I don't want to risk "cross contamination"......lol. If I logged on to one of them one day and found CYNIQUE all up on there cheesing and opinionating......there's no telling what I'd do, lol. To be honest, I'd much rather deal with people in real life than on the internet, especially after knowing them a while. This is one of the reasons I don't care too much for facebook or twitter. The computer doesn't carry the same type of "spirit" or energy as actually hearing a person's voice or seeing their expression in person.

Man, you two brothers sure do get around.....lol. I love to hear about Black men traveling the globe. If I had the money I would too. Some of the brothers and sisters I've worked with over the years who have good corporate jobs are always talking about their travels to Brazil, Hong Kong, Singapore, South Africa, ect....... When they do I often sit there dreaming and wondering what would have happend if I had focused more on my grades in school and tried harder to get through college, lol. Most of the Black boys in the schools I went to were focused on basketball, girls, and smoking weed....lol. I encourage Black men to get out of the United States from time to time just to see how other people live and how they're treated abroad so they can recognize the difference and compare it when they get back home. Especially how the women treat them. When I actually lived in Detroit I used to go to Canada every weekend and just going right across the border I saw a huge difference in how the people behaved and how they treated me.

Even if you and I combined all of our anecdotes, on the subject, this would not be proof, no matter how good it made us feel or how right we feel we are. Are a stack of research papers from Duke University supposed to suffice as "proof"????? The only REAL proof for a person is to either experience or witnessing whatever is being said to them. And because of this, if you really take it for what it's worth - so-called "scientific data" being presented to the individual is no more valid than anecdotes being presented to them. After all, BOTH are just second-hand narratives about a particular experience. -Grandma sitting at her kitchen table telling you what she knows about collard greens. -A White man in a white coat and glasses is standing there with a folder telling you what HE has concluded about greens. Which one do we go with? Who should we trust for our information? Personally, I believe that anecdotes from RELIABLE people are more trustworthy than "data" from dubious sources.