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While everyone watches the reality show based on this president, behind the scenes an authoritarian rule is being pushed onto the courts. As a result, the concept of freedom is going to deteriorate in America long after this president is gone. Trump, with support from the Republican Senate, and help from Senate Democrats, are stacking the U.S. courts in favor of conservative ideology and their idea of the rule of law. This means there will be more restrictions on civil rights. Heres More About That

And their lies your problem @Pioneer1 you let your imagination do your thinking and you create nothing of value. I never wrote I resented black men -you wrote that I did. Why do you want to know about my experiences with black men or any man? You wouldn’t understand it anyway. Heck, you don’t even have the guts to put your skin in the game. It takes courage to be vulnerable to another person.. to allow them to get close enough to even be hurt by them. It takes even more courage and heart to bring children in a world that’s brutal... It’s even more difficult to raise them up to be productive healthy and happy - even if they were an “accident”... yet I did just that. No, Pioneer you don’t get to live vicariously through my “stories”... You don’t get to know what black men did in my relationships with them. Here’s all you need to know about them - They are/ were brave enough to engage. Smh

@Pioneer1 That's funny that you coined the hype 'fake outrage'. I think today there are so many other more important issues that this media hype was not that important either and it may have been hyped up, but however, this tactic, in ancient times is one of the very modes of how we as Black-African-typed people have been conquered. And so, I can understand why I am not making sense to you about 'a white women coming into a Black environment and presenting themselves in a fashion that the Black kings would NOT ALLOW THEIR OWN WOMANKING TO DO. I can understand why you and perhaps many other Black men still today cannot recognize this issue as a method of White Supremacy and in how they were eventually overthrown. So, I guess, I will leave off from this scenario. But, before I do completely, I think that this very thread sort of touches upon what I am addressing. Many Black women today wear 'White women hair textures--that are NOT growing from our scalps and this was introduced to us, not only through modern slavery but a long time ago, in Africa and elsewhere. And now, we Black women are being bashed by many Black men that do not take responsibility for their part in this trend. NubianFEllow does speak on this though, he does say how Black men share apart in this issue. If Black men obssess over non-African traits in the presence of their own womankind then that is a form of White Idolation--White Supremacy, and from this too, some Black men harbor hatred and rejection against BLack women who do not have 'good hair' or 'curly hair'; That is a form of White Supremacy. We as Black people can also be defined as being 'White Supremacist' and that is why I don't feel that you should charge other INDIVIDUALS and attack them for issues that you feel are White Supremacist beliefs. Pioneer, we all have to deal with issues of racism and have to sift through the kind of people, Black, White or other, that are spritually whole or not. LOL. You are so off track, IMO. I just can't understand why your are reading into this. Everyone has a different experience and meet various people along the pathway of life. Do you think that Black African Americans should not marry out of their race/culture? If a Strong White man or Strong Black man is attracted to a woman and marries her, then the woman should feel that this man is 'the best man for her'. For a White man to marry out of his race or a Black man to marry out of his race is a conscious step in this world and due to how horrible this system as been, a man would have to be strong IMO when it comes to these choices; that is how I feel. I a non-African man asked me to marry him (of which has happened to me!), I would know that he is making a strong stance about his manhood. There are so many ways that @Mel Hopkins statement could be viewed, IMO and I do feel that you are imposing your ideals on her due to issues that you, as a Black man has come across. You're right! I have been dodging! And, I do have some personal stories but, I am trying to figure out how to write them down and am wrestling with some thoughts for certain reasons. For one, I did share a personal story in another thread and I feel that was a very good response to this topic!!!--But you may not have read it or agreed! Another reason I am slow to respond is because I have a problem speaking about certain issues about Black men because--I did not come into this community with the goal to speak against Black men-- therefore, I am trying to figure out how to speak about this kind of 'Black Disrespect coming from Black men to wards me as a Black woman' in such a way that it will not be detrimental as a whole. @Pioneer1 Another reason why I have not responded to you about this is because, it hurts deeply, as in the story that I did share in another thread. It is very demeaning when a Black man attacks a Black woman and in that story that I told, had it not been for other kind of men that responded to me positively, it would have been impossible to have a healthy self-esteem in that environment that I was a part of.

African and Native American Hair-type; THE COMB TEST One key historical mark that reveals issues of Colorism that existed in the Native American world would be a practice that became known as ‘the Comb Test’. Perhaps there has been some publications with regards to this subject but, my account would only be based on a personal experience. Nevertheless, as it was explained to me, this practice was common and widespread at least on the east coast of the States. However, there has been a serious mis-education when it comes to the whole truth about what life was like for millions of people who lived in North America before the coming of Columbus and the Colonial Movement. Even though the Native American world consisted of many different kinds of natives however, today we have been conditioned to define the American Indians (ie. Native Americans) by European construct. But sometimes when I look at my husband, who happens to be a ‘Black Indian’, I sometimes think about how back during the Civil Rights times, a common racist shout against Black people was to ‘Go Back to Africa’ and now, the deception becomes apparent. Because of this European tactic to ‘Divide & Conquer’, based on issues of Colorism as well as many other methods, the reality of Colorism that had already occurred amongst the native peoples became even more of a confusion. My husbands people though, mark both the ancient history and the more recent American Indian history too. As a Negro Indian [i.e. Black Indian], my husband reveals that not all people with nappy hair identifies with the term ‘Africa’ as it applies to the Mid-Atlantic African Slave Trade. For a certainty, all modern humans originated OUT OF AFRICA at one point in time, but also, just like many different kinds of people who are from other continents and countries all over the world and who have no known recent historical link to Africa, nevertheless, there are a significant presence of Native American Indians that fit todays physical description of ‘an African’ but have no recent historical link to Africa at all. Because their cultures were almost wiped out, therefore, some of them have intermixed with African Americans, have chosen to blend, or conveniently allowed people to define them as African Americans but many of them are not direct descendants. Over time, African American Descendants of Slaves have been made to absorb many other kinds of people into our culture and therefore, in order to better understand issues of Self-Hate and Colorism that has plagued us, it may be good to look deeper into our origins and formations. Following, will be four brief personal accounts with some of my relations that may better help to understand how, perhaps, the notion of ‘GOOD HAIR-BAD HAIR’ has been connected to Colorism and White Supremacy and used to classify Black African-typed people as being inferior to others. 1. My husband’s paternal grandmother. She would be defined as ‘a Straight-Haired North American Indian’ woman. He took me to visit her from time to time, before and after we married and it was always enriching because, she was always willing to talk and share a lot about her life. But she was also very frank, abrupt and sometimes crude to the point that some of her grandchildren became offended and would not visit her. On one visit she told me that she remembered ‘the Trail of Tears’. She said that she was very young but remembered it very well. She was led out by hand with her people as they were forced marched out of their lands westwards to become a part of a Cherokee Reservation. She was not Cherokee though, but Sioux, however, there was no designated reservation for the Sioux, so for the many that were caught in the North Carolina woodlands, they were force marched to Cherokee lands. On another visit she told my husband and I about ‘the Comb Test’ and said that this was a common practice. She said it became incorporated into her Church and when a visitor would want to join the congregation, the preacher would then call that person up to the front of the church! She further explained that the preacher would pull out a comb and then run the comb through the hair of the person and if they did not have ‘STRAIGHT-TYPED HAIR’, they could not become a member of their church community. I fell back… LOL. She told us this story with a straight and stern face. I asked her was she serious and she confirmed. On yet another occasion, she came to visit her son, my father-in-law. And as the family gathered around the table, I decided to ask her a question because I felt that her presence was so unique in how she compared to my father-in-law; her son. I said to her, “you have a beautiful skin tone but why is it that you are darker than your son and most of your children? She immediately smiled at me and then she threw her head back and paused. Then she looked straight forward, and it was almost as if she went into a trance. She looked as if she went far back in time and in her imagination while she was speaking of a very traumatic time in her childhood. She said, “I know. I am also darker than both of my brothers. I was my mother’s only daughter and she hated me.” Then she said that one day when she was a little girl, her mother punished her for not washing the dishes. Her mother led her outside and made her stay outside on the swing in the sun for a long time and ever since that time, her mother would tell her that she became dark because she was a bad girl. I could tell that her mind went back to that very experience and it seemed as if she was ‘that little girl’. But then after she told the story, she ‘came to’. Then she looked at me and said, she hated her mother and did not miss her after she died. She had no remorse. OMG! Anyway… fast forward … to one of her own sons, that was dubbed, the black one and he said that she was racist. My husband said that whenever they would go to visit this woman, his great-grandmother, who was a White woman, she would line all the children up—by color—LOL. My husband was always in the back! 2. THE POW WOW—I learned by going to Pow Wows that many of the East Coast Natives adopt spiritual names that relate to a significant event in their life or based on the nature of animals common to their environment. So in the western parts of America the natives may adopt spirit names connected to perhaps the buffalo, bull, horse, coyote, or etc. And in the east coast, some natives refer to the fox, squirrel, rat (swamp rat), beaver, deer, and etc. There are many different tribal people from all over America and I met a native, a Straight-haired-Indian, who told me an interesting story that made me realize that I had mis-judged my husband who spoke about this very topic. So, I need to go back to the story that my husband had told me about some of his father’s people. He would constantly tell me how some of his relatives would have a particular hair-type but then all of a sudden, it would completely change. He said that he had an uncle who was young and had very tight curly hair and then he got sick and was hospitalized but, afterwards, his hair became bone straight. And, he continued to tell me other similar stories repeatedly until, I got sick and tired of it. One day, I told him, “Negro Please! You don’t have to worry about your hair changing as nappy as it is. Be sure, it won’t change at all. Smh!” I didn’t believe it but then, when I went to the Pow Wow, this native man told me the same kind of story. I have since learned that there is such an occurrence in that some people do have this happening in that their hair will change texture or, they have a distinct combination-type hair texture, and not due to old age, but it is a commonality that occurs across the world in certain ethnic groups. This makes me wonder of the useless purpose of ‘the Comb Test’. 3. BLACKFEET Comb Test—My husband’s father lived in the Piedmont area and his people have a long history in this region. However, some of the decision that he made was spurred by the government’s programs aimed at wiping out the Native Americans. He marks a very crucial and historical time of conflict that revolved around the World Wars. The Federal government passed a law known as the Racial Integrity Act (RIA) in order to deal the American Indians and the federal reports concluded on the repercussions of this law years later. Initially, the natives had three choices; (1) they could be defined as White if they were light skinned enough, (2) they had to remain on reservations if they still wanted to be listed as Natives, or (3) they had to be defined as ‘Colored’ and be defined with the Negro ‘race’ if they signed up for the military. In general, and as a result of this RIA, the federal government documents later reported that almost 90% of the Native American men married White women and completely left the reservations and became ‘White’ if they could pass (this is what my father-in-law’s, father chose to do, but he was too dark skinned to pass as White). Only a few natives remained on the reservations and as a result many of them that remained became very impoverished. And finally, there was a small percentage of natives that were aggressive and did not want to be defined as White nor chose to remain on the reservations, therefore, they bonded with the African American community; and this is what my father-in-law chose to do. However, he married a part-Blackfeet woman. My husband’s mother, at my first glance, appeared to be an African American woman, but the story behind the picture of her grandmother displayed in her house was about a woman that came from Montana, was forced out of Blackfeet country with her people who faced harsh times of starvation. They were driven at first to Nebraska, and then some of them were taken by wagonloads further east to Maryland. My husband’s mother was a little girl at the same time that some famous Blackfeet Indians were being pressed hard by the government and were resisting annihilation. Black-and-White photos captured some of the Blackfeet Indians during the 1930s and there was one famous depiction of a Blackfeet on a subway rail in the Capital. But the very brief written documents about the Blackfeet Indians has been severely White washed and painted a very different view of a much bigger story! The oral story about the Blackfeet Indians has some color to it! Although my husband’s mother has that same distinct forehead that I see in a lot of pictures of Blackfeet Indians, her hair was also nappy, no doubt due to being intermixed on the east coast, however, there are small bits and pieces of early stories of the Blackfeet that does include the African presence before the Great Starvation. And also unfortunately, my mother-in-law conducted her own ‘Comb-Test’ amongst her own children and grandchildren. She made a point of announcing to me and her own son, my husband, that our firstborn baby would not be lucky enough to have ‘hair like Papa’. Both of our sons were born and grew nappy hair like her and all of her children and grandchildren. And like my husband, who has the same prominent forehead and hairline as she did, one of my sons were born with the same traits. Our first son developed some physical features of the Sioux while our younger son developed some physical features of the Blackfeet. 4. THE ETHIOPIAN YOUNG MEN—As a Biology Major, my further research began with my personal stories about my family here as an African American Descendant of Slaves. Yet, even though, through by son’s paternal line, they are Third Generation Native Indians starting with my father-in-law and Second-Generation Black Indians, and come from a long line of Natives, however, their maternal links to Africa through myself becomes the Agar that makes them so complete. The American government has damaged and fragmented the American Indian populations so intensely that the Black Indian Identity is almost gone. For this reason, and as my sons grew up, I became so happy to see their African traits develop. I enjoyed taking my sons to the barber shop to get the trendy African American haircut styles such as the High top, Box Cut, fade, and corn rolling their hair. I remember how all the Black young men grew out their afros over the summer and turned up in school for the 7th grade with these large ‘Jackson 5 afros’. And I could see that my older son began to look like my maternal origins more and more, as he grew up. He looked to me like East Africans, but I had no idea that he would receive this same confirmation from many East African and Middle Eastern people! I remember one day that we went to dine at a buffet restaurant in North Carolina and a rather large group of Ethiopian young men came into the restaurant to eat. They walked passed our table and sat over near the window and they were close enough so that their conversations in a foreign tongue could easily be heard as they talked amongst themselves. I noticed that they looked a lot like my son who was sitting at the table with us. But then my thoughts were confirmed by those men that day. At one point, my son stood up because he wanted to go to the sushi bar and he turned and began to walk towards their table because it was in the pathway of the direction to the sushi bar. As my son began to walk briskly towards that direction, the men stopped talking abruptly and looked directly at my son, and three of them immediately stood straight up and began to reach out their hand as if to shake hands with my son. Meanwhile, my son, who had no clue what was transpiring, kept on walking past their table and so, the three men looked baffled and then they slowly sat down and continued speaking in another language. Apparently, they must have assumed my son was going to greet them. I was so amazed at how much he looked like those young Ethiopian men, but it was not until I did more research that I could really appreciate his traits. And as he grew up, however, there was one unique trait that he began to express that really caught me by surprise. My oldest son went off to college and moved into the dormitory community when he was about twenty. But it was only a few weeks later that he told me that he had decided to cut his braids and get a barber shop cut. So, a few days later, I drove up to the campus to visit him and I was taken by surprise to see his new look. He opened the passenger car door and sat down in the car and my mouth dropped open as I gazed at his profile and look at his Mediterranean typed nose. … I said, “Okay, what happened to your hair!!!” He did a silent laugh and said, “I don’t know.” Then I said, “Where are your naps!? What happened to your hair!? It is BONE SRAIGHT! OMG! You look like a Gypsy. You’ve got a White woman’s bump in your nose. What am I going to tell you father? He is going to joke me! … I ran my fingers through his hair. So much for ‘the Comb Test!’ smh. To this day, my oldest son’s hair has no naps. When he grows it out, it is very, very Black and has soft big straight-type curls but, nonetheless, there are no naps!—at all! His hair texture resembles many Ethiopians in that he has a combination type hair texture. He lost the bushy afro that he used to have. His hairline has receded, and he looks like he could be one of Haile Selassie’s sons. Umh. What a thought. Well, I wrote some of my personal experiences with respect to ‘African traits’ [i.e. ???] because of the deeper research that I have done with regards to the ancient scripts of the distant past and to better explain the problems of today that has arisen due to issues of Self-Hatred and Colorism that has plagued the world. These four personal experiences are sort of an introduction to a better understanding of the past.

@Cynique Good points. The only people to suffer from scandals are black people. No one else suffers. Supremacists will be quoting this case 50 years from now to invalidate racism as they are doing now. Jussie is a supremacists dream case. The lgbt means the black community no good. They, like feminists, are part of white supremacy. I believe that even if he proved his case to be true, it would not benefit the black community. This whole case is trash. @Chevdove As much as I am no 50 Cent fan, Power is actually better and seem to push the lbgt agenda less. I liked Empire until the show revealed itself as a white supremacist agenda pushing homosexuality on the black community. The rate of homosexuality using hip hop to spread its ugly head is the worst thing to hit the black community since crack. They are not merely trying to cripple us. They are trying to paralyze us. As much as we hate to admit, a race war has been waged against black people. It seems to be happening in waves. The scariest part is that it has been disguised so well, the black community doesn't even suspect it.

Interesting again. There seems to be a lot of hidden history, yet to come out! My mother's mother, as I did say in the past, was part Native American and part East Indian and so, the hair texture obviously shows up in mixed-raced African Americans showing these links!!! But the Colorism and racis that existed in the Pre-Columbian World was really bad. And my mother's mother was really bad too, with her racism. She had a lot of children. I have a lot of aunts and uncles from her, and they all constantly say that she was racist. My aunt of which I was close to, was the lighter skinned one, and she had a 'mean streak'--lol. She was blunt. All of my aunts including my mother say that she was very attractive when she was younger and had a lot of attention, but then, they all did. But they all said that "Ma and Pa favored her over the others because she was light skinned like Ma". @Cynique My aunts would always say this and even she said this too! And that's when I had to laugh. One time I came to visit her in the nursing home and I sat beside her and asked her questions. She loved all of her nieces and nephews and would get angry if we did not come to visit her. Her siblings would come too, and at times she would slam the door in their faces and leave them outside in the hallway during visits. LOL. She hated my mother's second husband, and I think it's because he made a pass at her. But anyway, one day she told me, that "Ma and Pa spoiled her" LOL. I think she blamed them for causing her to become anti-social. She never married and she had no kinds. At any rate, I never met my maternal grandmother, but after hearing all of the stories about her, I'm kinda glad I didn't meet her. LOL. But her ancestry and that of her parents is interesting! I am so glad to hear you background. And, because you said that you married a Black man, then, you may understand how important it is too, though to embrace Africa!!! I agree because, HEY--you are here!--in this community dropping all of this knowledge! However, you married a Black man and so, your children have this ancestry too. So, I believe that you should be somewhat 'riveted on Africa' for their sake. That is one thing tht bugs me about my husbands people. They have benefitted due to African American Movement and their movement AIM (the American Indian Movement) did not form until after ours. So, they admit this and many of them connected with African Americans during the Civil Rights times. But some of them want to be separate now. There was almost nothing for them, so they were able to fight back for their rights with the help of Black people. Me and my father-in-law has some rounds on this issue! LOL.

@Pioneer1 maybe, but effective. you”ve been unmasked as a hater of black women. Now it makes sense why you “say” you never married a black woman.. you “said” you made them call you daddy , but you played them. And didn’t you “say” “no children” too? Is that a conscious decision? Is it the truth? Did you lose a child? (If so, my condolences) BUT If you can make babies, do you hate black women so much, you don’t even want to procreate with us? Wow! So, unless it’s a health problem - you didn’t even make a contribution to our “black” family. Well dang, at least me and black man had a baby together. All that whining about “white supremacy” and it turns out “you” the hater here.

If and when aren't words that you use to make a declaration. Also the phrase my beliefs makes it clear it is not a demand. I think you have difficulty taking the measure of a person. For someone who wants to lead you sound like a nihilist. Encouraging Mel to share her pain with a man who would laugh about Black girls be used by an old morally bankrupt leech. You prove something I believe strongly. The best leaders don't want to be leaders. And those that want to lead aren't even good followers. At times you sound as though you have more contempt for Black Women than the harshest racist. If I am praising white men because they say Black Man should listen to the Black Women. And you disagree, then I will praise that Man over you. I seriously wonder whose team you are on cause you aren't an ally to black women. At least not on this forum.

I have some thoughts on all of this subject. I was very interested to hear Chevdove elucidate on the Black Foot Indians. My father told us his mother, who was not married to his father, was a native American woman. I had no reason to doubt this because there was big portrait of her in a round ornate picture frame, that hung in my parents' bedroom. Because this picture was not in color i can only deduce that her skin color was medium tone, being neither dark nor light. She had an abundant crop of hair that was probably black in color, and wavy rather than straight in texture. It was styled in a long braid that was twisted in a knot pinned in the center of her forehead. She had high cheekbones, thin lips and a well sculpted nose and almond-shaped eyes. She was beautiful. This picture hung in that room all during my childhood, and me and my siblings referred to her as "our Indian grandmother". My grandfather who was born in Missouri and grew up in Kansas. a territory he left as a young man in his 20's to seek out his fortune in Chicago even before the "Great Migration" which started around 1915. He had married another woman and still lived in Chicago and would come to visit us from time to time during the years he was alive. He, oddly enough, was light complexioned, had freckles and nappy red hair. Anyhow. i seemed to have remembered him once saying about my dad's mother, the woman he had not wed, who was about 5 years older than him and had died young, was a Black Foot Indian. This stuck with me as a kid of about 8 years old because, in all of my childish innocence, i wondered if she had black feet. But in my mindless youth, i never paid much attention to anything my parents had to say bout their forbears. Fast forward many years when i came to realize the importance of tracing my roots. In doing research about my family tree, i saw that the Indian tribes that inhabited the area in Missouri and Kansas where my father and his people were from, were of the Osage nation, and i thought that was probably the tribe my grandmother was from, and that i was confused about my "black foot" memories. But, maybe she was a Black Foot who migrated to Kansas from nearby Nebraska where Chevdove placed some members of the Black Foot tribe. To me, that makes my grandmother more special because according to Chevdove, this tribe put up a fight when it came to government intervention. 😡 Also, my hair which started out as being a sandy reddish color and frizzy in texture, eventually turned brown and become quite bushy. However, as the years continued to pass, the texture of my hair continued to gradually change becoming thinner and quite silky. Now in my 80s i have long straight white hair (which i tuck under styled wigs when i go out because it is thin on top. ). Also a dentist once told me that my teeth had unusual characteristics that he'd never seen before but these traits were possibly native American in origin. 😬 My late brother-in-law, who was married to my older sister, was another example of someone whose hair nappy hair changed texture as he aged, it being almost straight at the year of his untimely death at age 50. He was a very exotic looking man. Tall, slender, amber in color, a long narrow face, a keen acquiline nose. It's so weird that my tall, slender 14-year-old great-grandson looks the same way altho he and this brother-in-law are in no way related; never even knew each other. Ironically, this grandson's other great-grandmother on his father's side obvious has native American blood lines... She actually looks like an Indian squaw in her old age, complete with long braids. So tell me, do i sound like a person who is full of self-hate? Like somebody who is lost and wants to be white?? Like somebody who should be riveted on Africa? When y'all talk about this "self-hate" thing, leave me out. i am, who i am and have no problem with this. And, i like all of my different blood lines, including the Scotch-Irish ones. i especially like my alien, Type "O" Rh-negative blood. 👽 OK. I'm done.

Despite the fact that i have repeatedly said this is not the case. The women here have also said that is not the case. The fact that I posted links expressing both sides of an issue, in the words of feminist, is lost on you. You also don't understand that Mel made a choice about one man based on her experiences with other men. You seem to miss the point, that she didn't indict all Black Men nor did she praise all White Men. Yet you are judging her heart and her choices. Then you want her to bare her sole about painful experiences. This is the height of insensitivity, arrogance and callousness. Yet she states how Bkack Women defend Black Men. However this is not reciprocated in a manner that Black women feel. Yet you say in your experience Black Men defend women when they are able. Some of the characteristics you associate with black men are incredibly negative. And then you give God like powers to all white people. Instead of the tiny minority at the the top who are exploiting all people.

You’re welcome! Between you, Cynique, Chevdove , things are never stale!

Thank you Mel. I listen and ask questions. And contrary to opinion I am not a spokesman for women, men children ir aby movement past present or future. @Pioneer @Troy

This is powerful! We do protect a black man’s image, don’t we? I think this is why so many are having a negative reaction to the R Kelly saga... Black women have covered black men for so long - that many (mostly men but women too) are shocked that a black woman produced and directed the film that gave his alleged victims a platform. Many black women have normalized the horrible treatment they’ve receive at the hands of black men, they call men “soft” who treat them well. Go on social media and you’ll see some black men say they are supposed to be “Future” to their “Ciara”. Instead of being kind to their woman; as Ciara’s husband “Russell” is to her. Those are the same black men who believe Ciara will tire of how well her husband treats her and her son with Future and she’ll come crawling back to Future. That’s how brain damaged some of young black men (and black women) are today. But I digress. I know some of my experiences with black men aren’t for publication either. And I can tell you, it’s those stories that haunt me; making it difficult to finish my second book. Some times, I tell myself that I’m being too sensitive or maybe I deserved it - but then I realize that is exactly how battered women rationalize their relationship experiences. So, yes I’ve been sorely disrespected by many black men. None of it deserved. But those experiences afforded me a lot of painful life lessons too. And now I know what it is like to experience kindness. Yet, I absolutely understand your position.

Wait-a-minute, I think I wrote about this incident in this very thread? Yes, this may be true but, they do not have the same history that we have and this is very important. That is just crazy wrong! LOL! I don't watch TV that much but I have seen shows in which it is commonplace in how Black men obsess over non-Black women and I don't see this coming from any other race/culture! You don't see the connection to 'oppression' in this regard? AGain, PIoneer, this is so wrong. At one point in the past, someone was able to come into Africa and set up human slavery and therefore, this process begins within our circles for what ever reason. Black men were not protecting their people for some reason. I agree! And it happens both ways though, sadly, IMO. It happens both ways, we, as BLack men and women demean each other in this mode and I suppose that may have been one of the reasons we were overpowered and enslaved.

Welp, your comprehension is illogical and that’s shoddy math. But if that’s your world view then you own it. Your inferiority complex has nothing to do with me or my words. As for this topic; it states the obvious. Black women ARE beautiful. It is part of record and was never up for debate. “Then will I swear beauty herself is black,   And all they foul that thy complexion lack.” Shakespeare~ Sonnet 132

@Delano me too Twin! I’m in a macro phase right now. I feel frustration when someone wants me to focus on minutia.. It feels like I’m way out there right (wherever that is) taking in the big picture.

Always a pleasure twin. I am learning / discovering some mind bending stuff.

@Delano , the action is highlighted in your quote above. I read it the first time but it resonated when @Chevdove quoted as further insight. When I "created" a man perfect for me - it was so I wouldn't have the unpleasant experiences of my previous relationships. BUT that's not choosing,at all. That's NOT Kuumba (divine creation)" that's freakin' commentary!!! Creation would be envisage a desired marriage based on nothing in existence... When I reread your quote, it clarified a lot of things for me. It reminds me of that other quote attributed to Einstein "We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them." Thank you!

Yes, that's your calling. Your quest stands a good chance of resonating with black folk because we are a spiritual people with well developed instincts who should probably liberate ourselves from religion and focus more on a pantheistic mental discipline. I wish you well. You know.

You are feeling if they can fit you in within the next two weeks you may do it. You are looking for a sign one or the other. You will decide in two days based on how you feel or what sign the universe gives. As long as there's no health risk , why not. You want it more than the teeth.

I should've also said that i think this "old wisdom" is stored in everybody's brain; it just has to awakened. No, i don't talk with other people about this or try to advise them. i let them find their own path. i don't even like to verbalize it. I prefer to just go with the flow and look with a third eye and hear with another ear.

They are being a bit excessive on the Jussie Smollett case, but my question is why? I'm no fan of any agenda supporting the LGBT movement but 48 years for filing a false police report is beyond overboard. It makes me question is there is an agenda against black celebs or what with all that is making headlines recently. SOURCE - https://www.unilad.co.uk/news/jussie-smollett-could-face-48-years-in-prison-after-sixteen-felony-counts-charges/ ABC Empire actor Jussie Smollett could be facing up to 48 years in prison after being hit with an additional 15 counts of filing a false police report. Smollett was hit with the 15 additional felony disorderly conduct charges by a grand jury on March 7. He may also be forced to pay a fine of up to $400,000. The 36-year-old actor had already been charged with one Class 4 Felony charge of disorderly conduct in February, which could have meant a three year prison sentence plus a $25,000 fine. As reported by ABC News, the indictment was confirmed by the Cook County State’s Attorney’s Office. Smollett’s attorney, Mark Geragos, released the following statement: The fact of an indictment is not unexpected. We knew that there is no way they would expose their evidence to a public airing and subject their witnesses to cross-examination. What is unexpected however, is the prosecutorial overkill in charging 16 separate counts against Jussie. This redundant and vindictive indictment is nothing more than a desperate attempt to make headlines in order to distract from the internal investigation launched to investigate the outrageous leaking of false information by the Chicago Police Department and the shameless and illegal invasion of Jussie’s privacy in tampering with his medical records. Jussie adamantly maintains his innocence even if law enforcement has robbed him of that presumption. Smollett has denied the charges, and will be returning to court in Chicago next week (beginning March 11). On March 14, he will face the charges in court. It is anticipated Smollett will cut a plea deal with authorities. Smollett told authorities he had been attacked on January 29, by two men who were ‘yelling out racial and homophobic slurs’. Smollett said one of the attackers had put a rope around his neck, and had poured some sort of chemical substance on him. Police believe Smollett had paid two men to carry out the alleged assault on him.

i'm not an avid fan of EMPIRE. It's just a show about show business. It has drama, comedy, and music. The homosexual aspect is marginalized in its plot because homosexuality is not unusual, especially in the entertainment industry. Homosexuality is simply a brain-wired sexual orientation, an anomaly that has always been around and it's not going away. i take it in my stride, and people do have a choice when it comes to watching shows that have gay characters. Furthermore, homo-sexuality exists across the board among all races so i don't buy it as being something that whites are seeking to use as a spell to cast over black men via the media. Paranoia is rampant in the black community. i don't think white people have to plot against any rich and famous black man seeking to acquire a piece of the action. They just have to wait for these celebs to commit stupid acts of sexual misconduct for which they are easily found guilty. Then all the "white powers-that-be" have to do, is sit back and leave black folks to exist in a perpetual state of suspicion about conspiracies that gnaw away at their minds. The crimes for which innocent black men are found guilty exacerbate this black mindset because African Americans can't relinquish their high expectations from a country they can't stop loving.

Everything Ms Bey wrote is familiar to me. Not because of something i have previously read. But something i have always known because it was inherent in my psyche, - a 6th sense just waiting to be realized, interpreted and applied. As a "star child", the "as above, so below" principle has also been an appoach taken by me when it came to my aspirations 🤩

Yes, this sounds strange. But for them to have to get a lawyer does seem like something may have occurred. This case is strange. Yes, Something does not sound right here, what a diversion. @NubianFellow I just learned something new. There is a show called Power? I will google. When I hear about something that Lee Daniels is behind, I already assume it's going to be about lbgt and this is what I heard about Empire. I don't know for sure though. This is awful. But again, this was the purpose for electing a 'Black' president imo, anyway. I saw it coming.

I've never identified as anything other than a member of a non white minority who was born and raised in this country, so marrying a man who was of the same category as me was a given and no big deal. BTW, I did forget to mention that i was told i had blue eyes when i was born, as do a lot of babies at birth. a temporary condition that changes during infancy. ( Eye color has a lot to do with body chemistry.) i got my fantasies about my RH negative blood from several sources, one being a documentary that explored the idea of this unusual blood type being alien in origin. But, of course, no proof exists for this hypothesis. i don't want to make this subject all about me, but i would like to clear up what may be some misconceptions. I have never been someone who ran behind white folks and sucked up to them, and as an individual, my personal policy has always been to treat them whatever way they treated me, which, as it turned out, has always been with civility. But i have actually never had a white friend; they've all been acquaintances and I am not really compatible with the white vibe. I am, instead, permeated with the essence of blackness that has been defined as soul. Nor have i ever been color-struck. I've always valued intellect and wit above skin tone. i have, however, been the target of people who had a problem with my light skin. So, it's not that i reject my African roots, it's just that i put them on the same level as all my other blood lines that contribute to the hybrid creature who is me. My genesis began on the shores of this country centuries ago. Even so, i have no great love for America. i think it's a big lie, - a land that has not kept its promises. i also think i am more typical than some realize. Every black person has a personal history that makes her/him unique, which is perhaps why black unity has never coalesced. This post has obviously triggered something in me, prompting me to do some self-examination at the expense of what might be called a captive audience. Sorry about that. Didn't mean to hi-jack the tread. Thanks for the further information about the Black Foot/Feet tribes, Chevdove. i guess i'll never know for sure about my grandmother, but i do know she did belong to a breed of native Americans. How cool is that?

Jussie appeared in court yesterday, here in Chicago, and entered a "not guilty" plea. I'm thinking he and his lawyers are going to fight this case, in an attempt to completely clear his name because reasonable doubt is creeping into the situation. The dumb-assed Chicago police, who did a 360 degree turn on the case, are so anxious to prove that they are not being racist they have gone overboard in their attempts to prove Jussie totally to blame. This may very well backfire on them because a lot of their evidence is circumstantial. i don't trust those Nigerian brothers, and am very unimpressed by their lawyer a young white woman who when she was first assigned to the case referred to them as "her boys". The immensely popular show EMPIRE premiered its new season on Wednesday and jussie will be appearing in it on up to the last 2 episodes which were being filmed during the time he was under suspicion, and the producers have written him out of the show for now. We shall see. I've heard the LGBT community is keeping its distance from this situation because they don't know who to believe. The black community seems to withholding judgment, too, and if Jussie is found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, he will have done great damage to both of these segments.

@Chevdove man! I hope you had/have a vocation in government and public affairs - because you are beautiful and have a beautiful way about you too! A lot of wars would not have been started if you were at Camp David! 😊 Also @Delano dang! Choosing based on past experiences is actually the antithesis of creation... Damn... maybe we’ve been doing this life thing all wrong. Thank you Delano and thank you @Chevdove for quoting!! Welp, “No lies detected here”.

WOW Thank you for your honesty! @Pioneer1 You are speaking truth, here. This is sad, but true when it comes to many African American men in this government. Again, WOW. I can understand on a personal basis too, especially about the 'black man not being financially secure'!!! And as far as you choosing not to do this or have children for this reason, I understand completely. I also understand why you would not want to do this 'by accident' and put out Black Children and suffer watching them suffer and also... blame you!!!--and NOT be able to recognize the part of this government!!! I can relate to this on a personal note!!! And this is why, even though, I understand your stance, if all Black men chose to do what you did, we would never win as a people though. So, I also don't blame others who do still marry Black women and have children and take on this HARD PLIGHT! My husband is getting is butt kicked--LOL! But I am so glad that he had 'an accident' with me!!! LOL! And, then he chose to marry me before the birth of my son! But, @Pioneer1 with your other beliefs on relationships, it's amazing that you did NOT have an accident--LOL. @Pioneer1 Yes, I can understand this too, but as a whole, when is there ever the right time? This government is bent on keeping us as Second class citizens. Okay, again @Pioneer1 Thank you for your honesty!!! But then, here is what I have to say about your response. Some men and women don't form a healthy spirit, a spirit that caused them to form a positive perspective and viewpoint about themselves--as they should fit in a physical world and go from this point to seek out a relationship with a person that fits their human presence. So, if you, as a man wanted to be married to the right kind of woman, then perhaps, you would have done that, but if you hook up with Black women that are shallow and who provide you an easy excuse to keep finding faults in our character, then you may be wasting you time. You know about Denzel Washington, right. That was what he said. He said that he was passed over when he was young and called ugly but, when he became older and confident, it became the opposite. And, that is what I have noticed with my sons. Just like Denzel said, regarding Black African American men. My sons were just 'invisible' by Black girls when they were young but, they built up a lot of confidence THAT CAME FROM ME! And so, by the time they reached high school, well, things changed dramatically!

Del I seriously wonder whose team you are on When it comes to disagreements on this site, no one has to "wonder" whose team YOU'RE on and will ALWAYS be on.....lol. Mel you"ve been unmasked as a hater of black women. All that whining about "white supremacy" and it turns out "you" the hater here. LOL ((shakes head)) Anyway...... So in other words, you won't tell us SOME of the terribly things you've alleged Black men did to you to justify your resentment towards them. I imagine you're not doing this for either one of two reasons: 1. NOTHING happened to you at the hands of a Black man and you are just using this "woe is me" crap as an excuse to justify your love for White men and contempt for Black men. or 2. Yes you did go through some issues with Black men but as bad as they were you know they were no worse than what White women have gone through with White men in their relationships; thus it doesn't justify your anti-Black man nonsense. Either way, you've been given multiple opportunities to justify your resentment and contempt for Black men and why you felt that that particular White man was so much better....but you failed to provide them. As far as I'm concerned any story of mistreatment at the hands of Black men you come up with after this will not be trusted. Chev It's about TIME you responded. I was waiting on YOU to respond to my post and all of these little "gremlins" popped up making a lot of noise...lol. But to answer your questions in detail: No I haven't been married to a woman of ANY race. Engaged twice...to Black women both times....but not married. So don't let Mel trick you by throwing that "to a Black woman" part in there, lol. And no, no children either. For two reasons: 1. I've been called ugly on more than one occasion so that cuts down on the amount of women who would want to marry and reproduce with me......lol. 2. I've been in the lower income bracket for much of my life and and still am. After witnessing what happened to one of my brothers, some of my cousins, and many other poor Black men in my community who had children by "accident" without being financially secure and mature enough to support them...I made the decision early in life to NOT have children until I was both married and financially stable. Although some have been disappointed, EVERY woman I've ever been involved with has respected my decision. But ofcourse people are free to make their own decisions as to when to get married have have children; however the years and years of community organization and social work I've done has shown me that over 60% of the problems Black people in America have can be DIRECTLY attributed to having children by "accident".....instead of properly planning for them. Having children they weren't psychologically mature enough or financially stable enough to take care of and those children grow up angry and with hate because they KNOW they weren't wanted and weren't treated properly growing up. I said I wasn't going to contribute to that.

@NubianFellow Thank you for breaking this down! Until now, I couldn't find the actual story. But I just read in the tabloids, yesterday, that he has returned to the set of that show, I think it's called, Empire. And I also read yesterday that the FBI has been requested to investigate the charges on his behalf. I'm not sure though. I only read briefly. But now, after your post, I am wondering if this is all some kind of hype that is coming from certain groups who want to draw more support for the LBGT cause and to connect this to Black Americans. I am wondering about this process due to this show called Empire, that I have heard about. I heard that the show is suppose to be really good, but i have no interest in watching it right now.

@Pioneer1You are really grasping at straws. It should've gone without saying that you were excluded from appreciating powerful white men who are kind because it's obvious you can't bring yourself to appreciate good character in a human being. That's how flawed your character is. And i hope you will continue to be offended by my not addressing Nubian Fellow the way you want me to. You don't tell me how to react to his words or what to call him. Just like Mel doesn't owe you any further explanations as to however she feels about black and white men. You act like you're somebody who we women here have to answer to, - somebody whose approval we should seek. Puleeze. I, myself, will continue to hold Nubian Fellow in high regard and believe that he is insightful enough to discern that i respect him as a strong black man who doesn't need me to "adopt him". You keep overlooking the things outside the subject of black beauty that he and i did agree on. I thought his observation that when it comes to white supremacy, black people aren't inferior, they just act inferior was truth in a nutshell. That was when he made a believer out of me, and was why i was glad that he became a regular on this board - for a while. @Del i couldn't care less about pioneer being an ally of mine or that he might hold black women in contempt. Any woman he holds in contempt must be doing something right. With allies like him, who needs enemies?

No qualifications needed. Your foolishness is part and parcel of this community.

@Delano thank you! But let’s not use Pioneer’s avatar as an example of how black men behave. His account is not a representative of any black man I take seriously. At least none I’ve ever met in real life. I’ve said this before, and I’ll say it again - his avatar reminds me of a group of people using one account. The Pioneer1 account displays as the social media’s version of FBI’s cointelpro... or the reverse black kkk lol - I’m not phased by the Pioneer1 account - I’m tickled by it ... reminds me of the black uncle everyone keeps their distance from and says “yea ok”.

@Pioneer1what are you going to do file police charges on my behalf? Sign up to be my fixer? Lol! get out of here with your little list. You’re not qualified to assess what women find too difficult to talk about.

@Pioneer1 Why do you ask?

Thank you for this thread Chev, I love hearing PERSONAL TESTIMONIES to hisorical events! I place much more value in them than I do in mere "information" presented in history books because they provide much more detail as well as an aire of legitimacy that contemporary historic scholarship doesn't for me. A few quick points I'd like to make................ 1. Having a White racist mother herself, your husband's grandmother was actually MIXED RACE and that explains how a lot of the poision of racism came into many of these so-called "Native American" communities down the line. This is one of the reasons I'm so specific and detail orieinted when it comes to defining race and insisting that mixed people are MIXED PEOPLE and shouldn't be called "Black" or "White" or "Native American". ....to prevent confusion. Which leads me to my 2nd point. 2. I'm careful to separate TRUE Native Americans who tend to be brown skinned with straight Black hair and more rounded features....from MIXED RACE people who CLAIM to be Native Americans but actually have predominately Caucasian genes. These fake $5 Indians who own many of the casinos in the United States tend to be nearly White skinned and are very racist against not only AfroAmericans but even TRUE Native Americans! This causes confusion for a lot of AfroAmericans because often times they'll encounter racism or read about a racist incident from one of these FAKE Indians and then make the mistake of believing "Native Americans" did this or felt this way. Many of these fake phony $5 Indians actually owned slaves but few people know that they were actually either Caucasians or Caucasians with only a trace amount of Native American ancestry DISGUISING themselves as Native Americans. 3. Although you didn't go into detail on it, people should know that Africans have been living in the Americas WITH the Native Americans for hundreds if not thousands of years BEFORE Columbus. Hell, even Columbus reported seeing Black African "tribes" who dwelled with the Native Americans. Mansa Musa's brother Abubakari and a crew of other Africans saild over here during the 13th century and the Olmec heads of African men with helmets could very well be more evidence of this.

Welp, @Troy your response to Chevdove applies perfectly to your explanation to me...And I couldn’t have said it better. Your foundation forms your worldview. Everything you’ve “learned” is synthesize through that lens.

@Mel Hopkins You are so right. Again, you are so right. Thank you, Thank you, Thank you!!!!!!!!!! Oh Gosh! I needed this!!!!!!! Thank you so much!!!! Oh Wow! Okay, I am probably wrong, but I actually thought that Shakespeare may have had some cultural connection to being 'Black' and that was why I love that quote. I read somewhere that the other poets did not like him. They called him an Upstart CROW. And they did not like it that the queen of England liked him! And lastly, some of his writings were based of of the Bible, I think either Songs of Solomon or Psalms or something like that. Okay, @Troy Since you saw the need in mentioning a 'book' King James commisioned, it is okay if I comment in response? "Beliefs one holds usually have nothing to do with reason or logic"? Well, when I compare: [1] Trump's Maga platform [2] the 'book' King James Commissioned, and [3] your assessment in that 'usually' ones belief has nothing to do with reason or logic, then I think about this; Trump's life is less than 100 years, your life is less then 100 years, King James life was less than 100 years, but the 'collection of books' that the king commissioned to be translated by a body of learned people, books that had been written by over 100s of people over the course of thousands of years, I guess you are right in your assessment in regards to people's beliefs usually not based on any sound reason or logic.

Your year is vintage.

If or when you can put pain to paper. You will free yourself from the past and others in the future. That's is my feeling. Baring your pain and shame is reliving it until it has no power over you.

Metaphysics also means beyond the physical. And some use it interchangeably with the esoteric

Ask the women if this is true in this forum or anywhere else. Noticed that Mel liked my comment to Nubian. Why di yiu think is the case. So you think women feel heard and respected by men. @Troy And how did you arrive at the position?

How can you understand what someone's problem is, if you aren't them. Or dinner experience their triumphs and frustration. How can a man know what life is like for a woman.

@Pioneer1You're full of it. i'll let Mel speak for herself but, me, I like Nubian fellow and love the way he articulates his points. Not seeing eye-to-eye when it comes to black hair is the thing he and I disagree about. We haven't clashed about any other aspect of black beauty. He's very perceptive and realistic when it comes to black men, as well as the ramifications of Africa's downfall. And he is not obsessed with the ridiculous idea that black women idolize all white men and look down on all black ones. Your lies about us equating wealth coupled with kindness as a sign of extraordinary masculinity is just another indication of how you distort things. It's ludicrous for you to think you have to hip Nubian Fellow about what only exists in your mind, especially since he's perfectly capably of using his own judgment when it comes to the position taken by the women here. With nothing to back you up, you have tried to make him your ally by planting the idea in his head that we aren't or wouldn't be his ally, when we might very well be so, depending on the circumstances. And your petulant accusation about black women hating themselves just because after 4 centuries, they have earned the right to be their version of mainstream America is just an example of your stagnancy. Finally, why wouldn't we consider Nubian Fellow a "brother"? It's all in the family.

You should have stopped the FIRST time you realized it was a MAN and not a woman, but you didn't....lol. Put the crack pipe down before you pick up a pen.

Title: Who IZ the Boulé?: The History of America's First Black Fraternity and the Derailment Toward Afrikan Self-Reliance Written by M'Bwebe Ishangi January 2019 Paperback, 6 x 9 inches 282 pages ISBN: 978-0-578-21516-7 This book is a cumulation of over 20 years research that started with the question, "how far back does systemic global white supremacy go and more importantly, how have they been able to sustain it?" These two loaded questions sparked the origin of my journey that hit home when I zeroed in on “how” they sustained it. I learned to succeed, there had to be a vigilant effort to control the minds of Black folk. ‘Who IZ the Boulé?’, an extension of George G.M. James', 'Stolen Legacy', is an in-depth look at the next level of systemic racism created post the emancipation of slavery, complete with a ‘who’s who’ of those involved and why it was necessary to also create black organizations that identified with western culture and philosophy instead of Afrikan, tracing back to the origin of our oldest and most prestigious black organizations like the NAACP, Urban League, Jack & Jill, HBCUs, and Fraternities and Sororities. Available in Paperback ($20USD), eBook ($17), Digital PDF ($15), and Audiobook (Pre-Order $15, release May 1st) For more details: • https://bit.ly/2HE0YRy • Read the Foreword: https://bit.ly/2sTyRnq • email: mbwebe@daghettotymz.com . . . #WhoIZtheBoule #BGLOs #BlackHistory365 #TheBlackHistoryYouDontKnow #WhoFoundedBlackOrganizations #SupportBlackAuthors #ReadingIsSTILLFundamental

I gave information as to the current status of the case, something you can't comprehend because you are repelled by facts. How you can consider yourself well informed is laughable. You can't even come up with an assessment of the situation that is something other than the same ol tired rhetoric. Actually, the African American community, including you, is pissing on itself because they think Jussie is being railroaded by the Chicago police. Now wipe your snotty nose and shuffle on back into your dank black man cave before Mel and Del do another number on you. You can pass the time by fantasizing about being RKelly.

Chev LOL. It was funny. But @Pioneer1 knows I love him too. Nothing but love this way sis! Del You are behind in points you wanna go some more, Cabeza de Piedra. Do I want to go some more?? That's a question for your boyfriend at night, not me...lol. Besides, you got some nerve to criticize me when...... tu comprende como loco perro......lol.