Pioneer1

Troy you clearly don’t live in the south my brother. I can’t even wrap my brain around what you just wrote. It was intellectually dishonest for you to leave off a key word in my statement. I said MOST....not all...MOST. And would you disagree with it? Do you believe MOST Black folks in the U.S. know how to farm and fish? frankster Understand this None of the Great Powers are able to keep any other power from Intervening inside their respective Countries 100%. Understood. But my question is, do they NEED to do this at 100%? If they can secure their borders and the influence and information that flows in and out of their nation ENOUGH, most nations would be satisfied. Show me the Truth in your Analysis....? Look at the current situation in Haiti as a stark example. You have several groups of armed men. The media calls them "gangs". I would call them militias. But all of them are armed and fighting eachother over territory, money, and resources that already exist or is promised to come in. How many of them are talking about farming to be able to feed their population, building new schools to educate the population, and building a new infrastructure for the nation? Any of them building hospitals? Zimbabwe. So, 2 questions: 1. Did the Black population of Zimbabwe forcibly KICK OUT the White power structure that ruled the land or were they GRANTED so-called "independence" from that power structure? 2. Is the nation of Zimbabwe currently THRIVING?

Man....is that your favorite word or something? You're the ONLY one I hear using it online OR offline...lol. But to answer your question.....and it actually is a pretty good question..... The simple and straight forward answer is I'M NOT SURE. But to go in more detail, I'll say consider 2 things............ 1. Knowing everything that will take place doesn't necessarily equate to predetermination. It suggests it, but doesn't equate to it. Kind of like programing a computer SUGGESTS that you will know how it operates.....but this doesn't necessarily EQUATE to it. Only KNOWING HOW IT WILL OPERATE equates to knowing how it will operate, regardless of who programmed it and how it was intended to operate. 2. If you consider the MULTI-REALITY Theory that suggests that ALL possibilities exist and are being played out somewhere in existence. Then ofcourse all things are predetermined by the Omniscient BEING because all things and all scenarios exist actually exist! But as an individual you could still have a choice as to which Reality you navigate through. And yes, the Omniscient BEING knows which Reality you'll choose to naviage through. But that doesn't necessarily mean THEY made that choice for you....THEY knew you'd choose it. Like I said about....knowing the choice you'll make may not necessarily mean THEY programmed you to make that choice. It may suggest it, but doesn't hard rock guarantee that this is the case. So perhaps predetermination AND individual free-will exists side by side if you accept the Multi-Reality Theory.

Don't get me wrong....... I'm not saying they were "enemies" of Black people. Not sure about Gaddafi and what all he did for Black people outside of gifting and loaning money to the Nation of Islam, but Castro did MANY magnificent things for Black people around the planet from funding and assisting in revolutions around Africa to sending aid and help to Black and poor struggles around the Americas. I'm just saying that a Black coalition needs to be led by BLACK PEOPLE. Not a White nor almost-White "savior". What does it say about us, that we aren't doing it on our own and need them? That actually defeats the purpose. Replace the French of British colonizer with a White Latino or White Berber colonizer....what's the difference? If I were one of the rich elite White folks who ran the world, that would probably have been my argument to Gaddafi or Castro to attempt to win them over, lol. "Yeah...we're ruling them because we don't think have sense enough to take care of and govern themselves! Say what? You said you're going to help organize them to overthrow our racist White power structure because they should be independent? Well....if they need YOU to do it because they can't do it on their own then doesn't that PROVE a White man should be in charge??? Let the Revolutions go and come and join us in rulership my 'almost but not quite White -but white enough' -brothers! "

frankster True its what they represent...but it starts with Kicking out the french a big part of it.. It's one thing to KICK the French out. It's another thing to KEEP the French out. Well they The AES is spoiling for the fight......David Meets Goliath - My money is on David If I were you I wouldn't conflate Biblical stories with real life current events. It could and often does lead to disappointment and bewilderment when things don't turn out like it did in the book version. That is Pure Unadultered Crap a Pristine Load of Aged BS propaganda spread by the West Even IF what you said about my analysis was correct....lol. Most propaganda has atleast a KERNEL of truth in it. However if I'm wrong, SHOW AND PROVE with a RECENT example of a Black nation that has FORCIBLY removed the White colonizers through revolution and is now thriving. Troy The French have been helpless since WWII, they have neither the military might or the will to come back into Africa. And who’s going to help them recolonize those African nations, the EU the Americans? The Global White Power Structure works as a TEAM. America is the chief enforcer of policies often devised in England, France, and Germany. It doesn't matter which language a White man currently in Africa speaks....the rest of his brothers will benefit from his exploits. ProfD Black folks have never needed white folks to teach them how to farm or do anything else. Never???? Bro, RIGHT NOW most Black folks in the U.S. don't know how to farm or even catch a damn fish. It's been like that for the past 50 years or so since most of our people left the rural South for big cities. Most Black folks in the U.S. totally depend on White folks directly or indirectly just for their daily bread and toilet paper. There's enough intelligence among Black folks to do anything we desire. Just a matter of removing foreigners from our lands and building strategic alliances among ourselves using our collective knowledge, skills and abilities. And how long have we talked about doing this? Over a century now. Will this time in Burkina Faso be different? Time will tell.

Troy there are many scholars that would disagree with you. True. And there are many scholars who would AGREE. Scholars who are both Christian and Afrocentrist will cherry pick and point out consistencies between Christianity, the Bible, and Egyptian Mysticism. Afrocentrist scholars who are reject Christianity will ask them: - what part of ancient Egypt did Christians derive the name "Jesus" from? - what part of ancient Egypt is there talk of a Christ figure dying for 3 days and being resurrected? - what part of ancient Egypt did the concept of Popes, cardinals, and nuns come from? Again, claiming Christianity comes from Egypt is just another excuse negroes make to adhere to the "old time" religion that White folks forced on their ancestors. Going back to your original question it was answered. If the roles were reversed, and everything else being equal, Europeans and Arab would’ve converted too it has to do with the way humans behave has nothing to do with the color of the skin. I suppose you have a few examples to prove this assertion?

I've concluded that I've answered your question. Lol....got another one?

One of the problems is under colonialism....much of the ancient culture and ways of farming and doing things to feed themselves were ERASED as the Europeans imposed a new system of doing things on them. After generation after generation of this, the "old ways" have been nearly forgotten. Now it's up to us to discover and invent brand new ways to become independent and self sufficient.....because the way the Europeans taught us certainly isn't working. But I don't think most of them are trying to do that. Many Africans....like many AfroAmericans....simply don't want White folks telling them what to do anymore, but still don't know how to fully take care of themselves and operate a fully functioning society. Kind of like a teenager who is growing up in an abusive foster home and wants their independence from their abusers, but doesn't have a job, doesn't own a car, doesn't know the first thing about leasing an apartment or buying a house.

Christianity did NOT come out of Africa. Nor is it founded in ancient Egyptian/Kemetic belief systems. I've heard and read these claims for years by a lot of quasi-Christian Afrocentrists. Most of them push this belief by CHERRY PICKING certain similarities that exist between the religion of Christianity and a few documented stories attributed to ancient Egyptian philosophy....but not by doing on extensive comparison between the two institutions. Based on my research on religion....especially Christianity and it's foundations and doctrine....there are VERY FEW similarities between Christianity and ancient Egyptian belief systems when both are compared in their "entirety". In my opinion, it's pushed by Black folks who are still affiliated with the church and Christianity and seek to find ways to justify their position and association to it by making it seem as if Christianity is really "our" religion so they don't have to make the difficult choice of leaving it. Similar to how they'll take a White Jesus and paint him "Black" but still hold on to the "white savior" mentality...lol. BTW, my question as to whether or not the Europeans or Arabs would have followed traditional African religion if the roles were reversed and Africans went up into Europe or Arabia to convert them has yet to be touched....lol.

Troy Lol..... They wouldn't be very "omniscient" if they DIDN'T know.....would they?

frankster I think you and are share very similar positions on this subject. I believe SOME things are pre-determined and SOME things are random and based on individual choices. What percentage is which...I'm not sure.

The Amish operate INSIDE the world's most militarily powerful nation and are pretty much guaranteed security by them. The island of Jamaica could easily conquer the Amish and snatch their musty asses up by their long grey beards.....if the U.S. government just sat back with their arms crossed and allowed them in to do it. America protect those within her territory....including those without the power to protect themselves like the Amish, Mennonites and other so-called "independent" communities. Think of the Amish as a senile old man living in the attic of his rich son-in-law and daughters well guarded multi million dollar mansion.... He can afford to open the window cussing and shaking his fists at people who walk past his home because it's well guarded and nobody will bother to get to him anyway...lol.

Then the question would be, why do so many of our people keep falling for the same okey doke over and over again? Look at what happened with Jim Jones and the "People's Temple". That shit happened as late as the 70s.....AFTER our community was educated and informed by the greats such as Marcus Garvey and Elijah Muhammad. Over 700 Black folks STILL fell for that devil's hype and followed that fool down there!

I don't think the French are "wurred" about what's going on in West Africa one bit. Know why? For several reasons: 1. It's not about kicking out the French alone. The System of White Racism is global and works as a team. If you kick out France, eventually England, Germany, the U.S. and Russia will get involved one way or another and you'll have to deal with them. 2. Any group of angry young men can pick up gats and declare a Revolution and declare themselves free. The White Power Structure COULD send in a battalion and lay so many of our brothers over there low....it wouldn't even be funny. But they probably won't do that. They'll probably do what they've BEEN doing for the past 50 years and just WAIT. Wait on what? Wait on them to get hungry...... Whether you're talking about Burkina, Niger, Haiti, or any other nation that is in the throws of a coup you find the same story. A bunch of young men who all want to stand around with gats but nobody wants to pick up a shovel and dig a ditch to lay the foundation for a new building. Nobody wants to go to the country side and plant trees, crops, raise animals, learn how to build buildings and irrigation systems. They just want to fight eachother over what already IS there and what's left after the many wars....and ofcourse wait on foreign aid in the form of food and money and fight eachother over that too. And White folks know it. We can see the coup. We can see the plans for armed revolution. We can see military men in uniforms and berets laying across their heads with gats on their hip standing around making speeches with more armed young men standing around looking mean. We see that. Now....show me the people actually FARMING and growing enough food to feed their population so they won't have to keep begging the West for sacks of grain and rice to fight over, and BUILDING brand new buildings and schools and hospitals THEMSELVES instead of asking Whites and Asians to do it for them -as part of this Revolutionary coup to replace the White System! I'm waiting. Like Sofia from The Color Purple said: Just don't keep me waiting TOO long.

During our discussion in another thread about why Africans so easily converted to other outside foreign religions, I forgot to add something....... I could understand if a Spirit or some other super natural Entity actually CAME to Africans and clearly openly declared Christianity or Islam or some other religion to be the correct one coming from God. I could understand if a super natural Entity came performing Miracles in the name of those other religions. In THAT case...I can easily understand how a person seeing this would convert and accept it. I can understand how someone BORN into the religion could just easily accept it as true.....however I'm talking about the FIRST people of those lands who were introduced to it. For another human being who doesn't even look like you to simply come from another nation with a book that you can't even read because it's not in your language and TELL you it came from God or TELL you it's holy and you should accept it and that religion....and you sincerely accept it without any proof or strong evidence....that, I take issue with. I wonder would the Europeans or Arabs so easily convert to traditional African religions as so many Africans converted to Christianity and Islam?

I guess when we say "necessary" we have to qualify it with a description of "necessay for what". If you want to talk about what is absolutely necessary for survival as humans, then you're talking: Food Water Want to extend your life a little further: ...on top of that add Shelter ...and depending on the climate, Clothing...lol. Want to live even longer: ...add First Aid and some form of Healthcare I think you get my point....LOL. If you want a relatively modern and functioning society, at this point wifi internet is a basic necessity. Take that away, the nation won't last long because it will fall into chaos and be conquered.

ProfD Today's Africans cannot reclaim their land and resources without going to war against white folks. In it's entirety, I believe you're right. However in small increments and individual cases....it can happen. Look at how the Chinese and non-White Arabs are buying so much land and property in Africa and White folks are allowing it. I believe there's a tipping point or critical mass that White folks will allow. We should at least get ourselves acquainted with it. The easy way out for most people seems to be 1) selling out and taking whatever white folks are willing to give or 2) leave the country and try to build a better life being an Uber driver in a white country. Well, if they aren't going to organize and lead a concerted effort to reclaim their land (and it doesn't look like they're planning to do so anytime soon) then I think option #1 is a little more honorable than option #2. A coup is the way some folks try to fight back and reclaim their country. Yes, but they're not actually reclaiming the land from the White folks who control it. They're reclaiming the POSITION of "go between" and HNIC from other Black folks in that position that they personally don't like. One group of niccaz get jealous of those in power because they're closer to "White Massa" than they are....so they round up a gang of armed niccaz and storm the capital to drive them out and then THEY sit in the seat and make the calls to "White Massa". After years of sitting in office stealing money and begging White folks....another generation of young niccaz who get jealous of and tired of THEM form a gang and do the same thing. Happening over and over again. It's only a matter of time before white folks con and arm the next wannabe leader to stage a coup. Rinse and repeat. Exactly. As just mentioned above. Which tells me more about THEM than it does about the White folks who are conning them. As I mentioned in another thread, Muammar Gaddafi was the last African leader who fully understood the problem. He wanted to unite Africa. We know that outcome. I don't think he should have been killed...especially in the manner that he did. However I don't think he should have lead any Black African coalition or movement. He wasn't a Black African. I'd consider him a friend and ally of Black people, but not to be followed for a number of reasons. One of them was because we have to get out of the habit of needing a White "savior" or atleast some non-Black person to unite us and rally us together. Again, it's that "Jim Jones" mentality of somebody who doesn't look like us who will come down to the 'hood and stand us up on our feet and do for us what we should be doing for ourselves. Gaddafi or Castro or any other non-Black person leading an African coalition...even if it was successful....would simply re-enforce the racist belief that Black folks need a "White savior" because they don't have sense enough to do it by themselves. Even at work I see this often. Black folks from different background and nations often have issues working with eachother and getting along and having respect for eachother...but some soft mild mannered White man will come along and they all fall in line and work in harmony UNDER him.

Most intelligent Black folks already have........... The time has come to stop going in circles and preaching the same common sense to the walking dead. If they didn't have sense enough to "get it" after 60 years or preaching the same things over and over to them, it's time to pack our things and move on.

I've read and heard numerous stories about how Africans and Native Americans were warned ahead of time about the coming of Caucasians but they didn't heed the warnings. Then I heard SOME heeded the warnings while some others....especially the leaders...did sell their people out for trinkets and bottles of beer or salt or out of fear of superior weapons. I'm not sure if these things are true or false.....or a mixture of both. I'm very analytical in my thinking so I don't condemn entire groups of people nor do I praise them. I take the actions of each individual and the circumstances surrounding those actions into consideration....and weigh them. It's easy to say "stand strong and don't let the White man take your land and women"....when you don't have 1000 muskets pointed at you, lol. If you notice, except for the religious aspect....most of my criticism of Africans are of the Africans of TODAY because it's based on the behavior that I've actually witnessed myself. Some of it is absolutely uncalled for and has no excuse. You're over in the Congo sitting on all types of gold and diamonds....diamonds tumbling out of mountains by themselves.....all you have to do is stick your hand out and you'll catch one. But you'll leave THAT because you don't want to do the digging....instead you fly over to America just to drive a damn cab in Washington D.C.

.....unless you grew up with it, lol. Now a days, the internet IS considered a basic necessity. Governments and most individuals (except for survivalists) can't function in society without it.

Lol....talk about an oxymoron.

ProfD To avoid imperialism, Castro probably meant well all things considered. His shortcoming was a failure to grow his island nation. I think he did the best he could given the cards he was dealt. He was leading a nation of....as I said before...mostly Black and Mulatto people. So as a well educated White man who came from a prosperous family, he knew the White world wasn't going to allow them but to get so far. Also, he was pushing a Communist program in the middle of a Capitalistic and Christian Western Hemisphere. His only friends and allies were thousands of miles away and weren't true friends at that (Russia). Cuba probably could have developed more technology if they were left alone. But with the embargo and constant harassment, it was enough to survive. Despite displays of violence, Black folks aren't barbaric enough to take over their own sh8t and run it like a well-oiled machine. Well, some may agree. Because on the scale of civility....Barbarism is a STEP UP from Savagery...lol. A lot of our people are in such savage condition that barbaric would be an improvement.

Well the issue is......if this IS it...we wouldn't know it, lol.

ProfD Fear of mortality. People are afraid to die. They've been programmed into believing their soul could spend eternity in h8ll. Nearly every African religion before Christianity or Islam not only taught that Life existed after death and that their Ancestors lived in that After-life, they also had rituals and herbs they used that allowed certain medicine men to ENTER those Realms and communicate with Entities in them! Now whether they could do this or not is obviously questioned by some, but the fact that they certainly BELIEVED in it isn't up for questioning. All Africans believed in Higher Beings and Life after physical death. Neither Islam or Christianity introduced these concepts to them. So how a bunch of European Caucasians or Arab Caucasians could come along with other religions and SINCERELY convince them to stop believing in that and believe in a bunch of words written down in a book that THEY didn't write and couldn't even understand the language of is - Come on bro. Jim Jones. People's Temple. Jonestown Guyana. A 47-year old clown convinced 909 people to commit suicide. Great example. And Jim Jones was a WHITE man! And most of those who followed that fool down there were BLACK folks! Look at that. Like the wino on Good Times would say: "Now what does that tell you? Huh? Huh??"

ProfD Yeah, got quite a few friends with sleep apnea and even have to use the machine. You must be heavy. A lot of people who are heavy in weight tend to have sleep apnea. As I get older I often imagine different ways I'd like to die also....lol. Simply dying in my sleep....during a nice and lovely dream...is ideal. However a very quick violent death in which I lose consciousness quickly would be far more ideal than going through months or years of some disease. This is one of the reasons I'm so angry at some of the teachings of many religions. I was promised that "the end" would come before the year 2000...lol. One religion says that Jesus would come back. Another said the world would end. Another said that a Savior would return and make the world better. Here we are in 2024....decades later... and the world is still shitty and there are wars and disease on top of war and disease. I have lady friends, but no children....by choice. Unlike you, I actually do believe in Life after physical death so I really have no reason to hang around in this Reality if the bad outweighed the good.

What else besides low intelligence would allow a grown man to change religions SIMPLY because an outsider comes to his community and tells him he's worshipping the wrong "god" that they've been worshipping since time immemorial? Some would tell me: "Well, Pioneer....it's not that simple. You have to understand the history behind it and how they did it." Understand what? I understand how people with superior weapons can over power you and take your land and women. I don't agree with it...but it makes sense. You were physically forced into it....it was beyond your control. But here you've been worshipping the same religion for THOUSANDS of years and some other group of men come over on a camel or horse....get off...tell you they have a book that came from "heaven" and it was given to them to give to you. And you start stretching your eyes and grinning and actually believe it with no proof or strong evidence but ONLY that man telling you about it. .....that actually says a lot about YOU more so than the colonizer!