Pioneer1

frankster True.. I asked for evidence but if you have proof then present it.. You asked for "evidence" for what? For the fact that people are ignorant of what happened here thousands of years ago and don't know? That's SELF evident....lol. One KEY piece of evidence that somebody may actually be wrong is when they try to tell you about something that happened over 1000 years ago. Anytime a human being tries to tell you about something that happened beyond a 1000 years ago that they haven't witnessed COULD easily be wrong. They may not be. They may actually be right. But they don't KNOW, that's my point. Yes....I experienced reading the information Lol.... Yeah well, EXPERIENCING watching porn isn't the same as actually EXPERIENCING sex....lol. Genetic memory How detailed is it? That maybe true... We are forced to accept the truth we know now and act from there......not the truth we may know in the future from which we cannot act True. We just need to make sure that what we THINK is true is ACTUALLY true, especially before acting on it. Just because a White man in a lab coat and glasses CLAIMS that it's true and wrote it in a book, doesn't make it so. Black people will serve well to stop arguing with EACHOTHER over information we got from White folks. ....and start getting it directly, ourselves. They came to their own conclusion reluctantly....that they were descended from Africans. How? Do THEY have a time machine over in China to verify this? Do Chinese themselves accept the Theory of Evolution or the Out of Africa Theory? There are many Realities and many levels to each Reality There is more to Reality than we both think or will ever know Facts. There is Your Reality and Shared Reality.....Shared Reality is agreed upon. Agreed. However I would tweak it a little by saying that Shared Reality is more PARTICIPATED IN than agreed upon. People are in it together whether some "agree" with it or not...lol. Not entirely true....its the same culture and geography Not for Racism. Racism spans the globe AND spans cultures. There is racism among the Indians of India. There is racism among the Spaniards of Spain. There is racism among the Arabs of Libya. It does need to be qualified....for its existence is dependent on society and its institutions Once something Exists, it ALWAYS Exists....even if only in the past. There is a difference between physical reality and social reality.... But it's still Reality. Race is Reality.....regardless of which CATEGORY of Reality you want to drop it in. You could fight? Still in the game. Sometimes winning....sometimes losing...but still playing. flee? Still playing the game. Just playing hide-n-go-seek....lol. "Peek a boo....I still see you ...nigger" play the game but by your own rules? You can try. just not cooperate? Still in the game. You'll just be penalized. "Stop resisting! Comply or die!" Being OUT of the game means you're no longer subject to the RULES of the game. If you're still subject to the RULES of the game (restricted actions and being punished) then you're definitely still IN the game. You're just a bad or uncooperative player. Ask the Haitians and the thousands of Maroons settlements that existed.....Palenques and Quilombos True. The Haitians of the past escaped the game. The Haitians of today are participants. Evidence of it is how they're constantly being dealt a bad hand by the dealer. You not in the game....they trying to get you to play You can be in the game without playing....just riding the bench, lol.

The only "problem" in sports betting is that there aren't enough AfroAmericans in office to regulate and legalize it and especially in the law enforcement sector that handle such issue to prevent unfair "selective enforcement" of the law. This is supposedly a "free" country so if people want to waste their money away gambling or MAKE a fortune gambling...it should be their decision. It's really a "problem" only because so much money is being circulated around without taxes being taken out. The numbers game was a "problem" too....until the states started running and regulating it and get THEIR cut of the money.....now it's promoted.

And as expected......many of those in the so-called "New Black Media" came out running interference for Trump. Claiming his latest racist actions weren't "that bad", and that other people in the cartoon were depicted as animals too, or saying it was just a distraction designed to anger Black Americans and get us out into the streets to help with the protests. Little actual condemnation on their part. I'm never surprised at Trump's racism, but I have to admit I am a little surprised that Trump or any sitting president would brazenly and flippantly promote such an openly racist image. He's clearly testing the waters. ProfD Now this DID surprise me....just a little...lol. This tells me that he's more of a fool than a sell-out. A true sell-out would have kept his mouth shut and diverted attention or simply would have ignored it to keep getting those bags, but this clown appeared to be genuinely hurt that the man "he loved" would do something like that...lol. Shows how foolish and gullible he is for his white massa. Him being hurt shows that he didn't think Trump WOULD do something like this; silly as hell. I done told yall..... That man ain't planning on leaving in a few years. He's not planning to leave at all! He takes being re-elected as a mandate from his supporters that he should be king...lol. If the ride gets a little bumpy, it'll be because those buses took the back roads to the concentration camps to stay off the main highways.

frankster Present the evidence? No, present the PROOF. Evidence is anything that supports your assertion. You can have evidence that supports it and then have evidence that contradicts it too. PROOF settles the question or erases doubt. Where is the PROOF? If memory serves....the earliest people of the americas are the so-called Clovis people then the found luzia - turns out she was African. Remembering something means you experienced or observed it in the past. You must be pretty old to "remember" something you experienced or observed yourself, from hundreds if not THOUSANDS of years ago...lol. Every generation some "new evidence" pops up claiming this or that history in the Americas. It may or may not be true, I'm not sure. Plenty of conjecture, theories, clay pots somebody dug up or painting on a wall in a cave somewhere..... But my point is...it's all THEORY....not FACT. Because..... again....no person today was around to witness it, so people shouldn't be so zealous about it. 100 years from now "new evidence" will pop up claiming the very opposite. Even the Chinese spent millions of $$$$ to prove that they were not descendants of Africans. And maybe they weren't. Again, we don't KNOW that they were. We have the San people of southern Africa with slant eyes and yellow skin. Other than them, we don't have anybody else in Africa who remotely looks like Chinese people. Yes... Not all realities enduring and exist independent of and stand on it own....some realities are dependent limited transient manmade constructions. Reality is Reality. If it's in Existence....it's Reality. Doesn't matter WHERE in Reality it is....if it Exists....it's Reality. Racism today is not the same as racism of yesteryears True. Like any religion it modifies and transforms itself based on time, culture, and geography to fit it's contemporary needs. Socially realities only exist within societies....as soon as those social structures are no longer supported- they fade Social Realities EXIST -stop right there, lol. No need to qualify it. Physically realities exist independent of society....within without before after and during. Physical Realities EXIST -stop right there, lol. Anything else beyond that is food for argument. No You have free will... You can refuse to play... or refuse to play by the rules of the game Do you consider having only 2 options: play the game or commit suicide......"free will"???? If you're living in a racist society and don't have the power to get out of it or destroy it, what else can you do besides participate/play in it or exit it through death? Refusing to play the game often leads to INCARCERATION in which you're still playing/participating in the game even if unwillingly. Getting punished or injured....you're still in the game. Unless you're powerful enough to destroy it or get out from under it's authority, the only exit is DEATH.

Chev You are absolutely contradicting yourself. How so? Explain...if you can, lol. You have an elementary form of understanding script. You don't understand "the script" AT ALL...lol. Because you haven't even read it. If so...where is it? You said it was locked up somewhere inaccessible. So how do you even KNOW what "the script" says? As one who taught language arts in public schools, you cannot even master basic language art skills that student in Middle School must master before they can achieve in higher education @Pioneer1. In your own words, you think linear. LOL. Yes. Linear means thinking STRAIGHT. A leads to B leads to C Straight forward...as opposed to thinking in circles and "thinking" you're being smart and super intelligent but not yielding any results. Your mind is so confused. If I'm confused and you're not, why haven't YOU solved the problems in our community then? Give us the answers that will SOLVE OUR PROBLEMS. Just as I had said, the White Supremacist have used us, African Americans starting from the beginning of Chattel Slavery times from childhood to put out corruption and to infiltrate Africa with their perversion. But not you...because you aren't confused. So give us the solution...lol. For this reason, thousands of years ago, as this is a repeated pattern of the Devil, the Creator God judges the adults who formed and after the third and fourth generations, He overhauls the systems. Black people have been in the U.S. for dozens of generations....has it been "overhauled" yet? Trump is in office right now.....is it being overhauled? Or are you speaking about that which you don't know? White folks were in power 400 years ago and they're in power today. Only a small percentage of the Blacks, even though, have been oppressed under racism will not make it into the New World When is this "new world" you speak of coming in? Is it after death? Is it in 2026 or 2027? People have been believing in a New World being established for HUNDREDS of years and their bodies have died and turned to dust waiting for it to come. Give me a date. You said that Adam was a White male and your source is a White Hebrew book. smh. Do you believe in the Bible? I don't. Nor do I believe in Adam. I simply use them as examples for people who DO believe in them. But I don't. Adam was an ALLEGORY. A symbol of the White race. We were here on this planet for MILLIONS of years before Adam or the White race. But if YOU believe in the Bible, then do YOU believe the Hebrew language is legitimate and that the book of Genesis was written in it? It is your understanding that the Creator could not form Adam in his own image and also use the dust of the earth elements to fashion him. I didn't say that. Find me the quote. It is your understanding that the Creator could not use the bones of Adam to clone Eve. I didn't say that. Find me the quote. It is your understanding that we, Blacks should not understand genetics and Y chromosome genes versus X chromosome genes. Now I DID say that....lol. Did YOU see the x and y chromosomes personally or was this something else you got from a White man's so-called "scientific" text book? I know you said you went to school for it but learning something in a classroom and observing it in real life are usually 2 different things. Have YOU confirmed the existence of X and Y chromosomes yourself with a microscope or some other form of technology to confirm this? Man I could not imagine you, as an old man exposing this kind of mindset to the next generations of Black Americans. As opposed to what? Smoking that fake ass weed so many younger people are smoking today? Many of the younger people are homeless, hopeless, and sexually confused. Since you don't want to expose the youth to the old man, then get with the young men you THINK have all the answers and ask them why haven't THEY solved the damn problems in society? Hell, if they're so smart....we should see some progress. If THEY aren't confused and are so smart and have the answers and know about the X and Y chromosomes....lol....use that knowledge to solve the problems and bring in the New World! .....don't waste time arguing with old men online about Adam and Eve and what they did up in the Garden, lol. That is why even Moses could not cross into the Promised Land. The Creator will not expose Black people to Colorism and White Supremacy even among us Black folk when he makes his move to overhaul humanity. You don't know WHAT Moses did, because you weren't around to witness it. All you know is what you read in some book. Nor do you know what THE CREATOR is going to do, because you aren't THE CREATOR. Again, if you and those you think are smart have the answers.....why don't YALL build a better planet or society what the so-called "knowledge" that you have???? Why argue scripture and script when you can USE it as a blueprint to build a new and better world???? Jesus said that many of the Children of the kingdom will not make it into heaven. You don't know what Jesus said either. How? Where is HIS book or HIS words? Do you have that script? Or is THAT locked away in a cave somewhere too? THIS is one of the reasons why traffic on discussion boards is low but social media traffic is high....... Because people don't like their ideas and views challenged. They like to post 1 or 2 sentences on Instagram and facebook with no evidence to support what they're saying and get a bunch of likes and thumbs up. Anybody questioning or challenging their assertions are simply blocked or banned.

"Dolemite is the name...... Knockin' over beehives is MY game!"

Chev I can't rewrite what has been written down. It was written in codes. Daniel sealed up prophecy, meaning he wrote in codes and so did all of the prophets. If that's the case, then how do YOU know what it says? Have you even read these scriptures for yourself? Who told you about them. I already explained one major prophecy about Black people that worship White people: The prophecy of the Bay and Grisled Horses. Where did you get that prophecy from? You believe in the interpretation of White Racist, all the while have not answered my question about the scientific proof of it today. I don't believe in any man-made book. Religious OR Scientific. If I can't get proof of it myself....I'm not believing in it. They can come up with all this "chromosome X and Y this" and "DNA that"....but yet they can't even figure out what causes and cures the common cold. Chromosome Y = y/why you believe in that shit....lol. here is the genetic proof today, of the reproduction of this OTHER MALE that you believe that the Bible is saying was also CREATED!? According to YOUR Bible....ONE male was create and the OTHER male was made or formed from dirt. There's a difference between CREATED and MADE/FORMED. When you CREATE something you bring it into existence out of...as they say...."thin air". You think or speak it and it exists. On the other hand when you MAKE or FORM something you take substances that is already here and put it together like making a cake or building a building. You take the material already here and shape it and form it to make something else. In the Bible YOU believe in (not me) one chapter speaks of males and females being CREATED together and in the next chapter it speaks of a man being FORMED/MADE from dirt and a woman being MADE from his rib. 2 different groups of people being put on the planet. One group created....another group made.

That's because YOU live in Wakanda. That place where all of the Black people are living large and lavish....lol. "Excuse my appearance. I just got back from a power luncheon and didn't have a chance to CHANGE into my late afternoon lounging attire."

Troy No cognitive dissonance is required to hold more than two thoughts in my head at the same time. I know...lol. And that describes YOUR thinking when it comes to race. -On one hand you claim that race is a social construct and acknowledge there are Black people. -On the other hand you claim that multiple races don't exist and don't accept that they do. If you accept that race is an idea constructed by society how can you deny the details OF that construction by claiming multiple races don't exist? You have a site dedicated to "Black" literature. What do you mean when you say "Black"??? Yeah, apply your subject pioneer-race-scale to these women and enlighten us. All the while proving the absurdity different race Lol..... Martin Luther King and Malcolm X and many other AfroAmerican leaders acknowledged they reality of different races, were THEY "absurd"? Many people in Congress and judges around the nation acknowledge that multiple races exist and promote laws to circumvent racism in America. Are you smarter than them? Do you know something THEY don't know that makes their behavior silly and absurd to focus on such "nonsense"??? Come on out of De'Nile bro, and dry yourself off.....lol. frankster We Know.....every scientific school of thought we have that has a bearing on this issue comes back supporting African and Africans being the source of all Human beings That's simply not true. They don't know....they merely theorize based on evidence they find. The evidence that contradicts this....such as the evidence they find in MesoAmerica.....is simply ignored because it doesn't fit the "out of Africa" narrative they CURRENTLY promote. The fact is, human beings today simply don't KNOW. They can theorize and hypothesize but they don't KNOW because they weren't around to see it....those are the FACTS. Racism Race and Races only has reality in a social setting where it is accepted as true and enforce it by law and practice "only has reality" is still REALITY none the less. Like telling a person, "You're only rich because your father left you the money". Yeah...but they're still rich...lol. Same as how only in a game of monopoly do you get $200 for passing Go...because the players accept it as true and enforce it by rule and play. But the game exists. And you're forced to play it. That White police officer who is looking for suspects WILL acknowledge race and use race to communicate with and identity the suspects he's looking for regardless of how much YOU think he shouldn't. Laws and rules acknowledge race and races whether or not we "think' they should be acknowledged or not.

Neely Fuller Jr. would say in that deep voice of his: "To the extent that it promotes and expands White supremacy........." When they use the Bible they WEAPONIZE it and use it for their benefit to oppress others....not keep themselves in check for follow some sort of moral guidelines. It's not just them. Look at how the Arabs in the Middle East and Africa use the Quran and their religion to justify enslaving Black people. I read a report the other day that the Taliban have re-instated or legalized Slavery in Afghanistan again! Racists don't use ANYTHING the same as other people do....especially Black folks. They use it to their benefit. Niggaz...on the other hand....use the Bible to justify their cowardice and NOT fighting back. They'll take the same book and point to the "turn the other cheek" or "forgive your enemy" passages to explain why they didn't fight back when the slaver master killed their own mother in front of them.

richardmurray I see:) i am dictatorial in my style, I stifle imagination with the structure of my posts ok I your commentary did not attack or offend the post. Talking about who contest beauty pageants is within the topic of beauty pageants. My point is that these two black owned beauty pageants have emphasized women who can not be deemed yella/white/mulatto while not excluding the range of all black women which are all shades of brown. And since they both exists in the usa, which is a white european country, I think they are fine examples of black ownership that is honest to the larger situation of black people. Your point is well taken. However my commentary that points out OTHER aspect of "Black" beauty contests doesn't divert or cloud out your point. My offense to your point, is that your talking about black media pundits, not the black owned beauty pageants. How so? I'm not about to go back to the beginning of this thread and read everything I said through a magnifying glass, however regardless as to whatever you took from it...my focus was that we need to make sure the Black women were BLACK women. Not identity thieves. Said pundits are mostly male, who are on white owned media outlets usually, with their most beautiful black woman is the yellaist black woman narrative... Exactly. They are brainwashed too. See my point. Chev Okay. I have to go back and read the full thread! Lol... You don't have to, just read my first few posts to see where I was going. Yes, Vanessa obviously shows some mixed traits, but man! She is Black IMO. She shows more than just "some" mixed traits....she's clearly MORE White than she is Black. And her father....in that photo atleast....is a straight up White man....lol. That's why I prefer the term "AfroAmerican" for people like her. She is part of our culture and ethnic group. I have family members who look just like her. She's part of our culture and has an African lineage, despite the amount of White ancestry she has. But racially speaking...she's not a Black woman. I fee it's an insult to Black women to point to HER as an example. Well, as a dark skinned Sista, I can certainly appreciate your views!!! However, @Pioneer1 history does not lie and some light skinned Black' people have been severely oppressed for being Black or of the Black American culture. Well you're an anomaly....lol. Most dark skinned sistaz I grew up with HATED the preferential treatment so many light skinned and mixed women got in the community in terms of jobs, marriage, and acting positions....especially in music videos. They didn't see light skinned people as being oppressed or victims of colorism. Yes...to WHITE people...they were still "niggers" and they faced racism from them...but from the Black community? A few snide remarks and resentment by darker skinned people is nothing compared to the GLORY and UPLIFTMENT some lighter skinned people often have gotten in our community in the past. Many if not most of the past leader in the AfroAmerican community have been light skinned and mixed from WEB Dubois to Huey Newton and Malcolm X and currently Minister Farrakhan. There's a reason for that. It taps into the subconscious love and respect many of our people have for light/white skin.

Beyonce Shakira Besides one being CALLED "Black" and the other being CALLED White....what is the phenotypical difference between these two women?

Chev I just showed you the origins of TWO DIFFERENT groups of people in the same Biblical book of Genesis. One in the first chapter, and the other in the second. Lol.... But you wanna sit up there and act like you didn't see what you just read, huh? "That ain't in MY Bible. I don't know WHAT he talkin' bout."

Chev You are pushing White Supremacy with your White reference for the name 'Adam' This isn't white "supremacy"....it's an actually FACT that the word "Adam" means "red" in Hebrew. You don't want to accept this FACT. , and this is exactly what the Bible said that we 'Blacks' would do. Well can you please show me the SCRIPTURE that says "Blacks" would do "such and such". I want to see those very words. Not some "interpretation. Your reference is from the 'White man's book whether or not it is stated to be a Hebrew dictionary'. The Bible ITSELF is a White man's book because it was White men who gave it to us. Who gave the Americans slaves....out Ancestors...the Bible? It was passed down to us from them FROM White folks. Even if you believe that Adam means 'Red' It's not a matter of "belief"....Adam MEANS RED. It's a FACT...plain and simple. If you want more Biblical evidence, Jacob's brother Esau was also called "Edom" because he was red and hairy. Edom and Adam both mean RED and they are the same Hebrew word with different vowels in English. that does not negate the fact that all black males have 'red' blood and some black males show this RED SKIN TONE even though they are very dark skinned like some of my own relatives that I have seen. Show me a picture of a dark skinned Black person with "red" skin tone. You're making things up to fit the scriptures. You're lying again about the Bible. The Bible does say that Adam is the beginning and gives a complete lineage up to Jesus Christ. Oh really????? Genesis Chapter 1 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. 29 And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. 30 And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so. 31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day. Genesis Chapter 2 2 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made. 4 These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the Lord God made the earth and the heavens, 5 And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the Lord God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground. 6 But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground. 7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. 15 And the Lord God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it. 16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: 17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. 18 And the Lord God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him. 19 And out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof. If we were read these scriptures LINEARLY and as they are: 1. God CREATED male and female together and this as on the 6th day. Later on 2. Lord God FORMED a man from the dust of the Earth called "Adam" and he was alone! 3. In chapter 1 MEN AND WOMEN were created together. In the 2nd Chapter we read about ONE MAN who was MADE ALONE And it was decided that it wasn't good for him to be alone and later on Eve was made for him. ONE group were males and females CREATED TOGETHER ANOTHER group was a man who was FORMED from dirt or dust and later on a woman made for him from his rib So there were people created BEFORE Adam...who was a MADE man.

Chev Confusing Then allow me to offer some clarity....lol. Although both concepts often overlap...... One is more focused on RACE and NATIONALITY : Black American The other is more focused on ETHNICITY: AfroAmerican The Black race who are American citizens!!! What a thought. I guess then, due to many freed Blacks during Chattel Slavery times, they would fit your description of 'A Black American citizen'. However; Some would, some wouldn't. ALL of them would be "AfroAmericans". But only those who are of predominant African decent would qualify as "Black". Free or not, the obvious Mulattos and Quadroons wouldn't qualify as "Black American" but they would definitely qualify as AfroAmerican because they are of our culture and lineage and history. People with light skin and wavy hair and keen features usually have too much White ancestry to qualify as being called "Black" anything. As far as who you're calling "Black Indians"............. There obviously were plenty of Black people (actual Black....lol) here through out the Americas for generations before Columbus and the other Europeans, but I wouldn't call them "Indians". Indians or those brown skinned people with straight hair whom we call "Native Americans" are clearly of a separate race. Just because White folks have tried to steal their identity, doesn't mean they were Black. They were much darker...but weren't Black. They were brown skinned...in my cases dark brown skinned....but still weren't Black folks. [1] The first and ORIGINAL Black American of the Black race would be an American Indian and a Native American of the Black race. [2] The first and Original Black American 'citizen' would then come before 1865 could be well, --who knows?-- Both freed Blacks and some left over Black Indians that did not get killed off or massacred and were part of the American government as Bounty Hunters or scouts or something like that perhaps. I tell my husband, at times, 'You know, you are truly, as an American Indian and a Black Indian at that, --the Original African American--, way before the DOS were forced over here on slave ships'. AfroAmericans are the descendants of enslaved Africans who are primarily Black but mixed with other races to various degrees. Black American citizens, whether or not they came recently from places like Nigeria, or Ethiopia, or Brazil, etc. and became Black American citizens, no matter, they would still be referred to as AfroAmerican. An AfroAmerican can also be 'An AfroAmerican citizen' as well, so what's the distinction? No, they aren't AfroAmericans. AfroAmericans are strictly those who hail from the lineage of enslaved Africans....regardless of racial admixture afterwards. Black Americans are ANY Black people....Nigerian, Brazilians, or even AfroAmericans....with a predominant amount of African or Black features and look Black AND have or acquired American citizenship. If they aren't an American citizen, they aren't Black Americans. Remember, both groups: AfroAmericans AND Black Americans tend to overlap eachother at times We are all mixed no matter what time period we came from. All of us people of African descent are mixed with something, but at one point, we came from Africa. So no matter if the term is 'Black' or 'African' as it applies to African origins, meaning the continent of Africa, it doesn't seem to be a difference. True, but some are more mixed than others. Some are mixed to the point of no longer being considered Black. In my opinion their MUST be a demarcation line set for BOTH race and ethnicity. Somebody has to "gate keep" our lineage and culture to preserve it. Somebody has to "gate keep" the Black race to preserve it too. So, I think these terms, [1] Black American, [2] Black American citizen, and [3] AfroAmerican, can be used interchangeably, however, the term FBA might be more unique in its definition in relation to chattel slavery and also American Indians and Native Americans that are of African 'Black' descent. The problem with "FBA" or Foundational BLACK American is that many of them aren't actually Black racially. Beyonce and Shemar Moore would be considered FBA....but neither is Black phenotypically. That's why I like the term AfroAmerican to describe those of us from that specifical lineage. It includes people of various phenotypes and admixtures as long as their ancestry came through American Slavery.

frankster No they are not....but land and geography do influence genes - those influences are then passed on Truth Poor choice as an example Professional Sommeliers or Wine Connoisseur can and do....as it is part of how they make their living. Well thanks for educating me. I didn't know that. It comes down to where you wish to stop.....but we know the source is African Do we KNOW this or simply BELIEVE this? In other words..... How does one "know" something without experience or direct observation? Who is alive today to have experienced or directly observed the first human or humans and where they were located before spreading to other parts of the planet? If nobody is; then all people are doing is hypothesizing and theorizing. Yes...Race as a social construct is a convention....where in varies attributes are agreed upon as it constituents. just as one can predicated a whole new race on individuals who have red hair or eleven fingers True on all three assertions. Infact, the reality of their being multiple races IS defended by this very ideology you just offered! Troy Of course I don’t believe in multiple races! I thought I made that abundantly clear over the years. And there are those who are sufficiently powerful enough to exploit the nonsensical belief, people have in multiple races and use it as a tactic to divide us for their personal benefit. Then you truly don't believe that race is a social construct. If you did, you'd acknowledge it but assert that you DIDN'T AGREE with their being multiple races....because of what it implies. But being a construct, you'd still accept it as a reality. To proclaim that the concept of race or multiple races as "social constructs" then turn around and deny it's existence because to accept it would suggest that one is perpetuating racism -sounds like denial as well as cognitive dissonance.

Chev Adam as 'a white man' is not possible unless he came from the anatomically straight YDNA haplogroup with origins from one Black African male individual of which all males today come from. The very word ADAM literally means "red" or "of blood". Any Hebrew dictionary will confirm this. The color link to the story of creation and its key word ‘adam’ comes by the word ‘adom,’ red. The close connection between the physical, perceptual elements becomes now even tighter: red, adom is the color of dam, blood. The chain: Adam-adama-dam-adom, men-ground-blood-red is the metaphorical mirror of God’s language in the physical word. Hebrew Word of the Day - Red - אָדֹם It's the literal description of so-called White people --- who are not actually "white" but pinkish or red colored....especially in hot climates like Africa or the Middle East. As opposed to the Black, Brown, and Yellow people who don't or rarely blush unless they're MIXED with "adam" ancestry...lol. In other regions and cultures like North East Africa...the people called "White" in America are often called "red" people. You're correct in suggesting that the first man or human couldn't be White because Black people couldn't have come from them. But you're speaking of Adam as if HE was the first man or human, when he was not. Adam was NOT the first man and the Bible doesn't even say he was the first man. According to the Bible, Cain left and went to the land of Nod and found a wife. If Adam and Eve were the first and only people on the planet where did Cain find a wife and enough people to populate a city after he allegedly built one? I don't agree with all of the Bible but it does contain a lot of truth. The main problem is people have been INTERPRETING it in a very narrow way that has led to confusion. Just as the Holy Bible states repeatedly, White Supremacy is professed and forwarded by millions of both, Black Africans and Whites who do not believe in the truth as it is confirmed with science and genetics and agrees with the Bible. We have free choice and free will. Well just remember that the same White folks who wrote or edited the Bible hundreds of years ago are the same White people who are writing the scientific text books. So BOTH of them may have to be taken with a grain of salt....lol. It wouldn't be wise to whole heartedly trust ANYTHING that comes from the hands of your open enemy whether it's religious OR scientific. It's not the Mayan Indians who gave the world the Bible and modern Scientific books.....but White folks. It's not the Nigerians who gave the world the Bible and modern Scientific books....but White folks. It's not the Eskimos or Hindus or Congolese who is putting out this material for us to debate over...but White folks. The same people. Yes the Ethiopians have an original scripture, but that's not the Bible that WE have.....the King James version. The script is different and it's not in English. I'm not sure if what the Ethiopians have is "holy" or not...but what WE'RE reading.....the KJV.....is without a doubt a book from the hands of White folks.

Chev Within this context, I think @Pioneer1 may have brought in some confusion and issues that was not intended for this thread!!! This thread was to highlight the advancement of Black women in these pageants. But although I did NOT read any of his post yet, I do plan to though, go back and read his post, because I recognized from other comments the contention that was presented and I do understand why @Pioneer1 would interject some of these contentions, but I know it is frustrating though. If confusion was brought in, that wasn't my intention. However our brother richarmurray may have to learn not to be so dictatorial as to demand that everybody march lock-n-step with HIS train of thought in every thread he produces. Thought...like speech...flows. When you start putting narrow limits and boundaries on it, you're intending to stifle creativity. Maybe my mistake was apologizing in advance...lol. Maybe I should have said what I had to say and he wouldn't have been offended by it. Anyway, as for what I said...... I simply stated that when we talk about Black beauty pageants, we need to make sure that the contestants are actually BLACK. Not mixed or damn near White like a lot of women are who are held up as representations of "Black beauty". Vanessa Williams....whom you just brought up...is a GREAT example. She's clearly mixed race and in my opinion is more White than Black. If you want to call her "Miss America"....because any particular race isn't specified for THAT pageant. But it would be crazy as hell to call a woman who looks as White as she does "Miss Black America". It would be an insult to the Black race in general and Black women in specific for a seeming "white" woman to steal the glory and win the prize over very beautiful brown skinned and dark skinned women. No other group would allow that. There are many Black Latinas, but when they choose a "Miss Latina" they aren't going to choose one. They choose women who look like the MAJORITY of their women.....brown with straight hair.

Nice grandstand.....lol.....🙄....but I didn't see an ANSWER to my question anywhere up there. Music is a social construct, and there are multiple genres of music. Politics is a social construct, and there are multiple political parties. Since you believe that race is a social construct, do you believe that there are MULTIPLE RACES? The question is quite clear and concise.

Troy I didn't say being a male or woman was a social construct. First thing's first....... Before we agree on what race is "based on" you must first acknowledge that there ARE multiple races among humanity.

Troy and Cynique Well..... Since both of you have your minds made up about what you THINK I believe or represent....regardless as to what I actually say/type....why waste time with explanations, evidence, and proof of my assertions? I'm going to let you two have eachother.....lol.

Troy I'm learning one cannot have a meaningful conversation with others on a given subject if there is not a basic foundation of shared knowledge. Nor can you have a meaningful conversation on a given subject with others if your mind is already made up and you refuse to entertain an alternative point of view...lol. Gender is a social construct. It's based in PSYCHLOGY and SOCIOLOGY...not genetics. There is no DNA or genes that you can point to as traits of a "gender". frankster Where Humanity is Cream Then Flavor is like unto ethnicity You can make that comparison. Or perhaps you can say that the COLOR of the ice cream is the race where as the FLAVOR of it is it's ethnicity....lol. Racial categorization is quite fluid. Isn't that one of the advertised purpose of those genealogy companies to ascertain where you ancestors originate....like Ancestor.com and 23andme. Yes. And I question THAT as well. Current understanding among the lay public is that they can..... Genes aren't tied to land or geography. You can determine who descended from WHO but not necessarily from WHERE any more than you can determine whether the wine you drink came from grapes descended from those grown in California or France. My personally opinion is that is not exactly what they do or are doing They are aggregating current DNA as to where they are most abundant in the so-called old world..... It has little bearing on where your ancestors originated from but more on where your DNA co hurts are now..... Exactly. They are taking DNA samples and matching them with where on the planet there seems to be a pool of others with those same genes and THEORIZING that as the "origin" of that particular group. Going by that method.... Most AfroAmericans will show "origins" of being from the Southern United States. But then going further back....it can also show "origins" of being from the Caribbean. But going further back...it can also show "origins" of being from West Africa. But going further back....we know that most West Africans migrated to that region from Northern and Eastern Africa and THAT will be the new "origin". It goes on and on. When you combine Migration patterns History Anthropology Archeology and Genealogy....then you can make a very accurate guess as to where your ancestors are from WHICH ancestors? That's the issue. My Parents are my Ancestors......and so are my Great, Great, Great, Great, Great, Great, Great Grand Parents. One time period will show ONE geographical location but another time period before familial migration will show ANOTHER geographical location. That's the point I'm getting at. You can only know who came from WHO....but not the region those genes originated from. That maybe so....but Race has no basis in genetics. Skin color does. Hair texture does .....race is usually predicated on these characteristics among others. They both have a different history and relationship with the particular Land....that must be weight - and negotiated. In other words, you're not sure...lol.

In that Friday comparison..... It's interesting how most of the women seem to look better NOW than they did 30 years ago...lol. Most women don't like showing their age.

Well....... That didn't last long, lol. Nobody can say I didn't TRY to make peace!